Originally by: Alica Wildfire

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Edited by: Alica Wildfire on 28/06/2010 11:38:09

Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Move on minmatar before you find more enemies than you would like to have at this point.

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I'm not defending you. You are a damn slaver and I will always fight your kind. I do not know you enough that I can say I hate you but damn me, I'm triggerhappy enough to shoot you on sight anyway, Nefris.

And I'm also not defending Jade. I'm defending freedom and the right to love anyone you like. That the small loyality overwrites the bigger one.

So care about your own little stuff about blood rituals or whatever games you play and don't get in my line of fire when I'm fighting for my cause. I'm not happy where this puts me here, but I fight where fate puts me.

Truth is that Jade does not belong on this list. And with her, I assume, many more do not but I don't know. I definitly didn't ASK YOU FOR HELP OR JOVIAL ADVICE, slaver*****! So get out of my line of fire.

Please.

With a cherry on top. Or you get more blood by this than you can suck.

I'm talking to my own kind here, not to you.

But okay. I'll stop it here.
This is ridiculous.

Just one thing: bootlicking? In your dreams, Nefris, in your dreams. And I don't fear enemies. Not numbers not strength. I can watch myself well enough. More enemies more honour. More targets.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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We know of no Minmatar corporation who uses terms like æSlaverÆ

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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and are shocked to hear of you not only using such Amarrian words

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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let alone at one of our best friends and closest allies.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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we have much more right to speak on behalf of Militia than you.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Revan Neferis has been a close ally of the Minmatar Militia

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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How dare you call her a slaver?

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Revan Neferis has been heavily involved with our operations and will continue to be. If you have issues with her (someone who has helped our cause more than your smacktalking corporation) then you have issues with not only ROSS but the entire Minmatar Militia.

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Originally by: Alica Wildfire

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And who the fragg are you?!

I'm no spokeperson for my corporation, besides that and am no diplomat. And who I like or not like is my personal matter. Neferis once crossed swords on the IGS when she announced to... ah that's a long story and I don't know what damn business of yours this is, SPEAR LIEUTENANT.

The killing is fun. If you want to do something for our cause, actually work a bit for it. You think recapturing systems is fun, eh? Go and get you some merits for the Republic first before you Lieutanant come along and piss at my pants.

And now back to the front and next time aim better on an Amarr, soldier, not on blue pilots.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Revan Neferis has been heavily involved with our operations and will continue to be. If you have issues with her (someone who has helped our cause more than your smacktalking corporation) then you have issues with not only ROSS but the entire Minmatar Militia.

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Originally by: The Cosmopolite

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I feel sure a captain of Alicia Wildfire's sound judgement will acknowledge the error and I also feel sure that questions as to Captain Wildfire's revolutionary and liberationist credentials will cease.

The Cosmopolite

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Originally by: The Cosmopolite

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My friends,

I feel an understanding can be reached here. I believe that Alicia Wildfire, in my view a captain of strong principle and with a record of freedom-fighting that should not be called into question, is labouring under a mistaken impression regarding the Lady Neferis.

Slander and lies as to the Lady Neferis regularly fill GalNet and I believe that, alas, Captain Wildfire has, like so many, uncritically accepted them. I understand why. It is true that Lady Neferis once kept slaves. Some people find it hard to believe that others can change. However, it is quite clear to those who are acquainted with the true facts that Lady Neferis has not been a slaver for quite some time, to the contrary Lady Neferis has liberated many slaves and aids freedom fighters in various locales of New Eden.

It is long since time that the lies told about Lady Neferis, which primarily have as their target not Lady Neferis but rather her lover, were treated with the contempt they deserve.

I feel sure a captain of Alicia Wildfire's sound judgement will acknowledge the error and I also feel sure that questions as to Captain Wildfire's revolutionary and liberationist credentials will cease.

The Cosmopolite

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Let me ask this, is it not traitorous to the cause of the Minmatar Republic to slander and lie about a person who has acted in support of the cause?

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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I do not shoot on blues. Sorry. But if you feel like that's the way you should act here and now.. go on.

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Originally by: Alica Wildfire

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But they were not representing the actual situation and this was my fault, I admit.

I'm sorry for any inconvenience and hope my excuse will be accepted and we can settle this issue soon before any harm is done to any reputation.

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Originally by: Rodj Blake

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It says a lot for the desperation of the Minmatar Militia that they're willing to consider someone who has (amongst other things) declared her support for the Sansha as an ally.

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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Alica you have responded admirably with your apology.

The Cosmoplite, as always you speak great words of sense and wisdom.

Revan, we are always at your service, as you have been for us.

I hope this matter can now be closed.

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Originally by: Alica Wildfire

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Edited by: Alica Wildfire on 28/06/2010 17:26:49
For I know Nefris not good enough to know of any change in her behaviour but some time ago. But I take the word from The Cosmopolite and with this from The Star Fraction that this has actually happend. And with this I have no problem to excuse myself for the wrong impression I had of her.

I respect very much when people have to power to change themselves. It is usually a sign of strength. As I see it as a strength to be sorry if a mistake was made. From the information I had at hand my words were correct. But they were not representing the actual situation and this was my fault, I admit.

I'm sorry for any inconvenience and hope my excuse will be accepted and we can settle this issue soon before any harm is done to any reputation.

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Should I start mocking you now?

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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Alica you have responded admirably with your apology.

The Cosmoplite, as always you speak great words of sense and wisdom.

Revan, we are always at your service, as you have been for us.

I hope this matter can now be closed.

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Yes the matter is closed Captain, unless you want to entertain yourself with the PIE jester here, be my guest.

