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Connner Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.11 13:15:00 - [31] Originally by: Mara Starr As has been stated above, you really shouldn't solo or do missions in a SB, but it is possible to solo someone possibly tanked if you range and and targeting speed are maxed and you have the targeting dampeners and skill to constantly be dampening or cloaking in between volleys. In my own experience a SB (Manticore is my SB of choice) can do a world of damage in terms of corp operations support roles. The best way to think of a stealth bomber is as a real world sniper. He can inflict a heavy amount of damage at a far range, but hes only one man and head on engagements are almost a death sentence. Now everything everyone has said about using them for gangs is applicable, but they work even better with a corp. You can disrupt operations like others have said above, but your role in a flat out battle or in the time leading up to it can be invaluable. A SB can sit off about 100-200 KM from a POS or gate and observe everything about the enemy and relay their movements to their corp. Additionally they can close up to a reasonable close distance and serve as as a warp beacon of sorts or make a book mark, disemnate it and then sit off. In terms of a battle, a SB can effectively target and kill many a support ship sitting if it has its range maxed and be outside the reach of some of the heavier ships. That's my $0.02. I disagree with the long rang tactic of an SB. Maybe if you were in a large gang it would be ok. However if you are in a small gang or posibly soloing (not a good idea, but some do), the best is to get within about 30-60km, decloak, launch a volley and then recloak before the missiles hit. If you are too far away your missils won't hit because you lose your lock, but if you are in the sweet spot you can pop in and pop out before your victem knows whats going on. This is more effective in a gang because you need the high alpha from multiple ships to pop someone on the first or second volley. Again SB's are not omgpwnmobiles, but they have a highly specilized role and are indeed usefull when they stick to that role. They will be even more effictive if the proposed Black Opps buff gets implimented soonish.
Tac Ginaz The Righteous Few	Posted - 2008.10.11 16:14:00 - [32] My first and one love in this game has been the stealth bomber. What you hear from others is mostly true. The SB is not a ship you want to get into if you are thinking that you can go solo hunting pvp. Doing that just gets you killed very quickly. The stealth bomber has several roles, all of which require it to work closely with other ship types. Role I: Fleet Support Type 1: Damage Assist. Sit 8km outside your fleet battleship's cluster and fire your cruise missiles at soft targets (cruisers, support ships) from long range. Not very glamourous, not very stealthy.. but in the end result you end up achieving something useful for your fleet. Type 2: Gate Camp. You need to be with some non-stealth frigates to tackle. You're there as the big bad DPS add on. Type 3: Bomber. Perhaps THE definite, ultimate role of the SB is to lob bombs at an enemy fleet. You must be working in conjunction with several other Bombers AND a recon frigate or else your bombs will be wasted. People say that bombing is useless. Its true when you do it solo or when you just get a couple more bombers who fire the bombs in an uncoordinated fashion. As single bombing is useless, I will skip that. To bomb effectively you need: 1, preferably 2 recon frigates 6 stealth bombers (or more). It is crucial to have the recon frigs.. they will be your way in and out of the enemy fleet, 'mobile safespots' if you will. Lets say the cluster of enemy BS is sighted. The bombers and recon frigs go to a safespot and cloak and wait. The recons head cloaked to the enemy fleet. One of them sets itself 80km on one side of the cluster, the other one sets itself 10km from the cluster. The 10km one frigate must be the one closest to the safespot where the SB's are in. It is best if the SB's are near the Star of the solar system as its an easier reference point to set up the attack. example: ---80kmrecon-------fleet---10kmrecon-------------->SB's--star Once the recons are set, the bombers attack in 2 waves. First wave jumps in from star to 10kmrecon using 'jump to 10km' so that when they emerge they will be 20km from the enemy fleet. First wave aligns to fleet cluster upon exiting warp, fires EM bombs + EM FOF cruises then warps to 10km from the 80km recon. 2nd wave of bombers jumps in 8 seconds after the 1st wave makes its jump to 10km frigate. They do the same process, firing EXP bombs and EXP FOF cruises When each wave arrives at 80km point, it turns around and warps to 40km of 10km frigate...making them appear again, 20km from the fleet cluster (fleet clusters usually 10km wide so 40km = fleet ships are about 18km from emergence point). They fire their bombs and warp to safespot near the sun (which is where their nose is pointing if they warped to the recon frig). Result is the fleet receives a first wave of EM bombs and missiles, knocking out the shields of most fleet setup battleships in the blast zone.. then 5 seconds later the explosive bombs hit them, likely killing several BS's. Then its repeated on the OTHER side of the fleet, causing more carnage. If you have enough stealth bombers for 3 waves, the first wave should be VOID bombers to prevent any ship from warping out. For that you'd need about 12 bombers. A small team working like this can achieve amazing results and its not that hard really. Once the first wave goes in its all a matter of the 2nd wave counting to 5 then warping in after them.
