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Macro Mackinaw Madness

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Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.20 19:37:00 - [121] Originally by: Huberek Morchu Its more than that. Always the same pattern. -npc corp -random name -no standings -no bio -no employment history -online 23/7 -same activity -inhuman precision -no socializing -no response to harrasment or even destruction -crap fits -same creation date as other players in group No human can do what these guys do. Only a dedicated farmer or macro. In the rare possibility it is a normal player who simply plays too much, they deserve to be ganked too. Always the same reply: "I am incapable of recognizing a player using multiple accounts from a macro, so I call them macro." Note that I all the post I have seen I am the only one to post a screenshot of a ice belt at different times of the day. No one so far has bothered trying to document that the people he call is on 23/7 is on line at different times. Sure macro exist, but are much more rare than people think, most are people multiaccounting. And nothing in the EULA is against multiaccounting.
Joss Sparq Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.20 19:54:00 - [122] Originally by: Trogglodite No. Why should I become pirate fodder just so that I can feed my POS because you don't like the fact that others are abusing macro's. Don't like it? Get in there, smart bomb them, play bowling, whatever - but don't suggest that everyone mining ice is a macro'er and throw them all to the pirates to please yourself. 1) Contrary to popular (and uninformed) belief, jumping into low-security space doesn't automatically result in the destruction of your vessel by pirates, player or otherwise. 2) He did not suggest everyone mining ice is a macro user, though he did suggest that many ice miners are. That is an important difference which you're missing there. Next, Originally by: Dirk Magnum I hate to say it but IMO the bigger jackass in the PvP transaction that is suicide anti-macro PvP is the legitimate player. Killing macro miners does nothing. At all. They have a bottomless pool of ISK to replace their ships, they don't lose more than a few minutes of their time because all they have to do is grab another ship and reactivate the macro, there are hundreds of them at work across various systems protected by buffed CONCORD and NPC corp mechanics, the RL companies they work for probably have a plethora of idle accounts skilled up for mining to replace accounts that get successfully petitioned. To kill one just to say you did it is one thing, but smartbombing a gang of them and their pods is just silly (unless you're just trying to run down your sec status.) I see Dirk has a good summary of the overall situation/problem. Generally, try to avoid podding them unless you're planning to spend some time living in low security space - or beyond - as a result. Originally by: Dirk Magnum lol I've started stealing from these guys in Tolle I just grabbed a load of ice in my Prowler but it seems that blue ice sells for ** so I gotta go grab a Mammoth. Do these macroers ever fight back or are they all just afk all the time? Back in my "good old days" when I'd started playing EVE, having dabbled in PvP and started harassing those whom I asssumed (by observation) were macro controlled characters I could expect a fight every so often - but not very often. One of the more memorable was an Iteron V that chose to fight back v.s. my Badger II. I can only describe it as being like watching whales try to mate - in slow motion. From memory I won because I had a Light Neutron Blaster v.s. their Light Electron/Ion Blaster, or something silly like that. We had each other scrambled and were sitting off station because of pre-Warp to Zero days. I eventually switched to the Mammoth as I quickly found it to be more flexible plus I liked fitting a dual 180mm AC to it to plink the other feisty Iterons I provoked. Originally by:** Dirk Magnum Oh in case anyone was wondering as soon as you park a hauler next to one of their jet cans they warp in an Itty 5 and switch the jet can with LSC's. Someone over at the macro warehouse is watching what's going on at least The only solace I get from it is that at least they have to work a little harder for their ill gotten gains.
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2009.01.20 20:08:00 - [123] Originally by: Zeba Call the Witchsmeller Pursuivant to end the horrid ice mining scourge once and for all! Just gonna quote myself caused I missed sniping the fifth page and its totaly comparative of whats going on in this thread. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Lt Angus Caldari End Game. Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.20 21:08:00 - [124] Originally by: Shadowschild Farmers are in every MMO i've played. It's so blatantly obvious too. WHy is it always the same story??? Hiding behind the game mechanics & never getting banned??? WTF! Farming is not against the rules, explain why you think it should be?
