Originally by: Mourn Navarre

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I'm not in game right now but I am pretty sure that it has 5 turrets on tranquility.

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Ok, so the EOS bonus to drone has been nerfed to oblivion : from 50m3/lvl, it is on Sisi, it is now 15m3/lvl. 250 at lvl 4.

On the plus side, it's base drone bay is now 150, so it's 210 at lvl 4. Not big of a nerf. But wait.

The bandwith has been set to 75. 75, that means 5 meds, or a bizarre mix of unbonused drones (2H, 2M and 1L). Ok.

And, now, looking closely, I see that it as lost TWO, not one, but TWO ******* TURRET HARDPOINTS!!! Only 5 out of 7.

Well? It was slightly overpowered, ok, now it is just pathetic. Please, CCP, if you don't want it to field 5 Heavy drones (without bonus), ok fine, but give us back our turrets! Or give us bonus like the myrm to drones...

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Compare the tanks too. Have you seen the monster tank on those ships? Now the Eos has a 5 slot tank (yay), no drones, no guns. It's not "inline", it's "reducing to worthlessness".

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:25
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:10

Originally by: Xao Wen

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Compare the tanks too. Have you seen the monster tank on those ships? Now the Eos has a 5 slot tank (yay), no drones, no guns. It's not "inline", it's "reducing to worthlessness".

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Uh? EOS has one of hardest tanks to *****, surely better than claymore (unless sleip faction fits), comparable to damnation (better in longer run). Only vulture has best fleet command tank.

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Originally by: Incantare

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Lol. About damn time it got rebalanced. It's a fleet command, not a field command, its role is to give bonuses not be a solo ship. Compared to the Damnation, Vulture and Claymore, the Eos was way out of line.

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Ok, so the EOS bonus to drone has been nerfed to oblivion : from 50m3/lvl, it is on Sisi, it is now 15m3/lvl. 250 at lvl 4.

On the plus side, it's base drone bay is now 150, so it's 210 at lvl 4. Not big of a nerf. But wait.

The bandwith has been set to 75. 75, that means 5 meds, or a bizarre mix of unbonused drones (2H, 2M and 1L). Ok.

And, now, looking closely, I see that it as lost TWO, not one, but TWO ******* TURRET HARDPOINTS!!! Only 5 out of 7.

Well? It was slightly overpowered, ok, now it is just pathetic. Please, CCP, if you don't want it to field 5 Heavy drones (without bonus), ok fine, but give us back our turrets! Or give us bonus like the myrm to drones...

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Yet again, those ships ALL have a 6 slot tanks. Now the Eos can't do ****. And stop with those pathetic DPS calculations, it's DPS is laughable with rail, and piloting a blasterboat is quite hard. It deserved the high DPS output. Well, no need to argue with Caldari fanboys, I'd be glad to hear from Gallente command ship pilots....

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Originally by: Aramendel

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And in exchange it has 1 more med slot for EW.
Its reduced tank does not come without an advantage.

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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now check damage from 3 ogres... 180 or so dps iirc. Plus 7 guns with 25% damage bonus = a lot. Compare it now to claymore/damnation/vulture. Now you should understand why eos is set BACK IN LINE with others.

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Originally by: Bellum Eternus

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:25
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:10

Originally by: Xao Wen

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Compare the tanks too. Have you seen the monster tank on those ships? Now the Eos has a 5 slot tank (yay), no drones, no guns. It's not "inline", it's "reducing to worthlessness".

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Uh? EOS has one of hardest tanks to *****, surely better than claymore (unless sleip faction fits), comparable to damnation (better in longer run). Only vulture has best fleet command tank.

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You're on drugs. Clearly you haven't actually flown any of the above ships.

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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now check damage from 3 ogres... 180 or so dps iirc. Plus 7 guns with 25% damage bonus = a lot. Compare it now to claymore/damnation/vulture. Now you should understand why eos is set BACK IN LINE with others.

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We just agreed it had 5 turret slots. With 5 ions, 3 ogres and a mag stab you get 490 dps. Great.

Now tell me why you would fly that ship over an Astarte? Any offers? It's tank is terrible. DPS is pitiful in comparison.