Connner Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.11 18:23:00 - [33] Tac Ginaz! That is brilliant. I'm going to have to try that w/ my corp. I havn't messed w/ bombs yet since they are expensive and require precise planning. This seems like some very nice planning.
Darkness consumes	Posted - 2008.10.11 18:39:00 - [34] one thing i will say about stealth bombers and know that i dont currently fly one 7 ships 6 stealthbombers and 1 of the other cloaking frigates taclking and ewing took my abaddon out
baltec1 Antares Shipyards Vanguard.	Posted - 2008.10.11 18:58:00 - [35] Originally by: Connner Tac Ginaz! That is brilliant. I'm going to have to try that w/ my corp. I havn't messed w/ bombs yet since they are expensive and require precise planning. This seems like some very nice planning. The very best us of a bomb is for blob warfare. If you have an enemy force on a gate stopping your assault from getting in a system then a bomber (which is already in said system) can launch a bomb at the enemy force and watch as they have an "oh shit" moment. If they dont warp off the smaller ships will die but if they do warp off (and most of the time they will scatter) this will give your attacking force the chance it needs to jump in. Basicly bombs are an anti blob weapon.
Adaera	Posted - 2008.10.12 00:12:00 - [36] Originally by: Connner They will be even more effictive if the proposed Black Opps buff gets implimented soonish. Black ops buff? Has something been confirmed for those? Sorry to go so off topic but I've been praying for a use for those almost since I started EVE
Liang Nuren No Salvation	Posted - 2008.10.12 00:19:00 - [37] Originally by: Adaera Originally by: Connner They will be even more effictive if the proposed Black Opps buff gets implimented soonish. Black ops buff? Has something been confirmed for those? Sorry to go so off topic but I've been praying for a use for those almost since I started EVE And now I know how people feel when I talk about the Myrm being one of my first pirate ships (I started Eve right after it was introduced, IIRC) Um, on that note though, they've said they're going to give it a fuel bay.... which it damn well should have, have you seen the amount of fuel it takes to jump something?!?!?!? -Liang --
TimMc Gallente The Motley Crew	Posted - 2008.10.12 00:26:00 - [38] Originally by: Feng Schui nice thing about stealth bombers is running with interceptor / frig / Cruiser gangs.. seems like i'm always the top damage dealer for some reason I've lost my interceptor to a rapier/SB combo.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.10.12 00:32:00 - [39] I dislike stealth bombers. I want to like them, but every time I take one out out play, I'm left feeling that I'd have been better off in ... pretty much any other ship. This is mostly because their capability and role is ranged firepower projection. And battleships just do that better. Even with cloaking recalibration... well, it's not like you need a fast lock, when you've got enough support to stop them warping off. Or their role is cloaked mobility - and recons do _that_ better. (For bonus points recons can do more DPS, and usually a few other tricks too) They're bad at being a frigate, because they're fat, slow and fragile. They're bad at being anything larger, because they have 'frigate' dps. Their niche is in bombing - which in practice happens rarely, as the right situations to execute are much less common. And also blackops bridging - they're cheap firepower to jump portal, so actually at that they're acceptable. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking?
