Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 [12] 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 20 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Mercenary Coalition
3171
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 20:49:03 -
[331] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote:Moon mining is not passive. So when you warp away or log off for the night, the moon harvester turns off? Income generation halts? |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2781
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 20:50:27 -
[332] - Quote
Common misconceptions ITT seem to revolve around the idea that individual players will be FORCED into mining by their alliance. This stems from the enshrined belief that moongoo = SRP. It doesn't; income = SRP. Moongoo is just one form of income. If your alliance is worth anything at all, they'll find new ways to fund SRP. If they can't, and SRP is important to you, consider a change.
Likewise, if your alliance tries to force you to mine, consider leaving. Democracy is omnipresent in Eve Online, but you have to vote with your feet, rather than with a ballot pen.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3914
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 20:59:07 -
[333] - Quote
Something I haven't seen addressed. Low sec alliances & defending their moon goo. While they certainly can shoot first, this will result in security status hits in low security space.
As a result (& for smoothing the road if any moon mining even if really inefficient in high sec) I propose that the field have an 'access list' and if you are not on that access list you get a suspect timer. This won't stop any ninja mining since someone still has to be there to shoot them anyway, but it means an alliance defending their refineries moon pull doesn't take sec status hits for doing so. |
Liira Savlin
Dominion Fleet Group
7
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 21:11:16 -
[334] - Quote
i wonder about the viability of prospect BLOPS fleets for moon mining with this operation. Is their yield too sh*t to be worth the effort, or would it be worth it for risk mitigation? |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3253
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 21:23:03 -
[335] - Quote
Querns wrote:Common misconceptions ITT seem to revolve around the idea that individual players will be FORCED into mining by their alliance. This stems from the enshrined belief that moongoo = SRP. It doesn't; income = SRP. Moongoo is just one form of income. If your alliance is worth anything at all, they'll find new ways to fund SRP. If they can't, and SRP is important to you, consider a change.
Likewise, if your alliance tries to force you to mine, consider leaving. Democracy is omnipresent in Eve Online, but you have to vote with your feet, rather than with a ballot pen.
Can't wait for people whining about mining CTA tho. We know it will happen in some corp/alliance. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2782
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 21:30:40 -
[336] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Querns wrote:Common misconceptions ITT seem to revolve around the idea that individual players will be FORCED into mining by their alliance. This stems from the enshrined belief that moongoo = SRP. It doesn't; income = SRP. Moongoo is just one form of income. If your alliance is worth anything at all, they'll find new ways to fund SRP. If they can't, and SRP is important to you, consider a change.
Likewise, if your alliance tries to force you to mine, consider leaving. Democracy is omnipresent in Eve Online, but you have to vote with your feet, rather than with a ballot pen. Can't wait for people whining about mining CTA tho. We know it will happen in some corp/alliance.
Probably true. Garbage organizations are everywhere.
oh shit we're in one right nooooow
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Obsidian Blacke
Oberon Confederation
2
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 21:49:53 -
[337] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Something I haven't seen addressed. Low sec alliances & defending their moon goo. While they certainly can shoot first, this will result in security status hits in low security space.
As a result (& for smoothing the road if any moon mining even if really inefficient in high sec) I propose that the field have an 'access list' and if you are not on that access list you get a suspect timer. This won't stop any ninja mining since someone still has to be there to shoot them anyway, but it means an alliance defending their refineries moon pull doesn't take sec status hits for doing so.
The rocks don't belong to their corp. You can't own a rock....man. |
Obsidian Blacke
Oberon Confederation
2
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 21:52:17 -
[338] - Quote
Leo Augustus wrote:
In either case, this is what I see. An effective end to the last scalable, profitable activity that doesn't require one plex a month per alt to scale up.
How so. You can still make a corp/alliance, do all the organizational work you want, and tax your members for passive income. :p |
Punctator
Shadow-Kill Aureus Alae
21
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:08:34 -
[339] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Something I haven't seen addressed. Low sec alliances & defending their moon goo. While they certainly can shoot first, this will result in security status hits in low security space.
As a result (& for smoothing the road if any moon mining even if really inefficient in high sec) I propose that the field have an 'access list' and if you are not on that access list you get a suspect timer. This won't stop any ninja mining since someone still has to be there to shoot them anyway, but it means an alliance defending their refineries moon pull doesn't take sec status hits for doing so.
eve should be more haotic not less it is because of the bunch of people wanting to control every aspect of this game - this game actualy sucks because they succed in thair plans completly. It must end or this game is dead, only a toy in hands of few very mighty people.
|
Fish Hunter
Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation
22
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:14:18 -
[340] - Quote
Punctator wrote:[quote=Nevyn Auscent]
eve should be more haotic not less it is because of the bunch of people wanting to control every aspect of this game - this game actualy sucks because they succed in thair plans completly. It must end or this game is dead, only a toy in hands of few very mighty people.
