|
| Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 :: one page | |
| Author | Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
 Tsual    |
Posted - 2004.04.26 15:44:00 -
[91] Edited by: Tsual on 26/04/2004 15:47:55 I remember something about germanic tribes while the emigration of nations/invasion of the barbarians epoch: Asfar as I understood it to find out what is the right direction to move on a holy woman pour animal blood on a stone and interpreted the resulting form. So what I want to say, I think this ritual or similar ritual to decide wouldn't or would hardly survive but maybe for political decisions of a clan the whole process might be started with a modified version. With regard to Discorporations posting: I would suggest that several of the old rituals might use Amarrian symbolics or are mixed with amarrian ritual rules as they were opressed with this "cultural meme complex" about 900 years, the Minmatars had to conceal their culture and perhaps they simply performed a ritual or mass that looked Amarrian but was actually after sebiestor/brutor/vherokior... tradition. As good real world example I'd suggest to take a look at the descedants of the mayans or ex-native cultures that were taught christian believes, they have learned to mix both and arange them in one world-view, simply telling you about their believes: "At day we are christians, at night we believe in the teachings of our ancestors." Or "Every sunday I'm a honest christian, the rest of the week I listen to the voodoo priest." (only exaggeration but help to explain what I mean.) This could also be a reason why the Amarrian Empire had problems of crushing the Minmatar culture, some or even a lot of slaves simply played the act of being "the brave and enlightende slave" when a person of the inquisiton watched them, and as soon as "big brother" was gone, they returned to their traditions. -------------------------------------- Tsual - Miner from faith, frigat junky for life. Ritual of the Qua'nadhar. |
 Tsual Minmatar Iikhelahii khulemah'lal |
Posted - 2004.04.26 15:44:00 -
[92] Edited by: Tsual on 26/04/2004 15:47:55 I remember something about germanic tribes while the emigration of nations/invasion of the barbarians epoch: Asfar as I understood it to find out what is the right direction to move on a holy woman pour animal blood on a stone and interpreted the resulting form. So what I want to say, I think this ritual or similar ritual to decide wouldn't or would hardly survive but maybe for political decisions of a clan the whole process might be started with a modified version. With regard to Discorporations posting: I would suggest that several of the old rituals might use Amarrian symbolics or are mixed with amarrian ritual rules as they were opressed with this "cultural meme complex" about 900 years, the Minmatars had to conceal their culture and perhaps they simply performed a ritual or mass that looked Amarrian but was actually after sebiestor/brutor/vherokior... tradition. As good real world example I'd suggest to take a look at the descedants of the mayans or ex-native cultures that were taught christian believes, they have learned to mix both and arange them in one world-view, simply telling you about their believes: "At day we are christians, at night we believe in the teachings of our ancestors." Or "Every sunday I'm a honest christian, the rest of the week I listen to the voodoo priest." (only exaggeration but help to explain what I mean.) This could also be a reason why the Amarrian Empire had problems of crushing the Minmatar culture, some or even a lot of slaves simply played the act of being "the brave and enlightende slave" when a person of the inquisiton watched them, and as soon as "big brother" was gone, they returned to their traditions. Moral is only usefull so far as society demands it from one to accept his presence. |
 Discorporation |
Posted - 2004.04.26 17:41:00 -
[93] The 'Education of slaves' was coined by old Sabaoth Incorporated and was a clever ruse to obscure the fact that slavery is quite horrible and that lots of slaves die every day in the Empire. No one truly believes in it, not even the Amarrians themselves. It's just a useful excuse to justify slavery other then the Prime Fiction one: "Our religion says it's OK, so it must be OK". I apologise for the off-topicness [Heterocephalus glaber] |
 Discorporation Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers |
Posted - 2004.04.26 17:41:00 -
[94] The 'Education of slaves' was coined by old Sabaoth Incorporated and was a clever ruse to obscure the fact that slavery is quite horrible and that lots of slaves die every day in the Empire. No one truly believes in it, not even the Amarrians themselves. It's just a useful excuse to justify slavery other then the Prime Fiction one: "Our religion says it's OK, so it must be OK". I apologise for the off-topicness |
