Just wondered if the Titan tracking nerf and stopping them from insta popping sub caps was still going to happen?
I remember 50 man RR BS and nano gangs but not it's 50-100 Titan gangs just mental really


For info purposes only before you trolls happen - I live in low sec where real gate camps happen :)

Dear OP,

Thank you for your letter.

I am afraid there are bad news for you, changing the game won't stop you from being terrible.

Just stop sucking.

/T

Just wondered if the Titan tracking nerf and stopping them from insta popping sub caps was still going to happen?
I remember 50 man RR BS and nano gangs but not it's 50-100 Titan gangs just mental really


For info purposes only before you trolls happen - I live in low sec where real pvp happens :)

Dear OP,
It is my pleasure and honor to let you know that there is an excellent counter to 50-100 Titans. Same number of Titans or decent amount of bombers. Enough that supercap nerf crap. They are called supers not for Rifter to come and shoot at them but because they are superships. Nerf yourself OP. Or learn to fly a Titan in combat instead of sitting at gate pewing 100 at 1 as usual in Lowsec and OMG run run run at sight of a few bombers.

+10 to Tobias.

Dear OP,
It is my pleasure and honor to let you know that there is an excellent counter to 50-100 Titans. Same number of Titans or decent amount of bombers. Enough that supercap nerf crap. They are called supers not for Rifter to come and shoot at them but because they are superships. Nerf yourself OP or learn to fly a Titan in combat instead of sitting at gate pewing 100 at 1 as usual in Lowsec and ONG run run run at sight of a few bombers.

+10 to Tobias.

Those tracking titans are trading any decent tank they can get in order to make them hit smaller ships, making them a giant glass cannon. Nothing needs changing

Those tracking titans are trading any decent tank they can get in order to make them hit smaller ships, making them a giant glass cannon. Nothing needs changing

Firts listen to an opinion of those that use them, and just copy&paste that goons say like a mindles sheep.

BTA have titans now? OMG why did I leave such an awesome alliance!

I didn't say no such thing.

Look at these bitches that tell the OP to learn to fly a cap so he can fight a cap. What a bunch of tools. It's like watching a monkey with a rock bash himself in the face over and over. He should really stop doing that, but for some reason he just won't.
Remember the nano nerf 1 and 2? Remember falcons? Soon it will be remember the titans!

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

Since when did price have anything to do with performance?

You can take a $2 million Bugatti Veyron and put it up against a tuned Skyline GTR and the Veyron will loose around a track. For abour $1.8 million less spent.

Titan weapons are so large that giving them fast tracking makes no sense at all. They should only be able to hit other Supers / Titans.

The thought of being able to hit a HIC is just not right.

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

Just wondered if the Titan tracking nerf and stopping them from insta popping sub caps was still going to happen?

Yes

Lets make sure that Capitals cant hit battleship sized targets.

And while we're at it, lets make sure that battleships cant hit cruisersized targets, and cruisers cant hit frigatesized targets. Seems only fair.

In 6 months, all of EVE would be back in frigs. Ah, the good 'ol days.

A glass cannon with more EHP and RR support than most fleets...

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

My pirate BS should be able to insta pop any frigate with its main guns because it costs so much more.

So if I spend 200 billion ISK on my Dominix, I will be able to insta-pop your titan?

Cost is not a balancing factor. Cost is a (very weak) factor in determining availability. Availability may be a balancing factor if you so choose (and utterly suck at balancing things), but is better used as just a pure epeen factor.

More to the point, if cost was a balancing factor, then either Titans would have to be nerfed toGǪ ohGǪ 1/20th of their current strength, or they would have to add another three zeros at the end of the price in order to match the Gǣmarginal improvement for magnitudes larger costGǥ progression of the rest of the game.

Battleship is to a titan what a frigate is to a battleship. Try to fit frigates with BS turrets.

when my mate has them pinned down or if they're so far out that their angular velocity doesn't matter... yea, I can hit them, pal.

when my mate has them pinned down or if they're so far out that their angular velocity doesn't matter... yea, I can hit them, pal.

