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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
3681
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 16:38:00 -
[61] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote:Doc Fury wrote:That should have been your question #1.
If the CSM is truly relevant, why are they not being used, and where is the transparency? We're consulted on a lot of things, but not everything. The community only sees the cases where we were not consulted on things we ought to have been consulted on. As to why the CSM was not consulted on this particular issue, I rather think any public statement about that ought to come from CCP.
So, you don't see a trend developing here? The stuff that really has the potential to ****-off the players and change the nature of the game you guys don't seem to ever be involved with. I do not blame the CSM for this, CCP uses you guys as the PR stunt they intended the CSM to be.
I would remind you the reason the CSM was created (the reason given to the NY Times) was to help prevent T20-type malfeasance from happening again (via oversight) and to provide transparency to the players regarding what CCP is up to. This has yet to work as advertised. Do we really need a "representative body" that are treated as irrelevant by the organization that created it? The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'. |

Reyna Snoo
Chop-Shop Mining and Logistics
1
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 16:45:00 -
[62] - Quote
I imagine CCP is kinda confused as this isn't the first time they've given prizes to Somer to give away. For Somer's one quadrillion celebration CCP gave them 4 Collectors Editions and some Ishukone Watch Scorpions to give away using this same giveaway mechanic and nobody seemed to care about it then. Is it the large in-game value that makes this different? |

arabella blood
I Swear She Looked 18
177
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 16:48:00 -
[63] - Quote
Great.
CCP: "We understand we did it wrong, now we gonna do it more so it makes it right".
Load of S***. I expect the prizes of this new program to be at least as good as the ones handed at Somer... Troll for hire. Cheap prices. |

Ali Aras
Valkyries of Night Of Sound Mind
406
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 16:56:00 -
[64] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote: So, you don't see a trend developing here? The stuff that really has the potential to ****-off the players and change the nature of the game you guys don't seem to ever be involved with. I do not blame the CSM for this, CCP uses you guys as the PR stunt they intended the CSM to be.
When we have been consulted on stuff that will **** off the players and change the nature of the game, to use your wording, it usually changes or dies on the vine. Those ideas never make it out of skype, internal forums, and the summits, and so the players never even see them to get pissed off. It's quite nice that Trebor posted his letter and CCP Pokecthulu's response here, because it's a chance for the community to see what our process usually looks like when we disagree with CCP actions, although obviously the writing is a bit more formal than normal. http://warp-to-sun.tumblr.com -- my blog |

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
3682
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:01:00 -
[65] - Quote
Ali Aras wrote:Doc Fury wrote: So, you don't see a trend developing here? The stuff that really has the potential to ****-off the players and change the nature of the game you guys don't seem to ever be involved with. I do not blame the CSM for this, CCP uses you guys as the PR stunt they intended the CSM to be.
When we have been consulted on stuff that will **** off the players and change the nature of the game, to use your wording, it usually changes or dies on the vine. Those ideas never make it out of skype, internal forums, and the summits, and so the players never even see them to get pissed off. It's quite nice that Trebor posted his letter and CCP Pokecthulu's response here, because it's a chance for the community to see what our process usually looks like when we disagree with CCP actions, although obviously the writing is a bit more formal than normal.
But yet, here we are... Again. CSM and CCP working in damage control mode after the fact, instead of preventing it because you guys were not allowed to be in the loop. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'Hodor'. |

Malcolm Shinhwa
Bad Touches
340
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:01:00 -
[66] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:So CCP says that ALL 3rd party sites will benefit from their largesse. I strongly doubt that.
And as for creating some kind of selection process, that means that CCP is exercising favouritism, as soon as one 3rd party group is selected over another, even though they both meet whatever criteria CCP establishes.
Yes I anxiously await CCP favoring minerbumping.com with a community spotlight blog and trillions of isk. Hey CCP, please slush my fund like you did for SOMER Blink. |

Arcueid Saber
Legio XCIX CA
8
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:20:00 -
[67] - Quote
So CCP allows favoritism this time, sweep the dust under the rug with some changes in EULA, and then do it again after some years later? Like the old T20 and IA dept? Nice. |

James Amril-Kesh
Goonswarm Federation
5805
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:29:00 -
[68] - Quote
CSM8: "We weren't told, but that's okay. Let's just say things everyone else has already said and hope CCP will listen." My Youtube Videos Latest video: August 25, 2013 |

Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
721
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:39:00 -
[69] - Quote
CCP wrote: We don't have the balls to turn over a **** decision we made because it would upset SOMER who makes us money via his RMT scheme but rest assure that we will look over the event and build a policy for the next time it will happen.
Most likely INB4 deleted post or ban. |

Oliver Stoned
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
14
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:39:00 -
[70] - Quote
Where was all these extra prizes during Fanfest? |

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
4651
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 17:56:00 -
[71] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:CSM8: "We weren't told, but that's okay. Let's just say things everyone else has already said and hope CCP will listen." you mean
and hope we won't be called out by the players, like some of the people who defended the tos non-change change There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |

jwingender
Tar Valon Research and Development
5
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:11:00 -
[72] - Quote
I'm just curious why they think they HAVE to re-release the unique ships (Gold magnate and Guardian Vexor) and not just make up some ships for this promotion. I would imagine a good portion of the rage over this is because they are re-releasing ships that should NEVER be released agian.