 Wren |
Posted - 2004.04.27 05:53:00 -
[95] Disco, I was looking at chemicals introduced by injections into specific areas of the body. The amarrian overlords were probably very good at injecting the enslaved minmatar people. The chemicals they also intruduced was probably also very effective and so might have come off as magical. I was going to go for different sorts of rituals that would use injections that go into the fingers, back/spine, torso, arms, and neck. I was going to go for halucinagenic, mood altering, physical enhancement (increased strength or resistance to pain) and all other sorts of things, and all surrounded by a ritualistic covering. It's the coverings I am having trouble with. Maybe many injections would be used on certain tattooed areas? (to cover the tracks) Do more tattoos mean that you are more in tune with the rituals and practice them more often? I was starting to think maybe the shamans actually know what the gizmos do, how they do it, and play it up as magical for the masses. What has survived the occupation, and what is a product of the occupation? What are the voluval marks? Why haven't we ever gotten a list? My books will be in tomorrow at the public library. I will see if they have anything on technoshamanism, but I seriously doubt it. -------------------------------------------------- |
 Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.04.27 05:53:00 -
[96] Disco, I was looking at chemicals introduced by injections into specific areas of the body. The amarrian overlords were probably very good at injecting the enslaved minmatar people. The chemicals they also intruduced was probably also very effective and so might have come off as magical. I was going to go for different sorts of rituals that would use injections that go into the fingers, back/spine, torso, arms, and neck. I was going to go for halucinagenic, mood altering, physical enhancement (increased strength or resistance to pain) and all other sorts of things, and all surrounded by a ritualistic covering. It's the coverings I am having trouble with. Maybe many injections would be used on certain tattooed areas? (to cover the tracks) Do more tattoos mean that you are more in tune with the rituals and practice them more often? I was starting to think maybe the shamans actually know what the gizmos do, how they do it, and play it up as magical for the masses. What has survived the occupation, and what is a product of the occupation? What are the voluval marks? Why haven't we ever gotten a list? My books will be in tomorrow at the public library. I will see if they have anything on technoshamanism, but I seriously doubt it. ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
 Discorporation |
Posted - 2004.04.27 10:18:00 -
[97] Edited by: Discorporation on 27/04/2004 10:21:49
Minnies aren't stupid, they'd know full well it were chemicals they were injected with  .
Kinda like Peyote, then? (only injected, not ingested. Ingestion is a better thing, imho, because it doesn't breaches the bodies' natural defenses, and injection can be seen as a way of 'defiling' the flesh). I was going to go for halucinagenic, mood altering, physical enhancement (increased strength or resistance to pain) and all other sorts of things, and all surrounded by a ritualistic covering.
Not sure, but I don't like injections in the first place (Don't like needles :P)
How amarrian of you . that's how i always perceived the Empire to display the emperor's power to the people, a grand, festive lightshow, with buttloads of special effects, singers, dancers and lots of hallelujah brothers!Doesn't seem to be something for the Minnies. Shamans would likely be quite open with the rest of the people, to ensure they are still trusted (trust is important after the occupation, I'd imagine). Cant answer guesstimate all of the following Q's but here goes:
Same reason we dont have a list of festivals, or Saints, probably no time to list tem. You can also make your own, ofcourse :D
Ask Bad Harlequin or do a few searches on Google. There's some funky stuff out there. Also, you might want to take a few looks at the current modern primitive subcultures, and try enter their mind-set. See how they would ingrain cybernetics, nano-technology, etc in their daily lives and practices. 's all I can say, really 0_o [Heterocephalus glaber] |
Discorporation Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers |
Posted - 2004.04.27 10:18:00 -
[98] Edited by: Discorporation on 27/04/2004 10:21:49
Minnies aren't stupid, they'd know full well it were chemicals they were injected with .
