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Arrogant Bustard
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Posted - 2011.04.18 10:50:00 -
[571]
I'm finding it amazing that in a failure that involves a couple of trillion isk, so much effort and discussion is being put into a transaction that cost the bank 3 billion.
What am I missing here?
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2011.04.18 10:55:00 -
[572]
Originally by: Arrogant Bustard What am I missing here?
A face! Truly a case of trying to close the barn door after the horse have left. Of course the action is not totally futile or without reason, you close the barn door if have some horses left. But seriously, if this level of effort had been made prior to implosion the bank might not have failed. If each billion had been treated with respect and diligence, the trillion(s) would have done quite well. Thus it is reasonable that even three (3) billion should get this much attention. If you disagree, take up Sencnes offer: Pay off the three (3) billion debt instead of trolling.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves; Aptitude and intellect are needless here; 'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.18 16:33:00 -
[573]
Edited by: RAW23 on 18/04/2011 16:34:52 The issue here is being obscured somewhat by all the focus on Kwint. The current problem is the board's decision to zero account balances for all members of an alliance from which some members scammed EBANK, with justifications ranging from 'guilt by association' (SencneS - since you signed off on this one then you should probably absolve Kwint) to 'because we can' (which is really just a gloss on the guilt by association reason).
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 16:49:00 -
[574]
Wait until you find out that we zeroed the account balances of everyone that is a member of a defaulter's corporation, then you'll really get sand in your vagina.
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
Cyaxares II
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Posted - 2011.04.18 17:03:00 -
[575]
Originally by: RAW23 Edited by: RAW23 on 18/04/2011 16:34:52 The issue here is being obscured somewhat by all the focus on Kwint. The current problem is the board's decision to zero account balances for all members of an alliance from which some members scammed EBANK, with justifications ranging from 'guilt by association' (SencneS - since you signed off on this one then you should probably absolve Kwint) to 'because we can' (which is really just a gloss on the guilt by association reason).
if you look at the actual actions taken (and not at the fluffy words, fictional "account balances" and worthless "shares"), you'll see that EBANK has been treating everyone equally so far.
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Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 17:13:00 -
[576]
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSACSE Listing |
Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 17:22:00 -
[577]
I remember Kwint's post like it was yesterday.
whatever happened to that guy?
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSACSE Listing |
RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.18 17:45:00 -
[578]
Originally by: Ray McCormack Wait until you find out that we zeroed the account balances of everyone that is a member of a defaulter's corporation, then you'll really get upset.
I sort of assumed that would be the case. How are you working that out? A member now, a member at the time of the default, a member at some point, or some combination? Just corps or alliances as well?
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 18:00:00 -
[579]
Originally by: Ray McCormack Wait until you find out that we zeroed the account balances of everyone that is a member of a defaulter's corporation, then you'll really get upset.
I preferred my original post, it was more appropriate to the nature of the drama.
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2011.04.18 18:31:00 -
[580]
Originally by: Ray McCormack I preferred my original post, it was more appropriate to the nature of the drama.
But it was also trolling, ignorant, and obnoxiously sexist regardless of your pointless drama. Seems you like the drama though, gives you a chance to live up to all that your previous post contained.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves; Aptitude and intellect are needless here; 'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 18:53:00 -
[581]
Your point being (I presume you have one)?
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
Amarr Citizen 155
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.18 20:07:00 -
[582]
tldr; We're sorry that things worked out like they did and that we aren't internet spaceship bank liquidation experts. If we could go back and change things we would but we can't. Please feel free to continue you're debate.
There is no Kwint issue, there might have been but that was a long time ago. No clue why people are still chatting about that one especially since there's far too many "he said she said" as well as conversations NOT carried out on the forums.
There is no EBANK Board of Directors and hasn't been for a long time. There is simply a couple of idiots who should have donated all the isk to Chribba a long time ago but instead chose to see it out. These guys are obviously nuts. There's also a third idiot that continues to fight the forum war, this role is his choice and not one that was assigned to him. So yeah, just a bunch of idiots.