Blastil	Posted - 2009.01.20 21:49:00 - [125] Originally by: Joss Sparq Post. Logic. Make. Brain. EXPLODE! seriously, lowsec FTW. We need more industry down here. And since POS'es are mainly a lowsec/0.0 thing, I think that mining for their ice should all happen there anyway. The only thing highsec POSes do is make manufacturing easier, and if your tired of crouded production ques, you should move out to lowsec. No wait times out here.
ggfdfasdgfsfdg	Posted - 2009.01.20 21:56:00 - [126] Originally by: Lt Angus Originally by: Shadowschild Farmers are in every MMO i've played. It's so blatantly obvious too. WHy is it always the same story??? Hiding behind the game mechanics & never getting banned??? WTF! Farming is not against the rules, explain why you think it should be? this
Tonglil Caldari Cosmic Euphoria Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.21 06:52:00 - [127] Hear me out? --- How about instead of moving belts into lowsec, move them to isolated highsec pocket system without a station. Macros will be harder to create since the surrounding systems will be lowsec with pirates. --- Visit my EVE blog EVE's Weekend Warrior @ http://evewarrior.com See ya around and fly safe capsuleers!
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.21 13:17:00 - [128] Originally by: Huberek Morchu Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Loyal Servant I just went to a system 1 jump from where I was... and what do I find... A crew of macro isk farmers in the belt in a back end system. Linkage Got me I guess there are none. That is not a lot but it's 6 plus 1 hauler. I can go to all kinds of systems up north and guaranteed to find 100 in one belt alone. There were 8 people in this system... 7 isk farmers and me. You go to a system, you see people mining ice, you scream macro. There is a huge bias in your evaluation system. For you anyone mining ice is a macro. Edit: just to point it, most people seeing your name would scream "Meaningless name: Macro". Its more than that. Always the same pattern. -npc corp -random name -no standings -no bio -no employment history -online 23/7 -same activity -inhuman precision -no socializing -no response to harrasment or even destruction -crap fits -same creation date as other players in group No human can do what these guys do. Only a dedicated farmer or macro. In the rare possibility it is a normal player who simply plays too much, they deserve to be ganked too. Instead of labelling them at first meeting I have checked them a little while on line, it is only a few jump and I can spare the time. Results: - 19: all 6 guys in your image are in system, 3 in the belts 3 docked. They haven't left station for some minute (AFK and logged? maybe); - 7 AM: only 3 of them in system, mining ice; - 13: all 6 in system and mining ice, in 2 different groups. Nothing conclusive but: 1) at least 3 of them aren't mining 23/7 2) probably 3 of them aren't macros as they aren't docking, dropping cargo and returning in the belt as a macro would do; 3) 3 of them are probably sharing the account (but they could have my same sleep schedule). I haven't definitely disproved that they are macros or isk farmer, but I think I have proved that Loyal Servant observation was based more on his wish to find macro user than on real facts. My impression is that most of the "macro haters" use the same approach. They see something dubiousand immediately label it as a macro, without any attempt to confirm that. Those characters (the 2 groups of 3 characters, BTW) could be easily alts of two players with a good PC running 3 of them at the same time to fuel some 0.0 POS, or of some guy farming isk running them in the background while at work: Remember that isk farming is not against the EULA, isk selling is against the EULA. If isk farming was against the EULA ratters would be the first to be banned from the game.
Huberek Morchu	Posted - 2009.01.21 13:28:00 - [129] Originally by: Venkul Mul Always the same reply: "I am incapable of recognizing a player using multiple accounts from a macro, so I call them macro." Note that I all the post I have seen I am the only one to post a screenshot of a ice belt at different times of the day. No one so far has bothered trying to document that the people he call is on 23/7 is on line at different times. Sure macro exist, but are much more rare than people think, most are people multiaccounting. And nothing in the EULA is against multiaccounting. [/quote Sorry, I dont buy it. If you act like the above, you will be shot. Simple as that.
Ocih Amarr	Posted - 2009.01.21 13:46:00 - [130] The example used says they weren't macro mining. 20 guys jumping to cans in a belt, haulers too. That's quite a ****in macro..
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.21 20:22:00 - [131] Originally by: Huberek Morchu Originally by: Venkul Mul Always the same reply: "I am incapable of recognizing a player using multiple accounts from a macro, so I call them macro." Note that I all the post I have seen I am the only one to post a screenshot of a ice belt at different times of the day. No one so far has bothered trying to document that the people he call is on 23/7 is on line at different times. Sure macro exist, but are much more rare than people think, most are people multiaccounting. And nothing in the EULA is against multiaccounting. [/quote Sorry, I dont buy it. If you act like the above, you will be shot. Simple as that. The point is that you pretend to have the insigth to look a belt and recognize the macro at first glance. So you don't do most of the check you posted early, you only assume they are positive. So be honest and say "I want a excuse to kill miners". A little info: in EVE you don't need excuses to kill people.
Catrha Steinard	Posted - 2009.01.21 20:29:00 - [132] Ok. Macro mining is bad. We all get that. There will always be loopholes to get around crap. But if we can make consequences for them I believe it would disappear. Therefor I propose that we eliminate ALL GSC's from belts. Not only would this reduce lag it would make macro's have to use jet cans. (unless there is another way around it). Just a possible thought. I know everyone loves it when they warp into a belt and find 68238278 GSC's floating around. <sarcasm there>. Might reduce lag too. I dont know. Anyways flame away!
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2009.01.22 00:12:00 - [133] Originally by: Venkul Mul So be honest and say "I want a excuse to kill miners". A little info: in EVE you don't need excuses to kill people. Absolutely. But what your missing Venkul is that the people here are not playing eve they are playing the forums. Basically every time you say black they will say white and so the forumwars emorage on. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.22 00:57:00 - [134] Originally by: Catrha Steinard Edited by: Catrha Steinard on 21/01/2009 22:15:14 Edited by: Catrha Steinard on 21/01/2009 22:14:44 Ok. Macro mining is bad. We all get that. There will always be loopholes to get around crap. But if we can make consequences for them I believe it would disappear. Therefor I propose that we eliminate ALL GSC's from belts. Not only would this reduce lag it would make macro's have to use jet cans. (unless there is another way around it). Just a possible thought. I know everyone loves it when they warp into a belt and find 68238278 GSC's floating around. <sarcasm there>. I dont know, anyways flame away! Been away from the game for a long time? If you don't renew the GSC it is removed after a month. And people using mackinaws or hulks will not bother with GSC.
Zex Maxwell Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.22 04:48:00 - [135] Edited by: Zex Maxwell on 22/01/2009 04:53:35 Originally by: Emily Spankratchet Originally by: Zex Maxwell Technically, All empire ice belts have been removed. Originally by: Patch Notes Misc: Ice belts have been removed from all systems with 0.8+ security standing Empire != 0.8+ security standing. Ice belts still exist in empire. As do macro/farmers. And now, as mentioned above, they use Orcas. Of course, to get the benefit of the Orca they have to form a corp (for the Orca and hauler pilot). Can we war dec them? No, because they close the corp when the war dec arrives and open a new one. Ad infinitum. And there's nothing you can do to stop that, because apparently it's not an exploit of the war dec system. I don't think you read all my post. They will still be there since there is a lot of units still left in the ice. therefor you have to you just have to bare with the macro miners. PS: even tho tolle is a .7 system IT will still take a long time for all the ice to be gone. CCP is watching ALL the roid and Ice belts in eve. So they are probbly turning down the respawn of ice units, and one the ice belt is dust. it will probbly stay that way sine the micro miners will be the first ones to mine the newly spawned ice. Also note that some belts only spawn 2 times a week. sometimes once. Just wait it out, they will macro miners will soon run out of steam and sell their accounts.
AmmoniaisNH3	Posted - 2009.01.22 07:50:00 - [136] how are you guys stealing ice when they dont use cans :( can you open the orca's cargo?
