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Disabling ghost training - the blog edition

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:52:00 - [2491] Originally by: Amarr Hyena see you edited the player guide CCP. dont forget your forum posts to, wouldent want any evidence left over that it was once indeed intended. getting on my bloody nerves and fast. Your stuff... Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Sahara Eternity Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:53:00 - [2492] Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:55:00 Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:54:18 Originally by: Lallante That may be true, but CCP have never said they didnt want us to use the unintended feature while it was possible to do so. In fact, the implication is they didnt mind us using it. This has absolutely ZERO baring on whether they intended to change it. eXcuse me ... who are you ? You have 8 post in the last 30 posts on this thread ... Are you a CCP official ? If not stop posting and let people tell theyr story, if yes log in your main please. EDIT: You beat me to it, make that 9 posts on 2 pages ... Opps added 1 more ...
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2493] Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: James Marshalll I can tell you with no hesitation YOU DO NOT document bugs in a new user guide... No, you can merely claim that YOU don't. So show us another example of where a bug is listed in documentation, in a manner that discribes it as a feature. Any game or application will do.
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2494] This thread is why I hate internet denizens so goddamn much. So **ing self-righteous, so willing to INVENT a reason to get ed off when no other one is available. Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku**
Za Tarc	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2495] Okay, lets play with the idea that this was not intended as a feature. Lets also say that they put it in the documentation because they wanted to be accurate. Now... due to this unintended feature, many many people found the power of two concept agreeable. They bought multiple accounts so that they could slowly work up a few characters (maybe a miner, trader or pvp) without paying an arm and a leg. Some would have bought these accounts anyway, but many would not have. CCP at no point in this documentation said, this feature is not intended and will be removed one day. Instead they took advantage of it and implied that this was a feature. They have now made additional money on this feature.. even if they are not fully aware of it. This leaves us with the perceived reality again, which is that people spent money based on current policy, only to have then revoke that policy after the investment was made. These players have the right to be mad. From their perspective, they have been deceived.
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2496] Originally by: Lallante Id love to know why it matters, to anyone, whether CCP once intended this, once supported it, documented it, whatever. Because then they can be all self-righteous and moral about CCP "lying" to them. (Which sounds a lot better than just whining because their exploit is being disabled.) This is all about the appearance of justification.
FalconBayerskt	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2497] Have CCP responded yet?? (dont have the time to check 80+ pages)
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:54:00 - [2498] Edited by: Lallante on 14/10/2008 19:55:10 Originally by: Sahara Eternity Originally by: Lallante That may be true, but CCP have never said they didnt want us to use the unintended feature while it was possible to do so. In fact, the implication is they didnt mind us using it. This has absolutely ZERO baring on whether they intended to change it. eXcuse me ... who are you ? You have 8 post in the last 30 posts on this thread ... Are you a CCP official ? If not stop posting and let people tell theyr story, if yes log in your main please. This is my main. If you havnt heard of me, it simply means you havnt been playing Eve long enough. You dont control the forums, you dont decide who posts. Go away Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Paladineguru Gallente DAB G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:55:00 - [2499] Now a single customer that doesn't log into the servers may not weigh heavily on our database infrastructure, just as a single snowflake isn't that heavy, hardly a measurable quantity. But it's hard not to notice an avalanche if it hits you. And that's what was starting to happen in our database. and pray tell how did you notice it. this game to record has never erased a single unused account. how many of those un renewed subs with a skill training training still were trials that DIDNT WANT TO COME BACK. how many were older players, a breakdown on where your getting your numbers might help. * please adjust the size of your signature image to no more than 400x120 - CCP Fallout
The Ubernomicon Eight year old girls GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:55:00 - [2500] It looks like a mod is going trough the thread and editing posts and not leaving any notice of the edits. A mod changed the embedding of this img to a link: http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m128/skyl3lazer/whocares.png * the posting of images is not allowed on the forum - CCP Fallout
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:55:00 - [2501] Originally by: Huan Hunglong So show us another example of where a bug is listed in documentation, in a manner that discribes it as a feature. In a manner that describes it as a feature? Where exactly was that?
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:55:00 - [2502] Originally by: Sahara Eternity Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:54:18 Originally by: Lallante That may be true, but CCP have never said they didnt want us to use the unintended feature while it was possible to do so. In fact, the implication is they didnt mind us using it. This has absolutely ZERO baring on whether they intended to change it. eXcuse me ... who are you ? A member of an alliance that has been using undocumented features as part of their gameplay for years.
