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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
371

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Posted - 2012.07.06 16:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
Today Team Five 0 made some changes to OTA sites, due late Summer. They are as follows:
1. Move the tower closer to the entrance 2. Remove the Maras 3. Reduce the effective hit points overall including a significant Niarja and Tama reduction
We are aware that the OTA sites are causing a lot of problems at the moment, and while we still have long-term plans for Incursions, we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes. I will update this thread when the changes hit SISI.
- Affinity CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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Vendetta
3
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Posted - 2012.07.06 16:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thanks for the update. Good step in the right direction. |

Serge SC
The Valhalla Project
38
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Posted - 2012.07.06 16:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
I'll be eager to test the sites once it's possible (and my Internet connection allows me to do so).
Keep up the good work CCP! Serge SC Le Frenchman Friendly FC |

Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure Rote Kapelle
264
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Posted - 2012.07.06 16:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
that should keep everyone happy and sites being run normally for the time being. Thanks for the update.
Have to wait to see what Darth says though   On holiday. -áIn some other world. Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours. To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent, It was a sun-á |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
371

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Posted - 2012.07.06 16:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Lyron-Baktos wrote:that should keep everyone happy
hopefully!
CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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chris1945
Ambivalence Co-operative Black Thorne Alliance
2
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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:16:00 -
[6] - Quote
In my opinion HQs and AS sites should pay better. They are more risky and are harder for the FCs and it's more work to keep them running if ppl. leave fleet. |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
372

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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
chris1945 wrote:In my opinion HQs and AS sites should pay better. They are more risky and are harder for the FCs and it's more work to keep them running if ppl. leave fleet.
We will look at payouts overall at a later date. This change fixes an extremely unbalanced VG site CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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chris1945
Ambivalence Co-operative Black Thorne Alliance
2
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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ok, it's fine. Thanks. |

Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure Rote Kapelle
264
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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:27:00 -
[9] - Quote
chris1945 wrote:In my opinion HQs and AS sites should pay better. They are more risky and are harder for the FCs and it's more work to keep them running if ppl. leave fleet.
Don't they get a pretty good boost to LP though?
They are a bit riskier due to more alpha I agree but I find them more boring tbh. You don't get targeted as much and they are a longer grind to complete.
On holiday. -áIn some other world. Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours. To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent, It was a sun-á |

Phattecia
SKEET ELITE Sk33t Fl33t
1
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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:44:00 -
[10] - Quote
The journey of a thousand miles, begins with but a single step. |
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Kodavor
Mine3
15
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Posted - 2012.07.06 17:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Today Team Five 0 made some changes to OTA sites, due late Summer. They are as follows:
1. Move the tower closer to the entrance 2. Remove the Maras 3. Reduce the effective hit points overall including a significant Niarja and Tama reduction
We are aware that the OTA sites are causing a lot of problems at the moment, and while we still have long-term plans for Incursions, we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes. I will update this thread when the changes hit SISI.
- Affinity
(hug) Thank you .  |

Asmodes Reynolds
Rayn Enterprises
76
|
Posted - 2012.07.06 17:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
I really love the CCP isn't just abandoning this feature, It is most definitely one of the best features you added to date. Now that being said putting on another Band-Aid over the six Band-Aids that you already put on it is not going to make it heal.
You need to balance the low sec incursions differently then the high sec incursions, because the two communities have very different needs and if you balance it for one community let's say Lowsec community (you would need to make the site pay more well taking the less time) to balance the risk enough to draw people back to them. however if you do this to the hi-sec incursion you'll be creating another faucet problem while unbalancing the risk versus reward again.
On the flip side if you continue to balance for high-sec the low sec/null incursions will just become an annoyance to anybody who happens to be living in that space because no one's going to bother running it because it's not worth the risk.
So I implore you look at redesigning incursions completely, Each security status should have its own group of sites: That way you can balance them independently from each other. For example:
You Could have a set of sites each security status, you set a scout sites, Vanguard sites, assault sites, HQ sites that only Spawn in high sec, & a completely different that only Spawns in low sec, & and a third that only spawns in null sec.
That way you can tailor each set of incursion sites to the needs of the group of that area without unbalancing the other two. I'm not exactly sure on what you should do to balance each particular security status however, I am 100% positive that you're never going to fix it if you just keep using these heavy-handed quick fixes |

Jerick Ludhowe
The Scope Gallente Federation
88
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Posted - 2012.07.06 18:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
This "nerf" to content difficulty is unfounded... Good fleets are clearing these sites in short time frames, bad fleets are not... Can you please not follow suit with the rest of the gaming industry by trivializing content.... Have some balls and stop listing to the whiners who are just pissed that their old ez mode economy breaking isk printing machine was nerfed within reasonable risk vs reward levels... |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
377

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Posted - 2012.07.06 21:13:00 -
[14] - Quote
keeping this on the first page for a while... CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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Pseudo Ucksth
The First One is Always Free Test Alliance Please Ignore
141
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Posted - 2012.07.06 21:37:00 -
[15] - Quote
Thanks Affinity, once the changes are on sisi we'll see what the numbers are, and if they are good enough, perhaps it can breathe some life back into the lowsec incursion community. |

Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Inglorious Waffles Care Factor
101
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Posted - 2012.07.06 21:49:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jerick Ludhowe wrote:This "nerf" to content difficulty is unfounded... Good fleets are clearing these sites in short time frames, bad fleets are not... Can you please not follow suit with the rest of the gaming industry by trivializing content.... Have some balls and stop listing to the whiners who are just pissed that their old ez mode economy breaking isk printing machine was nerfed within reasonable risk vs reward levels... Not a valid argument at all. High end, tight-knit communities running multi-billion ships and oevrmanning the grid can do it fast, true enough, but they can still do the other sites even faster. OTAs are a bottleneck at the moment, well out of proportion with the other two sites. Triple rep Myrms are like what you'd get if you strapped a beehive to Robocop. |

mkint
805
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 00:35:00 -
[17] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote: due late Summer.
???
Does that mean they were changed internally but may not deploy until as late as September? |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
248
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 00:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
Jerick Ludhowe wrote:This "nerf" to content difficulty is unfounded... ..
I don't see how you can say that unless you can't see the Wall of OTAs that populate the Vanguards 6 sometimes 12 hours before downtime. Look at the Journal for F+¦lkvangr's sake: Only 1 Incursion is being run anymore. I have high hopes that this will rejuvenate the hi sec incursions. I'm really hoping too the lo/null sec incursions too will be able to defeat the OTAs I think the current problem currently stems from only super shiney fleets being able do them in a survivable amount of time, and this is mirrored in the fact that they are not being done there because such shiney ships are too much a target(risk) in lo/null. Its is very founded in looking at how all Incursions have withered from being a vibrant growing community it was the very week before Escalation. An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Jack Miton
Bite Me inc Exhale.
368
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 01:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Lyron-Baktos wrote:that should keep everyone happy hopefully!
unlikely considering most people hate HS incursions. just saying...
Out of interest, am i understanding it right that in order to fix OTAs, youre making ALL the sites much easier by reducing the rat EHP??? That doesnt seem to make much sense. |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
377

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Posted - 2012.07.07 01:05:00 -
[20] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:CCP Affinity wrote:Lyron-Baktos wrote:that should keep everyone happy hopefully! unlikely considering most people hate HS incursions. just saying... Out of interest, am i understanding it right that in order to fix OTAs, youre making ALL the sites much easier by reducing the rat EHP??? That doesnt seem to make much sense.
um no.. I'm just reducing the EHP overall for OTA sites CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
377

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Posted - 2012.07.07 01:06:00 -
[21] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Jerick Ludhowe wrote:This "nerf" to content difficulty is unfounded... .. I don't see how you can say that unless you can't see the Wall of OTAs that populate the Vanguards 6 sometimes 12 hours before downtime. Look at the Journal for F+¦lkvangr's sake: Only 1 Incursion is being run anymore. I have high hopes that this will rejuvenate the hi sec incursions. I'm really hoping too the lo/null sec incursions too will be able to defeat the OTAs I think the current problem currently stems from only super shiney fleets being able do them in a survivable amount of time, and this is mirrored in the fact that they are not being done there because such shiney ships are too much a target(risk) in lo/null. Its is very founded in looking at how all Incursions have withered from being a vibrant growing community it was the very week before Escalation.
;) you're welcome CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
377

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Posted - 2012.07.07 01:06:00 -
[22] - Quote
mkint wrote:CCP Affinity wrote: due late Summer. ??? Does that mean they were changed internally but may not deploy until as late as September?
They have to go through a development cycle like everything else - they will come out with our late summer release
CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
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Gilbaron
Free-Space-Ranger Ev0ke
286
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 01:29:00 -
[23] - Quote
mkint wrote:CCP Affinity wrote: due late Summer. ??? Does that mean they were changed internally but may not deploy until as late as September?
half of CCP is on vacation right now |

Asmodes Reynolds
Rayn Enterprises
76
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 03:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
CCP Affinity, why no response to my suggestion is practically the only one you haven't responded to? or is that sort of fixing not in the timeline for this release like last time? |

