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Dak Hakin	Posted - 2005.12.17 05:25:00 - [31] Its real easy for people flying HACs and battleships to say "I'm making too much money!11!1 this suxors!". Not all of us have the capabilities to npc in 0.0 with a 1million ISK bounty per rat. I currently have less than 2 million in my wallet and I would kind of like to make some more, so that I can buy more skills etc. Please dont nerf npc bounties or loot. _______________________________________________ If you fear the thorn, do not crave the rose Mr. Grumpy-sour-pus
Nyphur	Posted - 2005.12.17 05:30:00 - [32] Originally by: Dak Hakin Its real easy for people flying HACs and battleships to say "I'm making too much money!11!1 this suxors!". Not all of us have the capabilities to npc in 0.0 with a 1million ISK bounty per rat. I currently have less than 2 million in my wallet and I would kind of like to make some more, so that I can buy more skills etc. Please dont nerf npc bounties or loot. I think you're missing the point. They're saying the highest end rats in 0.0 will net you more ISK than mining there. You wouldn't be affected by a nerf to that at all if you don't go to 0.0.
Dak Hakin	Posted - 2005.12.17 05:32:00 - [33] Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Dak Hakin Its real easy for people flying HACs and battleships to say "I'm making too much money!11!1 this suxors!". Not all of us have the capabilities to npc in 0.0 with a 1million ISK bounty per rat. I currently have less than 2 million in my wallet and I would kind of like to make some more, so that I can buy more skills etc. Please dont nerf npc bounties or loot. I think you're missing the point. They're saying the highest end rats in 0.0 will net you more ISK than mining there. You wouldn't be affected by a nerf to that at all if you don't go to 0.0. Ahh ok. I did miss the point then _______________________________________________ If you fear the thorn, do not crave the rose Mr. Grumpy-sour-pus
Raem Civrie	Posted - 2005.12.17 05:50:00 - [34] How high is it compared to lvl 4 missions? Similar gains per hour? --- God-King of Genitalia
Dao 2	Posted - 2005.12.17 06:25:00 - [35] Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:25:45 i get anywhere between 2-4 mil avg on a spawn, more if its dread or officer (havent run into one of those since patch) i can kill a spawn in like 5 min edit: and tank mining isnt much of an option when ur jammed or nossed or theres 3 bses shootin u ;p
Nyphur	Posted - 2005.12.17 06:28:00 - [36] Originally by: Dao 2 Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:25:45 i get anywhere between 2-4 mil avg on a spawn, more if its dread or officer (havent run into one of those since patch) i can kill a spawn in like 5 min edit: and tank mining isnt much of an option when ur jammed or nossed or theres 3 bses shootin u ;p You've obviously never mined in a deimos! The ultime sacriligle to a lovely battle vessel. Mining.
Dao 2	Posted - 2005.12.17 06:33:00 - [37] Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:33:17 Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Dao 2 Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:25:45 i get anywhere between 2-4 mil avg on a spawn, more if its dread or officer (havent run into one of those since patch) i can kill a spawn in like 5 min edit: and tank mining isnt much of an option when ur jammed or nossed or theres 3 bses shootin u ;p You've obviously never mined in a deimos! The ultime sacriligle to a lovely battle vessel. Mining. apoc with dcm 2s and crystals ;p edit: there was a dread that mined veld :\|
Hllaxiu	Posted - 2005.12.17 06:43:00 - [38] Originally by: Dao 2 Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:33:17 Originally by: Nyphur Originally by: Dao 2 Edited by: Dao 2 on 17/12/2005 06:25:45 i get anywhere between 2-4 mil avg on a spawn, more if its dread or officer (havent run into one of those since patch) i can kill a spawn in like 5 min edit: and tank mining isnt much of an option when ur jammed or nossed or theres 3 bses shootin u ;p You've obviously never mined in a deimos! The ultime sacriligle to a lovely battle vessel. Mining. apoc with dcm 2s and crystals ;p edit: there was a dread that mined veld :\| See, but thats USEFUL!