Is it really this hard to grab the skin of a ship already in-game, make up some new better stats/change the paint color, and then use this new ship with ALL these stupid 3rd party giveaways. Done.
 |

Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
721
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:14:00 -
[73] - Quote
jwingender wrote:I'm just curious why they think they HAVE to re-release the unique ships (Gold magnate and Guardian Vexor) and not just make up some ships for this promotion. I would imagine a good portion of the rage over this is because they are re-releasing ships that should NEVER be released agian.  Is it really this hard to grab the skin of a ship already in-game, make up some new better stats/change the paint color, and then use this new ship with ALL these stupid 3rd party giveaways. Done. 
How hard is it to actually read the OP to realise the ships were already changed? |

James Amril-Kesh
Goonswarm Federation
5806
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:23:00 -
[74] - Quote
Or how about CCP take back what it gave and promise not to do **** like this again?
NO WHY WOULD WE EVER DO THAT. My Youtube Videos Latest video: August 25, 2013 |

Prince Kobol
946
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:26:00 -
[75] - Quote
Reyna Snoo wrote:I imagine CCP is kinda confused as this isn't the first time they've given prizes to Somer to give away. For Somer's one quadrillion celebration CCP gave them 4 Collectors Editions and some Ishukone Watch Scorpions to give away using this same giveaway mechanic and nobody seemed to care about it then. Is it the large in-game value that makes this different?
Simply.. the goons didn't care :)
The only reason there has been such a storm is because the goons didn't like it this time round. |

Herr Kutz
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:44:00 -
[76] - Quote
This is a pile of bull stirred up by a whiny bunch of self-important, overly entitled people crying that they weren't clever enough to make stupid amounts of isk.
If it was anything else, this would've come up during the Somer Blink 1Q celebration, which was publicized widely and showed on the front page that CCP had given prizes to Somer.
It didn't, so stop trying to make this something it isn't. In other words, STFU, wind your collective necks in , stop crying.
As I said in a post on TMC, this is really about the "change" to the ToS meaning that a certain selection of people are no longer allowed to scam in the way they previously thought they were.
Eve is a game of ingenuity. Try using your brains and coming up with something clever, special or unique to make isk.
Oh and just a point regarding trust:
Most of the whining is from a certain select group, let's call them "Scamming little b's" who are trying to cause trouble for CCP because they aren't allowed to scam in the way they used to.
Many of those are pointing to a well known website named after it's founder and shouting that it should also be given *things* to give out.
If you want CCP to trust you enough to believe you will give out prizes they donate, then don't build your bed from lies, cheating, exploiting and more lies. |

Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
400
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:44:00 -
[77] - Quote
Trebor Daehdoow wrote: However, the requirement that one must be a member of SOMER Blink in order to participate remains, and for a lottery with such significant prizes, is very troubling to us.
This is my main concern with this event.
Remove insurance. |

Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
674
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:49:00 -
[78] - Quote
I appreciate the effort, CSM.
Looking at the SOMERBlink website, I can see it has that Las Vegas gambling feeling, which is probably one of the reasons for CCP to try this stunt. I am just puzzled how the excuse can be 'rush'; it is not like Eve Vegas came unexpected. And writing the policy AFTER committing to an event is... well, boggling.
Anyhow, I have been to Las Vegas, visited the casinos and did not play a dollar. I am confused on how I can participate in the drawing for these ships/fanfest tickets, without participating in other gambling that I have no interest in. Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook-á |

Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
3274
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:55:00 -
[79] - Quote
Chitsa Jason wrote:First :)
I see now how much thought has been put into this post. |

Davion Falcon
Those Once Loyal
60
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:55:00 -
[80] - Quote
Quote:and we are certainly learning from it now.
The last two to three years: http://i.imgflip.com/59qi.jpg
If your behaviour hasn't changed, you haven't learned a thing. Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise. Never forgotten, never forgiven. |

James Amril-Kesh
Goonswarm Federation
5807
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:56:00 -
[81] - Quote
Herr Kutz wrote:Eve is a game of ingenuity. Try using your brains and coming up with something clever, special or unique to make isk. Or you could just be favored by CCP and handed free stuff on a platter. My Youtube Videos Latest video: August 25, 2013 |

Kuni Oichi
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
29
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:57:00 -
[82] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Reyna Snoo wrote:I imagine CCP is kinda confused as this isn't the first time they've given prizes to Somer to give away. For Somer's one quadrillion celebration CCP gave them 4 Collectors Editions and some Ishukone Watch Scorpions to give away using this same giveaway mechanic and nobody seemed to care about it then. Is it the large in-game value that makes this different? Simply.. the goons didn't care :) The only reason there has been such a storm is because the goons didn't like it this time round.
So you're saying that we do a better job of raising awareness of concerning issues to the rest of the playerbase than anyone else?
Thanks for the compliment, it's nice to know our efforts are so appreciated. |

