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Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
384
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Posted - 2012.03.23 01:51:00 -
[31] - Quote
Ohh Yeah wrote:This is going to own.
Now all I have to do is canflip my alt and I suddenly am flagged to everyone in EVE.
That is ******* amazing. The number of fights a high-sec PvPer can get all over high-sec now is amazing.
Except that even if someone shoots you, you won't be able to shoot them back without going GCC. |
Tommy Shanks
3
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Posted - 2012.03.23 02:34:00 -
[32] - Quote
There are lots of oppurtunities for non consensual PvP and Pkers will no longer be able to hide behind BS mechanics while they plan their murders.
White knights are needed in this game we can't all be assholes
As far as the firing back against an attacker will get you a concord hit post proof |
FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
1167
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Posted - 2012.03.23 02:49:00 -
[33] - Quote
I'm all for the elimination of "accidental" aggression. Players should be making informed decisions.
Along with this is the addition of proper aggression transfers to logis. Goodbye stupid station games.
This new "suspect" flag I have mixed feelings about. It could be quite awesome, or it could be outrageously stupid. It depends on how it's implemented. I do know that it will result in a total end to can baiting.
I'm waiting for a proper dev blog detailing how they're actually going to implement these ideas before I tell them how stupid they are :)
It's time to put an end to CCP's war on piracy. Fight your own battles and stop asking CCP to do it for you. |
Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
2
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Posted - 2012.03.23 02:53:00 -
[34] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:Along with this is the addition of proper aggression transfers to logis. Goodbye stupid station games.
It's not going to end the games at all - it's just going to up the ante. Now instead of people fooling around on a station with only one logi to keep them up, they'll do it with 3. Mind you, I think it's a very good thing (and the right thing) that logis get the activation/docking timers on gates/stations, but don't kid yourself into thinking it's going to magically make station games disappear.
Furthermore, the whole idea that Greyscale mentioned of making neutral logi go 'suspect' if they rep people at war is easily avoided by accepting them into corp just prior to using them (only go red to WTs), and then immediately dropping them. Same effect as neutral logi, same consequences. Only difference is a ****** employment history. |
Goren Styne
GPS Industrial
0
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Posted - 2012.03.23 03:10:00 -
[35] - Quote
Sounds neat, I think rather than removing aspects of the sandbox it is adding them. These changes could promote player police forces, etc... |
Cedo Nulli
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
83
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Posted - 2012.03.23 03:35:00 -
[36] - Quote
That "Suspect" flag system sounds like the best idea to be brought to EVE so far. Seriously ... its something normal highsec folk have been waiting for years.
"Elite PVP" folk aka the guys who jump to some 5 week old mission runner to gank them in T3s after canflips and neutral-RR wanks seem to be actually terrified that their helpless prey might be able to shoot back now !
In current state the system gives complete immunity to the gankers ... but this new system would actually add some sense into the game and give the highsec bears the means to actually help eachother against a common foe !
I really think this is a brilliant change that will greatly improve the game for new and old players.
If the basement kids cry because they cant bully people without retribution ... well time to man up and actually take responsibility for acting like a douche ! |
Hesser Mech
El Dorado INC
14
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Posted - 2012.03.23 03:41:00 -
[37] - Quote
Ash Stewart wrote:I play eve for the realism.
Really? You fly a space ship in real life? |
Cannibal Kane
Brotherhood of KANE
303
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Posted - 2012.03.23 06:10:00 -
[38] - Quote
Cedo Nulli wrote:That "Suspect" flag system sounds like the best idea to be brought to EVE so far. Seriously ... its something normal highsec folk have been waiting for years.
"Elite PVP" folk aka the guys who jump to some 5 week old mission runner to gank them in T3s after canflips and neutral-RR wanks seem to be actually terrified that their helpless prey might be able to shoot back now !
In current state the system gives complete immunity to the gankers ... but this new system would actually add some sense into the game and give the highsec bears the means to actually help eachother against a common foe !
I really think this is a brilliant change that will greatly improve the game for new and old players.
