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Ralinastrife
Lost Dawn Chaos Stealth Syndicate
17
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 14:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
For instance..lets say someone got pissed at me and placed a bounty on me. i have cheap implants or none at all in. I use a cheap ship and a friend blows me up. he gets the bounty and gives me half or whatever. Lets just say a bounty was on me for 20mil and the total cost of me losing a ship podded etc came to 10 mil. That means we came out on top and basically just laughed in the face of whoever put a bounty on me.
how is this a good system? if i place a bounty on someone i want him to die and dont care if he is flyin a cheap or expensive ship. I just want that satisfaction of him in fear of dying then that last second when he hears that annoying noise of your ship and pod bout to explode!!!!!!!
I dont want someone to be like... oh someone placed a bounty on me for 10 mil. hey buddy you got a sec to help get rid of it for me..k let me jump in a frigate and lets go out there and get rid of it really quick. |

Propelled
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
9
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:06:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed. |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
627
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
"Is the Bounty System a Bad Idea?"
No.
/thread Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |

Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1105
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
Bounty system was changed so what you stated doesn't happen. You only get a % back of the value you destroyed. So there really is little way to come out ahead on trying to claim your own bounty.
E: However try if you want, no one is stopping you. |

Ralinastrife
Lost Dawn Chaos Stealth Syndicate
17
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
Propelled wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed.
oh....LOL..so in other words if i place a bounty for 10mil and lets say the person uses a cheap ship and the total kill was like 1 mil. then the person that killed would get like 200k.. would i get the 9 mil back.. |

John DaiSho
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
83
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
You just havent understood how bounties work.
If you lose a 10mil ship to your friend he gets payed out 20% of your ships worth, 2 mil. If your bounty was at 20 mil, it will still be 18 mil high after that. Any cargo your ship was carrying around does not count towards the amount of the bounty that gets paid out, so that you cant exploit the system by carrying a lot of heavily market manipulated items with you, that still are basically worthless (thats one of the things that happened with the FW LP madness, where some people killed their own frighters for profit) |

Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
567
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:13:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:Propelled wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed. oh....LOL..so in other words if i place a bounty for 10mil and lets say the person uses a cheap ship and the total kill was like 1 mil. then the person that killed would get like 200k.. would i get the 9 mil back..
No. It stays on his head until the end of time - or until He got killed in ships up to the needed value to clear the bounty - whatever happens first.
"Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
|

John DaiSho
Applied Creations The Fendahlian Collective
83
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:Propelled wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed. oh....LOL..so in other words if i place a bounty for 10mil and lets say the person uses a cheap ship and the total kill was like 1 mil. then the person that killed would get like 200k.. would i get the 9 mil back.. No, the bounty would become 9.8 mil. |

Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1105
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:14:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:Propelled wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed. oh....LOL..so in other words if i place a bounty for 10mil and lets say the person uses a cheap ship and the total kill was like 1 mil. then the person that killed would get like 200k.. would i get the 9 mil back..
Its a cumulative bounty. Which means it will subtract it from the total of the bounty until there is none left.
|

Ralinastrife
Lost Dawn Chaos Stealth Syndicate
17
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! |
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Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
567
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 15:15:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!!
/thread
"Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
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CCP Punkturis
C C P C C P Alliance
4535

|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:16:00 -
[12] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! /thread
   Gÿà EVE User Interface Programmer Gÿà GÖÑ Team Super Friends GÖÑ @CCP_Punkturis My Dev Blogs |
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silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
629
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:18:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! Rare instance of "rational argument convincing OP to change mind" observed.
Next such event scheduled for: 1st Quarter, 2015. Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |

Xearal
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
480
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
can't deny the facts. the bounty system as it is now is somethign that works.
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Spurty
V0LTA Verge of Collapse
799
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
It's 'anti-scam' loaded, out the door.
Generates mails as you pew pew telling you that your wallet just levelled up, which is also nice.
--- GÇ£If you think this Universe is bad, you should see some of the others.GÇ¥ GÇò Philip K. **** |

TheBlueMonkey
Don't Be a Menace That Red Alliance
407
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:For instance..lets say someone got pissed at me and placed a bounty on me. i have cheap implants or none at all in. I use a cheap ship and a friend blows me up. he gets the bounty and gives me half or whatever. Lets just say a bounty was on me for 20mil and the total cost of me losing a ship podded etc came to 10 mil. That means we came out on top and basically just laughed in the face of whoever put a bounty on me.
how is this a good system? if i place a bounty on someone i want him to die and dont care if he is flyin a cheap or expensive ship. I just want that satisfaction of him in fear of dying then that last second when he hears that annoying noise of your ship and pod bout to explode!!!!!!!
I dont want someone to be like... oh someone placed a bounty on me for 10 mil. hey buddy you got a sec to help get rid of it for me..k let me jump in a frigate and lets go out there and get rid of it really quick.
I don't care about bounties so when\if they're placed on me they really don't matter.
If someone comes looking to kill me for the reward, awesome, I get a fight. If no one comes looking to kill me for the reward, awesome, I'll go look for a fight.
Bounties or not, this doesn't change. |

Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2238
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
The size of my bounty coupled with the fact that I only fly a Velator means I can be blown up every day from now until the internet dies and still have plenty left over.
I have no problem with that. It's far and above better than the old bounty system.
Mr Epeen  There are 86,400 seconds in a day. You just saved one of them by typing 'u' instead of 'you'.-á Congratulations, dumbass! |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
629
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 16:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
Spurty wrote:It's 'anti-scam' loaded, out the door.
Generates mails as you pew pew telling you that your wallet just levelled up, which is also nice.
Also sends notes to those who post bounties that Justice is happening. Which is nice.  Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
879
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 17:54:00 -
[19] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:For instance..lets say someone got pissed at me and placed a bounty on me. i have cheap implants or none at all in. I use a cheap ship and a friend blows me up. he gets the bounty and gives me half or whatever. Lets just say a bounty was on me for 20mil and the total cost of me losing a ship podded etc came to 10 mil. That means we came out on top and basically just laughed in the face of whoever put a bounty on me.
You have just described the old bounty system. EvE Forum Bingo |

Achenar Chertio
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 17:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Xearal wrote:can't deny the facts. the bounty system as it is now is somethign that works.
Except it doesn't. Two main reasons why people place bounties on other people are 1. for the lolz and 2. just because I can. Secondly, I've seen a thread or two where the OP has placed 1 billion bounty or more on someone and nobody at least in the thread could care less. Heck, they even asked who cares. And why should they when the actual bounty that the wanted person is worth is probably a lot less.
But maybe this is how it's going to be without making the bounty system exploitable again. |
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Whitehound
795
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 18:03:00 -
[21] - Quote
It has a few oddities in how it pays out the bounties as it can happen for dead players to receive a payout, too, even when they have lost in a fight. This is the case when CONCORD or another police force kills a player does it then simply pick the first next player involved in the fight. To me does this make little sense as I see bounties as a reward and dying in the process just does not fit in here.
I am also not sure how it is handled when two corporation members (of the same corporation) kill each other and their corporation has a bounty on it. From what I have read does it then pay out the corporation bounty to the corporation members, which again makes little sense to me. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
1041
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 18:37:00 -
[22] - Quote
Well this new system is at least beter that the old one |

Aren Madigan
EVE University Ivy League
77
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 19:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
The bounty system is good, just comes with two problems. Its use as a method to reduce gank costs and how you basically need to destroy five equal value ships to afford losing your one unless you get some really good module and salvage drops. I can definitely understand it not being one for one, but I kind of wish it was more around one to two or three on average when you include the modules and salvage on average keeping bounty hunting high risk but something that's actually more viable to have as an active profession. I really couldn't forsee even a tenth of the pilots who are interested in this being able to maintain much of a better kill ratio than that. Suppose its a great supplemental pay to highly paid mercs though and its better than the old one by far. |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
639
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 19:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:It has a few oddities in how it pays out the bounties as it can happen for dead players to receive a payout, too, even when they have lost in a fight. This is the case when CONCORD or another police force kills a player does it then simply pick the first next player involved in the fight. To me does this make little sense as I see bounties as a reward and dying in the process just does not fit in here.
I am also not sure how it is handled when two corporation members (of the same corporation) kill each other and their corporation has a bounty on it. From what I have read does it then pay out the corporation bounty to the corporation members, which again makes little sense to me. I defy you to show me any formulaic system of bureaucracy which does not have Kafka-esque elements or moments. This system is still far and away superior to teh previous system.
Only way to prevent Kafka-esque events from randomly happening is to employ human arbiters for bounty-payment. And frankly, CCP will never have enough money to waste on throwing down that particular rat-hole. Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |

Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
687
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 19:08:00 -
[25] - Quote
New bounty system is pure gold for the suicide ganking community.
Its like a free 20% insurance policy for all your suicide gank ships - where the angry victims paid the premiums.
Last of all, I get to call myself a 'bounty hunter' instead of a suicide ganker, because miners always seem to have bounties on them these days. 
I would highly recommend increasing the payout to 50% of total losses, however.
Would make the bounty hunting profession even more attractive for us bounty hunters. |

Sid Hudgens
Totally not an NPC Corp
136
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 23:04:00 -
[26] - Quote
I'm kind of hoping that if nobody finds a good way to game the system then they might increase the percentage in the future. "....as if 10,058 Goon voices cried out and were suddenly silenced." |

Inquisitor Kitchner
Galaxy Punks Executive Outcomes
843
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 23:06:00 -
[27] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! Rare instance of "rational argument convincing OP to change mind" observed. Next such event scheduled for: 1st Quarter, 2015.
This man is an optimist "If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared." - Niccolo Machiavelli |

Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
2099
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 23:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! Rare instance of "rational argument convincing OP to change mind" observed. Next such event scheduled for: 1st Quarter, 2015.
Im not sure what just happened here...im scared... Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings? |

Whitehound
799
|
Posted - 2013.02.13 23:53:00 -
[29] - Quote
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:silens vesica wrote:Ralinastrife wrote:oh wow...the bounty system is good then!!!!!! Rare instance of "rational argument convincing OP to change mind" observed. Next such event scheduled for: 1st Quarter, 2015. Im not sure what just happened here...im scared... I blame ISDs. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
2753
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 00:15:00 -
[30] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Spurty wrote:It's 'anti-scam' loaded, out the door.
Generates mails as you pew pew telling you that your wallet just levelled up, which is also nice.
Also sends notes to those who post bounties that Justice is happening. Which is nice.  Nice until it becomes annoying. If there's a way to turn those off, I haven't seen it. If there isn't...CCP, get to it. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |
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Tesal
189
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 00:48:00 -
[31] - Quote
I just gave the OP a bounty. Haha. |

Crexa
Ion Industrials
26
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 03:11:00 -
[32] - Quote
I feel the bounty system is seriously flawed. It could be a lack of understanding on my part but...
Lets say I am a miner mining away in a 0.5 system, in my Mackinaw. Along comes a ganker/griefer/pirate/spy, whatever. He blows me up I lose my ship, mods and possibly my pod. Now I am a character with 50million skill points so I have a semi expensive clone and I had some decent implants including a mining implant. So im out 150m for the ship, 15m in mods and rigs, 200m +/- in implants(+3's and mining implant) and 15m for a new clone (guessing on clone cost). So I am out 380 million isk. I don't care if its my fault for not paying attention or not, that is irrelevant. Its the number that counts.
Ok now lets say I am mad (personally I wouldn't be but whatever). I place a bounty on the ganker who has lets say a -2.0 security status. Lets say I place a bounty equal to 1/3rd the amount I lost ,127m. What do I get for the kill? Besides being out the original 380m loss and the 127m bounty?
Nothing but a kill mail !!! Likely, not even a frickin corpse! So whats the point? Revenge? How is there any revenge when the guy you put the bounty on gets to first laugh at you for mining (stupid miners), then gets to laugh after you get blown up, then laugh after you get podded, then laugh at the bounty you placed on them because they think you made them mad.
The way the bounty should work is you get your bounty back (times the sec status as a multiplier, divided by ship value) and the person filling the bounty gets an equal amount minus the original bounty. "...its breakfast time and i am very hungry. may i have some of your paint chips?" |

Witchking Angmar
Perkele.
37
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 07:55:00 -
[33] - Quote
The only problem with the bounty system is that the payout percentage isn't higher. |