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Originally by: Aramendel

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Edited by: Aramendel on 23/10/2007 20:39:55

Originally by: Xao Wen

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Yay! We all know Ewar is great on Bboats. Painter? no. ECM? Unbonused, no. Damp? Close range : no. Tracking disrupt? You'll be far under optimal anyway... TBH that fifth midslot is completely stupid (as for the Hyperion).

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Actually 1 TD has a pretty noticeable effect at close range. It also reduces tracking significantly.

Mind you, it will not negate damage or anything near it but it will give you a bigger effect for your tank than a 6th lowslot would.
Unless you are standing still, that is. And no, being webbed is not the same thing.

Originally by: Mourn Navarre

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b) the change means you can actually have even more drone replacements so what DPS you have doesn't go all to hell when your drones are killed.

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In case of the Eos this isn't correct, it got actually now a good deal fewer replacements. In m¦ at least.

This is also about the only change which I find unreasonable with it though.

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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And why would you fly damnation over absolution? Dps pitiful in comparison, tank not much better (yeah its passive, you can AFK a while before you die, coz your damage wont save anyone anyways).

Eos is... FLEET command ship. Not "solopwnmobile" it was. Yeh it was cool to fly it, but it was WAY overpowered. Now its in-line with others.

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Originally by: Nicholas Barker

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i tackled somebody in the middle of nowhere, and told them i wouldn't leave untill they stripped on web cam. Who wants the video?

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Originally by: Meepie

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With Mediums, 450, with a mix 500.

The other Vulture and Claymore are both capabale of doing 500 dps with better tanks than the Eos, Damnation does 400 dps with a 750 tank or an insane passive hp tank.

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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Then there's the whole issue of the Eos having a bonus to a terrible gang bonus, but I've already covered that in my last post...

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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I JUST DID COMPARE IT TO OTHER FLEET COMMAND SHIPS. In the bit of the post you just hacked away. I was explainiig why dps isn't the important thing. Because it's a fleet command ship. And it's now underpowered at being a fleet command ship.

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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Now tell me why you would fly that ship over an Astarte?

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Quote:

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I even agreed it's dps needed nerfing. But heck, you're too ignorant to read a post through before flaming someone.

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:42:29
Because 6 slot shieldtank claymores are sooooooooooo useful for small roaming gangs. Yeah it can tackle or mwd away from enemy. Thats 8 slots. Web is also useful for tackling - already 9 slots. WTB 9 midslot claymore to fit 6 slot tank.

And if you sit with fleet you dont need tank anyways.

Same for damnation. Its passive tank... so what? It will sit there doing nothing till it dies. Over longer periods of time eos will tank much more than damnation + deal way more damage. EVEN after the nerf.

EDIT:
of if you seriously want "only tank" ship - go for passive shieldtank eos. Kkthxbye

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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now check damage from 3 ogres... 180 or so dps iirc. Plus 7 guns with 25% damage bonus = a lot. Compare it now to claymore/damnation/vulture. Now you should understand why eos is set BACK IN LINE with others.

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We just agreed it had 5 turret slots. With 5 ions, 3 ogres and a mag stab you get 490 dps. Great.

Now tell me why you would fly that ship over an Astarte? Any offers? It's tank is terrible. DPS is pitiful in comparison.

Now why fly it over another Gang Ship? It loses the 15% (max) bonus to a useful gang mod boost that the others get, it has another wasted bonus boosting a 150m3 dronebay when it can only 75m3 bandwidth, and it's tank is terrible. What are you going to do? Use it as a blaster ship, while using it as a gang boosting ship and perhaps at the same time use its drone bay for logistic purposes? Not to mention that it's tank will pop at any moment, which rather defeats the whole point of a Command Ship.

You're fixated on a number. DPS. Fleet Command Ships shouldn't be caring about dps. Balancing the dps and capabilities between them is fine. Eos needed a nerf to dps. But it also needed a boost to being an actual Command Ship. Instead its been nerfed even further.

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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You clearly compared eos to astarte. Asking why you would fly it over astarte. And astarte is FIELD command ship. So check what you post instead of smashing keyboard in blind fury.

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Originally by: Mourn Navarre

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I have actually used its gang bonus before. I had trained for it when I had decided to focus on ewar skills and I was a drone ship specialist so it only seemed natural for me. It works best with sensor damps in a gang of Celestis or Arazu/Lachesis. I always found the resist bonus ones the least useful. I had someone with max leadership skills while using my own hardeners, I was maybe getting an extra 1.2% resist from the gang leader. Gee, be still my heart. The bonus was ok without using my own resists but it was still uncomfortably low compared to using resistance modules.