Bloodpetal
Mimidae Risk Solutions
704
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 04:20:00 -
[25] - Quote
Gilbaron wrote:mkint wrote:CCP Affinity wrote: due late Summer. ??? Does that mean they were changed internally but may not deploy until as late as September? half of CCP is on vacation right now
And by half of CCP you mean 95% of CCP is on vacation.
Mimidae Risk Solutions Recruiting |

Ruareve
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
33
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Posted - 2012.07.07 06:53:00 -
[26] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:CCP Affinity wrote:Lyron-Baktos wrote:that should keep everyone happy hopefully! unlikely considering most people hate HS incursions. just saying... Out of interest, am i understanding it right that in order to fix OTAs, youre making ALL the sites much easier by reducing the rat EHP??? That doesnt seem to make much sense.
I think you should amend your statement to most forum posters hate HS incursions, but when you actually get into the game HS incursions used to be very popular. So popular in fact I used to have a hard time finding a system without a ridiculous amount of competition.
Personally I loved incursions before the nerfs, afterwards I just don't see a reason to go back as the fun and enjoyment just aren't worth the hassle of jumping through hoops. I would have been fine with a reduction to ISK payouts, but changing the basic structure of how the sites performed was a bad idea. Part of the fun of incursions was the challenge, the ability to meet new people not trying to kill me, and to spend a few hours here and there when I didn't have much time to be online.
With the nerf the challenge has changed into frustration and hassle, there aren't that many new people to meet, and the time needed to be successful has all gone up.
I'd rather be bored solo'ing lvl 4's than put up with the travesty that has become incursions. However since missions were so boring after the excitement of incursions what normally happened is I played World of Tanks for a few hours a night instead of logging on to Eve. Yet another blog about Eve- http://ruar-eve.blogspot.com/ |

Kodavor
Mine3
15
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 07:45:00 -
[27] - Quote
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:CCP Affinity, why no response to my suggestion is practically the only one you haven't responded to? or is that sort of fixing not in the timeline for this release like last time?
You are off topic . So try again . |

Jerick Ludhowe
The Scope Gallente Federation
89
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 14:14:00 -
[28] - Quote
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:Jerick Ludhowe wrote:This "nerf" to content difficulty is unfounded... Good fleets are clearing these sites in short time frames, bad fleets are not... Can you please not follow suit with the rest of the gaming industry by trivializing content.... Have some balls and stop listing to the whiners who are just pissed that their old ez mode economy breaking isk printing machine was nerfed within reasonable risk vs reward levels... Not a valid argument at all. High end, tight-knit communities, flying multi-billion isk ships with near-perfect boosters can do it fast, true enough, but they can still do the other sites even faster. OTAs are a bottleneck at the moment, well out of proportion with the other two sites.
Then wtf is the point of incursions if not to test the best comps and ship setups in eve? Seriously, how the hell is my point not a point at all... All you're doing here is whining to make end game content ez mode for the masses...... You want to run the easier ones then run ncos and nmcs, some difficult content needs to be left in each of the incursions systems...
Furthermore, saying that only tight-knit communities are completing these in reasonable time frames is utter bullshit and makes me believe you have no idea what the hell you are talking about... The ships needed do not have to be multi billion, they just need to be setup correctly and obviously this is and should remain intended... Nerfing them to the point where a scrub fleet can complete them in reasonable time frames is NOT the solution. You want ez mode content? Go run lvl 4s for 40m an hr. |

Mina Sebiestar
Mactabilis Simplex Cursus
68
|
Posted - 2012.07.07 15:26:00 -
[29] - Quote
While i don't mind this watering down of VG sites it would be lovely that assaults and up sites gain some reward changes so they are worth doing.
Whole this fus n whine started with isk printing machine and VG sites being most payed sites..and i don't care much rly il roll more chars to play for free,i still think that players that are willing to put more effort,risk more and have an issue with mindless repetitive action should be rewarded better.
And i can hardly believe that moving things in site/removing and or shifting stuff around is more easy that change few digits in payment...call me mathematical r****d. |

Jerick Ludhowe
The Scope Gallente Federation
89
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Posted - 2012.07.07 16:07:00 -
[30] - Quote
Mina Sebiestar wrote:
And i can hardly believe that moving things in site/removing and or shifting stuff around is more easy that change few digits in payment...call me mathematical r****d.
This is absolutely the correct "solution". Instead of making them easier why not just increase payment by a couple mil...
You essentially come to the same end by increasing the isk/hr ratio however you do it w/o trivializing content. Different sites with different difficulties and different payouts is OBVIOUSLY the correct solution. Watering everything down to the point where it's all the same bag of ez mode crap is not.
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Kodavor
Mine3
15
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Posted - 2012.07.07 16:36:00 -
[31] - Quote
Quote:Different sites with different difficulties and different payouts is OBVIOUSLY the correct solution.
Obviously this was the only correct solution . And since this was the only correct solution Mr . Jerick , why did you not make sure that it was made known to CCP and implemented . Now , because you , Jerick Ludhowe , slacked , all of the incursion pilots will have to face the wrong changes which , obviously , are absolutely wrong . |

Elsa Nietchize
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
29
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Posted - 2012.07.08 00:34:00 -
[32] - Quote
i'll be waiting for the fix 4 sites up now and only 1 has any blue in the bar and it's only at 64%.
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Ziranda Hakuli
Relativity Holding Corp
118
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 03:41:00 -
[33] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Lyron-Baktos wrote:that should keep everyone happy hopefully! do a complete roll back to what they were before the nerf. that will keep everyone happy for awhile till the changes are made. lol |

Placibo son Son
souchons corp
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 04:23:00 -
[34] - Quote
I might be wrong but has there ever been a blue bar in low sec? |

Timbo Severasse
Workshop Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 10:16:00 -
[35] - Quote
First of as far as shield tanking (BTL,TVP) is concerned, I cannot weigh in on "where it is at now". As I have only recently came to be part of that community, specifically TVP. In my opinion they're are very knowledgeable and professional. Insuring the safest and most efficient possible site you could hope for in today's New Eden. As close to a HQ blitz fleet you can come WITHOUT being fit specific.
In regards to the way they treat they're pilots, sometimes less is more. The necessity to keep discipline on coms at times is a god send. You must be able to deliver commands quickly and efficiently to your fleet and the logis must be given priority. Lets face it, the random chatter on TS is at times obnoxious and the STFU attitude is welcome. Of course this is just personal prospective.
The ridiculing of FCs is not helpful at all. If you have a better way to do things, step the **** up! If not sit down and make isk the way your told. I can guarantee being an FC myself that the particular way we do things is not unfounded. Meaning we tell you to shoot the niarja first cause we know its potential, what is does where it goes. This is also true with all the other ships on the field. At one point we all said "why is the niarja always first?" if you say different your lying. Experience has in this instance taught us the proper way to do things. As with anything in the world(yes, i do know this is a video game). Learn from what we have to teach and build upon it so you may become a better FC than us.
This game always seems to have a high turnover rate for pilots. The incursion community will educate new pilots on the principles of fitting, and intermediate fleet operations. Allowing one day themselves to take the reins on the respective groups. THIS IS CRUCIAL!
As stated before a lot of pilots use shiner fits post nerf. The thought behind this is surely not anything "necessary" (moar EHP)it is simply because it improves the completion time. Even n00bs should hands down be able to acceptably fit a T1 BS/BC with meta 4 mods. Able to meet the most picky FC's requirements for EHP, resists, and DPS. If not than the pilots need to be politely pointed in the correct direction. At least this should be the attitude of FC's who wish to see our community restored to what it once was.
With regard to the armor side of things. Blitzing VG's seemed to be a staple of the armor community. Its' all I could get into anywere I went(TDF,BAM,Vindis Only Blitz) was 10 man, 2bs 6t3 2oni blitz fleets. Which at the time was cool =} .
The problem came when you took this ability away from the pilots who choose to do this as an acceptable isk/hour occupation. Being an avid TDF member from the get, I can truthfully say that 50-75% of our community was GONE within a week of the patch. Those staying were optimistic that remaining players would be the "die-hard" players we want running in our fleets. Although the is truth to that sentiment, the renaming were few and far between. After the aforementioned abuse at the hands of CCP =] . Most chose to peruse different careers or change teams in a manner of speaking.
The armor community is on the upswing. In no small part in this pilots opinion to the Born-Ara Mob. This exclusive sect of TDF FCs has always been willing to invite novice pilots who may need some work with their incursioning. New pilots are given a place to grow, learning the ropes of VGs and Assults. If they choose, learning to become FCs themselves.
The negative outlook on the armor community as a whole by other pilots is outrageous. The FCs in TDF and BAM are just as experienced and willing to start fleets as the shield FCs. The problem is the lack of able body's. Personally id like to be able to run armor tanked HQ fleets 24/7 the way TVP is able. The numbers just aren't there, the current dedicated FCs are having trouble keeping Assault fleets running much longer than a few hours. TDF as a whole community needs to get off its ass and motivate pilots new and old to get involved.
However a middle ground seems to be achieved between shield and armor pilots. Working together to keep the influence down is an amazing idea. Shield fleets run their HQs and take big bites out of the bar, armor runs their VGs helping keep it up along the way. It is a balance, symbiont if you will. One day going head to head, contesting MOMs on occasion will be a reality once more. Until then it is in the best interest of all to work together as a community.
As shields, armor, TVP, TDF, or however else you can divide us. We must all come together to build OUR community to what it once was. By showing willing pilots the ropes in our corner of the universe, and by asserting the fact that we are not the bottom feeders of New Eden we are made out to be. After all, at least were not goons. =] |

