EVE Search - Fix the Ferox

All Channels

Ships and Modules

Fix the Ferox

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Haradgrim Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION	Posted - 2009.02.25 23:29:00 - [31] Beam Harb or Rail Brutix will kick the living crap out of a Ferox. Short range Ferox is lolltastic in comparison with short range BCs of every other race. I'm a big fan of saying every ship is good if you use it right...... but the ferox is just bad, much like the raptor.... it just doesn't have enough OOmmph to get the job done.... -- Originally by: CCP Oveur Just donæt forget the reach-around.
AKULA UrQuan Caldari Druuge Crimson Corporation	Posted - 2009.02.26 00:05:00 - [32] Originally by: Naomi Knight Oh i cannot decide which one to use the ferox with 126km opt +170dps or the brutix with 84km opt +263 dps +25m3 more drone . It is so hard to choose.... And if you want to kill frigs from your bs you wont hit them with spike loaded. And it is already bad if your friends bses are swarmed by enemy frigs .... If the hostiles are cooperative Spike can hit. If not switch out to faction Tungsten and take sub 2km/s transversal shots. This is really piloting tatics and theorycrafting that are outside the scope of the discussion. The Moa, Ferox and Eagle are all highly niche in their function. They preform that niche very well but the price paid is a damage output that is hardly eyepopping. Some deal with it and others don't.
Karl Luckner	Posted - 2009.02.26 00:17:00 - [33] If the Ferox gets an additional turret you will have the same weird situation as with the Rokh: running out of cap just by firing your guns.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.02.26 00:23:00 - [34] I dont want a turret ship... i want a better missile Battleship
6Bagheera9 Slacker Industries The Boat Violencing Initiative	Posted - 2009.02.26 03:21:00 - [35] Virtually all the tier 1 BCs (except the Brutix though its tough to fit) are underwhelming. Creativity will find niches, but they simply aren't first line ships.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.26 03:47:00 - [36] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 26/02/2009 03:47:59 Why not fit a buffer tank and shield harmonizing link? Kickass buffer to boot, and the passive recharge can almost be called a tank. Much like the Cyclone I see the best use for it as a cheap wannabe command ship, fit a link to boost the gang, slap some rails or blasters or even missiles on, whatever fits once ubertank, mwd and warfare links are sorted. Could even say its in some way better than the XL-Booster Cyclone.
Gneeznow North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.02.26 11:06:00 - [37] Originally by: Naomi Knight Edited by: Naomi Knight on 25/02/2009 22:40:45 Originally by: Xanos Blackpaw the ferox is fine. its made to be a support sniper and its great in this role. 180 dps at 151 KM. Lies. or fail fit without an mwd. [Ferox, t2 rigs] Reactor Control Unit II Reactor Control Unit II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II 250mm Railgun II, Spike M 250mm Railgun II, Spike M 250mm Railgun II, Spike M 250mm Railgun II, Spike M 250mm Railgun II, Spike M 250mm Railgun II, Spike M [empty high slot] Hybrid Locus Coordinator II Hybrid Locus Coordinator II Hybrid Locus Coordinator I ....... lulz 150km + 14km falloff, 150dps
Noisrevbus Caldari Breams Gone Wild	Posted - 2009.02.26 12:45:00 - [38] Edited by: Noisrevbus on 26/02/2009 12:50:39 Originally by: Haradgrim Yep, there is a great combination.... range (while useful) isn't a sufficient replacement for decent DPS, even in QR post nano... Originally by: Haradgrim I'm a big fan of saying every ship is good if you use it right...... but the ferox is just bad, much like the raptor.... it just doesn't have enough OOmmph to get the job done.... This, and this. Range + size: I think i argued the same case in a recent Raptor-thread. The range bonus of most (smaller-) ships is simply not enough to compete with a damage bonus. Once we start looking at BS sizes (Rokh) and the ships with double bonuses (Eagle, Vulture) the range bonus start to become appearant, but at the same time it is not incredibly strong (a Scorch-Lot still shoot quite alot further than a double-bonus Beagle). I'm not sure if it's a deficiency