If you were in a corp or alliance at the time that the corp or alliance defaulted/scammed (and you are still in that corp/alliance), then sadly there is no way of knowing for sure if you are an alt of an asshat or simply in the wrong corp/alliance at the wrong time. You guys can debate that if you want but it is what it is and it isn't changing. Aside from potentially giving isk to individuals that have already stolen billions, this was really the only option.
The plan is to finish handing out the rest of the shares in the next week and then start payouts. No I don't have a date for you and I don't have any written policy or any other nonsense. EBANK is dead and has been for a long time. I just hope everyone can eventually move past this.
I feel like everyone should know this information already but at the same time I read some of your replies and it seems like there are a few individuals who think ebank is still alive... it isn't. As far as mistakes made, sure there have been a ton of things that could and should have been done differently. Sadly, the last time I checked Brock had not yet perfected his time machine therefore we can't go back and change the past.
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Scramilton
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2011.04.19 02:29:00 -
[583]
guess you guys haven't gotten to the "S"s yet...been patiently waiting for my 3.7 bil or whatever's left of it. I appreciate everyone's efforts.
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Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 04:21:00 -
[584]
[04:17:21] EBANK Amarr155 > but what i meant is im done handing out shares [04:18:05] EBANK Amarr155 > its just too bad that Ray' slow ass isnt done [04:18:22] Brock Nelson > ray cares? [04:19:22] EBANK Amarr155 > you should post giving him **** in the ebank thread
Too lazy to start giving Ray some **** so I just posted the convo
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSACSE Listing |
Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 05:12:00 -
[585]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 you're debate.
your
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.19 09:22:00 -
[586]
Edited by: RAW23 on 19/04/2011 09:23:45
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 tldr; We're sorry that things worked out like they did and that we aren't internet spaceship bank liquidation experts. If we could go back and change things we would but we can't. Please feel free to continue you're debate. ... I feel like everyone should know this information already but at the same time I read some of your replies and it seems like there are a few individuals who think ebank is still alive... it isn't. As far as mistakes made, sure there have been a ton of things that could and should have been done differently. Sadly, the last time I checked Brock had not yet perfected his time machine therefore we can't go back and change the past.
The thing is, you acknowledge making mistakes and say you would go back and change them if you could but you then go on following exactly the same patterns of behaviour that led to those mistakes in the first place.
Quote:
If you were in a corp or alliance at the time that the corp or alliance defaulted/scammed (and you are still in that corp/alliance), then sadly there is no way of knowing for sure if you are an alt of an asshat or simply in the wrong corp/alliance at the wrong time. You guys can debate that if you want but it is what it is and it isn't changing. Aside from potentially giving isk to individuals that have already stolen billions, this was really the only option.
No debate, no discussion, no honest attempt to check, balance or improve your own ideas or to engage in constructive dialogue. The 'mistakes were made but let's move past that' line doesn't wash when you continue to act like this. And frankly, the idea that you would rather deprive completely innocent people of their isk than allow a defaulter to get their hands on some (better 100 innocent people should hang than one guilty one go free, right?) seems like the application of Ray's perverse 'troll the customers' forum attitude to actual policy, especially after all the rigmarole about the submission of API keys precisely so you could avoid paying out to defaulters.
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2011.04.19 09:34:00 -
[587]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 So yeah, just a bunch of idiots.
Thou shall not meddle with idiots. It says right there, in the Bible, Luke 23:34. Unless you exploit them, of course.
Black Sun Empire |
mine4ever
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Posted - 2011.04.19 10:25:00 -
[588]
Ive received my share so thanks Ray, stupid question but what now do i do with them no i have them, will i get a income from them or can i sell them on ?
ive never had shares before
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Zcorm Narwar
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Posted - 2011.04.19 10:37:00 -
[589]
Originally by: mine4ever Ive received my share so thanks Ray, stupid question but what now do i do with them no i have them, will i get a income from them or can i sell them on ?
ive never had shares before
All shares can be sent to me (Zcorm Narwar) and I will then proceed to turn them into isk for your convenience.