* winks

My regards to all of Ross.

Revan Neferis
Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign
Sani Sabik

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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The PIE jerker is simply not entertaining enough to warrant our attentions.

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Originally by: Rodj Blake

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Rather than that, perhaps you could explain to us all how your oath of loyalty to Empress Jamyl affects your friendship with corporations in the Minmatar Militia?

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Originally by: Arkady Sadik

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I also never understood why disagreements like this thread are discussed in public. Do you think this serves any purpose? Use your neocom mail system. It has the same results.

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Originally by: Vikarion

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Shouldn't all of you Minmatar militia be more focused on shooting the Amarr than each other?

You have a hostile entity bent on your destruction, namely the Empire, and you think that your time is better spent killing each other over one person? Not to be critical, but this sounds like somewhat of a waste of time. Perhaps you should fight a frigate duel to settle it and be done with it, don't you think?

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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What did you expect Alica? Most of the militia, and really the Republic as well, is more focused on causing death than anything else. I never want to see the Republic succumb to the Empire, but at the same time I wonder-what is necessary to cause change among our people?

Sasawong and many others fought hard to instill the ideals we thought to be the driving force behind the Tribal Liberation Force; passion, freedom, and perseverance. Perhaps it is the cynic that has awakened, or I faced the reality that the real driving force for most among it's ranks is the desire for murder; murder masked by "retribution". The idealists and romantics among the Tribal Liberation Force are considered weak if they do not quench the blood-thirst of many Matari and Her allies. Is this how we gauge Minmatar, by their "kill-board statistics"?

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Originally by: Arkady Sadik

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The vast majority of capsuleers judges everyone else by their "killboard stats". The plex work of the Amarr now is done by a select few, just like the plex work of the Minmatar in the last offense was done by a select few. The Minmatar are no different here from the other factions. Sadly, it's often easier to see the shortcomings of your own people, and assume the grass is greener on the other planet. It isn't. What makes us different from the Amarr is not that we somehow attract the more balanced capsuleers.

I never understood this hatred between the preferences. The hunters talk badly about those who captured plexes; the plexers in turn talk badly about those who prefer to hunt. Both are needed, there is a large group that does both, and cooperation works well. Trying to talk badly about "the other side" only causes fewer and fewer people to do both. Do you think this is helpful?

I also never understood why disagreements like this thread are discussed in public. Do you think this serves any purpose? Use your neocom mail system. It has the same results.

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Originally by: Nauticaa

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Right my 2 isk.

No one Person or corp can claim to speak for a Militia simple as.

Also Revan has stated publicy she is a slaver so dont see why your aguring that,

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Nauticaa

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Right my 2 isk.

No one Person or corp can claim to speak for a Militia simple as.

Also Revan has stated publicy she is a slaver so dont see why your aguring that,

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You really are the prize idiot at the idiot farm on national idiot day during the centenial idiocy celebrations of the proud republic of moron aren't you ?

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Edited by: Amun Khonsu on 29/06/2010 11:59:24
There is currently no internal wardecs among major minmatar militia corporations and all of us strongly discourage such ideas as they are counterproductive.

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Originally by: Nauticaa

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Right my 2 isk.

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Originally by: Gangleri

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Edited by: Amun Khonsu on 29/06/2010 11:59:24
There is currently no internal wardecs among major minmatar militia corporations and all of us strongly discourage such ideas as they are counterproductive.

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* Legatus Gangleri laughs very hard.

I like the word "currently" here ..... it makes all the more clear that we have to stand in the gap between the light of civilized society and the Minmatar tribes and their supporters gathered.

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Nauticaa

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Right my 2 isk.

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Have you considered suing your brains for nonsupport?

Revan Neferis
Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign
Sani Sabik

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Originally by: Zverofaust

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I had fish & chips yesterday. It was pretty delicious.

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Originally by: Zverofaust

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I used lemon juice, which is a perfectly acceptable substitute for vinegar on fried fish products in my humble opinion.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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For example, Pilot Nauticaa's point was correct, so she was insulted instead of responded to.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Now you lie and repeat the same lie.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Shouldn't be too hard right?

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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The first time you called me a liar...

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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*Rolls Eyes*

I believe what you are looking for is this Miss Star Sparrow...

But I am Curious jade dose this not make Sani Sabik "slaver Apologists" or am I missing something, just a civilised question , which I think deserves a semi civil answer.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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*Rolls Eyes*

I believe what you are looking for is this Miss Star Sparrow...

But I am Curious jade dose this not make Sani Sabik "slaver Apologists" or am I missing something, just a civilised question , which I think deserves a semi civil answer.

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You are missing the point of my Lover's announcement where she announces she will hire mercenaries to engage anti-Sansha forces attempting to impede the Sansha offensive in the Amarr Empire. From my perspective this represents an almost poetic justice that the Empire most complicit in the founding of the Nation and still practising slavery enthusiastically should be left to fend for itself against the society of technological slavers it spawned in its image.

Still it is her business at the end of the day. I am responsible for the political decisions I make alongside my comrades and free captains in the Star Fraction. I am not responsible for the independent decisions of other CEOs and leaders outside of the Star Fraction.

But I will say speaking personally now, I have seen a great deal of corruption, lies, and deeply disreputable behaviour from Amarrian nationalists using the Sansha offensive as a cover for their own disgustingly regressive ideology and worse yet, people are taken in by the notion it is right to fight alongside slavers against slavers because the Empire is somehow morally superior to the Nation. It is a nonsense and you should be ashamed.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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The first time you called me a liar...

