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Kiyoshi Aphelion
The League of Shadows Dogs of War.
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:07:00 -
[391]
If this happens I'm so quitting Eve. I didn't spend almost a year and a half training to fly a mom and get screwed like this.
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Cynthia Lynn
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Posted - 2007.10.23 17:46:00 -
[392]
If you do this all my work on skills for the carrier and all my money to buy it, you'll turn it into nothing more than a wimpy hauler.
This is by far the most stupid, thoughtless, and just plain ******** idea I've seen you "brains" at CCP come up with so far.
This may be the straw that broke this camel's back I'll tell you, I can't stand they way you "balance" the game, opps I mean RUIN the game. You're ruiners. CCP with your nerfs you're the worst griefers in the game. |
marakor
Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers
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Posted - 2007.10.23 18:50:00 -
[393]
Why not leave em alone and build a capital hauler cos thats how carriers seem to be going ffs.
The opinions that i give are the opinions of my corp although my alts opinions may differ as this |
Mundem Pashdale
Serenity Prime Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:20:00 -
[394]
Edited by: Mundem Pashdale on 23/10/2007 19:21:54 I've played this game for a while; I've flwn my Thantos for a while. I HATE fighters. They're a great way to loose loads of ISK. Fighters need fixing, as do carriers. NOT nerfing. Logistics platform? Great. I can live with that. But that's now what you sold them as when they where first released and you've just made many of us waste a year or so of skill trianing for a glorfied logistics ship that's a great big liability on the battle field. For the love of sanity, THINK AGAIN!
Awsume sig. hope you don't mind I copied it!
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IC Wiener
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Posted - 2007.10.23 19:50:00 -
[395]
Edited by: IC Wiener on 23/10/2007 19:52:07 Edited by: IC Wiener on 23/10/2007 19:51:44 i just have the picture of the funny flash video in my head where you could see how apocs got nerved and instead of guns it had a stick and bananas.
tbh that idea just goes into the wrong direction. like often said. with this price this skill requirements and all that stuff that you need to produce one it should be somehow a bit better than the normal t1 junk. and compared to its size ect it should be able to kill a BS to defend itself. just try it out. a carrier with 5 fighter drones cant in any way defend itself against a couple of good skilled BS pilots which give each other armor rep or shield when they get the 5 fighters attacking them. and with a couple i dont mean the common 50man gang.. i mean like under 10.
edit: if you want to nerf carrier and motherships "improve" the great fighter/drone AI a bit more and fighters will killing each other... problem solved...
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Gar Ddhen
Gallente Mining Bytes Inc. D-L
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Posted - 2007.10.23 20:41:00 -
[396]
I am for this in a way... but before something like this is implemented then some considerations to have to be taken into account, and some problems fixed... and they really do need to be fixed either before or at the same time you implement such a change.
First is lag, this really does have to go, it is hard enough to do anything in a lagfest, but to ask Carrier pilots to assign and reassign fighters as well as control their own and lay down their logistical support with current lag is a bit much.
Second is the drone interface panel and gang communication, most guys in PvP will be on voice coms of some sort, but the carrier pilot still needs to find the recipient of assigned drones in order to do the assigning. Not easy during a fight when you have to scroll through chat or gang window. Maybe some sort of broadcast would help? The drone interface and AI is, to be blunt, crap, so that needs sorting out, sooner rather than later. The other point some of these folks have mentioned is that they need some way of automatically recalling their fighters if the assigned pilot is dropped,logs off, warps out, jumps or is podded. The point is, if you are going to make a carrier pilots life more complex you have to give him or her the tools in which to manage that increased complexity.
Logistics modules, I took a Thanatos out on Armageddon day... and to be honest the range and cap use of the various capital logistics modules shocked me. If you want these ships to be fleet support ships you have to address several problems here.
First targetting, its too slow unless you are in Triage... which as far as I know is broken as Ewar still works (correct me if I am wrong here). Lock time is critical in a logistics role as you often have to switch target several times in a fight, and even with multitasking at 3 or 4 chances are you will have to drop targets to switch to your new primary support, or you get hit by a jam cycle. Related to this is the problem that carriers can only maintain 6 locks, definately not enough for a ship CCP envisages in a logistics role. It is also unrealistic to expect carriers to enter triage every time they entered a fight even if triage mode worked as intended as often a certain degree of mobility is required.