ARGH69 Beer For Breakfast	Posted - 2008.10.17 20:03:00 - [40] what's this? another stealth bomber thread and another series of "smart" pvp'ers bashing the ship again?.......LOL! this is how you fly the ship; null Linkage
Pac SubCom A.W.M	Posted - 2008.10.17 20:32:00 - [41] Originally by: ARGH69 what's this? another stealth bomber thread and another series of "smart" pvp'ers bashing the ship again?.......LOL! this is how you fly the ship; null Linkage Interesting setups. Straight and simple! --------------- ∞ TQFE
Jerat Gallente Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.10.18 16:15:00 - [42] Originally by: Karrade Krise If you time it just right, and are close enough, align to warp out point, uncloak, avtivate mods, click target, right click celestial object, hold cursor over warp to, wait that split second for target to pop, click warp to. You now have a kill, and got away before anyone could lock you in less than 2 seconds. Works extremely well if the target and his friends have no idea you're there. Guaranteed escape that way. This! Killing a ceptor that is not expecting you is always a big lol, especially if they are in a big gang camping a gate And remeber if solo never attack something you cant kill in one wolly
Neyro7830 Gallente Stormfront A.W. Stormfront J.U.N.T.A.	Posted - 2008.10.18 16:35:00 - [43] Originally by: Jerat Originally by: Karrade Krise If you time it just right, and are close enough, align to warp out point, uncloak, avtivate mods, click target, right click celestial object, hold cursor over warp to, wait that split second for target to pop, click warp to. You now have a kill, and got away before anyone could lock you in less than 2 seconds. Works extremely well if the target and his friends have no idea you're there. Guaranteed escape that way. This! Killing a ceptor that is not expecting you is always a big lol, especially if they are in a big gang camping a gate And remeber if solo never attack something you cant kill in one wolly I just installed fraps so I could document my sneakiness in this fashion. ^_^ ------------------------------------------------ I am not responsible for the above post, because apparently, my cat has learned how to type. :3
OffBeaT	Posted - 2008.10.18 19:41:00 - [44] Edited by: OffBeaT on 18/10/2008 19:42:11 go with the drake.. its a better t****r and pvp hunter solo then the Stealth Bomber.. ill use a drake up against two Stealth Bombers anyday with high jamming skills from what im seeing, just put a cloak on it. Stealth Bombers look like great back up ships for the raven... :) anyway thats how i would use them in esscort with my raven.
Karrade Krise Galatic P0RN Starz	Posted - 2008.10.18 19:54:00 - [45] Originally by: OffBeaT Edited by: OffBeaT on 18/10/2008 19:42:11 go with the drake.. its a better t****r and pvp hunter solo then the Stealth Bomber.. ill use a drake up against two Stealth Bombers anyday with high jamming skills from what im seeing, just put a cloak on it. Stealth Bombers look like great back up ships for the raven... :) anyway thats how i would use them in esscort with my raven. wut?
Word	Posted - 2008.10.18 22:46:00 - [46] I use the Hound to rat in a 0.2 system camped by a pirate corp. Got my 5.0 sec doing this. ( i then use an inty to salvage and get loot. Do not use the SB to open cans, you will get caught and die very quickly.) You have to train up all the related skills to get the 0 recal time, and max speed while cloaked. With 2X Sensor boosters you get near insta lock and great targeting range. Ever since the Hound boost to 3 launchers I've had the most fun. With Caldari Navy cruise missles I get over 500 hp and a good ROF with balistic mod in the low rack. They are terribly frail, I don't even bother with any tank mod, but when used correctly, very survivable. Remember, always stay aligned, and use the cloak to your advantage, ie, cloak, align, warp to move safely. Low friction nozzle rigs help the ship to align more like a frig. I want to be LUDICROUS
Karrade Krise Galatic P0RN Starz	Posted - 2008.10.18 23:31:00 - [47] Originally by: Word You have to train up all the related skills to get the 0 recal time, and max speed while cloaked. Uh...there is no recal time with stealth bombers, you uncloak and can lock as soon as you turn off the cloak.
