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AeonPhoenix	Posted - 2009.01.22 02:23:00 - [1] Edited by: AeonPhoenix on 22/01/2009 02:25:13 What follows is a series of unfortunate events - If the mission brief had said what type of rats were on this recon part 1, I would have tanked specifically from the word go, and not triggered off the timed spawns by going and having a look first. - If the mission hadn't been three jumps away I may have got back sooner before they all spawned in full force. - If I weren't greedily after isk to pay someone some isk back and just handed it in, the ship would have been spared for another day. - If I'd fitted a sensor booster, I may have been able to target the frigs to tell the drones to engage before the jamming kicked in. - If one of the two frigs hadn't scrambled me I could have warped out. - If the other one of the two frigs hadn't webbed me, I'd have easily tanked the giant storm of torpedoes incoming, and could have escaped by burning to the next acceleration gate. - If the one jam cycle had just given me a second longer on the one window I got, I would've just been able to target the scrambler frig with my drones. I kept a cool head, I kept aligned, I tried to lock the frigs the instant I got a window. I lasted around 5 1/2 minutes before my tank failed, it couldn't take every single rat in the room together with full damage. It wasn't super ultra tank as I has a heatsink but I could never have believed I'd end up so stuffed and sleepwalked straight into it. I've done this mission 200 times before but I guess I'd never warped out before, I realised I may be in trouble the moment I warped back in and the frigs were right on top of me from the off. The second marauder I've lost within less then a year. Cancelling out most if not all the profit I ever made on all the months grinding in between. Despite the skills of the character the wisdom of the pilot do not match up. I have now decided I'm no longer going to be using a Marauder within a mission again as even though I've got pretty much maxed out related skills I still manage to lose the ship. I'm also going to be selling this character on the market to someone who can do better with it then I did. Feel free to mock me if you like if it's so stupid to lose such items in a mission, it won't bother me as I'm still in that state of numb shock I get after a big ingame loss.
FT Diomedes Gallente Titan Industries Technology Team Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2009.01.22 02:46:00 - [2] I have never had Recon outside the system the agent is located in. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
AeonPhoenix	Posted - 2009.01.22 02:51:00 - [3] Originally by: FT Diomedes I have never had Recon outside the system the agent is located in. Sorry for murky explanation, fixed OP.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.22 03:53:00 - [4] That sucks man Don't sell the account though, sleep on it for a week at least. For next time, don't mix heatsinks with Guristas, you'd most likely do better in a Domi or plain Raven even if your skills aren't top notch.
Mia Restolo	Posted - 2009.01.22 03:57:00 - [5] Wait until reset at the next down time, blitz it in a shuttle or fast frig... takes a minute to complete.
Terminus Vindictus	Posted - 2009.01.22 04:26:00 - [6] That sucks, dude. I feel for ya. I lost a 2 bil ship in Pirate Invasion because I forgot to turn on my second booster, and I took my attention off the game for a few minutes to answer a phone call. By the time I remembered the game, I was sitting in my pod. I was ****ed at myself, and wanted to quit, but I took the loss in stride eventually and moved on. The good thing is that ISK is easy to come by in missions. I was lucky enough to have the cash in my account to pay for the replacement parts and start over. You can always start over in a lesser ship for a bit and make some money back, or just buy some GTC ISK. I wouldn't give up just yet. As an aside, your Golem couldn't take the full room at once? My Drake could do that easy. Might want to re-examine your mods when you build up your new setup... You should be able to tank that entire room in a Golem with no problems.
Lady Aja Caldari Hannibals Pirates Damnation of Souls	Posted - 2009.01.22 04:46:00 - [7] Recon Parts one and two can be done ina shuttle... just burn for the gate and youre done. 3rd part you need to tank... hell recon lvl 4 part 3 can be done in a zealot. this is such abn easy mission. sorry to hear you tried to do it the harder way. can i have some of youre stuff?
Lady Aja Caldari Hannibals Pirates Damnation of Souls	Posted - 2009.01.22 04:48:00 - [8] Originally by: AeonPhoenix Edited by: AeonPhoenix on 22/01/2009 02:50:33 What follows is a series of unfortunate events Feel free to mock me if you like if it's so stupid to lose such items in a mission, it won't bother me as I'm still in that state of numb shock I get after a big ingame loss. In the past onb a previous character I lost a dead space fitted absolution 4+b isk at the time of fitting. I took about 3 months off the game but kept training. you will get past it .