Snake Jankins	Posted - 2005.12.17 07:17:00 - [39] We, who have been hunting angels, were suffering from difficult npcs and not so good loot anyway. ( The two officers that I got solo in half a year don't make that big difference and count as luck, since I haven't got one for myself in the last 5 months or so although I'm hunting often up to 6 hours non-stop, when I needed money. And that never made me rich except the lucky officers spans ofc. ) And (angel) loot isn't as expensive as it once was. E.g. Arbalest siege Launchers have dropped to 1/4th of the price in the last year. So yes, hunting in 0.0 is more rewarding now in RMR, but there are people who make lots of money with mining arkanor in 0.0. Others are farming 10/10 complexes in 0.0 and earn lots of money by it. <I insert a quote here in a minute to show you some numbers> So now the usualy rat hunter gets a nice income, too. I like it. ___________ 'Only ships can be assembled, this is a Frigate.'
Bariina Tizhaan	Posted - 2005.12.17 07:20:00 - [40] I don't think that it will upset 0.0 economy in the long run. If ratters have more money then they'll surely pay more for items to purchase. As it is some of the low end mins are more expensive than in empire, just to encourage people to mine them. I'd hope to see it balance out. It'll also be an incentive for people to mine in groups as those on overwatch will earn money directly from protection rather than being paid afterwards.
Dao 2	Posted - 2005.12.17 07:25:00 - [41] Originally by: Bariina Tizhaan I don't think that it will upset 0.0 economy in the long run. If ratters have more money then they'll surely pay more for items to purchase. As it is some of the low end mins are more expensive than in empire, just to encourage people to mine them. I'd hope to see it balance out. It'll also be an incentive for people to mine in groups as those on overwatch will earn money directly from protection rather than being paid afterwards. im not afraid of it upsetting the .0 economy. im afraid of it upsetting the ENTIRE eve economy. Pumping that much isk into the game will surely cause massive inflation :\|
Snake Jankins	Posted - 2005.12.17 07:41:00 - [42] Edited by: Snake Jankins on 17/12/2005 07:42:26 I was talking about complex runners and wanted to edit it a quote in later, but guess it just would get lost, so: Originally by: Evil Thug 7b loss - is not too much for brag about. You must include, that you killed complex whoring alt. 1 completing of 10\10 complex = 700kk - 2000kk. So - i highly doubt, that its great loss for him. (quoted from here ) It describes 0.0 complex farming pre-rmr. So imho high-min mining, complex farming and t2 industry in case you have good BPOs are fields, where a lot of money is made. Now rat hunting got a upgrade, but I don't think that it's uber. If I spend a full day angel rat hunting, like a few hours before DT and the whole afternoon, I end with maybe 100 mil in bounties and a lot of loot, but the loot wasn't good before RMR in case of angels, now it's better, but the price for t1 loot is dropping anyway and will drop even faster now. If I mine arkanor or farm complexes a whole day, I think I make a lot of money, too. ___________ 'Only ships can be assembled, this is a Frigate.'
Dao 2	Posted - 2005.12.17 08:16:00 - [43] Originally by: Snake Jankins Edited by: Snake Jankins on 17/12/2005 07:42:26 I was talking about complex runners and wanted to edit it a quote in later, but guess it just would get lost, so: Originally by: Evil Thug 7b loss - is not too much for brag about. You must include, that you killed complex whoring alt. 1 completing of 10\10 complex = 700kk - 2000kk. So - i highly doubt, that its great loss for him. (quoted from here ) It describes 0.0 complex farming pre-rmr. So imho high-min mining, complex farming and t2 industry in case you have good BPOs are fields, where a lot of money is made. Now rat hunting got a upgrade, but I don't think that it's uber. If I spend a full day angel rat hunting, like a few hours before DT and the whole afternoon, I end with maybe 100 mil in bounties and a lot of loot, but the loot wasn't good before RMR in case of angels, now it's better, but the price for t1 loot is dropping anyway and will drop even faster now. If I mine arkanor or farm complexes a whole day, I think I make a lot of money, too. at least the isk is in items that can be sold :/ not ruin the value of the isk
TogetherAsOne	Posted - 2005.12.18 10:50:00 - [44] Where the hell are you guys NPCing? I've gone a little ways into 0.0 to check out the situation but seemed to have the usual frig or cruiser groups with a few BS spawns in there (although better BS spawns when i saw them). No BS all over the place like i've heard. Must be deep in 0.0, eh?