Tac Ginaz The Righteous Few	Posted - 2008.10.19 07:19:00 - [48] Well, there is another setup which is good for sort-of solo PVP'ing. But I still stick with my earlier statement: Solo PVP with a bomber is pointless... because STEALTH is pointless. You are still seen on the local chat and thus everyone knows there is a hostile in the system. but anyways, here is my solo setup (it actually works good for faction warfare!).. it is quite demanding of skill-sets as well as player skill: SkillRequirements: Cruise Missile 5 Warhead Upgrades 5 Target Navigation Prediction 5 Guided Missile Precision 5 Missile Projection 5 FOF Missiles 5 Covert Ops 5 Navigation 5 CPU and Powergrid reduction skills both to 5 (including advanced) Smartbomb 5 Setup only works with HOUND bomber. Hi: 1X small smartbomb (EM damage) 3X Cruise Missile Cloak II Mids: ECM BURST Low: CPU II 2X BCU II Note: Depending on what target you going for the lowslots can be changed to a combination of BCU II and Overdrive II and you can switch 2 of the cruise launchers to be T2 for faster refire of the FOF's if you have t2 cruise skill at lev 4 or 5. Missiles to use with this loadout: FOF missiles. The purpose of this setup is simple: Do not give the target any time to react. Think about the weapon loadout and you will see how it works: The FOF missiles do not require target lock. FOF missiles require your target to be 'hostile' to you. FOF missiles lock onto the nearest hostile to you. Smartbomb has a range of 5km Bomber loses cloak when inside 3km of a target. Cruise missiles fly at 3.7 km / s Hound is the Fastest cloaked bomber (even faster with Overdrive II's) Hound has bonus to Explosive damage Bomber can re-cloak 3 seconds after firing. To give you an example of an attack I carried out with this setup : Gate camper was in system. 3 interceptors and some T2 cruisers. I come in from a different gate they were not watching. Having been in this system before I have saved spots for off-grid near the gate. Jumped into that bookmarked point just off the grid by the camped gate. Cloaked. Speed cloaked with hound using overdrives is 720ms. Cloaked and racing towards the gate, I enter the gate grid and see 2 interceptors far below of the gate and the third was above the gate..each about 50km apart from gate. distance from each other was about 100km. T2 cruisers are sitting on top of the gate next to it waiting. Choose the topmost interceptor as target.. and flew to it. 10km from it I slow my ship down to 100ms and creep slowly to it, the timing has to be done right. Ship is aimed so it passes inside the 5km radius from target at a tangent. At 6km I punch full speed and hit decloak. After the 1 second it takes for ship to decloak (and its speed being nearly 300ms) hit the SMARTBOMB followed by the FOF missiles. (1 EM 2 Explosives, EM being the first in the firing sequence) Count to 3 and re-cloak, change vector, speed the fek away from the wreck at 720ms. What happened: In less than 1 second the Interceptor is hit by: EM smartbomb II (shield down to 90%) *** tags the interceptor as hostile FOF EM cruise missile (shield down to 10%) FOF Explosive Missile #1 (shield to 0, armor to 20%) FOF Explosive Missile #2 (armor to 0, hull to 0) (remember the cruises fly at 3.7km/s so it takes a second for them to hit the target..not enough time for the startled interceptor to hit the MWD!) The other interceptor and cruisers could not react in time before I re-cloaked. A bomber smacking one of their own with NO WARNING. The Hound's superb cloaked speed allowed me to be nearly 4km away from the death scene before the first interceptor zoomed by the wreck circling it. This requires many skillpoints for the ship to be fitted and the damage modifiers be high enough so that the FOF's can kill in one hit. Also requires a pilot that knows the target and is patient.
slightly sillydude	Posted - 2008.10.19 07:36:00 - [49] I will say, one thing bombers can do is rat in unfriendly 0.0. The cloak bonus does help get through gatecamps, and the extreme range and tiny size allows them to tank turret based NPC battleships, and the range gives them enough time to pop the NPC cruisers and below before they get to you. I used to use a hound to rat in the great wildlands and it was reasonably effective.
