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How will we let them down easily?

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Element 22 Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.31 13:37:00 - [1] Everyone has been speculating furiously about the box version coming out "soon" and the massive influx of new players. But the main problem isn't that they will all hear the "Jita is the place to go buy/sell stuff" (please do be considerate and point them in the direction of another hub for the good of us all, because if Jita goes down, the forums will be filled with the wail of 7000 players) but rather the "culture shock" of joining EVE compared to the other MMORPGs. Our usually derision and sarcasm/irrelevant counter trolling will not only not work, but we will also be baried on the sheer volume of their stupidity/trollishness/lack of RTFM/and noobienish (pronounced noob-e-nish). It isn't so much as we will need a structured way to retaliate/answer their question but a matter of mind set. So how would we as the community not lose our collective cool as we answer for the millionth time (and yes, it will be in the millions) that "yes, dying hurts", "scamming is perfectly legal", "there are black people in the game, they're called Minmatars", "no the game isn't too hard", "no you won't ever 'catch up' in terms of pure skill points, but that doesn't really matter", "no 60 million SP isn't 6 times better then 10 million SP", and last but not least "someone was mean to me/podded me for no reason/suicide ganked me/took my ransom and blew me up anyways" So I'm interested in what the community thinks would be ways of solving this. Would people be in favor of a more difficult intro mission? A EULA like thing you must read before being able to post on the forums (with multiple things to click so you can't just scroll to the bottom) or simply riding it out?
Mordekai Bloodwake Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.31 13:48:00 - [2] Although i agree with you, the main problem will be retention. You see the first time any of the new players get _ganked_ in what they think is a _safe_ area and then lose their ship along with their modules they will most likely leave. We have to consider where the majority of players come from. A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. Anyway, i truely hope this doesnt become the case.
Zaknussem Caldari Intrum Industria	Posted - 2009.01.31 13:49:00 - [3] Mass bannings on the forums. It's the only way to be sure.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.01.31 13:55:00 - [4] I will work on being fast with "can I have your stuff" responses.
Jaunis Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.31 13:57:00 - [5] retention is one of the biggest problems EVE/CCP have even now their are tons of new trial accounts that get made by actual NEW players that never make it past the first 2 weeks..
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N.	Posted - 2009.01.31 14:00:00 - [6] Originally by: Jaunis retention is one of the biggest problems EVE/CCP have even now their are tons of new trial accounts that get made by actual NEW players that never make it past the first 2 weeks.. On the other hand, those who do stay tend to stay for a very long time.
Jaunis Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.31 14:10:00 - [7] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Jaunis retention is one of the biggest problems EVE/CCP have even now their are tons of new trial accounts that get made by actual NEW players that never make it past the first 2 weeks.. On the other hand, those who do stay tend to stay for a very long time. i agree and usually have more than one account
Gimpb Deathwatch Ltd	Posted - 2009.01.31 14:11:00 - [8] As it has always been done? "Welcome to EVE"
Connner Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.31 14:26:00 - [9] Originally by: Mordekai Bloodwake Although i agree with you, the main problem will be retention. You see the first time any of the new players get _ganked_ in what they think is a _safe_ area and then lose their ship along with their modules they will most likely leave. We have to consider where the majority of players come from. A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. Anyway, i truely hope this doesnt become the case. I disagree with this. Basicly you are actually 'safe' in empire space as long as you arn't in FW, arn't carrying billions of isk in a paper airplane ship and arn't stupid enough to fall for a can flip scheme. Nobody is going to gank your rifter. At most you'll be frustrated w/ a ninja salvager.
Leiara Knight Gallente The Oblivion Guard	Posted - 2009.01.31 15:21:00 - [10] Originally by: Connner Originally by: Mordekai Bloodwake Although i agree with you, the main problem will be retention. You see the first time any of the new players get _ganked_ in what they think is a _safe_ area and then lose their ship along with their modules they will most likely leave. We have to consider where the majority of players come from. A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. Anyway, i truely hope this doesnt become the case. I disagree with this. Basicly you are actually 'safe' in empire space as long as you arn't in FW, arn't carrying billions of isk in a paper airplane ship and arn't stupid enough to fall for a can flip scheme. Nobody is going to gank your rifter. At most you'll be frustrated w/ a ninja salvager. You naughty boy. Stop threatening the drama.
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance OWN Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.31 15:24:00 - [11] Lots of people will buy the box. Lots of dumb newbies will start and die horribly. Entertainment for all. These newbies mostly quit after a week. CCP pocket the money from supplying 60 days gametime in box and only 7 being used.
Connner Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.31 15:57:00 - [12] Originally by: TimMc Lots of people will buy the box. Lots of dumb newbies will start and die horribly. Entertainment for all. These newbies mostly quit after a week. CCP pocket the money from supplying 60 days gametime in box and only 7 being used. I do agree with this. EVE is vastly different than any MMO, I'm sure there will be a lot of people who just won't give it a chance because it' too overwhelming untill you get over the learning curve.