Herr Kutz
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 18:59:00 -
[83] - Quote
Mara Pahrdi wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote: However, the requirement that one must be a member of SOMER Blink in order to participate remains, and for a lottery with such significant prizes, is very troubling to us.
This is my main concern with this event.
The event (Eve Vegas - remember, or have you all forgotten in your rage?) is sponsored by SOMER Blink and is open to all.
CCP have given SOMER Blink some prizes (the originals of which were clearly a massive mistake) to support and promote that event.
The only thing I hope for from this is that other equally deserving sites are rewarded for their efforts in the same way. |

Herr Kutz
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:04:00 -
[84] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Herr Kutz wrote:Eve is a game of ingenuity. Try using your brains and coming up with something clever, special or unique to make isk. Or you could just be favored by CCP for sponsoring a massive player event and handed free stuff on a platter to give out to players regardless of which corp/alliance/Coalition they're in.
FTFY |

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2343
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:25:00 -
[85] - Quote
wrote:]That said, we recognize it is imperative for CCP to remain impartial with respect to which 3rd parties receive CCP support for these kinds of activities. To that end, we will develop a clear policy on how we plan to conduct future events, including how we will determine which 3rd parties and which events will receive CCP support, and we will develop that policy in consultation with the CSM.
Good to see that CCP will 'remain impartial' in regards to their new policy of arbitrarily picking the winners and losers in Eve from now on. Titans were never meant to be "cost effective", its a huge ****.-á- CCP Oveur, 2006
~If you want a picture of the future of WiS, imagine a spaceship, stamping on an avatar's face. Forever. |

arabella blood
I Swear She Looked 18
177
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:28:00 -
[86] - Quote
Herr Kutz wrote:Mara Pahrdi wrote:Trebor Daehdoow wrote: However, the requirement that one must be a member of SOMER Blink in order to participate remains, and for a lottery with such significant prizes, is very troubling to us.
This is my main concern with this event. The event (Eve Vegas - remember, or have you all forgotten in your rage?) is sponsored by SOMER Blink and is open to all. CCP have given SOMER Blink some prizes (the originals of which were clearly a massive mistake) to support and promote that event. The only thing I hope for from this is that other equally deserving sites are rewarded for their efforts in the same way.
Brilliant. if you ***k up, but then do it regulary then its okay???
Troll for hire. Cheap prices. |

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2343
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:34:00 -
[87] - Quote
Also when can we expect a statement apologising for the way CCP T20 was treated by the company and the return of Evolution's Sabre BPO, since his historical actions in respect of spawning valuable assets to favour one player entity over another have now been adopted as official CCP policy. Titans were never meant to be "cost effective", its a huge ****.-á- CCP Oveur, 2006
~If you want a picture of the future of WiS, imagine a spaceship, stamping on an avatar's face. Forever. |

Drezen Tor
Junk United Corporation Junk Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:41:00 -
[88] - Quote
For those of you asking why people are upset now, I think it goes something like this:
Previous prize giveaways where relatively low key. Some PLEX, relatively cheap unique hulls (IshuScorp), totals of around 15-100b, so forth. Nothing game-changing or rewriting. People are upset now because the original proposition were items of historical importance. That got people's attention more than the raw value.
Now that the items are replaced with less historically significant items, people started evaluating the overall fairness. There wasn't enough attention generated previously for people to care. Now people care and are considering the practice as a whole. Had CCP give out a dozen IshuScorps, people wouldn't be considering the inherent unfairness of the practice, the entire event would've flown under most people's radar.
This leads to the question of "If its unfair to hand out what amounts to trillions of isk to a player entity, why is it any different to hand out several billion?" It isn't inherently different, which is why the continuing rage. For me, that was the thought process, Anger at historical items -> Anger at amount of money giveaway -> Anger at all giveaways.
TL;DR Nobody cared before because the items weren't that tied into lore, bringing in lore items got people's attention, now people have directed that attention to the process as a whole. |

James Amril-Kesh
Goonswarm Federation
5808
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:42:00 -
[89] - Quote
Herr Kutz wrote:James Amril-Kesh wrote:Herr Kutz wrote:Eve is a game of ingenuity. Try using your brains and coming up with something clever, special or unique to make isk. Or you could just be favored by CCP for sponsoring a massive player event and handed free stuff on a platter to give out to players regardless of which corp/alliance/Coalition they're in. FTFY You're forgetting the part where I'm forced to hand over ISK to this group in order to have a chance at winning any of these items, and the more ISK I hand over the more likely I am to win (more or less). My Youtube Videos Latest video: August 25, 2013 |

mynnna
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1883
|
Posted - 2013.09.28 19:44:00 -
[90] - Quote
Doc Fury wrote:So, you don't see a trend developing here? You are not being involved in the important things.
If "not being involved in the important things" means "having the opportunity to provide meaninful, often feature-changing input on virtually every aspect of the upcoming expansion", then, yes, we're not involved in the important things.
Unfortunately, all the discussion and chats related to that input is hidden behind the NDA, and can only be detailed with CCP's permission. As a result, cases like this set the perception that we don't actually do anything. Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal |
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