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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
TrDuff Minmatar No one Cares	Posted - 2009.01.15 12:33:00 - [6031] This is a mistake, it just further proves that CCP does not understand their playerbase. It seems to make sense on a corporate level, by inplementing this you will lose customers, but it won't matter if less then half the unsubscribed trainers leave, CCP will actually end up making more money and have less work with the ones that do stay. What CCP corporate doesn't understand is that much more then half of these unsubscribed playerbase only pay some subs because of this feature. Yes most of these people will continue to play but now CCP will be missing the extra 3 subs per account that only existed because of this training. This reminds me of the time a local service businessman was too busy with too many customers, so he started charging twice as much. He lost half his customers right away but ended up much less busy and with the same amount of income as before (he was on easy street). It also left a very bad taste for the remaining long term customer base who eventually went elsewhere leaving the businessman with only new short term customers that were more difficult to work with and would leave him on a whim without a moments notice. Leaving him with no solid customerbase and a lot larger advertisment cost trying to get new short term customers.
Anrui Koiju	Posted - 2009.01.15 12:57:00 - [6032] I'm just offended at the blatant lies in the first two paragraphs of the official statement. If they'd just come out and said 'hey guys, the credit crunch is here, and we're not making as much money as we hoped, so we're gonna remove ghost training in order to get you to pay us more money, thanks!' I would have purchased my next subscription here and now, honesty like that deserves money! But no, they try to spout some BS about it being a bug, blah blah blah. So instead, I'm considering not subscribing ever again. It's not about whether they should be 'allowed' to do this, its simply a case of customer confidence. I don't like being lied to, and as a consequence I am less likely to give my money, simple as that.
Gunnanmon Gallente UNITED STAR SYNDICATE	Posted - 2009.01.15 16:16:00 - [6033] Originally by: Lesique Or is it all about the money? Is this point even in question at this stage? The Ghost-training vote thread
Duskadantor	Posted - 2009.01.18 12:45:00 - [6034] Wow, 6000+ I'm impressed. Way to go everyone. You gotta hand it to CCP. Their marketing team, pulling out all the stops since this thread. March the 10th will see a retail re-release of Eve. Can only help improve their user base.
Shkval Valiant Logistics Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.18 17:29:00 - [6035] yea....theyre going for quantity over quality.
Ken LEEEEEEE Amarr	Posted - 2009.01.18 18:47:00 - [6036] Edited by: Ken LEEEEEEE on 18/01/2009 18:47:10 none cares about this anymore... long story short CCP don't care what pilots think !
8Z 6	Posted - 2009.01.18 21:34:00 - [6037] Originally by: Ken LEEEEEEE Edited by: Ken LEEEEEEE on 18/01/2009 18:47:10 none cares about this anymore... long story short CCP don't care what pilots think ! With a 201 page long thread youre blatantly mistaken, altho its painfully obvious CCCP doesnt give half a sh!t what its customers think.
Katana Seiko Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.19 22:35:00 - [6038] What does CCP mean again? Crowd Control Productions - does that mean "controlled by the crowd" or "we control the crowd"? I think that 6000 posts should be enough to rethink ghost training... --- "Multiple exclamation marks are a sure sign for a diseased mind." -Terry Pratchett
Cold Burrito	Posted - 2009.01.20 07:28:00 - [6039] Was using 5 day promotion to ghost a skill while in eve-low. Reactivate in February. Now leaving eve possibly forever because I was turned off during a swing time over what game to play.
Aina O'Sinnor	Posted - 2009.01.20 11:00:00 - [6040] Thanks god for this 5 day reactivation. I've been following this thread from day one of its creation. I was about to come back, and reactivate my two accounts, cause both had their skill training completed. I will not come back. Three big mistakes: 1. 30 days GTCs removed from the market. 2. Ghosttraining declared as a bug and fixed it. 3. CCP not commenting on this thread. Silence. I am ****ed. See you all in jumpgate evolution.

Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.20 22:54:00 - [6041] Edited by: Saphirro on 20/01/2009 22:56:35 Originally by: Aina O'Sinnor Three big mistakes: 1. 30 days GTCs removed from the market. 2. Ghosttraining declared as a bug and fixed it. 3. CCP not commenting on this thread. Silence. Oh but they did! Well, kinda: Extract from CSM-CCP meeting 2.1 Formal Meeting Day 2 - Saturday 17th January 2009 I. Mission Monopoly On Standing http://evajobse.net/csmwiki/index.php/Mission_Monopoly_on_Standing TL;DR: CCP understands the need to look into this, and there was a general consensus between CSM and CCP that the systems could be a lot more interesting. II. Ghost Training http://evajobse.net/csmwiki/index.php/Ghost_Training Link: TL;DR: Up yours TL;DR CCP apologise for the communication of how this was introduced, but it is not going to be added back into the game. Stats Raised by: Darius Johnson Submission Date: 11/1/2008 Issue ID: 0103-04-0086 Summary CCP has removed the documented feature known as "Ghost Training". The nature of this request is to ask CCP to attend to the will of their customers and reinstitute this long-running feature. Solution Turn it back on Pros Players who leave the game temporarily will have a vested interest in returning to new skills that have been training while they were away. The playerbase will be happy. They are not happy about this change. Cons I suppose there's a possibility that the system's somehow been gamed by people. No supporting information has been provided to explain this. 2 Pros, 1 con - a Con with no supporting evidence provided. And who says CCP doesn't care?!
Anope Gallente HammerTime Production Group Ethereal Spawn	Posted - 2009.01.21 05:38:00 - [6042] Edited by: Anope on 21/01/2009 05:38:17 I'm a big floater from game to game, and eve is the only one I keep comming back to.. a huuge part of that is I have an incentive to join back up, I don't feel like the world has left me behind because now (for example) I'm finished Battlecruise V, and im comming back in a shiny command ship.. Fail on CCP's part
Mezikk Earned In Blood	Posted - 2009.01.21 16:44:00 - [6043] 6k posts about time to bring it back? or are a few thousand more voices yet to be heard? eve is not a game people play non-stop, but are more encouraged to return to fly a new ship / use a new module which is not exciting by any means to watch train. The reason for disabling was people getting offended at this, which everyone can see is simply a lie. The marketing people surely will realise this is not getting CCP more money long term?
Skooba Steve	Posted - 2009.01.22 09:22:00 - [6044] Wow, first time I actually was bothered to read this as I didn't believe it, selling off and closing one char right now.
DeODokktor Dark Templars The Fonz Presidium	Posted - 2009.01.22 11:14:00 - [6045] Originally by: Lesique Its all fair and well you stop Ghost training, but if its only availible for paying customer. Why cannot I train all my other toons on my account. Hey I pay for the account so I can train... Or is this an over sight for cash is king? I would suggest that you allow other characters to train at slower speed from your main toon. I am sure CCP can make a new sales ploy... Or is it all about the money? Actually, The dollar has gained enough so that CCP now gets 1.8* what they once received (the markets will move back in blance one day tho).. As they said they save most of the money as euro/usd then they instantly made enough just through the conversion to retire a couple of staff members ;P... Of course, they could say "We didnt benefit cause the cost of food went up" but I doubt they gave all staff a 80% pay rise! Some of us were hoping for things like "skill queues" as the ONLY reason they ever gave for not doing it was that people wouldnt play, well, now people must be paying to skill so I dont see why it didnt roll.. Oh well, I am sure they are enjoying the economic downturn as their company has made a mint because of it!.
Denalak	Posted - 2009.01.22 11:52:00 - [6046] Just grabbed a quote from the 'outrage' topic. "Remove Ghost training okay, BUT give us skill queue." Now wasn't the reason they didnt add a skill queue because of Ghost Training? Now that theres no Ghost Training can we at least get some form of skill queue? Skill queuing should be a nice idea now that Ghost Training is gone.
