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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:38:00 - [1] VOIP The introduction of a VOIP system to EvE by CCP, one which we will have to pay to use, really goes against everything i, and im sure alot of other people, thought CCP stood for. Having played BF2 for quite some time now i can tell CCP from experiance that introducing a VOIP system will do nothing but cause major problems for them. With the mysterious connection drops to the server aswell as lag-kicks and so on, the VOIP system will not work as intended. Integrated VOIP systems in games have been known to cause major problems, i rememmber Planetside being down for almost a full week because of their integrated voice system, BF2 has had no end of bugs due to its VOIP system. CCP, the majority of the posts i have seen on this forum have been against having a VOIP system in eve. I implore you, spend time on things that are more vital to the players and eve as a whole, rather than somthing which we the players really dont need or intend to use. Please listen to your community. I leave the floor open to anyone who wishes to comment. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
The CaPoNe	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:41:00 - [2] Signed _________________________________________________ Capital Doomsday StripMiner Rank (25)
Obmud	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:43:00 - [3] Edited by: Obmud on 18/05/2006 08:43:47 Since it's a free will service not signed. Since I don't vote against anything i do not know or experienced yet not signed. ----------------------- This signature got altered because it was way to sexy and uber. If you want to know why don't ask. We're still horny.
Kay Han	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:43:00 - [4] Originally by: sidthesexist VOIP The introduction of a VOIP system to EvE by CCP, one which we will have to pay to use, really goes against everything i, and im sure alot of other people, thought CCP stood for. Having played BF2 for quite some time now i can tell CCP from experiance that introducing a VOIP system will do nothing but cause major problems for them. With the mysterious connection drops to the server aswell as lag-kicks and so on, the VOIP system will not work as intended. Integrated VOIP systems in games have been known to cause major problems, i rememmber Planetside being down for almost a full week because of their integrated voice system, BF2 has had no end of bugs due to its VOIP system. CCP, the majority of the posts i have seen on this forum have been against having a VOIP system in eve. I implore you, spend time on things that are more vital to the players and eve as a whole, rather than somthing which we the players really dont need or intend to use. Please listen to your community. I leave the floor open to anyone who wishes to comment. QFT Ohhh and /signed ___________________________________________ A wise man said once: 'Violence is the escape of the mentaly poor guys.'
duffmantt	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:44:00 - [5] signed. but seriously, even if they bring it in...why btoher paying for it? just keep on using vent/ts as usual. Recruiting Evildoers
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:44:00 - [6] Edited by: sidthesexist on 18/05/2006 08:44:29 Originally by: Obmud Since it's a free service not signed. Since I don't vote against anything i do not know or experienced yet not signed. No the service is not free. You will have to pay extra per month to use it. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:45:00 - [7] Originally by: duffmantt signed. but seriously, even if they bring it in...why btoher paying for it? just keep on using vent/ts as usual. My post is not to stop people paying for it. Its to put an end to the waste of time trying to impliment it, causing more downtimes and problems for eve as a whole when no one will use it. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
Obmud	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:45:00 - [8] Originally by: sidthesexist Edited by: sidthesexist on 18/05/2006 08:44:29 Originally by: Obmud Since it's a free service not signed. Since I don't vote against anything i do not know or experienced yet not signed. No the service is not free. You will have to pay extra per month to use it. no you don't get it. It's up to you wether you want to use it. And youre false information that its integrated is not true either. ----------------------- This signature got altered because it was way to sexy and uber. If you want to know why don't ask. We're still horny.
liquidism	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:45:00 - [9] hmm teamspeak and ventrilo are developed for a much longer time.. and if we have to pay extra for it who'll use it anyways? vent and ts are free
Obmud	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:46:00 - [10] Originally by: sidthesexist Originally by: duffmantt signed. but seriously, even if they bring it in...why btoher paying for it? just keep on using vent/ts as usual. My post is not to stop people paying for it. Its to put an end to the waste of time trying to impliment it, causing more downtimes and problems for eve as a whole when no one will use it. holy lord, you're jesus. You save us from something we do not know yet. Thank you so much. ----------------------- This signature got altered because it was way to sexy and uber. If you want to know why don't ask. We're still horny.

Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:47:00 - [11] Think they are going to stop development of it because we have a vote? They didnt ask if we wanted it before they started with it, and they wont care if we say we dont want it now either. --- The Eve Wiki Project
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:48:00 - [12] Originally by: Obmud Originally by: sidthesexist Originally by: duffmantt signed. but seriously, even if they bring it in...why btoher paying for it? just keep on using vent/ts as usual. My post is not to stop people paying for it. Its to put an end to the waste of time trying to impliment it, causing more downtimes and problems for eve as a whole when no one will use it. holy lord, you're jesus. You save us from something we do not know yet. Thank you so much. Far from jesus. I respectfully ask you stop flaming the thread. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
Obmud	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:48:00 - [13] Originally by: Jim McGregor Think they are going to stop development of it because we have a vote? They didnt ask if we wanted it before they started with it, and they wont care if we say we dont want it now either. qft. The thread opener is not really familiar with business investments. "i'm sorry we're going to cancel this contract because they petitioned it. :(" yeah. sure. ----------------------- This signature got altered because it was way to sexy and uber. If you want to know why don't ask. We're still horny.
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:53:00 - [14] This thread is completely and totally useless, and you have no idea on how they plan to use the VOIP. From the interview at E3 it plans to do far more then TS ever could. So wait and see. And useless votes by 10 people on the forums and their alts is gonna do squad all. And rightly so. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool
Sinistria	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:55:00 - [15] I am definitely not against such a feature. But I agree that there are many other things within Eve that should have higher priority. Apart from many bugs that stray around Eve, stuff like collision detection or usability problems come to my mind. The ingame browser is rotten, the petition system is not fully integrated into Eve (that would be much more useful than a VOIP system... because that's a reason not to run Eve fullscreen ) And BTW: I want to make use of that "Starbase Tactical Officer" skill... Gimme a target control window at our POSs ...
Feyd Darkholme	Posted - 2006.05.18 08:55:00 - [16] My kneejerk reaction to this whole thing is that it's a terrible idea that's bound to fail. One because of the inherant problems that such a system might bring, and two because I seriously doubt anyones going to opt to pay to use it if they can use a proven third party app for free. In that case, if noones going to use it it feeels like a waste of time and resources, esdpecially if it causes problems that similar systems have caused in other MMOGs. However I am willing to hold final judgement for now... ---------------
Fillmeup	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:00:00 - [17] As I said in the other threads, this one is provided by a third party. Third party servers, third party costs, no additional 'eve-lag'. Unless your machine is ridiculously crap (ie can it currently handle Teamspeak?), it shouldn't make any difference to the playability of the client. Shouldn't increase lag beyond the standard stuff right now. I'd like CCP to pay the VOIP provider directly, but tbh the features it comes with sound pretty awsome. If it ties into the game as well as they are predicting, it'd be a damm good system that BF2 and others won't even be comparable to. And yes, I experienced the fatally flawed implimentation of voice comms in BF2 - it sucked the big one. Perhaps CCP are trying to overcome this by outsourcing it to a third party server farm and thusly removing those issues, albeit at a cost. I agree, a fairly vocal minority of Eve players that actually post on these forums seem to hate the user pays system. I also agree that I would rather it was free. But it if it a kick-a$$ implimentation as it is described, I'd be happy to pay for it to be implimented. I hate using TS because it is seperate to the game, and TS overlay doesn't offer all the functionality I need to adequately use the features of TS. The only real issue I have with the user pays system as a premium service is that it segments the community. I know I will get flamed for saying this, but I'd rather everyone just paid an extra 50cents more per month and it was available to everyone, although it's not really fair to force everyone to use a tool that perhaps only 30% of Eve-players would actively use. It's a tough one. I'd like a non-forums based poll on it - perhaps an in-game poll that ran over a two week period and restricted you to one vote per account as you logged in. It's the only way CCP would get an honest indication of what the entire user base actually feel about this topic, as the forums unfortunately are never a true indication.
Reacz	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:02:00 - [18] Bit late now anyway, the VOIP system is due to be released with the first Kali patch, so theres a 75% chance its already been put in (or nearly has been). Plus chances are that CCP is already locked into a contract with them, so gl with that. :)
Callistus	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:05:00 - [19] I'm all for integrated VOIP, it could do a lot for gang command and corp communications if its done properly and I won't vote against something we know little about. Except to say that it should not be a premium service! Either it should be free and everyone uses it or not at all. -------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainfrane]
Balazs Simon	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:05:00 - [20] Originally by: Gariuys This thread is completely and totally useless, and you have no idea on how they plan to use the VOIP. From the interview at E3 it plans to do far more then TS ever could. So wait and see. And useless votes by 10 people on the forums and their alts is gonna do squad all. And rightly so. I see that interview. But what was described there can be useful only if everybody use it! If you have to play extra for it , a lot of ppl will NOT use it, including me (the features areameazing, I realy liked them, butcome one, I have problems paying my 2 account already, if I will have to pay extra, it just wont work for me, and for a lot of other ppes) If it will be free, the cool. Nice feature.. - POST WITH YOUR MAIN! New sig coming soon... This post is my personal opinion. It does not represent the standpoint of the DICE Corporation.

Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:06:00 - [21] According to stratics, it will be free. But who knows... --- The Eve Wiki Project
Miko Lee	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:06:00 - [22] NOT signed
Darineah Charach	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:07:00 - [23] signed
Padaxes	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:08:00 - [24] Cant help thinking theres about a million other things that I would rather see in eve than inbuilt Voice Comms :/ Where does it say we will have to pay for it as well ?! Can someone post a link please ? If we have to pay extra its complete Bull, working on a stupid cash cow feature at the expense of other more pressing problems would be truly cynical....
Meme One	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:19:00 - [25] Quote: CCP, the majority of the posts i have seen on this forum have been against having a VOIP system in eve. The most vocal is not the majority or even right most of the time. CCP has listened to their players iro VOIP. Do yourself a favour and go look at the Features and ideas section and count the amount of ppl that have asked for a voip solution ingame. You shout that TS/vent is better suited. I disagree. By introducing a voip in game there is a great chance to alleviate a huge number of headaches cause by normal operations. Imagine your FC sitting in a chat with his squad leaders. whilst all of them are still in gang. The FC can relay his orders to the SL's easily and they in turn can communicate their orders to their members easily. You shout that TS or vent should be the preferred method but have you rly thought about communicating just outside your corp/alliance? Are you going to allow random ppl to join ure server and chat there? I wouldn't allow any non corp/alliance members onto my server just cause it's just too much of a sec risk. I'm quite lucky that i have a multi monitor setup that I use to see quickly who is saying what on ts but how many players have that extra piece of hardware to enable them to do that? By asking ccp to stop the introduction of this system your effectively saying "STOP.....eve should stay as is no more new content" and that is a road that leads only to eve become second rate and failing in the end. There are programmers involved in getting this integrated into the current servers but they would most likely be dedicated to just the voip integration of eve and when their done Yipeee new programmers to help with normal coding. Last point. If you dont like it.....then simply dont subscribe to the new service. simple as that.
nico wurz250	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:21:00 - [26] Edited by: nico wurz250 on 18/05/2006 09:23:34 VoIP lol for what reason? I have TS and i can do VoIP trough multiple services in internet. /signed @Meme One i think you have a TS RTFM problem. .
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:24:00 - [27] IF its free/no additional charge, I can see it being used. ~Eximius Josari, Hegemon of the E.A.R.T.H. Federation
Seleene	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:29:00 - [28] I have five accounts. I think I'm paying enough TBH. While I think it's a feature no one asked for, I'll wait until I see some details before I give it a thumbs up or down. But I'm not paying for it. - History of the MC movie!
Boonaki	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:31:00 - [29] If it's free I'll use it, if not I dwont, I have teamspeak. Fear the Ibis of doom!
CB Cyrix	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:34:00 - [30] providing we can CHOOSE to not use it and therefore not pay for it, im all good. i aint paying for something that teamspeak can do for free. -GeoTech- -EveBay-