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mine4ever
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Posted - 2011.04.19 10:49:00 -
[590]
Originally by: Zcorm Narwar
Originally by: mine4ever Ive received my share so thanks Ray, stupid question but what now do i do with them no i have them, will i get a income from them or can i sell them on ?
ive never had shares before
All shares can be sent to me (Zcorm Narwar) and I will then proceed to turn them into isk for your convenience.
:)
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Amarr Citizen 155
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 15:27:00 -
[591]
Originally by: RAW23
The thing is, you acknowledge making mistakes and say you would go back and change them if you could but you then go on following exactly the same patterns of behaviour that led to those mistakes in the first place.
Umm, I think we might be talking about different mistakes because the ones I'm talking about could only be repeated if we restarted this whole process.
Originally by: RAW23
No debate, no discussion, no honest attempt to check, balance or improve your own ideas or to engage in constructive dialogue. The 'mistakes were made but let's move past that' line doesn't wash when you continue to act like this. And frankly, the idea that you would rather deprive completely innocent people of their isk than allow a defaulter to get their hands on some (better 100 innocent people should hang than one guilty one go free, right?) seems like the application of Ray's perverse 'troll the customers' forum attitude to actual policy, especially after all the rigmarole about the submission of API keys precisely so you could avoid paying out to defaulters.
There's no need to do anymore debating, discussing, checking, balancing, or improving at this point. It's over. It's done. There is no EBANK organization. The shares have nearly all been handed out and the next step is to send out isk. What exactly are you wanting us to go back and do? How about you get off your "greater than thou" high horse of perfection and tell me exactly what it is you think we need to go back and redo. You're no better than any of the other trolls at this point and I think you simply like to see your own text (hear yourself talk).
Prove me wrong. Tell me wtf you want me to do over. If you want to continue to point out **** that is over and done with and can't be undone then go ahead. You can join the ranks of all the other guys who like to continue to point out the obvious and claim that it's some new refreshing point of view.
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Roguehalo
Caldari Roguehalo Ship Brokers
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Posted - 2011.04.19 15:56:00 -
[592]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
Originally by: RAW23
The thing is, you acknowledge making mistakes and say you would go back and change them if you could but you then go on following exactly the same patterns of behaviour that led to those mistakes in the first place.
Umm, I think we might be talking about different mistakes because the ones I'm talking about could only be repeated if we restarted this whole process.
Originally by: RAW23
No debate, no discussion, no honest attempt to check, balance or improve your own ideas or to engage in constructive dialogue. The 'mistakes were made but let's move past that' line doesn't wash when you continue to act like this. And frankly, the idea that you would rather deprive completely innocent people of their isk than allow a defaulter to get their hands on some (better 100 innocent people should hang than one guilty one go free, right?) seems like the application of Ray's perverse 'troll the customers' forum attitude to actual policy, especially after all the rigmarole about the submission of API keys precisely so you could avoid paying out to defaulters.
There's no need to do anymore debating, discussing, checking, balancing, or improving at this point. It's over. It's done. There is no EBANK organization. The shares have nearly all been handed out and the next step is to send out isk. What exactly are you wanting us to go back and do? How about you get off your "greater than thou" high horse of perfection and tell me exactly what it is you think we need to go back and redo. You're no better than any of the other trolls at this point and I think you simply like to see your own text (hear yourself talk).
Prove me wrong. Tell me wtf you want me to do over. If you want to continue to point out **** that is over and done with and can't be undone then go ahead. You can join the ranks of all the other guys who like to continue to point out the obvious and claim that it's some new refreshing point of view.
All you gotta do m8 is gopher this gopher that and gopher the other
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 15:56:00 -
[593]
We could also braid each others' hair, how ****ing fun would that be!?
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
Brock Nelson
Caldari T2 Technologies Unlimited SRS.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 16:10:00 -
[594]
Sweet! I'll bring hot chocolates!
Investor Relation | IPO Doc | BSACSE Listing |
Elise DarkStar
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Posted - 2011.04.19 16:33:00 -
[595]
Yes, this is over. Finally. Thankfully.
Maybe when Ray and AC155 start their internet spaceship bank liquidation service we can question their professional credentials, but for now this **** is over.
Hallelujah.