Ghoest	Posted - 2009.01.22 05:25:00 - [9] Edited by: Ghoest on 22/01/2009 05:25:42 Recon 1 is harder to tank than the bonus room in AE at least for angels. Although Im surprised yo couldnt do it unless you tried to take a short cut on the tank fit. If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Mastin Dragonfly Absolutely No Retreat Blade.	Posted - 2009.01.22 06:14:00 - [10] Originally by: Lady Aja Recon Parts one and two can be done ina shuttle... just burn for the gate and youre done. 3rd part you need to tank... hell recon lvl 4 part 3 can be done in a zealot. this is such abn easy mission. sorry to hear you tried to do it the harder way. can i have some of youre stuff? It's a nice amount of bounties with a dozen high bounty battleships, I always clear the spawns, then again I get the bloodraider version, not the gurista version. Gurista are just plain annoying.
DrWh0 Gallente Cubewanos	Posted - 2009.01.22 07:23:00 - [11] Can I be the first one to hand you something to wipe away them tears.. as you say that you have completed the mission 200 times before so you should know how much dps this part kicks out on a full spawn. Tip: If you **** up a mission wait until DT or turn it down and get another
Flossing	Posted - 2009.01.22 07:26:00 - [12] if you wanted to clear the room but wanted to do it safe, why didnt you fly to the jumpgate and fight from there, if you got in trouble just use the gate, its not locked.
Erika Bronz Gallente Nidaros fritidsforening	Posted - 2009.01.22 07:35:00 - [13] It's not a jump gate, it's a warp gate in the mission. I don't think you can use the warp gate when you are scrambeled. A friend of mine lost a Drake that way, if I remember correctly.
Mikal Drey Minmatar Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.22 07:37:00 - [14] hey hey 2007.09.27 15:44 Victim: Mikal Drey Alliance: NONE Corp: Angels and Demons Destroyed: Claymore System: Aufay Security: 0.5 Involved parties: Name: Mercenary Wingman / Unknown (laid the final blow) Name: Corelum Guardian Chief Patroller / Serpentis Destroyed items: Medium F-RX Prototype I Capacitor Boost Power Diagnostic System II Warrior I (Drone Bay) Fusion M, Qty: 1687 (Cargo) 10MN Afterburner II Ballistic Deflection Field II Havoc Heavy Missile, Qty: 548 (Cargo) Valkyrie II (Drone Bay) Damage Control II Heavy Missile Launcher II 720mm Howitzer Artillery II 720mm Howitzer Artillery II 720mm Howitzer Artillery II Gist B-Type Large Shield Booster Invulnerability Field II Power Diagnostic System II Heavy Missile Launcher II Cap Booster 50, Qty: 10 (Cargo) Havoc Heavy Missile, Qty: 39 Fusion M, Qty: 12 Fusion M, Qty: 12 I rarely die on missions and by rarely I mean pretty much never. I warped back from the mission and spoke to the agent. Undocked and warped to recon 3/3. As i knew i can afk the mission i simply warped in then went afk for a sec. I returned tot he PC in a Pod :/ Undure what happened i looked around in spac e and noticed that there were rats on my deathmail. It turns out i didnt click finish for recon 2/3 and had actually warped there. Ive had that claymore for ages so i just went to refit. Suffice to say i almost had a heart attack when i saw the cost to replace it. That state of shock you are in is one of the best things about the universe we live and play in. From what you said about skills vs pilot sounds like you bought it and didnt earn it. **** happens, you either get busy living or get busy dying.
Washell Olivaw	Posted - 2009.01.22 08:43:00 - [15] Originally by: AeonPhoenix - If the mission brief had said what type of rats were on this recon part 1, I would have tanked specifically from the word go, and not triggered off the timed spawns by going and having a look first. Next time you see a mission briefing. Take note of the icon in front of the location. It denotes which rats/faction you will be fighting.
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.01.22 08:51:00 - [16] Originally by: Mastin Dragonfly It's a nice amount of bounties with a dozen high bounty battleships, I always clear the spawns, then again I get the bloodraider version, not the gurista version. Gurista are just plain annoying. …which is why you do it in an Ishtar: enough drone DPS to melt the room in short order even when ECMed to pieces; small enough not to care about silly torps or cruises; fast enough not be a complete brick while webbed; high enough kin/therm resists to laugh the rest of it off.
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2009.01.22 09:18:00 - [17] Originally by: Lady Aja Recon Parts one and two can be done ina shuttle... The reason to do it in a battleship is to collect the bounties and loot. Not to finish quickly for mission reward.
Cyb3r D3ath	Posted - 2009.01.22 10:35:00 - [18] I've always stuck around ta kill all the NPC's in Recon lvl4, in the first room & second, never had a prob, maybe your setup was'nt that great.