Kinda like Peyote, then? (only injected, not ingested. Ingestion is a better thing, imho, because it doesn't breaches the bodies' natural defenses, and injection can be seen as a way of 'defiling' the flesh). I was going to go for halucinagenic, mood altering, physical enhancement (increased strength or resistance to pain) and all other sorts of things, and all surrounded by a ritualistic covering.
Not sure, but I don't like injections in the first place (Don't like needles :P)
How amarrian of you . that's how i always perceived the Empire to display the emperor's power to the people, a grand, festive lightshow, with buttloads of special effects, singers, dancers and lots of hallelujah brothers!Doesn't seem to be something for the Minnies. Shamans would likely be quite open with the rest of the people, to ensure they are still trusted (trust is important after the occupation, I'd imagine). Cant answer guesstimate all of the following Q's but here goes:
Same reason we dont have a list of festivals, or Saints, probably no time to list tem. You can also make your own, ofcourse :D
Ask Bad Harlequin or do a few searches on Google. There's some funky stuff out there. Also, you might want to take a few looks at the current modern primitive subcultures, and try enter their mind-set. See how they would ingrain cybernetics, nano-technology, etc in their daily lives and practices. 's all I can say, really 0_o |
Wren |
Posted - 2004.04.27 13:16:00 -
[99] Okay, well if injection is in, then perhaps inhalers and pills would also be used? -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.04.27 13:16:00 -
[100] Okay, well if injection is in, then perhaps inhalers and pills would also be used? ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
 Tsual |
Posted - 2004.04.27 14:23:00 -
[101] Edited by: Tsual on 27/04/2004 14:27:14 Edited by: Tsual on 27/04/2004 14:24:47 I'm curious wether homeophathy would be a part of minmatar medicin? (Perhaps I find some time to read through the two 400 page thick documents my mother bought lately.) I found following about technoshamanism: her you can read it Following principels I quote from there:
Two spare informative but perhaps good introducing pages about Technoshamanism at http://www.hyperreal.org/raves/spirit/technoshamanism.html and http://www.geocities.com/firemoondancer/technoshamanism.html Some lengthier and rather scientific text about Technoshamanism here.(don't know if I should choose a more special attribute here) A Lexicon that that goes into the esoteric direction: http://www.fusionanomaly.net/TechNode.html -------------------------------------- Tsual - Miner from faith, frigat junky for life. Ritual of the Qua'nadhar. |
Tsual Minmatar Iikhelahii khulemah'lal |
Posted - 2004.04.27 14:23:00 -
[102] Edited by: Tsual on 27/04/2004 14:27:14 Edited by: Tsual on 27/04/2004 14:24:47 I'm curious wether homeophathy would be a part of minmatar medicin? (Perhaps I find some time to read through the two 400 page thick documents my mother bought lately.) I found following about technoshamanism: her you can read it Following principels I quote from there:
Two spare informative but perhaps good introducing pages about Technoshamanism at http://www.hyperreal.org/raves/spirit/technoshamanism.html and http://www.geocities.com/firemoondancer/technoshamanism.html Some lengthier and rather scientific text about Technoshamanism here.(don't know if I should choose a more special attribute here) A Lexicon that that goes into the esoteric direction: http://www.fusionanomaly.net/TechNode.html Moral is only usefull so far as society demands it from one to accept his presence. |
Wren |
Posted - 2004.04.27 21:49:00 -
[103] Thanks Tsual! Lots of things for me to read at work tonight instead of scrolling through the Oracle, CA, Official and EVE P&P boards. Sometimes I drive myself crazy waiting for 'the next' post. heh. So, anyway, with this and the other stuff I have to read, expect a short break whilst I digest the info and let it perculate. -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.04.27 21:49:00 -
[104] Thanks Tsual! Lots of things for me to read at work tonight instead of scrolling through the Oracle, CA, Official and EVE P&P boards. Sometimes I drive myself crazy waiting for 'the next' post. heh. So, anyway, with this and the other stuff I have to read, expect a short break whilst I digest the info and let it perculate. ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
 Discorporation |
Posted - 2004.04.27 22:04:00 -
[105]
inhalers are geeky, m'kay [Heterocephalus glaber] |
Discorporation Amarr Evolution Band of Brothers |