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Have Annwn Matari now stopped betraying the Matari people? Yes/no?

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Because somehow, you ****ing and flying alongside a Blood Raider who fights for that which you fight against, is not something to be considered "nonsense" that "you should be ashamed" of? Your duality is hilarious!

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Quote:

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Have Annwn Matari now stopped betraying the Matari people? Yes/no?
Would have required them to start betraying them to begin with.

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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Despite the poetic justice of Amarraians being enslaved do you not feel it is counter productive to overall cause, I have never supported slavery by far I have always opposed it, however do you not feel from these actions we are going from one form of slavery to another?

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Quote:

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And a second question to you jade is, do you agree that the recent nation invasion is a problem that we all face and should face together?

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I ask this because while I see the poetic justice in this I am all out against such actions, we face the fight of not only freedom but free will

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...and killing people who oppose the Sansha is very counter productive, however I do take note of you actions against nation supporting Corporations.

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First I should say for the sake of clarity that I have never believed your personal claims on opposition to Slavery. You fought for I-RED

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No. I will not defend the Amarrian Empire against an entity that it encouraged and empowered and shares many of the same cultural forms and intrinsic ideals. I consider a weakened Amarrian Empire is the best thing we can hope from recent Nation intervention.

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And you are claiming what? That slaves of the Amarrian Empire retain their "free will?" That the glaive and vitoc infection encourage independent thought? That transcraniel microcontrollers are somehow different from Sansha implants? That religious brainwashing is different from cult brainwashing?

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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Quote:

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No. I will not defend the Amarrian Empire against an entity that it encouraged and empowered and shares many of the same cultural forms and intrinsic ideals. I consider a weakened Amarrian Empire is the best thing we can hope from recent Nation intervention.

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I believe you have miss understood me here, I am asking weather you feel taking action against people who are defending the amarr empire is wrong given the fact that they are defending empire in general and not one specific race.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Aside from SHY's history with I-RED where they freed a few million slaves as a result of peaceful actions, where U'K has freed...who knows, maybe a few million, and killed the rest out of stubbornness...

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Your attempts to paint yourself in a brighter light after the truth comes out that...well, you actually support someone who supports Sansha so it's really...I don't know; counter-intuitive?

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I'd be really frustrated right now if I was one of your pilots...

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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I don't think lying about the Ushra'khan's results in the war against Amarrian slavery is the best way to open your commentary race-traitor. Who are you trying to persuade here?

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Revan Neferis has engaged mercenaries to attack capsuleer organizations defending the Amarrian Empire from Sansha incursions. That is her choice to do so. Her aggression was targeted at Amarrian interests so it is no surprise to for me to see an Amarrian sympathizer trying to paint this as a blanket support of the Nation over a specific attack on the Empire.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Quote:

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I'd be really frustrated right now if I was one of your pilots...

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I hardly see why since the free captains of the Star Fraction are fully entitled to engage Nation vessels anywhere they chose at personal discretion. I have said my own opinion is that I would be extremely unlikely to stand with Amarrian Nationalists to defend Amarrian worlds but every single pilot of the Fraction is free to make their own choices on this issue and Nation starships are KOS anywhere in known space.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Because they're allowed to do whatever they want yet have no support or morale boost from their leadership, who fully supports the opposing side. Seems like...oh, I don't know...seems like you're fighting for the enemy?

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Because they're allowed to do whatever they want yet have no support or morale boost from their leadership, who fully supports the opposing side. Seems like...oh, I don't know...seems like you're fighting for the enemy?

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Wouldn't that involve well ... "fighting for the enemy"? You know, like signing up to the 24th Crusade for six months and shooting our former friends?

I see what you are doing here Eran Mintor. You don't agree with Revan Neferis targeting Amarrian interests and deciding her organizational standings towards the Nation will be expressed to hiring mercenaries to oppose those fighting the Nation in Amarrian space. So you very quickly move to a stance of "if you are not with us you are against us" and consider that the actions of the Star Fraction in not condemning Revan's independent stance represent us "fighting" for the Nation.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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So you very quickly move to a stance of "if you are not with us you are against us" and consider that the actions of the Star Fraction in not condemning Revan's independent stance represent us "fighting" for the Nation.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Well we (Star Fraction) are against you Eran Mintor. Your organization is one we consider to be rife with Matari Race-traitors and turncoats. Annwn Matari is no friend of the Star Fraction and as a -10 entity you will be annihilated at any time or place of our convenience. If you wish to claim this makes us friends of the Nation that simply diplays the transparency of the manipulations you have placed in the public domain.

This is not a war of "us v them" "a vs b" "red vs blue" "freedom against tyranny". You are an Amarrian sympathizer in an Amarrian sympathizer corporation that would like to see a threat to Amarr neutralized so you can go back to convincing the Free Matari they would be better off rejecting their own government and finding god (and slavery) at the leash of the 24th Crusade and Amarrian Nationalist mainstream.

Let me be plain Eran Mintor. If I see you and vessels of the Nation in space the ideal outcome is to kill you AND the Nation. If you want to claim that makes me a supporter of Sansha then by all means make the claim. I trust anyone with a modicom of independent rational thought will see through your words as easily as they have seen your turncoat manipulations in times before.

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Well we (Star Fraction) are against you Eran Mintor. Your organization is one we consider to be rife with Matari Race-traitors and turncoats. Annwn Matari is no friend of the Star Fraction and as a -10 entity you will be annihilated at any time or place of our convenience. If you wish to claim this makes us friends of the Nation that simply diplays the transparency of the manipulations you have placed in the public domain.