Joe Umbra Legion Shadow Empire.	Posted - 2009.01.22 10:37:00 - [19] Originally by: Tasko Pal Originally by: Lady Aja Recon Parts one and two can be done ina shuttle... The reason to do it in a battleship is to collect the bounties and loot. Not to finish quickly for mission reward. I like todo it properly becuase of all the Named tachyons that i get Umbra Is recruiting Amarr Missioners!
Joe Umbra Legion Shadow Empire.	Posted - 2009.01.22 10:50:00 - [20] Originally by: Cyb3r D3ath I've always stuck around ta kill all the NPC's in Recon lvl4, in the first room & second, never had a prob, maybe your setup was'nt that great. OMFG Dude, your either a Vampire or a Robot, do you ever sleep?
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.22 11:20:00 - [21] Don't quit just because of one slipup! Remember to read the mission briefings on the EVE-Survival site.
Mistress Nyissa	Posted - 2009.01.22 12:14:00 - [22] I do the guristas 1 of 3 in my raven easily. IIRC I orbit the gate at something like 5k or 2.5k just enough to get the speed based damage reduction from the incoming missiles. The agro the whole room and start tearing them apart. Sucks with the jamming but I run a perma boost 2 small booster setup and can sit there all day waiting for a jamming opening but rarely have to (make the cruisers a priority). Those 1mil+ BS bounties are enough reason to leave the shuttle at home for this one.
Dax Ee'nnach Caldari Black Mesa Project	Posted - 2009.01.22 13:01:00 - [23] If you've really run this mission 200 times before it is surprising you are whining about taking your ball and going home because you lost a ship. WTF? It must have been a real bad night I suppose. Okay, so you've run this mission "200 times" before, so you know all the ways to do it right and plenty of posters have written to remind you how to do this mission. You have listed all the mistakes you did this time, so what's up with the emo "I'm selling this char to someone who can do better with it"? Does someone need a hug? Yeah, I am mocking you but not for losing to the mission, but for losing to Eve - if all it takes is ONE mission loss and you call it quits, then maybe that is for the best. If it is that you had your entire ISK fortune invested in this Marauder and now you are back at square 1, well, I can feel for you. If you had bemoaned having to start building that fortune again, sympathy would be there for having to go through that effort; but the only thing I can offer for "I got spanked! I'm quitting!" is can I haz your stuff.
Latrodanes Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.01.22 13:58:00 - [24] Done that, been there, sorta. Lost my first frigate to my first L2 mission. Hurt at that point, but I bought a newer, shinier one. So it needs to be said - Don't fly what you can't afford to lose! Come one, that's rule #1 in this game - always, be it PvE, PvP, hauling, mining, heck just sight-seeing. Also, you masochists fighting your way through the Recons. Thanks from all us blitzers. We are getting a lot of ISK rewards from completing these by just skipping right on through all three with fast frigs. To each his own I guess, but I'm off to do other missions while you are slugging through the uber-spawns.
AeonPhoenix	Posted - 2009.01.22 14:17:00 - [25] Yeah it was a little emo-whiney of me probably. But the Paladin was faction fitted too, I lost around another 100 mill in fittings in that regard hummm. If I make someone aware enough to make sure they take recon part 1 of 1 gurista seriously though I'm happy. Aswell as if they warp out the first room either come back with sensor booster or just leave alone tbh. As I got proper sucker punched. Originally by: Flossing if you wanted to clear the room but wanted to do it safe, why didnt you fly to the jumpgate and fight from there, if you got in trouble just use the gate, its not locked. I factored that into my OP. Thing is I was webbed down to about 5 m/s about 4 seconds after warp in. There was nothing I could have done at that point after I'd warped back in with that setup, the mistake was warping back into it in the first place. Would've needed a setup that could tank more than around 1000 dps perma whereas I didn't bring that as I knew how easy it was to speed tank missiles even in a bs. I wouldn't have been going anywhere for the next hour or so, could either slowboated to the next accel gate, or maybe eventually a large enough ecm window would've come up. Although I say I've done this mission 500 times before, I think part of the problem is around 450 of those 500 times before will have been against Sansha from my experience which is a lot easier. I never realised the entire rooms ecm would be so bad was my main mistake. If I'd realised beforehand the level of ewar that entire room puts out I'd known better to have left well alone. Originally by: Washell Olivaw Originally by: AeonPhoenix - If the mission brief had said what type of rats were on this recon part 1, I would have tanked specifically from the word go, and not triggered off the timed spawns by going and having a look first. Next time you see a mission briefing. Take note of the icon in front of the location. It denotes which rats/faction you will be fighting. It doesn't show the icon on this particular mission unless it somehow escaped my attention, I've always looked for that on every mission and I've seen it pretty much on every mission but I never saw it on this one. I'll have to look again next time.
