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[EBANK] The long, drawn-out death wail

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Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.27 08:17:00 - [181] Four days to more forum drama... Verified - 1,384,540,510,092.03 Write Off - 544,217,847,077.67 Zero - 10b+ Follow My EBANK Chatter
Breaker77 Gallente Reclamation Industries	Posted - 2010.11.27 14:31:00 - [182] Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 We are currently waiting on CCP to unlock BPOs so we can sell them, we are experiencing a bug that shows the bpos as locked down in the hangar but will not allow us to propose unlock votes because the system says they are not currently locked. Ah, this bug which I asked about almost a month ago. Highly annoying, but there is a workaround for it in that thread that halfway works. I'll also send it though evemail. It's worth a shot instead of waiting on a petition.
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.27 18:56:00 - [183] Ray, I'm somewhat interested in buying the ebank back end software. Has there been any discussion on selling it? Or open sourcing it? -Kal
WNxWolfy	Posted - 2010.11.28 01:50:00 - [184] Originally by: WNxWolfy Still waiting for my API to be verified, which I have provided at least three times now.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.28 06:49:00 - [185] Originally by: Kalrand I'm somewhat interested in buying the ebank back end software. Has there been any discussion on selling it? Or open sourcing it? You can purchase the source for hundreds of billions or negotiate a hosted solution. Follow My EBANK Chatter
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.29 01:40:00 - [186] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Kalrand I'm somewhat interested in buying the ebank back end software. Has there been any discussion on selling it? Or open sourcing it? You can purchase the source for hundreds of billions or negotiate a hosted solution. That sounds a bit higher than what I had in mind.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.29 05:05:00 - [187] Originally by: Kalrand That sounds a bit higher than what I had in mind. No doubt. Follow My EBANK Chatter
Mme Pinkerton United Engineering Services	Posted - 2010.11.29 06:56:00 - [188] Edited by: Mme Pinkerton on 29/11/2010 07:03:24 Originally by: Kalrand That sounds a bit higher than what I had in mind. He's only acting in the best interests of his depositors. Clearly, no sale > sale at a price he doesn't like. edit: If Ray thinks that the range he quoted is a realistic valuation of the EBANK website (which doesn't really matter in the situation at hand as selling it for even 1 ISK would be better for EBANK'S creditors than not selling it at all), Mr. Horizontal has my full sympathies (and 90b wouldn't have been more than a token amount for compensation of his work).
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.29 15:05:00 - [189] Originally by: Mme Pinkerton (which doesn't really matter in the situation at hand as selling it for even 1 ISK would be better for EBANK'S creditors than not selling it at all) Clearly you've thought this through... Follow My EBANK Chatter
Minerva Vulcan Caldari Ctrl Alt Elites	Posted - 2010.11.29 16:07:00 - [190] I believe this is where it's customary to swoop in and offer 1.01 ISK. 1.01 ISK!

Amarr Citizen 155 Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.29 20:14:00 - [191] Not sure what all you are talking about considering I own the source. My name was Neo in several former lives. Ray is way off anyways, its several trillion not several hundred billion.
Liberty Eternal	Posted - 2010.11.29 20:22:00 - [192] Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 Not sure what all you are talking about considering I own the source. My name was Neo in several former lives. Ray is way off anyways, its several trillion not several hundred billion. This is the part where a legal hero steps up and tells you you're about to face a class-action lawsuit
RAW23	Posted - 2010.11.29 21:37:00 - [193] I have no real idea about how intellectual property law applies to source code but I would assume that the code counts a someone's rl property. I'm not sure it's reasonable to expect whoever does own it (who does btw?) to liquidate out of game assets as part of the liquidation of EBANK, although I guess there is a more complicated question if developers were paid for their work on it in isk as part of an ingame arrangement. Does EBANK consider this an EBANK asset or a personal real asset?
