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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
621
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Posted - 2012.04.19 17:41:00 -
[121] - Quote
I'd like something skill based like 24h / level:
Infomorph Psychology 1 = 24h + 1 jumpclone Infomorph Psychology 2 = 12h + 2 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 3 = 8h + 3 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 4 = 6h + 4 jumpclones Infomorph Psychology 5 = 4h 48m + 5 jumpclones
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
202
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Posted - 2012.04.19 17:41:00 -
[122] - Quote
Vauss Dutan wrote: I dont pick the navy raven to go on frigate roams, i fly a ship i can afford to lose.
what does this have to do with JC? Pick a proper ship.
Vauss Dutan wrote:I dont do roams in a clone augmented for training, I use a clone with no implants. its your choice to put implants into your dumb head. You dont need to. If you do, deal with it. Yo know, eve is working without implants too.
Vauss Dutan wrote:I cant swap clones in station instantly when on jump cooldown so i wont go out on roams in a clone i cant afford to lose. its good that way, I love expensive pod killmails.
Vauss Dutan wrote:Why have the 24 hour cooldown also prevent same station clone swapping? because I like implants on killmails, as many others out there.
Vauss Dutan wrote:Whats the downside? obvious. Me not getting good pod killmails. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
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Posted - 2012.04.19 17:54:00 -
[123] - Quote
OP, your idea is bad and you should feel bad. We need less easy mode in Eve, not more.
I used to live in Omist, 50-some jumps away from my Empire assets. The fact that I could get stuff to Omist and get back with about in less than an hour of effort on my part is disgusting. It really ruined the "remote" feeling that a very deep nullsec region should give. It was also horrible that I could go from helping a newbie out in hisec to being in a deep nullsec fleet battle in only a few minutes. Jump [freighters, bridges, clones] may make life in 0.0 "easier", but they ruin a lot of the tactics and dedication that it would otherwise take to live out there. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:01:00 -
[124] - Quote
Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
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masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:03:00 -
[125] - Quote
Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me!
In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours.
I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:04:00 -
[126] - Quote
And you'll find people using dedicated pvp clones with useful implants for your podmails - and fewer people not playin the game because it is counter to long term goals to jump. When the rational decision is not to play, something is wrong with the game |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:05:00 -
[127] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:And you'll find people using dedicated pvp clones with useful implants for your podmails - and fewer people not playin the game because it is counter to long term goals to jump. When the rational decision is not to play, something is wrong with the game
Just remove the jump clone mechanic completely, it never really deserved to exist. It's as rancid as most of the ideas that get shot down in "Features and Ideas" every day. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:05:00 -
[128] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again.
Depends on your choice of coefficient and power - but 72 or even 96 hour timers after long jumps would seem reasonable |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:08:00 -
[129] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Depends on your choice of coefficient and power - but 72 or even 96 hour timers after long jumps would seem reasonable
72 and 96 are wimpy. You should be able to JC once a week at most. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:08:00 -
[130] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. I support this.
Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
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masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:10:00 -
[131] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
That's not exponential anymore. That isn't even geometric growth. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:11:00 -
[132] - Quote
Jump clones help negate the fact that learning implants disproportionately harm nullsec players. Empire dwellers live with almost no risk of bein podded, and as such get to train much faster nd cheaper. Nullsec needs reward to balance risk, and training times are one area where there is nothing given
I spend most my time in +4s or 5s and rarely play with characters who are training. Remove learning implants and I will support the removal of jumpclones |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:14:00 -
[133] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Ntrails wrote: Clone timer should be related to the distance between locations. Empire to null? 48 hours. Out of learning implans to clone i same station? 1 hour or less. Exponential, to keep the functionality of cheaper clones for pvp but reduce the ability to hop around the map at will.
Exponential sounds great to me! In Station - 24 hours Next System - 576 hours Next Region - 191102976 hours. I support this change as it effectively removes jump clones from the game, please CCP make the sandbox vast again. I support this. Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:14:00 -
[134] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Jump clones help negate the fact that learning implants disproportionately harm nullsec players. Empire dwellers live with almost no risk of bein podded, and as such get to train much faster nd cheaper. Nullsec needs reward to balance risk, and training times are one area where there is nothing given
I spend most my time in +4s or 5s and rarely play with characters who are training. Remove learning implants and I will support the removal of jumpclones
I'd love to see learning implants go to be honest. But no attribute increases, just permanently handicap everyone's training speed Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:17:00 -
[135] - Quote
Ntrails wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Ntrails
Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation
73
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:24:00 -
[136] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Ntrails wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote:Though, for more reasonable (and less trollish) figures, something like this looks reasonable:
- Same station - 12 hours
- Same solar system - 24 hours
- Same region - 48 hours
- Other region - +24 hours per regional jump needed to get there.
