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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:00:00 -
[1]
Okay now those things might be slightly overpowered (just like a lot of the T2 ammos), but I really enjoy them in my missions. Now on Sisi Bane and Inferno Javs got:
Exp radius: 400m (up from 300)
Damage: 380 (down from 450)
Speed penalty: Still the same
Other stats: don't know, don't matter to me.
Now I wonder, if those stats are correct, what exactly is the point in using Bane and Inferno Javs anymore? And why do Mjolnirs and Juggs still have the old stats? Is this another bug?
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ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:04:00 -
[2]
Ha-ha-ha!
Torpedo t2 Raven is almost crap(no tank, no nos, no mwd, nothing), but with javelin nerfing it will be completely useless.
CCP, would you be so kind to exchange useless torp skills for something more useful?
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:06:00 -
[3]
"Slightly?" :)
Its about time that those things get in line with the other weapons.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:09:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 24/10/2006 17:10:55
I wont mind a range reduction at all, but please leave the damage and exp radius alone. They don't nerf Barrage or Null into oblivion either, why do it to Javs? Either nerf em all or nerf none.
And I only really use missiles in PvE, and there explosion velocity is meaningless.
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ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Eilie
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:11:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Eilie on 24/10/2006 17:12:25
Good, torps arn't supposed to be better than cruise missiles. Thats why torps skill is rank4 and cruise is rank5.
And yes, torps (like rockets and the new heavy assualt missiles) are supposed to be short range, while standard, heavy, and cruise missiles are the lower dmg but far range weapons!
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Arakasai
Caldari
Blueprint Haus
Serenus Letum
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:11:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/10/2006 17:07:52
"Slightly" overpowered? :)
Its about time that those things get in line with the other weapons. I would hope that they get a range reduction too, because they are meant to be SHORT RANGE weapons with that kind of damage.
At the risk of turning this into yet another flame back and forth on the pros and cons of missiles I find I just have to ask this.
How the heck do you know what they are meant to be? Clearly they are meant to be long range weapons because that is how they were implemented. I imagine if they were meant to be shor range weapons they would have been implemented as short range weapons.
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:11:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/10/2006 17:07:52
"Slightly" overpowered? :)
Its about time that those things get in line with the other weapons. I would hope that they get a range reduction too, because they are meant to be SHORT RANGE weapons with that kind of damage.
I would like to repeat for you "Torpedo t2 Raven is almost crap." use it only in small gangs having excellent commander. With latest changes torpedo t2 Raven does not exist at all as warship.
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:16:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Arakasai
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/10/2006 17:07:52
"Slightly" overpowered? :)
Its about time that those things get in line with the other weapons. I would hope that they get a range reduction too, because they are meant to be SHORT RANGE weapons with that kind of damage.
At the risk of turning this into yet another flame back and forth on the pros and cons of missiles I find I just have to ask this.
How the heck do you know what they are meant to be? Clearly they are meant to be long range weapons because that is how they were implemented. I imagine if they were meant to be shor range weapons they would have been implemented as short range weapons.
Well, even though I realize that guns and missiles arent supposed to be exacly the same, for turrets, you have short range, high damage ammo, and long range, low damage ammo.
For missiles, you have torpedoes and cruise missiles. Cruise are fast, less damaging and torps are slow, high damage. It goes to reason that torps shouldnt have amazing range, because their damage will then far exceed the damage of turrets once the torpedoes start hitting.
Yes, missiles dont hit instantly, but is it fair that they should have very high damage and very high range because of it?
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:17:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Eilie
Edited by: Eilie on 24/10/2006 17:12:25
Good, torps arn't supposed to be better than cruise missiles. Thats why torps skill is rank4 and cruise is rank5.
And yes, torps (like rockets and the new heavy assualt missiles) are supposed to be short range, while standard, heavy, and cruise missiles are the lower dmg but far range weapons!
looks that you never saw quickfit.
Open this beatiful prgram and look for fitting requirements for torpedoes and explain why torpedos require impossible for Raven PG and impossible even for Raven CPU being worse than cruise missiles?
For what hell they exist at all?
