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Bad'Boy
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Posted - 2005.01.08 13:57:00 -
[391]
Edited by: Bad'Boy on 08/01/2005 13:56:48
missions sux tbh......
give my enyo 4th bonus plz(like HAC)
thx.
B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling
"Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.01.08 19:40:00 -
[392]
 Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: Arimas Talasko
Yes, AF's, including my boy the Retribution, smashes through level 3 agent missions like they are nothing
A Crusader can smash through lvl3 missions...
I bet with the new AB changes it could do it faster then a retribution.
Inty pilots like you and I are, bluntly, a bit better than average though. I've killed every other interceptor in my claw
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Vampire Blade
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Posted - 2005.01.08 19:51:00 -
[393]
maya, do you mean every other interceptor class, or every other interceptor you've encountered ever?
if it's the former, i deserve a cookie also \o\
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Alejandro Zapata
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Posted - 2005.01.08 21:27:00 -
[394]
Edited by: Alejandro Zapata on 08/01/2005 21:28:42
Quote:
3. Give the Retribution +1 mid slot and the Vengeance + 1 low slot. (I dont fly the other races but Im sure they need to be adjusted too.)
Rather than add slots to all the ships, just take away the Retribution's 5th Hi Slot, and place a second medium slot. This would still allow the ship to NPC hunt and PvP, while not making it, IMO, a super ship in comparison to the other AFs. It is the only AF that by design cannot fix an enemy in some way w/o lowering its speed potential. All the other ships, excluding the Wolf, have 3 or more medium slots.
Back on topic, I really like my new interceptor, and I am really going to like the new bonuses. Much thanks TomB. Can't wait.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.01.08 22:53:00 -
[395]
Originally by: Vampire Blade
maya, do you mean every other interceptor class, or every other interceptor you've encountered ever?
if it's the former, i deserve a cookie also \o\
Every other class. 1v1 :)
The Tarranis was the hardest, tbh
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Vampire Blade
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Posted - 2005.01.08 23:38:00 -
[396]
ya, only ever lost 2 other claw's 1 to a taranis with drones already out (curious as to how it would go) and my recent loss was to buhahahahaha's crow, turned off mwd too early, missed my range shooting range grr.
however, learnt some valuble lessons.
claw is a such a great ship, makes short work of all other interceptors when you apply some tactics and logic to combat and setups.
just a shame that with the crow and taranis, you don't need to do this. 99% of battles you can click the "i win" module ;(
i all honesty i'd love to see more falloff on the claw and a little boost to both autocannon tracking and damage.
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Meridius
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Posted - 2005.01.09 01:19:00 -
[397]
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Every other class. 1v1 :)
The Tarranis was the hardest, tbh
Tarani are the most predictable and imo, the easiest...that said, don't know what range you fight at...
Anyway, the Retribution needs +1mid, +1 turret, -1 low. I didn't sign up for this tanking bull****, i want a turret ship as amarr are suppose to be.
Other AF's such as wolf, enyo, harpy get 4 turrets + a launcher.
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Morikai Acler
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Posted - 2005.01.09 05:51:00 -
[398]
For the most part I like the changes. I didn't read through the whole thread, so I am asking for clarification on the warp speed changes. Does it mean regular frigs will still warp at 6au, non tackler ceptors will go 9, and tacklers will go 13.5 AU per second in warp. Or is it being changed to 2 au for frigs, 3au for ceptor, 4.5 au for tacklers? I havent been able to log in to test server for a bit because of heavy work schedule.
As far as AF's go, I can't really say much about the lack of mid slots on some ships. There are other ships in other classes that are in the same boat. I just take the view that rather than worrying about tackling with them, I hit fast and VERY hard. I personally would never underestimate an assault frig regardless of a midslot shortage. I underestimated a covert ops frig once and lost a crow because of it.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.01.09 15:10:00 -
[399]
Originally by: Meridius
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Every other class. 1v1 :)
The Tarranis was the hardest, tbh
Tarani are the most predictable and imo, the easiest...that said, don't know what range you fight at...
0-5km....
yep, beating them at their own game :)
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Dark Silver
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Posted - 2005.01.09 23:32:00 -
[400]
Edited by: Dark Silver on 10/01/2005 15:38:59
Quote:
1. Lost Interceptors getting upgraded - missing slots
Ares: +1 Med +25 CPU
Stiletto: +1 Lo +1 Missile
Raptor: +1 Hi
Malediction: +1 1 Hi +2 Missile
* These ships are damned as useless compared to their bigger brothers, they will still stay a little hybrid versions, not as focused on destroying as the other 4 are.
