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CCP FIX FREIGHTERS

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B Glorious	Posted - 2007.09.25 03:39:00 - [151] Edited by: B Glorious on 25/09/2007 03:39:51 At first I thought this thread was a necro, but anyways: You can't give freighters lowslots because then you would be able to put on cargo expanders and possibly get your cargo bay above 1,000,000m3, which is large enough to hold a carrier. That would allow hauling capital ships into high-security empire space, which should not be allowed, and therefore isn't an option. Freighters are not supposed to be able to protect themselves. They are supposed to be effectively helpless. You are supposed to protect your freighter because they can haul such a huge amount of stuff. They do not need midslots or dronebays or anything. What they SHOULD do is normalize the cargo capacities of freighters, because the differences do really make it pretty unbalanced. You need freighter IV or V to carry a Capital Ship Assembly Array in a Fenrir and Providence (I can't remember which exactly) while a Charon can do it with Freighter I. That's dumb. Either make CSAA's take up less volume or increase the cargo bays of all but the Charon. edit: I see somebody mentioned the capital ship transport thing already. Yeah well I didn't feel like reading the thread, so there
Admiral Pelleon Caldari White Shadow Imperium Burning Horizons	Posted - 2007.09.25 04:04:00 - [152] When is the last time you saw a container ship with flak cannons and armor? ________ "It's a good day to die!"
Ademaro Imre Caldari Eye of God	Posted - 2007.09.25 04:23:00 - [153] Originally by: Marcera Quote: I mean ITS A FREAKIN CAPITAL SHIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No it is not, does not need cap skill As for to fix them, there is a thing called have ship defending it Why do Freighter then require the Capital Ship Construction skill to build them? And one of the Freighters require at least 156 Capital Construction Components to build. And a Freighter is not a capital ship?
Captian Internet Lead Bricks	Posted - 2007.09.25 04:29:00 - [154] Originally by: Ademaro Imre Originally by: Marcera Quote: I mean ITS A FREAKIN CAPITAL SHIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No it is not, does not need cap skill As for to fix them, there is a thing called have ship defending it Why do Freighter then require the Capital Ship Construction skill to build them? And one of the Freighters require at least 156 Capital Construction Components to build. And a Freighter is not a capital ship? No because it can fit through star gates Changes to Local,War ,Navigation Shortcuts
III LightBringer Okkelen Grave Robbers	Posted - 2007.09.25 10:15:00 - [155] does oiltankers have armor? Does a cargoplane have missiles? Just make every freighter need 10 shield harnders / 10 armor hardners of each type to build, along with 1 damage control, and buff the resists with 30% on shield / armor and 50% on structure... Maybee boost the shields with 25k and the armor by 50k, and the suicide ganks should be even more expensive... It will still be 'soloable' in a couple of HAC/BS/commands if cought in lowsec / wartarget without escort, but not quite so gankable...
Vateh Omen Industries	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:33:00 - [156] It seems like the issue with freighter began when they began to drop loot. This cause the gank squads to begin to take down freighters. Instead of giving freighters slots, or banning them to low security space, the easiest solution seems to reverse the changes that made the freighters targets in the first place by removing the loot dropped by frieghters or just make freighters drop metal scraps and no cargo. This would solve the problem with the lowest amout of impact on the game
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:35:00 - [157] Originally by: Admiral Pelleon When is the last time you saw a container ship with flak cannons and armor? OK lets see 1940's Q-ships and liberty ships to name a few .. Tho I wish we could keep RL out of this , this is a game and my post was about an unbalanced ship.
Steve Hawkings	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:35:00 - [158] Theres nothing wrong with it, It was always inte4nded to drop loot.
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:37:00 - [159] Originally by: Vateh It seems like the issue with freighter began when they began to drop loot. This cause the gank squads to begin to take down freighters. Instead of giving freighters slots, or banning them to low security space, the easiest solution seems to reverse the changes that made the freighters targets in the first place by removing the loot dropped by frieghters or just make freighters drop metal scraps and no cargo. This would solve the problem with the lowest amout of impact on the game Not a bad alternative.
Adaris D-L	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:40:00 - [160] I don't understand why Freighters don't have drones to defend themselves with/fighters. Surely (in rp terms) given the amount of ganks there have been freighter engineeers see the damn need to include this. Also, why should they not have more effective anti-warp scrambling technology aboard? Its common sense to have them built in. The only thing that should stop them warping off is being bumped (another thing that should be fixed i.e. bumping causes dmg to bumper/some dmg to bumpee) and the new mass addition module. *******

zilllii Squirrel Power	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:46:00 - [161] sure fix freighters with some mids and lows but the drawback then would be that their cargospace shrinks to 10k cargo. omg we got that already in industrials and Transports. -------------------------------------------------- Originally by: Flinx Evenstar Love the new need for speed initiative. Pilots involved in a fleet battle can post on the forum and get a reply about wha
Adaris D-L	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:55:00 - [162] The don't need module slots. I have no problem seeing the aspect of 'Uber m3 proportional to Risk', but I would like to see some re-thinking about their defences by ccp. *******
Naruto Hunter Maza Nostra oooh Shiny	Posted - 2007.09.25 12:58:00 - [163] Originally by: Par Bobot GO fly a freighter 20-25 jumps each way in high sec every other day, and see how many friends tag along after 2 weeks. Try setting up camp for freighters with valuable cargo every other day, see how many friends tag along after 2 weeks.