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.12.18 10:53:00 - [45] get rich get the ISK and the assets now because this will be nerfed at some point - the flip side is more in 0.0 and also more PVP leading to more ISK sinks. So take advantage as the rest of us are doing because eventually a new balance will be found after CCP hotfixes etc. CCP please restore the recruitment channel
James Lyrus	Posted - 2005.12.18 10:56:00 - [46] L4 missions were a problem, not because they were large amounts of isk, but because they was no competition for L4 missions. 0.0 ratting is different - you make money, but then people can come and pop your ship, so... -- Lyrus Associates is recruiting
sonofollo	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:02:00 - [47] risk is also there but CCP have taken a big step at boosting PVP in this game - moving players to 0.0 with bigger rewards sure the alliances will get rich but with jump clones are likley to engage in more warfare more often and able to replace assets a lot quicker (plus with titans costing so much) the cost to support it will require less time. Theres a acquistion of things being sped up a bit in the game but im sure the NPC spawns will get a AI boost or perhaps a slight nerf it they are to out of balance (CCP craves game balance above all else) anything that doesntm eet this is nerfed CCP please restore the recruitment channel
Wild Rho	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:03:00 - [48] It sounds more like npc battleships are too easy to kill, maybe they should get a boost so players can't just solo a spawn of 3or 4 of them solo with no real effort.
Scalor Valentis	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:04:00 - [49] OHNOES!?!?!? SO NOW YOU AN ACTUALY EARN MORE ISK IN 0.4> AND 0.0 THAN IN >0.5 DOING LVL 4? NOW BELTS ARE ACTUALY WORTH SOMETHING IN 0.4? THIS CALLS FOE IMIDIET NERF tool
Copine Callmeknau	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:08:00 - [50] um So, according to many people here, enticing people to go outside the safety zone is bad and people should stay in high sec to make the game less dynamic? dubbleyou tee eff? ------- With five million sheep in this army I seem to be the only one fit to command
Khapeta	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:09:00 - [51] Dao, I have some belts to you in Otou, just pay me a visit, old friend. Or tell me where you are npcing, so I can help you. -
Shittake	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:09:00 - [52] /emote pretends to be Dao and says "Hey everybody, I just found a gold mine, looky here" !!!!! Damn it Dao, shut up :) THERE ARE NO GOOD SPAWNS IN THE NORTH AND YOU MAKE CRAPPY ISK, SO GO AWAY, NOTHING TO SEE HERE :)
Mesuinu	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:11:00 - [53] Dear CCP, Please don't nerf the npc's 'til I'm rich. Many thanks, Mes
Elve Sorrow	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:13:00 - [54] Originally by: Mesuinu Dear CCP, Please don't nerf the npc's 'til I'm rich. Word.
Wild Rho	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:14:00 - [55] Originally by: Copine Callmeknau um So, according to many people here, enticing people to go outside the safety zone is bad and people should stay in high sec to make the game less dynamic? dubbleyou tee eff? It's not being the belt npcs making more isk in 0.0 than in empire thats the problem, it's that it's already been shown that by pumping huge amounts of isk into the economy from sources such as npcs can cause a wide range of problems such such as inflation.
darth solo	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:17:00 - [56] aye NPCIng is pretty tasty now... larger commander and officer spwns do not have much support.. IE i found a Officer thingy and it had 4 BS as support.. Any fool can take that down, u just kill one then warp out. The problem with NPCing has always been trying to kill the frigs that scramble u. Also the new destroyers seem to have the sig radius of planets, they are so crap... that along with the battlecruisers, they seem to go down easier than normal cruisers. Anyways, not complaining.... d solo.