If the basement kids cry because they cant bully people without retribution ... well time to man up and actually take responsibility for acting like a douche !
Your a moron...
Like many people said Mob Justice is fine. It the SEC STATUS HIT when you kill somebody while defending yourself from 20 people shooting at you. That is an issue.
You will see alot less kills in HIGH sec. If this **** is for real I fear for what they have planned for wardecs.
I'm not a Pirate, I'm a Terrorist. |
Tikktokk Tokkzikk
Glorious Revolution
The 99 Percent
54
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Posted - 2012.03.23 06:23:00 -
[39] - Quote
As we learned during Incarna, CCP now cares more about their wallet than their game. What would be best for their wallet? Keep making the best MMO out there with a stable player base or make another WoW clone with a twist?
I've got a feeling CCP is heading towards a WoW clone but will fail horribly for various reasons.
For all we knows, CCP might even want to turn twilight online into their new main game. |
Cen Eve
State War Academy
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.03.23 06:41:00 -
[40] - Quote
letting more people shoot each other without CONCORD = taking away the sandbox?
idgi |
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Tallian Saotome
Fractured Core
Fatal Ascension
578
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Posted - 2012.03.23 06:51:00 -
[41] - Quote
snypah~
Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom. |
Cannibal Kane
Brotherhood of KANE
305
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:04:00 -
[42] - Quote
Cen Eve wrote:letting more people shoot each other without CONCORD = taking away the sandbox?
idgi
Your a moron as well.
Did you not read what the issue is that people are having?
Like many people said Mob Justice is fine. It the SEC STATUS HIT when you kill somebody while defending yourself from 20 people shooting at you. That is an issue.
I'm not a Pirate, I'm a Terrorist. |
March rabbit
Ganse
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
144
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:10:00 -
[43] - Quote
MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote:Seriously, your alliance should consider changing its name to Self Tear Extraction and Reclamation Services.
QTF 
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March rabbit
Ganse
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
144
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:35:00 -
[44] - Quote
kiki mo wrote:LOL, more tears comments...keep em coming!
your alliance.... you know.... 
kiki mo wrote:
Also, for the other response about living as an outlaw...I'd almost agree with the possibility of actually being a true -10 'outlaw' as envisioned if these changes go through...but I'd like to propose then, that it be reciprical and balanced...thus, -10 players would actually be welcomed at lowsec stations where pirate factions control it...and positive standings players would be shot at by the station guns, the npc police and possibly the gate guns, depending on the security status of the system. On a humorous thought; spawn NPC police if positive-status players enter the system and attempt to 'patrol the pirates'. I hardly think it's logical that people are allowed to sit around Guristas stations and have offices there that are positive standing.
I'd think that the possible benefit to a 'balanced and reciprocal' system like this would actually have people voluntarily move to lowsec.
Thoughts?
i would say your picture looks little sharp. In real world pirate factions live "in the shadow". They don't advert their freedom. Because if they do this they get full scale war. Killing good people can lead to unneded attention from CONCORD. Other thing: why should CONCORD pay attention and place bounties for NPC pirate factions? After all pirate factions is a paint in the ... of a local authority.
Other thing: security status and corporation/faction standings. What if you are "good -10 cowboy" but your standings with said Guristas are -10 too? You want them to welcome you and even protect? It would be strange.
It would be better to make security status only matter for human players. And for anything NPC related we already have standings.
CONCORD is somehow different from other NPC tho...
Let's say leave sec statuses like current system. But remove sec status gringind with killing NPCs. Secutiry status is only for humans. Kill bad guys ("help the police") and you will get forgiven.
Make it so your faction standings help you when you have trouble. If you have fight in sov where you are +10 then faction can help you. Visit pirate space and you can even find yourself without docking permission and under fire of station guns. And the same when you -10 to local faction. Docking permissions included. |
Tallian Saotome
Fractured Core
Fatal Ascension
578
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:38:00 -
[45] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:
It would be better to make security status only matter for human players. And for anything NPC related we already have standings.