Swidgen
Republic University Minmatar Republic
9
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Posted - 2012.07.08 10:43:00 -
[36] - Quote
Thanks for the update.
In the last year and a half we've gotten these expansions:
- Incursion - virtually 100% rolled back at present
- Incarna - essentially zero gameplay features
- Crucible - lots of little fixes much appreciated
- Inferno - drone alloy nerf, mission loot nerf... not much else
Well look at that! :18months:
The Flying In Space features in Crucible were most welcome, no doubt about that. But aside from that, we really haven't gotten too much in the last couple of years. CCP seems to have a lot of "long term plans" for stuff. Incursions, Ring Mining, POS revamp, nullsec improvements, Crimewatch system, sov mechanics, Technetium rebalance, supercap rebalance. etc. ad infinitum. I really hope you guys hire some more devs and get cracking on that backlog. NONE of those things require huge new expansions of content, just a lot of thought, re-design and implementation. Team Big Things had better make an appearance soon because the snail's pace of development is putting a lot of us to sleep. You honestly can't afford another :18months: fiasco at this point. |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
249
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 10:43:00 -
[37] - Quote
Placibo son Son wrote:I might be wrong but has there ever been a blue bar in low sec?
Yes all the time. I remeber early to mid last year when the first Revenant BPC finally was dropped & Villy was crowing about it in fleets after so many time other crappy BPCs had flushed out of the lo sec space turd  Lo sec Incursions before the nerf nearly always had partial blue bars right up until Escalation. I think after Escalation the furthest I saw the blue bar drop was to ~75% in my Journal in the MOST northeastern top of Intrepid crossing in null A week ago I did see& goto a lo sec incursion in lo that dropped to ~95% red but from what I saw the Wall of OTAs prevented its further dropping. Didn't join the fleets there due to not knowing them but they said it was pretty quiet. An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Jerick Ludhowe
The Scope Gallente Federation
91
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 20:50:00 -
[38] - Quote
Kodavor wrote:Quote:Different sites with different difficulties and different payouts is OBVIOUSLY the correct solution. Obviously this was the only correct solution . And since this was the only correct solution Mr . Jerick , why did you not make sure that it was made known to CCP and implemented . Now , because you , Jerick Ludhowe , slacked , all of the incursion pilots will have to face the wrong changes which , obviously , are absolutely wrong .
I can't always be around to hold developer's hands Glad we agree on the rest tho
|

Apolyon I
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
91
|
Posted - 2012.07.08 22:09:00 -
[39] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Placibo son Son wrote:I might be wrong but has there ever been a blue bar in low sec? Yes all the time. I remeber early to mid last year when the first Revenant BPC finally was dropped & Villy was crowing about it in fleets after so many time other crappy BPCs had flushed out of the lo sec space turd  Lo sec Incursions before the nerf nearly always had partial blue bars right up until Escalation. I think after Escalation the furthest I saw the blue bar drop was to ~75% in my Journal in the MOST northeastern top of Intrepid crossing in null A week ago I did see& goto a lo sec incursion in lo that dropped to ~95% red but from what I saw the Wall of OTAs prevented its further dropping. Didn't join the fleets there due to not knowing them but they said it was pretty quiet. why are you still here??
I thought you already unsub?? |

Lumi Leena
EVE University Ivy League
5
|
Posted - 2012.07.09 04:50:00 -
[40] - Quote
Jerick Ludhowe wrote:You want to run the easier ones then run ncos and nmcs, some difficult content needs to be left in each of the incursions systems... The problem is that people show up right after downtime, do all the NCOs and NMCs, and by the time everyone else arrives there are only OTAs left to do, because nobody wants to do them. They're a lot more difficult than the other sites and have *smaller* reward due to taking longer to do but paying the same. |
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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
249
|
Posted - 2012.07.09 08:29:00 -
[41] - Quote
Lumi Leena wrote:Jerick Ludhowe wrote:You want to run the easier ones then run ncos and nmcs, some difficult content needs to be left in each of the incursions systems... The problem is that people show up right after downtime, do all the NCOs and NMCs, and by the time everyone else arrives there are only OTAs left to do, because nobody wants to do them. They're a lot more difficult than the other sites and have *smaller* reward due to taking longer to do but paying the same.
A quick 'fix' should be to at least double the payouts of OTAs no long development cycle should be necessary for that ( the Kundalini Manifest pays differently in HQ systems )... Dynamic payouts with certain sites that are so unbalanced would be a good carrot & stick that could be reviewed every few months easily. The NCN's also suffer still from how they take such longer times to form fleets! I'd like to see the old more dificult NCN ( post logi allowed on both sides of course ) if it too paid double or 1.5X I bet I could get those fleets running with the hardcore Incursion runners in arnour & entice the VG runners too into the more sociable, larger fleets. Sort of makes sense in a roleplaying view too since Concord should start throwing money again because these sites now are bringing Sansha closer to total victory in lo/NULL Sec & crushing most systems in HI
So looking back I have to agree with much of what was said here ( although I doubt there is any single solution I think that there are many possible ):
Jerick Ludhowe wrote:Mina Sebiestar wrote:
And i can hardly believe that moving things in site/removing and or shifting stuff around is more easy that change few digits in payment...call me mathematical r****d.
This is absolutely the correct "solution". Instead of making them easier why not just increase payment by a couple mil... You essentially come to the same end by increasing the isk/hr ratio however you do it w/o trivializing content. Different sites with different difficulties and different payouts is OBVIOUSLY the correct solution. Watering everything down to the point where it's all the same bag of ez mode crap is not.
Funny how the development cycle appears to have been thrown out the window for the Inferno changes ( 2 weeks ago there was 1 patch a day for the entire work week!!!) but is strictly followed for the Escalation changes. I think that the 'development cycle' may have to be sped up again when the mineral stockpiles are depleted due to the Drone Escalation nerf & CCP Soundwave may be forced to introduce the new line of mining ships' changes ahead of schedule. An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Herr Ronin
Angels of Valour The Retirement Club
81
|
Posted - 2012.07.09 17:40:00 -
[42] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Today Team Five 0 made some changes to OTA sites, due late Summer. They are as follows:
1. Move the tower closer to the entrance 2. Remove the Maras 3. Reduce the effective hit points - including a significant Niarja and Tama reduction
We are aware that the OTA sites are causing a lot of problems at the moment, and while we still have long-term plans for Incursions, we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes. I will update this thread when the changes hit SISI.
- Affinity
I tell you! These cheeky Irish Dev's changing things :P
Looking forward to it. \o/ | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

Herr Ronin
Angels of Valour The Retirement Club
81
|
Posted - 2012.07.09 17:42:00 -
[43] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Lumi Leena wrote:Jerick Ludhowe wrote:You want to run the easier ones then run ncos and nmcs, some difficult content needs to be left in each of the incursions systems... The problem is that people show up right after downtime, do all the NCOs and NMCs, and by the time everyone else arrives there are only OTAs left to do, because nobody wants to do them. They're a lot more difficult than the other sites and have *smaller* reward due to taking longer to do but paying the same. A quick 'fix' should be to at least double the payouts of OTAs no long development cycle should be necessary for that ( the Kundalini Manifest pays differently in HQ systems )... Dynamic payouts with certain sites that are so unbalanced would be a good carrot & stick that could be reviewed every few months easily. The NCN's also suffer still from how they take such longer times to form fleets! I'd like to see the old more dificult NCN ( post logi allowed on both sides of course ) if it too paid double or 1.5X I bet I could get those fleets running with the hardcore Incursion runners in arnour & entice the VG runners too into the more sociable, larger fleets. Sort of makes sense in a roleplaying view too since Concord should start throwing money again because these sites now are bringing Sansha closer to total victory in lo/NULL Sec & crushing most systems in HI So looking back I have to agree with much of what was said here ( although I doubt there is any single solution I think that there are many possible ): Jerick Ludhowe wrote:Mina Sebiestar wrote:
And i can hardly believe that moving things in site/removing and or shifting stuff around is more easy that change few digits in payment...call me mathematical r****d.
This is absolutely the correct "solution". Instead of making them easier why not just increase payment by a couple mil... You essentially come to the same end by increasing the isk/hr ratio however you do it w/o trivializing content. Different sites with different difficulties and different payouts is OBVIOUSLY the correct solution. Watering everything down to the point where it's all the same bag of ez mode crap is not. Funny how the development cycle appears to have been thrown out the window for the Inferno changes ( 2 weeks ago there was 1 patch a day for the entire work week!!!) but is strictly followed for the Escalation changes. I think that the 'development cycle' may have to be sped up again when the mineral stockpiles are depleted due to the Drone Escalation nerf & CCP Soundwave may be forced to introduce the new line of mining ships' changes ahead of schedule.
Did anyone else just glance at this post and go, Well.. F*ck am i reading that...
I thought you left the game, Did you go to WOW, i heard the IQ went up a little bit. | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