Wrayeth	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:18:00 - [57] Edited by: Wrayeth on 18/12/2005 11:18:52 Originally by: Wild Rho It's not being the belt npcs making more isk in 0.0 than in empire thats the problem, it's that it's already been shown that by pumping huge amounts of isk into the economy from sources such as npcs can cause a wide range of problems such such as inflation. True, but CCP has already solved this - take a lot at NPC prices for POS control towers and components. The increased costs take money back out of the economy. I just hope it's enough. Anyway, as a player this has been a godsend. I'd pretty much quit playing on TQ since I could never get ahead, ISK-wise (PvP expenses and losses pretty much neutralized any gains I made), and hence couldn't do the things I wanted, such as acquiring a Machariel, working towards a dread, etc. This has finally made these things possible for me, and I hope it continues as-is - it's made me want to play again. -Wrayeth Go away.
Ariel Demon	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:20:00 - [58] Well, day after patch I went into a belt on a whim in random space where I'd been camping for a little while in my autotempest. I wasn't tanked for the rats, but there's a 3 BS spawn... no worries, cuz there's no inties, just a cruiser escort, so no fear of getting jammed or webbed = I'm safe. What do you know? The NPC's are patheticaly easy. Well, that was some nice easy money, let's see how my luck holds out... on to the next belt. An hour later I'm 15 mil richer in bounties and hold about 35 million isk worth of loot at naga prices. I don't know how mining is gonna get you 50 mil per hour solo, but tbh I don't see who'd want to. I tried again yesterday, and though loot drop wasn't quite as good (just over 20 million in an hour average) bounties per hour were about the same, so still beats any miner who makes less than 35 mil per hour. NOTE: In the loot isk I've included the few Damage Controll I's I found which sold for 2 million isk each ^^
Hans Roaming	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:21:00 - [59] Dao, if you look at the numbers of people in space well there are thousands in Empire and a few in 0.0 so I hardly think that it's going to be the huge pump of isk into the economy that it was before. Until now it was hard actually getting people to leave their level 4 missions and come to 0.0 as the risk reward balance was too harsh in CWE. Now it may be that where you are you're getting triple BS spawns, but that's not 1 jump from empire I bet, you're in a war zone if I remember and you have to watch local at all times in case a hostile comes in at which point you have to hunt them and kill them to keep your space clear. Now all this is different from undocking in Jita in an NPC corp and running level 4s all day as there is zero risk in doing that. What this actually might be is the carrot that lures people away from high sec into low sec and 0.0 and how would that be a bad thing to get more people out of the theme park and into the sandbox. I predict a lot more pressure on 0.0 alliances now for resources from empire which of course is going to make everything more exciting. I mean there is nothing worse than having 0.0 space and in CWE wondering what could entice your indy people out there (Providence), well now with POS manufacturing and adv refineries as well as NPC's there actually is. TBH now with the capital ships and all the new T2 ships including the BS coming down the line this is a good things as otherwise all the high end stuff will never be seen let alone used by the bulk of people in Eve. Remember the sinks in the form of BPO and skills for capital ships have also hugely increased so why not the forms of income and if they are in 0.0 then wow I'm all for that. El Presedente Be all you can be, join the Huzzah Armed Forces today!
Snake Jankins	Posted - 2005.12.18 11:23:00 - [60] Edited by: Snake Jankins on 18/12/2005 11:23:48 Originally by: sonofollo get rich get the ISK and the assets now because this will be nerfed at some point - the flip side is more in 0.0 and also more PVP leading to more ISK sinks. We'll see. I can't hunt for two weeks, because I'm going into holidays. I mean I managed also pre-rmr to hunt in away that I could kfll a lot of battleships per hour. Triple BS spawns were white common for me. If some whiners like people who make already insane amounts of money by t2 production, high-min mining or complex whoring manage that hunting in RMR gets nerfed to a level below Coldwar level and cut the only income I have, then I'll have a look, if the player loot is better in asteroid belts and complexes. ___________ 'Only ships can be assembled, this is a Frigate.'

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