Posted - 2004.04.27 22:04:00 -
[106]
inhalers are geeky, m'kay |
Gaius Kador |
Posted - 2004.04.27 22:59:00 -
[107] Wow! Very interesting thread, but I'll go back and lurk now ;) ---------------------------------------------- |
 Gaius Kador PIE Inc. |
Posted - 2004.04.27 22:59:00 -
[108] Wow! Very interesting thread, but I'll go back and lurk now ;) ---------------------------------------------- |
Wren |
Posted - 2004.05.02 06:48:00 -
[109] Edited by: Wren on 02/08/2004 07:46:37 Edited by: Wren on 02/08/2004 07:45:05 Here is what I am working on right now. A truely wise shaman would use basically 'tools' from any or all of the above. -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.05.02 06:48:00 -
[110] Edited by: Wren on 02/08/2004 07:46:37 Edited by: Wren on 02/08/2004 07:45:05 Here is what I am working on right now. A truely wise shaman would use basically 'tools' from any or all of the above. ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
Darius Shakor |
Posted - 2004.05.02 11:55:00 -
[111] Interesting stuff wren. I also see the minmatar as being more of a black arts race too. However, it's not all as dark as it sounds. A main part of such as voodoo is the use of inhaled drugs as a medium to communicate with their ancestors and the gods of the earth etc. I might need to look that stuff up but I saw another documentary on the descovery channel about Haiti and the use of voodoo. Their main shaman would take all sorts of things and then claim to be posessed by such gods as those of the clouds (for rain) so the people of the village would ask for rain for their crops, and the gods of the earth for a good growing season. And it is still practiced today. Another interesting point that i see a parralell with minmatar culture (and something you touched upon with the temporary shrines you talked about once here) was that when Haiti was influenced by the Roman Catholoc church, their "heathen" religion was near dismantled. However, the true belivers would simply take the saints and other religious figures of the catholic church and use them to represent their own faith in their minds, and fool the catholic church into thinking that their prayers to a particular god of voodoo in the chaple was a prayer to the catholic saints and god. And traditional figures and carvings of voodoo were replaced by pot figures of the virgin mary, though their meaning to them was simply the same as the old figures. Another thing I want to ask is, have you concidered talking with CCP to make this more official? Maybe you could cooperate with their fiction writers with the information you have and they can bring their own into it that would keep in line with prime fiction. Then they could publish it as being the first piece of player contribution to prime fiction specific to the minmatar race players. People are always saying they want more official player shaping of the role play aspect of this game. This could be the first step. ------ Analysis[Ceasefire]....Complete - 'Term given to the act of firing, causing the ceasation of the life it is directed at |
 Darius Shakor Minmatar Freelance Unincorporated Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.05.02 11:55:00 -
[112] Interesting stuff wren. I also see the minmatar as being more of a black arts race too. However, it's not all as dark as it sounds. A main part of such as voodoo is the use of inhaled drugs as a medium to communicate with their ancestors and the gods of the earth etc. I might need to look that stuff up but I saw another documentary on the descovery channel about Haiti and the use of voodoo. Their main shaman would take all sorts of things and then claim to be posessed by such gods as those of the clouds (for rain) so the people of the village would ask for rain for their crops, and the gods of the earth for a good growing season. And it is still practiced today. Another interesting point that i see a parralell with minmatar culture (and something you touched upon with the temporary shrines you talked about once here) was that when Haiti was influenced by the Roman Catholoc church, their "heathen" religion was near dismantled. However, the true belivers would simply take the saints and other religious figures of the catholic church and use them to represent their own faith in their minds, and fool the catholic church into thinking that their prayers to a particular god of voodoo in the chaple was a prayer to the catholic saints and god. And traditional figures and carvings of voodoo were replaced by pot figures of the virgin mary, though their meaning to them was simply the same as the old figures. Another thing I want to ask is, have you concidered talking with CCP to make this more official? Maybe you could cooperate with their fiction writers with the information you have and they can bring their own into it that would keep in line with prime fiction. Then they could publish it as being the first piece of player contribution to prime fiction specific to the minmatar race players. People are always saying they want more official player shaping of the role play aspect of this game. This could be the first step. ------ Shakor Clan Information Portal |