Those are more the sorts of numbers I envision. Though why in blocks of 24 instead of a pure equation based on distance? People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
What crap, everyone knows the game needs more things to make spredsheets for... :) |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
602
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:25:00 -
[137] - Quote
I would support 23 hours but not anything less. I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:27:00 -
[138] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote: People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
I am not bad at math, and those who are can HTFU.
Here's a reasonable formula for making jump clones based on distance.
Cooldown = ( base time ) ^ ( [ jump clone distance from player / pansy handicap ] + 1 )
Some properties:
- A distance of 0ly always yields the base time.
- Exponential growth on longer jumps controlled using the pansy handicap.
- Distance measured in LY just like jump drives.
I would use a base time of 24 hours like we do now and have a handicap that keeps the growth reasonable for however many light years is deemed "Far enough" then starts to rapidly spiral towards impossibleville.
EDIT: For obvious reasons base time > 1. Also, the handicap is an arbitrarily large number that slows the growth (so a handicap of 100 doesn't slow it as much as a handicap of 100,000). Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
811
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Posted - 2012.04.19 18:33:00 -
[139] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Petrus Blackshell wrote: People are bad at math. No need to overcomplicate it for everyone.
I am not bad at math, and those who are can HTFU. Here's a reasonable formula for making jump clones based on distance. Cooldown = ( base time ) ^ ( [ jump clone distance from player / pansy handicap ] + 1 ) Some properties:
- A distance of 0ly always yields the base time.
- Exponential growth on longer jumps controlled using the pansy handicap.
- Distance measured in LY just like jump drives.
I would use a base time of 24 hours like we do now and have a handicap that keeps the growth reasonable for however many light years is deemed "Far enough" then starts to rapidly spiral towards impossibleville. EDIT: For obvious reasons base time > 1. Also, the handicap is an arbitrarily large number that slows the growth (so a handicap of 100 doesn't slow it as much as a handicap of 100,000).
Also reasonable, and any sort of change for scaling up JC costs (linear, exponential, logarithmic, or CCPithmic like tracking/damage formulas) would make me a happy camper. The tear tsunami this would cause would also amuse me greatly. Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
Mashie Saldana
Veto. Veto Corp
480
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:05:00 -
[140] - Quote
Peter Raptor wrote:To those who like waiting 24 hrs for clone jumps, what have you been smoking?
No disrespect, but for the life of me why do you wanna wait 24hr for a piddly clone jump?? Due to power projection. Dominique Vasilkovsky Mashie Saldana Monica Foulkes |
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Herping yourDerp
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
517
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:07:00 -
[141] - Quote
i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:15:00 -
[142] - Quote
Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours.....
EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Ghoest
332
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:18:00 -
[143] - Quote
12 is not a good idea.
20 or 22 hour timers is a great idea. Wherever You Went - Here You Are |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
602
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:19:00 -
[144] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way ----->
Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier. I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Markus Reese
Debitum Naturae ROMANIAN-LEGION
126
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:39:00 -
[145] - Quote
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:No we want 0H JC delays IF you are in the same station as your jump clone.
48H - Other Region 24H - Same Region 12H - Same constellation 6H - Same System 0H - Same Station
Eve is small enough as it is, buy something with a jump drive if you want to get around.
Really? Sweet, so you are going to freely and safely offer my cynos to my other place of operations 60j away and pay for fuel too? greatly nice of you, will you bear my children?
This is a more lame suggestion than the 12 hour, I would like 12 hour cooldown, means if I make a jump somewhere at end of day, next day I can head back after business is done. 0h samestation is for crybaby anomaly ratters in nullsec who want their slave set ratting carriers, but can hide it away easily for pvp, then switch back for more farming. Flat rate timer, or make it a min same station, of 6 hours, add 2 hrs out of station, constellation, region proactively
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masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:40:00 -
[146] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier.
If I were designing this game we would be unable to warp to zero, have no jump clones, and there would be only nullsec. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Wyke Mossari
Staner Industries
191
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:41:00 -
[147] - Quote
Any reduction should be skill based, but against an increased base line.
e.g. 7 days standard, -1 day per skill level. |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
812
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:48:00 -
[148] - Quote
masternerdguy wrote:Alpheias wrote:masternerdguy wrote:Herping yourDerp wrote:i would like 12 hour jump times... at least bring it down to something like 20 hours..... EVE should not be on easy mode. WoW is this way -----> Indeed. So GTFO since you want to make EVE easier. If I were designing this game we would be unable to warp to zero, have no jump clones, and there would be only nullsec. Exactly. You're trying to make ganking miners so much easier Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate
326
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:49:00 -
[149] - Quote
Petrus Blackshell wrote:Exactly. You're trying to make ganking miners so much easier
More along the lines of making PVP in general far harder to run from. You should remember that I fully support NAPfests and blob warfare. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Shadowsword
The Scope Gallente Federation
125
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Posted - 2012.04.19 19:51:00 -
[150] - Quote
If jump clones were completely removed, it would be bothersome for me, but good for the game overall. So I'm in favor of their suppression. A part of what makes Eve a good game is that you have painful choices to makes. |
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