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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Now for Miss Revan...

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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...very similar to what SF's position was towards I-RED when they were supposedly still supporting CVA? It is so strange to see I-RED denounce slavery, and yet SF cannot condemn the actions that support your own "KOS" enemies.

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Actually your stance towards me and Annwn has nothing to do with my view towards you, rather your actions that you supposedly covet beyond all things. I have always viewed you in ill regard since my time in the Minmatar militia and beyond...yet you herald "action" before "words" and I find little but words when looking for your deeds against the Sansha incursion.

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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Hmmm such divine self righteousness that you cannot answer my completely legitimate and fair question.

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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But what do I know revan in your eyes IÆm dim

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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But donÆt worry your pretty little head with me Revan

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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Hypocrisy and stupidity walk hand in hand

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Your brilliant argument clearly shows what I have been repeating here: The fact that you have one brain cell, and it is fighting for dominance.
Don't let it tire you too much.

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Originally by: Merdaneth

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banner

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Oh Merdaneth...

Revan Neferis
Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign
Sani Sabik

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Originally by: Black Necris

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Jade Constantine approves.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Same old bland dribble.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Bursting into tears in a cloud of emotional embarrassment...

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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on that note...

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Don't hide your smile.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Please keep up the childish rhetoric

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Black Necris

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Jade Constantine approves.

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If that's true, I'll taste it from her lips, then let you know my review.

*winks

Revan Neferis
Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign
Sani Sabik

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Originally by: Black Necris

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Can i see you two kiss eachother? just for investigative reasons...

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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I have been waiting for months for Jade to show one pice of evidence showing me to be lying.

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... Showing MATAR to be traitors.

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Jade lied. We caught it, and Star Fraction have been calling us traitors ever since. We have been loyal to the Minmatar people since our inception and the only thing we have ever done that could be considered traitorous is...well, lets see, we took in a Minmatar militia corp as well as our own...we have agreed to support I-Red in their move away from slavers, and now Eran Mintor has left the Amarrian militia. Yes, we certainly have worsened the cause of our people.

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Meanwhile, we fight Sansha, and slander from the Star Fraction who desperately tries to paint us as Amarrian sympathizers all because Jade lied and refuses to admit it. Their arguments have devolved to repeating the same lies, ignoring their own words, insulting and slandering decent pilots and attempting to cause discord among those loyal to the Minmatar people. I have never, EVER, done anything to support the Amarr or Ammatar in either word or deed save for flying once in a coalition force against Sansha, and that only recently. Yet, this is what the argument devolves to?

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Jade lied. We caught it, [...]

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[...]and Star Fraction have been calling us traitors ever since.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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So, according to Jade who posted that conversation, he did actually make the statement you wanted him to, and he did so in public.

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No he didn't and I'll thank you not to post "according to jade" in a dishonest fashion.

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Oh, was this not you?

Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Edited by: Jade Constantine on 06/05/2010 18:26:32

[ 2010.05.05 20:32:58 ] John Revenent > We are not slavers.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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[ 2010.05.05 20:33:27 ] The Cosmopolite > You happily worked with and supported the vile slaver regime of the CVA.
[ 2010.05.05 20:33:51 ] The Cosmopolite > You are an apologist for and supporter of slavery.
[ 2010.05.05 20:33:52 ] John Revenent > We do so no more, I suggest you work on your intel

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The full thread can be found here : here.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Since John Revenent did not publicly sever ties with the CVA that night at the memorial and has never before or since looked like severing those ties you have made a clear lie on the record here Sophie Starsparrow...He didn't make a statement severing bonds with the CVA. You lied about that, and you cannot quote me posting them because such quotes do not exist.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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[ 2010.05.05 20:33:27 ] The Cosmopolite > You happily worked with and supported the vile slaver regime of the CVA.
[ 2010.05.05 20:33:51 ] The Cosmopolite > You are an apologist for and supporter of slavery.
[ 2010.05.05 20:33:52 ] John Revenent > We do so no more, I suggest you work on your intel
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:15 ] The Cosmopolite > Of course, you could simply have repudiated the CVA, all their works and slavery in general here.
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:16 ] Stitcher > All of this is irrelevant! This was neither the time nor the place for this.
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:16 ] Racjel > An Amarrian criticizing slavery. That odd.
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:33 ] The Cosmopolite > But your overweening pride appears to have stopped you from doing that.
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:49 ] Stitcher > hah! you speak of pride?
[ 2010.05.05 20:34:49 ] Dendar > The lack of Caldari militia is a telling sign that the Caldari governor has grown weak
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:02 ] John Revenent > If you have been paying attention we have removed ourselves from the Holders and moved to assist Ishukone on home soil.
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:03 ] The Cosmopolite > I am a free Amarrian and loathe slavery as a pestilence.
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:20 ] Sofia Roseburn > Doesn't really wash away your history though does it John?
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:22 ] Stitcher > you, who just spat on six hundred thousand graves to get your petty little message across?
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:33 ] The Cosmopolite > Well then, publicly renounce the CVA and your role in the CVA's vile slaver regime.
[ 2010.05.05 20:35:40 ] John Revenent > Of course it doesnt but its a start
[ 2010.05.05 20:36:03 ] Sofia Roseburn > For you maybe, but it's not your personal judgement that you have to consider.
[ 2010.05.05 20:36:10 ] The Cosmopolite > Malkalen awaits, John Revenent.
[ 2010.05.05 20:36:13 ] Purple Hydra > quite a collection of ships
[ 2010.05.05 20:36:29 ] Akai Tsumi > The Cosmopolite, being one of the formerly enslaved race, i can assure you that Ishukone-Raata has no place for slaver
[ 2010.05.05 20:36:58 ] The Cosmopolite > You have an opportunity to make it clear that this memorial gives no comfort to the slaver and the torturer and the conqueror of peaceful peoples.
[ 2010.05.05 20:37:17 ] The Cosmopolite > Then let your leader pronounce this and we shall see.
[ 2010.05.05 20:38:28 ] John Revenent > We have already made an announcement of our withdrawal from Providence and the Amarr Empire