in the bonus itself, or in the hybrid-weapon platform (as argued before), but the bonus simply can't compete unless you reach breakpoint ranges that have a real effect in the game. The Rokh for example does, both with rails and blasters, which is why it's considered a good platform. Changing ammunition and weapon types: With blasters Rokh hit beyond certain short tackle-ranges, which allow it to do something similar can't do better. While i too get the idea that the range bonus can be seen as a supplement for using different ammunition, that concept is today rather more turned around. Where a damage platform can use longer ranges instead, or go point blank with much more damage. Especially, when considering that certain ships get a tracking bonus as well, which is more in tune with "upgrading" weapons or ammunition than the ability of a Ferox to "downgrade". Ineffective range: Rails The end result is that with Blasters, the bonus of the Ferox do not alter it's strategic position (over eg., a Brutix), unlike what it does for Vultures, Rokhs and Eagles. With Rails the ability to downgrade ammunition can not match the ability to upgrade ammunition and/or weapon size. A Ferox with 250mm do not have enough range, or enough punch to warrant a semi-sniper position over a Brutix either (trading about 100 DPS for 30km range, prior to drones, using 250mm II's /w Spike and 2x Comps, just to take an extreme range yet possible example). Especially when a range of around 130km is in the middle of no-man's land in terms of reach, right between two warp-points. To fight in it's optimal and use it's range bonus a Ferox have to slowboat there (and should you start downgrade ammo, you'll lose damage down to ~90km range [even with CN ammo] which is shorter than a Brutix), even if you do gain some tracking it's a bad trade-off. Ineffective range: Blasters The same argument is more easily posed with Blasters, where the tech II ammunition is actually not worse than the faction-counterparts. With Void the damage is considerably less, not only without bonus but also less turrets and less drones. The difference is otherworldly. Using Null the Ferox do escape immidiate web/scram range (unlike a Raptor), but have no comfort-zone to operate in (unlike the double range-bonused ships) so it's still closer to web/scram than point-range and a short range platform. The Brutix will also do more damage at longer range with Rails and AM. Summary: I just can't think of any scenario where that range bonus, in a reasonable (or common) live-situation would be better than damage or tracking. That's my gripe with it. It's not that i dislike the concept, but it should be balanced around other logical ranges in the game. Short range is bracketed up where webs, scramblers and disruptors operate. Sniping is bracketed up between warp-points. Sniping beyond 100km but not up to 150km is fairly useless. Having a range bonus but still being in tackle-range is fairly useless. That makes the Ferox, fairly useless (where a Vulture and Eagle pay alot of "bonus-value" to make some sense).
fkingfurious	Posted - 2009.02.26 13:00:00 - [39] Blaster Ferox isn't actually all that bad, certainly no worse than a Cyclone or Prophecy, and has benefited alot with the Scrambler chnages as a brave pilot can attempt to get away with only a Scram as it's tackle. 6x Ion II, Assault Launcher II 10MN MWD, 2x LSE II, Invuln II, Scrambler II 3x MFS II, DCU II No rigs if you're poor, resist rigs if you're not poor and extender rigs if you're rich. That gives it 68K EHP with the resist rigs (78k with extender) and 520+ DPS with faction ammo. The beauty of the ship is that it's optimal range bonus allows Null to comfortably hit well beyond overloaded web range, which is why you don't need one. As anyone who's been on the receiving end of an AB/Scram frig knows, a webber won't help you hit them if they get close, so carrying one for that purpose just gives a false sense of security. Against any close range BC/Cruiser the lack of web won't hinder you at all, except for stopping someone slow boating to a gate. So really, as a blaster boat theres nothing wrong with it. (And if you are worried about frigs swap the launcher for a small neut and carry 5 warrior II's and you're as safe against them as a BC is going to get anyway).
