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Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.04 23:48:00 - [1] On my list this is at the top of current feature/frustrations. If you mine an asteroid you create a can and when someone steals from it they are flagged to you If you shoot an NPC you create a can and when someone steals from it they are flagged to you. IF you shoot a player you create a wreck/can and when someone steals from it they are.... ummm.. NOT flagged to you. Please at least give us an aggreement on the necessity of change to this. Being followed in empire by moochers who steal my or my victims loot is ridiculous. HOWEVER should this change be unacceptable I will accept one other solution listed below Asteroids will now follow players around and scoop their ore back. And NPC's will scoop their fallen comrades loot back up. Thank you for your time. This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
MotoTsume Gallente Clan Black Scorpion	Posted - 2007.04.04 23:51:00 - [2] Edited by: MotoTsume on 04/04/2007 23:47:50 Actually the wreck is flagged, but to the person you shot , the owner of the ship and that is how it should be. it isnt your loot the moocher is stealing but the person who's ship it was. So that person can kill the moocher It's just a game........Or is it?????
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.04 23:53:00 - [3] Didn't you guys complain about this last week? Didn't get much sympathy then either. Simply: The wreck belongs to the PC who's ship was destroyed. Any other method would increase griefing to the original owner. If you want something along the lines of "dual ownership" so that the killer AND the killed can take the contents, then we demand it for ore lost to can flippers too, plus several hundred other requests to make our stuff "safer" from thieves. <-----------> Keiron: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=427556&page=2 PvE and/or PvP is not something that appeals to the entire player base
Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.04 23:57:00 - [4] Originally by: MotoTsume Edited by: MotoTsume on 04/04/2007 23:47:50 Actually the wreck is flagged, but to the person you shot , the owner of the ship and that is how it should be. it isnt your loot the moocher is stealing but the person who's ship it was. So that person can kill the moocher Does that really make any sense though? That's like saying in a wrestling match for the world championship Bob knocks out Joe. Then some guy in the stands runs onto the ring takes the belt of Joe's unconcious body and if BoB attacks this dude for the belt he just won. The ref will shoot him in the head. ANd Joe who is out cold though has 15 minutes to wake up and beat up the guy who is in his car driving home. You just got blown up, you were engaged in a pvp fight and you lost. Now let's put aside ganking because I for one love fair and honorable 1v1s. I spend a long time in a fight between my battleship and someone elses. We both agree to risk all we have on it for that fight. The reward is the other person's stuff. No it isn't. Because in order for us to even remotely have a chance at that we have to orbit at less then 1500m. because some noob in a frigate/or indy will be stuck on one of us waiting for us to pop. Even if I do die, I have what 15minutes to fit a combat effective ship and find the person who stole the wreckage? I would personally rather have the person who defeated me have that. And meet him again in combat. Then some random paserby. This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:01:00 - [5] Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby Didn't you guys complain about this last week? Didn't get much sympathy then either. Simply: The wreck belongs to the PC who's ship was destroyed. Any other method would increase griefing to the original owner. If you want something along the lines of "dual ownership" so that the killer AND the killed can take the contents, then we demand it for ore lost to can flippers too, plus several hundred other requests to make our stuff "safer" from thieves. But it isn't the same. In mining. If I am engaged in mining and I'm concerned about someone stealing my ore. I can bring a battleship along with me. The moment he takes my ore I can blow him to kingdom come. In NPCing. same thing, hell I could probably do it in my npcing ship. However PVP is considered different for some reason. Where no victory is not celebrated it is dissuaded and the loser has protetion over what he has already agreed to lose by using in pvp. That makes absolutely no sense. By that right I should be able to go into a mission and loot off the cans of the things you blow up and you shouldn't have any reprocution against me. Why is my hard work any less worthy then yours? This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
Nicholas Barker Caldari Black Bands	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:04:00 - [6] Edited by: Nicholas Barker on 05/04/2007 00:00:24 it's so if that guy has buddies and they kill you, then some random joe runs up and grabs the loot they can kill the random joe. If you take the loot it doesn't matter, since you're at war with the guy and his corpys, so they can shoot you regardless. If you kill soembody and somebody else takes the loot, you should have been faster i guess :( edit - and so that if he has a friend with him from another corp he can retake the loot for him. ------------------------------------- Am Orbitin' ur shi... i said orbit... ORBIT... no don't fly off in that direction
Illyria Ambri Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:07:00 - [7] I can only think of 2-3 responses to this.. 1. Quit crying.. thats how its setup and this is an unforgiving game.. if you cant handle the loss of loot from loot thieves.. stop attacking ppl in jita with 300 other players hanging around. 2. "Adapt or GTFO" 3. You chose that possibility when you joined a player corp.. if you dont want that to happen.. get out of the player corp. Players that object to your way of doing things are told to adapt or quit cause EVE is unforgiving.. Now you want the system changed to benefit you so that it is less unforgiving.. Ironic imo ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Happiness is a warm railgun, Love is a stocked missle launcher. Sexual extacy is watching that NME Battleship go boom. "Will i
