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Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 02:58:00 - [1] Almost everyone (except the isk farmers) wants to see some sort of nerf for cloaks. I don't think making it possible to scan cloaked ships is the right solution. Instead it should be made so that they can't just stay cloaked forever. The idea: - Cloaking devices now require fuel to operate. (I suggest heavy water.) - Activation of the cloaking device uses around 80 - 100 fuel. - After activation the cloak uses 1 fuel per minute. - This only applies to the prototype and improved cloaks. The specialized covops cloak should not be changed. This would mean your average battleship might be able to cloak around 8 times before running out of fuel. If he cloaked only once, he could stay cloaked for around 10 hours. Fuel costs could be adjusted for smaller ships, but I think it would be easier to just add small, medium, large, and x-large cloaks to the game. (Quickly written while trying to probe a raven.) --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.25 03:57:00 - [2] I will summon the waaaaaambulance for you! I'm not an isk farmer and I don't want it nerfed. I think someone teased you in local too much and you got upset you couldnt find them and came here.
Empero Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 04:03:00 - [3] Edited by: Empero on 25/05/2007 04:03:07 Your nerf is too complicated. Easiest way would be that: (Cyno gen. like) Activation timer i.e. 300 seconds, than 60sec penalty till you can turn it on again. Or just remove local ;-) Edit: typos --
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Academy Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.05.25 04:29:00 - [4] Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 04:32:38 Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 04:27:56 NO NO NO Let me expand a bit-after all-you are BoB and should know better. You are a covops/recon pilot trying to set up a drop for your wingmen. You bust the safe spot (Raven in this case) and are approaching and maneuvering to set the drop. Suddenly the kitchen timer dings when you are 25km off target--"Oh **....I need to go get a barrel of water and chuck it into my cloak...oh crap...decloaked". What if this had happened while your covops pilot was bagging "Steve"??? Enough already "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the ** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Lore Isander Caldari The League of Legitimate Nigerian Businessmen	Posted - 2007.05.25 04:29:00 - [5] /signed
xenodia Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2007.05.25 04:52:00 - [6] Originally by: Shinigami Almost everyone (except the isk farmers) wants to see some sort of nerf for cloaks. I don't think making it possible to scan cloaked ships is the right solution. Instead it should be made so that they can't just stay cloaked forever. The idea: - Cloaking devices now require fuel to operate. (I suggest heavy water.) - Activation of the cloaking device uses around 80 - 100 fuel. - After activation the cloak uses 1 fuel per minute. - This only applies to the prototype and improved cloaks. The specialized covops cloak should not be changed. This would mean your average battleship might be able to cloak around 8 times before running out of fuel. If he cloaked only once, he could stay cloaked for around 10 hours. Fuel costs could be adjusted for smaller ships, but I think it would be easier to just add small, medium, large, and x-large cloaks to the game. (Quickly written while trying to probe a raven.) Better than most of the cloak nerf ideas out there. As long as cov ops and force recons had a bonus to negate fuel use id be fine with it.
Taran Summers The Merovingians	Posted - 2007.05.25 05:04:00 - [7] Ooooh ooooh. If we have to fuel our cloaks. I think we should get a little buff for it. Lets say we can use strontium to allow us to FIRE WHILE CLOAKED. WOOOOOT. Buff for a nerf. I think thats fair.
E Vile Caldari	Posted - 2007.05.25 05:11:00 - [8] Nerf Nerfing crybabies! Nerf this nerf that....gimmie some cheese with that whine "The key to immortality is to first live a life worth remembering." Shohadaku New York Metal
Anaalys Fluuterby Caldari	Posted - 2007.05.25 06:04:00 - [9] Sure, you can nerf cloaks when we get all those dedicated ships and cloaks for things OTHER than harrassing 0.0 alliances who should know better. For example: Where is my dedicated exploration vessels that would get a bonus to Astrometrics, Hacking and Archeology. And would have to have a cloak to survive extended time in deep space since its offensive power is non-existant. Right now if you plan on doing any exploration with a non-cloaked ship you are a sitting duck to anyone wandering through.... I say nerf local so it doesn't show cloaked ships. That way they won't bother you. <-----------> Factional Warfare: The LowSec wars which never happened.
Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:46:00 - [10] Originally by: RuleoftheBone Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 04:36:55 Did you get the Raven?? No I landed 10km away from him when the huge lag spike hit. He logged out and I spent 5 minutes trying to deactivate my cloak to launch a probe. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots

Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:49:00 - [11] Originally by: Taran Summers Ooooh ooooh. If we have to fuel our cloaks. I think we should get a little buff for it. Lets say we can use strontium to allow us to FIRE WHILE CLOAKED. WOOOOOT. Buff for a nerf. I think thats fair. I wouldn't be against that as long as there was a "distortion" in the cloak. This would allow the other player to spot the cloaked ship (visually) and move in close enough to decloak it. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
Brutus Proqqus	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:49:00 - [12] i dont support these nerf threads but i do wanna make a suggestion. The only right way to nerf the cloak if it even if it needed a nerf in the first place is: Make it like with the warfare link stuff. Give it insane CPU requirements and give covops ships and stealth bombers and other ships that are really build for the cloak a -99% in CPU Needs for Cloaks. Like the battlecruisers have with the warfare links.
justcheckingthemarket	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:52:00 - [13] i say nerf anoying pussies that aint got nothing better to do than whine!
Cold Senthen	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:54:00 - [14] Edited by: Cold Senthen on 25/05/2007 07:53:50 Ok you have nice ideas to change something! But only change the prototype cloak! Cause Recon ships are a bit like Stealth Bombers. And i dont like the fuel thing. Coverts (or Recons) have no cargo - probes AND fuel? No... :)
Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 07:59:00 - [15] Originally by: Empero Edited by: Empero on 25/05/2007 04:03:07 Your nerf is too complicated. Easiest way would be that: (Cyno gen. like) Activation timer i.e. 300 seconds, than 60sec penalty till you can turn it on again. Or just remove local ;-) Edit: typos I wouldn't be against removing local, but your other suggestion does not help the cloaking problem very much. In fact it makes the cloaks completely worthless in pvp. The idea is to limit their ability to live in hostile space, but not to nerf it's use for other activities. Right now you can have cloaking ravens safely ratting 2 jumps from your base. There is absolutely nothing you can do because they are able to safe spot and cloak before you can even activate your warp drive. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
Billy Hardcore	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:05:00 - [16] Edited by: Billy Hardcore on 25/05/2007 08:04:56 I have no solution to this, allthough I do agree that cloaks in their current form are overpowered. Especially a prototype cloak hardly gimps your ability to PvE, with only a 30 cpu requirment, while making you impossible to kill for other players. There's tons of corpless ISK farmers everywhere in 0.0 sovereign space. These people cannot be forcefully removed from these systems simply because they just save and cloak up the moment anyone enters local. 0.0 is about the tradeoff between risk and reward. But with the current cloak spamming there's no risk. It's all reward. The opposite happened when the Privateers brought 0.0 to empire; no-one was safe. I really believe that this is the other way around, and that this cannot be ignored.
Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:11:00 - [17] Edited by: Shinigami on 25/05/2007 08:09:44 Originally by: Billy Hardcore Edited by: Billy Hardcore on 25/05/2007 08:04:56 I have no solution to this, allthough I do agree that cloaks in their current form are overpowered. Especially a prototype cloak hardly gimps your ability to PvE, with only a 30 cpu requirment, while making you impossible to kill for other players. There's tons of corpless ISK farmers everywhere in 0.0 sovereign space. These people cannot be forcefully removed from these systems simply because they just save and cloak up the moment anyone enters local. That's right, but with my idea they would be forced to refuel after several cloaks. This would mean travel or bringing in fuel with another ship. Either way they would at least become vulnerable at some point in time. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
RuleoftheBone Minmatar Veto. Academy Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:18:00 - [18] Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 08:17:29 Originally by: Shinigami Originally by: RuleoftheBone Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 04:36:55 Did you get the Raven?? No I landed 10km away from him when the huge lag spike hit. He logged out and I spent 5 minutes trying to deactivate my cloak to launch a probe. Ravens are like Dorito's.....they always make more...and I like mine wet, raw, and wrigggglings . Seriously though-you do get my point I presume regarding "Steve"? "Lead Me..Follow Me..Or get the **** out of my way" General George Patton USA
Lorn Yeager Gallente Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:22:00 - [19] Everytime I have hunted isk-farmers, ninja ratters and family... they have just logged off. Nerf THAT before you nerf the cloak. Cloak is not a problem. He cant hurt you. He cant steal your epeen. He can only look at you.
Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:27:00 - [20] Originally by: Lorn Yeager Everytime I have hunted isk-farmers, ninja ratters and family... they have just logged off. Nerf THAT before you nerf the cloak. Cloak is not a problem. He cant hurt you. He cant steal your epeen. He can only look at you. Ya but he has to login again at some point. When he does that's another 100 fuel he has to spend. Alternatively you could just make the aggression timer for logging off count for npcs too. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots

Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 08:28:00 - [21] Originally by: RuleoftheBone Edited by: RuleoftheBone on 25/05/2007 08:17:29 Seriously though-you do get my point I presume regarding "Steve"? That's why I said that the Covert Ops cloak should not be changed. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.25 09:01:00 - [22] Looks like a perfect idea to me. Doesn't nerf covops, recons (stealth bombers should be included too), stops continual use of cloaks by ships that aren't really designed to use them. Up till now i've just ignored the macro ratters that have a program to warp off and cloak as soon as somebody enters local, however this is a nice and effective nerf to them and nobody else. sgb
Shirow Miyazaki Amarr I.Z.U Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.25 09:10:00 - [23] ....OR, instead of whinging about cloaks and how awful they are, how about have ALL cloaks with a huge cpu fitting, and give ships that are meant to use them a CPU reduction bonus. This way we get rid of people afk-ing in battleships but keep speciality cloaked ships as they are, instead of nerfing them for people who have blatantly never been near a cloak or a ship meant to use them.
Shinigami Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 09:15:00 - [24] Originally by: Shirow Miyazaki ....OR, instead of whinging about cloaks and how awful they are, how about have ALL cloaks with a huge cpu fitting, and give ships that are meant to use them a CPU reduction bonus. This way we get rid of people afk-ing in battleships but keep speciality cloaked ships as they are, instead of nerfing them for people who have blatantly never been near a cloak or a ship meant to use them. You obviously didn't read my entire post. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
Jenesti	Posted - 2007.05.25 10:20:00 - [25] Why not delete all modules and ships expekt one of them so everyone have the same fitting and ship.. ? THATS BALANCING !
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.25 10:34:00 - [26] Originally by: Jenesti Why not delete all modules and ships expekt one of them so everyone have the same fitting and ship.. ? THATS BALANCING ! I was just quoting the following post in the titan thread and thought I would bring it to your attention: Originally by: CCP Abathur Thank you for a well written and detailed post. Such efforts are noticed and appreciated by the Dev Team. We're well aware of the importance of many of the issues you describe and they are under heavy discussion almost daily as Kali 2 gets closer and closer. Threads such as this one are a great help in identifying specific issues that need more of our attention. Rest assured, we are paying attention. There are always problems in a constantly-evolving game such as eve. You are fairly obviously unaware of the need for constant balancing, however like it or not, it is present. Threads such as this one are an excellent way for people to present well-thought out ideas (or not) to the community at large, giving the devs the ability to peruse them at their leisure. Please refrain from posting idiotic comments in such threads in future. sgb
Marcus Alkhaar Conisor Excavations Syndicate Antagonistic Assembly	Posted - 2007.05.25 10:34:00 - [27] Off-topic: stop derailing the thread, thank you. try to be even remotely constructive if you want to post On-topic: nice Idea, good sir Death God . It wouldnt nerf haulers using cloaks either. with an agression from belt rats lasting 1-2 minutes it would totaly wipe out those macro-ravens ratting 0.0 systems. ------------------ Might Aswell Train Another Race Idiot
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.25 10:37:00 - [28] Originally by: Marcus Alkhaar Off-topic: stop derailing the thread, thank you. try to be even remotely constructive if you want to post On-topic: nice Idea, good sir Death God . It wouldnt nerf haulers using cloaks either. with an agression from belt rats lasting 1-2 minutes it would totaly wipe out those macro-ravens ratting 0.0 systems. No such thing as agro from belt rats, however it would severely hurt macro-ravens as they would be unable to go afk for longer periods of time without knowing if they had enough fuel for their cloaks. sgb
fire 59 Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.25 11:17:00 - [29] Edited by: fire 59 on 25/05/2007 11:16:34 Edit - Bah, reading comprehension for the win BoB vs the coalition of family values
smallgreenblur Minmatar Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.05.25 11:20:00 - [30] Heikki the whole problem of afk macro-ratters is that they are, well, afk. If they log off every time somebody comes into system they will not be able to carry on ratting easily, wheras those people actually paying attention to their computers will. Have I missed something? sgb



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