RotatoR	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:36:00 - [31] You can`t compare Vivox&CCP voice communication project to BF2 simply becouse BF2 uses data services free of charge and it works adequately. If the communication will be managed by Vivox servers so sound quality will be better than ts/ventrilo and CCP will manage to integrate it into system without problems, I bet lots of player will start to use it. Just let the CCP implement this feature and wait how it will work.
Des'ra Lafil	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:39:00 - [32] signed!!! why should anyone pay for VOIP? we have teamspeak for free! ______________________________________________ **** happens!
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:42:00 - [33] No idea why they had to develop a feature no one asked for, and sign the contract with some unknown $$$ hungry start up company that will develop a premium content software that already exists in free of charge form. Besides all that, VoIP can bring hordes of bugs and network bandwidth issues to the game. Waste of time and money IMHO.
Balazs Simon	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:42:00 - [34] Originally by: Des'ra Lafil signed!!! why should anyone pay for VOIP? we have teamspeak for free! That is the big problem of the VOIP companys !! Thats why they need to convince game developpers to integrate the VOIP into their game, or noone would use it. The game WILL FORCE you to use it. You will become inferion if you don't!!!! CCP this is totaly against your mentality! At least used to be against it.... Next time you will say we have to pay "extra" for an expansion.. and the next thing you notice is there will be 2 otehr servers, and you train skills by killing NPCs ... - POST WITH YOUR MAIN! New sig coming soon... This post is my personal opinion. It does not represent the standpoint of the DICE Corporation.
Miss Overlord	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:45:00 - [35] the deal is signed if the major aliacnes boy cott it in favour of teamspeak (id like to see a free teamspeak - Vent_ compatibiilty and for the major alliacnes to boycott it if it doesnt work. If forsome miracle it is made to work and it is fairly cheap (anything more than $2 extra a month will cause most ppl to ignore it)
w0rmy	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:45:00 - [36] Originally by: Obmud Originally by: sidthesexist No the service is not free. You will have to pay extra per month to use it. no you don't get it. It's up to you wether you want to use it. And youre false information that its integrated is not true either. No, you dont get it, the service wont be free. You will have to pay for it. Sure you can choose not to use it, but the service itself isnt free. And everything so far has said it will be intergrated. oh and /signed. Of course people whine, its cause your sig sucks
Wotar	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:46:00 - [37] Voice comms that shut down when the game shuts down = useless.
The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:46:00 - [38] teamspeak is bug free voip isent (no i dont have special powers giving me the ability to look in the futere but i can look in the past)
Theseuss	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:48:00 - [39] Signed, stick to Teamspeak or Ventrilo.
The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:49:00 - [40] Originally by: Wotar Voice comms that shut down when the game shuts down = useless. yea i want to hear them screaming when the server crashes

MachZERO	Posted - 2006.05.18 09:58:00 - [41] Teamspeak is perfectly fine... Why fix what isn't broken? At the very least release 2 clients. One with the VoIP and another without it. The beauty of choice. And when no one downloads the VoIP thingy then it should serve as a huge sign that we collectively don't want it.
Swethren	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:02:00 - [42] I'm sorry guys, but you could at least have waited till you have some sort of... I dunno.. FACTS?! How about being sure about the way it's gonna work, how much it is, how good it is, etc, etc, before you post things like this. Not cool Swethren
Chakoth	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:04:00 - [43] *Signed Why would anyone pay for something that is free? Teamspeak and Ventrillo work just fine. Instead of this spend time improving Eve. Like better sound effects and such. "No beast so fierce but knows some touch of pity. But I know none, and therefore am no beast." Shakespeare, Richard III
MysticNZ	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:08:00 - [44] I wouldn't mind, but charging us for it? I'm one of those cheap skates who isn't paying for a service like that. This will end up impacting everyone since fleet ops will now have this as a requirement. -=====-
Aodha Khan	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:11:00 - [45] It appears this is an optional service so 'not signed'. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:12:00 - [46] Its simple really, everything a VOIP system can do teamspeak can do too. As the interview says, you will be able to contact your squad commanders directly, thats possible with teamspeak, you just bind your keys to your fleet commanders or have channel commander talk binded and have all your commanders flagged with channel commander. Teamspeak + Vent - Free VOIP - Not Free Not a good move ccp :( ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:13:00 - [47] Originally by: Aodha Khan It appears this is an optional service so 'not signed'. Yes but every player has paid for it due to the fact the time spent on developing testing and integrating this VOIP could have been put to better use - reducing lag, improvments and so on. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
Aodha Khan	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:30:00 - [48] Originally by: sidthesexist Originally by: Aodha Khan It appears this is an optional service so 'not signed'. Yes but every player has paid for it due to the fact the time spent on developing testing and integrating this VOIP could have been put to better use - reducing lag, improvments and so on. True. But, I don't mine. Should I be starting a vote to stop all development on mining upgrades? So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:31:00 - [49] Originally by: Jim McGregor According to stratics, it will be free. But who knows... and according to CCP it won't... who do you trust?
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:34:00 - [50] Originally by: Aodha Khan Originally by: sidthesexist Originally by: Aodha Khan It appears this is an optional service so 'not signed'. Yes but every player has paid for it due to the fact the time spent on developing testing and integrating this VOIP could have been put to better use - reducing lag, improvments and so on. True. But, I don't mine. Should I be starting a vote to stop all development on mining upgrades? No because tha majority of eve mine and a large majority are empire miners. I can honestly say right now if things are as i think they are, very few people will pay for this. ________ Euphoria Released http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452

Flyyn	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:40:00 - [51] I have not seen anything from CCP saying you will have to use VOIP and no other.... Matter of fact, people are telling me I MUST sign on to VENT. But CCP has'nt. So with the introduction of VOIP how and why is it going to affect you? Or your game play? It might make things more laggy for me, maybe it will maybe it wont. But I still wont use it. Dont mind me I am just trying to catch up to DS and HK on the boards....
Eternal Fury	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:42:00 - [52] Edited by: Eternal Fury on 18/05/2006 10:44:36 I've read through this post, and many others on the subject, but the thing is this. Most of us don't want to pay for something that is going to cost almost twice per month what an existing hosted server costs. these magical features that allow us to split into squads and allow us wing commanders and other nested chat chaneels.. Folks, these features are already in ventrilo. For those who worry about lag, unless the VOIP/game software is coded badly, you shouldn't see a problem. one draw back that MANY of us have posted about is the simple matter of if you can't log in, or don't log into Eve, you can't connect to the voip server. I chat on vent while browseing the forums, while failing at my attempt to learn to use photoshop, when I'm reading books, or when I'm sitting at my desk painting models, or working on my PC. I won't be able to do that with this new feature. lag shouldn't be an issue as the voip servers will be 3rd party. I would suggest also ssetting up a out of game ability to connect to the voip server. The problem with this, is you'd have to also be able to connect to the log on server. Is the log on server run from the same server as the game? or can they be upgraded/shutdown/daily downtime'd without the login server going down too? I would HIGHLY suggest that CCP and this VOIP company give the eve player base a free month to try out this voip server, as many of us who are **ed tht you guys are spending time on this and not on fixing the GOD DAMNED PETITION system. I mean seriously. I've YET to have a petition go in since I started playing in January.. sheesh.. I'd rather see support added for things like the logitech G15 Keyboard. I hope you guys start releaseing some info on this soon.. ohh.. and are we going to pay CCP for this service, or are we going to be paying some company none of us know about? how about a deal. 2 or more Eve Accounts, and you get free VOIP.. that would assauge MANY of the hurt feelings here. though it'd ** off those with only 1 account :) Small PvE/PvP Corp looking for Members. 2-10Mill SP. Click for details.
Boonaki	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:43:00 - [53] It's a feature that wasn't really asked for, they're going to spend allot of time developing it and it's pushing back the stuff we actually want. Think a year back, small bug fix patches happened 2 weeks to a month apart. They had little events all the time and some really cool large scale events (remember the jove guy that exploded, colleecting parts). They released new ships without full scale expansions (stealth bombers, etc) and still put out full expansions with only a slight delay) Their two biggest priorities seem to be the China server (support this 100% actually) and VOIP. Fear the Ibis of doom!
James Lyrus	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:46:00 - [54] I see lots of posts saying 'TS is free'. I'm pretty sure that someone ends up paying for it, be it through the monsterous bandwidth it eats, or because they've got a hosted service somewhere else. Or am I missing something? My major concern is whilst TS/Vent may _not_ be free, it's possible for me to provide it, and then I can pester people to use it, without them giving the 'can't afford it' line. -- We are recruiting
loony zoon	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:49:00 - [55] SIGNED The only reason for doing this is to develop another income stream. Waste of time and resources.
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:50:00 - [56] Originally by: Aiyleena Iluvatar Stupids post ever!!!!! oh delicious irony
HippoKing	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:50:00 - [57] Originally by: James Lyrus I see lots of posts saying 'TS is free'. I'm pretty sure that someone ends up paying for it, be it through the monsterous bandwidth it eats, or because they've got a hosted service somewhere else. Or am I missing something? My major concern is whilst TS/Vent may _not_ be free, it's possible for me to provide it, and then I can pester people to use it, without them giving the 'can't afford it' line. We host our TS from a friend's bedroom, and it works fine. Entirely free excluding his net connection, which he is going to have to have anyway to use the VOIP system. My major gripes with this are: Taking development time Will most likely need you to be logged in to use Premium Service
Aiyleena Iluvatar	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:50:00 - [58] Stupids post ever!!!!! and once again it shows how hard it is for some ppl to even read more than a headline (or even read anything)
Boonaki	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:51:00 - [59] Edited by: Boonaki on 18/05/2006 10:53:09 Originally by: loony zoon SIGNED The only reason for doing this is to develop another income stream. Waste of time and resources. You don't know that, they may not make money off of this at all (I'm sure they will but still, don't know for a fact), the extra fee may just go to the service provider. Fear the Ibis of doom!
Taniya	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:53:00 - [60] Without reliable information I'm not signing anything. So far all I've seen is people repeating eachother. I have not seen a reliable article with detailed information on what is being implemented and what it would cost. Maybe they are going to charge 0.01 isk a month, maybe it's gonna show who is saying what in game. Maybe it will be a much better way to communicate with people that are not part of your corp alliance whatever. And maybe they are going to charge $15 a week and it will just be a teamspeak client. We just don't know. So not signed. -- May you live in interesting times

fuze	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:55:00 - [61] This whole thing pretty much blows because there will be enough zealots that going to pay for that VOIP account and it will split up corp/alliances because some are too stubborn to switch from Ventrillo/Teamspeak. And if its required that you must be able to use that VOIP ability ingame by CEO, FC or alliance leader my answer would be 'escrow you!'. My guess this goes for quite a lot of people. And it's pretty naive from CCP to think people will be paying for something they can get for free. Even though some person hosting a Vent/TS srv has this high BW load which is included in the ISP bill eventually. It's nice they are trying to arrange for ingame VOIP capabilties since members did ask for it. But the way they worked it out is flawed.
Flyyn	Posted - 2006.05.18 10:59:00 - [62] Edited by: Flyyn on 18/05/2006 11:01:32 Originally by: sidthesexist VOIP The introduction of a VOIP system to EvE by CCP, one which we will have to pay to use, really goes against everything i, and im sure alot of other people, thought CCP stood for. Having played BF2 for quite some time now i can tell CCP from experiance that introducing a VOIP system will do nothing but cause major problems for them. With the mysterious connection drops to the server aswell as lag-kicks and so on, the VOIP system will not work as intended. Integrated VOIP systems in games have been known to cause major problems, i rememmber Planetside being down for almost a full week because of their integrated voice system, BF2 has had no end of bugs due to its VOIP system. CCP, the majority of the posts i have seen on this forum have been against having a VOIP system in eve. I implore you, spend time on things that are more vital to the players and eve as a whole, rather than somthing which we the players really dont need or intend to use. Please listen to your community. I leave the floor open to anyone who wishes to comment. What games are you talking about? I never even heard of TS or Vent till I started playing Eve. The only games I have seen use a voice communications is X-box and playstation. Before you start a thread ment to incite panic and revolution you should be sure of the facts. Where are your facts? I see planetside and BF2...not good chocies to use, niether had the supporting hardware Eve-online started with. And concidering the bugs we have now, a voice progam bug wont hurt a darn thing. Dont mind me I am just trying to catch up to DS and HK on the boards....
Moghydin	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:08:00 - [63] Edited by: Moghydin on 18/05/2006 11:09:46 This is the link to an article on www.mmorpg.com: http://www.mmorpg.com/e32006NewsRoom.cfm/loadNews/5243 They clearly say that it's going to be a premium service. I won't pay because I'm fed up by different corporations effort to milk more money out of me. we have numerous "premium" services everywhere, that provide staff that was free not long time ago, pay-per-view TV, for example, is slowly consuming more and more areas of TV broadcasting. If it goes that way, we'll have soon to use credit card each time we turn our TV sets on or browse someone's site on the Internet. Who knows, it can even come to this eventually: Notification: Your breathing subscription has expired, you now have 0.0 m^3 of air on your monthly quota. Please renew your subscrbtion now. Call xxxxxxxx. Have a nice day
Sevarus James	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:10:00 - [64] Edited by: Sevarus James on 18/05/2006 11:14:29 Originally by: James Lyrus I see lots of posts saying 'TS is free'. I'm pretty sure that someone ends up paying for it, be it through the monsterous bandwidth it eats, or because they've got a hosted service somewhere else. Or am I missing something? My major concern is whilst TS/Vent may _not_ be free, it's possible for me to provide it, and then I can pester people to use it, without them giving the 'can't afford it' line. I rented a 150 member professionally hosted TS server awhile back for the corp I was running (older account). It cost me less than 20 bucks (US) a month to run. There are hosted TS servers that have been 'donated' for EVE members usage afaik, so costs can be very minimal, but usually not non-existant. The problem here is the 'how much?' factor. In all the blogs/e3 blurbs and forum posts, I've yet to see an answer to this one. If a 75 member corporation can rent a pro TS server for 8-15 bucks a month, then CCP had better factor this in. If that same 75 member corp is shelling out 2-3 dollars a piece for this 'in game feature', then there will be screaming to high heaven. The have/have not issues which are already evident in recruiting by some corps (use TS or leave us) will even further inflame the situation. CCP promised no extra costs for expansions and such. Of course they promised that EVE would always be ONE universe, and now there's another....I hate even to say this word..."shard" going up, with the executives saying that anyone with the $$$ can get "localized". (fancy way of saying: "shard", no matter how ccp politically spins it). This whole thing may be much to do about nothing, but it definitely is a sensitive issue at the present time. Of course on the flip side, most MMO's charge for every new thing they generate, so in the scheme of things perhaps CCP doesn't see this as a real issue. After all its "an option". Of course for those in a corp which decides to use the service it no longer becomes a choice. Its either pony up or "kicked to da' curb". Interesting times indeed. And now, back down to the Tech forum dungeon where we non microsoft lovers must continue our moanage over the evil that is DX10. ----- ------------ Linux Desktop+EVE
Kaathar Rielspar	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:20:00 - [65] Personally, I feel CCP have to be very careful about what they're getting into here with a VOIP system. I'm all for the further development and enhancement of EvE but the talk of making it a premium service is worrying. The crux of the matter is thus: What does the proposed VOIP service offer that existing voice comm's solutions (TS/Vent) dont? As noted above, as a premium service certain people will not/can't afford to pay extra for it, while the existing voice comm's programs do the job just as well. If CCP was to make the VOIP system an integral part of EvE (linking it into gangs for example) and thus superior to TS/Vent then does it not follow that the player(s) who use the VOIP service have an unfair advantage over those who dont? Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Originally by: Eximius Josari If BS Sized HACs would be overpowered, what are HACs? Overpriced Nos victims.
Aodha Khan	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:24:00 - [66] Originally by: sidthesexist No because tha majority of eve mine and a large majority are empire miners. I can honestly say right now if things are as i think they are, very few people will pay for this. Well, it hasn't been implemented and the pricing structure hasn't been anounced to it's a little premature to judge how many people will use this service. So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Taketa De	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:25:00 - [67] I could imagine paying for this, but only if certain conditions are met: 1. I have more then one account, however I'd only be willing to pay for one "login" to the system that has to be able to be used no matter which account I'm using (like Vent or TS), after all it's only going to be one player talking. 2. No more then 1 € extra a month, half of that would be more fair. Still more expensive then TS/Vent, but cheap enough so that the difference doesn't matter and is worth the extra features in game. Bonus point: It's an external app that integrates with the client so is still running if EVE goes down. That would also make point 1 easier to implement. --- The Advanced Drone Control Panel.
videorecorder	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:29:00 - [68] CCP, be smart about it. Listen to your community.
Vanlade	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:32:00 - [69] Signed
Caethes Adain	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:33:00 - [70] At the mo' i'm indifferent to the VOIP thingum until more information is given and we find out how it's all going to be implemented into the game. People seem to be getting a tad too emotional atm about it, yes other games may have had problems but it doesn't mean that it will be the same for eve. The main problem I see is that some people may get excluded from various oppurtunities if they do not pay the extra. Timecard people will be borked unless timecards come in 2 flavours...or what could get peolpe annoyed is if there is only 1 timecard which includes VOIP meaning they'll have to pay extra for something they may not want. The upside is that communication could become a lot easier and the client will be universal.

