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darth solo
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:25:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: Dak Hakin
Its real easy for people flying HACs and battleships to say "I'm making too much money!11!1 this suxors!". Not all of us have the capabilities to npc in 0.0 with a 1million ISK bounty per rat. I currently have less than 2 million in my wallet and I would kind of like to make some more, so that I can buy more skills etc.
Please dont nerf npc bounties or loot.
as im a nice guy and its christmas and all, ill help u out with NPCing in Fountain(access and good areas)... Fountain is bursting with good NPCs. I own fountain its MINE and im gorging on it the now like a fat kid eating his xmas dinner. .
d "nice guy" solo.
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Evil Mckenna
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:25:00 -
[62]
dao your a nut
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fairimear
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:26:00 -
[63]
shhhh, why complain i thought PA needed all the funds it could get these days/
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:28:00 -
[64]
Originally by: darth solo
as im a nice guy and its christmas and all, ill help u out with NPCing in Fountain(access and good areas)... Fountain is bursting with good NPCs. I own fountain its MINE and im gorging on it the now like a fat kid eating his xmas dinner..
d "nice guy" solo.
I might have something to say about that. I still haven't been able to stuff the Snake Delta implant I looted from a 9 million bounty commander rat down my throat yet. Anyone want to buy it? lol
And Fountain's mine, all mine! Darth Solo lies, stay away! (Besides, he was on the "Women Of Celestial Apocalypse calendar, and that was a disturbing sight, indeed - a better reason to avoid the area is hard to imagine.)
-Wrayeth
Go away. |
Admiral Koutsoudas
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:29:00 -
[65]
Can someone give me an example of what you get for loot then? 
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Shai Faetal
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:29:00 -
[66]
maybe this is al part of ccp's evil plan to populate the rest of 0.0, where the ppl blobbing jita aren't ?.
I think its a good thing, with many new items worth like titan/mothership bpo, even for a decent alliance getting the isk for them is a huge task, with the new npc bounty and loot tabes it may be a little more viable to do so for those who dont enjoy mining as much as i do (teh nubs).
i have been hunting the last 2 days in a low level 0.0 system and the spawns are better then they where in high lvl 0.0 pre-rmr. even finding 2-3 faction rats, been making about 5-15mil/hour + the loot, alot of named mods.
but 1 thing bothers me alot... ALL the RATS DRop 1MN AFTERBURNERS!!##, like wtf  . not even 1 other propulsion upgrade, but only 1mn ab's 1 out 50 is a named 1mn ab
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^_^ my sig is better then urs, damn right! ^_^ |
superscarface
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:29:00 -
[67]
Ive only read the first page of this thread, so im not sure if this is mentioned. Npcing yeah, its crazy now, I like it :)
Moreover, complexes seem to be a big money maker. Whats up with npc damages nowadays? I was tanking dual 750k spawns with a medium rep on my apoc? In a complex, we had once guy tanking 8 battleships with a large armour rep!!
Member of the : ISS |
Kay Brack
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:32:00 -
[68]
Man you guys don't know much about economics. What will happen when all your drops and 6000 other peoples drops hit the market ?
Heads up it will make things cheep for nubes like me to afford. I love the thought of it happening though some of the prices in this game are just stupid.
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:33:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Wrayeth on 18/12/2005 11:35:17
Originally by: Admiral Koutsoudas
Can someone give me an example of what you get for loot then?
/me hides his 3 heavy electrochemical cap injectors, 4 large accomodation armor reps, countless n-type armor hardeners...
...and modal mega ion blaster (yes, they actually drop, now!).
Of course, that's from almost 24 hours of intensive NPCing (12 hours yesterday, 12 today).
-Wrayeth
Go away. |
Haniblecter Teg
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:34:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Copine Callmeknau
um
So, according to many people here, enticing people to go outside the safety zone is bad and people should stay in high sec to make the game less dynamic?
dubbleyou tee eff?
^^^^What he said^^^^
This series is called exodus. If you look at average pilots in space, there is no 'exodus' at the moment.