Noisrevbus Caldari Breams Gone Wild	Posted - 2009.02.26 13:27:00 - [40] Edited by: Noisrevbus on 26/02/2009 13:30:39 Originally by: fkingfurious The beauty of the ship is that it's optimal range bonus allows Null to comfortably hit well beyond overloaded web range, which is why you don't need one. 13.3km [optimal + falloff] (on perfect skills) vs. 13.0km [overloaded] (on a non-bonused ship). What am i missing? 0.3km is well beyond? Are you sure you are not mixing the Ferox up with the Vulture? ;). (edit: 13.3km even, when double-checking, not 13.6km)
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.26 21:14:00 - [41] Originally by: Noisrevbus 13.3km [optimal + falloff] (on perfect skills) vs. 13.0km [overloaded] (on a non-bonused ship). What am i missing? 0.3km is well beyond? Are you sure you are not mixing the Ferox up with the Vulture? ;). (edit: 13.3km even, when double-checking, not 13.6km) 8.4 optimal + 7.8 falloff = 16.2 range on maxed ferox w/ null, and 5.6 + 7.8 on unbonused ship. Not that it is any sort of reasonable buffer against someone trying to get his overheated web on you, especially not in something as sluggish as a ferox. I still dont understand why people dont use the ship for the role its intended for, its a tier1 bc with tanking bonus, put a massive tank and warfare link on it. And use rails instead of blasters, it gets a bonus to optimal, which is a bonus to rails. [Ferox, warfare link] Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Damage Control II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing 200mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Plutonium Charge M 200mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Plutonium Charge M 200mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Plutonium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge M Dual 150mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge M Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Warrior II x5
Karl Luckner	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:06:00 - [42] Edited by: Karl Luckner on 26/02/2009 22:09:19 Great idea, you could as well fit 5 snowball launchers. And one unbonused ganglink doesn't make you primary. Tanking itself is no role.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:18:00 - [43] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 26/02/2009 22:19:16 Originally by: Karl Luckner Great idea, you could as well fit 5 snowball launchers. And one unbonused ganglink doesn't make you primary. Tanking itself is no role. Lulz. Providing gang boost is a role if you didnt know that. And surprise, for that role having a good tank is advised, while you couldnt care less about dps. Besides you can as well fit blasters, duh. Still a waste of that nice optimal bonus, but if you insist do it.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:43:00 - [44] Originally by: Saietor Blackgreen 7th turret + more fitting to actually squese it in could do the trick. Even now Ferox is extremely PG-deficient. Just more grid would be a start. Although I won't complain about it being a 7 turret BC - I mean, lets face it, the Brutix gets 7 turrets, a 50m3 dronebay, and a damage bonus. Compare to that ... well, even a 7 turret Ferox isn't particularly awesome, but it'd be a step along the right lines. Ideally it'd also have a low -> mid too. But now I think I'm starting to get a bit optimistic.
Karl Luckner	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:49:00 - [45] A mindlinked Claymore has a role in a small gang. The Ferox you proposed is hardly more then dead weight.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:55:00 - [46] Brutix is just a Thorax on steroids, not comparable to the Ferox in any way.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.26 22:59:00 - [47] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 26/02/2009 23:02:57 Originally by: Karl Luckner A mindlinked Claymore has a role in a small gang. The Ferox you proposed is hardly more then dead weight. You realize you are comparing a tier1 BC to a CS here? You see the pricetag?? But yea, the BCs just get the bonus to warfare links cause devs couldnt be arsed to think of something useful FYI, a mindlinked Claymore would profit from said Ferox a big deal.
Karl Luckner	Posted - 2009.02.26 23:13:00 - [48] No, I just say a your setup can't fill the Role auf a gang booster. A single unbonused ganglink is no substitute for tackle and DPS.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.27 00:14:00 - [49] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 00:18:05 Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 00:16:41 Originally by: Karl Luckner No, I just say a your setup can't fill the Role auf a gang booster. A single unbonused ganglink is no substitute for tackle and DPS. Well, you are wrong. Unless increased EHP is a bad thing in PvP now. You might notice no t1 BC gets a bonus to its ganglinks, so it fills the role just as good as any BC does. So what was your point again? Also tackle has nothing to do with gang boosters, not the slightest bit, and so does DPS. You really think that 1x web 1x scram are worth more than increased HP for the whole fleet? Really? Nobody in his right mind would use a Cyclone for DPS either, but its a much better booster platform than the hurricane.