Keith Planck
Ashton Technologies Ignore This.
347
|
Posted - 2012.07.09 21:45:00 -
[44] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Today Team Five 0 made some changes to OTA sites, due late Summer. They are as follows:
1. Move the tower closer to the entrance 2. Remove the Maras 3. Reduce the effective hit points - including a significant Niarja and Tama reduction
We are aware that the OTA sites are causing a lot of problems at the moment, and while we still have long-term plans for Incursions, we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes. I will update this thread when the changes hit SISI.
- Affinity
\o/ Our voices have been heard! |

KanashiiKami
104
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 02:11:00 -
[45] - Quote
incursions used to be interesting...
then i find mining to be more interesting... (after incursions got nerfed)... in 2 hrs i fill up my orca that actually makes more ISK than Q-ing for fleets ... WOW !!!
i have a feeling that CCP will not be rebalancing the incursions to the point that it becomes a smiley corner of the game, for that matter, why has TEC moons become a ISK printing machine and making some players smile??? bad rebalancing.
anyway, since the rebalance is only on OTAs, i do not bear much hope for ... what CCP is about to do in overall.
what CCP has been trying to do is ... in fact ... rebalance the way we make ISK ... so that holders of TEC moons get free plexs ... but the rest can hit the wall and die on boring content. seriously, rebalancing is not = making existing content MORE interesting, because the current content has become boring already.
the only thing that made a variable in interesting incursion content was to be able to fleet up with space friends and have a good time and still earn isk together ... that now is not longer an enjoyment as you pull your hair out either waiting for fleets, or get trashed in chat Q because they whine that you are not leet enough to join the incursion fleets, etc ... which is hilarious. how on earth will even new pilots get the fun? logi pilots are going to lose their hair on the head and the pxxxc hair all together.
CCP, as much as there will always be people that are unhappy and hence whine, there will also be real players who play and really feel that there is not much fun left in the game, so please do something about it.
no beer for you CCP ! WUT ??? |

KanashiiKami
104
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 02:44:00 -
[46] - Quote
so in a fleet ...
everyone fleets up (time used = x)
everyone enters with certainty that risk is involved (risk factor = y)
everyone knows it takes time to complete a site (time used = z)
x,y and z is trying to balance with : payout and great company (served up at the end =enjoyment factor)
so where does the rebalancing of just an OTA EHP fit in? is tipping just the OTA EHP scales going to result in great increase in enjoyment factor in incursions? WUT ??? |

Kamden Line
Sovereign Citizen and other Tax Evasion Schemes
20
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 05:00:00 -
[47] - Quote
I'm amazed there is no trolling by nulsec Santum runners.
Delve must be pretty busy to keep them all in CAOD . |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
249
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 10:22:00 -
[48] - Quote
WOW OTAs are a tedious mess. I helped in clearing a few out again in GALL space as the Vanguards became a 100% WALL OF OTAs again ( 25 otaS IN the constellation )around 8 hours before downtime. My god it was so ******* tedious. It is just no fun anymore. CONGRATs on sucking the fun out of the game DEVs. After 3-4 OTAs the fleet collapsed on itself leaving a few non OTAs for others to do but there was no one else left in the community to do it. The HQ community is still alive but how much longer can they without the Vanguards to recruit from?
lol: Pretty soon with numbers dwindling you're going to see a white flag spring up in NULL asking for CCP to stop spawning Incursions in NULL because Sansha HAS WON IN NULL! There has not been an INCURSION KILLED IN NULL OR LO SEC SINCE THE NERF!!! SANSHA WON  An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Felicity Barrington
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 12:11:00 -
[49] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:WOW OTAs are a tedious mess. I helped in clearing a few out again in GALL space as the Vanguards became a 100% WALL OF OTAs again ( 25 otaS IN the constellation  )around 8 hours before downtime. My god it was so ******* tedious. It is just no fun anymore. CONGRATs on sucking the fun out of the game DEVs. After 3-4 OTAs the fleet collapsed on itself leaving a few non OTAs for others to do but there was no one else left in the community to do it. The HQ community is still alive but how much longer can they without the Vanguards to recruit from? lol: Pretty soon with numbers dwindling you're going to see a white flag spring up in NULL asking for CCP to stop spawning Incursions in NULL because Sansha HAS WON IN NULL! There has not been an INCURSION KILLED IN NULL OR LO SEC SINCE THE NERF!!! SANSHA WON 
Fleets get through HS OTA's just fine, infact, I prefer OTA's to NCO's. If you are setup for OTA's, you can get through them quite quickly and do around 9 an hour, a little less if you don't use a dedicated hacker.
Remember, to be optimal in vanguards after the "knee-jerk" nerf: No shiney, no likey.
If you cannot be shiney, go and join TVP in HQ's, they are quite fun. :) |

Seleucus Ontuas
The Partisan Brigade Republic Alliance
7
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 13:57:00 -
[50] - Quote
The main thing I want to know is when these changes are hitting SISI. |
|

Miss Yanumano
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
39
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 16:27:00 -
[51] - Quote
Good thing CCP are still looking at Incursions! However, I've got a question!
How many low/null Incursion mothership sites have been successfully completed since the latest Incursion changes? |

Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings
261
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 16:58:00 -
[52] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:WOW OTAs are a tedious mess. I helped in clearing a few out again in GALL space as the Vanguards became a 100% WALL OF OTAs again ( 25 otaS IN the constellation  )around 8 hours before downtime. My god it was so ******* tedious. It is just no fun anymore. CONGRATs on sucking the fun out of the game DEVs. After 3-4 OTAs the fleet collapsed on itself leaving a few non OTAs for others to do but there was no one else left in the community to do it. The HQ community is still alive but how much longer can they without the Vanguards to recruit from? lol: Pretty soon with numbers dwindling you're going to see a white flag spring up in NULL asking for CCP to stop spawning Incursions in NULL because Sansha HAS WON IN NULL! There has not been an INCURSION KILLED IN NULL OR LO SEC SINCE THE NERF!!! SANSHA WON 
Sounds like an unsub vacation is overdue again. |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
249
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 18:36:00 -
[53] - Quote
Miss Yanumano wrote:Good thing CCP are still looking at Incursions! However, I've got a question!
How many low/null Incursion mothership sites have been successfully completed since the latest Incursion changes?
Zero ( 0 ), none, nada An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Ana'Gia
Pink Bunny Club
1
|
Posted - 2012.07.10 19:34:00 -
[54] - Quote
Sounds good to me.
So VGs will be fixed again. Hope you will take a look at Assaults and HQs after that.
Enjoy your summer vacations CCP. |

Kodavor
Mine3
18
|
Posted - 2012.07.12 09:43:00 -
[55] - Quote
When will the changes be up on SiSi ? |

ChemicalQueen
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
5
|
Posted - 2012.07.12 14:36:00 -
[56] - Quote
Miss Yanumano wrote:Good thing CCP are still looking at Incursions! However, I've got a question!
How many low/null Incursion mothership sites have been successfully completed since the latest Incursion changes?
None. CFC Stopped doing Incursions after the big patch due to other activities paying more isk/hr. It took a lot of organization to do low/null incursions, and it just wasn't worth it anymore. |

Pink Marshmellow
Caucasian Culture Club Transmission Lost
38
|
Posted - 2012.07.14 09:38:00 -
[57] - Quote
Speaking of incursions, does anyone bother flying that space turd with the head of a fly known as the revenant?
|

Herr Ronin
Angels of Valour The Retirement Club
207
|
Posted - 2012.07.14 13:04:00 -
[58] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Today Team Five 0 made some changes to OTA sites, due late Summer. They are as follows:
1. Move the tower closer to the entrance 2. Remove the Maras 3. Reduce the effective hit points - including a significant Niarja and Tama reduction
We are aware that the OTA sites are causing a lot of problems at the moment, and while we still have long-term plans for Incursions, we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes. I will update this thread when the changes hit SISI.
- Affinity
Make Command Ships to be able to enter a Cruiser Side of the NCN
Would make a nice change. | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
251
|
Posted - 2012.07.14 15:14:00 -
[59] - Quote
Pink Marshmellow wrote:Speaking of incursions, does anyone bother flying that space turd with the head of a fly known as the revenant?
CCP_Diagoras wrote: 29 May Tweet: Supercarriers: 3,463. 2,049 Nyx, 826 Aeon, 414 Wyvern, 172 Hel, 2 Revenant. So, 4,405 characters with a supercap as their active ship atm.
So a month & half ago there were 2 player pilotable space turds... dunno if any got flushed but bet if one was we'd heard about it! An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Jakerien Pahaydan
SILVER HAWK SECURITY
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.15 09:34:00 -
[60] - Quote
Hi, "we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes". The recent rollback was insignificant IMO, too little and already too late. Does CCP think the end of summer is not waiting? Your patient is beyond critical condition. Go ahead and wait to start CPR in late summer. Vanguards will be long dead and buried by then.  |
|

Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
251
|
Posted - 2012.07.15 14:02:00 -
[61] - Quote
Jakerien Pahaydan wrote:Hi, "we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes". The recent rollback was insignificant IMO, too little and already too late. Does CCP think the end of summer is not waiting? Your patient is beyond critical condition. Go ahead and wait to start CPR in late summer. Vanguards will be long dead and buried by then.  i hereby predict that incursion traffic will be at least 50% of what it was before the nerf on the same day the ota changes are patched onto tranquillity.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
255
|
Posted - 2012.07.16 07:50:00 -
[62] - Quote
Daniel Plain wrote:Jakerien Pahaydan wrote:Hi, "we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes". The recent rollback was insignificant IMO, too little and already too late. Does CCP think the end of summer is not waiting? Your patient is beyond critical condition. Go ahead and wait to start CPR in late summer. Vanguards will be long dead and buried by then.  i hereby predict that incursion traffic will be at least 50% of what it was before the nerf on the same day the ota changes are patched onto tranquillity.
I doubt your prediction will be provable anytime soon. Dr E seems to be the only one at CPP that would give out the stats if anything is going wrong and he rarely speaks. The last fanfest he proclaimed that Incursions were an unprecented success. He was even owning up to the Incarna release being unsuccessful at fanfest. I'm cursious what he'll say about the stats post Escalation and Inferno. Usually CCP Diagoras can be counted on to give some game stats but he has been silent ( silenced? ) ever since his return from vacation. An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Herr Ronin
Angels of Valour The Retirement Club
208
|
Posted - 2012.07.16 12:56:00 -
[63] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Daniel Plain wrote:Jakerien Pahaydan wrote:Hi, "we didn't want to make you wait for the OTA changes". The recent rollback was insignificant IMO, too little and already too late. Does CCP think the end of summer is not waiting? Your patient is beyond critical condition. Go ahead and wait to start CPR in late summer. Vanguards will be long dead and buried by then.  i hereby predict that incursion traffic will be at least 50% of what it was before the nerf on the same day the ota changes are patched onto tranquillity. I doubt your prediction will be provable anytime soon. Dr E seems to be the only one at CPP that would give out the stats if anything is going wrong and he rarely speaks. The last fanfest he proclaimed that Incursions were an unprecented success. He was even owning up to the Incarna release being unsuccessful at fanfest. I'm curious what he'll say about the stats post Escalation and Inferno. Usually CCP Diagoras can be counted on to give some game stats but he has been silent ( silenced? ) ever since his return from vacation.
Ok dude, We get the point, It happened in May, CCP are only Humans, Regarding how Incursions have lost interest is due to the fact that CCP brought them into the game to bring People and community's to play as one, They were not aware of the amount of ISK that could be made by someone who is dual-boxing.
Give CCP some credit, They got to look at your pathetic posts which are just a grind to read, They are aware of the error and are currently fixing it, So please stop being a scrub.
You are so focused on "Predictions" and statistics, How about the Facts, Are you aware you can still earn 80 mill per hour, If you are crying then GTFO out of BTL and TVP and join a community like ISN.
What i find hilarious is ISN - Incursion Shiny Network are the only community which are not crying, Yes its a bit **** but 100 mill a hour, is still good. I think you need to take a step back and learn how to Adapt, For you have failed and resorted to posting complete bollocks on the forums.
Love you forever ~ H.R | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
255
|
Posted - 2012.07.16 20:41:00 -
[64] - Quote
Herr Ronin wrote:Meow :Edited:
Ok dude, We get the point, It happened in May, CCP are only Humans, (snip)
You are so focused on "Predictions" and statistics, How about the Facts, Are you aware you can still earn 80 mill per hour, If you are crying then GTFO out of BTL and TVP and join a community like ISN.
What i find hilarious is ISN - Incursion Shiny Network are the only community which are not crying,
-Happened last April not May -By definition statistics are numeric facts -HQ's were less touched by the change then the other systems. I bet if CCP touched your part of the doll in the same manner you'd be crying too.
In other news: Damn looks like the Ewoks NULL sec Incursion died without them doing the MOM site: 2012.07.16 13:14:26Incursion expired00LP pool lost
I think they got the influence all the way down to ~20% closest since April 22 I've seen a Null/lo constellation get to spotting the mother ship. Last night before DT it was a Wall of OTAs
An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Herr Ronin
Angels of Valour The Retirement Club
208
|
Posted - 2012.07.17 00:49:00 -
[65] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Herr Ronin wrote:Meow :Edited:
Ok dude, We get the point, It happened in May, CCP are only Humans, (snip)
You are so focused on "Predictions" and statistics, How about the Facts, Are you aware you can still earn 80 mill per hour, If you are crying then GTFO out of BTL and TVP and join a community like ISN. (snip)
What i find hilarious is ISN - Incursion Shiny Network are the only community which are not crying,
-Happened last April not May -By definition statistics are numeric facts -HQ's were less touched by the change then the other systems. I bet if CCP touched your part of the doll in the same manner you'd be crying too. In other news: Damn looks like the Ewoks NULL sec Incursion died without them doing the MOM site: 2012.07.16 13:14:26Incursion expired00LP pool lost I think they got the influence all the way down to ~20% closest since April 22 I've seen a Null/lo constellation get to spotting the mother ship. Last night before DT it was a Wall of OTAs FYI Ronin you forgot to bump page 13 of your ISN thread with its wall of text ad to grind through while reading 
Thank you for taking the time in reading our Thread.
Regards | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

Jena Jamson
Classic Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 18:43:00 -
[66] - Quote
vgs were fine before the whole nerf thing. sure you make lots of isk, but only if you have a good fleet composition with good skills. and if there were more than 1 good fleet in a system, they will compete and only the best fleet will get the isk. pub fleets dont stand a chance, they dont make as much. i suggest ccp stop listening to jealous null sec players. btl pub is like a ghost town now, thanks to the nerf. community destroyed, well done well done ccp... |

Herr Ronin
Kenyte Capital High Sec Dropouts
209
|
Posted - 2012.07.19 21:20:00 -
[67] - Quote
Jena Jamson wrote:vgs were fine before the whole nerf thing. sure you make lots of isk, but only if you have a good fleet composition with good skills. and if there were more than 1 good fleet in a system, they will compete and only the best fleet will get the isk. pub fleets dont stand a chance, they dont make as much. i suggest ccp stop listening to jealous null sec players. btl pub is like a ghost town now, thanks to the nerf. community destroyed, well done well done ccp...
Yes a lot of community's have died, For they lack the ability to Adapt to the patch, It isn't CCP's fault they lack the brain power to work out how to do sites faster or get a better fleet comp. | Management Of ISN | Skype: Herr-Ronin | Twitter: @Herr_Ronin |
|

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
259
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 05:23:00 -
[68] - Quote
Herr Ronin wrote:Jena Jamson wrote:vgs were fine before the whole nerf thing. sure you make lots of isk, but only if you have a good fleet composition with good skills. and if there were more than 1 good fleet in a system, they will compete and only the best fleet will get the isk. pub fleets dont stand a chance, they dont make as much. i suggest ccp stop listening to jealous null sec players. btl pub is like a ghost town now, thanks to the nerf. community destroyed, well done well done ccp... Yes a lot of community's have died, For they lack the ability to Adapt to the patch, It isn't CCP's fault they lack the brain power to work out how to do sites faster or get a better fleet comp.
I'm sorry but the UTTER collapse of the null/lo sec incursions being run ( not a single null/lo sec MOM site has been run/finished since the Escalation NERF last April 24th) is an indicator that CCP fell asleep at the wheel with the monitoring/QA of Incursions Ronin and should have been addressed ALOT sooner. An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Nestara Aldent
Citimatics
73
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 08:10:00 -
[69] - Quote
Herr Ronin wrote:Jena Jamson wrote:vgs were fine before the whole nerf thing. sure you make lots of isk, but only if you have a good fleet composition with good skills. and if there were more than 1 good fleet in a system, they will compete and only the best fleet will get the isk. pub fleets dont stand a chance, they dont make as much. i suggest ccp stop listening to jealous null sec players. btl pub is like a ghost town now, thanks to the nerf. community destroyed, well done well done ccp... Yes a lot of community's have died, For they lack the ability to Adapt to the patch, It isn't CCP's fault they lack the brain power to work out how to do sites faster or get a better fleet comp.
|