Joran Dravius
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
21
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 08:45:00 -
[34] - Quote
Ralinastrife wrote:For instance..lets say someone got pissed at me and placed a bounty on me. i have cheap implants or none at all in. I use a cheap ship and a friend blows me up. he gets the bounty and gives me half or whatever. Lets just say a bounty was on me for 20mil and the total cost of me losing a ship podded etc came to 10 mil. That means we came out on top and basically just laughed in the face of whoever put a bounty on me.
how is this a good system? if i place a bounty on someone i want him to die and dont care if he is flyin a cheap or expensive ship. I just want that satisfaction of him in fear of dying then that last second when he hears that annoying noise of your ship and pod bout to explode!!!!!!!
I dont want someone to be like... oh someone placed a bounty on me for 10 mil. hey buddy you got a sec to help get rid of it for me..k let me jump in a frigate and lets go out there and get rid of it really quick. Go read up on how the new bounty system works. then come back and delete your post.
Witchking Angmar wrote:The only problem with the bounty system is that the payout percentage isn't higher. Agreed. 20% is too low to bother with. |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
662
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 09:35:00 -
[35] - Quote
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:silens vesica wrote:Spurty wrote:It's 'anti-scam' loaded, out the door.
Generates mails as you pew pew telling you that your wallet just levelled up, which is also nice.
Also sends notes to those who post bounties that Justice is happening. Which is nice.  Nice until it becomes annoying. If there's a way to turn those off, I haven't seen it. If there isn't...CCP, get to it. Fair point, and that would be a nice option.
I deal with that by being more selective in my bounty placement. Of course, When I bounty someone who is particularly 'popular' I still get a raft of messages. *shrug* Good with the bad. Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.
Malcanis for CSM8 |
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CCP Eterne
C C P C C P Alliance
2149

|
Posted - 2013.02.14 10:24:00 -
[36] - Quote
I have deleted a nonconstructive trolling post from this thread. New Eden Community Representative GÇ+ New Eden Illuminati GÇ+ Fiction Adept
@CCP_Eterne GÇ+ @EVE_LiveEvents |
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Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
689
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 11:53:00 -
[37] - Quote
Crexa wrote:
Nothing but a kill mail !!! Likely, not even a frickin corpse! So whats the point? Revenge? How is there any revenge when the guy you put the bounty on gets to first laugh at you for mining (stupid miners), then gets to laugh after you get blown up, then laugh after you get podded, then laugh at the bounty you placed on them because they think you made them mad.
You also forgot how they laugh at you when they take your 127M bounty and put it into their own pocket every time they gank.
After all, the ganker 'lost' a ship. Sure, one they were planning on losing anyway, but the game can't make distinctions. The ganker's alts make sure they get on the Concord KM by pewing it once. Bounty is awarded to the alt.
As a result, the bounty you placed went directly into the pockets of the ganker over the next several suicide attacks. You are essentially buying him new ships.
In my view this is part of CCP's plan to reintroduced a gank-victim funded insurance policy for gankers. As removing insurance from suicide ganking was a mistake in the first place, we welcome the change.
And CCP probably won't change it - because the ONLY way to collect bounties on suicide ganking characters is to ***** the Concord KM -because the only time they are going to be in a position to die is getting CONCORDED after popping some scrub in a Mackinaw. I mean, when ELSE are you going to have a shot at collecting the bounty?
Which is funny because getting ganked is probably a textbook #1 example of why someone would want to place a bounty on someone in the first place. Its supposed to deter 'crime' yet is pointless in the #1 criminal activity in highsec.
I believe the main reason the payout is only 20% is due to the overly generous insurance system. Increasing the payout on bounties would actually make bounties pointless and 'free' to remove.
If you want an increased payout for bounties - you have to insist on an insurance system nerf as well.
Hey, I know - lets cut back the stupid insurance system - or remove it entirely!
|

Planetary Mnemonic
NightFall Division
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:07:00 -
[38] - Quote
Personally I think seeing that over 3/4 of players have bounties on them nullifies the point of bounties. Yes this system is better then the old one, but allowing anyone to place bounties on anyone for any reason with the click of a button is useless.
Needs to be some sort of application application system so that people cant just right click and place bounty. Something where you have to jump through a few hoops, so that if you want to place a bounty you need to work at it.
Or increase the minimum bounty to 10 mill, that would work too.
Its rare that I see a player out of dock that doesn't have a crap bounty or actually has a real bounty when I start right clicking in Dodoxi.
Other than that, the new bounty system is actually way better than the old one. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14050
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:09:00 -
[39] - Quote
Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Personally I think seeing that over 3/4 of players have bounties on them nullifies the point of bounties. Yes this system is better then the old one, but allowing anyone to place bounties on anyone for any reason with the click of a button is useless.
Needs to be some sort of application application system so that people cant just right click and place bounty. Something where you have to jump through a few hoops, so that if you want to place a bounty you need to work at it.
Or increase the minimum bounty to 10 mill, that would work too.
Its rare that I see a player out of dock that doesn't have a crap bounty or actually has a real bounty when I start right clicking in Dodoxi.
Other than that, the new bounty system is actually way better than the old one. Except that your figure of 3/4 is complete rubbish. But thanks for posting.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Angelique Duchemin
Divine Intentions
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
In order for bounties to actually work. It would have to be a bad thing to have one. Now it's just a badge of honour to pirates and an annoyance for regular people who never earned them.
Bounties do not work at the moment no. |
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14050
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:14:00 -
[41] - Quote
Angelique Duchemin wrote:In order for bounties to actually work. It would have to be a bad thing to have one. Now it's just a badge of honour to pirates and an annoyance for regular people who never earned them.
Bounties do not work at the moment no. How do you know they never earned them? What gives you the right to say whether the reason someone placed a bounty, was a good one or not? It's there ISK, they wanted them wanted. End of.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
804
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:22:00 -
[42] - Quote
Angelique Duchemin wrote:In order for bounties to actually work. It would have to be a bad thing to have one. Now it's just a badge of honour to pirates and an annoyance for regular people who never earned them.
Bounties do not work at the moment no. I agree to some extend here. Bounties should not start below 10m ISKs (in the current economy). Too many players are willing to give away 100k ISK or 1m ISK just for laughs. It needs to mean something. Smaller amounts may seem reasonable for rookies, but I would not mind if they were spared the occasional joke bounty if all it means to increase the minimum. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

GreenSeed
213
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:23:00 -
[43] - Quote
my only gripe with the bounty system is that there needs to be a "median average" bellow which you don't get the annoying "WANTED" sign.
having it for 100kisk is lame.
having that wanted sign on your avatar needs to be a quick way for any Bounty hunter to spot a valuable target, and for someone who just became a valuable target to know he could warp into a gate camp in the next gate. |

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
183
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:31:00 -
[44] - Quote
Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Personally I think seeing that over 3/4 of players have bounties on them nullifies the point of bounties. Characters on active accounts with any bounty on them: 3.4% |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14052
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:42:00 -
[45] - Quote
Maybe it was a typo. But then that nullifies the point of their post. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
805
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:48:00 -
[46] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Maybe it was a typo. But then that nullifies the point of their post.  I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
184
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:54:00 -
[47] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Maybe it was a typo. But then that nullifies the point of their post.  I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space. All it takes is to klick the link and read the devblog. There is a graph for that too. Enjoy the colors, it's a Punkturis devblog  |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14052
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 12:57:00 -
[48] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Maybe it was a typo. But then that nullifies the point of their post.  I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space. Oh I have no doubt. But to claim it's 3/4 with what is anecdotal evidence and then ask for hoops to be made to jump through, I find rather ridiculous.
That said I can get behind an increase in the minimum though, but we need to be aware of new pilots lack of funds.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 12:58:00 -
[49] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Maybe it was a typo. But then that nullifies the point of their post.  I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space. All it takes is to klick the link and read the devblog. There is a graph for that too. Enjoy the colors, it's a Punkturis devblog  No. It only shows the bounties claimed per sec level. You think all those 100k ISK bounties in high-sec are getting claimed?
Takes a little bit more than clicking stuff, son.
Edit: And don't bother about the colours. CCP Punkturis is pregnant... SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
184
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:07:00 -
[50] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Whitehound wrote: I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space.
All it takes is to klick the link and read the devblog. There is a graph for that too. Enjoy the colors, it's a Punkturis devblog  No. It only shows the bounties claimed per sec level. You think all those 100k ISK bounties in high-sec are getting claimed? Takes a little bit more than clicking stuff, son. You mean you prefer to take a wild guess over an approximation based on related data? Maybe that works for you dad. |
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Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 13:19:00 -
[51] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Whitehound wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Whitehound wrote: I am sure the percentage of bounties is higher in Jita than somewhere in 0.0 or W-space.
All it takes is to klick the link and read the devblog. There is a graph for that too. Enjoy the colors, it's a Punkturis devblog  No. It only shows the bounties claimed per sec level. You think all those 100k ISK bounties in high-sec are getting claimed? Takes a little bit more than clicking stuff, son. You mean you prefer to take a wild guess over an approximation based on related data? Maybe that works for you dad. You do not get it, right. I will explain.
First of all is nobody here talking about the total average except a couple of forum warriors who want to win a non existing argument as they always do. No news here.
Now for a player who lives in high-sec will the number of players with an active bounty be higher. Just stay long enough in Jita and players will give you a bounty if you do not have one already, because they only need to look at the icons.
The dev blog, when looking at the pie chart for the sec levels, then only shows the amount of total ISKs claimed per sec level. It is then important to understand that a bounty can disappear if enough of it is being claimed. So since the ISKs claimed in 0.0 is much higher than for high-sec will this mean that there are a lot more unclaimed bounties to be found than in 0.0.
Just because it is not write pink on black so you can get it, does not mean one cannot draw conclusion out of those numbers.
You get this now? SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Planetary Mnemonic
NightFall Division
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:33:00 -
[52] - Quote
Interesting, I assume there is a way to look that up but I didn't know about it.
When i say 3/4 of the people have bounties on them, I mean I actually right clicked a bunch of people in dodoxi local one day while bored, and that about 3 out of 4 active players in local had a bounty on them.
Reality in dodoxi verses statistics game wide
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14052
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:34:00 -
[53] - Quote
Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Interesting, I assume there is a way to look that up but I didn't know about it. When i say 3/4 of the people have bounties on them, I mean I actually right clicked a bunch of people in dodoxi local one day while bored, and that about 3 out of 4 active players in local had a bounty on them. Reality in dodoxi verses statistics game wide You shouldn't base game changes, on anecdotal evidence or assumptions.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Takseen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
217
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:34:00 -
[54] - Quote
Devblog says
Quote:Characters that have logged in within the last 7 days with personal bounties on them 11.7%
Last Fanfest presentation had something like 70-80% of people living in highsec.
That's still very very few people with bounties, and short of evidence to the contrary that's what I'll continue to believe. |

Takseen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
217
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:40:00 -
[55] - Quote
Crexa wrote: What do I get for the kill? Besides being out the original 380m loss and the 127m bounty?
Nothing but a kill mail !!! Likely, not even a frickin corpse! So whats the point? Revenge? How is there any revenge when the guy you put the bounty on gets to first laugh at you for mining (stupid miners), then gets to laugh after you get blown up, then laugh after you get podded, then laugh at the bounty you placed on them because they think you made them mad.
The bounty system should only work for those who lose ships (with one type of multiplier) and podded (with another multiplier). You should get your bounty back (times the sec status as a multiplier, divided by ship value, times either ship loss or pod multiplier) and the person filling the bounty gets an equal amount minus the original bounty.
You'll get a killmail everytime he gets killed. Whether he gets killed more often cos of the 127m bounty depends on what else he does besides ganking miners. I'm unclear why you think you deserve your bounty back once the contract is filled, though. That's not how bounties, or any kind of services, work.
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Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 13:43:00 -
[56] - Quote
Mag's wrote:You shouldn't base game changes, on anecdotal evidence or assumptions. Is this an assumption of yours? 
Let me help you out.
If there is an imbalance, which does not show up in an average statistic, than your so called "anecdotal evidence" may be your only evidence for it. So it is good to look at those once in a while.
And every developer assumes their changes will work and improve the game. And if they have done their homework will their assumptions almost always prove right. They only will not know before it goes live. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14052
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 13:49:00 -
[57] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:You shouldn't base game changes, on anecdotal evidence or assumptions. Is this an assumption of yours?  Let me help you out. If there is an imbalance, which does not show up in an average statistic, than your so called "anecdotal evidence" may be your only evidence for it. So it is good to look at those once in a while. And every developer assumes their changes will work and improve the game. And if they have done their homework will their assumptions almost always prove right. They only will not know before it goes live. You missed my post above. I said I had no doubt that they look higher is certain systems.
Also, Devs assuming things will work, is not the same as basing changes on assumptions. Just helping. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 13:58:00 -
[58] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Also, Devs assuming things will work, is not the same as basing changes on assumptions. Just helping.  Actually it is.
You look at your evidence and draw conclusions, and when you implement a change then because you assume that whatever it is you want to change is going to work out. Only when you do not change a thing do you have certainty. So each time you make a change do you take chances. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14053
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:06:00 -
[59] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Also, Devs assuming things will work, is not the same as basing changes on assumptions. Just helping.  Actually it is. You look at your evidence and draw conclusions, and when you implement a change then because you assume that whatever it is you want to change is going to work out. Only when you do not change a thing do you have certainty. So each time you make a change do you take chances. I bolded the important part. That's the part I'm talking about.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 14:11:00 -
[60] - Quote
Mag's wrote:I bolded the important part. That's the part I'm talking about. Yes, exactly! Your evidence shows you the is-state. So what happens when you change the is-state? ... You invalidate your evidence! You do so purposely, because you want the evidence to go away, because it is the evidence of the problem you want to fix! SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |
|