The other thing about the Eos is that as a drone ship, you can always just use your the largest logistic drones to rep your gang buddies. Another useful ability that other command ships cannot take full advantage of.

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Originally by: Splagada

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SEED ME DADDY

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Originally by: Nicocat

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I am SO rubbing this in my friends' faces that trained exclusively for the Eos.

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Originally by: Snuggly

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It's just so great to have an actual reason to not die, incentive is fantastic!

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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With a mindlink and max skills, an armor resist gang mod should give every ship in your fleet approximmtely the equivalent of an extra EAN. Combine that with better armor rep (equiv of a T2 armor rate rig for example) and the tanks of the ships should be improving massively.

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Originally by: Jasai Kameron

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Yes, the Eos can boost EWAR ships, but that's only one part of your gang. So I think it's significantly less useful.

That's just my opinion. Obviously you disagree. Fair enough.

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Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Edited by: Horza Otho on 23/10/2007 21:27:02

Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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The ship is grossly overpowered when compared to other fleet command ships. This wasnt a nerf, it was a balance and it got what it needed. Fly an Astarte.

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Originally by: Kai Shinkachi

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Edited by: Kai Shinkachi on 23/10/2007 20:24:59
OMFG, what is it with you people!1!!11!!! Drone boats are not overpowered....

Why? Because drones are about as durable as paper... paper damnit! Hell most ships have the power to use 5 Light drones, send those after Heavy drones and watch what happens... ice cream dumped into the sun. Or better yet, people could think and bring a smart bomb with them. One blast, one wave of drones. Honestly people drones are not that powerful. They may have some hefty damage but they're sooooooo flimsy. So come on, at least let the Eos have 100 bandwith. It is a bloody command ship that takes NEAR 50 DAYS of training to get just on the Space ship command skills (stop rolling your eyes carrier/Dread pilots, i know that is not a long time for you). But honestly. The point of the Gallente drone boats is to be better than everyone else's drone boats. And now they have the same damn bandwith as other non gallente ships? So what is the point of being Gallente special ops then? (have picked that as my starter I always have used drones... the only weapon I ever used until L4s). So basically, being gimped at startup as Gallente by picking drones is even worse now! That Gallente cannot field more drones that are more powerful than everyone else? So we might as well just give everyone drone boats then...


EDIT: This rant is not just about the Eos, which if anything needing a Tanking nerf because it can tank a planet...

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Originally by: Acoco Osiris

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Originally by: Kai Shinkachi

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Edited by: Kai Shinkachi on 23/10/2007 20:24:59
OMFG, what is it with you people!1!!11!!! Drone boats are not overpowered....

Why? Because drones are about as durable as paper... paper damnit! Hell most ships have the power to use 5 Light drones, send those after Heavy drones and watch what happens... ice cream dumped into the sun. Or better yet, people could think and bring a smart bomb with them. One blast, one wave of drones. Honestly people drones are not that powerful. They may have some hefty damage but they're sooooooo flimsy. So come on, at least let the Eos have 100 bandwith. It is a bloody command ship that takes NEAR 50 DAYS of training to get just on the Space ship command skills (stop rolling your eyes carrier/Dread pilots, i know that is not a long time for you). But honestly. The point of the Gallente drone boats is to be better than everyone else's drone boats. And now they have the same damn bandwith as other non gallente ships? So what is the point of being Gallente special ops then? (have picked that as my starter I always have used drones... the only weapon I ever used until L4s). So basically, being gimped at startup as Gallente by picking drones is even worse now! That Gallente cannot field more drones that are more powerful than everyone else? So we might as well just give everyone drone boats then...


EDIT: This rant is not just about the Eos, which if anything needing a Tanking nerf because it can tank a planet...

