Highsec is a lot more dangerous for PvE.

No it's not. Far, far less people die in highsec than anywhere else. Once again, those are CCP's own stats from the destruction map they were nice enough to provide us.

It's far too easy and safe to AFK rat and AFK mine...given risk/reward we should force everyone out of there. Highsec is a lot more dangerous for PvE.

Yes, but FAR more people die doing PvE in highsec than doing PvE in sov null. As far as PvE goes, which is where the rewards are, highsec is much more dangerous. PvE in sov null is downright boring and safe...hence AFK miners and ratters.

Yes, but FAR more people die doing PvE in highsec than doing PvE in sov null.

PvE in sov null is downright boring and safe...hence AFK miners and ratters.

You don't even need a counter like that remiel, not 20 minutes ago he was bragging about eexactly the thing he's complaining about here in another thread.

Wev pointed, we've laughed, good God have we laughed (some of us May have even wet ourselves a little) but quite frankly veers will never have any meaningful impact on anything in eve and certainly wount be contributing anything of merit,
I find his desperation for attention quite ugly, transparent and wearing at the momentum and I'm sure others feel tthe same.
Can we just forget this halfbaked dinsdinsdale-de product of lust and let it fade back into whatever obscure hole it came from.

veers will never have any meaningful impact on anything in eve and certainly wount be contributing anything of merit

Or, some of us, like me, enjoy the safety and security of highsec. Being able to run L4s and incursions with minimal risk, no dscan, and infallible CONCORD allies. Personally I find that a lot more rewarding than dealing with the irritating dangers of lowsec.

Sov null is the safest space in the game for PvE players. See many AFK ratters in high? People AFK carrier rat with no CONCORD.

I'm not in null because I don't want to deal with the dysfunctional people running nullsec coalitions. I'm much happier with the "carebears" in high. Nothing to do with risk/reward - which is much better in sov null.

At significant risk of course - from rats and from gankers, and never AFK. That's the difference between me and Goons, etc... I make my isk with real effort, and at significant risk.

My head is spinning with your myriad contradictions.


First you say you PVE in hisec because it's safe and no risk.

Then you say null is safe too. Well, if it is, why wouldn't you go there?

Then you say hisec is not safe and risky.



How can a single person say completely different and contradictory things and expect people to take his arguments seriously?

Please explain.

Which I've been trying to establish for a long time now so that people can just ignore him and move on. My last reply to him above was literally my last reply to him ever. I've got more important things to worry about that some irrelevant highsec carebear scrublord with a superiority complex.

Everyone that responds to Veers is giving him relevance he hasn't earned, so I'm going to play a little game. When Christmas comes, I'm going to be going on a 50 billion isk Santa trip around new Eden delivering presents to a bunch of people on the forums, both people I like and don't like. Anyone I see replying to Veers from this post on gets crossed off my list.

Maybe I'll contract you some coal in Jita.

This is a lie. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=postmessage&t=384372&f=258&q=5202697 Notice the systems lela and keri.

Their are plenty of low sec systems with fewer than 20 jump in per 24 hours, tha'ts pretty empty.

And even if it's not empty, again, low sec pve is done in deadspace, it's easy to evade people trying to kill you. High Sec income can't compete with the 500 mil per hour a guy who can fly a carrier can make.

I lived my 1st year in high sec listening to people like you lie to me about EVE. After faction warfare came out i joined, learned the ropes, and learned that low sec only requires an ounce more effort to be pretty safe to live in. I don't really care if high sec people learn this or not, I'm just correcting an untruth that I suffered from, that made me miss a whole YEAR of fun and loot because dumb but well meaning people were risk averse.

This is why now i take new players with my to low to show them how not scary it is.



Low sec is better for solo individual isk making that high sec or null sec or wormhole space (you need an organization in wormhole space to pull out better isk per hour than you can solo in low sec).

As i told another guy in this thread, I'm not making this stuff up.

Or this.

Or this either.

I don't know of a solo pve activity in high sec or null or wormhole space (with the exception of solo Dreads in c5 wormholes, which I have never done) that pays better than 200 mil per hour sustainably purely solo. ALL of the pve activities I listed above do that (because I do them depending on my mood, I have 3 carriers in adjacent systems for lvl 5s, 2 toons in 2 different militias and a naga + stabber fleet issue in a low sec sisters of EVE station). And with the exception of lvl 5s, the things i do to make isk in low require CHEAP low sp ships.

I'll bet you any amount you want Ocih that you've never even tried some of the things I've linked, yet here you are telling people "don't even try". Perhaps the underling motivation is the same as the old saying of "misery loves company", but other than that, i can't figure out why folks like you believe what you do.

