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Disabling ghost training - the blog edition

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:01:00 - [2521] tears = sustenance Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Zilor Dragoon	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:02:00 - [2522] Lol.........it's all money now. Reminds me of SWG.
T0desengel	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:03:00 - [2523] Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff)
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:03:00 - [2524] Originally by: Lallante tears = sustenance And we've all feasted so well off your tears over the years. Yummy yummy.
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:04:00 - [2525] Originally by: Sailon Originally by: 10of10 Nice to see BoB coming to the defence of ccp on this......I wonder why this is ?????? i see new hidden bpo t2 lottery I see dead people. No, wait... They're just ghost training! Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Velda Chulai	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:05:00 - [2526] Originally by: Lag I'd like to see the statistics on the database. Assuming CCP is competent enough to not create a service that constantly queries the database to make appropriate updates, the only thing that inactive accounts would use on the database is space. Why have a service running that constantly checks for skill completions when the routine could be performed with a trigger such as loading the My Character page or Character information in-game? I don't see how ghost training is affecting the database. Stats please! It's time based. The Skillpoints are simply a slice of how many points you gain in a period of time. Client confirm that a duration of time has passed. The only time the time remaining is calculated on the server side is when the client directs the server to switch skills - the server then knows that in (skillpointsPerHour/60)(skillPointsNeededtierLevelMultiplier) that the skill will be complete. This is why your skill point rante doesn't change when you lose your implants and why you must not be training a skill when you clone jump - the re-calculation of skills doesn't occur until you specifically direct the game to do so.
Maurice MerleauPonty	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:06:00 - [2527] I am confirming that I did indeed cancel my subscription, and nobody can have my stuff. Post here if you have done the same, so others can associate faces and names of characters who they will not see in-game after the subscription period ends ( or earlier ).
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:06:00 - [2528] Originally by: Huan Hunglong Edited by: Huan Hunglong on 14/10/2008 19:59:47 Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Huan Hunglong So show us another example of where a bug is listed in documentation, in a manner that discribes it as a feature. In a manner that describes it as a feature? Where exactly was that? http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0810/lie.jpg which used to be what http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp said Actually, no. What the guide used to say was "Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive" which makes absolutely no statement about whether or not this is an intended feature, a bug, a loophole, a mistake, an oversight or an emergent property. It merely described, accurately, the way things worked. (Which apparently is A Bad Thing(tm) )
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:06:00 - [2529] Originally by: T0desengel Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff) Straw man. Torfi said its an UNINTENDED FEATURE. Which amounts to the same as a bug. Not a bug. Hence documentation. Reread the post. Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Velda Chulai	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:07:00 - [2530] Edited by: Velda Chulai on 14/10/2008 20:07:59 Edited by: Velda Chulai on 14/10/2008 20:07:16 Originally by: Lallante Originally by: T0desengel Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff) Straw man. Torfi said its an UNINTENDED FEATURE. Which amounts to the same as a bug. Not a bug. Hence documentation. Reread the post. Originally it was a game balance issue. It became a bug a few hour later.
Tito Sajic	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:07:00 - [2531] Originally by: T0desengel Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff) so, not only did they document this so called 'unintended feature', but they advised us on how to best 'exploit' it...until today when they edited it.
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:08:00 - [2532] Originally by: Lallante Which amounts to the same as a bug. Not a bug. ROFL!!! So which is it? Make ya mind you.
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:08:00 - [2533] Originally by: Maurice MerleauPonty I am confirming that I did indeed cancel my subscription, and nobody can have my stuff. Pretty please? Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Mr Nantucket	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2534] so CCP looks at it this way, they surely ran the numbers on what would happen on this, and it works for them because.... People quit eve because of ghost training nerf: CCP loses money: "Walking in stations comes out" CCP Gets more money from new players with the attraction of a 3d chat room type thing, and first person movement in this game. CCP Makes money: People who are new, Wont know of the 'old days" when you could train skills while your account lapsed for awhile, and so never stop their accounts for brake or otherwise = CCP Makes money: There for, CCP will most likely make more money out of this then they lose, even with all of us stopping our accounts, I for one am stopping mine if this nerf truely goes though, stuff will be given away cause im a nice guy (to alliance/corp) HOWEVER, CCP still wins with this nerf. Im sorry, but all this complaing wont do a thing, cause in about 3 months from now, CCP's income will most likely double or something.
Karma Eve University	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2535] Originally by: Brigsby5987 if you dont pay, you dont play. period. No one cares if your poor, or your gonna take your alts and cancel your account. I think the devblog explained it fairly well... no-one feels the weight of a snowflake.. but they'll definitely feel an avalanche.
Straight Chillen Gallente Solar Wind	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2536] So are you guys gonna do anything about inactive accounts farming data cores? are you gonna do anything about inactive accounts that have sell orders up? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Lag	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2537] As I already suspected and halfway stated in a previous post... So what kind of problems is Ghost Training causing on the database? I don't see any.... I believe they are just doing this in an attempt to gain money, and throwing the players an excuse that they hope the playerbase will buy.
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2538] Sorry, couldn't just lurk anymore with such rampant stupidity continuing to spawn. Originally by: Lag Why have a service running that constantly checks for skill completions when the routine could be performed with a trigger such as loading the My Character page or Character information in-game? Did you ever notice that while you are in game you get informed when a skill changes? The purpose of that should be obvious. This also makes it painfully obvious that there is some form of heartbeat check for skill completions. So please spare us your novice attempts at debugging things that apparently exceed your powers of observation. To Shar -verb: 1 - To say what you mean. 2 - To say what it means. 3 - To say something mean.