Second, cap use is way too high for the logistics modules, triage doesnt really address it either, while there is a good cap reduction there is also a massive reduction in cycle time which in essence brings cap use right back up. These ships need some kind of bonus to the amount of cap they are using so they can at least run 2 or 3 of those capital logistics mods for a decent amount of time and not have to fill tanking slots with cap rechargers or cap power relays. Maybe a level based drop like that of the logistics ships?
Third... range! Sorry... CCP want these as Heal your gang mates ships? Yet my Oneiros can do the job with no cap issues at TWICE the range? Buff the range, 150 km for capital logistics modules, possibly 200, make them worth taking out in that role. At least the cycle time of the capital logistics mods are fine :)
I am of two minds about how the fighter thing is, I think there are pluses and minuses to this 'nerf'. I think the best way to solve it personally is to ensure that fighters use the bonus of their owner not their controller, that is to say they fight with the bonuses of the carrier pilot who owns them, not those of the pilot to whom they are assigned. I would also like to see more fighter classes... ECM, Logistics, etc, there is more than one way of defending your ship than just using pure DPS. If the purpose of this is really to nerf Moms in low sec and nothing else, then I am afraid I agree with the 0.0 only option applied to Supercaps.
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Darahk J'olonar
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.10.23 20:56:00 -
[397]
Edited by: Darahk J''olonar on 23/10/2007 20:57:39
Originally by: Niffetin
Originally by: Lazarus Telraven Replying to all of your "cap blobs renders all other ships useless," CCP already fixed the cap blob, its called a System Cyno Jammer, forcing you to get a nice BS fleet and go attack their DeathStar POS before you can jump your cynos in, and honestly a support fleet can melt a carrier without any trouble
Fighters + web = DEAD
What about lowsec? What about people who drop 2-3 Carriers in lowsec on just a Battlecruiser? (Trust me, these aint rare..) What if the victim/his corp isnt strong enough to do anything about it? How lame is that?
Frickin Capital-Ships-Online...
What about it? YOU DIE! Get used to it. Space is a cold hard place and if you're in the wrong place at the wrong time, oh well.
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Julius Rigel
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:23:00 -
[398]
Pffh, we should nerf titans a bit more, every time I run into one in my Velator I just know I won't stand a chance. I mean, come on, give us new players a chance here, I mean, it took a whole lot of effort on my part to get those inital 800k skillpoints! So why should someone who has merely been playing for two years be able to oneshot me just because they've put a little more time and effort and money and not to mention effort into getting their little Avatar?
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Gallen Cross
Gallente The Holy Hand Grenades of Antioch
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:32:00 -
[399]
OMG... if this ever goes through ill just quit. ________________________________________________
I am not smart enough to make a sig, nor do I care... Why am I even putting this here? |
Djbugs
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:37:00 -
[400]
If this ever happend i am sooooo quiting the game it will just destroy the whole point in having a carrier that is just bs all of my friends and corp m8s in eve have said the same thing
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Rassad
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Posted - 2007.10.23 21:45:00 -
[401]
If CCP is serious. They should allso drop the price of Fighters to 10mill. And Drop Carrier price to 600mill Mothership to 1bill
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Alexiares
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:04:00 -
[402]
tbh reducing the amount of fighters away from a carrier is like chopping a males "special parts" away, it wouldnt be able to make love to other carriers or motherships, and that will just kill the carrier population..........not to mention i wont want a carrier if i cant drop 14 fighters
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AirWalker
Amarr Galactic Response Team
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:13:00 -
[403]
Edited by: AirWalker on 23/10/2007 22:13:49
Originally by: Alexiares tbh reducing the amount of fighters away from a carrier is like chopping a males "special parts" away, it wouldnt be able to make love to other carriers or motherships, and that will just kill the carrier population..........not to mention i wont want a carrier if i cant drop 14 fighters
alex you're making cutting you down too easy its sad
and carriers need real lovin....and no glovin
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Secure Container
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:24:00 -
[404]
it seems that they want carriers & moms to be sitting in pos force field & assigning fighters... but i seem to remember ccp refering to ppl using these stragys for gang bonuses on the titan.. something about "if they dont want to risk there assests like real men"
vid
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Anjoulina
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:28:00 -
[405]
Carriers and other capitals are tech 1. They SHOULD be sucky.