Kodavor
Mine3
20
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 08:48:00 -
[70] - Quote
Nestara Aldent wrote:Forum ate my post!
@Herr Ronin
Tailoring the content for both pirate BS with T2 guns and low skill T1 BS and BC is impossible. If the ISK for bad fleet is decent, ISK for great one will be probably to high, and if the site is safe for bad fleet, really good one will have it on ez-mode. OTAs are completely safe in a good fleet even now, but its the lesser fleets that can have a hard time.
In WoW we have that as player can be inspected for gear and spec so we can really know what a player is bringing to the raid. Also, there is raid tier system, entry level raids arent the same as the top raids available. There are hard modes of raids too, which give much better rewards.
Much of this can be implemented in Eve (if permission is given FC could have access to your ship fitting window, skills, and relevant weapon and defense stats), hard modes could exist as separate systems in incursion with hard mode raids and even raid tier system could be implemented (by having different active incursions in different tiers), but I digress from the topic.
No . |
|

Nestara Aldent
Citimatics
73
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 09:10:00 -
[71] - Quote
What exactly do you mean? You realize its impossible to balance the content fro both 1b ships and those T1 BS and BC, and that newbies that cant buy a Machariel/NM/Vindi rightfully expect to be able to raid too? And that is essentially problem with OTAs and that was the problem with old VGs too (in the beginning before blitzing Drakes Canes and Harbies were used, and ISK/hr wasnt so imbalanced).
|

Felicity Barrington
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 09:52:00 -
[72] - Quote
Nestara Aldent wrote:What exactly do you mean? You realize its impossible to balance the content fro both 1b ships and those T1 BS and BC, and that newbies that cant buy a Machariel/NM/Vindi rightfully expect to be able to raid too? And that is essentially problem with OTAs and that was the problem with old VGs too (in the beginning before blitzing Drakes Canes and Harbies were used, and ISK/hr wasnt so imbalanced).
Maelstrom, T2 guns (Meta if not) will get you into good fleets. |

Nestara Aldent
Citimatics
73
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 10:00:00 -
[73] - Quote
Felicity Barrington wrote:Nestara Aldent wrote:What exactly do you mean? You realize its impossible to balance the content fro both 1b ships and those T1 BS and BC, and that newbies that cant buy a Machariel/NM/Vindi rightfully expect to be able to raid too? And that is essentially problem with OTAs and that was the problem with old VGs too (in the beginning before blitzing Drakes Canes and Harbies were used, and ISK/hr wasnt so imbalanced). Maelstrom, T2 guns (Meta if not) will get you into good fleets.
Well not good enough by my standards. Its a difference betwen 100M ISK/hr in VGs (6 minutes OTA with warp-in warp out, so its 6m between wallet blinks in journal, NMC/NCO take less) and running HQs for 1 site each 40-45m because ppl need to afk/bio/fit AB/whatever.
|

Felicity Barrington
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 10:20:00 -
[74] - Quote
Nestara Aldent wrote:Felicity Barrington wrote:Nestara Aldent wrote:What exactly do you mean? You realize its impossible to balance the content fro both 1b ships and those T1 BS and BC, and that newbies that cant buy a Machariel/NM/Vindi rightfully expect to be able to raid too? And that is essentially problem with OTAs and that was the problem with old VGs too (in the beginning before blitzing Drakes Canes and Harbies were used, and ISK/hr wasnt so imbalanced). Maelstrom, T2 guns (Meta if not) will get you into good fleets. Well not good enough by my standards. Its a difference betwen 100M ISK/hr in VGs (6 minutes OTA with warp-in warp out, so its 6m between wallet blinks in journal, NMC/NCO take less) and running HQs for 1 site each 40-45m because ppl need to afk/bio/fit AB/whatever.
I know of a shiney group which will let one Maelstrom in with T2's and it doesn't affect the 6m OTA's. They have helped many people get isk for pirate and faction goodies.
If CCP really wanted to stop certain ship types, they could do it via the gate, they do in missions, they can do it in incursions. |

Aratani
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
5
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 21:27:00 -
[75] - Quote
Herr Ronin wrote: Yes a lot of community's have died, For they lack the ability to Adapt to the patch, It isn't CCP's fault they lack the brain power to work out how to do sites faster or get a better fleet comp.
If your view of "adapting to the patch" is everyone suddenly receiving 5-10 million more skillpoints to be able to fly with the standards ISN does, you really seem to need a reality check on the game's training times.
Most of your replies make this same moot point of "adapting" which seems to be "Get into pirate faction ships with t2 guns and everything's fine and dandy, you only make 20% less of what you did pre-patch in average ships".
The problem is right now even with the OTA fixes coming in, there's way too much EHP on field in all of the vanguard sites to be completed in realistically profitable timeframes for the low-average skilled pilots to make much more than solo level 4's do, which is simply a ******** situation considering the effort group gameplay requires over solo-content, high-sec or not. Either the EHP, spawn triggers or site rewards need to be changed or tuned up for incursions to become meaningful content instead of the ghost towns the systems are now. |

Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
105
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 22:32:00 -
[76] - Quote
Hey there, stop a little moment.
I'm fairly a new character (this is an alt) with +/- 30 mil skill points on 1, +/- 25 mil on second char. Made my way (on both accounts) mining, missioning, Worm Holes, PI, exploring, hauling, trading............ and after this "searching my way" into eve after 1 1/2 YEAR i'm finally getting into Incursions. Logistic ships ain't so hard to train for and also needed in those fleets. While using those I make ISK and have time to train for the shiny faction BS'ses. Maybe we better ask CCP for Incursion site's that can be done with 5/7 BC's between Scout and Vanguard site's. Scout site, can be done with many ships playing alone, reward 50.000isk/50 LP (5 players max) Next level: Vanguards, can be done with 6? 7? 8? but sure with 10 - 12 players, reward somewhere 12 +í 8 mil isk/ +1000LP. Assoults as next group, 17? 18? but sure with 19 players, reward 18+á20 mil/ LP accordingly. HQ, only did 1, yes "That One", xx players xxx reward in ISK/LP.
So, I think about it this way: Scout sites, ok the way it is now. New kinda sites, restricted to cruiser size ships max 8, reward 3-5 mil isk/ LP accordingly. Vanguards, restricted to BC sized ships and BS T1 (not faction), al sort of VG site more equal qua difficulty, reward a little lowered. Assaults as is now, HQ too..................
Just my 2 cents, All can play Incursion then............... Learn and adapt..
But most of all: Have fun! |

Nestara Aldent
Citimatics
73
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 23:16:00 -
[77] - Quote
Hey you cant run incursions without cruisers to take care of the frigates. By the way balancing in Eve dont work by the ship size at all, and proposing it dont make sense, just look how T2/T3 and some faction ships compare to bigger T1 ships. |

Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
105
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 23:17:00 -
[78] - Quote
Nestara Aldent wrote:Hey you cant run incursions without cruisers to take care of the frigates. By the way balancing in Eve dont work by the ship size at all, and proposing it dont make sense, just look how T2/T3 and some faction ships compare to bigger T1 ships. And where is ur proposal that makes sense? |

goldiiee
Superior Ratio High Sec Dropouts
5
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 01:28:00 -
[79] - Quote
Ok so does this really make sense to anyone?
I keep hearing the constant complaint that GÇÿOTAGÇÖs are too hardGÇÖ and that the communities that do run them are GÇÖElitists that donGÇÖt let anyone in their fleetGÇÖ If these two item are true then
How are they running them? And, how did they form a fleet if they donGÇÖt let anyone in?
First lets go with how. It is done with a focused specialized fleet with the proper balance of range, firepower, and logistics. These types of fleets can be found throughout Eve often in Wormholes doing sleeper sites, In low-sec and Nul-sec doing complexes and other sites, even in high sec doing Lvl4 missions. Always with an FC or player that knows exactly what he is going to run into, and how he is going to deal with it. These ideas are not new they are called foresight, and planning. If you canGÇÖt bring a ship and Toon with the proper skills and fittings to any of these aforementioned sites you get to warp out in a Pod and try again after you replace your badly fitted ship, or get some more time done in your training.
Where do they get the fleet members for these fleets? Simple they are all over the place, often times looking for a group they can trust, more importantly an FC they can trust to require all the other members of the fleet be their equal in skills, skills like GÇÿBattleship -5GÇÖ, GÇÿlarge artillery specialization 5GÇÖ, and GÇÿLogistics 5GÇÖ pilots with the perseverance to train these skills, not deviate for the GÇÿWhim of the day skill QueGÇÖ many players choose to adopt.
The average lvl4 mission runner knows if he can successfully tank GÇÿWorld CollideGÇÖ if not he brings friends, or asks for help from someone that can do it. Most just decline it and go back to lvl3 missions till his skills and ship can handle it. This is an example of the foresight and planning we spoke of earlier. Yet for some reason GÇÿscrubGÇÖ Incursion runners think these rules are arbitrary and should not apply to them.
Would I like the GÇÿOTAGÇÖsGÇÖ made easier? Yes I would. But ideally I think the primary problem is the idea that if your crap fit ship canGÇÖt do it, it must be to hard. This problem is exacerbated by the GÇÿscrubGÇÖ fleets doing HQ sites, this essentially gives the impression that GÇ£if I can do this GÇÿHQGÇÖsGÇÖ then I should be able to do those GÇÿVGGÇÖsGÇÖ.GÇ¥ As any lvl4 mission runner can tell you the lvl4 GÇÿCargo DeliveryGÇÖ can be successfully done in a shuttle but that doesnGÇÖt mean a Noob is ready to solo GÇÿDread Pirate ScarletGÇÖ.
End result is that fixing Incursions is only 10% CCP and 90% the playerGÇÖs job. Get in the right ship, in the right site, with the right fleet. Stop worrying about the ISK the other player is making with a 40mil sp Toon and a 4 billion ISK faction fit BS. He is probably losing ISK when compared to other things he could invest the same amount of ISK in. IE; a Ninja site runner in Nul can make 500 mil in an hour with 300 mil invested in ship. A GÇÿshinyGÇÖ incursion runner is lucky to make 500 mil in a day with over 2 billion in a modest ship.
I guess the long winded speech was unnecessary. Simply put if you canGÇÖt do these sites you are doing the site wrong, NOT that the site is wrong. Or that the other guys are cheating.
|

