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Catastrophe Bloom
MUSE Apprenticeship Metaphysical Utopian Society Enterprises
1
|
Posted - 2013.07.27 23:54:00 -
[61] - Quote
But look at me - I'm adorable! |

Nariya Kentaya
Always Negative
660
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:02:00 -
[62] - Quote
Aya Shinomiya wrote:Dear EVE Online players,
When I am bored a little bit I often click around and look at the characters you guys have created. One thing according to the female characters is very ... prominent: It seems you guys mostly like big racks and half naked, skinny bodies.
I know that with a probability of 80 to 90% a man created the character. I am not a feminist. I think this a firstly a questions of aesthetics which of course depends on personal views. But I ask myself is this the imagination you have how a woman should be? This is not an attack on you guys. And I do not want to start a discussion of what you all thing is beautiful. I only wanted to show a conspicuity.
I do not tell you what to do. EVE Online is a free game for which you all pay. You can do what you want. I only wanted to give my opinion.
Regards. eh, i personally prefer my girls fairly athletic/fit, so, small chests. but thats just me (as opposed to 99% of the other average-american-men, who believe "all women should have DD's and be chained to the bedpost with no clothes"*)
*this is a summarised quote derived from no less than 12 men i knew through highschool and college |

James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
5700
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:04:00 -
[63] - Quote
ITT: Women saying their version of beauty is the only correct one. Men's idea of beauty is sexist, women's idea of it is empowerment. -áMy (mostly boring) Youtube channel. |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
663
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 00:30:00 -
[64] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:ITT: Women saying their version of beauty is the only correct one. Men's idea of beauty is sexist, women's idea of it is empowerment.
This.
I've always found that any woman who emphatically states that men's standards of female beauty are sexist, inappropriate, etc, typically would not be considered attractive based on those standards.
Have-nots, hating on the haves. A lot of human interaction and motivations can be ascribed to this. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Alpheias
Euphoria Released Verge of Collapse
2271
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 02:08:00 -
[65] - Quote
I wonder if there is more to this, because I like to "attribute" my characters with scars.... Allow me to be frank. You will not like me. You will not like me now, and you will not like men++ a good deal less as we go on. |

Akemi Kiyoura
The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People
8
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 02:18:00 -
[66] - Quote
I get free stuff because I have boobies. |

Bob Blunts
48
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 02:28:00 -
[67] - Quote
Isaac Collins wrote:No one cares, I repeat. No one. Not anyone, no individual exist with a real care for this matter. The game is 94% men (90% Male if you wanna be generous) We could have women looking like Quazymodo's grandad after he got his anus pillaged by the Willy Wonka and the chocolate factory and No one would legitimately care.
My only wish is that I could give this more than 1 like. |

Bronto Scorpio
Aliastra Gallente Federation
43
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 02:53:00 -
[68] - Quote
Pfft... Giant boobs... Regular boobs are great, also who needs cleavage portrait when you have hair portrait |

Cynter DeVries
Spheroidal Projections
531
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 03:04:00 -
[69] - Quote
Another player laid it out in a similar thread: - Identity - Masquerade - Propriety - Convenience
I think he missed one. Fun.
As to why the prevalence, the likely answer is simple demographics. Most Eve subscribers are from the U.S. and most American men have a preference for that attribute. (Tried to find the study I'd read on the subject of body type preferences by culture but gave up after five minutes...) |

Selena Brutor
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
1
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 03:40:00 -
[70] - Quote
Protip: Brutor women have the best lips and the most killer hips. |

Sol Kal'orr
TLSG
24
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 06:14:00 -
[71] - Quote
Bronto Scorpio wrote:Pfft... Giant boobs... Regular boobs are great, also who needs cleavage portrait when you have hair portrait
Amen. it's follicles or bust.
A lot of men prefer bust. |

Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
515
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 06:54:00 -
[72] - Quote
Aleander Brunsh wrote:the problem starts even before a player shows up: all female shoes have high heels. Even combat boots are raised. I mean, seriously, that just makes no sense whatsoever.
Glad to see that I'm not the only one exasperated by this ! :D
Also, huge racks and naked bodies are as ugly as faces are detailed in this game, imo. So a woman described by OP isn't even attractive. Still imo. :p
G££ <= Me |