6 months from now ccp will release tech2 capitals... basically what capitals are right now before the nerf. Should extend players' subscriptions eh?
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Mundem Pashdale
Serenity Prime Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:36:00 -
[406]
Gar Ddhen, I recon you realy said it. If they want to make this change, which in SOME ways is ALMOST sensible, they need to fix some issues first, so people are happy with the change. Forcing people to waste SPs and then use semi-broken systems instead is not good for the community
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Lilan Kahn
Amarr The Littlest Hobos Insurgency
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Posted - 2007.10.23 22:36:00 -
[407]
Originally by: Anjoulina Carriers and other capitals are tech 1. They SHOULD be sucky. quote]
You mom.
I am just as construktive as you!
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Kumq uat
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Drunken N Disorderly
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Posted - 2007.10.23 23:12:00 -
[408]
This is what I hope happened.
Zul: Hey guys! man, I am so excited to get started on the game developing. This is awesome!
Dev: Yeeeeeah. Hey, we need you to do something. We got this idea and we figure you can introduce yourself and post about it in the forums.
Zul: Sure guys! Whatever you want!
Dev: That's great. Always glad to see happy co workers. Allright, now here is what we want...
Dev2: (Snickers)
Dev: Go on there, post your intro, and also post about this change we are going to make to carriers and motherships.
Zul: (Reads) Ummm, are you sure...
Dev: You do want to be on the dev team right?
Zul: Of course!
Dev: Then suck it up, get on there, and make the post.
Zul: Right, allright, thanks guys. (Goes off to make post)
Dev2: OMG! What a newb!
Dev: Can't believe he actually fell for that.
(Devs then take out a fifth of vodka and a blunt) www.eve-pirate.com author and goat molestor.
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Galaxyes
Omega Enterprises Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2007.10.23 23:21:00 -
[409]
i still find it amusing that people cry about how they die in 0.0 and low sec.... did you forget the sign the first time you jumped into low sec and 0.0? oh gno its dangerous..... you may die here.... simple as that... motherships should not be able to be killed by 2 torps btw i don't remember the idiot who said that but thats ********....
seriously if your going to nerf anything nerf lag.... there is to much lag it doesn't matter what you nerf cause you cant have a 50 vs 50 bs fleet fight without completely lagging out... or you cant have 10 caps attack a poss without lagging... forget about even engaging in a fleet fight at a poss... why cant you just fix some of your main infrastructure problems before fixing things that arnt broken
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longhhhh
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Posted - 2007.10.24 01:43:00 -
[410]
1 x90D name:Vitokaliffe 1x30D name:jiaokkr thanks
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NaRoaN
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Posted - 2007.10.24 01:49:00 -
[411]
We had a fleet of 20 or so ships the other day , few battleships and mostly BC or Cruiser, frigs... Killed 10+ battleships and 2 carriers they warped in towards the end..
SO once again carriers are not solo machines and frankly are worthless in up close combat and usually end up dead... Hence they do not need anything done to them because they are not to powerful
You want to change something?? ADD cpu to chimera
And fix the fighter so they actual work right
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NaRoaN
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Posted - 2007.10.24 01:52:00 -
[412]
CCP should run for President.....
Promises so much and never delivers.
Vote for Pedro
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Hyakuchan
Earth Federation Space Force
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Posted - 2007.10.24 01:52:00 -
[413]
Edited by: Hyakuchan on 24/10/2007 01:55:07
Originally by: Kumq uat This is what I hope happened.
You keep tellin yourself that. Denial is part of the coping process.
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Kumq uat
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Drunken N Disorderly
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Posted - 2007.10.24 02:00:00 -
[414]
Hey, I gotta have hope. www.eve-pirate.com author and goat molestor.
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LiQuiDCooL
Valiant Logistics Inc. EternalRising
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Posted - 2007.10.24 02:02:00 -
[415]
Originally by: Crohnx http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=512
Originally by: zulu Hi, Iæm Zulupark and recently transferred from the Quality Assurance department to the Game Design team. IÆve been with CCP for just under two years now and donÆt plan on going anywhere. Say hello to your newest balancer (I still haven't received a nerfbat though).
Iæm posting here now because the last few days weæve been looking at the way capital and supercapital ships are functioning on Tranquility, and to be honest weære a little concerned with the direction itæs taking.