I always thought of my stiletto as a deadly ew platform, serves well from nos'ing and warp/scram enemies whilst mwd'ing
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Hakera
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Posted - 2005.01.09 23:55:00 -
[401]
Originally by: Dark Silver
I always thought of my stiletto as a deadly ew platform, serves well from nos'ing and warp/scram enemies whilst mwd'ing
I like my stiletto - big bad taranis cant do nuttin when she's jammed
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
BigJim Beef
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Posted - 2005.01.10 00:26:00 -
[402]
Originally by: Hakera
Originally by: Dark Silver
I always thought of my stiletto as a deadly ew platform, serves well from nos'ing and warp/scram enemies whilst mwd'ing
I like my stiletto - big bad taranis cant do nuttin when she's jammed
No faster way of getting 3 warp scramblers on a target either 
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Sennju Zensu
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Posted - 2005.01.10 11:27:00 -
[403]
these changes incoming soon ?? ... 
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Erucyll Turon
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Posted - 2005.01.10 11:50:00 -
[404]
your sig = deleted
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M0rr1gan
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Posted - 2005.01.12 14:21:00 -
[405]
Dunno if this ahas already been mentioned as i couldn't be arsed to read all 12 pages. The only things I would change from the proposed setups are :-
Ares - +5% thermal missile damage instead of the +5% falloff. Maybe loose the drone bay and fit a 3rd launcher.
Stilleto - Give it 2 launchers and an +5% explosive missile damage bonus instead of falloff.
Neither of these would make better missile boats then the caldari intys but at least they would be far more attractive to use.
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Selim
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Posted - 2005.01.13 10:49:00 -
[406]
Since you slow programmers are taking forever to get this onto TQ, I'm going to make a last plea for the Crusader. Don't give it a tracking bonus, its got enough damn tracking. Give it an optimal range bonus.
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.01.13 17:52:00 -
[407]
same could be said for the claw (especially since you're boosting autocannon tracking ANYWAY)
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Vampire Blade
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Posted - 2005.01.13 18:47:00 -
[408]
i'd think a speed/falloff bonus on the claw would work.
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Elve Sorrow
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Posted - 2005.01.13 19:18:00 -
[409]
Id go with an optimal range bonus for the Crusader aswell, since it tends to go longer range. For the Claw ive seen most people seem to use 200mm, so falloff would be best. (Might not be 200mm, but one of the shortrange projectiles anyway...)
/Elve
New Video out! Watch me!
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Meridius
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Posted - 2005.01.14 01:43:00 -
[410]
Originally by: Selim
Since you slow programmers are taking forever to get this onto TQ, I'm going to make a last plea for the Crusader. Don't give it a tracking bonus, its got enough damn tracking. Give it an optimal range bonus.
Yes please.
If you devs flew crusaders in pvp you would know that it is not used at a range that is really affected by tracking.
Please do not give it a useless bonus
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Phades
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Posted - 2005.01.14 16:25:00 -
[411]
Only real advantage that the assault frigs really have over the interceptors would be range in most cases. Adding the range bonus to the crusader would make it a really fast retribution with more playability wouldnt it?
I am curious though about the comments about how the autocannon and the pulse laser have enough tracking speed. I know they hit reliably against slow or large targets, but what about against a similar calibur ship with both moving at high speeds creating a very dramatic transversal speed when both ships are on an opposite crossing pattern or oribt. Personally i am rather confused as to the reasoning behind the beefing up of the outgoing firepower of the interceptors instead of giving them a more reliable working range and hit setup against even the smallest and fastest targets like other interceptors. I would view the assault ship in their current form an answer to smaller ships by bumping up their ability to take damage and put out damage. This would be opposed to creating a ship that can do exactly the same thing, but be able to always choose the distance to fight at, have more versitalty, avoid most (if not all) damage intended for it, while putting out comparable damage to assault frigs and larger ships.
Considering the class that the interceptor ship represents, i am surprised that their ship bonuses are not the sig bonus, tracking speed, fall off, and a mwd/AB bonus of some kind across the board. Granted many of those are redundant towards the base values of the ship and one already exists for all interceptors, but it would appear that there is too much blurring towards what which ships can/should do already.
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Julien Derida
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Posted - 2005.01.14 21:45:00 -
[412]
Originally by: Phades
Only real advantage that the assault frigs really have over the interceptors would be range in most cases. Adding the range bonus to the crusader would make it a really fast retribution with more playability wouldnt it?