Nerogk Shorn Caldari Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:11:00 - [8] Originally by: Roue Originally by: MotoTsume Edited by: MotoTsume on 04/04/2007 23:47:50 Actually the wreck is flagged, but to the person you shot , the owner of the ship and that is how it should be. it isnt your loot the moocher is stealing but the person who's ship it was. So that person can kill the moocher Does that really make any sense though? That's like saying in a wrestling match for the world championship Bob knocks out Joe. Then some guy in the stands runs onto the ring takes the belt of Joe's unconcious body and if BoB attacks this dude for the belt he just won. The ref will shoot him in the head. ANd Joe who is out cold though has 15 minutes to wake up and beat up the guy who is in his car driving home. You just got blown up, you were engaged in a pvp fight and you lost. Now let's put aside ganking because I for one love fair and honorable 1v1s. I spend a long time in a fight between my battleship and someone elses. We both agree to risk all we have on it for that fight. The reward is the other person's stuff. No it isn't. Because in order for us to even remotely have a chance at that we have to orbit at less then 1500m. because some noob in a frigate/or indy will be stuck on one of us waiting for us to pop. Even if I do die, I have what 15minutes to fit a combat effective ship and find the person who stole the wreckage? I would personally rather have the person who defeated me have that. And meet him again in combat. Then some random paserby. You assume that it is your right to ownership of the wreck. As much as you want it to be... it isn't. There was no contract between you and Concord and because of that the original owner of the wreck still has ownership. D-F-A-A-B-A-A-S
Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:11:00 - [9] Originally by: Nicholas Barker Edited by: Nicholas Barker on 05/04/2007 00:00:24 it's so if that guy has buddies and they kill you, then some random joe runs up and grabs the loot they can kill the random joe. If you take the loot it doesn't matter, since you're at war with the guy and his corpys, so they can shoot you regardless. If you kill soembody and somebody else takes the loot, you should have been faster i guess :( edit - and so that if he has a friend with him from another corp he can retake the loot for him. Just tell me real quick. In what way has EVE ever been designed to reward those who have lost? Why should it now? Hell if I wanted to be honorable and give the guy his stuff back he lost I couldn't even keep it from being stolen. The defense of this feature, which has no realistic application in game at all. Is nothing but a bias against another form of gameplay. This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
DiuxDium Loot	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:15:00 - [10] To the victor go the spoils. Anything less is WoW-Ification. Quote: Also, he didnt even have a Scrambler, so the POS would have gotten away anyway.

Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:16:00 - [11] Originally by: Illyria Ambri I can only think of 2-3 responses to this.. 1. Quit crying.. thats how its setup and this is an unforgiving game.. if you cant handle the loss of loot from loot thieves.. stop attacking ppl in jita with 300 other players hanging around. 2. "Adapt or GTFO" 3. You chose that possibility when you joined a player corp.. if you dont want that to happen.. get out of the player corp. Players that object to your way of doing things are told to adapt or quit cause EVE is unforgiving.. Now you want the system changed to benefit you so that it is less unforgiving.. Ironic imo I rarely if ever engage in pvp in jita. Did you know people make a career out of following around members of my alliance to loot them. They set negative standings and follow us THROUGH OUT THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE. Remember when peopel could scan out your missions and take your loot and you couldn't do anything about it two weeks later it was patched, gotta protect the mission runners. Yet this form of what is by no different definition then mission griefing.. a form of GRIEFING. is supported. And some of us find a love of this game so intense that we feel compelled to at times express our opinions on forums, a tool ccp provided us for just that reason. Our intention is ussually to correct something we feel is wrong. But without expressing it, regardless of the decision, it won't be heard and therefore won't be responded to. In the past I've listened to hundreds of threads and supported those I felt, regardless of impact to me, had good points. This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
Roue Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:17:00 - [12] Originally by: DiuxDium To the victor go the spoils. Anything less is WoW-Ification. This thread I doubt will go anywhere, but your statement is so perfectly true to my feelings I am going to quote it and leave this thread to go wherever it wants. I certainly hope ccp shares my feelings about this. If they don't oh well. I cancelled 2 accounts and left messages about the absense of action against cheating in this game. I have another account I can cancel to if need be. This is my opinion not that of privateer corp, alliance, its member corps, affiliates, minions, pet animals, ex girlfriends, former roommates, 3rd grade gym teachers, late relatives, ontime relatives,
MotoTsume Gallente Clan Black Scorpion	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:18:00 - [13] Originally by: Roue Originally by: Nicholas Barker Edited by: Nicholas Barker on 05/04/2007 00:00:24 it's so if that guy has buddies and they kill you, then some random joe runs up and grabs the loot they can kill the random joe. If you take the loot it doesn't matter, since you're at war with the guy and his corpys, so they can shoot you regardless. If you kill soembody and somebody else takes the loot, you should have been faster i guess :( edit - and so that if he has a friend with him from another corp he can retake the loot for him. Just tell me real quick. In what way has EVE ever been designed to reward those who have lost? Why should it now? Hell if I wanted to be honorable and give the guy his stuff back he lost I couldn't even keep it from being stolen. The defense of this feature, which has no realistic application in game at all. Is nothing but a bias against another form of gameplay. At the same time why should EVE reward a group of players that basicly use grief tactics to gain their means? It's just a game........Or is it?????
Barbarellas Daughter Lonely Barbarella	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:19:00 - [14] Originally by: Roue Originally by: MotoTsume Edited by: MotoTsume on 04/04/2007 23:47:50 Actually the wreck is flagged, but to the person you shot , the owner of the ship and that is how it should be. it isnt your loot the moocher is stealing but the person who's ship it was. So that person can kill the moocher Does that really make any sense though? That's like saying in a wrestling match for the world championship Bob knocks out Joe. Then some guy in the stands runs onto the ring takes the belt of Joe's unconcious body and if BoB attacks this dude for the belt he just won. The ref will shoot him in the head. ANd Joe who is out cold though has 15 minutes to wake up and beat up the guy who is in his car driving home. You just got blown up, you were engaged in a pvp fight and you lost. Now let's put aside ganking because I for one love fair and honorable 1v1s. I spend a long time in a fight between my battleship and someone elses. We both agree to risk all we have on it for that fight. The reward is the other person's stuff. No it isn't. Because in order for us to even remotely have a chance at that we have to orbit at less then 1500m. because some noob in a frigate/or indy will be stuck on one of us waiting for us to pop. Even if I do die, I have what 15minutes to fit a combat effective ship and find the person who stole the wreckage? I would personally rather have the person who defeated me have that. And meet him again in combat. Then some random paserby. LOL! Use my metapher instead: You knock down a grandma, she lies on the floor. Then another guy comes around and steals the money of the grandma. So you believe its your money that has been taken??
Illyria Ambri Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:30:00 - [15] Edited by: Illyria Ambri on 05/04/2007 00:27:10 Originally by: Roue I rarely if ever engage in pvp in jita. Did you know people make a career out of following around members of my alliance to loot them. They set negative standings and follow us THROUGH OUT THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE. WOW.. You MUST be kidding me.. players taking advantage of the system to annoy another alliance w/o their consent?? Perish the thought ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Happiness is a warm railgun, Love is a stocked missle launcher. Sexual extacy is watching that NME Battleship go boom. "Will i
Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:39:00 - [16] The obvious logic is thus: 1) Only one can have ownership of a player's wreck, the victim or the victor. Who gets it? 2) Well, the victim probably already has kill rights on the victor. Flagging the victor for "stealing" from the victim's wreck isn't going to change much. 3) If victor gets ownership, that's sort of an insult to injury situation. The victim gets killed and has to also be flagged for stealing to get his stuff back? Obviously the game wasn't designed to have two owners for the same wreck. And just as obvious the reasons above are likely why the victor doesn't get ownership of the wreck. It all makes sense until the third party enters the equation. It's simply too easy to steal from the freshly killed in empire. It's likely too fundamental a change to the game to expect CCP to do anything about it soonÖ if at all. I wouldn't expect it anyway. ------------------- Say What?
Thread Winner Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:42:00 - [17] Kill Leeching is risk free and should be fixed. I may be an alt but I'm no privateer (no offense intended) You who post that they are only hauler gankers or jita killers are prime examples of the stereotyping degenerates that populate all MMO's please take your ilk elsewhere. It is broken, risk free, and damn annoying.
Ratamnim Natas	Posted - 2007.04.05 00:43:00 - [18] Well if you want to loot the wrecks move out of big shopping hubs and you may get a chance. I know thats where alot of you guys stay in the safety of dock range and try to gank people before they load Looting is a problem even in big alliances. You kill someone whilst you are in a gang and there is someone in the gang who has started looted the wreck before you even start to lock the pod. This ****es alot of people off especially the ones that dont share the loot with others in gang. I have seen in in places like jita alot what yyou are talking about though alot of noob corp chars and others just sat outside 4-4 waiting for a fight with there cargos open and salvagers flashing. For a corp that may make there isk from loot this would annoy me but i would go else where less active to make sure loot was more secure, even though it may mean i wouldnt get those cheap ganks some crave from shopping hubs.