Yup better make it so max of 200 characters per alliance and fleet and lets do away with any kind of standings overlay outside of alliance. Lets make it so hard mechanically to blue anyone that nobody would want to. Then we'll have a chaotic EVE |
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:16:57 -
[341] - Quote
Fish Hunter wrote:Punctator wrote:[quote=Nevyn Auscent]
eve should be more haotic not less it is because of the bunch of people wanting to control every aspect of this game - this game actualy sucks because they succed in thair plans completly. It must end or this game is dead, only a toy in hands of few very mighty people.
Yup better make it so max of 200 characters per alliance and fleet and lets do away with any kind of standings overlay outside of alliance. Lets make it so hard mechanically to blue anyone that nobody would want to. Then we'll have a chaotic EVE
Fine by me; we have a workaround for no standings.
Why do you think CCP added the ability to set folks blue in the first place?
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Fish Hunter
Blacksteel Mining and Manufacturing Renaissance Federation
22
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:23:31 -
[342] - Quote
Querns wrote:
Why do you think CCP added the ability to set folks blue in the first place?
I do not know, always assumed coalitions in space |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:24:36 -
[343] - Quote
Fish Hunter wrote:Querns wrote:
Why do you think CCP added the ability to set folks blue in the first place?
I do not know, always assumed coalitions in space Nope.
https://eveinfo.net/wiki/index~25.htm
You can use a portrait pack to differentiate between hostiles and friendlies. Groups with a portrait pack have a distinct advantage over those without, so CCP added standings to even the playing field.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Punctator
Shadow-Kill Aureus Alae
21
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:32:10 -
[344] - Quote
Querns wrote:Fish Hunter wrote:Punctator wrote:[quote=Nevyn Auscent]
eve should be more haotic not less it is because of the bunch of people wanting to control every aspect of this game - this game actualy sucks because they succed in thair plans completly. It must end or this game is dead, only a toy in hands of few very mighty people.
Yup better make it so max of 200 characters per alliance and fleet and lets do away with any kind of standings overlay outside of alliance. Lets make it so hard mechanically to blue anyone that nobody would want to. Then we'll have a chaotic EVE Fine by me; we have a workaround for no standings. Why do you think CCP added the ability to set folks blue in the first place?
i dont think they predict how large player structures will become. I think they do same mistakes calculating titans costs and now we have tones of titans. Mittani and others "lords" are the REAL cancer of this game. This game is realy the only one i know when new players are so awefull harased by old and mighty. There cant be something new in eve, because old "lords" may lose thair position, so lets destroy all using big toys from passive income or total control of t2 market. This is what realy brings eve to stagnation. CCP is just stupid but they learned somethink so who knows it may change.
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:34:39 -
[345] - Quote
Punctator wrote:Querns wrote:Fish Hunter wrote:Punctator wrote:[quote=Nevyn Auscent]
eve should be more haotic not less it is because of the bunch of people wanting to control every aspect of this game - this game actualy sucks because they succed in thair plans completly. It must end or this game is dead, only a toy in hands of few very mighty people.
Yup better make it so max of 200 characters per alliance and fleet and lets do away with any kind of standings overlay outside of alliance. Lets make it so hard mechanically to blue anyone that nobody would want to. Then we'll have a chaotic EVE Fine by me; we have a workaround for no standings. Why do you think CCP added the ability to set folks blue in the first place? i dont think they predict how large player structures will become. I think they do same mistakes calculating titans costs and now we have tones of titans. Mittani and others "lords" are the REAL cancer of this game. This game is realy the only one i know when new players are so awefull harased by old and mighty. There cant be something new in eve, because old "lords" may lose thair position, so lets destroy all using big toys from passive income or total control of t2 market. This is what realy brings eve to stagnation. CCP is just stupid but they learned somethink so who knows it may change.
Link your freighter lossmail.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
FoxFire Ayderan
231
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 22:51:37 -
[346] - Quote
The way moon mining works sounds very cool.
|
RainReaper
RRN Assembly INC Nefatari Union
86
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:00:49 -
[347] - Quote
...oh...OHHHH!!! USG ISHIMURA BABY #necromorph-infestation #stomp-everything |
Sky Marshal
Core Industry. Blades of Grass
145
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:07:40 -
[348] - Quote
Querns wrote:zluq zabaa wrote: First, as I've shown you and you fail to find any counter-argument: Moon mining is not passive.
Today's moon mining is extremely passive. You do a thing once a month. Putting up buy orders and sell orders is not strenuous. I really wonder how you make it work for a month, because even with a Gallente tower, I don't manage to get this number. Depending of the reaction, it can go between 11 days to a month (if you are happy with *Carbide reactions)... But it will be inefficient because it means more towers for each reaction, so more fuel and so less profit.