Sim Frost	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:44:00 - [71] Signed Say NO to paid Voip service .
Tharc	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:52:00 - [72] sky is falling ? , werent the voip gonna run on separate servers as far as i heard ? seems like op might be slightly mis informed, dont judge stuff that isnt even remotely done yet
Infinity Ziona	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:58:00 - [73] Sounds very cool. If it gives me coms in surrounding area local so I can yell at morons in slow indies, I'll subscribe!. Move it Fatso!!! Infinity
Fortior	Posted - 2006.05.18 11:59:00 - [74] Meh. Let's just wait until the thing is actually released. And it will be released, no doubt about it. There is no way in hell that CCP is going to cancel development and cancel the deal with Vivox, period. Looking at Swedish law for instance, CCP would most likely get OMGWTF-sued by Vivox in a heartbeat if that happened. Is everyone always this impatient?
Jenson Cole	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:16:00 - [75] As a CEO for a Corporation in game I'm keeping a close eye on this topic of the in game voice system. The decideing factor for me will be costs involved. The questions I have revolve around the cost. Is it a per person fee or per corp/alliance? If it's per person I'm going to scrap the idea of getting a server for my corp because I'm not going to force my members to pay an extra fee for bells and whistles. If it's a per corp fee and the fee is reasonable I'll look into getting it otherwise I'll stick with Teamspeak where a corp I'm allied with has gave my corp a room to use.
sidthesexist	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:17:00 - [76] Originally by: Jenson Cole As a CEO for a Corporation in game I'm keeping a close eye on this topic of the in game voice system. The decideing factor for me will be costs involved. The questions I have revolve around the cost. Is it a per person fee or per corp/alliance? If it's per person I'm going to scrap the idea of getting a server for my corp because I'm not going to force my members to pay an extra fee for bells and whistles. If it's a per corp fee and the fee is reasonable I'll look into getting it otherwise I'll stick with Teamspeak where a corp I'm allied with has gave my corp a room to use. From details released it will be per person. ________ Euphoria Released Sig removed, maximum allowed dimensions are 400x120. Please contact [email protected] (including a copy of the picture!) for more info. -wystler http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=339452
Elisabeth	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:18:00 - [77] Edited by: Elisabeth on 18/05/2006 12:20:38 I dont think it's the VOIP thingy that bothers me but the path CCP has choosen to wander down. When i first started playing this was a community tight nitted and friendly DEV's chatted with users, explained when something went wrong. Listened to peoples requests about changes and such. They wrote devblogs quite frequently and gave information in forums about upcoming releases . Maybe not precis information but atleast information. Nowadays a devblog is something uniqe and very rare, as for information whats happening to the game we are paying them to develope has complety dissapered altogether. We must scrounge throw interviews and mmo sites to get information about whats happening in "our" game. And what happend with fixing things that are vital to game play such as drones,POS,gui,capital ships and so forth ? This is the line of questioning we should be asking instead of bickering over the VOIP implementation which wether we like it or not is gonna be inserted into the game.
SL65 AMG	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:18:00 - [78] put that Voio thing on ice and concentrate on more important issues
LWMaverick	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:19:00 - [79] Yep.. waste of time, money and all that.. Now if it was free.... /Mav Spirits in the night! ALLLLL NIGHT!!!
Boogey Trollias	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:25:00 - [80] Integrated VOIP, no matter of the game, is a community killer. There are communities that play different games, and sit on same teamspeak/ventrilo server to allow easy community chat and view on who's doing what. If more and more games start integrating VOIP (which for Eve does nothing but create confusion between those using ts/vent and those paying for the "premium" service) in their games such communities will devolve back to only forum usage and on the long run works against online gaming. Thus I think it's a bad idea for Eve.

Julia Reave	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:29:00 - [81] My vote goes against creating two classes of people in Eve by making the VoIP thing (or anything else) an optional feature that is being charged extra. I am not against the VoIP integration in general and I think the presented ideas of command structures/hierarchy sound interesting. So either make it free for all, or maybe raise the montly fee a bit(!)...
Nafri	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:32:00 - [82] It all depends on who VOIP will be implentent in Eve. My fear is that it will be implentent so that you can use lots of new gang features only if you have this VOIP. Without VOIP you will be second class Eve player who cant utilize the full aspects of the game. Summertime - Campingtime!
RaYmEn	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:43:00 - [83] /me signed !1!11! CCP you waste your time with it.
Kuolematon	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:49:00 - [84] Signed! Unnerf Amarr! Proud member of Caldari Provisions
Ni'ka	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:58:00 - [85] Edited by: Ni''ka on 18/05/2006 12:58:34 /Signed against VOIP. ------------------------------ Originally by: Balklanac The biggest problem with T2 market is poor people.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2006.05.18 12:59:00 - [86] Originally by: Fillmeup As I said in the other threads, this one is provided by a third party. Third party servers, third party costs, no additional 'eve-lag'. It's requiring, per CCP interview, a LOT of work to integrate it into the new gang system. I, for one, would rather that the font be fixed by the UI coders. "The Human eye is a marvelous device, with a very little effort it can overlook all but the most glaring injustice" - Quellchrist Falconer
DigitalCommunist	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:01:00 - [87] I really don't care as long as they change the stuff that matters: instas, warp cores, local chat, sovereignty, damage Purchasing Complex Fullerene Shards, contact me ingame.
Suze'Rain	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:19:00 - [88] I was for VOIP, untill I found out about the additional fee. I am strongly against the "feature" in that context.
Pooka	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:31:00 - [89] Edited by: Pooka on 18/05/2006 13:32:53 signed. CCP please stop wasting time on this and work on the problems that already exist. (wonder how much this is going to affect normal play, and how many pepole will be taken away from the normal player base support to fix VOIP problems ) Or, how about the promises from last year?? Comet mining planet flight things like that Proud memmber of the 3 Word: p·ca (POO-kuh) [pu:k@] Meaning: p·ca = goblin, sprite, pooka
Liger Li	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:38:00 - [90] Edited by: Liger Li on 18/05/2006 13:38:42 A petition decrying untested future plans and claiming to know they'll fail because of anecdotal evidence? I think I just had a flashback to the WoW boards.