Wideen Resurrection R i s e	Posted - 2007.09.25 13:25:00 - [164] If people want better survivability on the freighters and the other half of people don't want to add any slots - how about we just make it tougher? This toughness could come in the form of better resists for instance, which would allow CONCORD to show up and do their thing, hence allowing for a greater chance of surviving a high-sec gank. As for low-sec, you're screwed without escort, as it should be. Originally by: P'uck I know somebody who heard somebody say that an Osprey defeated Chuck Norris. Twice. Need I say more?
343conspiracy43345	Posted - 2007.09.25 15:04:00 - [165] Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics?
MasterEnt	Posted - 2007.09.25 16:28:00 - [166] Freighters are made to require support, get some
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 16:52:00 - [167] Originally by: MasterEnt Freighters are made to require support, get some AAAAH another contribution of 0%
Captian Internet Lead Bricks	Posted - 2007.09.25 16:54:00 - [168] Originally by: Adaris I don't understand why Freighters don't have drones to defend themselves with/fighters. Surely (in rp terms) given the amount of ganks there have been freighter engineeers see the damn need to include this. Also, why should they not have more effective anti-warp scrambling technology aboard? Its common sense to have them built in. The only thing that should stop them warping off is being bumped (another thing that should be fixed i.e. bumping causes dmg to bumper/some dmg to bumpee) and the new mass addition module. Half assed role playing makes for bad game mechanics Changes to Local,War ,Navigation Shortcuts
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 16:59:00 - [169] Edited by: Par Bobot on 25/09/2007 17:01:56 Originally by: 343conspiracy43345 Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics? Let me ask, have you ever flown one alt? in 0.0 that helps but still a dread could warp in on you after you jump in and lock you before you get a chance to align for warp. Scouts?? in high sec whats he gonna do?? "look out boys theres a hauler by the gate , might be a ganker scout" scans you bumps you enough till the gang arrives.. logoofski?? "boys someones in this .9 system log" Point is ship needs to be balanced by adding slots?? or buffing shields.. FFS my drake has 4x the shields. Friends cannot agro gankers , unless a war taget in empire, so no help there .
Captian Internet Lead Bricks	Posted - 2007.09.25 17:14:00 - [170] Originally by: Par Bobot Edited by: Par Bobot on 25/09/2007 17:01:56 Originally by: 343conspiracy43345 Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics? Let me ask, have you ever flown one alt? in 0.0 that helps but still a dread could warp in on you after you jump in and lock you before you get a chance to align for warp. Scouts?? in high sec whats he gonna do?? "look out boys theres a hauler by the gate , might be a ganker scout" scans you bumps you enough till the gang arrives.. logoofski?? "boys someones in this .9 system log" Point is ship needs to be balanced by adding slots?? or buffing shields.. FFS my drake has 4x the shields. Friends cannot agro gankers , unless a war taget in empire, so no help there . No tank what so ever also the ancient art of Pre repping eludes you perhaps? but having 1 logistics ship there to pre rep can extend your lifespan to give you those crucial seconds needed for survival Changes to Local,War ,Navigation Shortcuts

Kolwrath Amarr	Posted - 2007.09.25 17:48:00 - [171] Edited by: Kolwrath on 25/09/2007 17:50:06 I can't belive I am going to post in this thread but oh well. I would like to point out too all those who say bring friends, fly in a gang, use a battlecruiser with support mods, blah, blah blah: Well to be blunt none of you realise the raw DPS of a high sec gank squad. If they are big enough, they are unstoppable. Period. Proper squads are hitting 1000 DPS or more since they need to pop the freighter before Concord shows up. Thats ONE THOUSAND DAMAGE PER SECOND minimum. A logistics ship or two, a massive gang of WTFBBQ gang mates, or heck all of BOB combined is not going to be able to save the freighter. It will pop in under 30 seconds. You might get a lock on one of the gankers before the freighter pops, and perhaps blow up that one out of the 15-20 or more gankers before the freighter goes, but thats all you can hope to accomplish at best. There is no chance of survival for the freighter, so please drop this point. More ships on your side will not protect a freighter. All they can do is try and protect the wreck. Thats it.
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.25 17:52:00 - [172] Edited by: Tortun Nahme on 25/09/2007 17:52:08 all you need is one industrial to follow you and scoop your cargo, then the gank squad loses everything make ganking unprofitable and they will stop 1987.08.31 00:29:09 Combat Your Smooth Criminal perfectly strikes Annie, wrecking for A Crescendo.