And as you are in a big alliance, you can afford to fill the import silos fully. A small alliance or an individual would take too much risk to do that, fill more than a week of raw products could be really dangerous because any attack would mean a big amount of ISK lost.
With a standard Caldari duo, you get more money because less fuel. But you need to go back each 4 days to retrieve the final reaction, as the silos can't store more than that. And if you don't want to take too much risks, one week of raws maximum.
So it is not so passive that you claim. It is passive for goons (and other big alliances).
Rowells wrote:zluq zabaa wrote:Moon mining is not passive. So when you warp away or log off for the night, the moon harvester turns off? Income generation halts? If we follow this logic, market orders are passive income. CCP should nerf them. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:14:05 -
[349] - Quote
Sky Marshal wrote:Querns wrote:zluq zabaa wrote: First, as I've shown you and you fail to find any counter-argument: Moon mining is not passive.
Today's moon mining is extremely passive. You do a thing once a month. Putting up buy orders and sell orders is not strenuous. I really wonder how you make it work for a month, because even with a Gallente tower, I don't manage to get this number. Depending of the reaction, it can go between 11 days to a month (if you are happy with *Carbide reactions)... But it will be inefficient because it means more towers for each reaction, so more fuel and so less profit. And as you are in a big alliance, you can afford to fill the import silos fully. A small alliance or an individual would take too much risk to do that, fill more than a week of raw products could be really dangerous because any attack would mean a big amount of ISK lost. With a standard Caldari duo, you get more money because less fuel. But you need to go back each 4 days to retrieve the final reaction, as the silos can't store more than that. And if you don't want to take too much risks, one week of raws maximum. So it is not so passive that you claim. It is passive for goons (and other big alliances). Rowells wrote:zluq zabaa wrote:Moon mining is not passive. So when you warp away or log off for the night, the moon harvester turns off? Income generation halts? If we follow this logic, market orders are passive income. CCP should nerf them.
Reactions are not the same thing as moon mining.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
3914
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:23:57 -
[350] - Quote
Obsidian Blacke wrote: The rocks don't belong to their corp. You can't own a rock....man.
And nowhere have I said that they 'own' the rocks. The problem is without people going suspect they take a standings penalty for shooting someone to protect something they made. Because at the end of the day the asteroids for moon mining are actually player made. They put up a structure, keep it fueled & defended in order to get the field.
So they should be able to defend it without being penalised with standing losses in low sec for shooting ships. All the suspect status does is eliminate the standing penalty, well, and stop people fleeing into high sec and suddenly becoming immune 2 seconds later. |
|
RainReaper
RRN Assembly INC Nefatari Union
86
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:27:06 -
[351] - Quote
...Hmmm after reading the dev blog. I have to say that I like the fact that you are making moon mining active mining with spawnable asteroids.
HOWEVER!
As far as I could see this structure... is prety much WORTHLESS in highsec and wormhole space other than it having... Slightly better refining when it's using refining rigs?
Unless it get some kind of use other than refining in high/WH space I dont think ANYONE is gonna use them there.
Which makes me IMMENSLY sad cause the drilling platform was the structure I looked forward to the most with its... Enriched material harvesting gameplay??? Sadly highsec wont be seing ANY of that gameplay... If only it was possible to have it spawn (Rare) ores in areas like highsec/WH space... Guess not... Gonna have to pass on this one... |
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1695
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:30:02 -
[352] - Quote
Quote: 32. Rumor mongering is prohibited.
Rumor threads and posts which are based off no actual solid information and are designed to either troll or annoy other users will be locked and removed. These kinds of threads and posts are detrimental to the wellbeing and spirit of the EVE Online Community, and can create undue panic among forum users, as well as adding to the workload of our moderators.
Removed a post and those quoting it for the above reason.
If you have any Reasonable belief a CSM, ISD, GM, and or a DEV is abusing their position, please file a support ticket Game Play support -> Rules and Policies -> Game Masters and ISD or you can email security directly.
ISD Max Trix
Lieutenant
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
|
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.23 23:30:49 -
[353] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Obsidian Blacke wrote: The rocks don't belong to their corp. You can't own a rock....man.
And nowhere have I said that they 'own' the rocks. The problem is without people going suspect they take a standings penalty for shooting someone to protect something they made. Because at the end of the day the asteroids for moon mining are actually player made. They put up a structure, keep it fueled & defended in order to get the field. So they should be able to defend it without being penalised with standing losses in low sec for shooting ships. All the suspect status does is eliminate the standing penalty, well, and stop people fleeing into high sec and suddenly becoming immune 2 seconds later.