Considering the price tag is only one of the factors, yea, it is balanced.

There's a reason why they're used by alliances with a lot of people in them.

But i forget we live in a world where people want instant gratification and disregard how people got the power they have in the first place and just assume it's unfair.

Newsflash bud.

Drakes are getting swatted out of the sky at close range. Once 50 titans hit the field you cant do squat because you die so fast. 0.0 is now a game of who has the most titans and right now there is only one winner every time.

GǪexcept that price is not a factor in balancing. Again: price is an easily avoidable factor in availability, which is a completely different thing. So no, costing 100 bil is utterly irrelevant to their ability to instapop a Dominix.

GǪexcept that they're quite easy to come by these days, and that they're not (now, or ever before) balanced for that. The problem is that titans still fall into the GÇ£best counter for X ships of type Y is X+1 ships of type YGÇ¥ category. When this happens, things are inherently broken GÇö no GÇ£ifGÇ¥s, no GÇ£butGÇ¥s.

Good job missing the point almost entirely.

Titans were a bad idea in the first place, and not being able to hit subcaps is the least they can do to balance those stupid things.

It would be even better if they just removed them from the game, maybe reimbursing the pilots as they did, but that would make too much sense I guess.

I've got a news flash for you too. When you blow up your sig radius with over sized shield extenders, it makes you an easier target to hit. I bet some of them where using microwarps too, to 'go really fast' not realizing that their sig radius is the size of a freighter. Also, I'm willing to bet them drakes where also pinned down by support fleet.

Battleship is to a titan what a frigate is to a battleship. Try to fit frigates with BS turrets.

So the options are, brick tank armour fleet that cant move and get ripped apart by titans or faster sheild fleets that get ripped apart by titans.

When the only counter to a ship is more of the same ship things need to change as they have done in the past.

Tough ****. A fleet that has years worth of effort behind it should kill your crappy sentimental battle cruisers. this is eve. Not world of warcraft where everything is the same with a different shade of brown and yellow.

They're suppose to be all powerful. They're suppose to be a pain in the ass to fight.

this is eve. Not world of warcraft where everything is the same with a different shade of brown and yellow.

Because the fleets involving hundreds of people that have worked together over years havent put in just as much if not more effort. What you are defending is exactly like wow gameplay where the level 85 (titans) wipe out the level 70s ( subcaps, carriers/dreads) in a handfull of vollies.

Btw, WoW game play is to homogenize everything so no one feels they're at a disadvantage when pvping. In a game that's about war and money there's gonna be things that are the best. It only makes sense.

No. They're supposed to be giant epeens. Unfortunately, they made them all-powerful and a pain in the ass to fight for no particularly good reason.

Unless they're also supposed to be very easy to fight if you bring the right tools (and GÇ£the right toolsGÇ¥ must not meant GÇ£more titans than the other sideGÇ¥), they are flawed designs to begin with, so it doesn't matter what else they're supposed to do GÇö they need to be repurposed to fit within the overall design strategy of the game.

And no, no matter how much people would like it to be, price is not a factor in well-designed balance. People who bring it up only highlight that the balance needs to be fixed because it is based on fundamentally flawed and downright idiotic principles.

Oh, and by the wayGǪGǪthat's why Titans dying horribly when faced with its proper counter needs to happen, rather than the current situation where the GÇ£N+1 of the sameGÇ¥ is still the best solution for supercaps GÇö that's pretty much the epitome of GÇ£the same with a different shadeGÇ¥.

Didn't realize epeen ships required months of training time and a galactic amount of effort that can only be accomplished by a well situated alliance, which is meant to be the flag ship of the alliance.

The end all that be type ship.

If the only counter is to field more titans

They are balanced

As many posters have said before, when people nerf something and destroy its capabilities to actually do what it used to do, people will settle for some lesser version of it and then that new thing will be whined about on the forums.

No. What makes sense is if there are things that are the best for a given situation, and if what you bring does not match the situation you're in, you're screwed GÇö you should feel the disadvantage you (accidentally?) chose to the very marrow of your bonesGǪ

GǪfor about 5s, when you wake up in your clone bay. This is what the current system fails to provide because there is a GÇ£bestGÇ¥ thing to be had. War is about strategy. GÇ£Everyone bring as many [best thing] as you canGÇ¥ is not strategy GÇö it's just a flat, moronic and thoroughly uninteresting leveling system.

War is about taking something you want

Not all strategies are good and what you said about best for the given situation is true, but no one has clearly found one to counter a few dozen titans with a support fleet outside of bringing more brute force, which makes sense.

No game mechanic is stopping people from doing this.

It sucks if a certain alliance can't be beaten because they simply have more firepower, but that's fair.

Nerfing the titan wouldn't even make them more vulnerable. It'll just make it where they redirect their efforts in the next best thing, and then the cycle of crying will continue.

The circumstantial evidence says different. When an alliance pummels another with ships that take vastly more materials to build, time, and isk... I'm gonna side with the big guys as the people putting in more effort.

Btw, WoW game play is to homogenize everything so no one feels they're at a disadvantage when pvping. In a game that's about war and money there's gonna be things that are the best. It only makes sense. And despite all the whining going on the forums I still see these ships as meh. Oh, they can insta pop a ****** tanked battleship. Boo hoo, go get a Kleenex and wipe those tears so no one can see them.

crap

So why are you siding with titans which do not require even a fraction of the logistical resources a large subcap fleet needs?


So you feel a hanfull of people should utterly wipe out the vast bulk of people with a single ship that invalidates everything else? Tactics, fleet comp, FC skill, logistics and fleet discipline mean nothing. In essence, exactly the opposide to what you want is happening. It is currently impossible for a new alliance to make any gains in 0.0 because they just have titans dumped on them all the time which they cannot counter.

They're tools and are used to bust balls.

Also, the game isn't broken

In almost all situations in this game, numbers win.

And a titan being able to rofl stop a few people is perfectly fine.

What wouldn't be fair is if small fish were able to take out bigger fish.

more crap.

Biased dribble about what is "balanced".

Nothing is stopping those people from applying to those alliances and join the winning side. They got that way because they put in the time and effort into it. Those start up alliances haven't done anything outside of leaving carebear land.

What wouldn't be fair is if small fish were able to take out bigger fish.
Obviously, they'd lose. All that they have ever done would never prepare them for what the group with the titans have accomplished to get there. Again, when claiming space seems impossible to claim on your own, maybe it's time to suck it up and join one of the bigger groups. Preferably the one that seems like it'll be around for a while.

I am a colossal moron and don't know anything about anything

As long as there are losers losing, people will always be crying for nerfs.

Look at the drake for christs' sake or anything with autocannons. Crying galore. And a simple counter is to jam those kind of ships. And the counter to ecm is to fit eccm mods and primary the jammers

Titans are fair and balanced.

it is fair considering all that goes into fielding them along the way as opposed to a regular sub cap fleet which is to take a bpo some trit here and there a manufacturing lab which can be done in high sec in a npc station in complete safety.

No they got that way because they own an I win button. Skill should always trump cash. There is a damn good reason why my corp managed to live in venal and hold off the NC at the hight of its power for years and cause some of the largest fleet losses ever seen in the game to that point. Small fish have always been able to take on the large and win in this game. Right now however even the large fish cant take on the titan blob.

The only thing broken about this game is the cap owners' ambition and attitude.

The bigger fish were small at some point and smart enough to not take on so many losses to allow then to become bigger fish.

And this force multiplier you speak of, why are there whelp fleets, alpha doctrine fleets, and lol drake fleets?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for startegy and tactics being able to turn the tables in a given situation

What about all them industrial ships that get ganked all the time in high sec? Them medium sized ships with a signature radius twice the sized of a cruiser, and effective hp of a frigate.

The balance people want isn't balance because they just want to win without having to put in the same amount of effort and time as the cap pilots.

Boo hoo

I agree with Surge Roth, most of the super capital nerf cryers are doing this because it benefits them.
They don't want to be able to think outside the box or use stragedy and tactics other than mindless blobbing.

They don't care if you put money, time, and effort in getting your supercap.