Cptn Z	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:47:00 - [91] Damn, I feel that literally anything CPP do causes a reaction similar to: "And what about the <insert my favorite feature here>? I want IT to be implemented instead of wasting your time on <insert the implemented feature here>! Nobody will use it!". Also, there were people asking for VOIP on forums; I personally seen such requests in "Features and Ideas", afair. Yes, a lot of people will stick to TS (like, most probably, myself). But nobody is forced to use this "premium" feature. So, why cry like there will be NO new features, except VOIP? Let's wait for the patch first, then flame. --- Regards, Z
Shimpu	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:48:00 - [92] I welcome the VOIP software. It's optional, it's something new and IF it's good i'll use it. If not, then I'm not using it. P.S.: Don't judge things before they are available and finished
w0rmy	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:50:00 - [93] Edited by: w0rmy on 18/05/2006 13:55:41 Originally by: Aodha Khan Well, it hasn't been implemented and the pricing structure hasn't been anounced so it's a little premature to judge how many people will use this service. Common sense dictates very few will use it. "Hmmm lets see, will a use this free high quality, localy hosted voice comm system where I have full control over it, or, shall I use this pay service, that provides less, than I can provide myself for free" Tough choice isnt it? Originally by: Wild Rho As long as im not forced to pay extra for it I'm not bothered. If I'm expected to pay for it even though I have no intention of using it, then hell no. You wouldnt rather the developement time(then bug fixing time) go into parts of the game weve been promised, and still havent been delivered? Originally by: Shimpu I welcome the VOIP software. It's optional, it's something new and IF it's good i'll use it. If not, then I'm not using it. Cool, YOULL use it... Which is kinda pointless when the rest of your alliance isnt. "Well instead of making everyone use ts/vent theyll be made to use in game coms" Sit back and watch, as your alliance becomes 1/4 of its size. Of course people whine, its cause your sig sucks
Wild Rho	Posted - 2006.05.18 13:50:00 - [94] As long as im not forced to pay extra for it I'm not bothered. If I'm expected to pay for it even though I have no intention of using it, then hell no. WE ARE DYSLEXIC OF BORG. Refutance is systile. Your ass will be laminated. - Jennie Marlboro
Suze'Rain	Posted - 2006.05.18 14:16:00 - [95] Edited by: Suze''Rain on 18/05/2006 14:17:50 Could'nt resist doing a design ramble. VOIP could have been spectacular: As a designer, I'm amazed at how unoriginal and conservative CCP have been with this. Imagine, if you would, ingame skills that could allow greater integration with the VOIP system - tiers of control and access through Command sections, down through each Wing to defined Squadrons, and on if needs be to the individual pilot. Imagine your gang leader giving voice orders on the strike on the war target, while he in turn is feeding your status back up to the commander whose ingame skills are giving your force a tangiable benefit from the controller whose leadership skills are being transmitted to an entire wing by the VOIP, instead of just by being there in person in a command ship, etc. Imagine, perhaps, that an overhaul of Eve's currently awful audio was implemented, that sound started to become an integral part of the game, something that can be used to know where targets were, and what's happening, without even needing to be looking.. Can you hear, in your head, eve, with full 5.1 positional audio, The ringing of a enemy ship locking you coming from your left hand side, and being able to instincively swing the camera to the side to see where the enemy is coming from based on the targeting alert... and then the changing tone and pitch of strikes making muffled electrical cra*kling across shields, and the change to the heavy bass impacts of armour, before the higher pitched, urgent rending tearing metal of your hull disintegrating. imagine the subtle humming of power coursing through a frigate, the tone dropping half an octave as the ship is directed to move, the sound dropping lower still as afterburners are kicked in, a doppler effect in the tone rising and falling, in front and then behind you in 5.1, as you approach and pass another ship. Imagine the same sound, magnified and dropped by octaves for the rumbling bass of a battleship or dreadnought, the sheer mass of the machine implied by the sound that comes from the ship. imagine the subtle underlying sounds of mechanical action as a rack of autocannons spin up, or the electronic hum of lasers. Now combine that with the proposed "heat" system, and the tone and pich can be shifted as a system comes closer to the point of critical overload - can you forsee (forehear?) the advantage of listening to the sound of the guns turned up to 11, hearing the rising tone and instead of seeing the situations just on a display, being able to recognise the point when the gun Heat will go supercritical, by sound alone? Now, imagine that the environment around you is dynamic too. inside a gas cloud, and you can hear the same sounds, quieter, from another ship, yor ship's sensors able to collate the information from an enemy, and be able to recognise what damage he's doing, taking, and the likes by sound alone - being able to tell he's at 110% on afterburner trying to keep up with you by the pitch, being able to work out his guns are overloading, knowing you're tanking him when he's trowing everything he's got, and more. Imagine all that being fed back through the integrated voice and audio. Instead, CCP have taken the "quick and easy" solution, tacking it on in such a way that this potentially spectacular asset has, frankly, been wasted. the division into "do you use VOIP or not" will split forces, not bring them closer, the additional fee threatens to undermine CCP's superb selling point of all additions costing nothing beyond subscription. What a waste.
Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.05.18 14:18:00 - [96] Edited by: Jim McGregor on 18/05/2006 14:18:33 Well, guess they didnt think of it because they didnt ask any players for input on it. Sounds like good ideas to me. --- The Eve Wiki Project
Adrian Kerensky	Posted - 2006.05.18 14:38:00 - [97] /signed
Roue	Posted - 2006.05.18 14:38:00 - [98] Originally by: Suze'Rain Edited by: Suze''Rain on 18/05/2006 14:17:50 Could'nt resist doing a design ramble. VOIP could have been spectacular: As a designer, I'm amazed at how unoriginal and conservative CCP have been with this. Imagine, if you would, ingame skills that could allow greater integration with the VOIP system - tiers of control and access through Command sections, down through each Wing to defined Squadrons, and on if needs be to the individual pilot. Imagine your gang leader giving voice orders on the strike on the war target, while he in turn is feeding your status back up to the commander whose ingame skills are giving your force a tangiable benefit from the controller whose leadership skills are being transmitted to an entire wing by the VOIP, instead of just by being there in person in a command ship, etc. Imagine, perhaps, that an overhaul of Eve's currently awful audio was implemented, that sound started to become an integral part of the game, something that can be used to know where targets were, and what's happening, without even needing to be looking.. Can you hear, in your head, eve, with full 5.1 positional audio, The ringing of a enemy ship locking you coming from your left hand side, and being able to instincively swing the camera to the side to see where the enemy is coming from based on the targeting alert... and then the changing tone and pitch of strikes making muffled electrical cra*kling across shields, and the change to the heavy bass impacts of armour, before the higher pitched, urgent rending tearing metal of your hull disintegrating. imagine the subtle humming of power coursing through a frigate, the tone dropping half an octave as the ship is directed to move, the sound dropping lower still as afterburners are kicked in, a doppler effect in the tone rising and falling, in front and then behind you in 5.1, as you approach and pass another ship. Imagine the same sound, magnified and dropped by octaves for the rumbling bass of a battleship or dreadnought, the sheer mass of the machine implied by the sound that comes from the ship. imagine the subtle underlying sounds of mechanical action as a rack of autocannons spin up, or the electronic hum of lasers. Now combine that with the proposed "heat" system, and the tone and pich can be shifted as a system comes closer to the point of critical overload - can you forsee (forehear?) the advantage of listening to the sound of the guns turned up to 11, hearing the rising tone and instead of seeing the situations just on a display, being able to recognise the point when the gun Heat will go supercritical, by sound alone? Now, imagine that the environment around you is dynamic too. inside a gas cloud, and you can hear the same sounds, quieter, from another ship, yor ship's sensors able to collate the information from an enemy, and be able to recognise what damage he's doing, taking, and the likes by sound alone - being able to tell he's at 110% on afterburner trying to keep up with you by the pitch, being able to work out his guns are overloading, knowing you're tanking him when he's trowing everything he's got, and more. Imagine all that being fed back through the integrated voice and audio. Instead, CCP have taken the "quick and easy" solution, tacking it on in such a way that this potentially spectacular asset has, frankly, been wasted. the division into "do you use VOIP or not" will split forces, not bring them closer, the additional fee threatens to undermine CCP's superb selling point of all additions costing nothing beyond subscription. What a waste. Yes for +to sound changes No to just basic standard VOIP. And honestly, let's not waste the time on it. EVE is a game of hard core long time loyal fans. They want fixes more then new content. They kind of players who need force fed content weekly to keep subs, are not in synch with eve's inner speed. Fix > Feature
Dinique	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:19:00 - [99] Originally by: sidthesexist VOIP The introduction of a VOIP system to EvE by CCP, one which we will have to pay to use, really goes against everything i, and im sure alot of other people, thought CCP stood for. I am fine with a integrated VOIP solution, I can choose to use it or ignore it, BUT: It should NOT be a premium service, because it segments the community into haves and have-nots. This is bad, and WILL lead to some corporations and alliances making it a requirement. That is assuming that there will actually be people that use this. IT also means that the usefulness of this system will take a dive for people that do pay for it, when the majority, or a significant portion of players they encounter don't. Its either for everyone, or not for anyone. The other point I'd like to make is that EVE has enough points of failure and bugs as it is. Why the hell you would want to add another (developed by a third party no less) at this point, along with another major update (Kali) looming on the horizon, is anybody's guess. Just thank your lucky stars they didn't buy some Microsoft system...
keepiru	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:21:00 - [100] I vote for VOIP just to spite this arrogant thread. ---------------- Please fix BC Sig/Agility!

KennyRogers	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:21:00 - [101] as long as this is an ooption and i am not forced to pay for the service I am fine with it.
Valeo Galaem	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:28:00 - [102] Edited by: Valeo Galaem on 18/05/2006 15:34:16 I don't see why everyone is going on about how this will be bad for the game. No official information has been given out covering its features or lack there of yet. We have nothing to complain about other than the service will cost an extra $X to use. The best thing CCP could announce at this point is that the service will be available to anyone to listen to (provided voice comms are only inside of normal text chats), but the premium fee will be for people to speak over it. There are many possible advantages to using an in game VoIP system: The ability to voice comm with anyone with just a single click, rather than making them get 3rd party software and connect to your server first. Being able to identify the speaker by their Character instead of a User Name. Automatic tiering of voice comms between Fleet Commanders, Commanders, and their Pilots with the new gang system. And need I say it, Customer Support from a company whose sole job is to provide VoIP service (remember, CCP is licensing the service and probably the program APIs from Vivox, so they can only screw it up so much) Of course it would be quite easy for CCP and Vivox to not deliver on these, what I think, vital features. And if they are left out, you probably won't find me paying for it. But if they pull through, I believe such a service would be desirable. Once the VoIP system is in, CCP should offer a trial period, maybe 3-7 days per account so that the players can evaluate it before subscribing. Thar be Pirates You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied! CONCORD Encryption
Chandaris	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:39:00 - [103] Unless I'll be able to radio people in local space, have them hear me and 'Heave to and Surrender or be DESTROYED!' through their speakers, /signed.
Prydeless	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:42:00 - [104] I think it will be pretty sweet, especially if i can get voicemail in my eve mail . So anyways, you get no signage from me, if you dont want it then dont pay for it, stop whining about it.
Laythun	Posted - 2006.05.18 15:54:00 - [105] who cares? its optional. Vote with your wallets and just dont pay for it. 400x120@24000 bytes Max please. -Capsicum If im flaming or not contributing, im sorry. But im trying to get into the [23]
TOOMY	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:00:00 - [106] Originally by: Laythun who cares? its optional. But its still gonna be in the game code, and create more lag than there already is. whether u use it or not
Rule2k	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:04:00 - [107] SHOULD FIX THE BUGS BEFORE REALEASING MORE 'STUFF'
Steppa	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:17:00 - [108] If you read the current dev blog, it clearly states that the third-party company is developing and deploying (and hosting) this new voice client. While integration is going to require some man-hours at CCP, for the most part the developers of the VOIP are going to be responsible for it. Further, the dev blog makes a good point when it talks about a "free" service. We use TS, but it is certainly true that the Sturmgrenadier syndicate in total uses the same TS servers, they are paid for by membership dues. Thus, not free. I am cautiously optimistic about a fully-integrated, fully-featured VOIP that is specifically tailored to Eve. It might not work, it may work wonderfully...but I'm willing to give CCP the benefit of the doubt and wait and see. Rabbling until your fingers bleed isn't going to change a thing at this point.
Valeo Galaem	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:18:00 - [109] Originally by: TOOMY Originally by: Laythun who cares? its optional. But its still gonna be in the game code, and create more lag than there already is. whether u use it or not How, exactly? Its not even hosted on CCPs servers. You you're not using the service, you don't have any additional connections open. Its impossible for this feature to cause 'lag'. Maybe a little extra bandwidth if you're actually using it, thats it. Originally by: Rule2k SHOULD FIX THE BUGS BEFORE REALEASING MORE 'STUFF' Oveur Just put out a new Dev Blog. In it he said that pretty much all development of the VoIP integration is being handled by Vivox. In the past month since work on it has started, CCP has invested only a few man hours helping them. Heck, they've probably spent more time drinking bree in the office than working on this project Thar be Pirates You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied! CONCORD Encryption
Ricdics	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:22:00 - [110] Give a 1 month free trial of the VoIP subscription once it has been implemented. Two weeks into the trial, run a poll through the character selection screen, asking players if they would accept a $0.20 subscription fee increase per month. If over 50% of poll results say Yes, implement for all, and increase the costing, giving CCP $24,000+/- per month to pay the VoIP providers for bandwidth etc. If over 50% of poll results say No, have VoIP as the optional extra, as is currently planned. Win/Win situation. CCP can show off their product in a 1 month period (CCP incurs the cost, fair considering the future outlay the customer base may be looking at). Us customers get to sample the VoIP product, and decide (based on our sample) how we would prefer VoIP integrated. Having even 20,000 / 130,000 poll results come back, should be a fine way to determine which way this system should be implemented. Of course, votes can only be made once per account (not character). What you guys think?

Preoccuppas	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:25:00 - [111] I'll keep it simple, Free without additional charge to the current subscription? Yes Anything else? No Reasons: >>Case of extra subscription costs I pay to play eve-online. an mmorpg. Games can evolve, add extra functionality and grow. But forcing people into buying something which many do not consider something that can and or should be part of the core game is a bad thing. >>Case of optional service For the voicecom to be used you should give people a reason, what is the added value of taking this service compared to the free ones. The people that actually may want to use the service already have a FREE alternative. The that don't use the service.. Won't use the service.. Since it bloody costs money and if they want to talk with other folk they get on TS >>Case of FREE service If well implemented people might want to use this service, because it's easy to reach for everyone within eve. It makes voicecom more attractive because you don't have to bother with installing TS or setting up a server or whatever. making the barrier lower.. Anyway :\|
Andros vonBek	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:33:00 - [112] In-game VOIP sounds like a cool idea to me IN THEORY, but there are a lot of reservations, all of which have been discussed herein ad infinitum - I'll not rabble what has already been rabbled... Personally I'll wait to see whether the corp/alliance requires this or not. I have 3 accounts, more than likely I'll pay for it if it's required. EVE is too important to quit or ditch my corp over this issue. The issue is one of communication, not between players in-game but between the devs and the player base. The lack thereof is causing great concern. Personally, I think if this is implemented it should be done so as an external application so that voice comms can be continued when out of game (be it via a disconnect, CTD, downtime, or just wanting to talk smack with fellow corpies while doing other stuff) but that prolly isn't going to happen. I'd also like to see some feature where those with multiple accounts (I have 3 personally, 2 regular and 1 P^2 which will be made into a full account in due time, and I know a lot of people have this many or more) can group their accounts together and not have to pay for this more than once. Instead of /signing or /not signing this, I'll /sign for a fully comprehensive devblog on how this feature is going to be implemented. It's the only way to put this to rest one way or another. Filesize too big. Mail [email protected] for info - Cathath
w0rmy	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:33:00 - [113] Originally by: Valeo Galaem Originally by: Rule2k SHOULD FIX THE BUGS BEFORE REALEASING MORE 'STUFF' Oveur Just put out a new Dev Blog. In it he said that pretty much all development of the VoIP integration is being handled by Vivox. In the past month since work on it has started, CCP has invested only a few man hours helping them. And you dont see the flaw in this? You also cannot tell me there isnt going to be much to implement this into the billing engine, the webpage, the client (If vivox are handling the implementation into the client alone, CCP are retards), the databse etc etc. The client is only a part of this. Then what about all the man hours spent by the different CCP teams, the discussion over how the are going to bill for this, and what rates is gonna take time in itself, how it should look. Then youve got 6 months of discussions on which font to use. Anyone from CCP saying the implementation of this is going to take very few of ccps man hours either: 1: Hasnt thought it through 2: Isnt that bright And what about supporting it. voip software is inherantly buggy, amagine the increase in petitions and work for GM's regarding this. CCP have never had enough GM's to do the job, you think theyre going to hire enough for this? Have the ever had enough Gms to handle petitions in timely manner? I could ramble on forever the potential problems I can see with this... And im still yet to hear 1 thing this will accomplish that cant already be acomplished by other products already out there. Ok Ok I lie, I see one difference. More $$$$$ For CCP. Dont tell me this isnt about the $$$$$ vivox put a great spin to CCP, and CCP just heard cha-ching Of course people whine, its cause your sig sucks
w0rmy	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:41:00 - [114] Originally by: Andros vonBek I have 3 accounts, more than likely I'll pay for it if it's required. That brings up a good question. If you have 3 acconuts, do you pay for it 3 times? Of course people whine, its cause your sig sucks
Andros vonBek	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:51:00 - [115] Originally by: w0rmy Originally by: Andros vonBek I have 3 accounts, more than likely I'll pay for it if it's required. That brings up a good question. If you have 3 acconuts, do you pay for it 3 times? Another reason why we need a fully comprehensive devblog on this. Unanswered questions... Leading to speculation and comparisons to other games, hypothetical situations, and unrest in the community as a whole who have no option but to speculate and voice their concerns here. Filesize too big. Mail [email protected] for info - Cathath
Swethren	Posted - 2006.05.18 16:55:00 - [116] Edited by: Swethren on 18/05/2006 16:56:47 Originally by: keepiru I vote for VOIP just to spite this arrogant thread. I'm on your boat here I'd like to know how everyon gets thier TS and Vent servers for Free. The client is free, but the server isn't. So either 1 guy in your corp/alliance is being a nice guy and footing the bill for your TS or you guys have illegal software. If push comes to shove, you simply do a corp mining op or summin, make a couple hundred million ISK, but some GTC's sell em on ebay, and volia, you've just paid for your VOIP service for the corp/alliance. Swethren
IsmaelYU5 Iluvatar	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:03:00 - [117] Originally by: keepiru I vote for VOIP just to spite this arrogant thread. ------------ An eye for an eye only makes the whole world blind - Ghandi
Ceratin	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:24:00 - [118] Signed.. waste of dev time, wouldnt use it anyway. Use time to fix games current unplayability plz ------------ - All Hail, Leader of The Pod Brigade
Sean Dillon	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:30:00 - [119] Signed. I feel about voice that its like, look what we can do with our mmorpg. We have voice no others have 11!11 But seriously ts>VOIP just because its free.
Zeknen	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:35:00 - [120] /signed No VOIP please... --- Looking for a pirate corp that will accept newbs? Join Atra Negotium. More info here: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=337334