You know, you finally had an idea that I agree with. I think that CCP should allow lowsec refinery havers to shoot thieves without a security status penalty. Keying it to the ACL works great.
I fear that it won't happen, though; it's a tall order, technically speaking.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Hilti Enaka
State War Academy Caldari State
129
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:14:22 -
[354] - Quote
Slept on it read more and still a no for me. This is the gayest change ever to Eve. How anyone can be happy at needing to mine is beyond me. I personally manage reaction towers and i don't think this change is going to make the game exciting if anything it just made a dull activity even duller apart from a cool GIF showing a piece of moon being tractor beemed out of a planet. I mean WTF is that really the best Fozzie and the devs can come up with? |
zluq zabaa
Inhumanum Legionis LowSechnaya Sholupen
33
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:18:46 -
[355] - Quote
Rowells wrote:zluq zabaa wrote:Moon mining is not passive. So when you warp away or log off for the night, the moon harvester turns off? Income generation halts?
So would you say taking a dump is active or passive? You press really hard and then relax and let gravity work for you... passive? Once you hit and release the flush and then the water and suction will do the rest... passive?
What about AFK Mining, AFK Ratting?
If you give me - in my R16 example - 200M for warping a few systems, getting fuel, warping back, fueling pos, waiting 10 minutes, taking goo, hauling goo to market, selling goo. Is it less passive then in your eyes if the Goo would be created once a month in 10 minutes when I am actually there?
There are things that require more or less activity, different kinds of activity, but they all do. There is no passive income. If in your personal view hauling, selling and caring about infrastructure is less active than flying a ship to (x,y,z) in space and start your auto-targeting something, well it might just be that you judge to your own preferences. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:21:46 -
[356] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote: There is no passive income.
Today's moon miners work while you're logged out. It's passive income.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Sky Marshal
Core Industry. Blades of Grass
145
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:39:33 -
[357] - Quote
Querns wrote:Reactions are not the same thing as moon mining. Oups sorry you are right, I thought I read reactions, my bad. Last time I check forums this late...
In an another note, I don't understand why the devblog mentions that some ice products will be required for reactions in the future. If it is really to compensate for the lower global fuel consumption, why not simply make the refinery modules use a big amount of fuel per hour ? If it remains like this, this requirement can help to reduce the impact on the price of ice products, but not for PI products who will go down. |
zluq zabaa
Inhumanum Legionis LowSechnaya Sholupen
33
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:44:27 -
[358] - Quote
Querns wrote:zluq zabaa wrote: There is no passive income.
Today's moon miners work while you're logged out. It's passive income.
If you qoute me be fair enough to quote my entire text in which I explain why it is not passive.
Again: If you shoot a rat and it does not die immediately while you press your button, but you have to wait for your guns to cycle a few times - in your logic that would be passive income. Same for market orders, as someone else said: you would consider them passive income as well. As soon as you need to do something in order to get something, you are not passive.
But I understand that you neither can or want to follow up on that logic, because you just repeat the very same thing over and over again without being able to counter argue. You've made your point often enough, you're not interested in discussion. Please stop spamming, thanks. |
Querns
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2783
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:48:22 -
[359] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote:Querns wrote:zluq zabaa wrote: There is no passive income.
Today's moon miners work while you're logged out. It's passive income. If you qoute me be fair enough to quote my entire text in which I explain why it is not passive. Again: If you shoot a rat and it does not die immediately while you press your button, but you have to wait for your guns to cycle a few times - in your logic that would be passive income. Same for market orders, as someone else said: you would consider them passive income as well. As soon as you need to do something in order to get something, you are not passive. But I understand that you neither can or want to follow up on that logic, because you just repeat the very same thing over and over again without being able to counter argue. You've made your point often enough, you're not interested in discussion. Please stop spamming, thanks.
You're splitting hairs for no gain. Moon mining is passive income. It just is.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
3253
|
Posted - 2017.03.24 00:49:16 -
[360] - Quote
zluq zabaa wrote:Querns wrote:zluq zabaa wrote: There is no passive income.
Today's moon miners work while you're logged out. It's passive income. If you qoute me be fair enough to quote my entire text in which I explain why it is not passive. Again: If you shoot a rat and it does not die immediately while you press your button, but you have to wait for your guns to cycle a few times - in your logic that would be passive income. Same for market orders, as someone else said: you would consider them passive income as well. As soon as you need to do something in order to get something, you are not passive. But I understand that you neither can or want to follow up on that logic, because you just repeat the very same thing over and over again without being able to counter argue. You've made your point often enough, you're not interested in discussion. Please stop spamming, thanks.
If I shoot a rat and it does not die and then I log off, it will not die alter. Your moon mining will still gather resources until it is full even if you get in a coma for a full week and can't log back in. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 [12] 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .. 20 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |