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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
HDCamper Itsim
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Posted - 2006.02.16 18:32:00 -
[301]
Edited by: HDCamper Itsim on 16/02/2006 18:35:31
Edited by: HDCamper Itsim on 16/02/2006 18:35:04
Sac. is a good ship and shouldn't lose any of its current bonus's. Those bonus's should be tweaked and maybe something new added. It should not be made into a Zealot. Proper use of a HAC is supposed to involve skill training. Having multiple skills to train high makes you a better pilot for that ship systems, as well as other ships with those systems. Losing shields is really nothing, they get wiped away so fast anyway. Would be good to be able to fit another named hvy beam and still be able to tank. Stop nerfing ships that require more then 1 set of skills. Try adding something vs removing anything or just leave it alone. Yes, it will still likely get owned by other HACs.
Yes, it does need to do some additional damage.
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dazedandconfused
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Posted - 2006.02.16 22:48:00 -
[302]
 Originally by: HDCamper Itsim
Yes, it will still likely get owned by other HACs.
Yes, it does need to do some additional damage.
This is true. The Zealot can out perform it in just about every way too imo. Even with the right skills trained the Sacrilege's bonuses are not nearly as effective. It needs some serious change, and thus we have this thread. Currently it just feels like one is better off flying a Zealot, assuming cost is not an issue.
I don't see how changing this ship, even the proposed changes, is a nerf. Has the meaning of the word nerf changed without me noticing? 
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Lucian Alucard
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Posted - 2006.02.17 09:41:00 -
[303]
Edited by: Lucian Alucard on 17/02/2006 09:41:24
I don't know I mean in my mind the Sac should be more similar to the Eagle in my opinion and both should have 5 turrets,give it the slot config of the Ishtar but with the bonuses tweaked to something similar of the eagles but you would have to make the optimal bonus 15-20% instead of 10 to make sure it actually does well in its role,the inherent problem with sheild tanking,Energy weapon ships is cap,CCP has painted itself into a corner simply by making Cap rechargers ludicriously over priced,nerfed Cap relays and thus disallowing the Khanid ships the ability to sheild tank and use energy turrets,now they tried fixing this by spliting the weapons pay loads of Khanid ships to use Missles and Energy turrets,this weakens both types of weapons in the process,yes it conserves cap and allows u to sheild tank but at the expense of greatly decreased DPS.
A Sac with a 5/5/5 slot config, emphisis on sheild tanking by making the Amar crusier skill give it 5% to SHEILD resistances instead of armor,boosting its optimal range bonus so it compairs to the Eagles thus attaining a true balance,keep the long overdue damage bonus and the standard cap reduction bonus,would be ideal in my mind.
All race of hacs are supposed to have two types of hacs by design long and short range, Ishtars are better at longer ranges then deimos,Vagabonds are better up close then Munins,Eagles are snipers where as Cerbs are better at medium ranges,so why shouldn't the Sac be better then the Zealot at longer ranges?
These new changes with Blood are good improvements to the ship for now but a serious redesign is due and should be looked into for Kali. Ultimately it is CCPs choice on what to do with the ships,all we can do is give the best addvice we can and tell them maturely what they do right and what they do wrong.
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"Quick, bring me a beaker of wine,that I may wet my mind and say something clever." ~Aristophane
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ShadowlordUK
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Posted - 2006.02.20 20:17:00 -
[304]
Yeah problem with telling them 'maturely' what to do is that every thread like this turns into, 'Make the ship i fly better plz'. (See thread for examples)
When was the last time you saw somebody actually argue that a ship they fly was overpowered?!..... Never is the answer.
There are plenty of people who will say other people's ships are overpowered but heaven forbid their own ship that they've trained for is nerfed.
You just end up with a continous stream of improvements of every ship in turn with people begging for more every time...
And the end result is ridiculously weakened npcs (raven can now solo a command spawn barley even bothering to turn on its shield booster!!!!) and massive inflation in the game as players can earn more and more isk with the same ships....
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Hellspawn01
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Posted - 2006.02.22 12:24:00 -
[305]
11 pages of ideas, pro¦s and contra¦s and some dev did what he saw would fit. This was a total waste of time for everyone that posted here.