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Friends Forever |
Kunming
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:39:00 -
[71]
I'm glad the devs gave the 0.0 folk a cookie, last time I ratted I logged off with disgust cause of the pathetic cruisers the NPC send after me.
Besides ppl in 0.0 are the ones that pvp the most and take the highest risk, they might be earning more ISK now but they also keep loosing/spending lots of it on war effords. I believe these changes will bring in more action to 0.0, which is nothing I would even complain about.
If u feel the need to nerf something look at the T2 producer in Jita who sits in the station all day putting up buy and sell orders, while cooking more T2 stuff in the factories, without any risk. IMO life in empire and 0.0 just got balanced.
Website
Killboard |
Shittake
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:39:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Hans Roaming
Dao, if you look at the numbers of people in space well there are thousands in Empire and a few in 0.0 so I hardly think that it's going to be the huge pump of isk into the economy that it was before. Until now it was hard actually getting people to leave their level 4 missions and come to 0.0 as the risk reward balance was too harsh in CWE.
Now it may be that where you are you're getting triple BS spawns, but that's not 1 jump from empire I bet, you're in a war zone if I remember and you have to watch local at all times in case a hostile comes in at which point you have to hunt them and kill them to keep your space clear. Now all this is different from undocking in Jita in an NPC corp and running level 4s all day as there is zero risk in doing that.
What this actually might be is the carrot that lures people away from high sec into low sec and 0.0 and how would that be a bad thing to get more people out of the theme park and into the sandbox. I predict a lot more pressure on 0.0 alliances now for resources from empire which of course is going to make everything more exciting. I mean there is nothing worse than having 0.0 space and in CWE wondering what could entice your indy people out there (Providence), well now with POS manufacturing and adv refineries as well as NPC's there actually is.
TBH now with the capital ships and all the new T2 ships including the BS coming down the line this is a good things as otherwise all the high end stuff will never be seen let alone used by the bulk of people in Eve. Remember the sinks in the form of BPO and skills for capital ships have also hugely increased so why not the forms of income and if they are in 0.0 then wow I'm all for that.
If you combine these NPC changes with the new starbase assembly arrays and the prevalance of trailer spawns to be farmed (which seems to be better after the patch) in deep 0.0, then you have a template for deep 0.0 capital ship production. A couple adequately equipped large POSes, about 8-10 people with multiple accounts across euro/northam timezone, and you have youself an almost self-contained mining/production operation (except for a local friendly refine conquerable station where you can recycle crap loot until some kind of Recycling Array is introduced).
While you get 3 battleships now instead of 1 before, you seem to see more trailer spawns (anecdotal evidence of course) than before the patch. The NPCs are just one of the really cool changes in this patch which makes deep 0.0 sapce WAY more attractive. If I remember correctly, the mass population of 0.0 space was a goal of the Devs, get the blob out of empire. If things stay as they are now, this will certainly do that.
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Pabs Sco
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:52:00 -
[73]
Well my point of view on this follows:
If NPC'ing is profitable then more will switch from mining to rat hunting...therefore less minerals on the market, mineral prices will increase as they become rarer. People who loss stuff NPC'ing ned to replace, but less people manufacturing, due to less minerals...market prices get higher, rat bounty seems less insignificant, as it costs more to buy buy replacements...makes sense no?
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Wrayeth
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:52:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Kunming
I'm glad the devs gave the 0.0 folk a cookie, last time I ratted I logged off with disgust cause of the pathetic cruisers the NPC send after me.
QFT! I was so heartily sick of the cruiser spawns showing up in nine out of ten belts that I gave up on ratting except when I had no choice but to grind ISK.
Quote:
Besides ppl in 0.0 are the ones that pvp the most and take the highest risk, they might be earning more ISK now but they also keep loosing/spending lots of it on war effords. I believe these changes will bring in more action to 0.0, which is nothing I would even complain about.
Damned straight - I started playing again now that I can afford PvP and also squirrel away money for a capital ship.
Quote:
If u feel the need to nerf something look at the T2 producer in Jita who sits in the station all day putting up buy and sell orders, while cooking more T2 stuff in the factories, without any risk. IMO life in empire and 0.0 just got balanced.
QFT (again)!