comrade captain Aliastra	Posted - 2009.01.22 14:25:00 - [26] i did this yesterday using 3 damage mods in a kronos with 1 large repper and 3 hardeners, you just gotta take down the bses pretty quick before they overwhelm you
Ancy Denaries Caldari Solaris Operations	Posted - 2009.01.22 15:56:00 - [27] Edited by: Ancy Denaries on 22/01/2009 16:06:12 Never actually lost anything in Recon 1/1, except my first Raven the first time I did the mission. I was still a nobling back then. But I feel for you and it sucks. But killing the spawns in Recon is actually really good money, and doesn't take all too long. In the second pocket I only pop the BS, and then bug out. The annoying parts are the HACs in the first pocket >.< I always do the Sansha version, so I don't get jammed, but TDs on my Tachs is no fun at all. It does, however, beat being permajammed by Guristas :/ The Nightmare does fine against those pesky blood raiders and sanshas. Pick yourself up, fly cheaper ships and have fun again. Oh, and don't spend your entire EVE career running missions...it's not really what it was meant for. Try some other things, like trading, pewpewing, mining, production. I've done must stuff, and finally got my sec status up from -4.3 so I'm welcome in high sec again :/. So now I do some trading. Balance is important, but you will always adapt to changing circumstances and you don't whine about stuff you can't change.
Dors Venabily	Posted - 2009.01.22 16:17:00 - [28] Hey man calm down dont leave because of a bad mission. Take it as learning experience. I lost my faction fitted Navy Megathron back when they were actually worth something because a noob corpie started to shoot the triggers at the blockade :D still here corpie got poded out of frustration. Recon is tough one of the few that actually are and you underestimated it and got punished.
Pwett Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony	Posted - 2009.01.22 16:27:00 - [29] Don't feel bad - I have the bad habit of always losing a ship when I fly it for the first time. I lost my first battleship because I tried my first level 4 mission (back when Zazzmatazz was hard) because I had approximately 500k sp in gunnery. I lost my first Fleet Tempest because I accidentally triggered full aggro in WC level 2 with only a speed tank. I lost my first Vargur because I accidentally popped an alliance mate's wreck instead of tractoring it
Mike Huntswarm	Posted - 2009.01.22 16:47:00 - [30] Originally by: Pwett Don't feel bad - I have the bad habit of always losing a ship when I fly it for the first time. I lost my first battleship because I tried my first level 4 mission (back when Zazzmatazz was hard) because I had approximately 500k sp in gunnery. I lost my first Fleet Tempest because I accidentally triggered full aggro in WC level 2 with only a speed tank. I lost my first Vargur because I accidentally popped an alliance mate's wreck instead of tractoring it did i read that right?
Pwett Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony	Posted - 2009.01.22 17:18:00 - [31] Vargur yes, and I meant WC room 2 - with the spies - wasn't really paying attention, tackled with an arty fit.
Vietone Gallente Mercury Industries	Posted - 2009.01.22 17:19:00 - [32] Recon 1 of 3 isnt hard in a proper ship. I usually run my alt with a faction fit CNR and cruise missiles. IF needed, ill bring another character in a Domi with remote shield transporters and sensor boosters and if needed, remote ECCM. Domi can use drones to kill frigates and having 10 light drones ( 5 from each ship) makes destroying frigates way too easy. I only use tech 1 drones because I launched them in the beginning of every mission. They make easy cannon fodder and the cruisers and BS that attack the light drones means thats a while longer they are not attacking my ship if its a hard mission. My CNR can perma run a XL booster and using 2 Caldari invil fields and 2 Tech 2 shield amps, I have yet to come across a mission that can break it. EveHQ shows an omni tank of over 900 DPS and EFT shows almost 900 defense rating as well.
Andrue Amarr	Posted - 2009.01.22 17:32:00 - [33] Edited by: Andrue on 22/01/2009 17:32:00 Meh. The current Recon is a shadow of its former glory. Even Nighthawk pilots used to stop grinning and pay attention to what they were doing. Now it's just another room with Things To Blow Up(TM). Ah well, get yourself another ship and move on. Ship losses happen in missions sometimes. ..or so I've been told.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.22 17:35:00 - [34] Raises a couple questions, btw. What if AeonPh had asked for help in local? Would he have gotten the vultures of Eve ready to pick his carcass, or would he have gotten help? Would you help someone asking for it in local? I probably would, ever since the lofty scam was addressed by CCP. Though I'd use a T1 ship with T2 fit, nothing overly expensive. Heck, in the OP's case any frig would have done the job.
