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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |

Jerick Ludhowe
trolllolcorp
519
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Posted - 2013.08.08 18:22:00 -
[121] - Quote
Psycros wrote:The fix to 90% of drone issues is simple, obvious and probably pure demonic heresy to some: allow drones to slowly repair their armor while in the bay. You can still lose them if you're not playing with both halves of your brain but this would allow for a lot of flexibility in balancing them. I wouldn't even be opposed to requiring a drone repair module to enable this ability, although if I'm losing a slot I'd want fairly decent repair speed, and I'd hope it would rep their hull as well.
So long as the repair duration is quite lengthy do I agree with you.
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Deacon Abox
Justified Chaos
171
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 18:23:00 -
[122] - Quote
True, there are so many problems with drones. Let's not fix any of them. Instead let's quickly respond to a vocal minority upset by one friggin alliance tournament, by nerfing them or the ships that use them.
Oh let's also further, but stealthily, nerf Command ships under the guise of a buff to them and nerf to Tech IIIs. Meanwhile not addressing the stupidity of off-grid ss'd tech IIIs . . .
Please balancing team don't continue down this road. I know I just posted kthxbye, but I'll always be back with a criticism. Sorry. |

Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
72
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 18:31:00 -
[123] - Quote
Well, something is clearly OP when people want to keep it unchanged. |

Gorgoth24
Sickology
40
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 18:54:00 -
[124] - Quote
It's a relatively minor change and I see where it's coming from. But it's not exactly tin-foil-hattery to think ATXI was a contributing factor.
However, drone assist mechanics are far more of the problem then the tracking bonus itself. I realize this is all tangled up in old code, but it is the primary issue here imo |

uyguhb
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
9
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Posted - 2013.08.08 19:07:00 -
[125] - Quote
Removing the dominix of the 1 thing making it unique. but lets put off working on drones until 2015  |

Deacon Abox
Justified Chaos
172
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 19:19:00 -
[126] - Quote
Gorgoth24 wrote:It's a relatively minor change and I see where it's coming from. But it's not exactly tin-foil-hattery to think ATXI was a contributing factor.
However, drone assist mechanics are far more of the problem then the tracking bonus itself. I realize this is all tangled up in old code, but it is the primary issue here imo Yes, clearly the biggest thing with drones that needs to be addressed is doing away with the ability to assign them. We don't want any more logi pilots getting on killmails.
However, don't stop there, they're too inexpensive. Especially the tech II and faction drones. Likewise no one worries about isk loss with drones because people can fit so many of them in their drones bays that they never run out. And the damn things have so many hitpoints they take forever to kill. Damn it's easier to target another ship's weapons and disable them than it is to kill a drone.
Additionally I've never seen a battlefield littered with drones. Drones not only left by ships that got blowed up, but also by nobody having to warp out to avoid getting blowed up. Noone is going to lose which are their sentrys if they are able to warp back to a battlefield. Conversely, I see people dropping their expensive tech II and faction guns and launchers throughout a battlefield all the time.
And just like any other weapon they can be overheated. And travel time is so much better than even missiles. Those damn drones zip around faster than a rocket. Even the heavy drones. Smarties are so much better for killing missiles than drones. This is not fair.
So yes, first priority should be to nerf the ability to assign drones. |

mama guru
Thundercats The Initiative.
143
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 19:23:00 -
[127] - Quote
Deacon Abox wrote:True, there are so many problems with drones. Let's not fix any of them. Instead let's quickly respond to a vocal minority upset by one friggin alliance tournament, by nerfing them or the ships that use them.  
7.5 % is fair, I honestly thought that 10% was out of control given the damage of sentries compared to turrets in the 50-100km range.
Still, the drone assist mechanic needs to stay unless you want to give me a 1000m3 dronebay and orbiting sentries. Having a maximum of 15 drones, which equates to 3 bombs or panic/bumped warpouts of ammunition is way to big a drawback to remove the assist mechanic. ______
EVE online is the fishermans friend of MMO's. If it's too hard you are too weak. |