Karl Luckner	Posted - 2009.02.27 00:51:00 - [50] Originally by: Lilith Velkor Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 00:18:05 Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 00:16:41 Well, you are wrong. Unless increased EHP is a bad thing in PvP now. You might notice no t1 BC gets a bonus to its ganglinks, so it fills the role just as good as any BC does. So what was your point again? Also tackle has nothing to do with gang boosters, not the slightest bit, and so does DPS. You really think that 1x web 1x scram are worth more than increased HP for the whole fleet? Really? Nobody in his right mind would use a Cyclone for DPS either, but its a much better booster platform than the hurricane. I guess we just have to agree to disagree. For me, there is no point in fielding such a poor gangbooster instead of an gankship/e-war platform. May become interesting for larger gangs, where it actually would make a difference, but in that case I would go for a fleetcommand anyway.
Ryoken McKeon Galactic Defence Syndicate Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.27 01:01:00 - [51] Give it the extra turret slot and PG, but make the optimal bonus to rails only. That will differentiate it's use with a brutix.
MidnightMartyr Gallente NailorTech Industries Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.27 01:44:00 - [52] Originally by: Stalina Edited by: Stalina on 25/02/2009 20:49:16 Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile My mind just exploded due to the fact that there is null in only one of the guns. (very OCD) Was that intentional, and thus have a reason, or did you just miss one when converting the charges? /ocd
Lisento Slaven The Drekla Consortium	Posted - 2009.02.27 02:03:00 - [53] Personally the resist bonus seems idiotic. The range bonus says it is a sniper. Why do you need resists when you're sniping? Why not give it a bonus that compliments the optimal range bonus? Or maybe increase the amount of the optimal range bonus. Let it snipe at 150km with a decent fit. Not one with t2 rigs or like...4 tracking computers + 4 tracking enhancers. I would use these if they could actually shoot outside sentry range without gimping them so much that it is more worth while to fly something else. --- Put in space whales!
Noisrevbus Caldari Breams Gone Wild	Posted - 2009.02.27 02:07:00 - [54] Originally by: Lilith Velkor Originally by: Noisrevbus 13.3km [optimal + falloff] (on perfect skills) vs. 13.0km [overloaded] (on a non-bonused ship). 8.4 optimal + 7.8 falloff = 16.2 range on maxed ferox w/ null, and 5.6 + 7.8 on unbonused ship. If you had actually bothered to read the referal post of the citation, you can clearly see the original poster saying "Ion". Your ranges are with Neutron. That is another weapon. As for the argument about Rails. Rails are an option, but not necessarily a clear cut choice. A range bonus is definately not supposed to be only a Rail bonus (even if longer range stand to reach better scaling), that's a "bad Gallente" argument. Even if you switch over to Rails, the damage bonus on the Brutix is superior. I have already raised some points as to why, if you had bothered to read the larger argument of what you are trying to quote out of it's context. Gang links, while i agree with the general idea of Links being a utility-option that can square against having eg., tackle (in a gang large enough to support it); being able to fit a Link is nothing unique to the Ferox. Instead, being unable to effectively incorporate Links is more in relation to the Caldari platforms as they lack grid, with grid-hungry weapons. The Drake being even worse than the Ferox in that regard (good boat without the link, but not made to fit a link despite having a bonus toward it). The Drake unlike the Ferox though, is a good platform overall.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar DEATH'S LEGION Red Box.	Posted - 2009.02.27 02:39:00 - [55] Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 02:45:39 Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 02:42:00 Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 27/02/2009 02:41:09 Originally by: Noisrevbus If you had actually bothered to read the referal post of the citation, you can clearly see the original poster saying "Ion". Your ranges are with Neutron. That is another weapon. Yea, my bad. I did actually notice it after I reading another post later, but didnt bother to edit. Quote: As for the argument about Rails. Rails are an option, but not necessarily a clear cut choice. A range bonus is definately not supposed to be only a Rail bonus (even if longer range stand to reach better scaling), that's a "bad Gallente" argument. Even if you switch over to Rails, the damage bonus on the Brutix is superior. I have already raised some points as to why, if you had bothered to read the larger argument of what you are trying to quote out of it's context. Well, I see it this way, a true bonus to blasters besides damage would be tracking, or falloff like the Deimos gets. Optimal is wasted on blasters, as you take a 50% penalty right away with AM, while Null gives more from falloff than optimal. Rails on the other hand profit a great deal from optimal bonus, more so since you dont typically use ammunation that'll cut your bonus in half right away. Quote: Instead, being unable to effectively incorporate Links is more in relation to the Caldari platforms as they lack grid, with grid-hungry weapons. The Drake being even worse than the Ferox in that regard (good boat without the link, but not made to fit a link despite having a bonus toward it). The Drake unlike the Ferox though, is a good platform overall. Yea, exactly my point. I'd never suggest putting a link on a Drake really as you lose out so much potential there. The Ferox on the other hand, much like the Prophecy (and Cyclone to some extend), is a low priority when calling targets (no dps to speak of, good tank), and hence the ideal platform to put a link on. I'm using links on the Hurricane now and then, but since it gets called primary early on it is a bad booster platform, Cyclone however does good as people usually shoot it last. In my opinion, the only race that doesnt get a nice t1 warfare link platform are gallente, as basically both of their BCs are damage dealers, although I can see the myrm being remotely useful in that role I'd prolly fit it for dmg anyway.