 Wren |
Posted - 2004.05.03 05:29:00 -
[113] The tools of the TechnoShaman: Auditory and visual stimulus û The shaman can use lights and sounds to alter the mood, perceptions, and energy levels of individuals as well as groups. Dancing, singing, chanting, or performing can be involved. (think the Zion ôraveö during matrix 2). High tech sound systems, laser lights and holographic emission are some of the more common tools used. Random Icon/number generation û the shaman can use a number of means to randomly generate icons, symbols, numbers or letters, and then interprets them. Data pads, dice, lots, holographic emitters, magnetic pieces (which when tossed connect in random ways to generate icons or characters), or chemicals (making different colors and transparencies) can be used in this random generation. Spirit Wanderlust û This injected drug effects the brain. The injection is given through the jugular vein or the tear duct. The user experiences an almost immediate hallucination, the length of which is determined by the dose. Usually, this is kept to within an hour, as any longer the danger of permanent brain damage starts to increase dramatically. Side effects from the drug are inability to sleep, headaches, blurred vision and speech, temporary paralysis, and in some cases reduction of short term memory. Bio-luminescent chemicals û A new addition to the shaman tools is a chemical which when properly mixed with the combined blood of all the participants creates a colorless, odorless, and permanent ink which will glow in a variety of colors when pressed against an area of skin marked with the same batch of ink. This has been used in recent years for tattoos of brides and grooms, blood brothers, or adopted children and parents. Death Spikes û this line of chemical injections simulate near death symptoms. There are some that effect heart rate, breathing, blood pressure, and other vital life functions. Users are placed into a state near death where they can experience hallucinations or introspective journeys. These are very dangerous drugs, and many who use them never fully recover, some even die. The injections are given in different areas, from the heart, spine, throat, or arms. Stardust û This is an inhaled chemical powder which expands consciousness and causes hallucinations. The powder also affects the endorphin generators. This drug is highly addictive. The shaman will hold a fistful of the powder and blow it into the nose and mouth of the user, however abusers of the drug just snort it. Withdraw from this drug can lead to depression, confusion and disorientation, shakes, and in some cases bleeding tear ducts. Other drugs û many other drugs can be used to journey into the self consciousness or spiritual world. There are others used purely for their mood altering effects. Any chemical substance used on someone can be called a part of technoshamanism if the individual can learn more about himself or the spiritual world around him. -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.05.03 05:29:00 -
[114] The tools of the TechnoShaman: Auditory and visual stimulus û The shaman can use lights and sounds to alter the mood, perceptions, and energy levels of individuals as well as groups. Dancing, singing, chanting, or performing can be involved. (think the Zion ôraveö during matrix 2). High tech sound systems, laser lights and holographic emission are some of the more common tools used. Random Icon/number generation û the shaman can use a number of means to randomly generate icons, symbols, numbers or letters, and then interprets them. Data pads, dice, lots, holographic emitters, magnetic pieces (which when tossed connect in random ways to generate icons or characters), or chemicals (making different colors and transparencies) can be used in this random generation. Spirit Wanderlust û This injected drug effects the brain. The injection is given through the jugular vein or the tear duct. The user experiences an almost immediate hallucination, the length of which is determined by the dose. Usually, this is kept to within an hour, as any