Ju0ZaS
Mentally Assured Destruction
9
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 20:04:00 -
[128] - Quote
Seems fair. 10% per level on any bonus seems kind of too strong anyways. Well, perhaps not including the 10% bonuses on some of the creappy frigs. |

Lic Tarek
Storm of Souls Expeditionary Force
0
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Posted - 2013.08.08 20:36:00 -
[129] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:
Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.
This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.
In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.
I call shenanigans!!! The re-balance of tracking and optimal range bonuses are what make the Dominix a much more viable ship for all activities. The tank has always been solid on this ship but the DPS was always abysmal. When CCP rebalanced this ship it may have stepped on the toes of the god-awful looking Gila and the noble Ishtar. But lets be honest those ships are meant to be mobile and deadly. A battleship isnt necessarily highly mobile vs the rest of the fleet of eve online. This is why battleships are supposed to have strong tanks and moderate to good DPS. Take the rest of the "tiericided" Tier 1 battleships and try to make a case that the Domi pre-Odyssey could truely come close to matching those ships in DPS. You cant unless you faction fitted the ship. And lets be honest, before Odyssey, how many faction fit Domi's did you find on killboards? I like the Dominix the way it is. It is now TRUELY a drone boat with teeth. Nerf it and its not worth the 150 million isk it now runs for in Jita.
CCP, Please do not do this.
-Lic Tarek
P.S. For those of you that don't know what "Shenanigans" means:
shenanigans plural of she-+nan-+i-+gans (Noun)
1. Secret or dishonest activity or maneuvering. 2. Silly or high-spirited behavior; mischief. |

Maggeridon Thoraz
Anomalous Existence
67
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 20:47:00 -
[130] - Quote
with all this changes coming for 1.1 . when do we get td effecting missiles as promised for 1.0 odyssey. once 1.0 odyssey hit the streets you , ccp , told us its delayed to get used to the missiles nerfs that came with it ? . I think with with 1.1 coming enogh time passed already. |
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Baren
Aura of Darkness Nulli Secunda
57
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 20:56:00 -
[131] - Quote
dislike, the drone mechanics are the problem, not the drones or bonuses them selves |

Gwen Ambraelle
Voodoo Children Workers Trade Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 21:28:00 -
[132] - Quote
Just when you get the Domi working right, you make it sub par again....
Sentry Drones have enough disadvantages as it is, the 10% bonus was the only thing that made them worthwhile.
Sentries can be shot, turrets cannot. Sentries can't move, turrets can. Sentries can't be overheated, turrets can. Drone interface is awful.
IF you have a better drone interface AND make sentries follow the ship AND double their hitpoints MAYBE, just MAYBE we can talk about the range/tracking bonus, but until then, leave the bl**dy thing alone.
-1 for CCP Rise (whos other work I've largely been supportive of), this is just a knee jerk reaction to ppl screaming after the Alliance Tournament. |

Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
517
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 21:33:00 -
[133] - Quote
Tobias Hareka wrote:Well, something is clearly OP when people want to keep it unchanged. If CCP announced tomorrow that they were nerfing all autocannon damage by 90%, the forums would collapse into some kind of black hole under the weight of all the hateposting. Clearly that means it's a change that needs to happen. EvE is supposed to suck.-á Wait . . . what was the question? |

Fronkfurter McSheebleton
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
242
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 21:33:00 -
[134] - Quote
EvilweaselSA wrote: Could you add gun assist and missile assist in the meantime so other fleet comps can be equally free of individual effort in any way
You can't shoot the guns off of a ship, or a whole fleet in the case of a few bombs, so there are pros and cons here. And it's not like being an F1-monkey is terribly complicated... thhief ghabmoef |

Roime
Ten Thousand Years Shinjiketo
3250
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 21:34:00 -
[135] - Quote
Lic Tarek wrote: The tank has always been solid on this ship but the DPS was always abysmal
If by "abysmal" you mean the highest dps of any T1 subcap, then yes.
Ten Thousand Years is recruiting pioneer spirits to Solitude. |

Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1436
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 21:51:00 -
[136] - Quote
Roime wrote:Lic Tarek wrote: The tank has always been solid on this ship but the DPS was always abysmal If by "abysmal" you mean the highest dps of any T1 subcap, then yes. I have to agree "Abysmal"=1500 DPS with its current iteration in a lolgank shield tanked fit.
The navy version will get up to 1700 DPs and have better tank. DED Complex Overhaul Idea - Ideas For Drone Improvement |

Michael Harari
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
649
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 22:04:00 -
[137] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:Quote: (Remember how in the T1 BS changes thread people said that no-one would ever fly a Dominix over a Geddon?) Glad someone else remembers this =)
(From the bs balancing thread)
Michael Harari wrote: If anything, the domi is too strong, tracking and range bonused sentries will make mincemeat out of all sorts of things.
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Liang Nuren
Heretic Army Heretic Initiative
3770
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 22:11:00 -
[138] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:mynnna wrote:Anharat wrote:>has nothing to do with the tournament >publishes the change right after the tournament seems legit If I could place a bounty on you for this awful post, I would. Gotta admit it is a little suspect, not as if people didn't question the wisdom of the 10% bonus prior to implementation. He is however probably telling the truth when he says the tourny was not the deciding factor, but there is no way it was not a contributing factor. Main thing is likely the FC assigned sentries from blobs in null that I hear is all the rage and has spawned Goddess knows how many threads to date.
I'm just remembering the damp nerf that was announced right after the alliance tournament. What was it, 10 damp Caracals rocked a more traditional team in the final round and the dev in question was pissed. Not long afterwards Damps were nerfed into ******* oblivion.
-Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
1436
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 22:22:00 -
[139] - Quote
I could be wrong but I believe in the BS thread it was proposed to give the Dominix 10% to drone damage, HP, and optimal and then as its second bonus +5% drone tracking and microwarp velocity DED Complex Overhaul Idea - Ideas For Drone Improvement |

Voith
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
143
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 22:57:00 -
[140] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:mynnna wrote:Anharat wrote:>has nothing to do with the tournament >publishes the change right after the tournament seems legit If I could place a bounty on you for this awful post, I would. Gotta admit it is a little suspect, not as if people didn't question the wisdom of the 10% bonus prior to implementation. He is however probably telling the truth when he says the tourny was not the deciding factor, but there is no way it was not a contributing factor. Main thing is likely the FC assigned sentries from blobs in null that I hear is all the rage and has spawned Goddess knows how many threads to date. The Ishtar was showing a 7.5% bonus before the Tournament. |
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Stridsflygplan
Tigers in the Snow Nyratic
64
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 22:59:00 -
[141] - Quote
Nice to see CCP being able to revisit and balance ships again just after they have been worked on. proves that CCP is actively looking at ships so they are working properly and are not to good/bad. When it comes to drones, I just want a new UI for them so they are easier to deal with. |

ElQuirko
Jester Syndicate S0UTHERN C0MF0RT
1747
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:00:00 -
[142] - Quote
Boooooooooooo. Now it can't hit anything. Save the Domi model! Spacewhales should be preserved. |

Endeavour Starfleet
916
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:13:00 -
[143] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:
Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.
This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.
In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.
How about NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Drones have MANY disadvantages. They are the only weapon system that can be removed from the player using them and you are comparing them to turrets? What is wrong with CCP these days?
Please say you will not implement this. This is yet another HUGE nerf to those who bothered to focus their training and you are basically telling newer players to not bother focusing their skills because they are just going to be nerfed anyway.
Seriously what is the point of playing this game when you are doing things like this CCP Rise? You took a giant step forward with the changes to industral craft yet with this change the game is running backwards.
Why are you spending valuable development time nerfing ships you have JUST recently fixed? Why should the players find this acceptable?
Don't do this. Please say this is not happening. |

Sigras
Conglomo
495
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:34:00 -
[144] - Quote
^^ So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?
(cough)Eos(cough) |

Goldensaver
ArTech Expeditions
221
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:38:00 -
[145] - Quote
Man, so many tears in this thread. At this rate there'll be enough to fill my stores. I'm actually quite appreciate of this change. It brings them more in line but still leaves them with advantages over turrets. |