eveplayer11	Posted - 2007.04.05 01:27:00 - [19] if you blow up my car its still my car.. i might not be able to drive it anymore but its mine. when you scavage it i want to kill you, thus i see red and you dont. makes perfect sence to me.. when your mining and make a can, its your can thus you see red when they steal from it.. its not your ship because you blew it up, it still has a owner.. now if you stole the ship before you blew it up its yours.. not even something to discuss imo, makes as mutch sence it can
Thread Winner Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.04.05 01:43:00 - [20] Originally by: eveplayer11 if you blow up my car its still my car.. i might not be able to drive it anymore but its mine. when you scavage it i want to kill you, thus i see red and you dont. Oh were playing the irl game eh? well unless your pockets are so fat that you can buy a car with cash its technically the Dealership/Financing Banks car You kill an NPC it dosen't give the guristas killrights on you it gives you a timer and a standing hit. You actually gain ownership of the can. Now what he is asking for is not total owner ship of the can but instead semi owner ship so he is able to defend that which he fought for. Now before you whip out the "OMG HAULER KILLER F*GS" argument. Think about it. Is that really so much to ask for? or are you logically blind since you like most people here have a vendetta against the privateers? Are the privateers that bad? The tutorial explicitly told you that you would not be safe unless you were docked. But well the forums shows how many people paid that any attention

Illyria Ambri Caldari	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:00:00 - [21] Originally by: Thread Winner Originally by: eveplayer11 if you blow up my car its still my car.. i might not be able to drive it anymore but its mine. when you scavage it i want to kill you, thus i see red and you dont. Oh were playing the irl game eh? well unless your pockets are so fat that you can buy a car with cash its technically the Dealership/Financing Banks car You kill an NPC it dosen't give the guristas killrights on you it gives you a timer and a standing hit. You actually gain ownership of the can. Now what he is asking for is not total owner ship of the can but instead semi owner ship so he is able to defend that which he fought for. Now before you whip out the "OMG HAULER KILLER F*GS" argument. Think about it. Is that really so much to ask for? or are you logically blind since you like most people here have a vendetta against the privateers? Are the privateers that bad? The tutorial explicitly told you that you would not be safe unless you were docked. But well the forums shows how many people paid that any attention Priv alt obviously... The OP is whining that he cannot have his cake and eat it too ------------ This is not War... This is pest control - Dalek Sek Happiness is a warm railgun, Love is a stocked missle launcher. Sexual extacy is watching that NME Battleship go boom. "Will i
Kyden Gallente Path of Light Hell Hounds	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:11:00 - [22] Griefers getting griefed? Damn thats awesome!!!
Blue Pixie	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:20:00 - [23] What did you expect? All the advantages of 0.0 and none of the disadvantages? That's the downside to warring in the relatively safety of high security space. Get over it, or get out of Empire.
Maglorre	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:37:00 - [24] Originally by: Thread Loser It is risk free, and damn funny. Fixed it for you
Dez Affinity Caldari Ore Mongers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:49:00 - [25] You just killed the guy, doesn't mean you own all his assets too. I posted this mentality in the other thread about this too. All his assets would be handed over to nearest sibling (or himself :S) if available, not to the guy who just brutally destroyed his ship and/or pod. Basically PvP was never meant for such large scale in high-security where so many people are active. If you don't get the guys loot, then unlucky, it was never yours in the first place. _______________
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2007.04.05 02:53:00 - [26] Originally by: Blue Pixie What did you expect? All the advantages of 0.0 and none of the disadvantages? That's the downside to warring in the relatively safety of high security space. Get over it, or get out of Empire. Even though I think 3rd party looting isn't 100% logical, that pretty well sums it up, doesn't it? * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
PleaseDon'tShoot	Posted - 2007.04.05 03:00:00 - [27] Edited by: PleaseDon''tShoot on 05/04/2007 02:57:10 Originally by: Barbarellas Daughter You knock down a grandma, she lies on the floor. Then another guy comes around and steals the money of the grandma. So you believe its your money that has been taken?? You, kind sir, have just won this thread, as well as all privateer whine threads from now on.
Tressia	Posted - 2007.04.05 03:07:00 - [28] adapt much?
Tolomea Gallente 5th Front enterprises New Eve Order	Posted - 2007.04.05 03:50:00 - [29] The saddest bit about this is that him and his friends are obviously incapable of appreciating the fact that the way he feels about loot thieves is damn close to how most of the rest of us feel about privateers. Thus they will never get why everyone hates them so much, they will never understand why eveyone laughs when they whine about loot thieves and they will never stop raising this same issue over and over again.
Dhaikin Lharoud Caldari Silent Solitude	Posted - 2007.04.05 04:03:00 - [30] Wow .... Miners are told that they should have a buddy hanging around to protect them, in case someone flips their can. You should have a buddy follow you around to loot your wrecks for you, problem solved DL



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