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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You helped I-RED to not renounce the CVA. You ran propaganda attempts to justify their past role as "enforcers" for the slaver regime in Providence. You've given a home a turncoat from the 24th Crusade who has been urging free minmatar to re-enslave themselves to imperialist dogma and Amarrian religion.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Until you admit your lying ways Sophie Starsparrow there is no real way we can progress its true. While its just a matter of you hurling groundless accusations while I point out you defended I-RED's role as "enforcers" for the Slavers of the CVA then there can be no middle ground and eventually we'll have a chance to continue the argument in space.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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I was in the Amarr militia for just over two months, and the Minmatar militia for well over a year. My "betrayal" was right after I had finished my offensive campaign against the Amarr home-worlds, personally leading the capture of only about 6 systems, to a total of 9 Amarrian occupied during our height of the campaign...my short time in the Amarr militia was to support their efforts in regaining this territory I had taken un-righteously. The Amarrians have pushed into Minamtar space since, something I do not approve of, and I have withdrawn my support of their operations in Minmatar space.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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I-RED did not need MATAR's help, nor would it need anyone's help to "not" do something (was this paradox intended?); MATAR went into the war against Star Fraction because of Star Fraction's own oppressive demands of "cede or die" towards a peaceful people. Peaceful, of course being relative when dealing with capsuleers...

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Annwn Matari did not run any "propaganda attempts" in regards to the war in question, as that would imply we are only presenting impartial facts or outright lying, as you declare Sophie of doing over and over again--Perhaps you should try to understand what she is saying before you discard all her words as lies simply because of her disagreements with you.

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It will be interesting to see how you attack a Minmatar (read: not Ammatar) alliance and still claim your support of Minmatar, freedom, and yada yada...Good thing for you that my acts against the TLF will give you some leniency in that regards.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Edited by: Amun Khonsu on 01/07/2010 12:26:54

Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Brief personal militia history

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This somehow makes you less of a traitor and terrorist sypathizer?

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Yes you declared war against us to support I-RED who earned their -10 by shooting at SF ships from neutral at the orders of the CVA in Providence while operating as "enforcers" for Aralis' regime. It's all very obvious and evident.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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I think its quite clear you are swiftly evolving into a full Ammatar alliance.

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Neu Bastian
Valklear Guard - CEO

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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I'm sorry, how does it make me a traitor and terrorist sympathizer; have you ever looked in the mirror and thought about your actions and their consequences? Did you mean to say "slaver" sympathizer,

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Where is the evidence that MATAR did it to support I-RED instead of what I said, and why would they need our help? ... When I-RED withdrew from Providence, and also the 'Provi-bloc', that should have been enough

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... but you wanted to beat your chest in public so you have reaped violence instead. Why do you think I-RED, or any Caldari entity for that matter, is against outright defying ancient Amarr traditions? I'll toss you a bone; it has nothing to do with slavery, God, or murder. Or another way; They simply have nothing to gain from saying what you demand be said.

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Originally by: Neu Bastian

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Now, The war between SF and MATAR, both allies of the VlkG, is a most unfortunate business. Tehre are many path to freedom, and none is made easier by inner struggle. I beg you both to stop aggression on each other, with guns or Galnet communications, and turn to something more productive instead, like the freedom of the enslaved.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Says who? I-RED fired upon Star Fraction vessels at the bequest of CVA in the role of "enforcers" for a slaver regime. What universe do you live in that an aggressor may simply retreat and consider all hostility is over without coming to a formal renunciation and ceasefire acceptable to the people they attacked?

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Yes I'm very sure they had nothing to gain from renouncing CVA publicly because they hope that at some point in the future if CVA are able to reclaim space they will take up their position as "enforcers" again and come back to Providence.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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In truth Neu Bastian this has not been much of a "war" - I believe a single MATAR starship was destroyed in a duel. But it is a war of words certainly, because the Fraction considers the MATAR wardec in support of the CVA-friendly I-RED to be a declaration of their alignment against Matari Freedom and the interests of Freespace on the frontier.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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In order for potential hostility to cease there will need to be meaningful diplomacy and apology from MATAR and a full renunciation of their affiliation to I-RED (as long as that organization also fails to distance itself from its "enforcer" role in Providence pre CVA fall.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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It would also require the likes of the race traitor Eran Mintor and stilted loon Sophie Starsparrow to end their endless galnet posturing but lets face it - that seems quite unlikely.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Suddenly, because we are against Fraction, we are also against Minmatar ...

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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But it is a war of words certainly, because the Fraction considers the MATAR wardec in support of the CVA-friendly I-RED to be a declaration of their alignment against Matari Freedom and the interests of Freespace on the frontier.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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The above quote is what you wrote, and what I was responding to, among the rest of what you said. If the war-dec against Star Fraction was seen as an action against 'Matari Freedom', what is wrong with me stating that's an irrational conclusion? You weren't even operating on the frontier but in Malkalen, Caldari hi-security space...the headquarters of Ishukone and well populated.
It wasn't a matter of slavery that brought you there, but personal grudges, and a desire to foster your superiority complex...it's "quite obvious and evident".