Quote:
Sacrilege armor has been increased, its shield has been decreased and its missile rate of fire bonus has been changed to medium laser damage.
I¦m fine with the shield/armor change but making it a weaker zealot sucks tbh. I love my sacrilege but this change is a slap into my face.
Quote:
It's a little bit too much Khanid too little Amarr so we made a few changes.
Malediction gets a EM missile damage bonus and it is a khanid ship.
The dev didnt even care to tell us what he thinks about the ideas here. Guess our opinions dont have that much value here.
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Ö
Ship lover
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Deva Blackfire
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Posted - 2006.02.22 23:49:00 -
[306]
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 22/02/2006 23:53:14
Have to agree with that... Creating another Zealot is just... stupid? Guess its time to buy 20 Sacris when they are still 100mil a piece :/ And why did I bother training missile skills? :(
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Maric
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Posted - 2006.02.23 10:35:00 -
[307]
So, it is over now. According to new dev blog, new Sacrilege will loose missile ROF and gain Laser dmg bonus. I have no problem with that.
Problem lies somewhere else. There are 11 pages of posts with very good ideas. Noone ever said "dont bother, We allready make up our minds". Dev's silence encourage us to have false hopes that Sacrilege can be a great ship or that comunity can have part in creating game. This is not right  . Dev's should say something.
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Khaldorn Murino
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Posted - 2006.02.23 13:24:00 -
[308]
It does make you wonder why they even started this sticky in the first place really.
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- The fire burns..
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Xeenon
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Posted - 2006.02.23 18:23:00 -
[309]
I wish sacrilige was Khanid armor tanking missle boat
With bonuses like:
Cruiser skill: 10% to heavy missle velocity, 5% armor resists
HAC skill: 5% to em heavy missle damage, 5% to heavy launcher rof
5 missle, 2 turret hardpoints.
Zealot - armor tanking turret boat
Sacrilige - armor tanking misssle boat.
But now we will have useless laser dmg bonus instead of more useless missle launcher rof bonus.
Sacri need complete overhaul
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Malken
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Posted - 2006.02.23 19:09:00 -
[310]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 22/02/2006 23:53:14
Have to agree with that... Creating another Zealot is just... stupid? Guess its time to buy 20 Sacris when they are still 100mil a piece :/ And why did I bother training missile skills? :(
its not going to be even close to a zealot.
the zealot have 2 bonuses that gives it more dmg, the RoF and the pure DMG bonus.
with this atleast it will be able to kill a assault frigate
its a step in the right direction.
next stop is to have NPC corps start selling the HAC's for lets say 50mill wich still will give the BPO owners some profit just not gazillion % profit.
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Dash Ripcock
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Posted - 2006.02.24 04:19:00 -
[311]
Originally by: Maric
So, it is over now. According to new dev blog, new Sacrilege will loose missile ROF and gain Laser dmg bonus. I have no problem with that.
Problem lies somewhere else. There are 11 pages of posts with very good ideas. Noone ever said "dont bother, We allready make up our minds". Dev's silence encourage us to have false hopes that Sacrilege can be a great ship or that comunity can have part in creating game. This is not right . Dev's should say something.
I've made this point before.
CCP - feedback goes both ways. If you ask us a question and you get an answer, at least have the courtesy to acknowledge it. You don't even have to be specific, just keep the thread rolling. Otherwise it makes us all feel unnecessary and our opinions undervalued. It's pretty basic communication.
The Firing Range |
Golgrath
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Posted - 2006.02.24 05:54:00 -
[312]
Tuxford never asked for any ideas etc. He just started the topic to inform us on those small changes in the first post. I dont know where you all got the idea that this is the 'get your ideas through' thread.
Quote:
All the cool kids stay on topic Wink
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Maric
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Posted - 2006.02.24 06:20:00 -
[313]
Originally by: Golgrath
I dont know where you all got the idea that this is the 'get your ideas through' thread.
Me neither. But when it starts, someone should stop it. Nice and easy.