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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:18:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 24/10/2006 17:19:31
Okay, complete stats for the nerfed Bane and Inferno Javs (unnerfed in brackets)[T1 torp in []]
Exp Radius: 400m (300m)[400m]
Flight time: 12.5s (25s)[30s]
Max. Velocity: 3750m/s (3750 m/s)[1250m/s]
Max. Velocity Penalty: -20% (-20%)[0]
Exp. Velocity: 500m/s (500 m/s)[250m/s]
Damage: 380 (450)[450]
Now I know I only use them for PvE so my opinion does not count, but I think this is quite a bit too extreme. Nerf the flight time and even the exp velocity for all I care, but keep the radius and damage the same.
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ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:18:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Eilie
Edited by: Eilie on 24/10/2006 17:12:25
Good, torps arn't supposed to be better than cruise missiles. Thats why torps skill is rank4 and cruise is rank5.
And yes, torps (like rockets and the new heavy assualt missiles) are supposed to be short range, while standard, heavy, and cruise missiles are the lower dmg but far range weapons!
QFT.
The whole "takes 10 minutes to get there" thing would be a bit of a clue, you'd think........
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AKULA UrQuan
Caldari
STK Scientific
Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:20:00 -
[12]
Bah! I Still have to train torps to level 5 for a dread down the road. 
Originally by: Wrangler
Win ME is more a some sort of virus than a OS..
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Hoshi
DAB
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:21:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Hoshi on 24/10/2006 17:23:17
Either one of these changes on its own seem alright but both at the same time is over the top. Javlin are supposed to be the torpedo version of precision but with 400m explosion radius that not the case anymore.
Now just became long range low damage ammo with very little practical use as long range (above 100km) is never going to be very usefull for missiles (in pvp at least that is, but how many use t2 ammo for pve?).
Edit: They nerfed range as well? Then what is the point of using them at all? they reach the target slightly faster but that's about it.
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Jim McGregor
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:22:00 -
[14]
Dont forget that they nerfed the turret ammo damage as well.
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Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:22:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 24/10/2006 17:19:31
Okay, complete stats for the nerfed Bane and Inferno Javs (unnerfed in brackets)[T1 torp in []]
Exp Radius: 400m (300m)[400m]
Flight time: 12.5s (25s)[30s]
Max. Velocity: 3750m/s (3750 m/s)[1250m/s]
Max. Velocity Penalty: -20% (-20%)[0]
Exp. Velocity: 500m/s (500 m/s)[250m/s]
Damage: 380 (450)[450]
Now I know I only use them for PvE so my opinion does not count, but I think this is quite a bit too extreme. Nerf the flight time and even the exp velocity for all I care, but keep the radius and damage the same.
But now we have good news, torp Raven is nerfed to death and we, caldari, have one setup to use, cruise.
I really want reimbursement of my torpedo skill.
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Tassi
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:24:00 -
[16]
Why is only bane and inferno nerfed?
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:24:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Tassi
Why is only bane and inferno nerfed?
certainly it is bug, and all will be nerfed to death.
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:24:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Dont forget that they nerfed the turret ammo damage as well.
Yes? How much? 50%?
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Tassi
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:25:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Tassi on 24/10/2006 17:25:59
If they change the jave torps like this none will use them anymore and everyone will go painters + rage 
EDIT: since ECM gets nerfed you have free meds for painters 
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Deva Blackfire
DAB
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:26:00 -
[20]
Cry caldari, cry :)
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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:26:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 24/10/2006 17:26:22
Well only bane and inferno being nerfed holds my hopes high that the nerfed ones are just a bug.
And where is Barrage nerfed? Still looked its overpowered self to me when I checked... (Now I am droped and cannot recheck)
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ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Tassi
Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:28:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Cry caldari, cry :)
Why? Didn't you see the stats of the drake?
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Leandro Salazar
Aeon Industries
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:29:00 -
[23]
I cry as a mission-*****, not as Caldari. In fact I hate Caldari but I love ISK and Jav torps were great for multiplying the contents of my wallet :P
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ZOMG my sig was concordokkened!