I am curious though about the comments about how the autocannon and the pulse laser have enough tracking speed. I know they hit reliably against slow or large targets, but what about against a similar calibur ship with both moving at high speeds creating a very dramatic transversal speed when both ships are on an opposite crossing pattern or oribt. Personally i am rather confused as to the reasoning behind the beefing up of the outgoing firepower of the interceptors instead of giving them a more reliable working range and hit setup against even the smallest and fastest targets like other interceptors. I would view the assault ship in their current form an answer to smaller ships by bumping up their ability to take damage and put out damage. This would be opposed to creating a ship that can do exactly the same thing, but be able to always choose the distance to fight at, have more versitalty, avoid most (if not all) damage intended for it, while putting out comparable damage to assault frigs and larger ships.
Considering the class that the interceptor ship represents, i am surprised that their ship bonuses are not the sig bonus, tracking speed, fall off, and a mwd/AB bonus of some kind across the board. Granted many of those are redundant towards the base values of the ship and one already exists for all interceptors, but it would appear that there is too much blurring towards what which ships can/should do already.
Why are you for a fall-off bonus but against an optimal bonus? Surely they amount to almost the same thing?(Apart from on lasers admittedly)
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Artistic Director & Chief Diplomat - FRICK |
Slik
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Posted - 2005.01.14 22:14:00 -
[413]
Originally by: TomB
4. Warp Speed Increased - tacklers need faster warping
Ares, Stiletto, Raptor, Malediction: 4.5 Warp Speed Multiplier
Taranis, Claw, Crow, Crusader: 3.0 Warp Speed Multiplier
Normal Frigate: 2.0 Warp Speed Multiplier
As far as this change is concerned, I would prefer to see this as an inteceptor skill bonus... so:
Bonus: 50% Faster Warp per inteceptor skill level.
It just makes more sence.
Slik (slippery when wet) |
Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.01.14 22:41:00 -
[414]
Originally by: Phades
I am curious though about the comments about how the autocannon and the pulse laser have enough tracking speed. I know they hit reliably against slow or large targets, but what about against a similar calibur ship with both moving at high speeds creating a very dramatic transversal speed when both ships are on an opposite crossing pattern or oribt.
99/100 times you're dealing with a mutural web.
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
Phades
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Posted - 2005.01.15 05:51:00 -
[415]
I only suggested fall off, because many of the higher tracking weapons work more with the falloff range than the optimal and the overal working range is a touch short for a ship as fast as an interceptor. Also a falloff modifier doesnt affect the longer range weaponry as heavyily by comparison, but it does benefit from it. Extending the working range dramatically with a optimal range modifier would be more detrimental overal when considering role, intended or not.
Originally by: Maya Rkell
Originally by: Phades
I am curious though about the comments about how the autocannon and the pulse laser have enough tracking speed. I know they hit reliably against slow or large targets, but what about against a similar calibur ship with both moving at high speeds creating a very dramatic transversal speed when both ships are on an opposite crossing pattern or oribt.
99/100 times you're dealing with a mutural web.
Yeah i see your point, somehow i allowed myself to be dilluded into thinking that there was a possibility that a interceptor wouldnt be fitted to disrupt propulsion once in awhile. Perhaps a better alteration or ship class specific modification via skill for the interceptor ship would be a negation towards hostile disruption of the propulsion of the ship to allow it to function at high speeds. I think i remeber someone else suggesting that or something similar before.
I still think that the tech 2 ships, such as the interceptor, should be build around a philosiphy or purpose instead of the generalization that they appear to have currently. There are really only 4 examples of role defined ships, so far and i feel that narrows the scope of how diverse a encounter could be. Many of the ships seem to be a generic ship with a *insert perk here* rather than something designed to perform a specific task and unfortunatly only the industrial ships and mining barges perform the job noticably well in their intdended role and better than other ships attempting to play the role. Let the base class ships (frigate, cruiser, battleship) be good at different tasks or roles, but make the other ships perform more adequatly than those in only one area and not all of them at the same time.
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Yaman
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Posted - 2005.01.15 19:28:00 -
[416]
Ok I'm sorry but the interceptor is now worthless...
I was away for a month or two and I come back and you can't only use an oversized AB on it without a terrible penalty, but now that I figured a way to go really fast and keep a small signature radius....I find out you can't outrun missles in an orbit!
WHAT THE FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUULK?
That's wrong. I'm sorry. I can understand not wanting to have super rifters and such. That's fair ok. I mean let's put aside the fact that a complete noob probably wouldn't have one since training to use a micro auxiliary powercore took a little bit of time... I know it's a LOT quicker than training for interceptors. So fine. I'll take that. No more super frigates.
HOWEVER. The interceptors were fine. 100% fine. They didn't need to ruin them. What? Did too many people whine? Did some head hancho say ooh I hate these things... Why? Cuz they were too stupid to know how to counter them? It's really simple. NOS OR WEB. Or even drones. Interceptors were invincible only under certain conditions as are tanking battleships under certain conditions. Why not nerf them too? Hell why not make every ship obsolete? We can fly around in shuttles and mine and trade instead of fight.