-Wrayeth
Go away. |
Jerusaleman
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:26:00 -
[75]
Edited by: Jerusaleman on 18/12/2005 12:27:38
Originally by: Dao 2
Sup all,
Just have to say :S
Patch seems to be stabilisng now and its nicer and all ;p, but i see one horrible thing :| the new npc changes are absolutely crazy. Now i live in .0, and am inpcing right now ;p so it's not like OMG NERF THE PPL GETTING RICH!!!! T
hough I agree with the risk v reward the new amount of BSes that show up with spawns is god damn crazy! I make more money then I ever had now :o. Im perfectly fine with being rich and all ;p but my problem is that its gonna pump A LOT of isk into the game... REALLY fast...
So I don't really thing this is a good thing :/
ur comments? ;p
what a tool
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Jerusaleman
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:27:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Dao 2
Sup all,
Just have to say :S
Patch seems to be stabilisng now and its nicer and all ;p, but i see one horrible thing :| the new npc changes are absolutely crazy. Now i live in .0, and am inpcing right now ;p so it's not like OMG NERF THE PPL GETTING RICH!!!! T
hough I agree with the risk v reward the new amount of BSes that show up with spawns is god damn crazy! I make more money then I ever had now :o. Im perfectly fine with being rich and all ;p but my problem is that its gonna pump A LOT of isk into the game... REALLY fast...
So I don't really thing this is a good thing :/
ur comments? ;p
stfu and sit down knob cheese
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marioman
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:30:00 -
[77]
All this talk of "pumping too much isnt into the market"
Did any1 remember the new cap ships? what is it 65 BILLION isk for a single titan bpo, not to mention the bpos for the components, the POS itself needed to build the ships, and the modules for the ship itself. Then you also have the carrier and mothership bpos. We are talking trillions in isk sinks.
Maybe they had to make npc'ing better in some way to counter the massive isk sinks they added with RMR.
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McArthur BR
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:10:00 -
[78]
I don't really think that NPCing is more profitable then mining...
Mining crokite, i make +-39mil per hour, including the corp taxes and selling zyd for 3500 (and donating the nocx)
--------------------------------
The Canadian got in a store and said to the seller:
- I'm a Canadian and I can kill you!
- Can what?
- Canadian! |
Nyphur
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:12:00 -
[79]
Originally by: McArthur BR
I don't really think that NPCing is more profitable then mining...
Mining crokite, i make +-39mil per hour, including the corp taxes and selling zyd for 3500 (and donating the nocx)
That's the thing, they're comparing low end mining to high end npcing. You can make a lot NPCing now but only in the same places you can make a lot mining.
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turnschuh
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:46:00 -
[80]
about 5-15mil per hour when ratting in 0.0
not a big deal. but It got better yeah and I think its just fine now
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Skarsnik
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:47:00 -
[81]
I'm definatly enjoying the changes to the NPC's a good move on CCP's part. Tis may possibly have more of an impact o the whole macro-miner debacle too. With more isk flowing into the game from the NPC bounties the less likely people will be tempted into that demon of 'Buying ISK'.
Not usre if thats CCP's intentions from this change but it could be a possibility 
-------------------------------------------------
Statement of the Obvious
Contrary to Popular belief - it is NOT possible to walk on water.
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Wendat Huron
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:49:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Snake Jankins
... Triple BS spawns were white common for me...
Freudian slip from herr german here? 
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Chucky
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:52:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: Dao 2
Originally by: aeti
any stuff that makes 0.0 better is good
then makes isk worthless ;p?
Definitely needs looked at. We all remember what happened when players could make 20-50mil/hour doing level 4 missions, don't we? They nerfed them because they were upsetting the economy. If the same has been done here, it needs a look.
How was agent *****s paying 100mil for Arb seige launchers and 200 mill for ravens upseting the economy again?