CONCORD is somehow different from other NPC tho...
As far as game mechanics are concerned, CONCORD standing = sec status. They are literally the exact same thing.
Also, literally ******, just cuz
Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom. |
Xorv
Questionable Acquisitions
181
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:40:00 -
[46] - Quote
Vimsy Vortis wrote:Xorv wrote:
Yes this is the part that really looks like they're pushing High Sec PvPers out of High Sec. Which would be fine if they also pushed lucrative PvE out of High Sec as well, but no sign of that happening yet. I'm still waiting for the complete story before final judgement, we haven't seen the Wardec changes yet.
The thing is you can't push people out of highsec, PVPers or otherwise. If you make it prohibitively difficult to engage in PVP in highsec the people whose entire playstyle is built around killing things in highsec will just quit and go and play another game. At that point the nullsec people who constantly advocate for changes that would make highsec PVP more difficult now, will whine that highsec is too safe and that no PVP happens there.
The reason many of those players are in High Sec is because the targets are there, and that was really my point. If CCP takes non consensual PvP out of High Sec they should also take out all the non newbie PvE. When I think of previous Sandbox MMORPGs I've played I can't think of any that have safe zones where you can also engage in PvE. Well Shadowbane had a newbie zone, but it had no value to characters after they'd spent a couple of hours there. No one would complain High Sec was too safe if all you could do there was trade, build things, and do newbie tutorial missions. I'm certainly not advocating all PvPers join Sov Nullsec alliances.
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Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service
3
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Posted - 2012.03.23 07:41:00 -
[47] - Quote
This idea makes Vlad sad.
I like being able flip a can and get a solo fight against a small number of opponents. I don't like dying to a huge blob. If I wanted that, I'd be back in lowsec. And sadly that seems to be what CCP is pushing for.
Well here's to hoping that they don't jack up the war dec mechanic when they rework that. |
Tallian Saotome
Fractured Core
Fatal Ascension
578
|
Posted - 2012.03.23 07:42:00 -
[48] - Quote
Xorv wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:Xorv wrote:
Yes this is the part that really looks like they're pushing High Sec PvPers out of High Sec. Which would be fine if they also pushed lucrative PvE out of High Sec as well, but no sign of that happening yet. I'm still waiting for the complete story before final judgement, we haven't seen the Wardec changes yet.
The thing is you can't push people out of highsec, PVPers or otherwise. If you make it prohibitively difficult to engage in PVP in highsec the people whose entire playstyle is built around killing things in highsec will just quit and go and play another game. At that point the nullsec people who constantly advocate for changes that would make highsec PVP more difficult now, will whine that highsec is too safe and that no PVP happens there. The reason many of those players are in High Sec is because the targets are there, and that was really my point. If CCP takes non consensual PvP out of High Sec they should also take out all the non newbie PvE. When I think of previous Sandbox MMORPGs I've played I can't think of any that have safe zones where you can also engage in PvE. Well Shadowbane had a newbie zone, but it had no value to characters after they'd spent a couple of hours there. No one would complain High Sec was too safe if all you could do there was trade, build things, and do newbie tutorial missions. I'm certainly not advocating all PvPers join Sov Nullsec alliances.
I actually think they should make one of the gates near the EVE gate one way, and turn that pocket into a newbie zone. Can't get to jita, or even highsec, without leaving the zone, and if you explore around that area, even the names are perfect for it.
Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom. |
discordigant
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2012.03.23 08:36:00 -
[49] - Quote
Karma Bad wrote:BUT really , how much more punishment can highsec pvper's take.
BAHAHAHAHAHA High sec ganking is not PVP |
Cannibal Kane
Brotherhood of KANE
305
|
Posted - 2012.03.23 08:39:00 -
[50] - Quote
discordigant wrote:Karma Bad wrote:BUT really , how much more punishment can highsec pvper's take. BAHAHAHAHAHA High sec ganking is not PVP
It not about ganking. Alot of people in threat are morons it seems.