Eniy Oh Gallente United Systems Navy	Posted - 2009.01.22 16:08:00 - [6047] Edited by: Eniy Oh on 22/01/2009 16:09:07 So recently the record of the most people online at the same time has been broken again, what does that fact spell out for all the predictions that disabling ghost-training would hurt EVE's growth? Growth is btw a thing that happens even if while things progress on some side they regress on another side (if looking merely at the ammount of active subscriptions, this applies). Many players maybe leaving, but also a lot of players sign up. So it can still be growth and very sensible from a business perspective. With EVE being a single-universe game where you'll always have tens of thousands players on the same server as you, I wonder if this move by CCP isn't also a way to encourage people to play the game more actively. It's always sad to see your corp mates just log ocasionally for some skill changing, or have this awesome capital pilot only log when he feels like, "because he wants to take a break from the game". IMHO you play the game or you don't. IMHO this game is also about numbers, there's not much you can accomplish just by yourself. So if it's clear you'll benefit more from the game's features (read: amongst other things, skill training) if you log on frequently, it encourages the players who remain to be more active and thus there'll be more group activity. Just my .02 cents.
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.23 01:02:00 - [6048] Edited by: Saphirro on 23/01/2009 01:02:54 Originally by: Eniy Oh IMHO you play the game or you don't. IMHO this game is also about numbers, there's not much you can accomplish just by yourself. Not true. Many people play just fine by themselves, whether it's mining, PVP, PVE, manufacturing/researching or playing the market. If the only goal to the game is to get 0.0 space. fly in fleets and build an outpost - then you'd have a point. Originally by: Eniy Oh So if it's clear you'll benefit more from the game's features (read: amongst other things, skill training) if you log on frequently, To a degree yes. However, again some people benefit from the way the game actually plays just by the occasional logon. You do realise that just because it's classed as an MMO (or MMORPG) it doesn't mean can't solo and have fun right? Originally by: Eniy Oh So if it's clear you'll benefit more from the game's features (read: amongst other things, skill training) if you log on frequently, it encourages the players who remain to be more active and thus there'll be more group activity. Again, not strictly true. If the skills were experienced based then yes, frequent logging in would provide more benefit. They aren't though. There is no more benefit to the actual skills of a character from logging on and setting a training skill and not logging on for a period of time, than there is for being logged on and/or playing 23/7. The only difference is that now the skill progression is more Dollar/Euro based too.
fried eggs Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.23 02:46:00 - [6049] Originally by: Eniy Oh Edited by: Eniy Oh on 22/01/2009 16:09:07 So recently the record of the most people online at the same time has been broken again, what does that fact spell out for all the predictions that disabling ghost-training would hurt EVE's growth? Growth is btw a thing that happens even if while things progress on some side they regress on another side (if looking merely at the ammount of active subscriptions, this applies). Many players maybe leaving, but also a lot of players sign up. So it can still be growth and very sensible from a business perspective. With EVE being a single-universe game where you'll always have tens of thousands players on the same server as you, I wonder if this move by CCP isn't also a way to encourage people to play the game more actively. It's always sad to see your corp mates just log ocasionally for some skill changing, or have this awesome capital pilot only log when he feels like, "because he wants to take a break from the game". IMHO you play the game or you don't. IMHO this game is also about numbers, there's not much you can accomplish just by yourself. So if it's clear you'll benefit more from the game's features (read: amongst other things, skill training) if you log on frequently, it encourages the players who remain to be more active and thus there'll be more group activity. Just my .02 cents. I was going to break this post down point by point but to be honest; I am tired of caring about Eve. I'll just say this about the new record and how it reflects on the current state of affairs...it doesn't. We have no way of knowing how many of the 45K (or whatever the number was) players were on trials or the 5 day freebie. However, judging by the number of banner ad's that you now find on "prime time" sites and the statements from CCP stating how great the recent freebies have been, you would have to assume that there are some. This recent record reflects about 5% growth in a little over a year. What we will probably never know is what the ôCustomer acquisition costö was? In other words, did it cost CCP more to get this new record than they will make? They had a system in place that brought long time customers back after periodic breaks, that didnÆt COST them anything. They decided that they didn't want us back and would rather go after new blood. Right or wrong, it appears that the decision is written in stone. So, as I said, I am tired of caring. Eve was a great game (and I know that some still love it). For me, the party is over...