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:13:00 -
[61] - Quote
The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14054
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:14:00 -
[62] - Quote
Now I'm not even sure, you know what you're disagreeing with. Being as you're saying what I'm saying. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
805
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Posted - 2013.02.14 14:22:00 -
[63] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Now I'm not even sure, you know what you're disagreeing with. Being as you're saying what I'm saying.  I disagree with your statement:
"You shouldn't base game changes, on anecdotal evidence or assumptions."
It makes no sense, because you do look for evidence (anecdotal, hidden, odd, strange, funny or otherwise) and you do make assumptions.
Perhaps explain to me why one shouldn't do it. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14054
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:26:00 -
[64] - Quote
The OP suggested a change that required us to jump through hoops, because he assumed that 3/4 of people had bounties.
That's why I said what I said. No dev in their right mind would say, "Oh look, 3/4 of people have bounties, let's change them."
What is it with you white? Good god man, you even said the same but in a different way ffs. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
184
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:27:00 -
[65] - Quote
Whitehound wrote: First of all is nobody here talking about the total average except for a couple of forum warriors who want to win a non-existing argument as they always do. No news here.
I'm pretty sure someone was talking about a total average of 3/4 of players with a bounty on their head. That's where my response was aimed at.
Whitehound wrote: Now for a player who lives in high-sec will the number of players with an active bounty be higher. Just stay long enough in Jita and players will give you a bounty if you do not have one already, because they only need to look at the icons.
And just stay long enough in Jita and players will shoot your ship into pieces and claim the bounty. I suggest you read one of the QEN about the distribution of ship kills or take a look at ship kills per hour on your star map to validate what i just said.
Whitehound wrote: The dev blog, when looking at the pie chart for the sec levels, then only shows the amount of total ISKs claimed per sec level. It is then important to understand that a bounty can disappear if enough of it is being claimed. So since the ISKs claimed in 0.0 is much higher than for high-sec will this mean that there are a lot more unclaimed bounties to be found in high-sec than in 0.0.
That doesn't follow at all. That's just your gut feelings, nothing more.
Whitehound wrote: Just because it is not written pink on black so you can get it, does not mean one cannot draw conclusion out of those numbers.
And yet you try to draw conclusions out of thin air and think that is somehow superior to an approximation based on related data.
Whitehound wrote:You get this now? No dad, I don't get you at all |

Whitehound
805
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:29:00 -
[66] - Quote
Mag's wrote:The OP suggested a change that required us to jump through hoops, because he assumed that 3/4 of people had bounties.
That's why I said what I said. No dev in their right mind would say, "Oh look, 3/4 of people have bounties, let's change them." Why not? You have based your assumption that no changes are needed on the average value of 3.4%, because you believe it is a low enough number, meaning it represents only a minority. Do you then know what an imbalance is and what an imbalance in bounties could look like? ...
@Karak Terrel: I won't reply to your comment as I do not want to run two conversations and you already seem to be happy with just picking the crumbs out of my comments. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14058
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:30:00 -
[67] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:The OP suggested a change that required us to jump through hoops, because he assumed that 3/4 of people had bounties.
That's why I said what I said. No dev in their right mind would say, "Oh look, 3/4 of people have bounties, let's change them." Why not? You have based your assumption that no changes are needed on the average value of 3.4%, because you believe it is a low enough number, meaning it represents only a minority. Do you then know what an imbalance is and what an imbalance in bounties could look like? ... Mkay.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Planetary Mnemonic
NightFall Division
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:31:00 -
[68] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
Yes, this is a good way to vastly lessen the crap bounties you see everywhere, give a consequence to putting multiple bounties without damaging the rest of the bounty system. +1 lol |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14058
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:33:00 -
[69] - Quote
Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Ratmuss wrote:The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
Yes, this is a good way to vastly lessen the crap bounties you see everywhere, give a consequence to putting multiple bounties without damaging the rest of the bounty system. +1 lol Except that bounties are a player standings led mechanic, so NPC standings are irrelevant.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
185
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:38:00 -
[70] - Quote
Whitehound wrote: It makes no sense, because you do look for evidence (anecdotal, hidden, odd, strange, funny or otherwise) and you do make assumptions.
Perhaps explain to me why one shouldn't do it.
Because they are statistically irrelevant, which means they are completely worthless? Why do I even have to explain this.. oh wait this is a discussion on the internet.. right. |
|

Whitehound
806
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:39:00 -
[71] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Ratmuss wrote:The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
Yes, this is a good way to vastly lessen the crap bounties you see everywhere, give a consequence to putting multiple bounties without damaging the rest of the bounty system. +1 lol Except that bounties are a player standings led mechanic, so NPC standings are irrelevant. He seems to be talking about the sec status and not NPC standings. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Skorpynekomimi
427
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:39:00 -
[72] - Quote
Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Interesting, I assume there is a way to look that up but I didn't know about it. When i say 3/4 of the people have bounties on them, I mean I actually right clicked a bunch of people in dodoxi local one day while bored, and that about 3 out of 4 active players in local had a bounty on them. Reality in dodoxi verses statistics game wide
That's because it's a trade hub. There's lowsec pvp nearby, mission runner and miners, the new order's moved in, and there's a bunch of scammers around. I've been getting mails in the last week for slapping a couple of mil on a scam-spammer in local.
Bounty system seems to work. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14060
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:43:00 -
[73] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Ratmuss wrote:The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
Yes, this is a good way to vastly lessen the crap bounties you see everywhere, give a consequence to putting multiple bounties without damaging the rest of the bounty system. +1 lol Except that bounties are a player standings led mechanic, so NPC standings are irrelevant. He seems to be talking about the sec status and not NPC standings. He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:47:00 -
[74] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Planetary Mnemonic wrote:Ratmuss wrote:The bounty system should be open to all, but when a "Law-Abiding" citizen, AKA "carebear", places bounties, there should be some negative effects on their public standing.
Suggestions:
- Placing Bounties on players with positive sec status costs the issuer sec status.
- The higher the bounty's sec status, the greater the minimum cost. Substantial enough that putting a hit on an otherwise "upstanding citizen" too often can lead to "legal" problems in Hisec.
- Set a cap on number of active bounties per account. 10 is a good number. If people have issues with more than 10 people, they should be placing bounties on corps, or alliances.
Yes, this is a good way to vastly lessen the crap bounties you see everywhere, give a consequence to putting multiple bounties without damaging the rest of the bounty system. +1 lol Except that bounties are a player standings led mechanic, so NPC standings are irrelevant. He seems to be talking about the sec status and not NPC standings. He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing.
When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14060
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:51:00 -
[75] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
806
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 14:55:00 -
[76] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Whitehound wrote: It makes no sense, because you do look for evidence (anecdotal, hidden, odd, strange, funny or otherwise) and you do make assumptions.
Perhaps explain to me why one shouldn't do it.
Because they are statistically irrelevant, which means they are completely worthless? Why do I even have to explain this.. oh wait this is a discussion on the internet.. right. All you are explaining to me is that you do not understand it. I'll help...
With an "imbalance in bounties" do I not mean the ratio of players with bounties versus players without bounties. In fact, I believe that it should be completely acceptable to have 100% at one point in time and as long as it is not a permanent state.
What I then mean by an "imbalance in bounties" is the distribution of bounties among those players who have one.
What if all those 3.4% could always only be found in 0.0? Or what if they were all in high-sec?
Such things need to be looked at, because you do not want to have every rookie in high-sec running around with a bounty while they are new to the game.
Does this make sense to you? (I doubt it ) SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:02:00 -
[77] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC.
...And? If Concord can frown upon attacking innocent citizens, Concord can frown upon placing bounties on upstanding citizens.
...And? i didn't say it was not an NPC standing, i said it wasn't exclusively and NPC standing. |

Whitehound
806
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:04:00 -
[78] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC. In real-life is placing a bounty often a criminal act (in some countries). He seems to suggest to make it one in New Eden as well. I think he is making a fair point. I just do not believe CCP will take the technical effort, which is behind this. Increasing the minimum is in my opinion a better and simpler way. If someone wants to place lots of bounties when the minimum is like 10m ISK then why not?! SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14060
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:05:00 -
[79] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC. ...And? If Concord can frown upon attacking innocent citizens, Concord can frown upon placing bounties on upstanding citizens. ...And? i didn't say it was not an NPC standing, i said it wasn't exclusively and NPC standing. It's still an NPC standing and irrelevant to the player led standing bounty system. Thanks for posting.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14060
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:09:00 -
[80] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC. In real-life is placing a bounty often a criminal act (in some countries). He seems to suggest to make it one in New Eden as well. I think he is making a fair point. I just do not believe CCP will take the technical effort, which is behind this. Increasing the minimum is in my opinion a better and simpler way. If someone wants to place lots of bounties when the minimum is like 10m ISK then why not?! This isn't real life and an NPC standing is meaningless to how someone feels about another. You don't need an NPC standing, to be an arse.
As far as raising the lower amount is concerned, I already said I can see the argument for it. We just need to be aware of new pilots, with any change.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |
|

Whitehound
807
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:21:00 -
[81] - Quote
Mag's wrote:It's still an NPC standing and irrelevant to the player led standing bounty system. And why do you believe should CONCORD be looking away? So you can be a nice carebear with a 5.0 sec status??
Other than this do I not see your point. The fact that the sec status is an NPC standing is at best a meaningless coincidence. It sure is not a point when it could be implemented in such a way. CONCORD is already looking at fights in high-sec, decides over wars and takes money of alliances. I see no problem for them to get involved in bounties, too.
It may only not fit into CCP's long-term plans on what the role of CONCORD shall be. I think we all want less CONCORD, but it does not quite work without them. Maybe it never will... SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:29:00 -
[82] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:It's still an NPC standing and irrelevant to the player led standing bounty system. And why do you believe should CONCORD be looking away? So you can be a nice carebear with a 5.0 sec status?? Other than this do I not see your point. The fact that the sec status is an NPC standing is at best a meaningless coincidence. It sure is not a point when it could be implemented in such a way. CONCORD is already looking at fights in high-sec, decides over wars and takes money of alliances. I see no problem for them to get involved in bounties, too. It may only not fit into CCP's long-term plans on what the role of CONCORD shall be. I think we all want less CONCORD, but it does not quite work without them. Maybe it never will... Well Concord do look when it matters and then they punish those nasty pilots.
The main issue I have with linking it to an NPC standing, is it's limiting factor. If someone with a very high sec status is scamming or whatever, people shouldn't be punished for wanting them wanted.
Many want Concord removed. I personally think they are necessary and should stay, but they shouldn't be included in the bounty system.
Edit: Should = Shouldn't.  
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:42:00 -
[83] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:He's talking about peoples sec status. Which is an NPC standing. When sec status goes below a certain level, players can attack them with impunity, thus is is not exclusively an NPC standing. And? Just because people use it, doesn't make it not an NPC standing. It's given and taken away by Concord, who just so happens to be an NPC. ...And? If Concord can frown upon attacking innocent citizens, Concord can frown upon placing bounties on upstanding citizens. ...And? i didn't say it was not an NPC standing, i said it wasn't exclusively and NPC standing. It's still an NPC standing and irrelevant to the player led standing bounty system. Thanks for posting.
I disagree, good sir.
Sec status is modified by (and not exclusively to) Concord's monitoring of player actions against other players. Placing bounties in Hisec, is by definition, player action against other players and should fall under Concord Jurisdiction.
As an amendment to my previous suggestions:
- Bounties could only be placed while in stations, and only stations in NULL or Losec would be immune to Concord's influence on the issuer's standing.
Would that address your concerns?
Besides, the value of concord is altogether another topic. My posts are made working with the current Concordian systems in place. |