AeonPhoenix	Posted - 2009.01.22 19:20:00 - [35] I thought about it at the time Quin, while I would've offered a reward as incentive to any who came and saved the ship. Something like 100 million isk. As I had more then enough time to wait for someone to get me out of that mess. Thing is I decided against it and I'm glad I didn't, as there's bound to be at least one vulture in local, who only needs to fleet up, warp to me and just sit there and watch me die. Or even if a who came to rescue me didnt quite do it fast enough, he still would've wanted paying no doubt. And I'd be in the shame situation right now, minus around 120 million in module drops from my wrecked ship that they would have looted.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2009.01.22 21:27:00 - [36] I was farming recon 1/3 for sec status a while back, (was -3 or so and we were about to do some wardecs), kill 1 bs on warp in, then kill all the ships that aren't bs, then kill 1 bs every 15 mins or w/e it is. my tank was 1 lar II, 2 kin hardener II, 2 therm II. using a domi with garde IIs. depending on what else I was doing I would either take missions on my alt and go help with those or just sit in the room. permajam and warp scrams from guristas is the suck, how I lost my first raven
Naran Darkmood Gallente MC Cubed 101010 Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.22 21:57:00 - [37] There is a reason my mission Domi is called "Yuk XI" (there 3-4 of the others still alive stashed away at some remote agent locations). The first loss was fitted with a centus x-type LAR (when they were only 600 mil). even deadspace items don't help, if you don't activate your tank ... Take it liek a man, you can earn another marauder in a fortnight
Lady Valory Caldari Caldari Strike Force PuPPet MasTers	Posted - 2009.01.22 22:16:00 - [38] The saddest part is the OP is doing recon all wrong... 1) find any of a dozen low sec pockets with 10 level 4 q20 agents 2) max out ur standings/social/LP skills 3) build a uber recon-mission ship like a stabber Now what u do is just fly around and spam ur agent... When u get recon, u do the 3 missions, and then respam... In a day of missioning you can make 300 000 LP for zero work, zero risk, and u get lots of uber faction missions to complete ... After a while u can even start selling standings by ganging people 50 jumps away and just sharing the standings... Anyway, doing the recon mission in 1 minute is just the proper way to do it... forget the rats and just do it easy and semi afk.
Number 86 Eat Ship and Die	Posted - 2009.01.23 23:24:00 - [39] I run lvl 4 Recon 1/3 and 2/3 in a tristan, it never fails.
MarieFrance Tessier	Posted - 2009.01.24 01:29:00 - [40] Originally by: Vietone Recon 1 of 3 isnt hard in a proper ship. I usually run my alt with a faction fit CNR and cruise missiles. IF needed, ill bring another character in a Domi with remote shield transporters and sensor boosters and if needed, remote ECCM. Domi can use drones to kill frigates and having 10 light drones ( 5 from each ship) makes destroying frigates way too easy. I only use tech 1 drones because I launched them in the beginning of every mission. They make easy cannon fodder and the cruisers and BS that attack the light drones means thats a while longer they are not attacking my ship if its a hard mission. My CNR can perma run a XL booster and using 2 Caldari invil fields and 2 Tech 2 shield amps, I have yet to come across a mission that can break it. EveHQ shows an omni tank of over 900 DPS and EFT shows almost 900 defense rating as well. Sensor strenght does NOT affect NPC jam rates, thus ECCM are ineffectual.
Salpad Caldari Carebears with Attitude	Posted - 2009.01.24 02:01:00 - [41] Originally by: Ancy Denaries I always do the Sansha version, so I don't get jammed, but TDs on my Tachs is no fun at all. It does, however, beat being permajammed by Guristas :/ The Nightmare does fine against those pesky blood raiders and sanshas. I don't know about Amarr ships, but the Golem, the Caldari marauder, has quite poor sensor strength, compared to the Raven (BS) and even more so the Navy Raven (faction BS). Even the Drake (BC) has much better sensor strength than the Golem. Doesn't that help against NPC jamming? -- Salpad
Homefries	Posted - 2009.01.24 07:15:00 - [42] I'm rather new to the missioning world, but was able to clear Recon 1 of 3 Angel faction with a Maelstrom perma boost (it took a while because my dps skills aren't that great). 3 CCCs Lows: DC2, CapFluxCoil2 x 4 Mids: ExpHard2, InvField2 x 2, XLargeBoost2, BoostAmp, CapRecharge2 Highs: ArbyCruise x 3, 1400mm Scout Arty x 3, DroneLinkAug, 200mm Light Scout Auto I waited til all 4 waves were launched before releasing drones. Just in case, I orbited the jump gate but the tank was never threatened. Used Depleted Uranium Ammo and Devastator/Wrath cruise missles. No faction modules, all t1 weaponry and drones--basically, nothing special. I'm too poor and don't play enough to make the big iskies for anything more. EFT says it tanks ~950 Angel dps. For those Minmatar pilots who are new to the game and looking at this fit--you'll need to have good shield tanking skills to make the perma boost work. Great BS for missioning except it moves so bloody slow. Don't sell your character bro, none of it is real anyway. Just put together another ship, you'll be fine. Name it Phoenix.