Dristra Amarr Shadows of the Dead Aftermath Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.25 18:04:00 - [173] A few slots, like one high, one medium, and a few low, a nerf to cargo space, and there you have it. The lows can be used for cargo expanders, or some sort of structure tank. without cargo expanders, the cargo hold suffer, with the best ones, it will haul more than before. It's great being Amarr isn't it.
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 19:21:00 - [174] Originally by: Captian Internet Originally by: Par Bobot Edited by: Par Bobot on 25/09/2007 17:01:56 Originally by: 343conspiracy43345 Do you guys not understand the importance of scouts, warp to zero, and logoffski tactics? Let me ask, have you ever flown one alt? in 0.0 that helps but still a dread could warp in on you after you jump in and lock you before you get a chance to align for warp. Scouts?? in high sec whats he gonna do?? "look out boys theres a hauler by the gate , might be a ganker scout" scans you bumps you enough till the gang arrives.. logoofski?? "boys someones in this .9 system log" Point is ship needs to be balanced by adding slots?? or buffing shields.. FFS my drake has 4x the shields. Friends cannot agro gankers , unless a war taget in empire, so no help there . No tank what so ever also the ancient art of Pre repping eludes you perhaps? but having 1 logistics ship there to pre rep can extend your lifespan to give you those crucial seconds needed for survival Sorry but not all production corps have several highly skilled command pilots if any at all..
Tassadar Beta Amarr BIG Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:02:00 - [175] Edited by: Tassadar Beta on 25/09/2007 20:02:37 Freighters do not need fixing in my opinion, I won't state why because the OP will just blindly say no that what I state actually means they should be boosted. If you think they need fixing go make a well constructed post in the ideas section of the forum, instead of an unconstructive rant. I read this thread and I was really disappointed . But I don't think you will make a well constructed post, because you are too busy reading what people post and interpreting it in whatever way you want so it supports your argument. Which in the end will simply turn this thread into a flamefest and no-one will actually listen to you, because you're just whining and not suggesting something balanced/constructive in the correct section of the forums.
Cornucopian Gallente Orias Fringe Enterprises United Freemen Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:28:00 - [176] Originally by: Tassadar Beta Edited by: Tassadar Beta on 25/09/2007 20:02:37 Freighters do not need fixing in my opinion, I won't state why because the OP will just blindly say no that what I state actually means they should be boosted. If you think they need fixing go make a well constructed post in the ideas section of the forum, instead of an unconstructive rant. I read this thread and I was really disappointed . But I don't think you will make a well constructed post, because you are too busy reading what people post and interpreting it in whatever way you want so it supports your argument. Which in the end will simply turn this thread into a flamefest and no-one will actually listen to you, because you're just whining and not suggesting something balanced/constructive in the correct section of the forums. you ACTUALLY read 6 pages of whines and flames? dont do that to yourself on a regular basis man, or ill be posting 'can I have your stuff' far to soon in your farewell thread. These threads KILL people you know. ----------------------------------------------- "post with your main. delete your alt, you sad little exploiting metagamer." Originally by: Royaldo complete win by Cornucopian!
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:36:00 - [177] unless you have forum warrior 4 trained you simply dont have the resists to tank them 1987.08.31 00:29:09 Combat Your Smooth Criminal perfectly strikes Annie, wrecking for A Crescendo.
Cornucopian Gallente Orias Fringe Enterprises United Freemen Alliance	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:44:00 - [178] Originally by: Tortun Nahme unless you have forum warrior 4 trained you simply dont have the resists to tank them QFT alas, I suffer from an extended training time on lvl1 'dont try to derail obvious GD whines' My char is unequipped to pass these moans by. ----------------------------------------------- "post with your main. delete your alt, you sad little exploiting metagamer." Originally by: Royaldo complete win by Cornucopian!
Par Bobot	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:44:00 - [179] Originally by: Tassadar Beta Edited by: Tassadar Beta on 25/09/2007 20:02:37 Freighters do not need fixing in my opinion, I won't state why because the OP will just blindly say no that what I state actually means they should be boosted. If you think they need fixing go make a well constructed post in the ideas section of the forum, instead of an unconstructive rant. I read this thread and I was really disappointed . But I don't think you will make a well constructed post, because you are too busy reading what people post and interpreting it in whatever way you want so it supports your argument. Which in the end will simply turn this thread into a flamefest and no-one will actually listen to you, because you're just whining and not suggesting something balanced/constructive in the correct section of the forums. NO I would like your opinion as to why they dont need to be fixed. If I knew exactly what needed to be done I'd have put it there but did so here for open debate
Tortun Nahme Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.09.25 20:45:00 - [180] sounds like your "eyes glazing over" implant needs an upgrade 1987.08.31 00:29:09 Combat Your Smooth Criminal perfectly strikes Annie, wrecking for A Crescendo.



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