Kaptain Kruncher	Posted - 2009.01.23 07:45:00 - [6050] I thought you quit.

Zaldoza Caldari EVEfan.dk	Posted - 2009.01.23 09:29:00 - [6051] Well if nothing else,i hope CCP have learned a good lesson..Dont lie too your costumers I dont really mind the removal off ghost training,only how it was put out too the public..
Ezoran DuBlaidd	Posted - 2009.01.23 09:54:00 - [6052] ok, so since non-subbed training (recently renamed to ghost training so as to try to put a spooky feel to it so that people would fear it and be glad that it's gone...), is gone... am i going to start getting 'rested' skill point generation? i mean.... that IS what non-subbed training was the equivalent of, yes? so, since i can only have a single character per account, the rested skill training (same as rested experience gain) should simply be added to each account after d/t each day. say, 2-3 hours per 24 hour day where you gain SP at double the normal rate? or, is the next change going to be that you only gain SP while you're logged on AND actively using the skill in question?
Liu	Posted - 2009.01.23 10:58:00 - [6053] Originally by: Eniy Oh With EVE being a single-universe game where you'll always have tens of thousands players on the same server as you, I wonder if this move by CCP isn't also a way to encourage people to play the game more actively. It's always sad to see your corp mates just log ocasionally for some skill changing, or have this awesome capital pilot only log when he feels like, "because he wants to take a break from the game". IMHO you play the game or you don't. IMHO this game is also about numbers, there's not much you can accomplish just by yourself. So if it's clear you'll benefit more from the game's features (read: amongst other things, skill training) if you log on frequently, it encourages the players who remain to be more active and thus there'll be more group activity. Just my .02 cents. dude, none of what you say has nothing to do with ghost training, but with offline training instead. people logging on just to change the skill are not ghost training. they are training offline. and offline training is here to stay, at least until it is declared an oldtime bug.
Zaldoza Caldari EVEfan.dk	Posted - 2009.01.23 12:01:00 - [6054] Only reason i and im sure many others choose Eve,is the ability to train while offline.Its Eve¦s strongest asset and would be suicide too ever change that,not to mention it would kill the servers forcing people to be on sitting afk in the hangars ..So im not too worried about them ever changing this aspect of the game..
fried eggs Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.23 14:39:00 - [6055] Originally by: Kaptain Kruncher I thought you quit. I know that you are "not the sharpest knife in the drawer" but you surely understand that when you cancel your account, you don't lose the time that you have already paid for. You do get that don't you?
Kaptain Kruncher	Posted - 2009.01.23 15:11:00 - [6056] Originally by: fried eggs Originally by: Kaptain Kruncher I thought you quit. I know that you are "not the sharpest knife in the drawer" but you surely understand that when you cancel your account, you don't lose the time that you have already paid for. You do get that don't you? I do get that. When does your account expire? Soon?
Don West Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.23 19:08:00 - [6057] I would expect a move like this from Sony Online Entertainment. But not from CCP. I just took advantage of the resub promotion and this already puts a bad taste in my mouth. But most lies do that.
Jobby Minmatar UNITED STAR SYNDICATE	Posted - 2009.01.23 23:41:00 - [6058] Originally by: Denalak Just grabbed a quote from the 'outrage' topic. "Remove Ghost training okay, BUT give us skill queue." Now wasn't the reason they didnt add a skill queue because of Ghost Training? Now that theres no Ghost Training can we at least get some form of skill queue? Skill queuing should be a nice idea now that Ghost Training is gone. Presumably you missed the reason for not adding a skill queue.
Zarak1 Kenpach1 R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.25 06:31:00 - [6059] Can't wait for a release date on jumpgate
TemplarMessiah Crusada Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2009.01.25 18:30:00 - [6060] Wel, now we know who those 12-year old emo rage babies are. Can't believe people are whining about this so badly.



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