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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How would you interpret that we are negotiating for blue standings with I-RED, co-operate with them during Sansha incursions and peacefully share the Intaki system with them?

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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Oh, I know the difference. I was just clarifying exactly how far you'll go to force everyone to conform to your viewpoints.

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Originally by: Neu Bastian

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I'll shoot and kill Revan if I have the chance

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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This was never just about wardecs, Jade. You disrupted a memorial to six hundred thousand people to enforce a viewpoint.

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Even members of your own alliance strongly balked at it - and yes, I did actually talk to some of them.

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You broke the terms of your own ultimatum by blowing up a ship that had come outside as you had demanded.

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You asked them to recant support for a cause they never practiced,

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even if their allies did, and yet constantly complain that people paint you as a Blood Raider or a Sansha supporter just because you happen to be allied with something which does.

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Then you ask straightfacedly why people are inclined to wardec you.

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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What, and feed your ego? I don't need to declare war to reinforce my surety that what you do is hypocritical and wrong.

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I don't need to prove something by adding another war to my already full schedule. Besides, I'm part of a five-man corporation, and you have a 400-man alliance at your back.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Yes much better to froth mindlessly without consequence on Galnet isn't it LeHane? Why not join the ranks of the toothless and pathetic who hurl poinless vitreol without substance against the ones they envy but can never displace. I quite understand your dilemma and it is shared by many of your ilk.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Have you ever considered why you only have a 5 man corporation and I have this mighty alliance LeHane? Never wondered that it might have something to do with your mastery of the art of galnet PR interactions? I mean it can't just be pure coincidence now can it?

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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The Final Stand

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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What exactly do you have that I desire, or... occupy that I have any wish to displace you from? Laughing stock of the IGS? The not-quite-there of the Alliance Tournament?

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This barb would surely hurt me more if I wasn't talking to the executor of the alliance who recently lost a corporation, several of its members citing to me as a reason for doing so that you - not Star Fraction, you specifically) - and I quote "talk too f**king much". Star Fraction generally hemorrhages dozens of members a year to other, better, not to mention quieter alliances like The Final Stand, Rote Kapelle and so on. I mean, it can't just be pure coincidence now can it?

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Your ignorance is a little bit embarrassing for all concerned

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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briefed on their reasons

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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Hey, I'm just repeating what I was told by some DX4 members. But I guess even first-hand evidence isn't reliable if it disagrees with what Jade says, right?

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Originally by: DJ Obsidian

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Ok seriously you all need to shut up and take a break. Take a vacation, I know some good places in Solitude. I have a few nights at a couple of resorts there, there are no politics there, no wars, just peace and quiet. If that's too far for you, maybe some places in the Citadel Region? There is this luxary cruise that is to die for, so scenic. But yeah, all of you need to take a vacation.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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snipped the usual load of lies

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Edited by: Jade Constantine on 01/07/2010 12:28:43

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Sophie Starsparrow is a capering stilted loon.

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Oh, Jade, you certainly have ink in your blood. Have you ever considered copy writing? Seriously.

(And now we return you to your original programming.)

Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Alica...I am very dissappointed in you. Everything I have known about you told me you were of much stronger character than you showed here.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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snipped the usual load of lies

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I suggest you review the Cosmopolite's thorough deconstruction of your position before continuing.

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Neu Bastian
Valklear Guard - CEO

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Originally by: Neu Bastian

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Jade, CVA has been beaten and I-RED no longer supports them. Your fixation with them is counter productive. Hell, they have even offered me support.

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There are bigger fish to fry, and I would respectfully request you begin working on one. The choice is, of course, yours.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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We do so no more, I suggest you work on your intel

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We have already made an announcement of our withdrawal from Providence and the Amarr Empire

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Originally by: Azure Skyclad

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Seems like the only way to settle this one is to have John clarify what he means by;

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We do so no more, I suggest you work on your intel

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and

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We have already made an announcement of our withdrawal from Providence and the Amarr Empire

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I can see how both yours and SFs interpretation could be drawn from those statements. He,s saying they don't work with CVA anymore, true. It is not however a clear repudiation of what the CVA stand for.

Sophie, your interpretation leaves an unspoken "but we might do so again in the future" Whereas a clear denunciation of the CVA is unequivocal.

As i said, only John can clear this one up really.

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Originally by: Neu Bastian

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Jade, CVA has been beaten and I-RED no longer supports them. Your fixation with them is counter productive. Hell, they have even offered me support.

There are bigger fish to fry, and I would respectfully request you begin working on one. The choice is, of course, yours.

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Originally by: The Cosmopolite

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Originally by: Neu Bastian

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Jade, CVA has been beaten and I-RED no longer supports them. Your fixation with them is counter productive. Hell, they have even offered me support.

There are bigger fish to fry, and I would respectfully request you begin working on one. The choice is, of course, yours.

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The CVA may have been beaten but they are very far from destroyed. They continue to constitute the gravest threat to freedom and ignoring them would be folly. Indeed, at present, while they gather their forces anew, their main weapons are subversion and destabilization carried out through agents, paid informers and race-traitors.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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snipped the usual load of lies

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I suggest you review the Cosmopolite's thorough deconstruction of your position before continuing.

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Erm, yes, Where Cosmo posts the same convo I posted from local that you originally posted showing John saying things in public that you still claim he did not say. That recronstruction? I stand corrected?

Sorry Alica. I've said all we have to say. We will not be bullied into not speaking the truth.

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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My brothers and sisters, may I ask that we do not fuel this thread anylonger as it has become something that as usual, it was not intended for.