Valhallas	Posted - 2009.01.22 14:58:00 - [137] So its not really easy to suicide a Mack, and your sec status will drop off like a rock. Its no longer possible to steal from the macroers as the ice is routed thru a GSC. So what does that leave for getting back at the macroers? Well how about suiciding a fully loaded iteron 5. Just spam the itty with a cargo scanner. Once full warp scram, bump then kill it. (Also may require a ship to transfer any dropped cargo to your own can which can then be picked up or destroyed) Would 4 newly created characters trained up to lv3 destroyer be enough to do this?, I'm not sure, 32 t1 blasters on an industrial is a lot, all fully insured of course. Cost per destroyer lost is minimal. When sec status falls too low just bin the characters and create new ones and repeat. It only requires that you keep one of your three character slots free to recycle the characters. I realise that the macroers could switch to direct hauling to the station in thier Macks, but at least thier profits would be down. Any thoughts on this?
Loyal Servant Caldari PURE Legion KIA Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.22 15:02:00 - [138] Originally by: Valhallas Would 4 newly created characters trained up to lv3 destroyer be enough to do this?, I'm not sure, 32 t1 blasters on an industrial is a lot, all fully insured of course. Cost per destroyer lost is minimal. When sec status falls too low just bin the characters and create new ones and repeat. It only requires that you keep one of your three character slots free to recycle the characters. I think that recycling characters for the purpose of ganking farmers will probably get you a ban. Remember, the farmers have more control than we do.
Darth Obvious	Posted - 2009.02.23 02:22:00 - [139] 6 macks swarming around a single Orca fell victim to a single disco Phoon in Kamio tonight. The characters piloting the Mackinaws were probably macros
Rawr Cristina Caldari Naqam Exalted.	Posted - 2009.02.23 02:31:00 - [140] These are common, not just in hi-sec but 0.0 too It's a good thing we have things like the Ice Preservation Society to fight this menace, but it is not always enough. - Infectious -
Insa Rexion Minmatar M3T4LH34DZ	Posted - 2009.02.23 17:13:00 - [141] Originally by: RedSplat Tolle. 30+ Mackinaws in local, all in the single Ice belt there, with Macro'esque names and 'players' that don't respond to convo (i know what you were about to say, don't please.) and reside exclusively in NPC corps. They fly in gangs of 4 or more with each member within 1k of another, they move from one GSC to another with the cans anchored in a line that following the entirety of the belt. Every 3 minutes an itty 5 warps in to the bottom can, emptys it and warps back to the same station it left from. 3 minutes later it warps back into the belt but to the can next up the chain. Apparently, according to the few legit miners left there, this is the norm for that system and the operation is almost constant. Isnt it about time all ice got moved to Lowsec? It's time a LOT of the over plentiful resources of Hisec got moved to low or just plain removed. well mannered ah*
Ryoken McKeon Galactic Defence Syndicate Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.23 17:49:00 - [142] Step 1: Insure your battleship Step 2: Fit with Smartbombs Step 3: Warp to ice field Step 4: Find largest concentration of mackinaws Step 5: Disco! Step 6: Get friends in haulers to take all the ice that drops
Insa Rexion Minmatar M3T4LH34DZ	Posted - 2009.02.23 18:06:00 - [143] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Loyal Servant Originally by: Zeba Yes. Matter of fact there is one in the high sec system im mining missions in and there is never anyone there. Hell even the belts are full of untouched ore. I have seen them, too. The reason there are no farmers in them is because they are... A. In lowsec B. have no direct hisec path to jita. Meaning they are in hisec but you have to go thru lowsec to get there. screnshot 1 screenshot 2 Ice belt: 1, check High sec system: 0.5 , check Near a trade hug?: amarr 6 jumps, Jita 14, check First pick was taken with 47K+ people in play, second with 25k+ people in play. I fail to see the hordes of macro miners mining 23/7. Maybe instead of "every ice system, at every time of the day" it is some system, mostly near Jit, and all the rest is propaganda? In the second instance the only guy mining ice was I for at least 1 hour. can I has a trade hug, i is lonely well mannered ah*

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