What we want is pretty basic: We want to make fighter wielding capital ships more reliant on their support fleet and less of a direct nber deathbringer.
How are we going to do it?
Well, we have an idea, and before you go ballistic remember that this is an idea and weære still working on it:
We plan on changing the way fighters work, and have it so that you can still launch all the fighters you want (within limits of your ship/skills) but you can only directly control 5 of them at a time. That means that a carrier/mothership can launch 5 fighters, assign them to a gang mate, launch 5 more, assign them to another gang mate etc. etc.
This means you will NOT be able to launch 20 fighters from a mothership and send them all to incinerate a battleship in .2 seconds. It does however mean that you can assign 5 fighters to each of your lilæ friends in the fleet and send them forth to be the messengers of your burning fury.
Remember, weære not messing with the final total amount of fighters you can launch and delegate, just the amount you can control and delegate at a time. You can of course also launch 5 fighters and make them attack a target of your own choice, if it pleases you.
But wait! Thereæs more!
Not only do we want to limit the amount of fighters you can launch, but also the amount of drones! Yes, we want to limit carriers and motherships just like other ships, i.e. they should only be able to field 5 regular drones at any given time.
Thatæs it! No beer for you at Fanfest!
Awww man you can't let me run dry. But seriously, the reason we want to implement something like this is that we feel that capital ships are being used way too much as better-than-battleships-at-killing-stuff ships, when we in fact think that they should be used more as the-ships-that-keep-other-ships-alive-and-provide-them-with-additional-firepower ships. Did that make sense? Probably not, but anyway, we hope you get the gist the direction we want to move them in and the way we see that happening.
Remember that this is still just an idea and we want your feedback on this, so please, post constructively and you just might make a difference in the (EVE) universe.
oh and can u erase like 60mil of my skillpoints while ure at it so those 1 week old players can stop whining and play with people that are in here 3+ years , really wtf
I totally disagree with the change ccp is thinking of. this defeats their whole purpose and the reason why people send lots of isk and time training for them. the skillbook alone cost more than a dread. dreads take out carries like there a slice of butter i dont undertand why people are crying because they die all the time. they are not the ubar wtf pwn everything they require tactics like everything else. I fly a carrier and they are nice but not the uber wtf pwn everything. you should have to properly fit your fleet to take them out. they are specialized ships like everything else. and they require alot of training and skills and isk.
CCP is going to have alot of vertin player very upset with these changes especally those of us that been with this game since beta including me. LiQuiDCooL Vlinc baby! |
Vaughan
Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2007.10.24 07:57:00 -
[416]
nerfing carriers is simply madness - it would take the fun out of the game for me. Maybe it's time to find new interest anyway
Sod politics, Lets RIOT!!
I am 'Armourer
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judes23
The Silent Rage M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.10.25 23:26:00 -
[417]
men and women, boys and girls, CCP is STILL going to nerf our beloved carriers and motherships! WHY? we want them they way they are. So what if a player that has lower skillpoints cant kill a carrier by it self, you know, it should be like that. its almost time to boycott the game for a while until they unnerf it (i will boycott it when they finaly make the nerf)
save them, save your future |
judes23
The Silent Rage M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.10.25 23:54:00 -
[418]
hey guys, if this nerf goes out like CCP says, i say enmass boycott the game untill CCP unnerfs the carriers and motherships, the only real complainers are noobs on trail accounts.... i believe that CCP will make the right discouson, and hopfuly it will save them thousands upon thoasands of dollors
save them, save your future |
judes23
The Silent Rage M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.10.25 23:55:00 -
[419]
hey guys, if this nerf goes out like CCP says, i say enmass boycott the game untill CCP unnerfs the carriers and motherships, the only real complainers are noobs on trail accounts.... i believe that CCP will make the right discouson, and hopfuly it will save them thousands upon thoasands of dollors
save them, save your future |
General Xenophon
Caldari Infinite Improbability Inc Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2007.10.26 01:01:00 -
[420]
Edited by: General Xenophon on 26/10/2007 01:03:29 ARGH!
Props to CCP for taking back their bad idea, but still not real happy about the upcoming carrier / ms nerf. By the way, you do need to refit a carrier, in case you forgot there are better fittings for carriers in certain situations. Just thought you should know before you go nerfing something else........... ...... ... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= "Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men." - Boondock Saints |
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