Whitehound
808
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:51:00 -
[84] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:- Bounties could only be placed while in stations, and only stations in NULL or Losec would be immune to Concord's influence on the issuer's standing. This makes no sense for W-space hooligans, 0.0 POS dwellers and AFK cloakers. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:56:00 -
[85] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Ratmuss wrote:- Bounties could only be placed while in stations, and only stations in NULL or Losec would be immune to Concord's influence on the issuer's standing. This makes no sense for W-space hooligans, 0.0 POS dwellers and AFK cloakers.
Could you elaborate on what doesn't make sense? when i said Bounties could only be placed in stations, i meant:
The issuer must go to a station to place the bounty with a bounty NPC; the target can be in space - anywhere in the universe. |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
12887
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:56:00 -
[86] - Quote
I'm worth more than all alliances and all but three corps.
Of course it's a good idea! 
/epeen Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 15:59:00 -
[87] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:
I disagree, good sir.
Sec status is modified by (and not exclusively to) Concord's monitoring of player actions against other players. Placing bounties in Hisec, is by definition, player action against other players and should fall under Concord Jurisdiction.
Sec status is controlled and issued by Concord, thus making it an NPC mechanic. This doesn't mean people cannot use it, nor does it mean when they do, it becomes a player mechanic. It still remains an NPC mechanic.
Ratmuss wrote:As an amendment to my previous suggestions:
- Bounties could only be placed while in stations, and only stations in NULL or Losec would be immune to Concord's influence on the issuer's standing.
Would that address your concerns?
Besides, the value of concord is altogether another topic. My posts are made working with the current Concordian systems in place. To what end? What's the point in this change, when NPC standings are meaningless?
Also, Whitehound's post nailed it.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
809
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:00:00 -
[88] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Whitehound wrote:Ratmuss wrote:- Bounties could only be placed while in stations, and only stations in NULL or Losec would be immune to Concord's influence on the issuer's standing. This makes no sense for W-space hooligans, 0.0 POS dwellers and AFK cloakers. Could you elaborate on what doesn't make sense? when i said Bounties could only be placed in stations, i meant: The issuer must go to a station to place the bounty with a bounty NPC; the target can be in space - anywhere in the universe. A station might simply be unreachable for them. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
51
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:06:00 -
[89] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:It has a few oddities in how it pays out the bounties as it can happen for dead players to receive a payout, too, even when they have lost in a fight. This is the case when CONCORD or another police force kills a player does it then simply pick the first next player involved in the fight. To me does this make little sense as I see bounties as a reward and dying in the process just does not fit in here.
I am also not sure how it is handled when two corporation members (of the same corporation) kill each other and their corporation has a bounty on it. From what I have read does it then pay out the corporation bounty to the corporation members, which again makes little sense to me.
Since the bounty payout is only 20% of the forcefully decomissioned ship, it does make sense. You (the despicable person that voluntarily stays in a corporation that most assuredly encourages antisocial behaviour) loose more than You earn when You kill Your corp mates.
EDIT: that is to say, the corp as a whole looses more than it earns. You however, despicable and antisocial as You are earn ISK in the process. I say kill them all, get rich and the leave the corp. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Angelique Duchemin
Divine Intentions
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:20:00 -
[90] - Quote
The two issues that need to be addressed before we can even have a functional bounty system is that having a bounty should be a bad thing and placing one should not be something you can do lightly.
Placing a bounty on someone who deserves it is meaningless because you're just feeding their ego and placing a bounty can be done so lightly that it's become greatly abused.
One option could be to limit the amount of bounties a person can place. Perhaps related to a bounty skill that enables you to place 2 bounties per level.
Lets be hones, since the launch of eve, bounties have never had a single practical application other than ruining the mid sized portrait for regular players and feeding the ego of pirates. No one could say that they "need" to place a bounty at the moment. Making people train a skill to place a bounty would mean that only people who feel really strongly about placing a bounty on someone specific would be able to do so. At the same time, limiting the bounties to 10 per player means they won't be used as lightly as they are today. In order to place a new bounty after you reached your cap you would have to revoke an old one. Doing so would make you lose the credits offered on the bounty to keep people from using the bounty system as banks.
As for how we can make having a bounty a bad thing. I don't see any way to make that happen. Perhaps fixed bounty tiers were if you get poded or your ship destroyed by someone, you can place a bounty on them and at certain amounts of ISK the bounty would negatively effect their security status. Say 200 million ISK per tier with a max of 1 billion to insure the maximum amount of sec loss for that bounty. Revoking the bounty would restore the sec status to that person.
It would of course be combined with the bounty skill to limit the amount of bounties you can place.
Personally I would just throw away the entire bounty system until they can implement it in a way that it works. Having a broken system that can't even accomplish its own sole purpose makes no sense. |
|

Whitehound
809
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:21:00 -
[91] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Since the bounty payout is only 20% of the forcefully decomissioned ship, it does make sense. You (the despicable person that voluntarily stays in a corporation that most assuredly encourages antisocial behaviour) loose more than You earn when You kill Your corp mates.
EDIT: that is to say, the corp as a whole looses more than it earns. You however, despicable and antisocial as You are earn ISK in the process. I say kill them all, get rich and the leave the corp. If I took your point of view, then it must be allowed to self-destruct and claim 20% of one's own bounty... which is not allowed.
If I want corp members to kill each other and to have a bounty can I place individual bounties on the members. Here it makes sense, because these are individually placed bounties.
I want corporation bounties to be different from individual player-bound bounties so that corporation members cannot get any ISKs from it. Some corporations then hold little PvP matches, where they destroy their own assets purposely, but to train their pilots. I do not want a corporation bounty to serve here as a payment for such events.
SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:25:00 -
[92] - Quote
Angelique Duchemin wrote:Placing a bounty on someone who deserves it is meaningless because you're just feeding their ego and placing a bounty can be done so lightly that it's become greatly abused. Greatly abused? In what way?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight
49
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:26:00 -
[93] - Quote
The bounty system as-is merely gives you a bonus for killing someone you were already going to blap anyway. Meh.
For bounty hunting to be a *career*, there needs to be a way for bounty-hunters to a) invest serious time in a 'bounty hunting' skill tree which b) allows them to activate kill-rights on bountied players in hisec having a negative security status. Defense against 'abuse' being not having a negative sec status, or status of a certain level, etc...
Without those two key elements (training + shoot-anywhere), bounty-hunting is by no means a 'career' in EVE. Sadly so. http://evedarklord.blogspot.ca |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:31:00 -
[94] - Quote
Hows this then? (for issuing)
Minimum bounty 10 mill
Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections
(once max is reached, one bounty must be revoked before issuing another) |

Whitehound
810
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:37:00 -
[95] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections Interesting.
I'd like to add another to this:
- Reduction of the payout from 20% to 5% - A new skill Bounty Negotiations, which gives 5% extra payout per level with a maximum of 30% at level 5. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:39:00 -
[96] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Hows this then? (for issuing)
Minimum bounty 10 mill
Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections
(once max is reached, one bounty must be revoked before issuing another) Why?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
810
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:44:00 -
[97] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Hows this then? (for issuing)
Minimum bounty 10 mill
Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections
(once max is reached, one bounty must be revoked before issuing another) Why? Honestly, I can only think of two reasons... because training skills is fun and it should have been in there right from the start!!  SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
3
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:45:00 -
[98] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections Interesting. I'd like to add another to this: - Reduction of the payout from 20% to 5% - A new skill Bounty Negotiations, which gives 5% extra payout per level with a maximum of 30% at level 5.
that would work. people who want to play the role of BH can train for it and have more ability/reward. everyone could place a bounty if it tickles their fancy, but Bounty Hunters would have a real advantage.
I would add prereqs:
Social III Negotiation III Security Conenctions IV Criminal Connections III
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:48:00 -
[99] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Hows this then? (for issuing)
Minimum bounty 10 mill
Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections
(once max is reached, one bounty must be revoked before issuing another) Why? Honestly, I can only think of two reasons... because training skills is fun and it should have been in there right from the start!!  I can see the logic to your idea. You're making it have meaning and giving it more of a focus towards bounty hunting.
His ideas so far, just look at limiting bounties. As the system has only just been delimited, it seems odd to go backwards.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
810
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:52:00 -
[100] - Quote
Mag's wrote:His ideas so far, just look at limiting bounties. As the system has only just been delimited, it's odd to go backwards. His idea is brilliant, because it is just funny. Run it through your head a few times... you need to train Criminal Connections in order to place bounties!
The value itself seems low and I would probably vote for like 10 bounties per level. It leaves plenty of room for casual bounties but stops the nutters, who place 50 bounties per day on random players. I sure EVE has got these players... SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |
|

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:54:00 -
[101] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Hows this then? (for issuing)
Minimum bounty 10 mill
Maximum number of bounties 3 per lvl of Criminal Connections
(once max is reached, one bounty must be revoked before issuing another) Why? Honestly, I can only think of two reasons... because training skills is fun and it should have been in there right from the start!!  I can see the logic to your idea. You're making it have meaning and giving it more of a focus towards bounty hunting. His ideas so far, just look at limiting bounties. As the system has only just been delimited, it seems odd to go backwards.
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize. |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:55:00 -
[102] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:His ideas so far, just look at limiting bounties. As the system has only just been delimited, it's odd to go backwards. His idea is brilliant, because it is just funny.  Run it through your head a few times... you need to train Criminal Connections in order to place bounties! I want to train. The value itself seems low and I would probably vote for like 10 bounties per level. It leaves plenty of room for casual bounties but stops the nutters, who place 50 bounties per day on random players. I am sure EVE has got such players...
as in real life, to be a successful bounty hunter, you should have connections with lowlifes :) |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 16:55:00 -
[103] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:00:00 -
[104] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam?
the posts of people claiming to sit on gates and put bounties on people as they enter systems
the posts from players saying WTF!!! bounty on me, but why??
but yeah you're right, rampant was perhaps too strong a word. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14061
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:04:00 -
[105] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam? the posts of people claiming to sit on gates and put bounties on people as they enter systems the posts from players saying WTF!!! bounty on me, but why?? but yeah you're right, rampant was perhaps too strong a word. They have every right to do that. It's not yours or my place, to dictate the reason people have for placing bounties.
Anyway, CCP have already nailed the rampant suggestion. I'm simply surprised, people are still trying to flog that dead horse.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Ratmuss
Children of Prophecy
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:11:00 -
[106] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam? the posts of people claiming to sit on gates and put bounties on people as they enter systems the posts from players saying WTF!!! bounty on me, but why?? but yeah you're right, rampant was perhaps too strong a word. They have every right to do that. It's not yours or my place, to dictate the reason people have for placing bounties. Anyway, CCP have already nailed the rampant suggestion. I'm simply surprised, people are still trying to flog that dead horse.
No one is dictating. We're having a discussion on idea's to improve game systems.
It is in everyone's interest to make suggestions. We have every right to make suggestions.
You, however, only seem to shoot ideas down with no constructive comments or contribution to the thread.
Thank YOU for posting.
|