... you will see more and more marketing which in turn will bring you more players to torture. |
Himo Amasacia
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Posted - 2005.12.18 14:57:00 -
[84]
Sounds to me like they need to mix more frig escorts into the mix really. I noticed the lack of frigs rating in a 0.3 last night myself. Toss in a few more 4000 isk frogs with warp scramblers and the risk is back with no real increase to bounty generation
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Unknown Subject
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Posted - 2005.12.18 15:24:00 -
[85]
comments? my comment to you is stfu in future because the devs will now get the nerf bat out. its because of big mouthed A-holes like you at the good things in games get removed. fking whiners...
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2005.12.18 15:46:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Nyphur on 18/12/2005 15:54:27
Originally by: Unknown Subject
comments? my comment to you is stfu in future because the devs will now get the nerf bat out. its because of big mouthed A-holes like you at the good things in games get removed. fking whiners...
Bigger isn't nececarilly better. Level 4 mission rewards were bigger. They were ruining the game and were rebalanced. If this does the same (which it appears not to, after some investigateion, since you can mine and make more), it would be broken and need rebalanced.
I'm curious. If you found an exploit, would you petition it or are you the type of player who would exploit it and ***** when it gets fixed?
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Jim Hsu
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Posted - 2005.12.18 22:48:00 -
[87]
Edited by: Jim Hsu on 18/12/2005 22:53:09
Edited by: Jim Hsu on 18/12/2005 22:50:28
I'll try to look at this analytically.
On today with a player record of 20000, about 1500-2000 people (aggressive estimate) are in 0.0. Let's assume at any given time, 20-40% are ratting (as opposed to mining, fighting, traveling, etc).
NPCing is roughly 2-3 times as profitable now compared to the past. With a commonly thrown around figure of 20-30M/hour, I'm guessing the improvement to be .. um... 15M/hour?
That would introduce about 8B/hour (add/subtract a few B). It would also introduce an item/loot value of about the same amount.
Since timezone flunctuations (20000 is peak), avg 0.0 people is more like 1000-1500, making the value mmore like 5.5B/hour for 23/7 (~120B/day).
This would subsequently enter empire markets. Obviously, a significant portion of this would stay within 0.0, for alliance purchases (PvP, etc).
Probable effects:
-Prices of "uber-loot" will increase, as 0.0 people bid on them for their ships. However, since there is an element of risk factored in, that keeps it in control as people are unwilling to fly what they can't afford to lose (unlike empire people). Since the journey is arduous from 0.0 to empire, this discourages people from purchasing empire items, and encourages purchase of 0.0 equivalents.
-Prices of dropped loot (t1, named) will decrease significantly as markets are flooded. Considering the influx of newbies, this will too be in control as newbies scramble to buy cheap named/t1 loot. AND also since the journey is arduous from 0.0 to empire, less people are willing to make runs with cheap loot to empire (more items would stay in 0.0).
-0.0 people entry may increase, if there are other incentives (e.g. corp recruitment). This would have an effect of driving down profit (and this the number of people coming in would equalize).
-And the essential fact: this money is lost as 0.0 people spend money killing things and being killed.
Overall, this would have an effect, but not as much as L4's did pre-Cold War, since the geographical and numerical distribution of people is completely different.
--
If you're a math wizard, help me here:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=255750&page=1
:)
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Arewen Elendil
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Posted - 2005.12.18 23:01:00 -
[88]
Well, I was in 0.3 space, Akora, or nearby. Hanging around the stargate were 2 NPC rats worth 85K each. So i took a shot. They fought back, but my little Merlin lost only a third of its shield against each of them. 190K for 2 very easy kills.
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Deja Thoris
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Posted - 2005.12.18 23:04:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Jim Hsu
...
I dont even pretend to know how many people do xxx.
I can tell you your assumptions are way off though. You are looking at the whole population base as if they are all capable of ratting in 0.0
Add to this, more people ratting = more ISK around and more loot drops. These offset each other.
We as players do not have the tools to analyse this accurately.
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Dao 2
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Posted - 2005.12.18 23:06:00 -
[90]
Originally by: TogetherAsOne
Where the hell are you guys NPCing? I've gone a little ways into 0.0 to check out the situation but seemed to have the usual frig or cruiser groups with a few BS spawns in there (although better BS spawns when i saw them). No BS all over the place like i've heard. Must be deep in 0.0, eh? 
yeah it is deeper .0 ;p
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