thelung187 Guiding Hand Social Club Dystopia Alliance	Posted - 2010.11.30 00:08:00 - [194] Originally by: Amarr Citizen 155 Not sure what all you are talking about considering I own the source. My name was Neo in several former lives. Ray is way off anyways, its several trillion not several hundred billion. Your software is not worth the USD:PLEX exchange-equivalent of several trillion. Get over yourself tbh
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.30 02:11:00 - [195] Originally by: RAW23 I have no real idea about how intellectual property law applies to source code but I would assume that the code counts a someone's rl property. I'm not sure it's reasonable to expect whoever does own it (who does btw?) to liquidate out of game assets as part of the liquidation of EBANK, although I guess there is a more complicated question if developers were paid for their work on it in isk as part of an ingame arrangement. Does EBANK consider this an EBANK asset or a personal real asset? I just want to make it clear that I don't consider the EBANK software an EBANK asset. I don't think the EBANK board wants to continue operating, and I'd hate to see the software lay in waste. That's really all. I could tell that Ray's "hundreds of billions" was really just his way of saying no. And I can respect that decision considering how much hard work I'm sure went into everything.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.30 04:58:00 - [196] Originally by: RAW23 Does EBANK consider this an EBANK asset or a personal real asset? It is an EBANK asset. I'll clarify our intentions with it, which are threefold. Sell the source code. We would part with the source code for a considerable sum, hundreds of billions. This is the only working, tried and tested banking software in the EVE universe. It was developed over a couple of years and literally months of man hours were spent on it. And considering the financial possibilities I list below, we would be foolish to sell ourselves short here. Sell hosted solutions. We will offer hosted solutions on our own infrastructure for a monthly fee; as well as provide setup, support and customisations. Sell obfuscated code. We are contemplating selling obfuscated code for hosting on your own infrastructure; again we would provide setup, support and customisations for a fee. Any and all proceeds from sales will be issued as dividends to shareholders once costs were covered. Service fees will go to those performing the service. Follow My EBANK Chatter
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.30 06:25:00 - [197] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: RAW23 Does EBANK consider this an EBANK asset or a personal real asset? It is an EBANK asset. I'll clarify our intentions with it, which are threefold. Sell the source code. We would part with the source code for a considerable sum, hundreds of billions. This is the only working, tried and tested banking software in the EVE universe. It was developed over a couple of years and literally months of man hours were spent on it. And considering the financial possibilities I list below, we would be foolish to sell ourselves short here. Sell hosted solutions. We will offer hosted solutions on our own infrastructure for a monthly fee; as well as provide setup, support and customisations. Sell obfuscated code. We are contemplating selling obfuscated code for hosting on your own infrastructure; again we would provide setup, support and customisations for a fee. Any and all proceeds from sales will be issued as dividends to shareholders once costs were covered. Service fees will go to those performing the service. Since it now appears that you are serious, I think you may want to account for the fact that your perspective sales would likely come from the audience of this forum. An auction would probably be the only way to fully realize the highest likely price.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.30 07:05:00 - [198] Originally by: Kalrand An auction would probably be the only way to fully realize the highest likely price. Unlikely, also I see more of a market with large alliances and corporations looking to add another aspect of gameplay to their offerings than MD. As it goes, the best offer on the table is for us to resell the platform ourselves, not to auction of that ability to someone else (well, not for an untidy sum anyway). Follow My EBANK Chatter
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.30 07:30:00 - [199] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Kalrand An auction would probably be the only way to fully realize the highest likely price. Unlikely, also I see more of a market with large alliances and corporations looking to add another aspect of gameplay to their offerings than MD. As it goes, the best offer on the table is for us to resell the platform ourselves, not to auction of that ability to someone else (well, not for an untidy sum anyway). Have you ballparked what the service fees would be?
Dasola Minmatar	Posted - 2010.11.30 09:35:00 - [200] Edited by: Dasola on 30/11/2010 09:36:12 Originally by: Ray McCormack Sell the source code. We would part with the source code for a considerable sum, hundreds of billions. This is the only working, tried and tested banking software in the EVE universe. It was developed over a couple of years and literally months of man hours were spent on it. And considering the financial possibilities I list below, we would be foolish to sell ourselves short here. Why would anyone buy it, clearly it didint prevent massive corporate theft and we all know result, bank is closeing as results of it. Bank didint even get alarm about misconduct of one leader of it, until it was too late to do anything about it. So clearly theres no proof your bank software works.

RAW23	Posted - 2010.11.30 14:32:00 - [201] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: RAW23 Does EBANK consider this an EBANK asset or a personal real asset? It is an EBANK asset. I'll clarify our intentions with it, which are threefold. Sell the source code. We would part with the source code for a considerable sum, hundreds of billions. This is the only working, tried and tested banking software in the EVE universe. It was developed over a couple of years and literally months of man hours were spent on it. And considering the financial possibilities I list below, we would be foolish to sell ourselves short here. Sell hosted solutions. We will offer hosted solutions on our own infrastructure for a monthly fee; as well as provide setup, support and customisations. Sell obfuscated code. We are contemplating selling obfuscated code for hosting on your own infrastructure; again we would provide setup, support and customisations for a fee. Any and all proceeds from sales will be issued as dividends to shareholders once costs were covered. Service fees will go to those performing the service. Is the plan, then, to keep EBANK operating on a skeleton basis after all the ingame assets have been liquidated in order to manage the proceeds from this last asset, with payments being made indefinitely to EBANK shareholders? Or do you forsee a final cut off point at which the administration of the source code income will be shut down as well and the code sold to the highest bidder, even if the income from the sale is negligible?
