Yes, but it didn't really have any effect on non-PLEX commodities, or if it did that effect was buried under everything else (rise and fall of minerals, tech, etc). That's my point - PLEX is the only item in Eve that responds in any perceptible way to that sort of inflationary pressure.

Bounties and mission payouts generate isk from nothing, while activities such as running wormhole sites do not generate isk. You may thing, wait, running wormhole sites makes more isk than missions or ratting. How can it not be a faucet? Well, sleepers in wormhole sites do not pay bounties they drop items, those items, such as nano ribbons, are then sold to other players for isk. No new isk is generated, it is just existing isk changing hands.

Velocity of money seems to have an awfully minimal if not non-existent effect on inflation of non-PLEX goods in this game though.

Back to sinks & faucets:
something that really disturbed me was the ISK sink reductions of FW tiers (75%)which once where taken out had an immediate effect on PLEX prices. Further more I still argue that in the long term (2 years) those ISK reductions per item will have a net negitive in the LP sink eventhough in the short term alot of ISK was taken out of the economy.

Your earlier post discussing replacing mission reward ISK with LP has merit but due to the lingering effects of reduced ISK LP from the FW bonanza LP value is espeically suffering. A way to counter that would be addition of new valuable LP items. Furthermore the FW LP bonanza had a very definite deflationary effect on items such as Fleet Issue stabbers and probably all faction ammos except Amar faction crystals.

I'm mildly curious how much the FW bonanza contributed to deflation too.

FW Tiers did nothing to alter the "sinkiness" of an LP.
Tier 1: 1000 LP + 1000 ISK = 1 Item. => 1000 ISK sunk for 1000 LP.
Tier 5: 250LP + 1000 ISK = 1 Item => 1000LP + 1000 ISK = 4 Items. => 1000 ISK sunk or 1000 LP.

Each LP takes the same amount of ISK down the drain with it when it's used, and I didn't see any evidence of high tiers resulting in massive hoards of unspent LP being socked away because "I only needed the one item."

The market value of the resulting item is entirely irrelevant to the amount of ISK that LP stores sink.


The price of a product decreasing because the cost to produce that product has decreased is not "deflation," it's the normal workings of the market. Just like cruiser prices didn't rise (aren't rising) after Retribution because of "inflation," they rose (are rising) because the cost to produce them has increased.

If they'd left it in long enough to completely shatter the markets, perhaps.(snip) .

Malarky 4 items where introduced where there was 1 before for the same price as 1. Unless demand is perfectly elastic we're looking at a significant ISK sink reduction over time. I would not doubt that there is some elasticity found in cheaper FW items but I think its fairly rigid

If demand were inelastic,

I agree with your implication that the velocity of money affects the price of PLEX and the extreme increase thanks to the 'summer of FW lp bonanza ' went to prove that. I think this discussion though is better discussed in the thread I put forth about the PLEX intervention.

Show me how consumer demand for implants has increased? or especially why it will in the future?

FW Tiers did nothing to alter the "sinkiness" of an LP.
Tier 1: 1000 LP + 1000 ISK = 1 Item. => 1000 ISK sunk for 1000 LP.
Tier 5: 250LP + 1000 ISK = 1 Item => 1000LP + 1000 ISK = 4 Items. => 1000 ISK sunk or 1000 LP.

Show me how consumer demand for implants has increased? or especially why it will in the future?

Your numbers are a bit off though, the old formula looked more like:
Tier 1: 4000 LP + 4000 ISK = 1 item
Tier 2: 2000 LP + 2000 ISK = 1 item
Tier 3: 1000 LP + 1000 ISK = 1 item
Tier 4: 500 LP + 500 ISK = 1 item
Tier 5: 250 LP + 250 ISK = 1 item

That is why people cashed out at T5 or if desperate T4. It's why the new tiers don't change either the LP or ISK in the stores, only how much LP you gain for doing tasks. You could easily make 4000 isk/lp in the old system, while now 1000+isk/lp is great*.

*Haven't looked at the prices across the entire market recently, but that's what it was last I looked. Of course, some items might still give high payouts, I'm talking general items without crashing the market.

Doesn't matter. The ISK is sunk at the point of item creation. What happens to the item later is irrelevant.

So demand doesn't matter?

Bump manufacturing fees in highsec. If my estimates are correct, changing it from the current negligible system to a mere quarter percent of estimated value of the production job is worth upwards of 3-6T isk/month in sinks while having negligible effects on the sale price of items between players.

Different approach: Eliminate isk payouts and time bonuses for missions, replace them with an LP payout instead. This approaches the problem by both removing a faucet (roughly ~6T/mo by Diagoras' old numbers) and adding a sink (the isk required to spend that LP, which is typically 1000 isk per LP on the most convenient cashout items.) This also allows them to dial mission income around a bit, depending on the rate that they replace the isk payouts with LP at. For example, if they replace it at a 1000 isk per LP rate, then a mission runner would have to buy items with that LP that are worth a final sale price of 1000 isk/LP to maintain his previous income...but could increase his income by taking a more thoughtful approach to redeeming his LP than "buy as many implants as possible and dump to buy orders."

The specific numbers don't matter. All that matters is the fact that the ratio of ISK sunk to LP converted stays constant within any given LP store offer.

Do you have any suggestions for switching over wormhole items to counter that source?

What do you mean by that?

So unless I'm off base here you're the next CSM chair ya?

What do you consider an appropriate growth in the isk supply?

If your two suggestions were implemented we would still have ~18T or more coming in per month.

Do you have any suggestions for switching over wormhole items to counter that source?

Eliminating bluebooks would require further iteration on wormholes to add value to replace it...at least some of it. Wormholes aren't my forte and I'm not really sure how much of their income is from the bluebooks vs other items, but an outright and complete removal is probably inadvisable. Partial replacement might be a welcome change from the wormhole crowd, but it's not something I've thought too much about as far as concrete ideas. ;)

If you lose a Hulk you lose a ship but you don't lose isk so the total amount of money in the game stays the same and is even increased by the insurance payout. I really don't see how you can disagree with me on that. :P