longer the danger of permanent brain damage starts to increase dramatically. Side effects from the drug are inability to sleep, headaches, blurred vision and speech, temporary paralysis, and in some cases reduction of short term memory. Bio-luminescent chemicals û A new addition to the shaman tools is a chemical which when properly mixed with the combined blood of all the participants creates a colorless, odorless, and permanent ink which will glow in a variety of colors when pressed against an area of skin marked with the same batch of ink. This has been used in recent years for tattoos of brides and grooms, blood brothers, or adopted children and parents. Death Spikes û this line of chemical injections simulate near death symptoms. There are some that effect heart rate, breathing, blood pressure, and other vital life functions. Users are placed into a state near death where they can experience hallucinations or introspective journeys. These are very dangerous drugs, and many who use them never fully recover, some even die. The injections are given in different areas, from the heart, spine, throat, or arms. Stardust û This is an inhaled chemical powder which expands consciousness and causes hallucinations. The powder also affects the endorphin generators. This drug is highly addictive. The shaman will hold a fistful of the powder and blow it into the nose and mouth of the user, however abusers of the drug just snort it. Withdraw from this drug can lead to depression, confusion and disorientation, shakes, and in some cases bleeding tear ducts. Other drugs û many other drugs can be used to journey into the self consciousness or spiritual world. There are others used purely for their mood altering effects. Any chemical substance used on someone can be called a part of technoshamanism if the individual can learn more about himself or the spiritual world around him. ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
Wren |
Posted - 2004.05.03 09:07:00 -
[115] Elemental thoughts: Instead of the four elements we see used alot, Earth, Fire, Water and Wind/Air, I think it would be interesting to discuss a possibility that the Minmatar see seven, since seven appears to be a special number for the Minmatar. Heat Cold Solid Liquid Gas Light Darkness As you can see, you can still get anything by using one or a combination of elements. Any thoughts? -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.05.03 09:07:00 -
[116] Elemental thoughts: Instead of the four elements we see used alot, Earth, Fire, Water and Wind/Air, I think it would be interesting to discuss a possibility that the Minmatar see seven, since seven appears to be a special number for the Minmatar. Heat Cold Solid Liquid Gas Light Darkness As you can see, you can still get anything by using one or a combination of elements. Any thoughts? ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
 Tsual |
Posted - 2004.05.03 15:47:00 -
[117]
Interesting thought, so for every thing you either get a dual mixing system (a primary attribute element and secondary attribute element), or a triagonal classification system (one base element, an attribute element and an "flavour" element) -------------------------------------- Tsual - Miner from faith, frigat junky for life. Ritual of the Qua'nadhar. |
Tsual Minmatar Iikhelahii khulemah'lal |
Posted - 2004.05.03 15:47:00 -
[118]
Interesting thought, so for every thing you either get a dual mixing system (a primary attribute element and secondary attribute element), or a triagonal classification system (one base element, an attribute element and an "flavour" element) Moral is only usefull so far as society demands it from one to accept his presence. |
 Wren |
Posted - 2004.05.04 03:44:00 -
[119] Yeah, why make it simple. Any other comments on Elements or Technoshamanism? If not I will move to the next few classifications I have earlier up. -------------------------------------------------- |
Wren Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan |
Posted - 2004.05.04 03:44:00 -
[120] Yeah, why make it simple. Any other comments on Elements or Technoshamanism? If not I will move to the next few classifications I have earlier up. ----------------------------------- Wren says: "Chirpy Chirp Chirp.... DAMNIT!" |
| Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 7 :: one page | |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page | |
Originally by: Wren| Copyright © 2006-2025, Chribba - OMG Labs. All Rights Reserved. - perf 0,25s, ref 20251112/0814 EVE-Online™ and Eve imagery © CCP. |
| COPYRIGHT NOTICE EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website. |