Minerva Vulcan Caldari Ctrl Alt Elites	Posted - 2010.11.30 15:52:00 - [202] Well, tomorrow is D-Day. D, of course, more than likely standing for drama.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.30 16:19:00 - [203] Originally by: Dasola clearly it didint prevent massive corporate theft and we all know result, bank is closeing as results of it. Bank didint even get alarm about misconduct of one leader of it, until it was too late to do anything about it. That's because it is banking and not accounting software. Originally by: Kalrand Have you ballparked what the service fees would be? We did, but there are many factors that contribute to our final cost, so it will be dealt with on a case by case basis. The number one factor being how much you can afford and are willing to pay for it. We have a minimum figure in mind that makes the effort worth our time, and I'm sure the renter has a maximum figure in mind that makes it worth their time. Where we meet depends on how well each party negotiates. Originally by: RAW23 Is the plan, then, to keep EBANK operating on a skeleton basis after all the ingame assets have been liquidated in order to manage the proceeds from this last asset, with payments being made indefinitely to EBANK shareholders? Or do you foresee a final cut off point at which the administration of the source code income will be shut down as well and the code sold to the highest bidder, even if the income from the sale is negligible? **** me you ask some inane questions sometimes. The answer is whatever combination of things achieves what we want. Follow My EBANK Chatter
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.30 17:30:00 - [204] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Kalrand Have you ballparked what the service fees would be? We did, but there are many factors that contribute to our final cost, so it will be dealt with on a case by case basis. The number one factor being how much you can afford and are willing to pay for it. We have a minimum figure in mind that makes the effort worth our time, and I'm sure the renter has a maximum figure in mind that makes it worth their time. Where we meet depends on how well each party negotiates. I was looking for a very broad range. Saying "depending on the services provided" is a very fair way to explain the concept of negotiation and why a broad range is there. AC stated above that she owns the code. Which of you is the actual person making decisions wrt this asset? Have you considered asking for a percentage of assets under management as a service fee?
Carnagge	Posted - 2010.11.30 17:48:00 - [205] Originally by: Kalrand Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Kalrand Have you ballparked what the service fees would be? We did, but there are many factors that contribute to our final cost, so it will be dealt with on a case by case basis. The number one factor being how much you can afford and are willing to pay for it. We have a minimum figure in mind that makes the effort worth our time, and I'm sure the renter has a maximum figure in mind that makes it worth their time. Where we meet depends on how well each party negotiates. Have you considered asking for a percentage of assets under management as a service fee? I'm pretty sure they will consider anything as long as its worth there time. Which was already stated...
Kalrand GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.11.30 19:05:00 - [206] Originally by: Carnagge Originally by: Kalrand Have you considered asking for a percentage of assets under management as a service fee? I'm pretty sure they will consider anything as long as its worth there time. Which was already stated... Often times Ray's approach is to offer to do something at an unreasonable price to deflect the criticism. This is how I took his initial offer to sell the Ebank back end for "hundreds of billions" of isk. What that told me is that it wasn't genuinely for sale. Instead, the Ebank board would rater sell the bank back end as a service, which is fine, but something he could have just come out and said.
Ray McCormack Nordar Innovations.	Posted - 2010.11.30 20:01:00 - [207] **** me George, do you want the software or not? Let's stop brandishing broadswords in public and if you're serious about starting up the Goonbank of public stupidity my mail address is in my bio. Follow My EBANK Chatter
thelung187 Guiding Hand Social Club Dystopia Alliance	Posted - 2010.11.30 20:17:00 - [208] Edited by: thelung187 on 30/11/2010 20:17:27 Originally by: Ray McCormack **** me George, do you want the software or not? Let's stop brandishing broadswords in public and if you're serious about starting up the Goonbank of public stupidity my mail address is in my bio. He might be more receptive if you didn't sound like an utterly condescending jerkoff
Carnagge	Posted - 2010.11.30 20:21:00 - [209] Edited by: Carnagge on 30/11/2010 20:24:37 Originally by: Kalrand Originally by: Carnagge Originally by: Kalrand Have you considered asking for a percentage of assets under management as a service fee? I'm pretty sure they will consider anything as long as its worth there time. Which was already stated... Often times Ray's approach is to offer to do something at an unreasonable price to deflect the criticism. This is how I took his initial offer to sell the Ebank back end for "hundreds of billions" of isk. What that told me is that it wasn't genuinely for sale. Instead, the Ebank board would rater sell the bank back end as a service, which is fine, but something he could have just come out and said. An assumption. Assumptions are great ways to do business. Instead. Ray can you come up with a clear and definitive number that you would want to sell it for? Thank you. (just an example, I will resume communication 101 later on this thread).
Lanais Suleia	Posted - 2010.11.30 21:38:00 - [210] Originally by: thelung187 Edited by: thelung187 on 30/11/2010 20:17:27 Originally by: Ray McCormack **** me George, do you want the software or not? Let's stop brandishing broadswords in public and if you're serious about starting up the Goonbank of public stupidity my mail address is in my bio. He might be more receptive if you didn't sound like an utterly condescending jerkoff It's the only language goons understand.



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