Ratio Legis Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:55:00 - [2503] Originally by: Julius Rigel Originally by: Catherine Frasier Microsoft documents the Blue Screen of Death in their Windows user guide, so by your logic the BSoD is advertised as a feature of Windows. I'm so starting a threadnought at microsoft.com if they ever nerf bsod. Are you with me? Come on people! If Microsoft came and told all the world the BSOD has in fact been an unintended feature all along and they never wanted to have or supported a mechanism for reporting critical errors to the user (which is the idea of the BSOD), then you'll see all the internet calling them on their bullshit, just as it happens here.
Sahara Eternity Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:56:00 - [2504] Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:58:00 Originally by: Lallante This is my main. If you havnt heard of me, it simply means you havnt been playing Eve long enough. You dont control the forums, you dont decide who posts. Go away LOL !!! Let me spell it to you again: L.O.L ! You joking right ? EDIT: On the second part of ure post that is exacly my point, every one has the right to say his oppinion, you just to ... tenacious ...
Alex Salas BROTHERHOOD OF SPARTA Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:56:00 - [2505] Edited by: Alex Salas on 14/10/2008 19:57:29 Originally by: Lallante Id love to know why it matters, to anyone, whether CCP once intended this, once supported it, documented it, whatever. What difference does it make? They dont like the effect its having on the game now, so they are changing it. Personally, I remember beta when this started happening. Its a side effect of the coding, not the intention, they were just happy with it until now. Grow the **** up people I am not angry because CCP is getting rid of ghost-trains. I utilized it for a few weeks on accident in fact. My accounts were fully paid for 99.9% of the time. I am angry on how blatantly condescending CCP has lied about the situation. I have canceled my four account If you want proof, my corp is part of GBC so you can ask my CEO my views and intentions. One of my accounts is set to lapse in 2 days. I will rid the rest out till the last one lapse in December. Edited for spelling ___ ___ EVE lies...rotating FTL!!! http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?patchlogID=99 On the Serenity server, skills no longer train when the owning account is deactivated. Tranqu
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:57:00 - [2506] Originally by: Za Tarc Okay, lets play with the idea that this was not intended as a feature. Lets also say that they put it in the documentation because they wanted to be accurate. Now... due to this unintended feature, many many people found the power of two concept agreeable. They bought multiple accounts so that they could slowly work up a few characters (maybe a miner, trader or pvp) without paying an arm and a leg. Some would have bought these accounts anyway, but many would not have. CCP at no point in this documentation said, this feature is not intended and will be removed one day. Instead they took advantage of it and implied that this was a feature. They have now made additional money on this feature.. even if they are not fully aware of it. This leaves us with the perceived reality again, which is that people spent money based on current policy, only to have then revoke that policy after the investment was made. These players have the right to be mad. From their perspective, they have been deceived. By this logic CCP cant change any aspect of the game whatsoever Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:57:00 - [2507] Edited by: Huan Hunglong on 14/10/2008 19:59:47 Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Huan Hunglong So show us another example of where a bug is listed in documentation, in a manner that discribes it as a feature. In a manner that describes it as a feature? Where exactly was that? http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0810/lie.jpg which used to be what http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp said
Gedhay	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:58:00 - [2508] Originally by: Lallante Originally by: Carsidava Eighty-one pages and no response from CCP. We're being treated like mushrooms: kept in the dark and fed bullshit. I'm going to post this again, fully realizing that CCP is ignoring us and just going to go blindly ahead with this ridiculous plan. Nope, sorry. This doesn't wash. If you disable skill training for inactive accounts, why aren't you also disabling market orders from inactive accounts? Why aren't you also disabling RP accumulation from inactive accounts? Why aren't you disabling dividend payouts to inactive accounts? Why are only skill points being hit? Sorry CCP, this is an entirely unsatisfactory answer. Theres a response saying they are monitoring this thread closely. Im sure they want to have a proper meeting tommorrow, you know, during the day time, before they make any official response. that's before or after the patch launch??? and don't ell me u never used this "bug" cause u, bob's have a lot of people doing that!!!
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:58:00 - [2509] Originally by: FalconBayerskt Have CCP responded yet?? (dont have the time to check 80+ pages) Responded to what? The dev blog linked in the OP covers it all pretty well, what else is there to say?
Ratio Legis Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:58:00 - [2510] Originally by: Catherine Frasier In a manner that describes it as a feature? Where exactly was that? Because it wasn't in the "known problems" section?