Pteranodon	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:03:00 - [43] Recon is a mission which gives you choices- blitz or fight. You made the wrong choice with you ship fit. Get over it & stop whinning- because it was all your own fault. If I want the extra 10 million + bounties in recon then I do the mission & fit with an Omni tank- so I dont have to worry about damage & you should do the same. Stop moaning you got jammed by a little frig which should have been easily killed by a combat drone- did you forget these as well? Go back to mommy- she will kiss you & make you feel better.
Leandro Salazar Better Dead Then Smeg	Posted - 2009.01.24 12:03:00 - [44] You need to add "If I hadn't had the silly idea of using a lasership against Guristas..." to your list On another note, if you had enough time to ponder asking for help in local, why didn't you just log off? One minute after logoff, your ship vanishes from space if it is not pvp-aggroed, and then you can come up with a plan to get out while its safely in limbo, or even just wait the 7 days till the mission expires. And if you are reading this, you have arrived at the signature without noticing...
commander death666	Posted - 2009.01.25 11:10:00 - [45] ever think of reading eve survival for a mishy brefing to know what to expect and such? it would of saved you a lot of isk and the unfortunate loss
Eelis Kiy Gallente Revelation Space	Posted - 2009.01.25 11:57:00 - [46] Originally by: Washell Olivaw Originally by: AeonPhoenix - If the mission brief had said what type of rats were on this recon part 1, I would have tanked specifically from the word go, and not triggered off the timed spawns by going and having a look first. Next time you see a mission briefing. Take note of the icon in front of the location. It denotes which rats/faction you will be fighting. And read up on the mission on the mission reports website (ask for the link in help channel).
Depopulo	Posted - 2009.01.26 01:10:00 - [47] Originally by: Lady Valory The saddest part is the OP is doing recon all wrong... 1) find any of a dozen low sec pockets with 10 level 4 q20 agents 2) max out ur standings/social/LP skills 3) build a uber recon-mission ship like a stabber Now what u do is just fly around and spam ur agent... When u get recon, u do the 3 missions, and then respam... In a day of missioning you can make 300 000 LP for zero work, zero risk, and u get lots of uber faction missions to complete ... After a while u can even start selling standings by ganging people 50 jumps away and just sharing the standings... Anyway, doing the recon mission in 1 minute is just the proper way to do it... forget the rats and just do it easy and semi afk. huh?? 300,000 Lp for a day of missioning? How does this work again??
Talio ZomB	Posted - 2009.01.26 10:25:00 - [48] I think u should use marauders still, just pimp it even more. stick with it dude!!!11eleven11!! My bro uses a kronos to great effect with 3 mag stabs, and amazing dps, with also pretty much perma tank, has a very nice rep, dunno what, plus guristas are easy to tank.
Tom Peeping	Posted - 2009.01.26 16:20:00 - [49] Wow... that sucks man... but how could it happen? You said you lasted 5 and 1/2 minutes right? how could a single webbing frigate have prevented your approaching the acceleration gate and jumping? This has happened to me loads of times in an abaddon, but I've never failed to make the jump. That said, obviously you're not a noob if you've run this hundreds of times. It is definitely a real bugger.
Weeka Lyonesse. KIA Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.26 22:22:00 - [50] Originally by: Andrue Meh. The current Recon is a shadow of its former glory. Even Nighthawk pilots used to stop grinning and pay attention to what they were doing. No they didn't ---
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.26 23:17:00 - [51] Originally by: Tom Peeping Wow... that sucks man... but how could it happen? You said you lasted 5 and 1/2 minutes right? how could a single webbing frigate have prevented your approaching the acceleration gate and jumping? This has happened to me loads of times in an abaddon, but I've never failed to make the jump. He said he was scrammed too. Can't use an accel gate or warp if you're jammed.