Link removed due to bad language on remote site. -wystler
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Butter Dog
The Dead Miners Society
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:30:00 -
[24]
haha, brilliant :)
About time, too. 600DPS from 240km? NOT ANY MORE.
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Rehmes
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:31:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Zixxa
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/10/2006 17:07:52
"Slightly" overpowered? :)
Its about time that those things get in line with the other weapons. I would hope that they get a range reduction too, because they are meant to be SHORT RANGE weapons with that kind of damage.
I would like to repeat for you "Torpedo t2 Raven is almost crap." use it only in small gangs having excellent commander. With latest changes torpedo t2 Raven does not exist at all as warship.
You seem to forget that they are meant to be used in gangs. MOst if not all caldari ships (this includes amar) are meant to be more effective in gangs. Just cuz people use raven as solo ships doesnt mean that they are meant to be used as such.
T2 Torp ravens dont suck as you seem to point out, otherwise the ship wouldnt be seen in pvp at all tbh. This is not really a nerf but rather a measure taken to bring an overpowered weapon down to the others' capabilities.
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:33:00 -
[26]
Edited by: LUKEC on 24/10/2006 17:33:46
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Cry caldari, cry :)
Looks like torp spec 5 will await bc 5 :P
and bitter dog, it's not that easy to fit full rack of sieges either.
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Butter Dog
The Dead Miners Society
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:33:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Zixxa
Originally by: Eilie
Edited by: Eilie on 24/10/2006 17:12:25
Good, torps arn't supposed to be better than cruise missiles. Thats why torps skill is rank4 and cruise is rank5.
And yes, torps (like rockets and the new heavy assualt missiles) are supposed to be short range, while standard, heavy, and cruise missiles are the lower dmg but far range weapons!
looks that you never saw quickfit.
Open this beatiful prgram and look for fitting requirements for torpedoes and explain why torpedos require impossible for Raven PG and impossible even for Raven CPU being worse than cruise missiles?
For what hell they exist at all?
so? take out some of the stabs from your lowslots and use fitting modules
fitting a full rack of torps is no problem for anyone but the most retarded raven pilot
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:36:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Rehmes
You seem to forget that they are meant to be used in gangs. MOst if not all caldari ships (this includes amar) are meant to be more effective in gangs. Just cuz people use raven as solo ships doesnt mean that they are meant to be used as such.
T2 Torp ravens dont suck as you seem to point out, otherwise the ship wouldnt be seen in pvp at all tbh. This is not really a nerf but rather a measure taken to bring an overpowered weapon down to the others' capabilities.
Javelin dps now is below CRUISE DPS. For what hell shoudl I use torps? And care about fitting?
Rage fit is usable only with zillion painters + few webbers + covert + . How many time you have zillion painters?
And in any case it is NOT SUITABLE for FLEET BATTLE.
And now it is ABSOLUTELY NOT SUITABLE for SMALL GANGS. You cannot kill with javelin(lock time+flight time), but you may scare enemy. At least stupid enemy which cannot use MWD to tank javelins. Now you may scare only industrial. Sometimes. When it is not tanked.
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Butter Dog
The Dead Miners Society
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:37:00 -
[29]
Originally by: LUKEC
Edited by: LUKEC on 24/10/2006 17:33:46
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Cry caldari, cry :)
Looks like torp spec 5 will await bc 5 :P
and bitter dog, it's not that easy to fit full rack of sieges either.
About as easy as a full rack of Tachs, Neutrons, 425 II's, or any other comparable decent weapon.
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.10.24 17:42:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Testy Mctest
Leandro, at the minute these kill everything, even frigates to an extent, and certainly kill everything cruiser sized or bigger.
They're basically cruise missiles with much more damage and an irrelevent drawback.
They're overpowered, so they've been nerfed. They needed it. I know, because I fly with multiple Ravens everytime I play, and they annihilate anything they hit; it's wrong that a battleship class ship can shoot everything from small to large with one kind of ammo.
Drones do that too, but at least they have range issues.
I predict price of sieges II droping to 2 mil again... might be good for reprocessing...
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