I'm not a Pirate, I'm a Terrorist. |
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Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
124
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Posted - 2012.03.23 09:13:00 -
[51] - Quote
I'm not so sure about the sec status hits, that needs some work.
However, the suspect thing seems like it could work.
Would give the hisec people (and I admit I am one) a chance to defend themselves and 'their system' against the hisec greifer.
Because, lets be honest, preying on the weak, while it may be fun for some, its hardly balanced.
Jint Hikaru - Miner / Salvager / Explorer / SpaceBum
In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. |
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
228
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Posted - 2012.03.23 09:39:00 -
[52] - Quote
--Ninja salvaging has effectively dead since the Noctis crashed salvage prices.
Mission runner baiting, now on life support since the Orca nerfs - will be effectively dead.
The kill itself was rarely a problem, it was the time spent getting trying to get aggression. "Always bet on stupid" was the motto, however.
Well, CCP finally figured out how to save the stupid. Give them a life preserver that they can't figure out how to take off.
"Bear safety condom on = bear don't die."
But, like I said, that profession has been on life support for awhile. Ninja looting, alternative gameplay, RIP. Good job, CCP.
--People seem to be so focused on 'can flippers'. Can flipping has been a joke for a very long time....very low returns on your time, lots of boredom.
Suspect flags are about killing off ganking 'for profit'.
Most of this does not effect me directly, because I almost exclusively kill Exhumers and the loot is simply not that important....I'll carry on instapopping miners day in and day out.
But for those gankers who need to turn a profit - simply looting the wreck (that you killed) will allow anyone to attack you.
First, the RISK:
-spending hours scanning targets
-getting the kill (not guaranteed while ship/insurance loss IS guaranteed)
-cargo must drop....
-cargo must not be stolen by others...
and now....
-you must survive simply collecting the loot - on busy trade routes, no less.
Have fun scooping a successful freighter gank with another freighter.
The risks and inconveniences are being piled on. I'm not seeing any rewards on the other side of the equation.
I would have liked to see PODs drop implants.
I would like to see Orcas made scannable and drop loot - the corporate cargo bay is too easily exploited by haulers.
But I suppose CCP only caters to carebears in highsec these days.... |
Sutskop
PILSGESCHWADER
Monkey Circus
59
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Posted - 2012.03.23 10:00:00 -
[53] - Quote
Karma Bad wrote:I have come to love this game over the years..... BUT really , how much more punishment can highsec pvper's take.
"hisec pvp" is currently basically risk free, so stop whining, you hardcore outlaw hisec canflippers.
I welcome every change to aggro mechanics that make hisec a bit more multiplayer and not the grind place it is. Currently the only ones losing ships there are noobs silly enough to shoot back, the ones that weren't told to not shoot anybody in hisec but instead ignore their surrounding, and that is too boring and counterintuitive for a pvp game. |
Sutskop
PILSGESCHWADER
Monkey Circus
59
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Posted - 2012.03.23 10:05:00 -
[54] - Quote
Herr Wilkus wrote:
First, the RISK:
-spending hours scanning targets
-getting the kill (not guaranteed while ship/insurance loss IS guaranteed)
-cargo must drop....
-cargo must not be stolen by others...
Those are not risks. You are using a throwaway ship from the beginning. |
Krixtal Icefluxor
Bison - Ammatar Thunder
Thundering Herd
400
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Posted - 2012.03.23 10:26:00 -
[55] - Quote
As Dr. Eggnog is currently saying: TOO MANY PEOPLE ARE LEAVING BEFORE THE 3 MONTH MARK.
Noobs are treated "horribly".
The primary reason being you guys can't even let them get a descent start.
Nobody hanging around =no profits for CCP=No EVE=No game for YOU at all.
It's a rather simple equation.
YOUR own extreme, out-of-control behaviors and playstyle have brought this about.
OMG He Spent His Free-áAURUM !
God is simply-áthe very extraordinary power of the Universe to organize Itself as percieved.