Andracin Free Galactic Enterprises Violent-Tendencies	Posted - 2008.10.19 09:04:00 - [50] SB's suck at...stealth bombing...I have yet to see a single time a SB deploys its bomb and survives long enough to warp out. Where they do shine is combined with recons...falcon jams, arazu scrams, rapier webs, pilgrim neuts and SB's provide a massive amount of alpha damage. This is particularly effective when your main goal is to harass a larger force and keep them guessing where your going to pop up next. for a 12-15 mil fitted glass cannon they are fairly effective at what they do.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.10.19 10:03:00 - [51] Originally by: ARGH69 Edited by: ARGH69 on 17/10/2008 20:32:07 what's this? another stealth bomber thread and another series of "smart" pvp'ers bashing the ship again?.......LOL! this is how you fly the ship; Linkage Oh look, someone using the single counter example as a justification why the ships are good. Somehow missing that whilst stealth bombers were used effectively in that video, several other ship choices would have done a better job. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking?
ARGH69 Beer For Breakfast	Posted - 2008.10.19 19:23:00 - [52] Originally by: James Lyrus Originally by: ARGH69 Edited by: ARGH69 on 17/10/2008 20:32:07 what's this? another stealth bomber thread and another series of "smart" pvp'ers bashing the ship again?.......LOL! this is how you fly the ship; Linkage Oh look, someone using the single counter example as a justification why the ships are good. Somehow missing that whilst stealth bombers were used effectively in that video, several other ship choices would have done a better job. oh look, another clueless player. tell me, what other solo ship would have done a better job? it was a single stealth bomber picking off one of their tech 2 frigates on a 100 man bubble camp with a half dozen interceptors and several nano vagabonds. lol i love it. keep it comming sb bashers. my favorites are the ones that claim it is useless because it cannot use the covert ops cloak lol!
Mire Stoude Cash Money Brothers Elitist Cowards	Posted - 2008.10.20 00:02:00 - [53] I've enjoyed the stealth bomber. It could use some tweaks to make it a little more useful. A covert ops cloak would be nice, but then it would interfere with the covops frig role. My corp had a 9 man gang consisting of 5 bombers, an 2 interceptors, a covert ops ship and a falcon. A sucker bubble with well placed decloak cans helped quite a bit. We did some damage and had some fun while only losing a ceptor because he decided to go a few systems over and go 1v1 a vaga and ishtar.
Karrade Krise Galatic P0RN Starz	Posted - 2008.10.20 04:43:00 - [54] [] Originally by: ARGH69 Edited by: ARGH69 on 17/10/2008 20:32:07 lol i love it. keep it comming sb bashers. my favorites are the ones that claim it is useless because it cannot use the covert ops cloak lol! If you can't figure out how to use a Stealth Bomber the way it is, then you don't deserve to warp cloaked in it. I love when people agree with me on that :D
Aram Gishno Caldari The Graduates Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.10.20 16:16:00 - [55] Edited by: Aram Gishno on 20/10/2008 16:16:36 Originally by: baltec1 Basicly bombs are an anti blob weapon. This statement is what I feel as the best role of the SB. aside from the fun kills you may get here and there it is a good way to deal with blobs. Bombs also have a good success rate against fighters (18 mil a piece) and breaking the locks from spidered carriers. When used properly a SB can be a good tactic to bring in a major cap/fleet battle. That is if the lag monster doesn't kill you first.
Galia Bonaventure	Posted - 2008.10.20 19:13:00 - [56] Originally by: Mire Stoude A sucker bubble with well placed decloak cans helped quite a bit. Sploitz!

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