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CCP Inc v. SomethingAwful LLC

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Ammoina University of Caille	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:30:00 - [151] Originally by: Anille Kole If you have a transcript of the petition, that'd be nice. However, as far as I know, there is none, so the wording is entirely up for question. If I knew one way or the other, I'd post to match, but I feel as though my wording was appropriate based on the general feel of the first wave of posting. The first 'wave' of posting was a single, polite, to the point, post. That got smacked down. The 'second wave' is undoubtedly what you are referring to yes?
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:31:00 - [152] lulz @ goonswarm thinking they are so important that they are worth a law suit! Why would CCP even bother? Nice lawyers letters to the sites that broke they story, formally requesting a retraction, or at least appending the story with their investigations outcome. That is probably as far as it goes. Still, the thought of this conversation makes me feel good: CCP: If we banned all of the members of a single organisation within our game, would we be opening ourselves up to legal action? Lawyers: No. It's your game. You can refuse anyone's business at any point. CCP: * CLICK * Serious Business indeed... The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Ammoina University of Caille	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:38:00 - [153] If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR.
Megadon Caldari Deathshead Inc.	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:47:00 - [154] Originally by: Ammoina If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR. yeah riiiight, CCP bans Goons for being ****** smacktards, the repercussions would last like a whole..... DAY.
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:47:00 - [155] Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/05/2007 00:46:41 Originally by: Ammoina If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR. I think we have a different definition of bad PR. I'd like to see toasted bees, m'self. //Maya
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:50:00 - [156] I can see the headlines now CCP VOWS TO MAKE EVE BETTER, STARTS BY TAKING OUT THE TRASH
The Beast Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.05.31 00:51:00 - [157] TBH ban every account that has something to do with Goons and lets enjoy the game! They have done nothing but complain about stuff. STFU already. Seriously STFU! "If God Posted His Second Coming Here I Would Ban His Ass For Being Off Topic ! :)"
Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:01:00 - [158] Originally by: Maya Rkell Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/05/2007 00:46:41 Originally by: Ammoina If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR. I think we have a different definition of bad PR. I'd like to see toasted bees, m'self. Because you know, $45k/month of income is something a corporation like CCP is going to just shrug off... --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:02:00 - [159] peanuts _________________ Burn.
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:08:00 - [160] Originally by: Hllaxiu Originally by: Maya Rkell Edited by: Maya Rkell on 31/05/2007 00:46:41 Originally by: Ammoina If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR. I think we have a different definition of bad PR. I'd like to see toasted bees, m'self. Because you know, $45k/month of income is something a corporation like CCP is going to just shrug off... Greater good of everyone else, and the people who'd otherwise quit. Cheap. //Maya

Mogrin Caldari Spartan Fleet Systems	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:19:00 - [161] Originally by: Avon lulz @ goonswarm thinking they are so important that they are worth a law suit! Why would CCP even bother? Nice lawyers letters to the sites that broke they story, formally requesting a retraction, or at least appending the story with their investigations outcome. That is probably as far as it goes. Still, the thought of this conversation makes me feel good: CCP: If we banned all of the members of a single organisation within our game, would we be opening ourselves up to legal action? Lawyers: No. It's your game. You can refuse anyone's business at any point. CCP: * CLICK * Serious Business indeed... Did you like.. read anything in that blog? _______________ Rokh vs. Hyperion
Mogrin Caldari Spartan Fleet Systems	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:26:00 - [162] Oh and looks like CCP won't have been the first to threaten legal actions. http://www.somethingawful.com/d/legal-threats/ _______________ Rokh vs. Hyperion
Maya Rkell Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:30:00 - [163] Originally by: Mogrin Oh and looks like CCP won't have been the first to threaten legal actions. http://www.somethingawful.com/d/legal-threats/ Why are you linking SA? EveGoons \| SA. Do try and keep up. Please! //Maya
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:31:00 - [164] according to that sight, they HAVENT threatenened to sue, omgdramabomb
Caios Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:34:00 - [165] it's about time someone set a precedent that this kind of griefing isn't something you kekeke about. I'm no lawyer, but between defamation and trespass of chattels, CCP has a pretty good shot. 1st amendment defense can be responded to by the fact that what was being done was not so much speech as it was standing on someone's lawn with a defamatory sign-something that is NOT protected. might be tricky to determine whether breach of duty occured, since it can be argued that SA can't be responsible for the actions of its users. there's no possibility of a countersuit, at least one that's related to the spamming incident. donno about the whole dev thing though; that would be a stretch, methinks.