Stop whining about the supercapitals and shoot the subcapital fleet that's supporting them. Then those supers are just sitting ducks since they can't hit you.

GǪwhich will buff it quite drastically.

Except for when it comes to stuff like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5aR0OK7MXE.
I'm sure there are other areas in the game where their shields stay at 27-30 percent and taking away the shield resists will make them pop in those situations.

But people like you wouldn't care.

So the drakes gains some more dps which will make it more effective at blobbing.

GǪexcept that the loss can be compensated for.

Just wondered if the Titan tracking nerf and stopping them from insta popping sub caps was still going to happen?
I remember 50 man RR BS and nano gangs but now it's 50-100 Titan gangs thats just mental really


Btw i am asking because i am interested to know not because its a whine - before you trolls happen - I live in low sec where real pvp happens:).

Lmao. A kid whose in low-sec is bitching about titan tracking? Is this forreal or just a troll?


You bitched and moaned about doomsdaying of subcaps, now you're bitching about titans being able to pop sub-caps with regular guns. When the **** will you STOP bitching? Christ, you kids whine more than a nursery filled with infants.

Except for when it comes to stuff like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5aR0OK7MXE.
I'm sure there are other areas in the game where their shields stay at 27-30 percent and taking away the shield resists will make them pop in those situations. But people like you wouldn't care. So the drakes gains some more dps which will make it more effective at blobbing, but because they are in a blob, the dps increase will go unnoticed.

I especially liked the part of the video where he just floated in space and waited for the red bars to fill. I see no reason to take away ones freedom to not have to try.

The gist of eve is this. Some people might have to manually turn on and off a module here and there. Maybe double click in some space.

I hear fleet combat is whole groups of people doing this all at once. It's quite riveting I must say.

Even if the drake is compensated for, it still doesn't make up for the fact that what was once possible now is not. And that, is a swift kick in the balls for the poor sap who had nothing to do with a bunch of selfish whiny people who want things their way. As for the topic, I still firmly believe titans are ok. I wouldn't want to fly one, but they should be all powerful considering what they are and how much effort it takes to get one flying properly.

yeah all that effort to build them has ensured their rarity

or not

stop being dumb?

Yes

Lets make sure that Capitals cant hit battleship sized targets.

And while we're at it, lets make sure that battleships cant hit cruisersized targets, and cruisers cant hit frigatesized targets. Seems only fair.

In 6 months, all of EVE would be back in frigs. Ah, the good 'ol days.

Lmao. A kid whose in low-sec is bitching about titan tracking? Is this forreal or just a troll?


You bitched and moaned about doomsdaying of subcaps, now you're bitching about titans being able to pop sub-caps with regular guns. When the **** will you STOP bitching? Christ, you kids whine more than a nursery filled with infants.

I want the old DD back

Cost is a determining factor because it takes time and some PvEing and/or ganking of high value targets to get that isk. Again, they're easy to come by because people allowed it to happen. The alliances fielding these ships of mass destruction didn't start off with 150 titan fleets. Took em years to make it happen. And any fool who is stupid enough to fly solo in one will part ways with it in no time. They are justified in blowing up your crappy sub cap ships. If they get nerfed and become too weak, then it'll be one of many ships people just don't bother using anymore because they suck. They're suppose to be all powerful. They're suppose to be a pain in the ass to fight.

When there's a fight, any fight there is always an individual or group of individuals who cannot cope with the fact that they lost. They will say: "I had a back injury going into the fight" or "I didn't think you would fight dirty". The excuses and rampant bullshit coming from losers will always be ever present.

So is it in EVE. Losers want game mechanics to change, not because they are imbalanced but because losers lose. The problem is that it is a slippery slope, because no matter the game mechanics, losers will always find a way to lose. Before titans, losers whined about carriers and dreadnoughts and how everyone blobbed with carriers, and that it was "unfair". Even before that, battleships were "imbalanced" and only "no-lifers who grinded isk for months" were able to get them. And then when they became cheaper the losers whined once more because the "no-lifers" grouped together and had "blobs" of battleships.