Jim McGregor	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:36:00 - [121] I think this thing will be way better than the current TS/vent thingie. Devs seem pretty excited about it and that wouldnt be the case if it wasnt something special. If its really good im sure it could be just like being in a room with 40 people with no distortions in sound. But we'll see. I agree it should not be a premium service though. Its going to create problems when some people want to spend money on it and some people dont. --- The Eve Wiki Project
Alessandra Grey	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:41:00 - [122] So many of you nay-sayers are so uneducated and so locked into your arbitrary "i dont want it, so it cant be put in" state that you dont take time to read or examine anything. Firstly, to the OP's comment about all games with integrated voice systems having major problems, i'd like to point out to you the most successful game in recent history: Counter-Strike. Thats right, Half-life, half-life 2 and all their various mods have had integrated voice since the multiplayer feature went live (i've been playing CS since pre-beta 1 as i lived in the same dorm as two of the original mappers and had an "in" so to speak). There have never been "lag drops" or "mysterious crashes" because of the voice system. So yes, if you're running a game like planetside (which was garbage anyway) and you throw very very limited resources on a voip system, then you're going to have problems. CCP solved this by contracting a professional third party company to design one specifically for this game. Anyone who happened to be paying attention at E3 (yes, i realize that most of you werent there, but I was) saw the demo and it was SWEET. Read oveur's dev blog that just came out, specifically the section regarding this thread's topic. The key difference between the eve-speak tool and teamspeak/skype/ventrilo is that it's all in-game. No more not knowing who's talking, because their character picture highlights on the screen when they talk! No more wondering who's giving the orders in fleet battles because, as oveur said, theres going to be a muting function when the fleet commander is speaking. Theres a wide range of possibilities for this. Imagine flying into 0.0 without getting permission and instead of just being insta-whacked, someone contacts you via voice and requests clearance. The possibilities are endless. As far as price goes, you people are acting like CCP is gonna saw off your arm for the ability to use this on a monthly basis. Remember: they havent released a price schedule yet! For all any of us know, it could be a 50 cent increase in your monthly fee (which i know for a fact aint gonna break people's pockets) and i'm absolutely positive that they're going to integrate a way to pay for voice if you rely on GTC to play. Quit making mountains out of molehills. You dont have enough information to make an informed decision. Also, Oveur specifically said that there will be ways to try out the voice function FOR FREE in the dev blog. Also, on a more personal note to the OP: For ages, probably before you were playing, people were SCREAMING for an in-game voice system to make gang/fleet warfare easier. You claim to speak for "the community" when you truly dont. Yes, there are those who dont agree with facets of the idea and are going to not use it. However, this in no way constitutes a majority. Take for example the various threads on the fact that the agents moved from hageken are gone for a month. I counted over 400 individual posts (not threads, posts) on the subject and not one dev response. Now, upsetting as that might seem, does that mean that they need to listen to their "community" and drop what theyre doing to appease us? No. They have bigger fish to fry. 3 Major updates and countless fixes are in the works. If you really want a say, I suggest one of three things: 1.) Become a very very active beta tester on sisi and give more feedback than a room full of computer science majors. 2.)Send oveur 5000 cases of the beer of his choice. 3.)Get a job with CCP. Other than that, keep ranting all you want, but understand that just because you THINK that the majority wants or doesnt want something, it's still only YOUR opinion. _______________________ ...Greetings, Starfighter. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the frontier against Xur and the Kodan Armada...
Rorix Whitecloud	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:41:00 - [123] Originally by: Andros vonBek In-game VOIP sounds like a cool idea to me IN THEORY, but there are a lot of reservations, all of which have been discussed herein ad infinitum - I'll not rabble what has already been rabbled... Personally I'll wait to see whether the corp/alliance requires this or not. I have 3 accounts, more than likely I'll pay for it if it's required. EVE is too important to quit or ditch my corp over this issue. The issue is one of communication, not between players in-game but between the devs and the player base. The lack thereof is causing great concern. Personally, I think if this is implemented it should be done so as an external application so that voice comms can be continued when out of game (be it via a disconnect, CTD, downtime, or just wanting to talk smack with fellow corpies while doing other stuff) but that prolly isn't going to happen. I'd also like to see some feature where those with multiple accounts (I have 3 personally, 2 regular and 1 P^2 which will be made into a full account in due time, and I know a lot of people have this many or more) can group their accounts together and not have to pay for this more than once. Instead of /signing or /not signing this, I'll /sign for a fully comprehensive devblog on how this feature is going to be implemented. It's the only way to put this to rest one way or another. I fully agree with this. Instead of "/sign"-ing something you dont even fully know about, /sign-ing for a devblog explaining the issue here is a lot more productive, and informative for us as customers and players. I want to know the details for this new VOIP feature before i judge it, instead of just basing my decision on hearsay. ~I don't remember. That's the second thing they teach you.
Blayde Firefly	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:47:00 - [124] /signed!
Valeo Galaem	Posted - 2006.05.18 17:56:00 - [125] Originally by: Zeknen /signed No VOIP please... This is to everyone with the same attitude... You realize that CCP has already made a contract with Vivox. What do you expect them to do, say "We're sorry but or closed-minded fanbase won't let us proceed. The agreement is off and all the tens of thousands of dollars that's probably on the line is gone"..? The only reason for people to have a grip over is that the new service will be an additional (and optional cost). The features and service plans have not yet been announced, let alone finalized. How about being more productive and tell CCP what kind of features / service options you would like that would make subscribers more likely support it?! Thar be Pirates You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied! CONCORD Encryption
Samirol	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:03:00 - [126] /signed Shakespearean Insults
Pailloran	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:06:00 - [127] /signed. I might be putting my foot in my mouth if somehow all of the technical problems and support issues I foresee with this are somehow averted, but I still can't get past the issues of segmenting the population and CCP spending too much time looking forward when their focus belongs in the here and now. I feel that I pay enough for CTDs, broken petitions, a clunky UI, dated sound system, and poor utilization/support of new hardware. Also, (and I may be completely wrong on this, maybe someone who is more network savvy can correct me if so) if the feature is integrated into the client and login dependent, doesn't this mean that whether the host server is 3rd party/proprietary or not, that the CCP servers will still have to communicate with it on at least some base level? If so, that's just one more thread to get knotted. In any case, I'd never use it and feel the time could be better spent.
Das Yad	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:08:00 - [128] VOIP is bad news causes lag, more server problems, and look at CS annoying people spam with random noise. most corps / alliances have dedi' vent / ts servers Not as classy as my old one ;]
outlawren	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:21:00 - [129] not signed i want VOIP :)
Atom HeartMother	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:34:00 - [130] the mods keep pwning my sigs :*(

Cmd Woodlouse	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:34:00 - [131] /signed there are FAR more important things to do for the game tbh --------------------------------
Ryea Eripmav	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:44:00 - [132] Someone lock this thread up, please, because this is pointless. -=The VOIP service is OPTIONAL!!! =- And for goodness sake -you're not going to accurately gauge the community's overall desire via a petition thread. If it were really that important to CCP, I am sure they would figure out a better way to do it, like ingame. I doubt you guys are even considering those that may have requested CCP make such a service available. ----------------------------------------------- (\_/) (O.o) (> <) The Bunny strikes again, on his way to world domination. "...The bunny, the bunny Oh! I love the bunny..."
Eximius Josari	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:59:00 - [133] At the very least, I think a more comprehensive information source is required. I would rather not pay extra for a service I can't reasonably 'require' everyone I play with to use. If even one person can't use it. It's useless. ~Eximius Josari, Hegemon of the E.A.R.T.H. Federation
Saeris Tal'Urduar	Posted - 2006.05.18 18:59:00 - [134] Edited by: Saeris Tal''Urduar on 18/05/2006 18:59:49 /signed for VOIP, not against. I dont know if I'd pay for it. But I like the idea. Originally by: sidthesexst The introduction of a VOIP system to EvE by CCP, one which we will have to pay to use, really goes against everything i, and im sure alot of other people, thought CCP stood for. Not sure what that means....because that is what CCP stands for...inovation and breaking new ground with original ideas. You know kinda like everyone on one server and no instancing, and so on.
James Snowscoran	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:07:00 - [135] I'm all for VOIP, but can't they just increase the monthly fee by 1 dollar for all the players and give everyone access? Otherwise, like so many people have said, it loses pretty much all of its functionability. -----
Julia Reave	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:13:00 - [136] Originally by: James Snowscoran I'm all for VOIP, but can't they just increase the monthly fee by 1 dollar for all the players and give everyone access? Otherwise, like so many people have said, it loses pretty much all of its functionability. IMHO it's the best solution...
The Wizz117	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:13:00 - [137] Originally by: James Snowscoran I'm all for VOIP, but can't they just increase the monthly fee by 1 dollar for all the players and give everyone access? Otherwise, like so many people have said, it loses pretty much all of its functionability. what if u have more characters like most of us do (this more character is also smart thing of ccp to drag in more money)
Lygos	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:20:00 - [138] I would like to see more flexible integration of the player avatar database and sundry third party apps. Especially Skype. I can use TS/Vent for my team, but I like Skype for clients. Skype is largely free and the extras are affordable. Only the voicemail and forwarding is expensive. We should be able to put more information categories in our profiles. Especially ingame employment related info.

Ivan Kirilenkov	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:33:00 - [139] Thread cleaned for "/signed" and "/not signed" only posts and non-constructive spams. Please remember that posting "/signed" only is considered spam since it adds very little constructive to the thread. Post your feature ideas in that thread, and reserve this one for constructive and polite discussions. Since the topic is hot for discussion and new threads on the issue pops up fairly rapidly, we're designated these two threads the "official" ones, and other threads about the issue will be closed.