Cyan Nuevo The Blackguard Wolves	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:38:00 - [166] Haven't read the thread, so someone else might have linked already, but here goes. Libel ---
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:41:00 - [167] Yes, Perhaps they're just talking big, thats what BoB usually do. It would be pretty hilarious for them to sue on the basis that goon are trying to ruin their game and reputation, im sure in their defense the goons law team would have to get access to all of CCP's records.. there are some internal ISD forums from long ago that i wouldnt mind getting my hands on. But then again. They've probably disappeared by now. I particularly like the part about ruining CCP's reputation, they did have a good reputation... once... before "t20, like t2 only free!" came out. And the subsequent cover up and months of denial... Why would ANYONE in their right mind who doesnt have the memory of a goldfish ever trust you again CCP?
umop 3pisdn Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:47:00 - [168] Originally by: Megadon Originally by: Ammoina If they did do that... the resulting storm would be so gigantic CCP would never recover from the bad PR. yeah riiiight, CCP bans Goons for being **** smacktards, the repercussions would last like a whole..... DAY. Goons are smack tards now? Goons are weird to be sure, but anyone who hangs around SA or even 4chan can "understand" them. BoB on the other hand... holly **... the foulest smack in the game comes out of their camp. CCP wants to keep taking goons money. What they dont want is people like Kugu trying to uncover corruption within the ranks of CCP (call him a hacker if you like, but did he hack anything of CCPs? unless you consider the bob forum CCP's property...) Goons DDOS the forum? You know if you dont lock their threads constantly and just directed them towards a thread about Nate Hammertown and a few others they wouldnt keep spamming new ones. But of course, if its not about bob, it gets locked in COAD.
Aramova Gallente Middle Finger Technology Ghosts Syndicate	Posted - 2007.05.31 01:48:00 - [169] Eh, What back lash. This is all over the social news sites, Digg...Slashdot...Broken Toys... People are siding with CCP on this. The low life leadership of the Goonies have ruined it for their members. Quote: Goons have a long and storied history of stirring things up. As a poster on somethingawful.com said, Quote: To be quite honest I donÆt really put it past the Mittani (Goonfleet leader), moral scruples are not in his job description. Broken Toys Discusses the world Vs. Goon A great link, a great post, lots of information. Mattani is renowned for his underhanded bull. No body going to cry on Goon's side in this, except for goonie alts. -- Get the feeling SomthingAwful is going to happen to Mattani?
Shark Diver Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2007.05.31 02:38:00 - [170] Edited by: Shark Diver on 31/05/2007 02:41:56 Originally by: This Pilot The first accusations were dismissed and silenced until the raging horde of goons and others made it impossible to cover up. The subsequent investigation showed that yes indeed a CCP employee was in fact cheating, by his own admission. So, when a new accusation was dismissed and silenced involving some of the same entities from the first accusation, who would you believe? Logic dictates you assume the action was repeated. That's like reasoning like this: I never saw a man die. Therefore all men are immortal. So, it's an argument based on past experiences, while a so-called logic argument is more along these lines: I am human. All humans are mortal. Conclusion: I am mortal as well. Also note that it does not matter at all if 'I am human' and/or 'All humans are mortal' are true. Nonetheless from those assumptiones follows the conclusion. -> Logic can us help with reasoning but it only takes ONE assumption to be false to invallidate our conclusion.

Imager GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.05.31 02:39:00 - [171] Originally by: Aramova Mattani is renowned for his underhanded bull. No body going to cry on Goon's side in this, except for goonie alts. Oh Mattani and goonies.