The constant pattern of meandering drivel hurf-blurfing out of the inane mind of losers is tiresome. They resort to some kind of misplaced idealism and illusions of "balance", where they really mean that they want the game imbalanced on their behalf, safety-mechanisms in the game so they won't have to deal with the fact that they're losers.

I would give losers the advice to go play another game, but even with some games being like virtual overprotective parents out there, the unfortunate fact is that "loser" is a state of mind, and no changes or game mechanics will change that fact.

You have to change yourselves first.

But that notion is so deeply buried below psychological defense mechanism, denial, projection and self-loathing that probably is impossible. As is this futile attempt at making losers realize that they are.

titans?

Ok PL guy, put your money where your mouth is. Stop using Titan blobs and lets see how you become one of those losers shall we

you sure needed a lot of words to say "hi i'm a no-lifer"

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

Clearly 100bill isn't enough to stop alliances from mass producing them.

Just wondered if the Titan tracking nerf and stopping them from insta popping sub caps was still going to happen?
I remember 50 man RR BS and nano gangs but now it's 50-100 Titan gangs thats just mental really


Btw i am asking because i am interested to know not because its a whine - before you trolls happen - I live in low sec where real pvp happens:).

When there's a fight, any fight there is always an individual or group of individuals who cannot cope with the fact that they lost. They will say: "I had a back injury going into the fight" or "I didn't think you would fight dirty". The excuses and rampant bullshit coming from losers will always be ever present.

So is it in EVE. Losers want game mechanics to change, not because they are imbalanced but because losers lose. The problem is that it is a slippery slope, because no matter the game mechanics, losers will always find a way to lose. Before titans, losers whined about carriers and dreadnoughts and how everyone blobbed with carriers, and that it was "unfair". Even before that, battleships were "imbalanced" and only "no-lifers who grinded isk for months" were able to get them. And then when they became cheaper the losers whined once more because the "no-lifers" grouped together and had "blobs" of battleships.

The constant pattern of meandering drivel hurf-blurfing out of the inane mind of losers is tiresome. They resort to some kind of misplaced idealism and illusions of "balance", where they really mean that they want the game imbalanced on their behalf, safety-mechanisms in the game so they won't have to deal with the fact that they're losers.

I would give losers the advice to go play another game, but even with some games being like virtual overprotective parents out there, the unfortunate fact is that "loser" is a state of mind, and no changes or game mechanics will change that fact.

You have to change yourselves first.

But that notion is so deeply buried below psychological defense mechanism, denial, projection and self-loathing that probably is impossible. As is this futile attempt at making losers realize that they are.

some northrn regions with tech moons have 800-1200 billion isk income... a month... titan production cost; 45b at 800 billion that is 18 titans a month........

Ok PL guy, put your money where your mouth is. Stop using Titan blobs and lets see how you become one of those losers shall we

Clearly 100bill isn't enough to stop alliances from mass producing them.

They'd still win and then you losers would whine about what they did to get it nerfed.

They cost nearly 100billion isk, the least they can do is insta pop your ****** dominix.

They are being built faster than they are being killed, so yes, true statement.

The constant pattern of meandering drivel hurf-blurfing out of the inane mind of losers is tiresome. They resort to some kind of misplaced idealism and illusions of "balance", where they really mean that they want the game imbalanced on their behalf, safety-mechanisms in the game so they won't have to deal with the fact that they're losers.

I would give losers the advice to go play another game, but even with some games being like virtual overprotective parents out there, the unfortunate fact is that "loser" is a state of mind, and no changes or game mechanics will change that fact.

You have to change yourselves first.

But that notion is so deeply buried below psychological defense mechanism, denial, projection and self-loathing that probably is impossible. As is this futile attempt at making losers realize that they are.

Like how thier fleet got wiped out in under 20 min last night?

It's like in those movies when the main character is a child who is constantly getting bullied and in the end of the movie the kid finally wins a fight against the bully and the credits roll. Know what happens in a real world situation? The bully comes back with his friends and beats the little squirt so bad he ends up dying at the hospital.