-á-á- Lee Smolin "Three Roads to Quantum Gravity" |
Reppyk
The Black Shell
P O D
69
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Posted - 2012.03.23 11:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
Almost every reply in this thread is terrible. 
My feeling :
RR neutral will not end, but you won't see that much on Jita 44 (noob undocks, the sensor boosted legion points it, noob's friends undock and start melting the poor legion, the 11 neutral guardians try to save it, and the 231 neutral tornados around will alpha them one by one).
I'm disappointed :
- what about the flags and lowsec ? Goddamnit, what's the problem of being a "suspect" down there ?
- will sensor boosting make you a suspect ? or tracking links ?
- it's the highsec incursion nerf ? (suddenly, hundred of "suspect" logistics, everywhere !)
- still no word about corp jumping, dec shield, invulnerable pos
- no ponies.
- canflipping seriously ? nobody gives a **** about it
- the worst nerf ever for the gankers (good luck getting the loot from the wreck in an indus and making it alive).
- 1mn agression timer for the logis please. It would nerf a bit too the retards playing station games with carriers in low/00NPC (or even sov). |
Tallian Saotome
Fractured Core
Fatal Ascension
580
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Posted - 2012.03.23 11:04:00 -
[57] - Quote
Herr Wilkus wrote:
First, the RISK:
-spending hours scanning targets
-getting the kill (not guaranteed while ship/insurance loss IS guaranteed)
Thats not risk, thats effort. There is a difference, you know.
Risk is 'I might get blown up' or 'I might lose all my isk'
You have a guaranteed explosion of you ship, so no risk there.
Only thing you are actually risking is wasting your time, and well, you are already playing a game about internet spaceships, so I am pretty sure thats moot.
Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom. |
Reppyk
The Black Shell
P O D
69
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Posted - 2012.03.23 11:06:00 -
[58] - Quote
Tallian Saotome wrote:Only thing you are actually risking is wasting your time, and well, you are already playing a game about internet spaceships, so I am pretty sure thats moot. I have seen "a few" gankers getting podded.
(but that's not really the point of this thread) |
Lady Spank
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
1910
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Posted - 2012.03.23 11:39:00 -
[59] - Quote
I don't see how you can have issue with incurring a sec penalty hit for a criminal act, especially considering any of these suspect initiations don't lower your sec enough to kick you out of high-sec. That's left to the GCC acts like suicide gangs.
The versus system sounds fundamentally damaging to low sec small gang and solo PVP initially but it remains to be seen as some of you high-sec PVPers have no intention of going to low/null as it is. I doubt it will draw away too many already in low/null and at any rate, it might be a good way for people to learn their chops before moving on to something more interesting like hunting down your targets and engaging larger numbers. I got my start in high-sec offering 1v1's so I don't fundamentally see a massive problem. I'd prefer there was still some element of risk involved since it was always fun dealing with surprise remote rep and other backup... forcing pure 1v1 kind of neuters the experience and encourages yet more of an expectation of safety in New Eden. A direction CCP really don't need to go down further.
The real problem with the proposed changes AS THEY STAND NOW is that flagging yourself to everyone does not mean you can fight everyone back should they choose to shoot you. There's no way that will go through as currently proposed though.
Overall, the changes look interesting and if they do it right it means high-sec PVP could be interesting, but will force the griefer noobs to learn to deal with numbers and face some risk when flipping noobs.
(a¦á_a¦â) ~ http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.com/ ~ (a¦á_a¦â) |
Subdolus Venator
State War Academy
Caldari State
14
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Posted - 2012.03.23 11:55:00 -
[60] - Quote
kiki mo wrote:
Do you think that will work? It seems, to me at least, to be aimed at the ninjas, can-flippers and other ne'er-do-wells of hisec with the intention of creating a completely safe zone.
Are you kidding me? This is the creatiion of one of the greatest griefing tools, ever.
Swipe mission-crittical stuff in a n00bship, re-can it before you get shot-up, sit back and giggle as n00bs turn themselves in knots trying to decide whether to become criminals, or abandon their mission.
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