DiuxDium Free Mercenaries Union FATAL Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.31 02:51:00 - [172] Edited by: DiuxDium on 31/05/2007 02:52:47 Originally by: umop 3pisdn Goons are smack tards now? Goons are weird to be sure, but anyone who hangs around SA or even 4chan can "understand" them. BoB on the other hand... holly **... the foulest smack in the game comes out of their camp. CCP wants to keep taking goons money. What they dont want is people like Kugu trying to uncover corruption within the ranks of CCP (call him a hacker if you like, but did he hack anything of CCPs? unless you consider the bob forum CCP's property...) Goons DDOS the forum? You know if you dont lock their threads constantly and just directed them towards a thread about Nate Hammertown and a few others they wouldnt keep spamming new ones. But of course, if its not about bob, it gets locked in COAD. 4chan in its current state is just a bunch of 12-15 year olds pretending to be "hardcore" by spamming the same silly things they've heard from those before them but don't understand. The same can be said about SA. The community has degenerated to almost complete filth, if you don't believe me, take a look at the FYAD archives. Compare what was to what is, and you'll understand. The 'good' members of the community were simply smothered underneath the 70k new members who refuse to lurk. But this has nothing to do with eve, now does it. e; my post reads like a bitter :00: post, which is good, because it fits. ** new people. ------------- [En] - So....I think the devs don't like me.
Caios Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:16:00 - [173] Edited by: Caios on 31/05/2007 03:22:06 Edited by: Caios on 31/05/2007 03:17:10 If CCP can demonstrate loss of revenue both directly and proximatley caused by Goon's actions, they have a case for Trespass of Chattels a la compuserve v. cyberpromotions (might have been aol v. cyberprom, forgot). Doesn't matter what prompted the actions, doesn't even matter if CCP secretly launders isk for BoB and everything that was said was true. What matters is not what was said, but how it was said. CCP, as a private organization has every right to censor its own forums, whereas Goons' act of spamming those forums is in no way protected or legally excusable. The only question would be whether any party that CCP can take action against can be held liable for the spambomb, whether it's SA, Goon leadership or individual goonies. Looking back, I think defamation is actually a longshot for CCP. Defamation, libel or slander is something that the defendant must know for a fact is false. Unless it can be proven that the Goonies knew for a fact that their accusation was untrue, CCP doesn't have much to go on. I think this caveat really only applies to plaintiffs who are public figures, but it certainly makes sense. It's not defamation unless it's lying with the intent to harm reputation. (Bob Dunne FTW)
Phoebus Athenian Gallente KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:17:00 - [174] Wake up call for the goonz... nobody will take them seriously from now on... at least in this sphere ;) ---
Elspeth Vigneron Caldari Phoenix Logistics Industries	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:24:00 - [175] Originally by: WhitePhantom Eve does no contain sports nor gambling, so does the RICO apply to Eve exactly? CCP does not offer gambling of any kind, other plays might offer it, but CCP could end that very easily if that was an issue that was brought up. Please provide proof how RICO effects CCP who is in another country. I really hope RICO isn't some screwed up American Act, because I really hate those organizations.... Edit I thought RICO was an Organization like RIAA. RICO in a nutshell: Quote:** Under RICO, a person or group who commits any two of 35 crimesù27 federal crimes and 8 state crimesùwithin a 10-year period and, in the opinion of the United States Attorney bringing the case, has committed those crimes with similar purpose or results can be charged with racketeering. Those found guilty of racketeering can be fined up to $25,000 and/or sentenced to 20 years in prison. In addition, the racketeer must forfeit all ill-gotten gains and interest in any business gained through a pattern of "racketeering activity." Racketeering activity means: * Any act or threat involving gambling, murder, kidnapping, arson, robbery, bribery, extortion, dealing in obscene matter, or dealing in a controlled substance or listed chemical (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act), which is chargeable under State law and punishable by imprisonment for more than one year; * Any act which is indictable under a wide variety of specific provisions of title 18 of the United States Code relating to bribery, counterfeiting, theft, embezzlement, fraud, obscene matter, obstruction of justice, slavery, racketeering, gambling, money laundering, commission of murder-for-hire, etc. * Any act which is indictable under title 29, United States Code, section 186 (dealing with restrictions on payments and loans to labor organizations) or section 501 (c) (relating to embezzlement from union funds), * Any offense involving fraud connected with a case under title 11 (except a case under section 157 of this title), fraud in the sale of securities, or the felonious manufacture, importation, receiving, concealment, buying, selling, or otherwise dealing in a controlled substance or listed chemical (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act), punishable under any law of the United States, * Any act which is indictable under the Currency and Foreign Transactions Reporting Act, * Any act which is indictable under the Immigration and Nationality Act, section 274 (relating to bringing in and harboring certain aliens), section 277 (relating to aiding or assisting certain aliens to enter the United States), or section 278 (relating to importation of alien for immoral purpose) if the act indictable under such section of such Act was committed for the purpose of financial gain, or * Any act that is indictable under any provision listed in section 2332b (g)(5)(B); law. Now you have an idea about RICO. For the life of me I don't know why people are flinging it around. CCP didn't commit a crime. And it's hard to see where they committed any kind of tort. The EULA, which they so conveniently ignored in regarding Section 8A in their defense of Sharkbait and the POS issue, is pretty broad in asserting their intellectual property rights and just how few rights, if any, we the consumers actually have. Phoenix Logistics Industries
Taerenius Caldari	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:25:00 - [176] This is the first time I've gotten involved in any political post on the forums but I just thought I'd say a few things. A) It's hilarious how EVERYONE suddenly becomes a lawyer when something like this pops up - people who have a law background that ONLY includes what they've read on wikipedia talk like they've been a professional lawyer for 10 years. B) CCP has a great game, the fact that anyone would smear them just because things aren't going "their way" just speaks volumes about the type of person(s) they are C) Before this incident I just thought goonswarm was fairly ******** and annoying but could just be ignored. I have quite a few friends in goonswarm (its hard not to since theres so many of them). At this point though I'm just disgusted, I hope all my friends that are in Goonswarm will leave, and I hope Goonswarm will disintegrate as they don't even deserve to be an alliance anymore (nor does goonfleet deserve to be a corp). Of course CCP won't forcibly do it because that would make them look bad, but I just hope the bad publicity against GS now is enough to make their members flee in droves. D) On the bright side, this will probably BOOST most people's trust in CCP which I'm sure is the exact opposite of what the GS members wanted so something good came of this. I know my faith in how the game is being run has been boosted just by reading the blog since this incident.
Caios Caldari Unified Refining Federation Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:41:00 - [177] Originally by: Taerenius A) It's hilarious how EVERYONE suddenly becomes a lawyer when something like this pops up - people who have a law background that ONLY includes what they've read on wikipedia talk like they've been a professional lawyer for 10 years. Nothing wrong with that if it's true. Didn't look at wiki myself, just trying to remember the **** I learned last semester. After seeing the wording in the wiki, though, I'ms starting to suspect my proff's the one who's writing them. More likely all lawyers think alike.
Diana deVos	Posted - 2007.05.31 03:44:00 - [178] Originally by: Imperator Jora'h Originally by: Loyal Servant CCP - think that one over a minute. That does nothing but embolden people, and make more rise up against you. Take a hint: let it die. Calling your lawyers then TELLING your customers that your calling your lawyers on them is just going to insight them against you. Not to mention you have virtually no case. Eh? I'm ready to start a CCP Legal Aid Fund for them. I hope they do find sufficient reason to go after these people. It is getting tiresome where people are emboldened by internet anonymity and feel their actions have no repercussions or consequence. Not even counting their reputations a lot of people work for CCP. Apparently it does not concern these people that they are messing with other people's livelihoods and doing so in a callous and craven manner. If they are so convinced of CCP bad intetions and despise company so much then they are free to cancel their accounts. You mean like when you butcher legal concepts for which it is clear you have no understanding or training and insult others who have demonstrated a greater, albeit, layman's grasp? Including jurisdictional differences within the international community. The irony is a 684 HP Perfect Wrecking Shot.
Thull Arcannon	Posted - 2007.05.31 04:12:00 - [179] What a bunch of malarky. I happen to be a lawyer, although this kind of law is not my specialty. The goons have no legal recourse, whatsoever. Any countersuit they would file would be laughed out of court. Have to love the clueless posting nonsense. There is nothing here but a smoke screen by the goons. Hope they are sweating it out.
Imperator Jora'h	Posted - 2007.05.31 04:50:00 - [180] Edited by: Imperator Jora''h on 31/05/2007 04:49:24 Originally by: Diana deVos You mean like when you butcher legal concepts for which it is clear you have no understanding or training and insult others who have demonstrated a greater, albeit, layman's grasp? Including jurisdictional differences within the international community. Prove me wrong or STFU. Everything you just said is a lot of arm waving, ad hominem crap.



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