One victory is nothing.

simple way to neftbat titans... change the damage applied formula to have two new values...

if 1 = yes then x= 0.5-1
if 0= yes then x = 0.01-1

value 1 is sub capital ships
value 0 is capital ships

x is the variable in the damage applied formula... so if chance to his is anything under 0.5 then you will never hit a sub cap...

what this will do is in effect reduce titan chance to do damage to a sub cap by 50%...

hell you could even make it by 75% so if 1=true then x= 0.75-1

so that means you would have to have chance to hit be 0.75-1 to do any damage and at most would get a scratch hit...

The problem is this:
Dreads are already fairly useless against subcaps, carriers are at best meh, and SCs are also pretty damn useless. If titans were made to ALSO be useless against subcaps, then there's not much of a reason to actually field capital ships, ever. IMO what should happen is titans getting a good tracking nerf, while removing the tracking penalty from siege mods. Suddenly dreads become a viable counter to BCs/BSs, while still being unable to hit HACs, and titans get nerfed without being made useless.

There NEEDS to be some reason to field capitals against subcaps, because otherwise there's not reason to field caps at all. Shooting structures? Subcap fleets can do that no problem, and it's not something that happens often enough to justify making the entire upper tier of ships (and the only ones that can't be used in highsec) useless for everything else.

When there's a fight, any fight there is always an individual or group of individuals who cannot cope with the fact that they lost. They will say: "I had a back injury going into the fight" or "I didn't think you would fight dirty". The excuses and rampant bullshit coming from losers will always be ever present.

So is it in EVE. Losers want game mechanics to change, not because they are imbalanced but because losers lose. The problem is that it is a slippery slope, because no matter the game mechanics, losers will always find a way to lose. Before titans, losers whined about carriers and dreadnoughts and how everyone blobbed with carriers, and that it was "unfair". Even before that, battleships were "imbalanced" and only "no-lifers who grinded isk for months" were able to get them. And then when they became cheaper the losers whined once more because the "no-lifers" grouped together and had "blobs" of battleships.

The constant pattern of meandering drivel hurf-blurfing out of the inane mind of losers is tiresome. They resort to some kind of misplaced idealism and illusions of "balance", where they really mean that they want the game imbalanced on their behalf, safety-mechanisms in the game so they won't have to deal with the fact that they're losers.

I would give losers the advice to go play another game, but even with some games being like virtual overprotective parents out there, the unfortunate fact is that "loser" is a state of mind, and no changes or game mechanics will change that fact.

You have to change yourselves first.

But that notion is so deeply buried below psychological defense mechanism, denial, projection and self-loathing that probably is impossible. As is this futile attempt at making losers realize that they are.

Personally I like adding to the game rather than detracting from it. Give the vets new things to train for. Capital interdictors. Capital electronic warfare ships. Mobile capital cynojamming ships. Capital mines (dont affect subcaps much), minelayers and minesweepers. Deployable and dockable motherships. In short - introduce a capital level rock-paper-scissors game that will drive the scale of EVEs allready massive battles to previosly unheard of complexity and scale.

I'm not sure if it's been mentioned or do people actually realise this but:

- many CCP players are Goons
- many CCP decisions are made by those people
- Titans at the moment are one of the last effective weapons against the Goon Drake fleets

You're misunderstanding the whole thing.

We throwed Drakefleets in Titan Meatgrinders until CCP saw that there is nothing 800 subcaps can do to a Titan fleet.

Of course we knew it was going to happen.

And it happened. And CCP took notice.

And boom, nerf.



The plan worked as expected, thank you very much Raiden for participating in this.

[quote=DelBoy Trades]
Cost is not a balancing factor. .

Yeah that whole risk reward thing should go right out the window.

The main problem isnt the ship or any of its possible counters guys.

True wich is why the game needs to be developed further,bringing in new counters,new capital ship types,& developing 0.0 for just Supercapitals. Every1 is going to progress & prior to the stupidity of this so say patch,every1 would of wanted to 1 day have a titan,but whats the point after making them a coffin?The whole nerf is due to Goons failing @ EVE,and becuase they fail @ EVE every1 has to pay the price.