bldyannoyed Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.02.27 12:23:00 - [56] I think the Ferox should definitely get an additional turret slot and a boost to fitting to accomodate it. Because of course the ship wouldn't be massivley superior to all the other tier 1 BC's if it did..... Seriously, with the way scramlers work these days (allowing you to tackle with only a single module) the tasty resist bonus (compared to the utter fail of say the Brutix's rep bonus) a 7 Ion triple MFS ferox would be an absolute monster. With my skills (so no all lvl5 silliness) I would get 515DPS out of 7 IonII's with CN AM and 3x MFS II BEFORE drones and whatever you choose to throw at the last high slot. So potentially you're looking at 600DPS or more (you get 97 out of 5 Hob II's) with a 57K UNRIGGED buffer tank and the ability, thanks to a questionable change to scrams, to tackle all by your very own self. DO IT IMMEDIATELY CCP.
Naomi Knight Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.02.27 13:45:00 - [57] Edited by: Naomi Knight on 27/02/2009 13:45:09 Originally by: Lilith Velkor While ~250 dps arent exactly stellar, having the option for mid-range sniping isnt useless in a well-rounded gang. But it isnt 250dps it is 170dps with 6x250mm rails +2 magfs t2. If you want to use antimatter with rails then you should fit blasters. 170dps is nothing ,even some frigs have more ...
Stalina Gallente Deep Space Exploration Squad	Posted - 2009.02.27 15:45:00 - [58] Originally by: MidnightMartyr Originally by: Stalina Edited by: Stalina on 25/02/2009 20:49:16 Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Null M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Bloodclaw Light Missile My mind just exploded due to the fact that there is null in only one of the guns. (very OCD) Was that intentional, and thus have a reason, or did you just miss one when converting the charges? /ocd checking range? _________________________________
Cedric Diggory Perfunctory Oleaginous Laocoon Mugwumps	Posted - 2009.02.27 16:02:00 - [59] Quote: If you want to use antimatter with rails then you should fit blasters. lolwut? 250mm Rails on a Ferox with antimatter have a 25km optimal without any tracking mods... add your 15km falloff and you're still dealing reasonable damage at 40km out, which is perfect midrange sniper territory. Add some magstabs, tracking computers and a little bit of tank and an afterburner and you have a ship dealing 250 gun dps at 35km whilst travelling at 400m/s. --- Originally by: 7shining7one7 a) there are no conspiracies whatsoever b) those who believe there are are nuts
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.02.27 18:10:00 - [60] Originally by: Heloise ChateauBriande Keep the suggestions coming! I really like the look of the Ferox and want to be able to use them. Issue is the same with almost all rails platforms (ie, moa, eagle, ferox, etc). They never have enough powergrid to fit the powergrid hungry top tier rails - which you need to snipe and counter-snipe. They need to fit sensor boosters then most of the time to target out to those ranges and often tracking computers to hit out to those ranges even though they're supposed to be sniper ships. Increasing power grid and locking distance, base optimal on the ships - by itself - would fix their problems. Then they'd be a reasonable sniper. Right now you need to put fitting equipment on them to fit the guns, you wind up hitting for non-existent damage and you have no tank to speak of.

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.