Our bonds remain strong

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Originally by: Andreus LeHane

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This was never just about wardecs, Jade. You disrupted a memorial to six hundred thousand people to enforce a viewpoint. Even members of your own alliance strongly balked at it - and yes, I did actually talk to some of them. You broke the terms of your own ultimatum by blowing up a ship that had come outside as you had demanded. You asked them to recant support for a cause they never practiced, even if their allies did, and yet constantly complain that people paint you as a Blood Raider or a Sansha supporter just because you happen to be allied with something which does.

Then you ask straightfacedly why people are inclined to wardec you.

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Originally by: Captain Vaguy

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wine it is Revan :)

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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Jade posted John saying "We are not Slavers" in local, and then said he did not and called me a liar.

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If what John said is not enough for you, fine your choice, but since then Star Fraction has chosen to portray me and my entire organization as Ammatar, blood traitors, and Ammarian supporters all to support this original lie

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If you truly want to settle this, I would suggest an actual conversation.
If you are fine with the way things are, thats your choice too, but I will not stand by and allow you to slander us in every thread I choose to speak in regardless of the topic at hand.

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Originally by: Literia

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Pilot Constantine First you accuse people that I fly with of being traitors to the Matari people, now you accuse the entirety of Annwn of being traitors. I strongly suggest that you provide evidence of this state. I have stayed silent for far too long, garner your evidence and bring me PROOF. If you do not, this matter is closed. Yet again, you would have proven yourself to be the fool that does not know when to be quiet. You do not speak for the Matari people, so do not presume that you do. Literia Khammael

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Originally by: Literia

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Really, that shows me that you lack any evidence or truth to your accusations that you have to result in threats.

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We are here to clarify that Ishukone-Raata operations do not involve itself in the inner-workings of the Amarr political influences anymore

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our organization has never permitted the dishonorable use of slaves

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while we conduct trade in there space we do not political back them with their religions claims and beliefs. While we will still assist certain corporations that operate within the Amarr Empire's it will solely be to assist against Piracy, not political enemies of the Empire itself.

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We will not be assisting in Anti-Piracy Operations in the Providence Region to either aid Ushra-Khan or CVA

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Originally by: Cheiftan

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I-RED's stance on slavery

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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If you want this matter cleared up I suggest you prevail on John Revenent to make the clear statements he is being called to make and then have your alliance mates apologize for their various lies and slander on Galnet.

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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In other regards I think it would do us all well to reflect on precisely what comment brought Sophie Starsparrow to this thread in the first place. As we can see from that link, she posted to support the assertion made by Pilot Naautica that my lover Revan Neferis was a slaver.

As the very point of this thread was inaccuracy of that claim made by another person it seems precisely on-topic to consider one falsehood from Starsparrow laid upon other falsehoods we've have seen in the last pages.

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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In other regards I think it would do us all well to reflect on precisely what comment brought Sophie Starsparrow to this thread in the first place. As we can see from that link, she posted to support the assertion made by Pilot Naautica that my lover Revan Neferis was a slaver.

As the very point of this thread was inaccuracy of that claim made by another person it seems precisely on-topic to consider one falsehood from Starsparrow laid upon other falsehoods we've have seen in the last pages.

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A point worth repeating at this point where the situation is beyond ridiculous.

Hear hear!

Revan Neferis
Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign
Sani Sabik

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Here's some more dirt I scooped up. This really is too easy.

Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Having earned a reputation as one of Amarrian's most controversial ideologists and powerful Power Brokers û Revan Neferis is probably more deserving of the moniker "Dangerous Lady" than many pod combat pilots. Those who have known the Amarrian-born beauty insist that despite her little interest for self-combat methods, she's very likely to cause Revolutions and wars of great impact with influence, money and persuasion alone.

Religious alignment : Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign of Bloodveil, Sani Sabik Faith
Political ideology: The House of Sarum.

Diplomacy:

Amarr Empire:

Sarum: Friend
Ardishapur: Enemy
Kador: Enemy
Tash-Murkon: Enemy
Kor-Azor: Enemy

Khanid Kingdom: Neutral

Minmatar Republic: Enemy
Gallente Federation: Neutral
Caldari State: Neutral

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Minmatar Republic is enemy, yet the Caldari State, who works with the Amarr Empire, is neutral? So strange...

I guess this is enough to prove my point, I should stop he-....ah who am I kidding...

Again...

Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Arelius Sarum

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Good to know your need and love for tyranny.

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Why, thank you kindly. But was this ever any sort of secret around here? Or maybe you were expecting a True Amarr , Sani Sabik to hail "LibertT, FraternitT, EqualitT?"? * smiles shaking her head again *

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Seems like she disagrees with many of your own values, Jade.

Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Sepherim

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In fact, if I may say so, Thrice Illustrious Leader of the Sani Sabik, your "support" of Lady Sarum can only harm her in all that has to do with the Empire.

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If that's the case, she should do things that displeases me instead of being involved with rumours of secret weapons and murderers of certain Joshua cultists and such... so far, I have no reason at all to be displeased. She is the ruler that I would be if in her place.

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Revan approves.

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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all I did was simply agree with a U'K pilot who was speaking the truth.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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You try to imply...

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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[b]show proof

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Why are you such venom-less snake, Revan Neferis?

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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show proof

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The existence of the thread itself.

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Originally by: Amun Khonsu

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Edited by: Amun Khonsu on 28/06/2010 15:59:44

Originally by: Alica Wildfire

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Edited by: Alica Wildfire on 28/06/2010 11:38:09

Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Move on minmatar before you find more enemies than you would like to have at this point.