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:03:00 - [13] The easiest way to put down people is... Mhmmh mhm mhmmhmh What? MHMHmhm. Oh. Well. Guess...that won't work on this.
JoDan Troikian	Posted - 2009.01.31 16:58:00 - [14] Edited by: JoDan Troikian on 31/01/2009 16:58:46 How did you learn not to solo mine/rat in .4 and below? When you did it and got popped. That's called experience. I lost everything I own several times in this game starting out b/c I didn't know how to read the map/get a scout, etc. Now I know. The pain felt by losing T1 frig/cruiser/industrials is important building blocks in their careers playing eve. If they ragequit, they'll either come back or they will move on. Either way, they will become better or they will leave. my 2 isk. EDIT: my speling suks
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:06:00 - [15] It won't be an issue as huge as people seems to picture it. the "adapt or die" at its finest ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Crumplecorn Contact the CSM about it, voting themselves into disbandment wouldn't be pushing the boundaries of absurdity for them.
Gabrialle Amarr Sanctuary Logistical Industries Inc	Posted - 2009.01.31 17:11:00 - [16] CCP should hire players to sit outside noob stations, fleet noob, pop noob, point out that this is eve and EVERYBODY is out to get you.
rValdez5987 Amarr 32nd Amarrian Imperial Navy Regiment.	Posted - 2009.01.31 18:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Mordekai Bloodwake Although i agree with you, the main problem will be retention. You see the first time any of the new players get _ganked_ in what they think is a _safe_ area and then lose their ship along with their modules they will most likely leave. We have to consider where the majority of players come from. A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. Anyway, i truely hope this doesnt become the case. This is exactly why i love eve. the little wussy "I hate pvp" f***** can go somewhere else.
xavier69 Gallente Stark Enterprises LLC	Posted - 2009.01.31 18:30:00 - [18] Edited by: xavier69 on 31/01/2009 18:33:23 Edited by: xavier69 on 31/01/2009 18:31:40 Quote: A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. I wouldnÆt worry to much about it, I donÆt think the box is going to sell a lot of copies the fact is now days players donÆt trust software companies to release a finished product so a lot of these new guys will do some checking to find out about the game before purchase and see the pvp and never buy it. Lets be real I have played everything from meridian 59 to this game and have 13 years playing online games and could easly list nearly 20 titles. Every Game that has had non-consenting or non-duel pvp has been a complete disaster and these players arenÆt going to trust ccp to actually deliver a fair pvp environment. Especially when 6-year-old wash-up douche-bagger can flips a 3-day-old newb and pops him. ThatÆs going spread on the web like wildfire pvp is shunned in todayÆs market of online games. Will we get some new players yea will we get a rep for being a seaspool of horrible players who are vile and who scam and cheat, These are not concepts other games even allow I don't think the PR is going to work out in ccp favor at all. Atari is just cashing in on ccp and knows its not going to go well, they have done this with several recent titles they donÆt care if it goes well so long as they get there % and I am sure ccp got bent over the fence to get there logo on the box. PS: I donÆt hate the game I just donÆt bs
Naibasak	Posted - 2009.01.31 18:46:00 - [19] xavier, are you kidding? thatÆs the whole reason i play eve ^^
Mordekai Bloodwake Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.31 18:47:00 - [20] Edited by: Mordekai Bloodwake on 31/01/2009 18:48:05 Originally by: rValdez5987 This is exactly why i love eve. the little wussy "I hate pvp" f***** can go somewhere else. Ah yes Natural Selection at its best, i love it!
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2009.01.31 19:37:00 - [21] 95% of new players will quit. If Eve was for everybody, it would have dancing. --- Originally by: Roguehalo Can you nano Titans?
Grek Forto THE IRIS United Freemen Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.31 19:44:00 - [22] Edited by: Grek Forto on 31/01/2009 19:44:38 The box should have some kind of disclaimer. Maybe a new PEGI marking showing a brain with a lightning trough it.