Jarnis McPieksu	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:34:00 - [140] Originally by: w0rmy Originally by: Andros vonBek I have 3 accounts, more than likely I'll pay for it if it's required. That brings up a good question. If you have 3 acconuts, do you pay for it 3 times? Another example why per-account extra fee is a really really really bad idea. 'Sorry guys, I'm on my alt and it has no VOIP paid...' Raise the monthly fee, if you must. Otherwise you just tear up the ingame community. - Jarnis McPieksu Industrial Operative, Beagle Corp

fuze	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:47:00 - [141] Edited by: fuze on 18/05/2006 19:52:04 CCP's rationale is that bandwith costs money. But you can't defeat those many TS srv that run on accounts that already paid for it so it pretty much costs NOTHING extra. It will disrupt operations in corp and alliances because not everyone is either willing or even able to pay for the extra fee. During fleet ops audio is a total must so you'll loose an important tool if you don't have all members online. Ever thought of getting a license on an existing API or helping develop an open-source API for the existing audio servers that are already out there? It may be worth while the wait of effort to come up with this. To me that's the only sensible alternative because I never ever will pay for something I don't need. And if I'm forced to do so I rather cancel my subscriptions than to give in.
Noriath	Posted - 2006.05.18 19:49:00 - [142] I don't think MMORPGs should have their own Voice Chat, because then they are responsible for a comunications medium that cannot possibly be censored in any way. If those channels are riddled with prophanity and worse it casts a bad light on company making the game. If people set up their own teamspeak it's different.
Morgina	Posted - 2006.05.18 20:06:00 - [143] Signed! There are plenty things that needs fixing, implemnting ... please don't waste time and isk on this.
Sakura Nihil	Posted - 2006.05.18 20:18:00 - [144] signed, spend more time fixing the bugs, less time working on something we don't want, k? damn sig hijack!!11! Signature removed. Max filesize is 24,000 bytes. -Eldo ([email protected]) Forum warrior in training =P
fuze	Posted - 2006.05.18 20:36:00 - [145] Besides to react on the reasons Oveur gave in his blog. He said it was hard to setup a TS client and taking time. It's not hard. You're just lazy to do so. Unlike the eve client you actually can save you're password and log in with one mouseclick. He also uses the famous phrase 'it only takes a couple of hours to implent'. If I get would get an ISK for every time I used that one I'd be flying a titan. You'd get tons of reactions from people with crappy soundcarddrivers that are having troubles getting it work. And they all will blaim the new software and with reason. So c'mon you know better than that. And if you're a player who has a say in the development doesn't mean you can force these things in the client because you think its a nice thing to have. The impact is way bigger than you want us make to believe. With already having trouble keeping up the schedule for the chinese realm it doesn't make sense to implement something new into the client thats probably not going to be used by most players anyway. Besides, having 5 clients running on one puter will make things even harder if they have integrated software. You can't switch between characters and their roles or login to a channel with a fake character. And as a spy record valuable intel to post on the forums to mock others. Like the infamous 'There is always deniabilty' phrase. And if you would have a pole on how many times a TS client crashed and how many times Eve client crashed we all would know the outcome. Besides TS actually works during downtime so you can chat up even then. And whats up next with the premium service? Having integrated fraps? Having no commercials ingame payed for by 3rd parties? (Many game developers are contemplating about commercial advertising in online games these days.) Custom ship skins? So in short. Nice to think up CCP, but it ain't gonna work. Try again.
Valeo Galaem	Posted - 2006.05.18 20:42:00 - [146] Originally by: fuze He said it was hard to setup a TS client and taking time. It's not hard. You're just lazy to do so. Unlike the eve client you actually can save you're password and log in with one mouseclick There is a way to save passwords in EVE and log in with one click. Its secure too. You're just too lazy to figure out how to do so. Thar be Pirates You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied! CONCORD Encryption
fuze	Posted - 2006.05.18 21:57:00 - [147] Originally by: Valeo Galaem You're just too lazy to figure out how to do so. A good developer is a lazy developer so you're absolutely right. My ancestors were dutch btw so I'm cheap as well.
Galk	Posted - 2006.05.18 22:00:00 - [148] Edited by: Galk on 18/05/2006 22:02:00 Originally by: w0rmy Dont tell me this isnt about the $$$$$ vivox put a great spin to CCP, and CCP just heard cha-ching Pretty much id imagine, i said this the other week, id love to know how many others have shaken a stick at ccp with making money in mind. In any case it's not for me... id love to see an ingame poll though.... Would you/won't you..... First thoughts for me would be about 70/30 (wouldn't) people that just stroll around the empire keeping themselfs to themselfs are still the majority... so in saying that.. id imagine about 80/90% wouldn't bother. But anyway... it's not about majority, or want... it's about extra revenue stream (reguardless of fancy patronising press releases) ______ Long ago one gorgeous night, we let the stars grow free. We let Zhuge do that once, he came back carrying a traffic cone, a forsale sign and three empty bottles of dutch lager. He also lost his Zimmer Frame... - Imaran
Rungi	Posted - 2006.05.18 22:07:00 - [149] Against, but IF it is implemented don't put the servers in the same locale! Puhleese! Appropriate bandwidth for appropriate services. Besides, I can just imagine being in a general channel like Help and the servers go down.. RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! Perhaps they should be in the same locale. -------------------------------------------- Mining is my business, and business is good.
NightmareX	Posted - 2006.05.18 23:36:00 - [150] Not signed. And since we don't know enough on how this VOIP are gonna work, i will not sign anything. And yeah, if this VOIP system is better than TS and Ventrilo, then i gladly pay 1 dollar extra on my account to have this

Shadow Vice	Posted - 2006.05.18 23:50:00 - [151] not signed i reserve judgement and if its done right it could blow ts/vet out of the water for eve use as far as i see it may not just be limited to pure voice chat audio messages ect may be possible
Rekless Revenge	Posted - 2006.05.19 00:02:00 - [152] VOIP in EVE, superb idea! Lots of online games have it built in as standard (but dont do a good job of it). Would make good sense to a small company such as CCP to outsource a third party expert at VOIP. I dont mind paying extra for it and Leaves CCP to develop what they do best, Eve! And the best thing is, if you dont like it or don't want to pay extra, you don't have to use it.
Nanobotter Mk2	Posted - 2006.05.19 00:13:00 - [153] People already do it with TS vent etc... having it integrated with the client would be nice but not for extra money or a loss of stabilty.
Nee'kita Frist	Posted - 2006.05.19 00:17:00 - [154] I am going to wait and see what it is like before I begin to develop an opinion on the voice comms. I WOULD LIKE TO STATE however. That I would like to see it have semi independance of the client so if, for example, I did crash I would still be connected to the voice channel so I at least know whats going on. -------------- I'm just bitter
Dirtball	Posted - 2006.05.19 01:30:00 - [155] Yeah I was reading another thread that told me to come here to say no to ccp having a voip. so i vote we already got voip and adding more things to go wrong and lag us is abad idea
Hawkeye Jones	Posted - 2006.05.19 01:37:00 - [156] CCP could just charge China for the VOIP service and let us have it for free, they wont know any better anyways
Mishima	Posted - 2006.05.19 01:50:00 - [157] Don't want that VOIP and people, Ventrilo > TeamSpeak I love x-mas :D
Kim Chee	Posted - 2006.05.19 01:51:00 - [158] VOIP in general, fine.... having it work as well as Ventrilo without having to alt-tab to control it sounds like a good thing. Just be sure it DOES work at least as well.... don't make the same mistake DDO did with their horrible excuse for voice chat. Paying extra for it? Hmmmm, well... that's a hard choice. On the one hand, I wouldn't mind a dollar or two if I were in a large enough corp/alliance to make use of it. OTOH, if it's more than a few dollars I could set up a vent server and split the costs between the corpies. Not signed yet. <=----=> *Vila Restal: I'm entitled to my opinion. Kerr Avon*: It is your assumption that we are entitled to it as well that is irritating.
Marden Grace	Posted - 2006.05.19 02:36:00 - [159] Edited by: Marden Grace on 19/05/2006 02:37:20 I really don't get it... It will make lag? Every game that I have played with VOIP implemented hasn't lagged when people talked. Besides, it's being done by a 3rd party company who probably knows what they're doing. BF2? I have NO problem using voice comm. HL2? HL1? Never had a problem. It costs money? They're not forcing you to go with it. What? Corps and alliances will make them mandatory? Didn't you just say that nobody will use it? Which is it?! Besides, if the CEO wants you to use a VOIP and you don't want to, guess what? DON'T JOIN IT. Freakin' sheep. Dev time wasted? So, the minority of the player base who actually read and post on the forums have deemed the time spent a waste? As others have said, this HAS been a suggested feature. Also, guess what? If they scrap the idea then it will DEFINITELY have been time wasted. Derailing support? I'm sure the company they've signed on with will take care of the VOIP questions. Personally, I think it's a great feature to add. It would be a load of fun to have someone request a chat as you enter space and have them go, "Halt! No, wait! Die!!" Also, I wouldn't say that the majority of posts on the forum have been against VOIP. Seriously, if you think this is protest then you should go on to other game forums where literally every post is against a feature. What's happening here on the EVE forums is nothing. I am looking forward to VOIP and I am willing to pay for it. Unless it's required for every account... Then I'll only pay for it on my main (this). P.S. Just in case anybody tries to call my post moot because I may be an alt: This is my main. I am indeed a 2-3 month newb.
LUGAL MOP'N'GLO	Posted - 2006.05.19 03:36:00 - [160] Here's whats gonna happen. CCP will somehow give an advantage to the people that use the ingame VOIP. How will they do that? I'm not quite sure. It will force people to use the ingame VOIP because it will have some features pertaining to the game that TS does not. You will pay for it, not because you have to, but because it will be in your best interest. Its all about $$$ boyz I have no sig, because I can't compress my picture down that far. It looks like crapola.

Agent F	Posted - 2006.05.19 03:49:00 - [161] If they can implement the ingame voice, while still having a side client that we can use without loging into eve that might just be as good idea as ever, but if its just going to be in game only then you can not compare the cost of having a teamspeak/ventrilo server, because with those 2 apps you can acess them any time anywere as long as you have the client.
Ricdics	Posted - 2006.05.19 03:54:00 - [162] I think some of you are behaving really ignorant. " Oh No, just another way for CCP to make more cash off us ". Well, I work for one of Australia's largest ISP's, and we also offer a VoIP service to customers. While the service is cheap (compared to regular telephony), it is by no means free. Now, we have close to 1 million customers, around 80,000 of those using the VoIP service. Bandwidth is not free, and in the case of Eve, if implemented for everyone to hear (ie, player one has purchased so can talk, player 2 has not purchased but can still listen) then bandwidth is still racking up for both parties. I would go out on a limb here and say that CCP will be making zero-extremely low money off this. Even if they were making money off it, they ARE a business. Some of you need to wake up and see this. Personally, I believe they are making nothing off VoIP, however the VoIP addition is there to encourage more signups, a form of advertising as it were. Not sure if I am correct, but am I right in believing that Eve would be the first MMORPG ever to introduce integrated VoIP services? Best case scenario for the VoIP would of course be having it completely free. This is not going to happen. Again , CCP is a business, and designing an addition to the game that costs X amount / month with no future income stream generated from it, it wouldnt be viable. Then there is the group " We dont want VoIP and would rather you spend your time fixing bugs etc". The Devs have repeated over and over and over again, that there is a dedicated bug fixing team, as well as dedicated teams for other roles. These guys need to stop complaining. If the Dev's say that it takes minimal working hours to implement the VoIP, I believe them. Who do this group think they are to actually think they know better than CCP. Yes, I deal with plenty of VoIP, and no, there arent too many problems with it. Sure, it takes some of your OWN bandwidth (not CCP's), meaning that 56k eve players can forget about it. 256k players will find their computer performance a little degraded. Anything above this, should have no problem running integrated VoIP and Eve. Just to reiterate. Everyone saying this will lag out the servers. Wake up, it will be running on it's own bandwidth tunnel, separate from Eve. The client will not lag any further. Cant believe how many people are willing to shoot down the company without even seeing the service in action. Anyone would think you are all Jesus and have prophesised the future already.
Wrayeth	Posted - 2006.05.19 03:56:00 - [163] I have no problem with VOIP. I think it could add a lot to the game, granting people the ability to communicate across corporate and alliance lines without having to go through the hassle of giving out secure TS info. Moreover, it will solve the age-old question of: "Is that really a chick, or just a dude roleplaying a chick"? -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
crazyiven	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:01:00 - [164] Edited by: crazyiven on 19/05/2006 04:05:19 Signed! I agree, no need for it... unless it would be free.
Wrayeth	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:08:00 - [165] You guys do realize that CCP won't have to do much work to implement the VOIP system, right? That it's being coded by a third party? -Wrayeth "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
MurderCityDevil	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:16:00 - [166] Originally by: sidthesexist VOIP Integrated VOIP systems in games have been known to cause major problems, i rememmber Planetside being down for almost a full week because of their integrated voice system, BF2 has had no end of bugs due to its VOIP system. When did Planetside have VOIP? musta been waaaay back. UT2004's voip seems to work pretty good, though a little garbled you still get the idea. I think having a negative view of something new is like being afraid of a camera stealing your soul...or looking at that awful new invention called the Telephone that will make men lazy.
Rauk Bascha	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:34:00 - [167] AGAINST IT. Do it and lose more players and more money than it is worth. Concentrate on the game: gameplay, bugs, design and all the stuff that makes EVE fun.
Gierling	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:40:00 - [168] To be honost they don't have to do much to make this essential. Just entwine it in the interface, voicemail is handy... but beaing able to ensure that only people in your corp are in your channel, thats damn handy as well. Add in bits like a heirarchal structure based on corp position that will mute nublars speaking out of turn while the FC is trying to call primaries, or on screen graphical indication via the HUD who is speaking... Yeah, it would become a tool that you would need to pay for to be competitive. PRoposal to fix blobbing and make Charisma useful.
Gariuys	Posted - 2006.05.19 04:55:00 - [169] Originally by: Rauk Bascha AGAINST IT. Do it and lose more players and more money than it is worth. Concentrate on the game: gameplay, bugs, design and all the stuff that makes EVE fun. Why would CCP lose members, cause they spend a couple of hours helping a third party develop something that's completely up to you to use or not, and doesn't affect the game server much if at all? Ah no reason... so you're just throwing around the "OMG do this and EVE will die" argument... ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool
Cptn Z	Posted - 2006.05.19 05:26:00 - [170] Edited by: Cptn Z on 19/05/2006 05:31:07 Edited by: Cptn Z on 19/05/2006 05:30:21 Edited by: Cptn Z on 19/05/2006 05:28:01 Originally by: w0rmy Originally by: Cptn Z Also, there were people asking for VOIP on forums; I personally seen such requests in "Features and Ideas", afair. Yes, a lot of people will stick to TS (like, most probably, myself). You are quite correct, a lot of dumb and un thoughtout ideas are posted on the forums. And I ask you this... If a lot (and in my opinion the large majority) of people wont use this feature... Why not invest the research/developement/roll out time into features people will use? Sure. Forums are non-constructive due their nature. Dumb ideas, dumb discussions, flame and other crap. That's why they're loved by so many people! Are you sure that CCP have only one development team working on everything? I'm not missing some developer posts saying "Holy Crap! We were almost fixing that drone bugs, but our managers told us to forget about that junk and integrate VOIP immediately", am I? All we know now is that maybe VOIP will be integrated in the next patch and it probably will be "premium". We don't know if CCP does this work, or provides some kind on interface for VOIP-owners to integrate this; we don't know what features will VOIP offer; we don't know if it will be integrated into client or run as a third-party program. So, what is the reason of whining about something we know nothing about? Let's whine about damn drones! Edit: and NO, putting more developers working on the same problem will NOT help. If you think it helps - read "The Mythical Man-Month: Essays on Software Engineering" by Brooks. Edit2: also, as it was mentioned previously Originally by: Steppa If you read the current dev blog, it clearly states that the third-party company is developing and deploying (and hosting) this new voice client. While integration is going to require some man-hours at CCP, for the most part the developers of the VOIP are going to be responsible for it. So, don't worry, drones are being fixed. Hopefully. --- Regards, Z