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I'm not defending you. You are a damn slaver and I will always fight your kind. I do not know you enough that I can say I hate you but damn me, I'm triggerhappy enough to shoot you on sight anyway, Nefris.

And I'm also not defending Jade. I'm defending freedom and the right to love anyone you like. That the small loyality overwrites the bigger one.

So care about your own little stuff about blood rituals or whatever games you play and don't get in my line of fire when I'm fighting for my cause. I'm not happy where this puts me here, but I fight where fate puts me.

Truth is that Jade does not belong on this list. And with her, I assume, many more do not but I don't know. I definitly didn't ASK YOU FOR HELP OR JOVIAL ADVICE, slaver*****! So get out of my line of fire.

Please.

With a cherry on top. Or you get more blood by this than you can suck.

I'm talking to my own kind here, not to you.

But okay. I'll stop it here.
This is ridiculous.

Just one thing: bootlicking? In your dreams, Nefris, in your dreams. And I don't fear enemies. Not numbers not strength. I can watch myself well enough. More enemies more honour. More targets.

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Federal Investigations Agency cannot act as spokespersons for the Minmatar militia. A corporation that has to date 2,304 kills should not have someone claiming to have knowledge of the workings of militia, claim superiority over someone who has aided militia, or pretend to act in any remote capacity as spokespersons.

We know of no Minmatar corporation who uses terms like æSlaverÆ and are shocked to hear of you not only using such Amarrian words let alone at one of our best friends and closest allies.

Where were you and your vast corporation during the Great Battles of Kamela or Sosala? Where were you when we led vast fleets of soldiers to oust CVA from Providence? We do the job and you are claiming the credit?!

If there is any corporation(s) who has done more than any to advance the cause of Freedom for the Minmatar people it would be the Royal Order of Security Specialists (ROSS) among other corporations like Ice Fire Warriors and Valklear Guard (to name a few). With 12,748 kills against the Amarrian menace, and our organization of vast allied fleets which strike deep into Amarr High Sec, low sec and 0.0 space, we have much more right to speak on behalf of Militia than you.

Revan Neferis has been a close ally of the Minmatar Militia and fought with courage, bravery and skilled leadership against the Amarr and their allies (CVA) in 0.0. How dare you call her a slaver? We at ROSS (and our Militia allies) view this as totally unacceptable.

You do more to harm the Minmatar Militia than to help it, first, by thinking you have done such a grand job that you act as the mouthpiece of militia. Then, you call our allies æSalversÆ and 'Slaver*****'?!

Revan Neferis has been heavily involved with our operations and will continue to be. If you have issues with her (someone who has helped our cause more than your smacktalking corporation) then you have issues with not only ROSS but the entire Minmatar Militia.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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Amun makes some very inaccurate implications here.

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If you have issues with her (someone who has helped our cause more than your smacktalking corporation) then you have issues with not only ROSS but the entire Minmatar Militia.

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Originally by: Aria Dirser

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they deem themselves important and worthy of adulation.

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Originally by: Eran Mintor

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It is not my problem

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Originally by: Aria Dirser

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Mr. Eran Mintor,
You arent going to achieve anything with the two wenches.
They live in their own small world, were they deem themselves important and worthy of adulation.

They havenÆt yet realized the storm on their backs, the one that comes when their utility ceases (and that is happening now); they need to prove at every corner two things:
a)We are not slavers
b)We defend the cause of the Minmatar freedom fighters

The problem grows as they try desperately to grab at their allies hands begging ôplease, please Mister UÆK and Mister AAA donÆt hurt me! I promise I wonÆt try my revolutionary bullà with you, I promise that I will even set a corner for me and call it freespace but will obey to your every command!ö
This is the moment when they grovel and kiss the feet of their superiors.
Then they run to the IGSàa deep feeling of inferiority weighting heavily on their subconscious and start screaming ôMight makes right!ö or "Traitorous scum!" and "Lying Mongrel!",while at the same time training the sport of throwing all variants of insults regarding pigs and trolls.

The purpose however is to find any semblance of danger coming from any entity possible to be regarded as slaveràwhy?
Well, If they donÆt practice it, and find someone to bash for being a slaver, daddy UÆK will beat the crap out of them and purge like the annoyance they are from Providence( and always will be in any corner of space not so much because of their pilots, but more because of their incessant whining and bullsà).

As I said in the beginning Mr.Eran Mintor, Thank you, but no use in continuing.
DonÆt worry thought, the Minmatar traitours inside the TLF and the would be Matar friends are getting their due soon enough.

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Originally by: Revan Neferis

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Originally by: Jade Constantine

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In other regards I think it would do us all well to reflect on precisely what comment brought Sophie Starsparrow to this thread in the first place. As we can see from that link, she posted to support the assertion made by Pilot Naautica that my lover Revan Neferis was a slaver.

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As the very point of this thread was inaccuracy of that claim made by another person it seems precisely on-topic to consider one falsehood from Starsparrow laid upon other falsehoods we've have seen in the last pages.

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Originally by: Nauticaa

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Right my 2 isk.

No one Person or corp can claim to speak for a Militia simple as.

Also Revan has stated publicy she is a slaver so dont see why your aguring that,

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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I won't allow you to call Nauticaa a liar for speaking LIES without saying something about it. [ Because I'm a liar too]

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Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow

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This has absolutely nothing to do with what John did or did not say, and whether or not this is good enough for you. I said you posted something that you denied posting. I quoted it and have been called a liar repeatedly since. It really is this simply for us.

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