S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
98
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 07:02:00 -
[73] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:This.
I've always found that any woman who emphatically states that men's standards of female beauty are sexist, inappropriate, etc, typically would not be considered attractive based on those standards.
Have-nots, hating on the haves. A lot of human interaction and motivations can be ascribed to this.
In an age where plastic surgery, clothes, makeup, and diet pills can fix everything, someone not adhering to a particular standard is very arguably a matter of choice.
While I typically loathe "oppression" based arguments, I find gripes about idolizing big boobs, tight skirts, and high heels fairly legitimate. It's hard to argue that a beauty standard which revolves around debilitating the opposite sex is anything but power-centric.
I also think it really shouldn't bother people as much as it does. Appearance has evolved the way it has because it's a time saver; being able to judge someone's personality, motivations, and constitution at a glance streamlines social interaction immensely. Similarly, if a man is fixated on these things and you're not into submission, why be upset that he reveals his nature sooner than later?
I fall into the "anything more than a handful is a waste" camp so... grain of salt. |

S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
98
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 07:09:00 -
[74] - Quote
Aya Shinomiya wrote:That is right. The gender is choosen very late in the development of an unborn child. But I think it is more a symbol for fertility. We are all still driven by instincts.
I can't tell if you're serious or not, but I'm pretty sure gender is determined at conception. It doesn't get much earlier than that. |

Bienator II
madmen of the skies
1873
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 07:50:00 -
[75] - Quote
i am totally into grim looking old men with metal plates in the head. eve style bounties (done) dust boarding parties imagine there is war and everybody cloaks - join FW |

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
1490
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 08:19:00 -
[76] - Quote
S Byerley wrote:Aya Shinomiya wrote:That is right. The gender is choosen very late in the development of an unborn child. But I think it is more a symbol for fertility. We are all still driven by instincts. I can't tell if you're serious or not, but I'm pretty sure gender is determined at conception. It doesn't get much earlier than that. Also, wtf is "******" censored? People do understand the "he who must not be named" bits are satire right? Censoring history is not OK.
Let's sort this out.
Gender is determined upon conception. Anyway, the earlier stages of embryonic development are common and so at an early stage everyone had the same precursor structures. Later those structures develop in a way or another depending on hormones, but the point of "everyone was female" is not accurate, as commonality affects non gender-specific structures. As fascinating as is the topological transformation of those structures into gender specific genitals, males never had a vagina or a womb.
And just in case you wonder what are the edge cases of such embryo development...
66-Year-Old Hong Kong Man Discovers He Is Woman After Doctor Visit Reveals He Has Turner Syndrome
CCP Unifex: -á"lurking single players (...)-áare the majority of characters on Tranquility"
...And so now we know why CCP hasn't done anything for soloers since Apochrypha. |

Accidentally Myname
Myname Replacement Brokerage LLC
21
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 08:57:00 -
[77] - Quote
I think I should be resculpted with larger breasts. If i could also be resculpted with the ability to make a sammich and fetch a beer that would great. |

Jessica Onzo
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 09:19:00 -
[78] - Quote
We all know that 95% of all EvE players are dudes how ever Female toons are cuter to look at. |

Jessica Onzo
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 09:23:00 -
[79] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:S Byerley wrote:Aya Shinomiya wrote:That is right. The gender is choosen very late in the development of an unborn child. But I think it is more a symbol for fertility. We are all still driven by instincts. I can't tell if you're serious or not, but I'm pretty sure gender is determined at conception. It doesn't get much earlier than that. Also, wtf is "******" censored? People do understand the "he who must not be named" bits are satire right? Censoring history is not OK. Let's sort this out. Gender is determined upon conception. Anyway, the earlier stages of embryonic development are common and so at an early stage everyone had the same precursor structures. Later those structures develop in a way or another depending on hormones, but the point of "everyone was female" is not accurate, as commonality affects non gender-specific structures. As fascinating as is the topological transformation of those structures into gender specific genitals, males never had a vagina or a womb. And just in case you wonder what are the edge cases of such embryo development... 66-Year-Old Hong Kong Man Discovers He Is Woman After Doctor Visit Reveals He Has Turner Syndrome
Biology class in EvE, LOL love it! Yes you are correct the mother has a XX (female) chromosome. The father provides an XY (male) or XX (female). |

kes88
Swords of Persephone
27
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 09:45:00 -
[80] - Quote
Aya Shinomiya wrote:Dear EVE Online players,
When I am bored a little bit I often click around and look at the characters you guys have created. One thing according to the female characters is very ... prominent: It seems you guys mostly like big racks and half naked, skinny bodies.
I know that with a probability of 80 to 90% a man created the character. I am not a feminist. I think this a firstly a questions of aesthetics which of course depends on personal views. But I ask myself is this the imagination you have how a woman should be? This is not an attack on you guys. And I do not want to start a discussion of what you all thing is beautiful. I only wanted to show a conspicuity.
I do not tell you what to do. EVE Online is a free game for which you all pay. You can do what you want. I only wanted to give my opinion.
Regards.
I haven't bothered to read this entire thread but I do have a couple of things to say:
If you have a problem with the way people make female avatars busty or overly make-up -y I don't think Eve is really where you're going to change attutudes...they're just avatars.
The core of the problem with society's attitudes towards how women 'should' look is actually far more simple. You should probably start with magazines such as Heat and Grazia if you want to question portrayal of women, rather than a game.
|