Endeavour Starfleet
916
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:43:00 -
[146] - Quote
Goldensaver wrote:Man, so many tears in this thread. At this rate there'll be enough to fill my stores. I'm actually quite appreciate of this change. It brings them more in line but still leaves them with advantages over turrets.
In my opinion you have not spent the time training to use the ship properly. You simply do not understand how easy it is to remove a Domi's ability to do DPS. And neither does CCP in my opinion.
Instead of actually putting in the development time to fix drone UI weaknesses, change NPC aggro so that drones aren't primaried by them right off the bat. Or you know making changes to the game that are actually wanted "Like Logi on killmails" They decide to simply nerf the Domi and done with it?
For someone like me who actually had patience. Who actually bothererd to wait until I had the skill to make use of this ship. Why should I find this change acceptable? Why should I accept CCP comparing drones to turrets? |

amurder Hakomairos
Fellowship Of Lost Souls Rebel Alliance of New Eden
58
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:46:00 -
[147] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:
Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.
This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.
In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.
What a crock of sh*t. You say in your post that the Domi is not OP, so why in the hell are you nerfing it? This nerfing you guys do just for the sake of nerfing is a crock. Things should not be nerfed unless they are OP/gamebreaking. Every nerf devalues the training people did for these ships modules.
How can you justify making this change just 2 months after the new bonuses when you yourself say the Domi "hasn't been oppressively powerful". So good in PvE, not OP in PvP is a reason for a nerf now? |

Endeavour Starfleet
916
|
Posted - 2013.08.08 23:47:00 -
[148] - Quote
Sigras wrote:^^ So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?
(cough)Eos(cough)
The Domi is balanced with a 10 percent bonus. There are so many other ships in the game that need a balance pass and the Domi is not one of them. Especially when removing their DPS is EASY compared to removing DPS of a turret or missile ship.
So yes It could have stood that way for 3-6 years and been fine. Only fools were complaining about the domi and it is saddening to see CCP accepting the arguement of fools instead of focusing development time on aspects of the game that need changing now. (Logistics need so much development time) |

Irya Boone
TIPIAKS
237
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 00:24:00 -
[149] - Quote
I don't really understand the need of nerfing of Gallente ships , when you "balanced the BS" you put some EWar bonus on other BS of the other races but ... Gallente NO.
We Have to get close to do some good damage but our PvP tank is generally passive armor tanking ...so making your ship an anvil...
railguns ... don't even talk about it ....( except some mega fit )
And we had domi with sentries ... and now because of your ****** tournament you nerf it too.. what's wrong with you people
For years we are asking for some changes and you don't give a **** .. but you spend Dev time on things NO ONE ASK YOU... i don't get
Really ..THX ccp
and for god sake be honest and tell people to stop skilling drones or Gallente ships because you don't like them
ps: don't forget to make the Domi uglier , and more uglier too!!! RENAME null sec systems With the name of REAL Universe Stellar Name like KOI-730 etc etc It will be awesome. Need Black Ops be able to FIT cover ops cloaking device !!! |

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
681
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 00:45:00 -
[150] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:Sigras wrote:^^ So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?
(cough)Eos(cough) The Domi is balanced with a 10 percent bonus. There are so many other ships in the game that need a balance pass and the Domi is not one of them. Especially when removing their DPS is EASY compared to removing DPS of a turret or missile ship. So yes It could have stood that way for 3-6 years and been fine. Only fools were complaining about the domi and it is saddening to see CCP accepting the arguement of fools instead of focusing development time on aspects of the game that need changing now. (Logistics need so much development time) Logistics aren't even up on the table yet and I severely doubt that this is taking any real amount of time save looking over the usage and effectiveness of the ship on TQ, which is what they should be doing anyways. The revised bonus leaves you at 87% of the effect in range and tracking you had before and the ship was useable even before that bonus was applied. A single Omni tracking link more than makes up the loss.
Edit: Math Fail, I compared lvl 5 of the current to lvl 4 of the revised, you're actually getting ~92% range |
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