Alex Salas BROTHERHOOD OF SPARTA Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2539] Originally by: Lallante What aspect of there statement is a lie. Anyone who played beta can confirm this is an unintended feature. I remember the original CSMs where it was discussed. To classify an unintended "feature" into a bug does not bode well for EVE's community and insults the intelligence of the customer. Real time training is a selling point of this game; even allowing once upon a time to complete a train while an account was unsubbed. ___ EVE lies...rotating FTL!!! http://myeve.eve-online.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?patchlogID=99 On the Serenity server, skills no longer train when the owning account is deactivated. Tranqu
Catherine Frasier	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2540] Originally by: Velda Chulai Originally it was a game balance feature. No. Originally (and from someone else) it was an undocumented feature, in effect a bug, which was problematic for game balance reasons. That's still completely true.
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:09:00 - [2541] Originally by: Tito Sajic Originally by: T0desengel Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff) so, not only did they document this so called 'unintended feature', but they advised us on how to best 'exploit' it...until today when they edited it. Yes. Exactly. Whats the issue? They documented safespots, jetcans mining, instajumps etc in the past too. All of them were unintended features. Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Hun Jakuza Naughty By Nature	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:10:00 - [2542] Originally by: Lallante Originally by: T0desengel Edited by: T0desengel on 14/10/2008 20:03:16 This really is the clincher for me, 'Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though).', for thosew who have posted about it being a bug dont fool yourselves! How many more pages before CCP replies? if we ever see a reply! i dont think so. This is even more evidence that CCP are full of 5H1T and treat the community with the upmost contempt. (and no you cant have my stuff) Straw man. Torfi said its an UNINTENDED FEATURE. Which amounts to the same as a bug. Not a bug. Hence documentation. Reread the post. Torfi said. LOL Maybe he are your parent ? Write someon for you "eXcuse me ... who are you ? You have 8 post in the last 30 posts on this thread ... Are you a CCP official ? If not stop posting and let people tell theyr story, if yes log in your main please."
Medusa d'Mon	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:10:00 - [2543] From Revelations patch notes: 'On the Serenity server, skills no longer train when the owning account is deactivated. Tranquility is not affected by this change.' If the so called 'bug' was fixable on Serenity way back then, why wasn't the same 'bug' fixed on Tranquility at the same time?
INF Wonderwoman	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:11:00 - [2544] I have come to the conclusion that CCP will not change there decision no matter how long this thread gets. The main reason being that they not only have blown us off completely, but they told everyone two days before it happens. I personally will cancel my two alt accounts and play only on my main until I find a time that I need to take a break (finals/family) and at this point I most likely wont come back. Was a good run, thanks for all the fish!!
Huan Hunglong Intensive CareBearz	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:11:00 - [2545] Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Huan Hunglong Edited by: Huan Hunglong on 14/10/2008 19:59:47 Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Huan Hunglong So show us another example of where a bug is listed in documentation, in a manner that discribes it as a feature. In a manner that describes it as a feature? Where exactly was that? http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0810/lie.jpg which used to be what http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp said Actually, no. What the guide used to say was "Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive" which makes absolutely no statement about whether or not this is an intended feature, a bug, a loophole, a mistake, an oversight or an emergent property. It merely described, accurately, the way things worked. (Which apparently is A Bad Thing(tm) ) Using that arguement EVERYTHING documented in the player guide could be an 'unintended feature' But im pretty sure theyre not.
BIind	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:11:00 - [2546] Originally by: Lallante Straw man. Torfi said its an UNINTENDED FEATURE. Which amounts to the same as a bug. Not a bug. Hence documentation. Reread the post. I want a report on how many bug reports have been filed over the 5 years regarding this and how often it appeared on the Known Issues page on my desk right away.
Gonada Priory Of The Lemon	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:11:00 - [2547] EXCELLENT IDEA CCP yes I said it. now you lamers have to pay for skill advancement, instead of ghost training. Please, jump into traffic
Julius Rigel House Rigel	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:11:00 - [2548] Originally by: Catherine Frasier Originally by: Velda Chulai Originally it was a game balance feature. No. Originally (and from someone else) it was an undocumented feature, in effect a bug, which was problematic for game balance reasons. That's still completely true. Originally it was a dev blog, then it ate some trolls and grew into a threadnought! /me sniffles. Look at our little thready, he's all grown up now! Frigate racing is fast and fun!
Lallante Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:12:00 - [2549] Originally by: Medusa d'Mon From Revelations patch notes: 'On the Serenity server, skills no longer train when the owning account is deactivated. Tranquility is not affected by this change.' If the so called 'bug' was fixable on Serenity way back then, why wasn't the same 'bug' fixed on Tranquility at the same time? Just a guess here, looking at the 84 page thread... Fear of community reaction? Which is now outweighed by the huge number of people (ab)using it. (which, by the way, included myself; ive resubbed only because of this change). Lall - THE Vocal Minority - Reikoku
Mr Nantucket	Posted - 2008.10.14 20:12:00 - [2550] Edited by: Mr Nantucket on 14/10/2008 20:13:19 They could have done this better though, instead of 3 days notice

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