Brastagi	Posted - 2006.05.19 05:52:00 - [171] Edited by: Brastagi on 19/05/2006 05:52:35 As far as I'm concerned, I'm not goign to pay extra for VOIP. /wuv his TS --------- The PIEs are there. The cAKe are here. Even the [23] are watching you...
Vendrin	Posted - 2006.05.19 06:20:00 - [172] signed _____________________________________ Need help in Caldari Space? Join channel CCDF to give or recieve it.
spiderbaby	Posted - 2006.05.19 06:49:00 - [173] Signed. Waste of development time, stupid idea to make it a "premium service". Vent/TS are fine.
Aodha Khan	Posted - 2006.05.19 06:59:00 - [174] Edited by: Aodha Khan on 19/05/2006 07:01:00 Vent/TS may be fine but this will be an integrated client with functionality integrated with Eve. You will also be able to enable it for your CORP. Devblog with comments on VOIP So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong and to strike at what is weak.
Ricdic's Hoe	Posted - 2006.05.19 07:03:00 - [175] Announcement from Vivox in PDF Format regarding the new project
Ricdic's Hoe	Posted - 2006.05.19 07:04:00 - [176] Announcement from Vivox in PDF Format regarding the new project
Adam Weishaupt	Posted - 2006.05.19 07:32:00 - [177] Edited by: Adam Weishaupt on 19/05/2006 07:34:28 No. Go for it, CCP. If it fails in testing, it fails, but if not, there's a lot to gain. Edit: Read the press release, and read the dev blog - this isn't a waste of time at all. How efficient are the third party programs, even for those who know how to use all the features? A specific solution is always better. And it's not mandatory...not like you don't have to pay for the TS/Vent servers, anyway.
Rangar	Posted - 2006.05.19 07:45:00 - [178] No VOIP please. That will cause problems!
fuze	Posted - 2006.05.19 08:01:00 - [179] Another reason would be that spread TS/Vent srv are way harder to hit with DDOS attacks than a single service from a payed serverpark. There are enough RL pirates that ransom servers with their botnets. Yarrr?
Joe	Posted - 2006.05.19 08:06:00 - [180] Originally by: Jim McGregor Think they are going to stop development of it because we have a vote? They didnt ask if we wanted it before they started with it, and they wont care if we say we dont want it now either. Correct, the Devs AND gm's have commented previously in 'petition' threads. They do_not_care what you think. If they want player feedback, they will ask for it. Petitions are basicly whine threads and the mods should be quicker to act imho.

Mr Moonwatcher	Posted - 2006.05.19 10:15:00 - [181] signed
ParMizaN	Posted - 2006.05.19 10:28:00 - [182] Normally i could see some reasoning behind the not-so-great decisions CCP have made before but not this one .. im totally against it for the good of the game. Phenomena of ironies, cast the litany aside How intelligible, blessed be the forgetful
fuze	Posted - 2006.05.19 10:30:00 - [183] Just visited the vivox site and found out they actually are a smaller corp funded by financial institutions that invest in starters. But I can't find any reports on their experiences within MMORG gaming. So is EVE gonna be their first go at this? Besides does this smaller corp have enough critical mass to keep up the needed infrastructure? As well their continuity which seems to have a positive outcome now because voip technologies is booming atm. But it will take a few failed projects for them to go belly up since they are a rather new player. Or face fierce compitition from other startup or bigger players in the market. Doesn't make it more sense that CCP will arrange for their own infrastructure in order to be independant from 3rd parties and have better continuity on the long run at lower costs for their subscribers?
Max1mus	Posted - 2006.05.19 10:53:00 - [184] Ok guys, I am all for seeing what CCP bring out. So far all I have heard on this thread is "Why would I want pay for this when Teamspeak is free" and "no one asked for this". Teamspeak software is free, bandwidth and servers are not. I would be very interested if someone can prepose a voip solution that could cater to the requirements of a 150 man corp with decent voice quality and no cost to anyone. I say lets see what CCP bring out before we start shouting from the rooftops about the travesty of it all. In concept intergrated VOIP support could have huge potential. Case in point we could refer to BF2. In Bf2 you have squad chat and commander chat. This means you can have hierarchical structure of communications from overall commander to his squad leaders who can then use independant voice comms to delegate instruction to his team. I am definately a newby to the fleet combat scene but would this not be beneficial in large fleet engagements ? Being able to set different squadrons into their own voice comms with fleet commander speaking directly to the squadron leader. To the point of payment. Again, it may be free for you to join your corps TS server, but most of the time someone in your corp is paying for your extra slot on that server. I say lets not scream about paying until we actually know what the cost is. End of the day, CCP will bring this out and I suspect they would not have investigated this unless they thought we would want this feature. And if you don't like it, you don't have to pay for it. (Flame on if you will)
Averiana	Posted - 2006.05.19 12:15:00 - [185] Edited by: Averiana on 19/05/2006 12:15:49 /signed... why cant we have the current problems fixed first.... I mean I dont want VOIP, I do want my ships to fly forward and my local to work, and less lag.. I think u get the point.. This isnt the usual carrot infront of donkey technique u use when introducing new ships to cover up problems.. Dont create a new problem by giving us VOIP...
Auritt	Posted - 2006.05.19 12:18:00 - [186] DDO Had a great VOIP included in the game due to a deal they did with Gamespy. If it isn't free or doesn't offer some feature not available in the public domain then don't introduce it. Auritt
Sha'asta Naztikur	Posted - 2006.05.19 12:25:00 - [187] Honestly as I suspect it will be closely linked with the implementation of the new gang/squadron hierarchies and command structures, I really really feel it should be a feature which everyone gets access to (and then I mean talk AND listen access). Because the devs WILL be working a lot on the new gang system, and tbh the new gang system isn't all that useful at all without VOIP tailored to suit it. Increase the monthly fee by a dollar and let everyone have access to it.
rittersporn2	Posted - 2006.05.19 12:37:00 - [188] Basically I am opposing the EVE-Voice-Chat. I wont pay for something which is freely available anyway. But having some background in development and administration myself I can imagine some unique features from this Voice-System: Authenticate against the Ingame-Database, that is, you can actually create channels reserved for specific corps, alliances and people. No second DB, easy ingame-integration. Given that they don't develop the system themseles I can even imagine it to work well from the start - Packet-Voice isn't exactly nuclear science, it is around for nearly 20 years now in form of ISDN, ATM, VoIP, H.323 and others... But paying for this little comfort? Nope. This can also be done with TS, we have used exactly "only allow real ingame/forum accounts on TS" on out own TS by using the SQL-interface of TS. CCP should instead offer a method for TS-servers to ask the CCP-Servers for authentication. Uses LOTS LESS bandwidth and makes everyone happy. If people can set up a TS with SQL-authentication then they can still rent TS-servers "run by CCP". Btw, I doubt Ventrillo can use SQL-Authentication. But I hope that TS in its next release might even support PAM/NIS-Authentication, then we start talking "big time". Ritters****2 (name censored to protect minors like you) Graduate of Darth Vader School of Personal Management
Winter Star	Posted - 2006.05.19 12:47:00 - [189] I'm all for the integrated VOIP - I don't understand why so many of you would discount it out of hand, w/o experiencing it, even after Ovuer has outlined the features and capabilities which to me at least sound a lot more convienient and useful than TS/VENT, ect. P.s please don't just do /signed that does my nut in!!! If you're against it please state why at least instead of appearing to follow the heard. Baa!! BHTM\|Recruitment
Khonsu	Posted - 2006.05.19 13:13:00 - [190] The only problem I see is that IF this service will be an optional pay-and-activate-per-account solution, it will be useless. The reason is that no matter how cheap it will be, quite a few people will not be able/willing to pay for it. 'The article' states that it will be a premium service, which usually means paying extra for it, but it's possible that they put a different meaning into it. Imagine you're in a 20-player corp/alliance gang. What if 18 of them had paid for VOIP and 2 had not. Then you will either have to switch to TS or kick the non-paying slackers. And numbers will more likely be 50/50. The EVE VOIP will simply not be an option, except for very small corps where everybody agree to subscribe to it. It will have to be available to EVERYBODY or NOBODY. Solution: Raise subscription rates for everybody by 20 cents per month. Of course, that wouldn't be fair when there are people who've already prepaid for a year And even if it was a 1 cent increase, you'd hear people complaining about how they can't afford it. So scrap that idea, but then I don't know how to solve it, besides letting it be included in the current subscription rate.

fuze	Posted - 2006.05.19 13:33:00 - [191] Adding Khonsu example. If those 2 people would be top brass or even CEO it might cause the corp to break up. And a corp breaking up might cause an alliance to break up. So having it optional is a non-argument. You either have to use it all or not. And thus hindering people moving to other corp as well as corps merging or alliances merging. And that's a huge penalty IMHO. We ain't got balls, but plenty of nuts.
IsmaelYU5 Iluvatar	Posted - 2006.05.19 13:44:00 - [192] for it i'm waiting till its there btw ROFL funny to see what arguments are made of ppl that just read "premium service void is comin" -there will be options that corps can use it for all members -there is no lag for eve servers -ts is not "free" -no dev-time is really used to develop it bc the software is there and they just need to install the ui for it -etc ------------ An eye for an eye only makes the whole world blind - Ghandi
Siren Shiva	Posted - 2006.05.19 13:46:00 - [193] /signed No VOIP please, vent and TS work well and are free for most members to use. Lyticus > I freaking hate you! Siren Shiva > I love you too <3 Trey > Siren sounds like she could kick my ass on Vent [vi
Max1mus	Posted - 2006.05.19 14:01:00 - [194] Edited by: Max1mus on 19/05/2006 14:02:55 Apoligies if I sound like I am flaming, but one question I would like to clear up HOW IS TS FREE ? Yes, the software to run a TS server is free but do all corps have someone sitting with a spare 20mb upstream/downstream leased line and server sitting 24/7 in a back room somewhere ? If not then NO TS is not free. If you don't pay the server rental and are happy for someone to foot the bill then I guess yes, it is free for you to jump on a TS server. Oh and I agree with the poster who asked the "/signed" to state reasons for disagreement. If you honestly want CCP to listen to you then please try and give at least half a reason why you don't agree with the idea. Respect to those who do express their point of view though, we all have our own views of whether something this radical would be good or not.
Alexi Borizkova	Posted - 2006.05.19 14:14:00 - [195] Edited by: Alexi Borizkova on 19/05/2006 14:13:57 Double post ftl. In Corporate Caldari, taxes pay YOU.
Alexi Borizkova	Posted - 2006.05.19 14:14:00 - [196] Last night some jackass managed to use soem scriopt to come into our teamspeak server, use a well known exploit to gain admin status, and proceeded to make horrible noises, then kick everyone out who could boot his ass. Ended up throwing a sizeable monkey wrench into our plans for that night. I will no longer speak against VOIP in eve. In Corporate Caldari, taxes pay YOU.
Xoria Krint	Posted - 2006.05.19 14:22:00 - [197] One of the reason i like CCP, Is that they release the expansions for free, They care about the community. I got shocked when i heard that we will have to pay to use ingame stuffs like VOIP.. Its sick. And i hate it. We are paying to play the full game, Not 99% of the game. Please CCP. Dont go the same way as Blizzard. I will not pay for VOIP since i can use Ventrilo. But if it was for free. I would probably use VOIP. ---- My Movie: Insane World
Tizi	Posted - 2006.05.19 19:43:00 - [198] I'm fine with CCP introducing VOIP on an optional basis. If you don't want it, it costs you nothing. What's with this my way or nothing attitude?
videorecorder	Posted - 2006.05.19 20:02:00 - [199] Edited by: videorecorder on 19/05/2006 20:02:36 Originally by: Alexi Borizkova Last night some jackass managed to use soem scriopt to come into our teamspeak server, use a well known exploit to gain admin status, and proceeded to make horrible noises, then kick everyone out who could boot his ass. Ended up throwing a sizeable monkey wrench into our plans for that night. I will no longer speak against VOIP in eve. Why blame others for your n00bness? edit : and I doubt this happens on a regular basis. Infact Ive used ts for more than 5 years and I have NEVER heard about this happening.
Tannach	Posted - 2006.05.19 21:12:00 - [200] I happened to be at E3 and had a go on the voice in the game. They have it working now on one instance (not sure about server wide), but it is integrated into the game(channel management was as well). So the devs are not wasting time working on it. The quality is fantastic, and there is no lag...so these two reasons raise it above TS (in my opinion). It also mixes, so you dont get that annoying cut out half way through someone talking because of the lag. I agree that most people are going to use TS short term, but i can forsee some very interesting game content from having an ingame voice channel (ECM/ESM anyone?) Good on CCP for being one of the first MMOG's to do this, i imagine most others will follow suit (especially the more PVP orientated ones). Tan

