That sure is an impressive amount of character attacks on the whole of hi-sec you managed there Jenn. Definitely taking notes.

If you use the same account then you can't update sell orders and mission at the same time. If you use an alt then your isk/h is halved whereas if you use an alt in null your isk is doubled. You're changing from what you originally said, moving the goalposts.

I agree completely, you don't need those mods, however that's not the point now is it? Ships that are NOT officer fit are ganked daily in just the system I mission from. There are dozens of other mission hubs and the surrounding systems. You're changing from what you originally said, moving the goalposts.

I am well aware of the ESS and exactly how it functions, used it for months when I was in null. The LP is gives is a small amount and your income isn't impacted by much even if you decide to not use it. In fact your income is eventually increased if you use it long enough over what you were making before the ESS iirc. The majority of your income however is still in raw isk.

You're in an organized alliance with thousands of members with Tax, Moon goo, supers and all kinds of other toys that help support that infrastructure. I get it, null is different to HS, that's what I've been saying. Part of that is that it's easier to ramp up income to well over what is possible in HS. And that's FINE because you need to be able to do that. I'm not advocating a nerf to null so untwist those undies.

These people

Did you even bother to read what I said regarding incursions?

Also I don't think there's much of anything I Alt agree on, ever. In fact lumping me and him into the same goup is probably the most telling and hilarious thing in your last two posts haha.

These people

Incursions are no longer the most broken things in high sec. You've personally documented the thing that is, it's in your sig.

You are agreeing right now. Further, You agree with him every time you take a page from his play book and gloss over the costs and context of pve in null vs what you do in high sec. ie you mention the costs in time and isk for skill training and acquiring ships needed to blitz missions for 200 mil isk per hour (side note, he only disagrees on the isk/hr thing because he doesn't want people to think you can actually make isk in high sec), while not acknowledging the ongoing and continual cost to null sec players in terms of either isk or real life money to maintain multiple alts to just barely reach the same isk.hr you do with one character... That's pure Market McSelling Alt thinking if ever there was such a thing..

And where did I say "those people". Lying is also a Market McSelling Alt thing that you just did...

And second, I thing you know it's no use arguing with these people. Like Malcanis likes to say (which was lifted off some dead guy) GÇ£It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.GÇ¥ . The imbalance is well documented (even recently, with CCP Quant expressing surprise at how few people Incursion why also generating the 3rd largest isk faucet).

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Concord is not protection, it's punishment. if someone wants to gank you concord will not stop them. Come on, this is basic Eve stuff.

What, you mean as a solo player? Come on, you're not even comparing two different types of food here never mind apples to apples.

Firstly, nice seeing you the other night in Wicked Creek Baltec. I took a potshot at your Mega hoping to be on your kill mail, then you up and didn't die. Next time Baltec, next time...

There is a hardcap to what I do, I've said that multiple times. Doing it with more than one character is asking for very, very expensive lossmails. Incursions and nullsec ratting (and even wormholes) is consistently multiboxed with a far higher isk cap. I mean I multiboxed

I already addressed the nullsec ongoing costs and the fact that you as part of a giant alliance have multiple income streams to cover them.

There is a hardcap to what I do, I've said that multiple times. Doing it with more than one character is asking for very, very expensive lossmails. Incursions and nullsec ratting (and even wormholes) is consistently multiboxed with a far higher isk cap. I mean I multiboxed them fine, all three.

And I think I've established the upper limit of what you can achieve running non-Burner missions with up to 3 characters: It's about 150m ISK/hour with storyline missions and the occasional lucky Zor implant drop; 100m ISK/hour on the lower side with crappy mission draws and when Bob frowns upon you. With a single character you will be hard-pressed to break 50m ISK/hour with a combination of shooting/looting NPCs unless again, Bob smiles and you get a lucky Zor implant drop. And the 50m ISK/hour would be running something like a Golem (so not exactly a small hit on the wallet or skills).

In order to routinely break that 200m ISK/hour ceiling you need to really get lucky with Burner mission draws or spend a lot of time accepting regular missions repairing your standings (even with V social skills). And there are more than a few Burner missions where if you screw up just once, you're effectively hooped (and get a ringside seat to watching your 100m+ ISK ship explode in flames). And then there are the Burner missions you draw that are just useless (Guristas base being a prime example).

And let's not forget that the 200m+ ISK/hour more or less relegates you to SOE agents and systems, making you a prime ganking target regardless of fit (I've seen masses of Catalysts taking out T2-fit battleships just for sh*ts and giggles to pad their killboard). With upwards of 100 mission runners in any system at any given time, it's a gank smorgasbord.

I can't speak to low-sec, null-sec or wormhole income - but I would assume risk vs. reward comes into play. Ditto for high-sec Incursions, as I imagine a high rate of return entails running a rather blingy ship.

As an aside, I should note that there's a way to break 600m+ ISK/hour if you cherry-pick a specific series of L4 missions. The downside is that you will absolutely, positively destroy opposing Empire standings in the process - as well as severely damage your own declining mission after mission to get it. I'm referring of course to the 'Enemies Abound' mission series for Caldari (and Empire equivalents). Mission rewards and salvage alone typically exceed 170m ISK per run, so with LP you're easily over 200m per character. With 3 characters you can easily blitz all three sets in roughly an hour. 600m+ ISK. Voila.

However, this should be considered a burst in income - and isn't sustainable unless you regularly pray at the Altar of Bob (you could literally get two 'Enemies' back-to-back or decline 50 missions and not get a single one...). You will also need at least one Golem to pull this off (ideally 2 or 3), if only for the salvaging/cargo capabilities.

If you want staggering income you need to try bomber blitzing FW level 4 missions.

I've heard it can be insanely lucrative. But how staggering are we talking about?

I've heard it can be insanely lucrative. But how staggering are we talking about?

Then again, incursion abuse can still happen.

If you blitz highsec level 3 missions using a t2 fitted mach you can hit 80-90 mil an hour and you can do this all day every day without interruptions like you get in null. The best income right now via shooting comes from highsec, the only reason anoms are done is because you can run them afk although afk income will take a large hit when carriers lose their ability to use drones next year.

If you want staggering income you need to try bomber blitzing FW level 4 missions.

Carriers would still be able to use drones with even better bonuses at the expense of losing their logi capabilities last I heard.....unless CCP changed their minds again from that last blog.

Looking into this, but I think you need to join a FW corp to do this if I'm mistaken which I'd really hate to do. NPC corps are simply the best.

The two carriers to do the job of one thing seems another move designed to push people into getting more alts.

Carriers would still be able to use drones with even better bonuses at the expense of losing their logi capabilities last I heard.....unless CCP changed their minds again from that last blog.

Carriers are losing drones and fighters need to be manually used, the age of AFK carriers is at an end. You also cant refit with a weapons timer or use capital reps without the new dedicated logi capitals without large drawbacks so current defensive tactics are also taking a large hit. Ratting carriers can still work but you will need new fits, tactics and you cant be afk in them.

Carriers are losing drones and fighters need to be manually used, the age of AFK carriers is at an end. You also cant refit with a weapons timer or use capital reps without the new dedicated logi capitals without large drawbacks so current defensive tactics are also taking a large hit. Ratting carriers can still work but you will need new fits, tactics and you cant be afk in them.

Ratting Dreadnoughts?

Oh god forbid you have to actually be at your computer while you get the largest wallet ticks available in the game.

Possible, I'm more interested in nano dreads

OK, you perked my interest. Any details you'd care to share?

OK, you perked my interest. Any details you'd care to share?