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:00:00 - [23] My concern is that we all want more people playing and we want EVE to have the respect and population it deserves... yet we may shoot ourselves in the foot by not treating new players like guests in our home. The forums will be flooded with a lot of questions and whines we've heard a million times and rather than - as a general population of EVE players - responding as if we were ambassadors for the game we love, we'll flood the forums with "STFU NOOB" and "gb2wow" and other useless other crap. Personally, I want to make sure I go out of my way to answer questions in a serious manner for these players both in the forums and in the game (the responses in-game tend to be much more civil and helpful and thought out, sadly). Even if I find it frustrating, I'll try to treat them respectfully so that even despite their confusions or frustrations, they'll feel compelled to continue trying to figure the game out, because they like the community. (And as mature and decent as the community has a reputation for, it can be just as ****headed and trollish as any other game community out there, too). If I need to re-iterate to an angry carebear why gatecamping or ninja-salvaging is part of the game mechanic and explain to them how they need to not be angry about it, but find a way to work within the mechanics of the game, then I'll do so. Rather than telling them "cry more; go away". Most importantly, I think it would be very helpful if the major EVE bloggers and sites out there begin to prepare for these new people NOW. And in these forums, we should probably put together a more updated list of FAQs that address all the common expected questions and complaints so when they hit the forums, there are some immediately helpful answers for them. It would also be good if CCP would make it easier to see/find the right forums. For example, why is the GENERAL DISCUSSION forum so far down the list? It's like the 15th forum, even under the warfare and mission forums. And there's nothing to really distinguish it from the other 30 forums. CCP really should do something like make the titles of the echnical (mac/windows/linux) and General and CCP News forums a different color or bold or change the backgrounds of them (not in general - just on the main forum index page when you first click "Forums").
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:04:00 - [24] Originally by: Qordel For example, why is the GENERAL DISCUSSION forum so far down the list? It's like the 15th forum, even under the warfare and mission forums. And there's nothing to really distinguish it from the other 30 forums. CCP really should do something like make the titles of the echnical (mac/windows/linux) and General and CCP News forums a different color or bold or change the backgrounds of them (not in general - just on the main forum index page when you first click "Forums"). If a player dont have enough patience to find the correct forum channel, they wont like Eve.
NightF0x Gallente Intergalactic League of Terrorists	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:32:00 - [25] Originally by: xavier69 Edited by: xavier69 on 31/01/2009 18:43:56 Quote: A large number come from other MMO's that do not share the same _niche_ PvP system Eve has to offer nor will they like the fact they have no _safe_ area to feel relaxed in. I wouldnÆt worry to much about it, I donÆt think the box is going to sell a lot of copies the fact is now days players donÆt trust software companies to release a finished product so a lot of these new guys will do some checking to find out about the game before purchase and see the pvp and never buy it. [If the box has pvp as main theme expect record low sales] Lets be real I have played everything from meridian 59 to this game and have 13 years playing online games and could easly list nearly 20 titles. Every Game that has had non-consenting or non-duel pvp has been a complete disaster and these players arenÆt going to trust ccp to actually deliver a fair pvp environment. Especially when 6-year-old wash-up douche-bagger can flips a 3-day-old newb and pops him. ThatÆs going spread on the web like wildfire pvp is shunned in todayÆs market of online games. Will we get some new players yea will we get a rep for being a cesspool of horrible players who are vile and who scam and cheat, These are not concepts other games even allow I don't think the PR is going to work out in ccp favor at all. Atari is just cashing in on ccp and knows its not going to go well, they have done this with several recent titles they donÆt care if it goes well so long as they get there % and I am sure ccp got bent over the fence to get there logo on the box. PS: I donÆt hate the game I just donÆt bs Are you joking? There are groups of players just looking for a place just like Eve. It shows every time that there is a huge in-game scam and Eve makes the news, there is a huge influx of new players. PvP isn't dead, far from it. ------------------------------------
Don Zoul	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:48:00 - [26] Personally, I don't think the influx of people from the box launch will be as large as when walking in stations finally arrives.
Destination SkillQueue Are We There Yet	Posted - 2009.01.31 20:54:00 - [27] Edited by: Destination SkillQueue on 31/01/2009 20:55:02 Is this really a problem? General forum is for general chatting and I don't care if the poster is a noob or a vet. There are so many alts here anyway, so do you bother checking the posters age/history every time? Bad ideas/threads get trolled in all forum sections. So what? I can't belieave someones feelings get hurt by anything that stays withing the EULA. If you have a question and just want it answered, you go to the new citizens forum. There people answer your questions seriously with minimal trolling every time. Guide noobies to post there, if you are worried about the reactions of the general forum population. New players maybe quests, but they are visiting our home. I can be polite, but the things/people I care about are the people and atmostphere already in EVE. The quests don't have to like these things, but when they whine about how the people here suck and things work all wrong, I feel justified suggesting, that this game isn't for them and they should GTFO instead of trying to ruin everything for the people who like things the way they are.
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2009.01.31 21:33:00 - [28] Originally by: Jim McGregor 95% of new players will quit. If Eve was for everybody, it would have dancing. This, and the remaining 5 % will stay for the next 5 years too! But sure, I would like to have /dance and /hiphop brought in with ambulation anyway! Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL
Statsministern	Posted - 2009.01.31 21:35:00 - [29] The main problem are you whiners! STFU and play the game.
Wloire Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.01.31 21:55:00 - [30] I think the best thing about this is people who will never be right for EVE will waste their money on the box and quit 2 weeks later. We don't have to put up with that segment of the MMO population and yet we will benefit from their cash influx. All in all it's a great deal for those of us who actually enjoy the game.

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