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Joerd Toastius
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Posted - 2006.02.24 11:02:00 -
[314]
People complain about not being told stuff, and when CCP tell the players stuff people complain about not being listened to...
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Slink Grinsdikild
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Posted - 2006.02.24 12:29:00 -
[315]
Guess this means I won't be training Amarr Cruiser V next after all. Thanks for breaking the Sacrilidge, CCP. 
/sulk 
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{-,-}
/)__)
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Inactive as of 11-02-06. Still Whorum Foring though.
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Dash Ripcock
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Posted - 2006.02.26 00:08:00 -
[316]
Originally by: Golgrath
Tuxford never asked for any ideas etc. He just started the topic to inform us on those small changes in the first post. I dont know where you all got the idea that this is the 'get your ideas through' thread.
Quote:
All the cool kids stay on topic Wink
But if someone says, "We're thinking of doing this X" and you get eleven pages of people saying this is good and that isn't, a reply from the original poster would be very much appreciated by those who spend time writing their replies. Even something like, "Interesting point - we decided to do X because of the following reasons" would let people know that even if CCP have made up their minds, they are still willing to reason and converse with those on the forums.
The Firing Range |
Hellspawn01
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Posted - 2006.02.26 01:59:00 -
[317]
Originally by: Dash Ripcock
Originally by: Golgrath
Tuxford never asked for any ideas etc. He just started the topic to inform us on those small changes in the first post. I dont know where you all got the idea that this is the 'get your ideas through' thread.
Quote:
All the cool kids stay on topic Wink
But if someone says, "We're thinking of doing this X" and you get eleven pages of people saying this is good and that isn't, a reply from the original poster would be very much appreciated by those who spend time writing their replies. Even something like, "Interesting point - we decided to do X because of the following reasons" would let people know that even if CCP have made up their minds, they are still willing to reason and converse with those on the forums.
The person you talk about has obviously no interest to answer our requests or to state why he made his changes. The unsticky¦ing of this thread proves it even more. Its almost a week now and the dev responsable for this has answered multiple times on other threads so he has time to look at this forum.
In short: He doesnt care about 11 pages nor about the cosequences of his changes. I say, to hell with him!
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Ö
Ship lover
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Hellspawn01
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Posted - 2006.02.27 12:08:00 -
[318]
Still waiting for an explanation of a certain dev. C¦mon tux, this is urgent.
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Ö
Ship lover
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Degarion Soth
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Posted - 2006.02.27 13:34:00 -
[319]
I think we pee'd him off, hes got the arse on and thinking '**** em - im not going to change it now so there! they cant make me answer their questions!'
...
Does make you wonder why you bother though sometimes...
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Pes T'Lance
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Posted - 2006.02.28 02:38:00 -
[320]
One thing that I don't understand, The sac is too Khanid, WTF? It is khanid, what else is it going to be. If it's made more amarr then it ceases to be khanid, it's amarr so what is the point. It's like saying the pope is too catholic, so make him jewish, but oh no thata means he's not'a da freakin pope a'no more. Khanid is already a poorly implimented, making the sac a missile armour tank would have been a step in the right direction. This change just smells of admitance of faliure and a pretty **** poor cop out in just making it plain amarr in black. Oh well so much for making khanid worth somthing, Amarr pilots fall right back into being the race that has the least opportunity to change damage.
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Dor Daedeloth
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Posted - 2006.02.28 03:21:00 -
[321]
How about you now fix how retarted stabs are? and dont make them win please?
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Weirda
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Posted - 2006.02.28 04:00:00 -
[322]
Originally by: Dor Daedeloth
How about you now fix how retarted stabs are? and dont make them win please?
/me looks for 'punch in the neck' emote
stabs are for losers. they know it already - that is enough... 
@hell
right there with you - the bonus change blow... the other was good, but removing that missile bonus you might as well remove the missile points alltogether tbh. with 3xlauncher, bonus and 1xbcu you could barely do the damage of 3xturret with no bonus (and that with excellent missile skill for heavies - trained t2 heavy just for this ship only + support)... guess they just want to pile everyone with missile skill into the origami-bird-ship crap...
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Weirda
Assault Ship deserve a 4th Bonus and More!
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