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RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.19 16:36:00 -
[596]
Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155
There's no need to do anymore debating, discussing, checking, balancing, or improving at this point. It's over. It's done. ... What exactly are you wanting us to go back and do? How about you get off your "greater than thou" high horse of perfection and tell me exactly what it is you think we need to go back and redo. You're no better than any of the other trolls at this point and I think you simply like to see your own text (hear yourself talk).
You ask me what I think you should go back and redo whilst at the same time saying everything is over and done. The only suggestion I'm making at this point is the rather radical idea of honouring your obligations and not screwing over everyone who has been in the same alliance as a defaulter.
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Florestan Bronstein
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Posted - 2011.04.19 16:54:00 -
[597]
Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 19/04/2011 16:55:07
Originally by: Ray McCormack We could also braid each others' hair, how ****ing fun would that be!?
excellent idea
Quote: for they have a custom which is as follows;--whenever they are about to put their lives in peril, then they attend to the arrangement of their hair.
(long hair is somewhat impractical in battle and braiding it tightly did supposedly give some additional protection to the head)
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Ray McCormack
Nordar Innovations.
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Posted - 2011.04.19 17:21:00 -
[598]
Originally by: RAW23 You ask me what I think you should go back and redo whilst at the same time saying everything is over and done.
Wait, are you for real or are you really just that ****ing stupid? Never mind, I know the answer...
I agree that shooting people with a headache in the head is a good idea, because it will stop their headaches. |
RAW23
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Posted - 2011.04.19 17:36:00 -
[599]
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 19/04/2011 16:56:21
Originally by: Ray McCormack We could also braid each others' hair, how ****ing fun would that be!?
excellent idea
Originally by: Demaratos for they have a custom which is as follows;--whenever they are about to put their lives in peril, then they attend to the arrangement of their hair.
(long hair is somewhat impractical in battle and braiding it tightly did supposedly give some additional protection to the head)
Ah! Ray is on a Greek trip. That explains a lot.
Originally by: Thucydides
The Athenians to the Melians:
Well, then, we Athenians will use no flue words; we will not go out of our way to prove at length that we have a right to rule, because we overthrew the Persians; or that we attack you now because we are suffering any injury at your hands. We should not convince you if we did; nor must you expect to convince us by arguing that, although a colony of the Lacedaemonians, you have taken no part in their expeditions, or that you have never done us any wrong. But you and we should say what we really think, and aim only at what is possible, for we both alike know that into the discussion of human affairs the question of justice only enters where the pressure of necessity is equal, and that the powerful exact what they can, and the weak grant what they must. ... The Melians refused the Athenian demand to surrender and eventually their city fell. ... The Athenians thereupon put to death all who were of military age, and made slaves of the women and children. They then colonised the island, sending thither 500 settlers of their own.
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trance atlas
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Posted - 2011.04.19 21:02:00 -
[600]
Originally by: RAW23
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 19/04/2011 16:56:21
Originally by: Ray McCormack We could also braid each others' hair, how ****ing fun would that be!?
excellent idea
Originally by: Demaratos for they have a custom which is as follows;--whenever they are about to put their lives in peril, then they attend to the arrangement of their hair.
(long hair is somewhat impractical in battle and braiding it tightly did supposedly give some additional protection to the head)
Ah! Ray is on a Greek trip. That explains a lot.
Originally by: Thucydides
The Athenians to the Melians:
Well, then, we Athenians will use no flue words; we will not go out of our way to prove at length that we have a right to rule, because we overthrew the Persians; or that we attack you now because we are suffering any injury at your hands. We should not convince you if we did; nor must you expect to convince us by arguing that, although a colony of the Lacedaemonians, you have taken no part in their expeditions, or that you have never done us any wrong. But you and we should say what we really think, and aim only at what is possible, for we both alike know that into the discussion of human affairs the question of justice only enters where the pressure of necessity is equal, and that the powerful exact what they can, and the weak grant what they must. ... The Melians refused the Athenian demand to surrender and eventually their city fell. ... The Athenians thereupon put to death all who were of military age, and made slaves of the women and children. They then colonised the island, sending thither 500 settlers of their own.
2 history lessons in 1 thread :swoon: my hivemind is about to explode
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