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.26 23:43:00 - [52] Originally by: AeonPhoenix - If the mission brief had said what type of rats were on this recon part 1, I would have tanked specifically from the word go, and not triggered off the timed spawns by going and having a look first. ... ... The second marauder I've lost within less then a year. Cancelling out most if not all the profit I ever made on all the months grinding in between. First, it is too bad that players do know what types of enemies they face so they can tank and arm accrdingly in many missions. I truly wish that players would not know this, as it takes away a degree of "realism" in the game, thus degrades the game a bit. In RL, when armies go into battle, they do not know exactly what they will be facing. I really wish it were this way in EVE--in ALL the missions. Second, too many players fly ships too expensive. If you lost "months of grinding" to pay for that one ship, then your ship and mods are too expensive and you should step down to more affordable ships and mods. How many times must this fact be stated on these forums?
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.27 00:52:00 - [53] Originally by: Sagacious Z In RL, when armies go into battle, they do not know exactly what they will be facing. Umm, yes they do. It's not the 1940's anymore. Well, the 1st world does at least, and the 1st world only fights 3rd world nations, or guys in caves. Thus enjoying total intelligence domination. Since WW2, that is. (Falklands schmalklands, Argies were a 3rd world nation back then, and I'd say they still are.) Yeah, you can argue details if you want, but overall that's how it is.
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.27 02:02:00 - [54] Edited by: Sagacious Z on 27/01/2009 02:04:02 Originally by: Qui Shon Umm, yes they do. Umm, no they don't. There is never perfect intelligence, e.g., USA goes to war in Iraq because of nukes (there were no nuke programs/materials discovered), and had no idea if chemical weapons would be used or not--they went into battle with logistics and tactics prepared for chemical weapons, and chemical weapons were not used. 2nd example taken from an ABC news report during the land war in Iraq: "When the U.S. Army recently lost a pair of its ultimate ground battle vehicles, the M1 Abrams tank, to Iraqi ground forces fighting in southern Iraq, the knock-out punch came from a weapon Iraq was not expected to have ù a Russian missile called the Kornet-E." So, you are dead wrong. How in the world can you even think that there is perfect intelligence leading up to battle in real life? 3rd example: the USA had absolutely no idea whatsoever that they would face the types of IEDs that Iraq used, nor did they know at the time Iran was supplying them to Iraq, and many deaths occured to these IEDs because of a lack of "perfect intelligence" that you so ridiculously believe occurs in every battle since 1940. You obviously lack knowledge about military intelligence and capabilities, and you obviously are not a student of current affairs or military history (even recent history) regarding military operations. Analogies aside, it is too bad that EVE players can know ahead of time in most missions how to tank their ship and what type of ammo or missiles to use. The more realism there is in a game, the more challenge there is to the game. The greater the challenge, the more the fun. It is so sad that we are able to know what type of enemy we will face on most missions and their capability, and it is even sadder that so many EVE players want to know this info ahead of time.
Walhall Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.27 03:11:00 - [55] Originally by: Sagacious Z Edited by: Sagacious Z on 27/01/2009 02:04:02 Originally by: Qui Shon Umm, yes they do. Umm, no they don't. There is never perfect intelligence, e.g., USA goes to war in Iraq because of nukes (there were no nuke programs/materials discovered), and had no idea if chemical weapons would be used or not--they went into battle with logistics and tactics prepared for chemical weapons, and chemical weapons were not used. 2nd example taken from an ABC news report during the land war in Iraq: "When the U.S. Army recently lost a pair of its ultimate ground battle vehicles, the M1 Abrams tank, to Iraqi ground forces fighting in southern Iraq, the knock-out punch came from a weapon Iraq was not expected to have ù a Russian missile called the Kornet-E." So, you are dead wrong. How in the world can you even think that there is perfect intelligence leading up to battle in real life? 3rd example: the USA had absolutely no idea whatsoever that they would face the types of IEDs that Iraq used, nor did they know at the time Iran was supplying them to Iraq, and many deaths occured to these IEDs because of a lack of "perfect intelligence" that you so ridiculously believe occurs in every battle since 1940. You obviously lack knowledge about military intelligence and capabilities, and you obviously are not a student of current affairs or military history (even recent history) regarding military operations. Analogies aside, it is too bad that EVE players can know ahead of time in most missions how to tank their ship and what type of ammo or missiles to use. The more realism there is in a game, the more challenge there is to the game. The greater the challenge, the more the fun. It is so sad that we are able to know what type of enemy we will face on most missions and their capability, and it is even sadder that so many EVE players want to know this info ahead of time. true
Niko Takahashi	Posted - 2009.01.27 04:36:00 - [56] A timed mission spawn being uber after you mess up and come back laer to fin the whole 1000 dps plus room waiting for you :D ahahahah sorry read the dam mission reports :D \Can i have your stuff :D
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.27 07:27:00 - [57] Originally by: Sagacious Z Umm, no they don't. Mere details, which I said you can argue.
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.28 00:21:00 - [58] Originally by: Qui Shon Edited by: Qui Shon on 27/01/2009 17:56:19 Originally by: Sagacious Z Umm, no they don't. Mere details, Haaa! ROFL! Yes, they were "mere details" and the "mere details" detailed that you were dead wrong in saying that in modern times there is (paraphrased) "perfect intelligence". I gave you three (actually more). Do you want more examples? Actually, you should go brush up on recent military history. I'll let you find more examples. In EVE, when you get blown up an podded, you just go back to base, dust yourself off, get into your new clone and get yourself a new ship. That is what you need to do here. You've been podded.
Qui Shon	Posted - 2009.01.28 02:17:00 - [59] Originally by: Sagacious Z Haaa! ROFL! Yes, they were "mere details" and the "mere details" detailed that you were dead wrong in saying that in modern times there is (paraphrased) "perfect intelligence". I gave you three (actually more). Do you want more examples? Actually, you should go brush up on recent military history. I'll let you find more examples. In EVE, when you get blown up an podded, you just go back to base, dust yourself off, get into your new clone and get yourself a new ship. That is what you need to do here. You've been podded. Pfft, hardly. You're the only one who's been going on about perfect intelligence, not me. I said total intelligence domination, which is something completely different and cannot be paraphrased into "perfect intelligence". If you cannot discern between a comparative statement and an absolute one, that's your problem. The things you brought up are minor details that matter at a low level, to individuals or company level at most. Of course also at an emotional level for others, but that's neither here nor there as far as this discussion is concerned. They do not matter army level, which is the statement I responded to. You're going on about trifles like IED's, an unexpected missile and loosing a couple tanks. These do not matter. They have no impact on ability to complete the mission. I gave you examples of scale that matter to armies, to contrast with your little worries, but I guess you didn't read them. Or understand the difference.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.28 11:30:00 - [60] Originally by: AeonPhoenix Edited by: AeonPhoenix on 22/01/2009 19:30:04 I thought about it at the time Quin, while I would've offered a reward as incentive to any who came and saved the ship. Something like 100 million isk. As I had more then enough time to wait for someone to get me out of that mess. Thing is I decided against it and I'm glad I didn't, as there's bound to be at least one vulture in local, who only needs to fleet up, warp to me and just sit there and watch me die. Or even if whoever came to rescue me didnt quite do it fast enough, he still would've wanted paying no doubt. And I'd be in the same situation right now, minus around 120 million in module drops from my wrecked ship that they would have looted. One reason not to stay in NPC corps the whole time...
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:05:00 - [61] Originally by: Qui Shon You're going on about trifles like IED's I would like to see you tell each member of the families of all the soldiers kiled in Iraq that it was a mere "trifle" that they lost their son or daughter to an IED, and that since "modern armies have perfect intelligence", their son or daughter died in vain. You even said that major powers have this perfect intelligence over third world nations--you are wrong on both, as this example proves. Air forces and navies have even less perfect intelligence than armies. The USA did not have perfect intelligence to prevent 911. What little they had was flawed. The United Nations did not have perfect intelligence on the whole nuke issue re Iraq. The fact remains your statement is ridiculous, that intelligence is far from perfect, and as it relates to EVE, it makes no sense that players should know what rats they will face and how to arm themselves and tank their ship accordingly. There is no such "pre-intelligence" that is foolproof in real life, and in game play, it is sad that there are sources that let us know what NPC we will face and how to best deal with it. I really wish the NPCs were random in terms of attributes to reflect a real life battlefield.
Pwett Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:11:00 - [62] Stop Stop Stop Stop. This is neither the time nor place to discuss real-world politics.
Sagacious Z Minmatar Eve University	Posted - 2009.01.29 19:20:00 - [63] The "real world politics" was used as an example to illustrate a game play issue (a concern of mine).... re knowing what type of NPC we will face in a mission ahead of time.
Petronous Fabel	Posted - 2009.01.30 05:04:00 - [64] Not to beat a dead dog or anything.... But when the USA went to war with Iraq, they did in fact know they would be fighting Iraqis. So my agent giving me a mission and telling me I am fighting the Amarr is, in fact, quite plausable. I don't think this is unrealistic. Just my 2 cents.

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