Jude Nova
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 03:36:00 -
[80] - Quote
Wow, Much debate..
Not that i like to agree with ISN people, But i must admit that ISN in this case is spot on. Im Owner of a small community called "ICU", And we focus on nothing but Vanguards. Why..?... Because we still belive that these are the most profitable and "LESS" risk in terms of losing a ship. And i must point out that at "ICU" we "LOVE" OTA's... Why ???.... Because we know how to run them properly. Belive it or not but like ISN we also hit 100m per hour( even with a mael or 2 ), And yes we do run shiney, But this is only a bonus. Do we take non-shiney ships ?... Yes.! ..... Do we require our members to fly shiney ships with shiney mods?...No.... Its a bonus if they do, And anyway running with us has made billions for our members and they LIKE to improve there ships.!
If you made x amount of isk in mission's wouldnt you WANT to improve its fitting to make that mission go quicker ? Same rules apply for Incursions!
Are OTA's easy ??.... Yes.. we run 2 Basi and 8 DPS and still make 100m per hour.!  There's no secret to it... Wanna know ??? Convo me or join our channel. (Incursion United).
(I dont mean to make above sound like a recruitment add but im just pointing out what Vanguard communitys can do... in this case...us at ICU)
But anyway.... While i agree alot with ISN i understand both sides of the coin and can confirm that BTL and the like have become ghost towns, But will i blame CCP for "nerfing" Vanguards?? No!!!.. I cant belive there is soo much crap going on with people saying i wish they didnt nerf the Vanguards because we loved making 150m per hour running OTA's in under 2 mins... Come on people wake up and understand that the changes i think are actually better and still best for Isk ratio compared to Assault and HQ.... (Assaults and HQ stop and start many times).
Sorry to go on its very late but i hope ther eis a point in everything i was saying  Fly safe guys and spread the word that there are still many Vanguard Communitys out there, You just need to look for them or Stand up and make one for yourself like i did 6 months ago!. |
|

Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
106
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 02:03:00 -
[81] - Quote
Doing 10 OTA's in 1 hour? Wow.... |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
260
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 06:50:00 -
[82] - Quote
Jude Nova wrote:(snip) Are OTA's easy ??.... Yes.. we run 2 Basi and 8 DPS and still make 100m per hour.!  There's no secret to it... Wanna know ??? Convo me or join our channel. (Incursion United). (I dont mean to make above sound like a recruitment add but im just pointing out what Vanguard communitys can do... in this case...us at ICU) But anyway.... While i agree alot with ISN i understand both sides of the coin and can confirm that BTL and the like have become ghost towns, But will i blame CCP for "nerfing" Vanguards?? No!!!.. (snip) .
OK So go then with your shiney fleets in null/lo sec Incursions to knock down the Wall of OTAs there. I'm sure the nerf had nuthing to do with not a single null or lo sec constellation MOM has been spoted since April 24th  An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |
|

CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
429

|
Posted - 2012.07.24 09:52:00 -
[83] - Quote
These changes will be released with Inferno 1.2 on August 8th CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity |
|

Kodavor
Mine3
21
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 17:17:00 -
[84] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:These changes will be released with Inferno 1.2 on August 8th
WOOOT !! Thank you %)))
|
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CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
437

|
Posted - 2012.07.24 17:40:00 -
[85] - Quote
Kodavor wrote:CCP Affinity wrote:These changes will be released with Inferno 1.2 on August 8th WOOOT !! Thank you %)))
You are very welcome :3 CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity Content Designer for EVE Online |
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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
260
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 03:54:00 -
[86] - Quote
Thanks for the definitive date Affinity  I had a longer post but the forums ate it 
To be honest I perfer Assaults over Vanguards but the impending death of communites from the Wall Of OTAs forced me to do soo many Vanguards to keep my community (TDF) alive. It was an act o will for the Armour commiunities leaders to stay alive without mechanics changes( still a bit surprised we outlived BTL PUB with thier vast numbers compared to ours). I'll be glad to get back to Assaults again even though they pay less.
I did not realize Vanguards were such an integral part of the lo/null sec incursions. The number of assualts done there must be infintessimal?
Been hoping to see some relavent stats about Incursions' histories past 3-4 months from CCP Diagoras in his tweets after his vacation last month but it sounds like the Wall of Text CSM minutes are eating up all his time & he has not peeped at all 
I hope you get to see your longer term goals for Incursions realized beore another Team reorginization. I'd have loved to see the site logs mentioned here over the past 4 months http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCf6pXHBFRM
I'm guessing right now Drone content is in your crosshairs? An' then [email protected], he come scramblin outta theTerminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system'scrashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children' |

Keith Planck
Ashton Technologies Ignore This.
349
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 06:40:00 -
[87] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:Kodavor wrote:CCP Affinity wrote:These changes will be released with Inferno 1.2 on August 8th WOOOT !! Thank you %))) You are very welcome :3
I'm counting the seconds /)^3^(\
get a room you 2 >:3 |
|

CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
479

|
Posted - 2012.07.25 09:00:00 -
[88] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Thanks for the definitive date Affinity  I had a longer post but the forums ate it  To be honest I perfer Assaults over Vanguards but the impending death of communites from the Wall Of OTAs forced me to do soo many Vanguards to keep my community (TDF) alive. It was an act o will for the Armour commiunities leaders to stay alive without mechanics changes( still a bit surprised we outlived BTL PUB with their once vast numbers compared to ours). I'll be glad to get back to Assaults again even though they pay less. The old NCNs actually were more fun with thier randomness but they were 1 room middle too long IMHO. I did not realize Vanguards were such an integral part of the lo/null sec incursions. The number of assualts done there must be infintessimal? Been hoping to see some relavent stats about Incursions' histories past 3-4 months from CCP Diagoras in his tweets after his vacation last month but it sounds like the Wall of Text CSM minutes are eating up all his time & he has not peeped at all  I hope you get to see your longer term goals for Incursions realized beore another Team reorginization. I'd have loved to see the site logs mentioned here over the past 4 months http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCf6pXHBFRMI'm guessing right now Drone content is in your crosshairs?
I don't work on that - that would be CCP Bettik. We are on the same team, but we work on seperate projects to maximise the amount of content we can deliver. After Summer vacation I will hopefully be able to give you all more definite answers on what we will release for Winter. Incursion changes (including the OTA change) were not planned for the August release at all, we just felt it was important to not leave this issue until Winter. Hopefully after August 8th we will see an improvement in both Vanguards and Community spirit :)
CCP Affinity | Team Five 0 |-á @CCP_Affinity Content Designer for EVE Online |
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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
260
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 16:55:00 -
[89] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote: Incursion changes (including the OTA change) were not planned for the August release at all, we just felt it was important to not leave this issue until Winter. Hopefully after August 8th we will see an improvement in both Vanguards and Community spirit :)
Well thanks for the earlier then planned release then, I hope it breathes life into null/lo sec Incursions too. lol Community spirit right now is about to blow up into threatened wardecks & Blackbird squads again it'll be fun watching the farmers threaten each other with pitchforks again. Nostalgie ist die Faehigkeit, darueber zu trauern, dass es nicht mehr soist, wie es frueher nicht gewesen ist. -- Manfred Rommel-á |

Thrace Lucre
Tribuo Quod Victum The AirShip Pirates
1
|
Posted - 2012.07.28 13:28:00 -
[90] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:Well thanks for the earlier then planned release then, I hope it breathes life into null/lo sec Incursions too. lol Community spirit right now is about to blow up into threatened wardecks & Blackbird squads again  it'll be fun watching the farmers threaten each other with pitchforks again.
I do miss watching this kind of drama unfold :( Would be nice to see the incursion community back at the point where this kind of thing happens when FCs burn out (example: HTIDRaver) and pilots take alts and attempt to take down mothership sites with groups like Brick Squad (example: Ammzi)
Even nicer would be seeing incursions at a point where it's "balanced" in all respects and is both fun and profitable for the pilot running the sites. |
|