Whitehound
810
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:12:00 -
[107] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam? Imagine the guy who got banned for botting recently, who had 300b ISKs. If he had given out 300 times 1b ISKs bounties then this could have caused quite a nuisance and also a lot more work for CCP.
I can also see a positive side on such a limitation, because once one comes close to the limit or simply cannot place another one will some choose their bounties more wisely. This can (does not have to) lead to bounties of a higher value. The thought is that when one cannot place endless little bounties then some will place a few big bounties instead. This would play into the hands of bounty hunters. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
1
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:15:00 -
[108] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the idea is to reduce rampant bounty spam.
not to limit, but to rationalize.
What rampant bounty spam? the posts of people claiming to sit on gates and put bounties on people as they enter systems the posts from players saying WTF!!! bounty on me, but why?? but yeah you're right, rampant was perhaps too strong a word. They have every right to do that. It's not yours or my place, to dictate the reason people have for placing bounties. Anyway, CCP have already nailed the rampant suggestion. I'm simply surprised, people are still trying to flog that dead horse. Under the current system, sure they have every right, but why? Why would CONCORD let a capsuleer put out a hit on another capsuleer without repercussions? Dispensing justice is CONCORD's responsibility, not the capsuleer's.
So yeah, no, I'm not a big fan of the current system. It's not a bounty, because bounties are for criminals. In the real world we call that a hit and it's illegal. Placing a hit on someone should have consequences. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14062
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:23:00 -
[109] - Quote
Ratmuss wrote:Mag's wrote:Ratmuss wrote:
the posts of people claiming to sit on gates and put bounties on people as they enter systems
the posts from players saying WTF!!! bounty on me, but why??
but yeah you're right, rampant was perhaps too strong a word.
They have every right to do that. It's not yours or my place, to dictate the reason people have for placing bounties. Anyway, CCP have already nailed the rampant suggestion. I'm simply surprised, people are still trying to flog that dead horse. No one is dictating. We're having a discussion on idea's to improve game systems. It is in everyone's interest to make suggestions. We have every right to make suggestions. You, however, only seem to shoot ideas down with no constructive comments or contribution to the thread. Thank YOU for posting. So what was the point in mentioning people sitting on gates and people saying WTF, if you didn't want to limit that? Thanks indeed.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14062
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:28:00 -
[110] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote: Under the current system, sure they have every right, but why? Why would CONCORD let a capsuleer put out a hit on another capsuleer without repercussions? Dispensing justice is CONCORD's responsibility, not the capsuleer's.
So yeah, no, I'm not a big fan of the current system. It's not a bounty, because bounties are for criminals. In the real world we call that a hit and it's illegal. Placing a hit on someone should have consequences.
Why? Because it's about player standings between each other. Concord have no place in that.
Also you're dead wrong. Dispensing justice is as much a players right, as it is Concords.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14062
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:30:00 -
[111] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:I can also see a positive side on such a limitation, because once one comes close to the limit or simply cannot place another one will some choose their bounties more wisely. This can (does not have to) lead to bounties of a higher value. The thought is that when one cannot place endless little bounties then some will place a few big bounties instead. This would play into the hands of bounty hunters. Choose more wisely? Why should we say what's is and isn't wise, about any bounty placed?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
670
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:31:00 -
[112] - Quote
For those of you who want bounties to be placable only on people with low sec statuses, I'd like to present a short list of things that I regularly do that people would want to place bounties on my for but don't effect my sec status:
-I join corps in order to kill members of that corp -I go into peoples missions and steal their loot -I sit around as a suspect and try to convince people to kill me -I bump peoples ships so they cannot obtain their objectives -If I see someone putting up or taking down a POS I'll land on it while something is unanchored in space and steal them -I put up margin scams -I offer services that I never deliver on, stealing someone's money in the process -I wardec corps and alliances
All of these thing I can do without effecting my sec status at all. In fact, several of my fellow Skunks have positive sec statuses.
In your view, are these not valid reasons to put a bounty on me? Are they only valid if I've also done some suicide ganking in my time?
More importantly than that, why do you feel that you're a "good guy" because you've shot a couple plusses here and there? And why do you feel the game needs to favor "good guys"? Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14062
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:33:00 -
[113] - Quote
Psychotic Monk wrote:For those of you who want bounties to be placable only on people with low sec statuses, I'd like to present a short list of things that I regularly do that people would want to place bounties on my for but don't effect my sec status:
-I join corps in order to kill members of that corp -I go into peoples missions and steal their loot -I sit around as a suspect and try to convince people to kill me -I bump peoples ships so they cannot obtain their objectives -If I see someone putting up or taking down a POS I'll land on it while something is unanchored in space and steal them -I put up margin scams -I offer services that I never deliver on, stealing someone's money in the process -I wardec corps and alliances
All of these thing I can do without effecting my sec status at all. In fact, several of my fellow Skunks have positive sec statuses.
In your view, are these not valid reasons to put a bounty on me? Are they only valid if I've also done some suicide ganking in my time?
More importantly than that, why do you feel that you're a "good guy" because you've shot a couple plusses here and there? And why do you feel the game needs to favor "good guys"? This.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:38:00 -
[114] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Why? Because it's about player standings between each other. Concord have no place in that. Yeah, and I don't like my neighbor, but so what? The local police don't care about my standing with my neighbor, but they do care if I put a hit on her. And CONCORD does have a place in player standings between each other or they wouldn't come by and crush the guy who just podded an afk miner in 0.9 space.
Quote:Also you're dead wrong. Dispensing justice is as much a players right, as it is Concords. Haven't we pretty clearly established that a bounty has nothing to do with justice? That's not what I'm talking about. Going after a guy with a suspect flag in high sec is fine. Going after a guy with a bounty and no suspect flag is not fine. Again, not justice. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14063
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:44:00 -
[115] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Why? Because it's about player standings between each other. Concord have no place in that. Yeah, and I don't like my neighbor, but so what? The local police don't care about my standing with my neighbor, but they do care if I put a hit on her. And CONCORD does have a place in player standings between each other or they wouldn't come by and crush the guy who just podded an afk miner in 0.9 space. Quote:Also you're dead wrong. Dispensing justice is as much a players right, as it is Concords. Haven't we pretty clearly established that a bounty has nothing to do with justice? That's not what I'm talking about. Going after a guy with a suspect flag in high sec is fine. Going after a guy with a bounty and no suspect flag is not fine. Again, not justice. I wondered when we would get the first RL anaoly. Well done, you win Eve today.
I didn't say they were, although there is a link. Shooting people is dispensing justice. Placing bounties, is hoping someone will dispense justice. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:47:00 -
[116] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Placing bounties, is hoping someone will dispense justice.  Explain to me how placing a bounty on a noob in Rookie chat is justice.
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:47:00 -
[117] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Placing bounties, is hoping someone will dispense justice.  Explain to me how placing a bounty on a noob in Rookie chat is justice. OK edit.
There idea of why someone should have a bounty, is down to them. Why should you start saying under what reason they can or cannot place one?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:50:00 -
[118] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Placing bounties, is hoping someone will dispense justice.  Explain to me how placing a bounty on a noob in Rookie chat is justice. Can you read? Well enough to know that answering a question with a question isn't an answer. And well enough to know that you misspelled "analogy" in your previous post. |

Whitehound
812
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:52:00 -
[119] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Whitehound wrote:I can also see a positive side on such a limitation, because once one comes close to the limit or simply cannot place another one will some choose their bounties more wisely. This can (does not have to) lead to bounties of a higher value. The thought is that when one cannot place endless little bounties then some will place a few big bounties instead. This would play into the hands of bounty hunters. Choose more wisely? Why should we say what's is and isn't wise, about any bounty placed? No, this is not what I meant. Players want to place bounties for many reasons and the most common reason will perhaps be retaliation. What it should not be is to place them for the sake of placing them, which is currently the case and because bounties are new. Point is, players want to place bounties and when they are being restricted will they not just sulk and walk off, but they will try to find ways to work around the limitation. So some will use alts (no surprise here), but some will simply place higher bounties as for their retaliation instead of many little ones. Others will try to place corporation and alliance bounties more often than individual bounties. This is why I believe it will play into the hands of bounty hunters when players are being forced to place bounties more wisely.
Bounty hunting has to face the mass of little bounties, which are simply not worth going for. So these really have little meaning until the ISKs eventually pile up, which means it is going to take a while and then a retaliation may have lost its purpose and it is only a lot of notifications to the players. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:53:00 -
[120] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Placing bounties, is hoping someone will dispense justice.  Explain to me how placing a bounty on a noob in Rookie chat is justice. Can you read? Well enough to know that answering a question with a question isn't an answer. And well enough to know that you misspelled "analogy" in your previous post. I edited that typo. I also edited that reply before yours. But sure, pointing out spelling and grammar are always a winner. Just like RL analogies. Amirite?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 17:56:00 -
[121] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Whitehound wrote:I can also see a positive side on such a limitation, because once one comes close to the limit or simply cannot place another one will some choose their bounties more wisely. This can (does not have to) lead to bounties of a higher value. The thought is that when one cannot place endless little bounties then some will place a few big bounties instead. This would play into the hands of bounty hunters. Choose more wisely? Why should we say what's is and isn't wise, about any bounty placed? No, this is not what I meant. Players want to place bounties for many reasons and the most common reason will perhaps be retaliation. What it should not be is to place them for the sake of placing them, which is currently the case and because bounties are new. Point is, players want to place bounties and when they are being restricted will they not just sulk and walk off, but they will try to find ways to work around the limitation. So some will use alts (no surprise here), but some will simply place higher bounties as for their retaliation instead of many little ones. Others will try to place corporation and alliance bounties more often than individual bounties. This is why I believe it will play into the hands of bounty hunters when players are being forced to place bounties more wisely. Bounty hunting has to face the mass of little bounties, which are simply not worth going for. So these really have little meaning until the ISKs eventually pile up, which means it is going to take a while and then a retaliation may have lost its purpose and it is only a lot of notifications to the players. Well I see your point. But it still boils down to their reason for placing the bounty, is not what you would reason to be a good one.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:01:00 -
[122] - Quote
EVE has a pretext of law and order. There are criminals, there are suspects, there are people who skirt the law. There are people who are jerks. Being a jerk is not illegal. Placing a hit however, does not fit within the established pretext of law and order. If it's illegal to loot someone else's container, then it should be illegal to offer a payout on someone's head. |

Whitehound
813
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:04:00 -
[123] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Well I see your point. But it still boils down to their reason for placing the bounty, is not what you would reason to be a good one. Yes, of course. I do not judge them based on what may have triggered the bounty (ship explosion, theft, etc.), but what it means for the game play of EVE. The more meaning something has got, the more fun it becomes. Just like loss is meaningful.
Or what is good about many little bounties when nobody likes to go for them? It actually becomes pointless to argue why a particular bounty is good or why it is bad, when in the end nobody cares for it. SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:05:00 -
[124] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:EVE has a pretext of law and order. There are criminals, there are suspects, there are people who skirt the law. There are people who are jerks. Being a jerk is not illegal. Placing a hit however, does not fit within the established pretext of law and order. If it's illegal to loot someone else's container, then it should be illegal to offer a payout on someone's head. Nice edit.
You seem to be playing the wrong game. A game where criminals hide in all areas and are not bound by NPC standings. Or you're simply still confusing a game, with RL. Who knows?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:08:00 -
[125] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Mag's wrote:Well I see your point. But it still boils down to their reason for placing the bounty, is not what you would reason to be a good one. Yes, of course. I do not judge them based on what may have triggered the bounty (ship explosion, theft, etc.), but what it means for the game play of EVE. The more meaning something has got, the more fun it becomes. Just like loss is meaningful. Or what is good about many little bounties when nobody likes to go for them? It actually becomes pointless to argue why a particular bounty is good or why it is bad, when in the end nobody cares for it. On that we'll have to agree, to disagree. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:11:00 -
[126] - Quote
Mag's wrote:You seem to be playing the wrong game. A game where criminals hide in all areas and are not bound by NPC standings. Or you're simply still confusing a game, with RL. Who knows? What are you even talking about? People with neg sec status show up in high sec all the time. What does that have to do with the bounty system? |

Takseen
University of Caille Gallente Federation
221
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:13:00 -
[127] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:EVE has a pretext of law and order. There are criminals, there are suspects, there are people who skirt the law. There are people who are jerks. Being a jerk is not illegal. Placing a hit however, does not fit within the established pretext of law and order. If it's illegal to loot someone else's container, then it should be illegal to offer a payout on someone's head.
Lots of things in Eve don't follow real world logic, so that's not a particularly strong argument. And most of the activities Psychotic Monk describes WOULD be illegal in real life, but are deemed legal in-game in terms of CONCORD intervention.
Also its not like having a bounty on your head means people can safely attack you, they still need the killrights.
Honestly I think between the tradeable kill rights and the new bounties, things are looking a lot better.
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:14:00 -
[128] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:You seem to be playing the wrong game. A game where criminals hide in all areas and are not bound by NPC standings. Or you're simply still confusing a game, with RL. Who knows? What are you even talking about? People with neg sec status show up in high sec all the time. What does that have to do with the bounty system? Bound as in anyone can be a criminal. Even noobs. The fact you thought I only meant neg sec players, speaks volumes.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:19:00 -
[129] - Quote
Takseen wrote: Also its not like having a bounty on your head means people can safely attack you, they still need the killrights.
Which I did state in a previous post, and makes the bounty system pretty useless.
|

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:22:00 -
[130] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:You seem to be playing the wrong game. A game where criminals hide in all areas and are not bound by NPC standings. Or you're simply still confusing a game, with RL. Who knows? What are you even talking about? People with neg sec status show up in high sec all the time. What does that have to do with the bounty system? Bound as in anyone can be a criminal. Even noobs. The fact you thought I only meant neg sec players, speaks volumes. Okay then. Explain to me what you mean. Without asking me if I can read, please. And for the record, I was not assuming you meant only neg sec players, that was just an example I used. |
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14064
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:39:00 -
[131] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Mag's wrote:Bound as in anyone can be a criminal. Even noobs. The fact you thought I only meant neg sec players, speaks volumes. Okay then. Explain to me what you mean. Without asking me if I can read, please. And for the record, I was not assuming you meant only neg sec players, that was just an example I used. The status of criminal, has a different meaning within the bounty system. Any player can be considered a criminal by another player. Some may have a very high sec status, but their actions with a corp or individual, may have made them highly despised and thus wanted.
Then someone may consider a players actions in a chat channel criminal and place a bounty on them. As daft as any reason may sound to you and I, it's their reason and I believe we should respect that. Many calls for change, seem to be based on this. People think the reasons are wrong and want it limited to stop what they consider are, bad bounties.
One of the early reasons for limitations, was the charge that everyone was getting a bounty. That it wouldn't be long before all of New Eden, were flying around with 100k. But this has all but vanished, mainly due to CCP's blog and it's numbers.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
673
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 18:59:00 -
[132] - Quote
This all begs the question, though, why people seem to feel that not interefering with others gameplay in a direct way should be considered morally right, or "good", and why being "good" should be a protected game style.
It's a bit like going into a game of Team Fortress 2 and not shooting anyone and saying that you should also be immune to being shot because of it. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |

Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
673
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:05:00 -
[133] - Quote
To follow that along, should no space get invaded if the owners of it acquired it through peaceful means? Should nobody's orders ever get undercut?
Should nobody ever initiate an action against another player in any way? If so, what do you propose the end state of this should be?
Or should only certain motivations allowed in order to take an action? Should wars only exist so that carebear corps can clear off the abandoned POSs of other carebear corps? Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |

Whitehound
816
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:10:00 -
[134] - Quote
And shall I eat pizza tonight?
(I thought I add another important question here.) SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14066
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:11:00 -
[135] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:And shall I eat pizza tonight?
(I thought I add another important question here.) I've just had Thai. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:20:00 -
[136] - Quote
Mag's wrote:The status of criminal, has a different meaning within the bounty system. Any player can be considered a criminal by another player. Some may have a very high sec status, but their actions with a corp or individual, may have made them highly despised and thus wanted. Placing a bounty doesn't make a player a criminal, nor is a player considered a criminal simply because he or she has a bounty. Nothing in the dev blogs, the Retribution notes on bounties, or in evelopedia state that. The Retribution notes say that it's another means for pilots to seek redress. That's all. Nothing about criminals. There are some pretty clear rules on what makes a criminal a criminal, and another player can't just decide that.
Quote:Then someone may consider a players actions in a chat channel criminal and place a bounty on them. As daft as any reason may sound to you and I, it's their reason and I believe we should respect that. Many calls for change, seem to be based on this. People think the reasons are wrong and want it limited to stop what they consider are, bad bounties. Well, it is daft. I don't have a problem with players putting innumerable hits on other players, but how about we call it what it is and stop pretending that Player B is a criminal because Player A decided that he was. Player B is not a criminal if he hasn't met the guidelines already set out, and that's what I mean by people who skirt the law. It's annoying and Player B may be a jerk, but he's not a criminal.
Quote:One of the early reasons for limitations, was the charge that everyone was getting a bounty. That it wouldn't be long before all of New Eden, were flying around with 100k. But this has all but vanished, mainly due to CCP's blog and it's numbers. I was pretty surprised that more people don't have bounties because someone was handing them out to nearly everyone in Rookie Chat my first day. That's pretty obnoxious, and not to mention frustrating for noobs who don't really know what it means or how it works.
But, CCP doesn't care what my opinion is anyway because they've made it clear that they're more than happy with how it works. |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:29:00 -
[137] - Quote
Psychotic Monk wrote:This all begs the question, though, why people seem to feel that not interefering with others gameplay in a direct way should be considered morally right, or "good", and why being "good" should be a protected game style. Nobody's protected in EVE. If you're a law-abiding citizen and get ganked in high sec, CONCORD doesn't protect you, they punish the guy who ganked you.
Placing a bounty is not a direct interference in someone's gameplay. You're asking a third party to take care of this nuisance for you instead of sacking up and doing it yourself. |

Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
674
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 19:33:00 -
[138] - Quote
Paying someone to do something is doing something.
But yes, exactly. EvE does not (or at least claims not to) value one morality over another, and I don't see why they should start with who you're allowed to place bounties on or for what reason. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |

Santo Trafficante
the united Negative Ten.
5
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 20:33:00 -
[139] - Quote
The bounty system currently kicks ass + the kill rights u can make sum serious cash if u do it the right way |

Angelique Duchemin
Divine Intentions
4
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:14:00 -
[140] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:Placing a bounty on someone who deserves it is meaningless because you're just feeding their ego and placing a bounty can be done so lightly that it's become greatly abused. Greatly abused? In what way?
People spam bounties on hundreds of people just for laughs. This is especially common in NPC corps.
|
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14070
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:42:00 -
[141] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:Placing a bounty doesn't make a player a criminal, nor is a player considered a criminal simply because he or she has a bounty. Nothing in the dev blogs, the Retribution notes on bounties, or in evelopedia state that. The Retribution notes say that it's another means for pilots to seek redress. That's all. Nothing about criminals. There are some pretty clear rules on what makes a criminal a criminal, and another player can't just decide that. Why do I need to rely upon CCP or Evelopedia, to tell me when I or anyone else for that matter, consider someone a criminal? The fact is I don't. If I decide they are in my eyes and I want them wanted, I shall place a bounty accordingly. Or simply shoot them myself. It's not your place to tell me otherwise and this is why you are misunderstanding the bounty system. You are quite obviously still of the mind, that only those with negative sec status can be criminals. How wrong you are.
The bounty system is a player led standings mechanic. When a player places a bounty, they consider that person to be of a lower standing and therefore wanted. It's their personal standing towards that player.
You see Concord, cannot get involved in all criminal activity. They are only there to punish. This is where players need to get involved and dispense justice. Either by facilitating others through the bounty system, or shooting them themselves.
This is another reason why I think the bounty system is great. It opens up the possibility of player retribution. Which is why it's no coincidence, that name was chosen.
Lei Gao wrote:Well, it is daft. I don't have a problem with players putting innumerable hits on other players, but how about we call it what it is and stop pretending that Player B is a criminal because Player A decided that he was. Player B is not a criminal if he hasn't met the guidelines already set out, and that's what I mean by people who skirt the law. It's annoying and Player B may be a jerk, but he's not a criminal. Daft to you maybe, but not to someone else. That's the whole point and one that seems to elude you.
Lei Gao wrote:I was pretty surprised that more people don't have bounties because someone was handing them out to nearly everyone in Rookie Chat my first day. That's pretty obnoxious, and not to mention frustrating for noobs who don't really know what it means or how it works.
But, CCP doesn't care what my opinion is anyway because they've made it clear that they're more than happy with how it works. Many of us expected there to be a mad rush of bounties early on, but other took this as the norm. It calmed down rather quickly, so it's quite obvious it wasn't. I can see you think many bounties are obnoxious, others don't. I have a feeling you'll never see the other peoples views in this regard.
CCP does care, but not for those who think sandbox means the game should only be played their way. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14070
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:43:00 -
[142] - Quote
Angelique Duchemin wrote:Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:Placing a bounty on someone who deserves it is meaningless because you're just feeding their ego and placing a bounty can be done so lightly that it's become greatly abused. Greatly abused? In what way? People spam bounties on hundreds of people just for laughs. This is especially common in NPC corps. You have figures to show me, just how abused it is?
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
12891
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:47:00 -
[143] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:People spam bounties on hundreds of people just for laughs. This is especially common in NPC corps. You have figures to show me, just how abused it is? I'd be more interested in hearing how that qualifies as abuseGǪ?
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Whitehound
821
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:48:00 -
[144] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:Placing a bounty on someone who deserves it is meaningless because you're just feeding their ego and placing a bounty can be done so lightly that it's become greatly abused. Greatly abused? In what way? People spam bounties on hundreds of people just for laughs. This is especially common in NPC corps. You have figures to show me, just how abused it is? I could show you pictures of my private parts... SCAM CAT - Titan Jump - I was there - Goon Dog |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14070
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:50:00 -
[145] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mag's wrote:Angelique Duchemin wrote:People spam bounties on hundreds of people just for laughs. This is especially common in NPC corps. You have figures to show me, just how abused it is? I'd be more interested in hearing how that qualifies as abuseGǪ? I was going to ask, but think I know their reason. So thought I'd focus on the figures first.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

BoBoZoBo
Divine Beasts Nite's Reign
212
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 21:51:00 -
[146] - Quote
It certainly works better than the old bounty system.
Now... whether or not it really motivates someone to hunt down the dog you want you want to put to sleep is another story. Chances are, they are more likely to ge the bounty as a result of a kill already in progress than something they chased you for. Primary Test Subject GÇó SmackTalker Elite |
|

ISD LackOfFaith
isd community communications liaisons
425

|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:06:00 -
[147] - Quote
Deleted a vulgar trolling post. Please stay respectful, constructive, and on-topic, guys. ISD LackOfFaith Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
|

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3557
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:08:00 -
[148] - Quote
BoBoZoBo wrote:It certainly works better than the old bounty system.
Now... whether or not it really motivates someone to hunt down the dog you want you want to put to sleep is another story. Chances are, they are more likely to ge the bounty as a result of a kill already in progress than something they chased you for. Oh, I think many people keep an eye open for bountys as people pass by even if not many go out of their way to hunt someone specific down.
Still, even if they only realize the bounty was in place after a kill they will certainly be pleased and keep an eye out for the person from that point on. To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |

Lei Gao
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:08:00 -
[149] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Why do I need to rely upon CCP or Evelopedia, to tell me when I or anyone else for that matter, consider someone a criminal? The fact is I don't. If I decide they are in my eyes and I want them wanted, I shall place a bounty accordingly. Or simply shoot them myself. It's not your place to tell me otherwise and this is why you are misunderstanding the bounty system. You are quite obviously still of the mind, that only those with negative sec status can be criminals. How wrong you are. I'm not wrong because they are not necessarily criminals. You can't shoot someone with a bounty with CONCORD nearby if CONCORD doesn't consider them criminals. Bounty =/= Criminal. Do you understand the semantic difference between a bounty and a hit?
Quote:The bounty system is a player led standings mechanic. When a player places a bounty, they consider that person to be of a lower standing and therefore wanted. It's their personal standing towards that player. Your point? Because that person still does not automatically become a criminal.
Quote:This is another reason why I think the bounty system is great. It opens up the possibility of player retribution. Which is why it's no coincidence, that name was chosen. Which, again, I have no problem with. But it's still not a bounty, it's a hit.
Quote:Daft to you maybe, but not to someone else. That's the whole point and one that seems to elude you. What seems to be eluding you is the difference between, "I don't like you" and "You're a criminal."
Quote:I can see you think many bounties are obnoxious, others don't. I have a feeling you'll never see the other peoples views in this regard.
CCP does care, but not for those who think sandbox means the game should only be played their way. ;) Probably not, given that I had a 100k bounty my first day in EVE, and not because I asked a question, but because I answered one.
Well, you want the sandbox your way and your way just happens to be the way it's currently played, so how are you any different? All I'm saying is that in a game that does have legalities (loose as they are, I mean really, how can CONCORD possibly know if I loot someone else's container?) that a "bounty" system of placing a price on a character for any reason doesn't make sense. |

Miss Spent Youth
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:18:00 -
[150] - Quote
Yes See my thread |
|

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14071
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:39:00 -
[151] - Quote
Lei Gao wrote:I'm not wrong because they are not necessarily criminals. You can't shoot someone with a bounty with CONCORD nearby if CONCORD doesn't consider them criminals. Bounty =/= Criminal. Do you understand the semantic difference between a bounty and a hit? You're limiting it to your definition.
Say for example someone steals from a corp. Concord will not get involved, but the corp members will consider him a criminal. They may then bounty him or hunt him themselves.
Lei Gao wrote:Your point? Because that person still does not automatically become a criminal. I didn't say they did. I'm merely pointing out that their standing to the other player was lowered, when the bounty was place and some may consider them criminals.
Lei Gao wrote:Which, again, I have no problem with. But it's still not a bounty, it's a hit. The bounty facilitates the hit. Because they may consider them criminals.
Lei Gao wrote:What seems to be eluding you is the difference between, "I don't like you" and "You're a criminal." No that's you trying to place your limitations, on what other may want to think.
Lei Gao wrote:Probably not, given that I had a 100k bounty my first day in EVE, and not because I asked a question, but because I answered one.
Well, you want the sandbox your way and your way just happens to be the way it's currently played, so how are you any different? All I'm saying is that in a game that does have legalities (loose as they are, I mean really, how can CONCORD possibly know if I loot someone else's container?) that a "bounty" system of placing a price on a character for any reason doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense to you, obviously. It seems you have a misunderstanding, of what sandbox means.
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Skorpynekomimi
430
|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:41:00 -
[152] - Quote
I'm just waiting for the bounty button to make it onto the forums already. |
|

ISD LackOfFaith
isd community communications liaisons
425

|
Posted - 2013.02.14 22:42:00 -
[153] - Quote
Deleted a link to a locked thread, and posts quoting it.. ISD LackOfFaith Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
|

Sarok Zateki
Marabu Red Cat Nomad Society
0
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 01:29:00 -
[154] - Quote
how about we keep it as it is but let the player put a bounty on the target clone (pod).
-the bounty could have a fee depnding on the target SP, and a minimum fee to avoid griefing new players.
-the fee is a collateral you have to pay to keep the bounty there, until someone claims it.
-The collateral will be payed weekly with a 10% tax
To collect you could get a bountyhunter license from concord
-the cost of the license depends on the target
-its for 3 days and has collateral, it can be extended for another 3 days paying the collateral again and a tax.
*this last one could be like a hit contract and allow you to hit someone in highsec. |

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
7622
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 08:47:00 -
[155] - Quote
Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal? Criminals put out bounties (or contracts) on people in the real world all the time, probably more than LEOs do. Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717&find=unread |