Isaac Collins
Insanely Twisted D3vil's Childr3n
35
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 10:10:00 -
[81] - Quote
How much longer do we have to pretend like your opinion matters at all to anyone? I'd love for us to have real EVE discussions like bitching about how avatars would like if we could actually walk them around and outside of the CQ. Maybe then this situation could be remotely fart worthy of mention. |

Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
167
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 11:22:00 -
[82] - Quote
The Eve character creator does not really allow you to create a completely flat character. This character was designed to be petite with almost all the sliders set to the minimum. Although I do not think I would go much lower with breast, hip or rear size it is interesting that it isn't even an option.
I also almost have her in one of the Sterling shirts, but currently have the Avenue on to show off the new sleeve. |

J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
848
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 11:25:00 -
[83] - Quote
Wait till Femen find out that we female avatars can't remove our tops ... there will be hell to pay in Iceland and an invasion of half naked Russian chicks ... oh the horror ..  This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.-á Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless |

Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy Caldari State
36
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 12:41:00 -
[84] - Quote
J3ssica Alba wrote:Wait till Femen find out that we female avatars can't remove our tops ... there will be hell to pay in Iceland and an invasion of half naked Russian chicks ... oh the horror .. 
Recently I saw an interview on RT with one of these Femen. They really live in their own world.
|

Remiel Pollard
Uitraan Diversified Holdings Incorporated
1561
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 12:48:00 -
[85] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:ITT: Women saying their version of beauty is the only correct one. Men's idea of beauty is sexist, women's idea of it is empowerment. This. I've always found that any woman who emphatically states that men's standards of female beauty are sexist, inappropriate, etc, typically would not be considered attractive based on those standards. Have-nots, hating on the haves. A lot of human interaction and motivations can be ascribed to this.
I wonder then if radical feminism isn't actually an inherent hatred of men, but rather ironically, an inherent hatred of other women instead. This line of reasoning would indeed go a long way towards suggesting that, and it's not entirely far fetched. Just think of all the times you've encountered supposed feminists telling other women how they should live their lives in order to be a 'real' feminist, the 'with us or against us' mentality. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |

Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Academy The ROC
673
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 13:00:00 -
[86] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:ITT: Women saying their version of beauty is the only correct one. Men's idea of beauty is sexist, women's idea of it is empowerment. This. I've always found that any woman who emphatically states that men's standards of female beauty are sexist, inappropriate, etc, typically would not be considered attractive based on those standards. Have-nots, hating on the haves. A lot of human interaction and motivations can be ascribed to this. I wonder then if radical feminism isn't actually an inherent hatred of men, but rather ironically, an inherent hatred of other women instead. This line of reasoning would indeed go a long way towards suggesting that, and it's not entirely far fetched. Just think of all the times you've encountered supposed feminists telling other women how they should live their lives in order to be a 'real' feminist, the 'with us or against us' mentality.
Oh, you have no idea...
I can't keep count of how many other women have attempted to tell my wife that she isn't really happy being a housewife and a stay at home mom, and those same women scream and howl about how much they hate working in their very next forum post.
It's actually observable very easily. For instance, the majority of men like long hair on women. However, attempt to observe (or get the conversation secondhand) a group of married women discussing the possibility of one of them cutting her hair. "oh, it would look so cute on you!" and "it would make you look more youthful!", etc, etc. It does no such thing, however, and subconsciously they are aware of this. But in groupthink, lowering someone else's attractiveness is the same thing as improving yours, without even having to do anything.
Also note, that in almost every case, none of them will tell her to ask the one person whose opinion *should* be most important when it comes to her attractiveness. Her husband. Instead, she dresses and behaves in the manner of the consensu of whatever her social group is.
I have seen this in groups of women from figure skaters to book clubs to cheerleaders to business executives. Same thing, every time. Not posting on my main, and loving it.-á Because free speech.-á |