Soon Shin
Caucasian Culture Club Transmission Lost
113
|
Posted - 2012.07.31 05:55:00 -
[91] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:CCP Affinity wrote: Incursion changes (including the OTA change) were not planned for the August release at all, we just felt it was important to not leave this issue until Winter. Hopefully after August 8th we will see an improvement in both Vanguards and Community spirit :)
Well thanks for the earlier then planned release then, I hope it breathes life into null/lo sec Incursions too. lol Community spirit right now is about to blow up into threatened wardecks & Blackbird squads again  it'll be fun watching the farmers threaten each other with pitchforks again.
Didn't you say that you rage quit over incursions?
I see the true incursion carebear stench in you. |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
265
|
Posted - 2012.08.02 17:12:00 -
[92] - Quote
From the CSM notes I can easily draw the conclusion that the CSM doesn't have a clue about the Incursion communities. There was not a peep about how we all knew that the 'rollback' would be a complete farce and they didn't even know how badly we were decimated by the Escalation nerf until CCP showed them.The distinct impression I got from the CSM is they'd rather see it die since it doesn't affect their interests
Nostalgie ist die Faehigkeit, darueber zu trauern, dass es nicht mehr soist, wie es frueher nicht gewesen ist. -- Manfred Rommel-á |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
265
|
Posted - 2012.08.02 17:41:00 -
[93] - Quote
CCP Affinity one problem with your idea about having scouts as a mini Vanguard trainning area is that you still need someone to FC them that has done it before. Currently we train newbies by vetting thier ideas about fits & then giving them a full taste of a site by throwing them in the deepend but with a big watchfull eye after we make sure they know what tags & broadcasting is.
Still I sort of like the idea but you better not iclude any scramblers inside the sites else it'll become a graveyard and turn off potential Incursion runners before we get to throw them into the deepend without floaties...
Also with scouts not sure how you'll get 5 or so newbies together & include 2 logistics when regular fleets are desperate for logistics unless you are going to have these mini vanguards logi-less which doesn't really train someone upfor any other Incursion site because without logistics not a single non scout can be completed. I guess you can try to have them spider tank (but that will leave them with the impression that spider tanking is viable in any other sitewhich it is not and was especially proved in the original NCNs ) Nostalgie ist die Faehigkeit, darueber zu trauern, dass es nicht mehr soist, wie es frueher nicht gewesen ist. -- Manfred Rommel-á |

SC0T1SH WARRIOR
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
99
|
Posted - 2012.08.02 21:32:00 -
[94] - Quote
...Yep, still ******
*goes back to running anoms* Dont mind me, -ájust touching your stuff. |
|

CCP Affinity
C C P C C P Alliance
585

|
Posted - 2012.08.03 12:09:00 -
[95] - Quote
DarthNefarius wrote:CCP Affinity one problem with your idea about having scouts as a mini Vanguard trainning area is that you still need someone to FC them that has done it before. Currently we train newbies by vetting thier ideas about fits & then giving them a full taste of a site by throwing them in the deepend but with a big watchfull eye after we make sure they know what tags & broadcasting is.
I guess I'm curious if you're going to want these scout site groups to be fleeted?
Still I sort of like the idea but you better not include any scramblers inside the sites else it'll become a graveyard and turn off potential Incursion runners before we get to throw them into the deepend without floaties... Current scout sites work without a deadspace acell gate your current thinking thinking continueing that?
Also with scouts not sure how you'll get 5 or so newbies together & include 2 logistics when regular fleets are desperate for logistics unless you are going to have these mini vanguards logi-less which doesn't really train someone upfor any other Incursion site because without logistics not a single non scout can be completed. I guess you can try to have them spider tank (but that will leave them with the impression that spider tanking is viable in any other sitewhich it is not and was especially proved in the original NCNs )
Hope above is help full. An Incursion wading pool that helps us point potenial Incursioners to try out is alot beter then the elitist 'your fit sucks' mantra I always hear.
I think what you should take from the summit minutes is that Incursions is not being forgotten. It was high on my priority list to discuss with the CSM and, while the ideas were still very high level - we wanted to make sure everything mentioned was included in the minutes. CCP Affinity | Follow me on Twitter Content Designer for EVE Online |
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DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
266
|
Posted - 2012.08.03 15:22:00 -
[96] - Quote
CCP Affinity wrote:
I think what you should take from the summit minutes is that Incursions is not being forgotten. It was high on my priority list to discuss with the CSM and, while the ideas were still very high level - we wanted to make sure everything mentioned was included in the minutes.
I think you & Soundwave are the only ones that hadn't forgotten about Incursions.
What I took from the summer minutes was that the CSM was clueless about how the Incursion communities were decimated until CCP Soundwave told them "Soundwave sheepishly mentioned CCP broke incursions and showed the CSM a graph depicting the drop off in incursions activity. There were many GÇ£Ohhh snapsGÇ¥ around the table."
CSM gave me a distinct impression of Schadenfreude (or skadefryd ): "The massive drop off of Vanguard sites was praised since they were relatively risk-free ISK."
And they buy into the forum trolls' lies assertion incursions are 100% risk free: "Soundwave pointed out that people do die in incursions at rates higher than some other kinds of PvE content"
While only caring about thier own interests: "UAxDEATH would like to know how any of that related to null sec," BTW: UAxDEATH could have been informed not a single MOM site has been destroyed in NULL since the Escalation NERF and beore the nerf they were being run more and more often in NULL which could be attested by CCP Diagoras ( were is he anyways seems like he fell of the face of the earth is he one o the DEVs that had a kid orsomething? )
The after impression is that the CSM would rather see us wither and die: "Seleene then asked if Incursions were ever going to end." =========================================================
EVE residents: 5% Wormholes; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 6: 100% Nullsec residents. EVE demographics vs CSM demographics, nothing to worry about... |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
266
|
Posted - 2012.08.03 15:40:00 -
[97] - Quote
In the CSM notes you mentioned looking into Concord LP store expansion I overheated my brain trying to figure out what'd be good items for newbies would be to get them into fleets... not alot although maybe a Concord equilvalent to the Sansha Purloined Codebreaker that is actually usefull (ie: does not have to be fitted on the useless 1 mid Echelon ) that'd hack towers faster?
Also usefull would be Concord webifiers becuase I think that is one item used extensively by all fleets armour & shield. Of course I'd like the range to be 20km+ but the 14kn Fed Navy ones seem to be the most used becuase those pesky Incursion frigates allways just hangout righ at 10.1km just out o the range of t1&t2 webbiiers.
Strange that we have all those capitol mod BPCs although a the beginning days o the Incursions I recall they were the big sellers to NULL fetching many 9k ISK per LP I think the flooding of the market has reduced Cocord LP value to ~750 ISK per LP. I now only use my 4.5 million pile of LP to buy faction crystals(ammo) for personal use & have 2 clones with full of 6% Concord implants in all slots and won't buy anymore because I liketo reserve my other clones for NULL SEC jaunts =========================================================
EVE residents: 5% Wormholes; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 6: 100% Nullsec residents. EVE demographics vs CSM demographics, nothing to worry about... |

Spc One
The Chodak Void Alliance
69
|
Posted - 2012.08.11 08:00:00 -
[98] - Quote
Even with the changes, it's super hard to get people and fleet together. We tried to form up a fleet but ended waiting for 1 hour for people, then fleet disbanded because we couldn't get 10 people.
I guess no-one is doing incursions anymore.

I also want to know why do we get 10.395 mil instead of 10.5 mil if we get 10 people doing incursions ? Since ccp "Unnerfed" incursions we should get 10.5 mil per tick for 10 people. |

DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
275
|
Posted - 2012.08.11 17:36:00 -
[99] - Quote
Spc One wrote:Even with the changes, it's super hard to get people and fleet together. We tried to form up a fleet but ended waiting for 1 hour for people, then fleet disbanded because we couldn't get 10 people. I guess no-one is doing incursions anymore.  I also want to know why do we get 10.395 mil instead of 10.5 mil if we get 10 people doing incursions ? Since ccp "Unnerfed" incursions we should get 10.5 mil per tick for 10 people.
It may take a bit for peeps to trickle back to Incursions even though the Wall of OTAs(TM) has been brought down. Another thing is that the icks in no way are as quick as they were pre NERF so expect the non-social farmers to stay in FW speedtank frigats until the LP item market crashes big time... sort of a good thing IMHO because FW needed some love & although I doubt they like the farmer luv a few o them will inevitably stick to lo sec.
I suggest you may want to check out one of the more traditional chat channels like "The Ditanian leet" for armour or "BTL PUB", tvp, or ISN for shield fleets in the mean time because that is where many weathered out the Escalation nerf bat decimation.
As for the 10.395 versus 10.5 programmer DEVs can't do math I blame the Icelandic education system.  =========================================================
EVE residents: 5% Wormholes; 8% Lowsec; 20% Nullsec; 67% Highsec. CSM 6: 100% Nullsec residents. EVE demographics vs CSM demographics, nothing to worry about... |
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