Muthsera	Posted - 2006.05.19 21:26:00 - [201] signed I do not want the voip. Unessisary effort on something that players really don't want to have. And this is very close to ccp selling out on it's community. My thoughts
FooB2	Posted - 2006.05.19 21:49:00 - [202] Edited by: FooB2 on 19/05/2006 21:52:09 quite frankly, this thread has 7 pages and im simply not gonna scan it all just to see if my two cents on this has already been posted, so im just going to post it anyway. Basically, im not against CCP trying to do this, well done, you realise that your subscribers use a certain service that you want to provide for them yourself, and there is absolutley nothing wrong with that, HOWEVER. making people pay extra for it, when essentially they get the same thing they already have and know how to use, and have used daily from the past 3 years, will bring about people simply just staying put with what theyve got. ventrilo is of absolute crisp quality when its set up right, and teamspeak works in perfect harmony with most things and is low bandwidth, and cost-free. if you try and implement your own integrated voip, i see it hardly being used and its just a lot more bugs caused and more server load to a game that really couldnt use it. Personally, i think you should offer a pay-for service, which you can choose to rent yourself via your ingame account, for a server on your OWN voip program. and this client interacts with EVE, say, with an overlay or something. but thats it. essentially the voip program is a seperate program to eve. this will minimize bugs, and will run on a seperate server to TQ, and thus not put any strain on it. and as for whoever said CCP wont listen to us, as theyll just do it anyway. thats simply not true, the community IS thier company. if they dont please us, then they would be screwed. they are always listening to us and i think this thread is being watched carefully by the devs. and rightly so. if they implement it anyway, they obviously have a good reason, or they are highly confident about it. not just do it anyway "cos it was on the list". i have every bit of confidence that when a dev reads this, it will be added to a list of ideas/considerations, and discussed when they come to decide exactly what they are doing, and say "hey, this guy may be a tosser, but hes got a point". as it stands, im going to /signed this. but take my ideas into consideration. as i think it is a healthy compromise. Pre-Nerfed Tactics - yes, we are just plain nasty boys.
fuze	Posted - 2006.05.20 11:43:00 - [203] Originally by: Alexi Borizkova Last night some jackass managed to use soem scriopt to come into our teamspeak server, use a well known exploit to gain admin status, and proceeded to make horrible noises, then kick everyone out who could boot his ass. Ended up throwing a sizeable monkey wrench into our plans for that night. Hacking is bad (and prolly illegal as well). But about anything can be hacked. So I don't think thats an argument tbh. Best thing you can do is to patch the server and rinse and repeat. We ain't got balls, but plenty of nuts.
Elune Ferret	Posted - 2006.06.01 12:53:00 - [204] I woun't read all 7 pages either. But still going to throw in my 2 mill isk's I'm very opposed to the idea that I have to pay a subsciption fee to play any kind of game, even though I've played WOW and loved it. Now I'm playing Eve and I'll stictk to this for a very long time, think I need to train skills for the next 25 yesra to get the one I need. That being said I feel an urge to justify why I stick around even though I'm opposed to the core concept. I see this game actually changes so what I actually have here is the RPG game I've been looking for since Eye of the Beholder. As for the fee, well 15Ç a month, that's like the same cost as if I would want a new game every month, but manageable, also it's afixed expence so it's okay after all. Now that I subscribe to the game, what would I actually be willing to pay, well 100 DDK ~ 10-12Ç was my limit back at WOW, this is a bit more pricy, but the game is also this much better, so the extra 15-25% cost doesn't bother me. Now I found there's a Eve magazine which I really want to read (15Ç), so I'm thinking well it'd be cool if I could get that too, but I don't like paying for second stuff (new purchace), but I would mind paying the extra 5Ç a month if it was tired into my subscribsion fee, call it account+mag fee? now they're talking extra stuff, but this time ingame stuff (Voip), well again if I could mix it with my account fee, and the price increase wasn't too much and that the Total cost of EVE was still within acceptable ranges I'd pay, no more quistions. As for the effect of all/some are having the Voip, I'd say flexible payment metodes are a MUST. One stated the problem of a 20 member corp where some have it and some don't, well consider the scenerio where the 3 directors find it handy to have it. Then for being a director prequirement is that you would have Voip, have the hardware to support it (sound/microphone) and are able to actually speak, but not for regular members. Well why not, if I had a 15-50 member corp I'd be setting demands in my leaders as I do in real life, that migth also include material effects as a computer or specifik sofware (if you don't have the meens to read the EMD1405, I will not hire you to be head of my research department). Also if the member recruited to be a director, even fleet commander have skills worth paying real life cash to hire into my corp, why not sponsor his Voip as part of his contract? Isn't this the way everything works if you have something I want, that being knowledge, skills, or say an Obelisk, we would negotiate as to the point where we both agree we're doing a good deal. For an expamle I get you as my fleet commander (person reasource) in exchange for me paying your Voip, your EvE accountfee, a real life car (real life money resources). (Wonder who's getting the better deal here ) What if I feel like as CEO to sponsor Voip for all my directors or members, how much different would it be then to go setting up the TS capabillieties (Server, client, bandwidth, support, training, SQL database for accounts, ect ect). And with EVE Voip it actually sounds like I could do all this with nothing but some Ç, E.G. I don't need any real life skills, extra software, hardware, power outlets.... Think about it. To me all it comes down to is the price and how well it works ingame. P.S. Dev please keep the voice customizing features for it, if it's not build in, I'll have to add 3rd party software to it anyway. If I can customize my portrait, I sure as h... will want to customize the voice connected to that character. This is an RPG as in Role Playing
Steppa	Posted - 2006.06.01 13:06:00 - [205] After the recent ugliness (although fun) in 9CG which pitted Fix/BoB vs CODA, I realized just how useful a properly implemented VOIP could be. Once you get over a certain number of people in a gang, it just gets too difficult to manage voice comms. While my own corp maintains VERY strict comms during combat, I can not say that for other organizations in Eve. Being mass-ganged with these types can not only hinder ops, but makes the whole experience far less enjoyable. Teamspeak's functionality, IMHO is limited in this respect. IF the VOIP is implemented is such a way that you can set Fleet/Squadron/Flight hierarchies and easily talk between those channels, it will be worth my extra .25 a month. Further, being able to "hail" someone in space sounds like a very cool addition to the immersive nature of Eve. I'm for giving it a chance.
UndergrounD	Posted - 2006.06.01 13:38:00 - [206] will it really be 'integrated' or will it be a standalone client utilising database info regarding alliances, gangs etc -----------------------------------------------
Fly Catcher	Posted - 2006.06.01 14:02:00 - [207] I can't believe this is still going on. Get over it for pities sake - we're getting voice built into Eve, I don't care if you don't want it, I don't care if you prefer TS or whatever and I don't care what BF2 is like. Thankfully neither do CCP.
Kraven Kor	Posted - 2006.06.01 15:10:00 - [208] Some of us do want it and are excited to see how it works as far as integrating with the gang / fleet in a useful fashion. Strength through Unity, Discipline, and Honor!
Alpha Runner	Posted - 2006.10.30 10:23:00 - [209] VOIP - well yes i would be interested... But some games such as BF2 dont make you pay for it. Dont we pay enough? 26,000 players online x $14.95 = $388,700 hmm would love to see what the outgoings are Well about time CCP something is for FREE! Signed if not for free!
Roshan longshot Gallente Order of the Arrow	Posted - 2006.10.30 11:33:00 - [210] Did'nt your mama ever tell you to "let the dead rest in peace? Necro.... Free-form Professions, ensure no limetations on professions. Be a trader, fighter, industialist, researcher, hunter *pirate* or mixture of them all. [i]As read from the original box.

Soulita Gallente Inner Core	Posted - 2006.10.30 11:46:00 - [211] Edited by: Soulita on 30/10/2006 11:49:23 /signed any game which has a monthly fee for playing should follow CCPs normal policy of having all features and content available to all players at no additional cost. If CCP ever decides to opt for extra content packages which cost in addition to the normal monthly fee I will leave the game instantly (Just like I did with the other mmorpgs that did that). VOIP is not extra content in that sense, it is a mere functionality. Still, charging for it - if it makes it ingame - is borderlining it. The idea of charging extra for VOIP is definatly a step in the wrong direction!
Patch86 Di-Tron Heavy Industries	Posted - 2006.10.30 11:55:00 - [212] Oh my, necro..... Although /not signed, since I'm reading it. If you don't like it, don't use it. -----------------------------------------------
gordon861 Minmatar Research Associates	Posted - 2006.10.30 11:55:00 - [213] I can't see me paying for this service unless it really does offer something above TS that I actually want to see. My other concern is, I run two clients on my PC at the same time. Does this mean I will need to pay for 2 accounts to use the VOIP, even though if I do have them both switched on I will be able to hear myself talking on the other client when I use the first one. I would be much more interested with them fixing the bug that causes the game to crash your PC when you have sound switched on with both clients. Recruiting NOW !
Nir	Posted - 2006.10.30 12:08:00 - [214] Originally by: sidthesexist Integrated VOIP systems in games have been known to cause major problems, i rememmber Planetside being down for almost a full week because of their integrated voice system, BF2 has had no end of bugs due to its VOIP system. What you forgot to mention is that even now with VOIP in Planetside working and absolutely free to use - NOBODY IS USING IT. Third party voice comm programs and servers have the upper hand simply because they can be used in a multitide of games and not just one, they can be used out of game and when you're disconnected from a game. It is just plain better and more user friendly on all fronts. I really don't understand as to why CCP are trying to reinvent the wheel here. Sure, its optional and a whiner like me won't have to pay for it if he damn well doesn't want to () But I fail to see the point..
Bill Shankly	Posted - 2006.10.30 12:10:00 - [215] Originally by: Boonaki Edited by: Boonaki on 18/05/2006 10:53:09 Originally by: loony zoon SIGNED The only reason for doing this is to develop another income stream. Waste of time and resources. You don't know that, they may not make money off of this at all (I'm sure they will but still, don't know for a fact), the extra fee may just go to the service provider. why else wud they do it, you idiot ?
Captain IceEye Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.30 12:16:00 - [216] Originally by: Patch86 ...If you don't like it, don't use it... Pure Ignorance. If it was for free that statement would be true. But if it costs RL money thats another story. elfen > read the forums they will tell u the truth
Kai DeathCutter	Posted - 2006.10.30 12:17:00 - [217] I won't use it for the simple reason that when the node your 30 man fleet is on crashes, as it does regularly when u engage, TS/Vent doesn't get taken with it, so it is still possible to have some kind of order and control when you have to madly start trying to re-gang everyone.
Za Po Caldari	Posted - 2006.10.30 12:25:00 - [218] There is a lot of misunderstanding floating around in this thread. EVE's VoiP solution is not developed by CCP. CCP developers are not spending time on VoiP that should be used on the game. EVE's VoiP solution is not hosted on the same servers as the game. As such, VoiP usage will not affect game lag. EVE's VoiP servers are not managed by CCP. They are managed by a company that does nothing but VoiP, and as such chances are that they'll be good at it. In any case, VoiP outages will not influence the game. Since it is not free, CCP is not using significant financial resources on the VoiP project that could be used on the game. The VoiP project is supposed to be self-sustaining. Basically, if you don't want to use the VoiP service, then just don't use it. Don't ***** about something that doesn't influence you but other people may enjoy.


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