Whitehound
824
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:06:00 -
[156] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal? Criminals put out bounties (or contracts) on people in the real world all the time, probably more than LEOs do. You say "Criminals put out bounties on people" and then you ask "Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?" ...
Are you joking or do you seriously not see the connection?  Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
51
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:37:00 -
[157] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Debora Tsung wrote:Since the bounty payout is only 20% of the forcefully decomissioned ship, it does make sense. You (the despicable person that voluntarily stays in a corporation that most assuredly encourages antisocial behaviour) loose more than You earn when You kill Your corp mates.
EDIT: that is to say, the corp as a whole looses more than it earns. You however, despicable and antisocial as You are earn ISK in the process. I say kill them all, get rich and the leave the corp. If I took your point of view, then it must be allowed to self-destruct and claim 20% of one's own bounty... which is not allowed. If I want corp members to kill each other over a bounty can I place individual bounties on the members. Here it makes sense, because these are individually placed bounties. I want corporation bounties to be different from individual player-bound bounties so that corporation members cannot get any ISKs from it. Some corporations then hold little PvP matches, where they destroy their own assets purposely, but to train their pilots. I do not want a corporation bounty to serve here as a payment for such events. Or imagine a high corporation bounty when a new player starts awoxing it. It would play right into the awoxer's hands.
No, You cannot and certainly not by my point of view claim bounties placed on yourself. And even IF you could it'd be of no use to you since you loose more than You'd gain by that. It works as it should be, in a strictly technically sense a bounty is 100% harmfull to the one who's head is on the wanted poster.
And yes, "awoxing" was just what I was talking about, in that regard I don't see any problem with the current bounty system, if anything I'd even raise the payout to 30 - 40% of the destroyed assets.
There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
14075
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:44:00 -
[158] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Malcanis wrote:Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal? Criminals put out bounties (or contracts) on people in the real world all the time, probably more than LEOs do. You say "Criminals put out bounties on people" and then you ask "Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?" ... Are you joking or do you seriously not see the connection?  I think he meant that certain people assume the bounty system, is only for criminals. As in people with high sec status shouldn't have them. This doesn't mean they are not involved or get bounties. Or that sec status is any indicator, of who is or isn't a criminal to another player.
I could of course, be wrong. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM 8 |

Whitehound
824
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 14:46:00 -
[159] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:No, You cannot and certainly not by my point of view claim bounties placed on yourself. Right, but I can use an alt.
Now explain why a corporation can claim their own bounty. And do not say because of awoxing. If I want to awox myself then I should have the same right as anybody else no matter if I use an alt or through self-destruct.
I call it a paradox, but I am curious how you will explain it. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
51
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:04:00 -
[160] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Debora Tsung wrote:No, You cannot and certainly not by my point of view claim bounties placed on yourself. Right, but I can use an alt. Now explain why a corporation can claim their own bounty. And do not say because of awoxing. If I want to awox myself then I should have the same right as anybody else no matter if I use an alt or through self-destruct. I call it a paradox, but I am curious how you will explain it.
Which is completely and utterly useless as You still loose more than You gain. It'd be cheaper just to transfer the money from one alt to another.
regarding alts: everyone could be everyones alt, being in the same corp is not a valid indicator. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |
|

Whitehound
824
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:22:00 -
[161] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Which is completely and utterly useless as You still loose more than You gain. It'd be cheaper just to transfer the money from one alt to another.
regarding alts: everyone could be everyones alt, being in the same corp is not a valid indicator. So why is one not allowed to directly cash in on one's own bounty? Because it is meant to make abuse difficult!
And why is it allowed for corporations to cash in on themselves? Because CCP did not think it through and so it is being abused.
Conclusion: I cannot recommend anyone to use corporation or alliance bounties for this reason - do not use them. Instead, place individual bounties on only a few members and hope it does not encourage abuse as much as corporation/alliance bounties do.
If I wanted to put ISKs into the pockets of those players who I want to place a bounty on then there is already an easier way. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
51
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 15:55:00 -
[162] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Debora Tsung wrote:Which is completely and utterly useless as You still loose more than You gain. It'd be cheaper just to transfer the money from one alt to another.
regarding alts: everyone could be everyones alt, being in the same corp is not a valid indicator. So why is one not allowed to directly cash in on one's own bounty? Because it is meant to make abuse difficult! And why is it allowed for corporations to cash in on themselves? Because CCP did not think it through and so it is being abused. Conclusion: I cannot recommend anyone to use corporation or alliance bounties for this reason - do not use them. Instead, place individual bounties on only a few members and hope it does not encourage abuse as much as corporation/alliance bounties do. If I wanted to put ISKs into the pockets of those players who I want to place a bounty on then there is already an easier way.
I don't even know why You're saing that, it's nonsense. Being in the same corp doesn't mean You're the same person and I cannot stress this point enough, just because You can kill corp mates and cash in their bounty doesn't mean you can actually abuse that system. The corp as a whole looses more than it gains by this practice.
I really do not get Your point. If You want Your bounties to be cashed in only by certain people then I suggest to not use the bounty system at all and hire some mercs instead. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Whitehound
824
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:04:00 -
[163] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:I really do not get Your point. You do not get why people discuss issues on the game?
It is to bring the issues into the light. Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling. |

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
7628
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 16:25:00 -
[164] - Quote
Whitehound wrote:Malcanis wrote:Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal? Criminals put out bounties (or contracts) on people in the real world all the time, probably more than LEOs do. You say "Criminals put out bounties on people" and then you ask "Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?" ... Are you joking or do you seriously not see the connection? 
Apologies: I should have been more precise and said "Where do people get this idea that having a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?"
Vote for Malcanis for CSM8 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=192717&find=unread |

Skorpynekomimi
441
|
Posted - 2013.02.15 18:01:00 -
[165] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Whitehound wrote:Malcanis wrote:Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal? Criminals put out bounties (or contracts) on people in the real world all the time, probably more than LEOs do. You say "Criminals put out bounties on people" and then you ask "Where do people get this idea that a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?" ... Are you joking or do you seriously not see the connection?  Apologies: I should have been more precise and said "Where do people get this idea that having a bounty is anything to do with being a criminal?"
Well, you have to do SOMETHING to deserve it. Sexually harassing my alt is a fine example of that something. |

Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:17:00 -
[166] - Quote
Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. Even podded the clone wakes up minus implants (big deal) and continues on the same course.
The current situation has people placing 100k bounties on everyone, rendering the overview useless when bounty-hunting.
In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something.
Translating this into Eve consider a system where the wearer of the bounty loses 1SP per 1,000 isk of bounty on his head. That would make the bounty worth something to all concerned; wearer AND hunter.
Regaining SP after being podded for a few M isk bounty would be trivial. Recovering from being podded having 100's M isk bounty is another matter. For those toons with 100's B isk bounties? No change as those toons were never seen anyway.
Constraints.
If left as a free-for-all this system could be used to annihilate a toon by anyone with a fortune in isk to burn. When it comes to relatively new toons it wouldn't require a fortune, so there would need to be limits on when a bounty can be placed.
Options.
Restore the old limitations to placing a bounty. Concord won't allow a bounty on someone with a +ve sec status, as they won't recognise the potential victim as deserving of it. Apart from that: free-for-all.
Bounties can be placed only on someone on whom you have kill rights. There can be no argument you would be justified fully in placing the bounty. However that stops bounties being placed on someone who just raped your corporation, so is a harsh limitation.
Implementation.
In changeover to the new system the current plethora of bounties would need to be considered, with a view to zeroing bounties on toons that meet certain criteria. Probably usng the above criteria would work.
If someone has a bounty placed on him he is able to pay concord an amount of isk to reduce it, on an isk-for-isk basis, all the way to zero.
Practice.
You are protected from mailcious bounty-placing provided you remain within the constraints. If you are podded, with the bounty gone, you are again protected by it (sec status reset to 0 or kill rights reset?) until you make yourself vulnerable to the bounty system. This stops you from becoming helpless in the face of repeat bounty-placing.
If bounties are allowed on anyone with -ve sec status then having that at -10 tends to screw you unless you bring it up to 0.0+. Grinding status up while all the time being vulnerable to bounty-PvP may be too much to ask. Then again: you want to brag low sec status, then pay the price. It's a thought.
Harsh? Maybe, but bounties are still broken so any idea that can change this is worth punting. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
|

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13439
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:24:00 -
[167] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. So it works, then, seeing as how the target does suffer any time someone claims a bounty on him?
Quote:In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something. Same as in EVE, then.
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Dave Stark
2378
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:26:00 -
[168] - Quote
Skorpynekomimi wrote:Well, you have to do SOMETHING to deserve it.
wrong.
i placed a bounty on some one today just because i could, they hadn't done anything. you waste time reading this? |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13439
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:31:00 -
[169] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Skorpynekomimi wrote:Well, you have to do SOMETHING to deserve it. wrong. i placed a bounty on some one today just because i could, they hadn't done anything. He was obviously messing with your mojo, or you would have picked someone else. 
Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3861
|
Posted - 2013.04.04 17:32:00 -
[170] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. Even podded the clone wakes up minus implants (big deal) and continues on the same course.
The current situation has people placing 100k bounties on everyone, rendering the overview useless when bounty-hunting.
In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something.
Translating this into Eve consider a system where the wearer of the bounty loses 1SP per 1,000 isk of bounty on his head. That would make the bounty worth something to all concerned; wearer AND hunter.
Regaining SP after being podded for a few M isk bounty would be trivial. Recovering from being podded having 100's M isk bounty is another matter. For those toons with 100's B isk bounties? No change as those toons were never seen anyway.
Constraints.
If left as a free-for-all this system could be used to annihilate a toon by anyone with a fortune in isk to burn. When it comes to relatively new toons it wouldn't require a fortune, so there would need to be limits on when a bounty can be placed.
Options.
Restore the old limitations to placing a bounty. Concord won't allow a bounty on someone with a +ve sec status, as they won't recognise the potential victim as deserving of it. Apart from that: free-for-all.
Bounties can be placed only on someone on whom you have kill rights. There can be no argument you would be justified fully in placing the bounty. However that stops bounties being placed on someone who just raped your corporation, so is a harsh limitation.
Implementation.
In changeover to the new system the current plethora of bounties would need to be considered, with a view to zeroing bounties on toons that meet certain criteria. Probably usng the above criteria would work.
If someone has a bounty placed on him he is able to pay concord an amount of isk to reduce it, on an isk-for-isk basis, all the way to zero.
Practice.
You are protected from mailcious bounty-placing provided you remain within the constraints. If you are podded, with the bounty gone, you are again protected by it (sec status reset to 0 or kill rights reset?) until you make yourself vulnerable to the bounty system. This stops you from becoming helpless in the face of repeat bounty-placing.
If bounties are allowed on anyone with -ve sec status then having that at -10 tends to screw you unless you bring it up to 0.0+. Grinding status up while all the time being vulnerable to bounty-PvP may be too much to ask. Then again: you want to brag low sec status, then pay the price. It's a thought.
Harsh? Maybe, but bounties are still broken so any idea that can change this is worth punting. Except, of course, that bounties are working just fine as they are (although minor tweaks in payout ratio's might be considered.
The bountied individual loses the value of the ship and modules he is in, over and over again until the bounty is gone... 5X the amount of the bounty. If podded he loses the value of the implants and clone replacement, which can be a considerable amount, again over and over again until the 5X limit is reached. This is hardly trivial.
Best of all, the system is entirely in the hands of the players without the need for convoluted game mechanics to keep the obvious potential for exploiting the situation in check.
By the way, there is no such thing as a justified bounty. Any bounty is justified if the player placing it feels motivated to do so. Game mechanics should play as small a role as possible in this regard. If I decided you have annoyed me I am free to put money on your head to annoy you in return. I am completely justified in this, and Concord should play no role in saying that I cannot do so.
This allows the, shall we say, criminal element access to the same abilities and the "good guys"... much as criminals in real life have the ability to place a "hit" on any person they deem worthy of the expense.
In EvE you should never be protected from the consequences of your actions just because you consider yourself a "good guy". To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors. If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
|

Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
26
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 08:49:00 -
[171] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. So it works, then, seeing as how the target does suffer any time someone claims a bounty on him? Quote:In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something. Same as in EVE, then. That isn't suffering, as it's no deterrent. Not the same, regardless of your 12-year-old one-liners. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
|

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
8535
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 09:38:00 -
[172] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. Even podded the clone wakes up minus implants (big deal) and continues on the same course.
The current situation has people placing 100k bounties on everyone, rendering the overview useless when bounty-hunting.
In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something.
Translating this into Eve consider a system where the wearer of the bounty loses 1SP per 1,000 isk of bounty on his head. That would make the bounty worth something to all concerned; wearer AND hunter.
Regaining SP after being podded for a few M isk bounty would be trivial. Recovering from being podded having 100's M isk bounty is another matter. For those toons with 100's B isk bounties? No change as those toons were never seen anyway.
Constraints.
If left as a free-for-all this system could be used to annihilate a toon by anyone with a fortune in isk to burn. When it comes to relatively new toons it wouldn't require a fortune, so there would need to be limits on when a bounty can be placed.
Options.
Restore the old limitations to placing a bounty. Concord won't allow a bounty on someone with a +ve sec status, as they won't recognise the potential victim as deserving of it. Apart from that: free-for-all.
Bounties can be placed only on someone on whom you have kill rights. There can be no argument you would be justified fully in placing the bounty. However that stops bounties being placed on someone who just raped your corporation, so is a harsh limitation.
Implementation.
In changeover to the new system the current plethora of bounties would need to be considered, with a view to zeroing bounties on toons that meet certain criteria. Probably usng the above criteria would work.
If someone has a bounty placed on him he is able to pay concord an amount of isk to reduce it, on an isk-for-isk basis, all the way to zero.
Practice.
You are protected from mailcious bounty-placing provided you remain within the constraints. If you are podded, with the bounty gone, you are again protected by it (sec status reset to 0 or kill rights reset?) until you make yourself vulnerable to the bounty system. This stops you from becoming helpless in the face of repeat bounty-placing.
If bounties are allowed on anyone with -ve sec status then having that at -10 tends to screw you unless you bring it up to 0.0+. Grinding status up while all the time being vulnerable to bounty-PvP may be too much to ask. Then again: you want to brag low sec status, then pay the price. It's a thought.
Harsh? Maybe, but bounties are still broken so any idea that can change this is worth punting.
Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out. Please vote for me for CSM8-áhere
My recommended voting list |