Remiel Pollard
Uitraan Diversified Holdings Incorporated
1562
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 13:45:00 -
[87] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:ITT: Women saying their version of beauty is the only correct one. Men's idea of beauty is sexist, women's idea of it is empowerment. This. I've always found that any woman who emphatically states that men's standards of female beauty are sexist, inappropriate, etc, typically would not be considered attractive based on those standards. Have-nots, hating on the haves. A lot of human interaction and motivations can be ascribed to this. I wonder then if radical feminism isn't actually an inherent hatred of men, but rather ironically, an inherent hatred of other women instead. This line of reasoning would indeed go a long way towards suggesting that, and it's not entirely far fetched. Just think of all the times you've encountered supposed feminists telling other women how they should live their lives in order to be a 'real' feminist, the 'with us or against us' mentality. Oh, you have no idea... I can't keep count of how many other women have attempted to tell my wife that she isn't really happy being a housewife and a stay at home mom, and those same women scream and howl about how much they hate working in their very next forum post. It's actually observable very easily. For instance, the majority of men like long hair on women. However, attempt to observe (or get the conversation secondhand) a group of married women discussing the possibility of one of them cutting her hair. "oh, it would look so cute on you!" and "it would make you look more youthful!", etc, etc. It does no such thing, however, and subconsciously they are aware of this. But in groupthink, lowering someone else's attractiveness is the same thing as improving yours, without even having to do anything. Also note, that in almost every case, none of them will tell her to ask the one person whose opinion *should* be most important when it comes to her attractiveness. Her husband. Instead, she dresses and behaves in the manner of the consensu of whatever her social group is. I have seen this in groups of women from figure skaters to book clubs to cheerleaders to business executives. Same thing, every time.
Er... I think you chose a 'too specific' example. I know plenty of guys that like women with shorter hair. I'm one of 'em. I hate getting a mouthful of it when spooning.
Long or short though, the most important thing about a woman for me is that she is capable of conversation, compassion, honesty (mostly with herself, because being honest with others is a natural follow on), and rationality, she has to know when it's time to have some fun, and she has to know when it's time to stop having fun and start taking things seriously. Maturity is important, but likewise, so is knowing when to be a little immature.
As for a woman's physical appearance.... someone once told me it's like autistic people almost automatically see 'beyond' the surface features of someone and straight to their character. I guess I'm kinda like a dog that way, seeing in greyscale - everyone looks the same to me. But, I do have preferences. I like petite women, I have a thing for glasses, and I like short hair. I think that's about it.
But yeah, I get what you're saying. It's always easier to bring someone else down than it is to pull yourself up, but it's more a matter of perception. How we want to be perceived, and how we perceive others. It's the same for men. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |

Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy Caldari State
36
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 13:45:00 -
[88] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote: Oh, you have no idea...
I can't keep count of how many other women have attempted to tell my wife that she isn't really happy being a housewife and a stay at home mom, and those same women scream and howl about how much they hate working in their very next forum post.
It's actually observable very easily. For instance, the majority of men like long hair on women. However, attempt to observe (or get the conversation secondhand) a group of married women discussing the possibility of one of them cutting her hair. "oh, it would look so cute on you!" and "it would make you look more youthful!", etc, etc. It does no such thing, however, and subconsciously they are aware of this. But in groupthink, lowering someone else's attractiveness is the same thing as improving yours, without even having to do anything.
Also note, that in almost every case, none of them will tell her to ask the one person whose opinion *should* be most important when it comes to her attractiveness. Her husband. Instead, she dresses and behaves in the manner of the consensu of whatever her social group is.
I have seen this in groups of women from figure skaters to book clubs to cheerleaders to business executives. Same thing, every time.
In psychology and sociology group behavior of humans is very important. I studied it in some lectures on college. Humans are social beings. They need to fit themselfs into some kind of group. If they do not they become ill. You can also see different group behaviors between men and woman based on the different thinkings of men (rational, logical) and woman (emphatic, emotional). Even the brains are different. The female brain is smaller but more efficient. The male brain is bigger. |

James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance
5710
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 14:02:00 -
[89] - Quote
Jessica Onzo wrote:Biology class in EvE, LOL love it! Yes you are correct the mother has a XX (female) chromosome. The father provides an XY (male) or XX (female). The mother provides X, the father provides X or Y. The resulting zygote and subsequent child then has XX chromosomes and is female, or XY chromosomes and is male.
For simplicity's sake this is of course discounting the less common possibilities where the child may have different combinations of sex chromosomes. -áMy (mostly boring) Youtube channel. |

Teinyhr
A Club for Reputable Gentlemen
178
|
Posted - 2013.07.28 14:59:00 -
[90] - Quote
Tein would be nearly or completely flat if only the character creator allowed it. |
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