Soma Khan	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:58:00 - [2511] Originally by: oilio Originally by: Soma Khan What exactly do you find wrong here? Well, I posted disatisfaction towards CCP - NOT YOU - and you responded with this: Originally by: Soma Khan Nothing but good will come from you and those like you leaving this place. Less database and forum pollution, as witnessed by this thread. See that? That was your initial response. Looks like a trolling insult, doesn't it? So, there is nothing wrong, except for my trolling (which is a subjective judgment, but so be it). Right? ___
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:59:00 - [2512] Originally by: Alex Salas Edited by: Alex Salas on 14/10/2008 19:57:29 Originally by: Lallante Id love to know why it matters, to anyone, whether CCP once intended this, once supported it, documented it, whatever. What difference does it make? They dont like the effect its having on the game now, so they are changing it. Personally, I remember beta when this started happening. Its a side effect of the coding, not the intention, they were just happy with it until now. Grow the ** up people I am not angry because CCP is getting rid of ghost-trains. I utilized it for a few weeks on accident in fact. My accounts were fully paid for 99.9% of the time. I am angry on how blatantly condescending CCP has lied about the situation. I have canceled my four account If you want proof, my corp is part of GBC so you can ask my CEO my views and intentions. One of my accounts is set to lapse in 2 days. I will rid the rest out till the last one lapse in December. Edited for spelling ___ What aspect of there statement is a lie. Anyone who played beta can confirm this is an unintended feature. I remember the original CSMs where it was discussed. Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku**
Hun Jakuza Naughty By Nature	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:59:00 - [2513] Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 14/10/2008 19:59:03 Originally by: FalconBayerskt Have CCP responded yet?? (dont have the time to check 80+ pages) According to you who can't fix a bug under 5 years, it responds to something inside 10 minutes ???
James Marshalll Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:59:00 - [2514] Edited by: James Marshalll on 14/10/2008 20:00:22 Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: James Marshalll I can tell you with no hesitation YOU DO NOT document bugs in a new user guide... No, you can merely claim that YOU don't. do you have a grasp on why you wouldn't document bugs in a new user guide that you DIDN'T want users using? do you have a grasp on the concept that a blue screen of death IS a feature and not a bug as another user pointed out? do you have a grasp on the reason people are ****ed, for the most part is not directly associated with the fact they are losing the ghost training but the way its been handled, the fact there is way more ground breaking things in game to worry about, and that this has no affect on any player or the balance of the game? Are you just a troll trying to get a rise out of people who are paying customers who are giving feedback on a change that will affect them from multiple positions like GTC prices, character sale prices, population, and friends leaving and not coming back because they have nothing to look forward to? So far in this thread you have posted the same crap over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and ignore any post that really does show you the other side, and only respond with "oh quit whining!". At least if you have something to add, make sure its something other then the same old tired "This was a bug, not a feature even if it was in the new user guide!". CCP can fight its own battles, it doesn't need you or the CCP2.0 alt club BoB defending it against its own customers... that is unless you are paid to? I mean at least BoB got BPO's out of it..
10of10	Posted - 2008.10.14 19:59:00 - [2515] Nice to see BoB coming to the defence of ccp on this......I wonder why this is ??????
ISIAM	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:00:00 - [2516] Originally by: Sahara Eternity Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:55:00 Edited by: Sahara Eternity on 14/10/2008 19:54:18 Originally by: Lallante That may be true, but CCP have never said they didnt want us to use the unintended feature while it was possible to do so. In fact, the implication is they didnt mind us using it. This has absolutely ZERO baring on whether they intended to change it. eXcuse me ... who are you ? You have 8 post in the last 30 posts on this thread ... Are you a CCP official ? If not stop posting and let people tell theyr story, if yes log in your main please. EDIT: You beat me to it, make that 9 posts on 2 pages ... Opps added 1 more ... INDEED. (..)
Lag	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:00:00 - [2517] I'd like to see the statistics on the database. Assuming CCP is competent enough to not create a service that constantly queries the database to make appropriate updates, the only thing that inactive accounts would use on the database is space. Why have a service running that constantly checks for skill completions when the routine could be performed with a trigger such as loading the My Character page or Character information in-game? I don't see how ghost training is affecting the database. Stats please!
BIind	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:00:00 - [2518] This thread is about forum cred now.
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:01:00 - [2519] Originally by: James Marshalll Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: James Marshalll I can tell you with no hesitation YOU DO NOT document bugs in a new user guide... No, you can merely claim that YOU don't. do you have a grasp on why you wouldn't document bugs in a new user guide that you DIDN'T want users using? Where has anyone from CCP said they didnt want anyone using it? They simply changed it. They were happy for people to use it before the change goes live. Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Sailon	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:01:00 - [2520] Originally by: 10of10 Nice to see BoB coming to the defence of ccp on this......I wonder why this is ?????? i see new hidden bpo t2 lottery

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