Dave Stark
2448
|
Posted - 2013.04.06 09:41:00 -
[173] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Skorpynekomimi wrote:Well, you have to do SOMETHING to deserve it. wrong. i placed a bounty on some one today just because i could, they hadn't done anything. He was obviously messing with your mojo, or you would have picked someone else.  nope, he just made a thread on the forums. it wasn't even particularly bad, i just did it for the lulz really. you waste time reading this? |

Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
28
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 17:44:00 -
[174] - Quote
Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
|

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
4069
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 18:09:00 -
[175] - Quote
I may have already posted this, but the only advantage to the new Bounty Hunting system is receiving the notifications that someone you Bountied has died....over and over and over again. There is much to be said in favour of modern journalism. By giving us the opinions of the uneducated, it keeps us in touch with the ignorance of the community.-á-á-á-á - Oscar Wilde |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
13514
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 18:16:00 -
[176] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:That isn't suffering, as it's no deterrent. Losing your ship is nothing? Interesting. I suppose we could just do away with CONCORD then and make the whole game a free-fire zone since no-one really suffers from losing their ships.
How is losing something not the same thing as losing something?
Quote:Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Sure they do. Especially when they highlight a rather suspicious and unfounded claim that rather goes against the general view of things. Vote Malcanis for CSM8. |

Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Lords.Of.Midnight -affliction-
86
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 18:28:00 -
[177] - Quote
Sorry, but bounties as implemented remain substantively vaporware. Beyond a few edge-cases of extremely high-bountied players being pursued, bounties in general do NOT drive bounty-hunter careers & gameplay.
I remain convinced that if bounty hunting is to ever jump-bridge from vaporware to career-driver & substantive gameplay you MUST have... - long duration skills relating to bounty hunting that people must train - unlocks associated with those skills, namely the ability for a 'bounty hunter' to make a bountied person (with negative sec status) go suspect or limited engagement to him in HISEC
http://evedarklord.blogspot.ca |

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
8579
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 20:51:00 -
[178] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one.
You tried to say that gettin podded is "no big deal". If I got podded right now it would mean I had to replace ~600-700M worth of implants.
If losing ships and pods is so trivial, then I'd say that the punishment fits the cirme. Please vote for me for CSM8-áhere
My recommended voting list |

Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
126
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 21:55:00 -
[179] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. Even podded the clone wakes up minus implants (big deal) and continues on the same course.
The current situation has people placing 100k bounties on everyone, rendering the overview useless when bounty-hunting.
In the real life bounty system, when the bounty hunter claims the bounty the target is either in chains or is in a box. Either way he has lost something.
Translating this into Eve consider a system where the wearer of the bounty loses 1SP per 1,000 isk of bounty on his head. That would make the bounty worth something to all concerned; wearer AND hunter.
Regaining SP after being podded for a few M isk bounty would be trivial. Recovering from being podded having 100's M isk bounty is another matter. For those toons with 100's B isk bounties? No change as those toons were never seen anyway.
Constraints.
If left as a free-for-all this system could be used to annihilate a toon by anyone with a fortune in isk to burn. When it comes to relatively new toons it wouldn't require a fortune, so there would need to be limits on when a bounty can be placed.
Options.
Restore the old limitations to placing a bounty. Concord won't allow a bounty on someone with a +ve sec status, as they won't recognise the potential victim as deserving of it. Apart from that: free-for-all.
Bounties can be placed only on someone on whom you have kill rights. There can be no argument you would be justified fully in placing the bounty. However that stops bounties being placed on someone who just raped your corporation, so is a harsh limitation.
Implementation.
In changeover to the new system the current plethora of bounties would need to be considered, with a view to zeroing bounties on toons that meet certain criteria. Probably usng the above criteria would work.
If someone has a bounty placed on him he is able to pay concord an amount of isk to reduce it, on an isk-for-isk basis, all the way to zero.
Practice.
You are protected from mailcious bounty-placing provided you remain within the constraints. If you are podded, with the bounty gone, you are again protected by it (sec status reset to 0 or kill rights reset?) until you make yourself vulnerable to the bounty system. This stops you from becoming helpless in the face of repeat bounty-placing.
If bounties are allowed on anyone with -ve sec status then having that at -10 tends to screw you unless you bring it up to 0.0+. Grinding status up while all the time being vulnerable to bounty-PvP may be too much to ask. Then again: you want to brag low sec status, then pay the price. It's a thought.
Harsh? Maybe, but bounties are still broken so any idea that can change this is worth punting.
I agree with your intentions, although I feel that your method is way off with this suggestion as I understand it.
May I suggest my own proposal, where all pod kills result in SP loss currently equivalent to losing a tech 3 cruiser or another similar mechanism. This way bounty hunting could be specifically linked to a pod kill and would be far more effective and produce much more exciting gameplay.
The only change necessary in my opinion would be pods would have to be immune to non targetted warp disruption, but that is pretty easily done.
By the way, this was the old system which CCP originally introduced also until medical clones where made available. |

Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 07:21:00 -
[180] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. You tried to say that gettin podded is "no big deal". If I got podded right now it would mean I had to replace ~600-700M worth of implants. If losing ships and pods is so trivial, then I'd say that the punishment fits the cirme. Again: don't fly what you can't afford to lose. Basic wisdom in Eve.
Losing 100,000 SP. Now THAT'S a big deal. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
|
|

Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 12:37:00 -
[181] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:That isn't suffering, as it's no deterrent. Losing your ship is nothing? Interesting. I suppose we could just do away with CONCORD then and make the whole game a free-fire zone since no-one really suffers from losing their ships. How is losing something not the same thing as losing something? Quote:Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Sure they do. Especially when they highlight a rather suspicious and unfounded claim that rather goes against the general view of things.
Loss of ship in no way deters people in this game, else there would be no one playing. Bounties don't give other players kill rights, therefore they change nothing in gameplay. I'm surprised you don't know this.
Your trolling skills need improving. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
|

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
78
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 13:07:00 -
[182] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one.
Dude, that wasn't just a one liner, those were clearly two lines, two sentences even ... o_O
There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
78
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 13:17:00 -
[183] - Quote
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote: unlocks associated with those skills, namely the ability for a 'bounty hunter' to make a bountied person (with negative sec status) go suspect or limited engagement to him in HISEC
No. if the sec status is negative enough You can attak him/her/it anyway. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
78
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 13:22:00 -
[184] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. You tried to say that gettin podded is "no big deal". If I got podded right now it would mean I had to replace ~600-700M worth of implants. If losing ships and pods is so trivial, then I'd say that the punishment fits the cirme. Again: don't fly what you can't afford to lose. Basic wisdom in Eve. Losing 100,000 SP. Now THAT'S a big deal.
Big deal or no, the punishement in his case would mutlate into real life since time cannot be replaced. It is therefore not desirable to implement such a half arsed feature. There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
8586
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 14:15:00 -
[185] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. You tried to say that gettin podded is "no big deal". If I got podded right now it would mean I had to replace ~600-700M worth of implants. If losing ships and pods is so trivial, then I'd say that the punishment fits the cirme. Again: don't fly what you can't afford to lose. Basic wisdom in Eve. Losing 100,000 SP. Now THAT'S a big deal.
Then the punishment would be disproportionate to the crime. Please vote for me for CSM8-áhere
My recommended voting list |

Colonel Xaven
Decadence. RAZOR Alliance
266
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 15:04:00 -
[186] - Quote
The power of knowledge has ended this thread on page 1 afaik 
www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance |

March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
615
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 15:38:00 -
[187] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. So it works, then, seeing as how the target does suffer any time someone claims a bounty on him? some time ago i have had 39 millions of bounty and BIG RED MARK "WANTED"  few low-sec roams and i have no bounty.
Nothing changed for me.
When you get killed it doesn't matter if you have bounty or not - you are getting killed anyway. No one will stop firing if you have no bounty. When you kill someone his bounty is just pretty bonus to killmail. You get killmail + bounty? Great. You got killmail without bounty? Great.
So from point of normal pvp bounty adds nothing. It can't be main source of ISK: 20% of killed ship is too small to compensate your losses.
High-sec i spend like 2 or 3 months in high-sec with my bounty. Nothing happened. No one decided to meet CONCORD and gift me killrights to collect this bounty. So from high-sec pilot position bounty added nothing to my Eve life.
Putting bounty on someone: why? I still haven't one reason to spend a bit of my ISK (and i'm space rich) to put bounty on someone.
So from my point of view: bounty system is like "sugar" on top of my pvp life. It adds a little bonuses and that's all. If this is supposed result of this BIG SYSTEM then i'm ok with it. If this system is supposed to be considered by people - then it failed from start. |

Max Crysis
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2013.04.10 04:13:00 -
[188] - Quote
They should just make it simple. You have a 20 million bounty, if they kill you they get 20 million. Simple enough eh. |

Setaceous
Nexus Prima
21
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 04:30:00 -
[189] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Ralinastrife wrote:Propelled wrote:I'm not sure what you're talking about. If the kill is worth 10m, the payout is 2m. In order to get the whole 20m bounty, 100m would need to be destroyed. oh....LOL..so in other words if i place a bounty for 10mil and lets say the person uses a cheap ship and the total kill was like 1 mil. then the person that killed would get like 200k.. would i get the 9 mil back.. Its a cumulative bounty. Which means it will subtract it from the total of the bounty until there is none left. Indeed. Though I could do without the eve-mail spam when the numpty I put a bounty on gets shot up in his rookie ship 17 times in a row |

Karl Hobb
Stellar Ore Refinery and Crematorium
1503
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 05:52:00 -
[190] - Quote
Max Crysis wrote:They should just make it simple. You have a 20 million bounty, if they kill you they get 20 million. Simple enough eh. What if I kill myself with an alt? Always think about how you can game a system before suggesting changes, you'll find it's rarely "simple enough".
The bounty system was changed in an effort to prevent gaming the system and making bounties more meaningful, at least for those doing the killing. Professional bad guys were unfortunately not available so instead they sent me. |
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Mikhael Taron
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
29
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 08:49:00 -
[191] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. Dude, that wasn't just a one liner, those were clearly two lines, two sentences even ... o_O "Dude", that was two one-liners, both of which were fail attempts at smartarse humour. Do keep up. You can fool some of the people all of the time. You can fool all of the people some of the time. You can make a fool out of yourself anytime.
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Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
81
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 09:16:00 -
[192] - Quote
Mikhael Taron wrote:Debora Tsung wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Malcanis wrote: Since implants are no big deal, could I trouble you to contract me a few dozen +5 sets? I forgot to pick some up when I went to the store and now I'm all out.
Smartarse one-liners do not a point make. Also, never wear anything you can't afford to lose. Even noobs know that one. Dude, that wasn't just a one liner, those were clearly two lines, two sentences even ... o_O "Dude", that was two one-liners, both of which were fail attempts at smartarse humour. Do keep up.
True, but unlike You, he was right.  There's nothing a million chinese guys can't do cheaper. |

Hannott Thanos
Notorious Legion
543
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 09:53:00 -
[193] - Quote
March rabbit wrote:Tippia wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. So it works, then, seeing as how the target does suffer any time someone claims a bounty on him? some time ago i have had 39 millions of bounty and BIG RED MARK "WANTED"  few low-sec roams and i have no bounty. Nothing changed for me. Except the obvious fact that you lost your ship.
People kill people in real life too, even if they don't have bounties. If you have one, that only makes people want to kill you more. |

March rabbit
epTa Team Inc.
618
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 09:59:00 -
[194] - Quote
Hannott Thanos wrote:March rabbit wrote:Tippia wrote:Mikhael Taron wrote:Bounties will never work in a game where the wearer of the bounty suffers nothing when shot-up for the bounty. So it works, then, seeing as how the target does suffer any time someone claims a bounty on him? some time ago i have had 39 millions of bounty and BIG RED MARK "WANTED"  few low-sec roams and i have no bounty. Nothing changed for me. Except the obvious fact that you lost your ship. i lost 2 or 3 ships before bounty is empty. And i lost a couple after
As i said: nothing has changed for me
Hannott Thanos wrote: People kill people in real life too, even if they don't have bounties. If you have one, that only makes people want to kill you more.
"want" - is a very personal. I can't say if someone wants to kill me or not. Either he tries or not. And looking at my Eve life i can't say that i feel the difference between "with bounty" and "without" |
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