I'm serious, try it if you don't believe me. find the right area of low sec, get you a naga and see what you can do.

Highsec has safety from CONCORD...but enough risk from rats and gankers that you need to be at keyboard. Sov null should have tremendous risk, but due to player alliances has essentially none...which leads to AFK play.

I don't go to null because of the socially dysfunctional people running the place.

To recap, since you are finding this hard - I enjoy the protection from ganking in highsec, but also the risk of rats and gankers. Sov null has essentially no risk, and inflated rewards.

Clear now?

You certainly are manufacturing "facts" here. PVE in null is not AFK play. It depends on what alliance and what null system, under which sovereignty umbrella, you are in.

You are making gross generalizations about an area of space which you admittedly have never operated in, for reasons that make no sense. Socially dysfunctional people? These socially dysfunctional people inspire the most visible player-driven publicity that EVE has.


You won't find any articles about Veers surviving incursion rats. You will find plenty of buzz about massive battles in null and the criminal content generated there.






*) You enjoy the free protection from gankers but gankers are a threat.

*) You don't like people AFKing in null but it's a terrible crime that you can't go AFK yourself.

*) The rats in WH and null are insanely tough, to my low SP pilots, but apparently tough rats in hisec is a problem CCP needs to fix.


Was your post meant to clear up your contradictions? Seems as if these contradictions are breeding and multiplying!

Everyone that responds to Veers is giving him relevance he hasn't earned, so I'm going to play a little game. When Christmas comes, I'm going to be going on a 50 billion isk Santa trip around new Eden delivering presents to a bunch of people on the forums, both people I like and don't like. Anyone I see replying to Veers from this post on gets crossed off my list.

Maybe I'll contract you some coal in Jita.

In any rational discussion, you can't just say whatever you want and expect it to be treated as a fact. You don't seem to ever step up to meet your burden of proof.

Your argument:

*) Hisec has more people than any other sec <-- never presented any data. Also, I said people, not alts.

*) Surviving 20 seconds against a gank is hard <-- this is not even true

*) Rats in hisec are hard <-- it's a game. If you think ratting in hisec is hard, then go into F&I and start a thread

*) All PVE in null is AFK <-- not true from my experience. You never presented any data

*) Income in null is higher than in hisec <-- never presented any data

*) People in nullsec are dysfunctional <-- this is not even true. You never presented any data. We both know you actually don't know any of these people

*) More PVE deaths occur in hisec but anywhere else <-- of course it does, hisec has more people. You also never presented any data

In any rational discussion, you can't just say whatever you want and expect it to be treated as a fact. You don't seem to ever step up to meet your burden of proof.

Your argument:

*) Hisec has more people than any other sec <-- never presented any data. Also, I said people, not alts.

*) Surviving 20 seconds against a gank is hard <-- this is not even true

*) Rats in hisec are hard <-- it's a game. If you think ratting in hisec is hard, then go into F&I and start a thread

*) All PVE in null is AFK <-- not true from my experience. You never presented any data

*) Income in null is higher than in hisec <-- never presented any data

*) People in nullsec are dysfunctional <-- this is not even true. You never presented any data. We both know you actually don't know any of these people

*) More PVE deaths occur in hisec but anywhere else <-- of course it does, hisec has more people. You also never presented any data

You are missing one valid point Jvpiter. This is not a rational discussion.

Blah blah blah - data - blah blah blah.

Feel free to start the Pew Polling institute for Eve. No hard data exists. Thankfully we have logic and common sense...and as usual all of my points are correct.

Do you have any actual arguments, or do you just want to scream DATA and preclude any fruitful discussion?

Highsec has safety from CONCORD...but enough risk from rats and gankers that you need to be at keyboard. Sov null should have tremendous risk, but due to player alliances has essentially none...which leads to AFK play.

I don't go to null because of the socially dysfunctional people running the place.

To recap, since you are finding this hard - I enjoy the protection from ganking in highsec, but also the risk of rats and gankers. Sov null has essentially no risk, and inflated rewards.

Clear now?

Blah blah blah - data - blah blah blah.

Feel free to start the Pew Polling institute for Eve. No hard data exists. Thankfully we have logic and common sense...and as usual all of my points are correct.

Do you have any actual arguments, or do you just want to scream DATA and preclude any fruitful discussion?

Do you have any actual arguments, or do you just want to scream DATA and preclude any fruitful discussion?

I think he fell asleep. Quick, does anyone have a magic marker so that we can draw on his face?