The interceptor was a strategical ship and I'm sorry if someone important lost a battleship to one...whoever did, congrats you're a noob. (or just gambled and didn't put a nos/web on. oh well)
So now you can't outrun missles, you can't have a low signature radius and go fast... What's the point?
Ok, I really like challenges and I'll admit that. I've come up with some really insane setups (anyone who ever followed my research) and I'll do the math. I know how fast I need X ship to fly in order to dodge X turret or missle. I know the formulas and I take the time to work on this.
Ok and now I'm hearing rumors of the Malediction getting missles? NO. WRONG. I mean hey, I'm Amarr, I'll love it. I'll kick the crap outa things with it...but it's balanced without the extra high slot because it has the 3rd medium slot!
What are you on over there dev team???
Let me remind you how it's setup. Crusader = LOTS of damage due to extra slot, but less medium slots so not really for PVP. Malediction = One less hi slot so you do less damage because you have 3 med. slots for web and scramble.
YOU DO NOT want to put more damage on the Malediction because then you'll have them doing too much damage. I use these ships and I'm honestly saying it'll be unbalanced... well that is if you ever decide to make interceptors how they used to be.
Outrunning missles was the entire point... Did you know... SINCE I KNOW YOUR MATH apparently you don't... That an interceptor can fly without any mods or anything at 500m/s or so and dodge battleship turret fire! Did you know that? So with a simple afterburner using almost nothing in power/cap, you can dodge mostly all turrets. Just not missles of course.. So what's the point of using afterburners? Whats the point of MWDs? Hell you can forget the micro aux. powercore now because that's out the window. Waste of slot. It was there merely to accomodate the oversized AB. MAYBE if someone wanted stronger weapons but remember the stronger weapons have lower tracking speed and putting a powercore eats up a slot where you might want to put a tracking mod.
See, I know how to set things up. This game is like chess, it's like a puzzle. I figure things out. ...maybe, I guess I can't change the rules of missles :(
I give up. I don't care what you do. I'm going to find a way to fix it and make you change your rules again!
With this bullllllllllllcrap they put out now, it's over. It's done.
Plain and simple CCP..... FIX THE FREAKING INTERCEPTORS. (and missles!)
Or else all you'll see soon is a bunch of people tanking in scorpions...
carebare dev team.. bah
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Yaman
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Posted - 2005.01.15 19:42:00 -
[417]
woah I'm readin the dev's original post...
ARE YOU STUPID?
Congratulations, you made the Crusader worthless.
The only thing it will have on the malediction is a tiny bit more speed (which is worthless now because the only reason you want to go fast is to outrun missles as I pointed out in my previous post).
You really don't have a clue what you're doing do ya?
Are you new on the job?
You destroyed the purpose of speed by disallowing the ability to outrun missles in orbit. Now you don't need those oversized ABs or the MWDs.. You can just fly at normal speed to outrun most guns. Ok, a normal 1mn afterburner for frigate guns I guess. And yes you won't be able to outrun ALL guns, but for pvp combat concerns you can easily dodge the battleships..
SO... now that you've taken away the purpose of speed... You decided to do some other messed up things like ooh I know, 25% DAMAGE! instead of speed for the Malediction. WHAT? WHAT ARE YOU ON? The CRUSADER has the bonus for damage the Malediction for rate of fire. You do want DIVERSITY in the game, right? I mean you don't want all the ships to be the same...
The Malediction will be the best interceptor in the game now most likely. The Crow... well I know it was hot because it fired missles before but guess what... now the Malediction will so what's the point?? What? Speed? No. Guess again. The only time you're gonna see a significance for a few 100 m/s speed difference is when you're fighting interceptor vs. interceptor.
Congrats... you destroyed something I loved... I hope you're happy.
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Vampire Blade
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Posted - 2005.01.15 20:53:00 -
[418]
are you an alt of that alt that was flaming me for something totally irrelevent?
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Vardemis
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Posted - 2005.01.16 01:20:00 -
[419]
Since the recent changes to missiles and oversized abs I only lost one interceptor in battle. It was not to these changes, they are still great and do there job. When you cannot find a way to fit them properly now, its your problem. I fly most of the time interceptors. So far only caldari and amarr though. both are very nice and with the new changes I am about to add some Raptor and Malediction to my Flight Deck. To enjoy the diversity and usefulness they will offer.
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Selim
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Posted - 2005.01.16 07:18:00 -
[420]
In reply to Yamans post, if the devs read the later posts in this thread, they'd realise the Crusader should get an optimal range bonus. Which would give it a unique edge over the Malediction. Crusaders already the better tank anyway.
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