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I'm going to point out a few flaws with your wall of text.
First-drones actually can take a fair bit of abuse before dying. If the drone controller is close to his drones, it is very difficult to kill the drones before they're scooped. Some ships (notably the Drake) can do it, but require a full volley on a single drone. Light drones sure would be nasty vs. heavy drones, but again, they can't kill the heavies before they're back with Mommy, unless Mommy's being an inattentive idiot.
Second-It takes several heavy smartbombs to pop a drone, and they are absolute cap hogs. If you fit to kill drones, guess what your entire role will be-oh, it'll be killing drones!
Third-Just because the Eos has been nerfed does not mean that the plethora of Gallente drone boats have been nerfed, or that the Gallente gunboats have lost their large drone bays.
Fourth-the Eos, despite having a good tank, doesn't have an ungodly tank.

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Originally by: Sandzibarr

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dont forget that rev3 will also bring in the new 'drones dont heal sheilds' feature once you scoop and release em..

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Originally by: shinsushi

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Originally by: Sandzibarr

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dont forget that rev3 will also bring in the new 'drones dont heal sheilds' feature once you scoop and release em..

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True, so that just means pre-emptively scoop/deploy your drones in combination with dampners. Really... how fast can another BS lock your drones with 2-3 damps on it?

Test it out with a friend, figure out a good amount of time, get used to it... then pretend nothing happened.

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Originally by: xHoodx

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Originally by: shinsushi

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Originally by: Sandzibarr

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dont forget that rev3 will also bring in the new 'drones dont heal sheilds' feature once you scoop and release em..

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True, so that just means pre-emptively scoop/deploy your drones in combination with dampners. Really... how fast can another BS lock your drones with 2-3 damps on it?

Test it out with a friend, figure out a good amount of time, get used to it... then pretend nothing happened.

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Of course if you want to solo in the eos you pretty much want scrambler, webber, injector and mwd taking up 4 of your mid slots leaving 1 slot to fit a dampener in.

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Originally by: Augeas

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Quote:

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Of course if you want to solo in the eos you pretty much want scrambler, webber, injector and mwd taking up 4 of your mid slots leaving 1 slot to fit a dampener in.

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There should be no reason to solo in a Fleet Command.

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Originally by: dalman

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Sigh, CCP strikes again.

Yes, the Eos was a very good solo ship. Perhaps it was appropriate to nerf it, as this wasn't it's "intended" role.
And this nerf, removal of turrets and drone nerf (hey, remember it doesn't have a damage bonus plz!) makes it pretty much useless for solo PvP.

But the problem then is that the Eos is completely useless in it's "intended" role.
And I'm not talking about the "uselessness" of information links.
First off, the Eos has the worst tank of the 4 fleet ships. In a gang situation, where it's intended, it has by far the worst tank. For example, the rep bonus is pretty much useless, it's got a big sig radius, it only have 5 lows and it has a huge exp hole that has to be filled.
Except the fact that a plate doesn't get the resist bonus of damnation/vulture, it really lacks grid to fit one.
The fitting reqs also continue to haunt it when trying to fit gang links. You'll pretty much be flying with 4 empty highs (some exaggeration, but you can't fit decent guns).

Then there is the drone thing. Who is the dev @ CCP that is designing ships without understanding that drones are very useful in a solo fight but becomes more and more useless the more ships that are involved?

It's seriously some kind of achievement to come up with the idea of making a fleet ship that is based on drones and armor rep bonus, both of which are ******* useless in a fleet.

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Originally by: Incantare

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And FYI I fly blasterboats, Thorax and blaster Myrm specifically, I considered training for an Eos but had the sense to see it was overpowered and would inevitably be nerfed.

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Originally by: shinsushi

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Slightly overpowered?

HEy, with 5 turrets and 5 medium drones, the EOS will still be the # damage dealing fleet command ship won't it? How many DPS is it still pumping out anyway?

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Originally by: SpaceTrucker 3000

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Wow this coming patch is shaping up as the best patch ever. This nerf was strongly needed, I didn't even think they were going to nerf a gallente ship ever. Now damage is in par with the other fleet commands, it probably still outdamages them but not so ridiculously much.

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Originally by: Vitaki

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Lolol they are nerfing the Myrmidon down to 75/125. Want some ketchup with your foot?

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Originally by: CCP Atropos

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The Eos has been brought in line with the other Fleet Command ships. It has, for a long time, been immensely overpowered compared to the Claymore, Damnation and Vulture. It was the only Fleet Command ship that could out damage it's equivalent Field Command. If you don't think that's wrong, then can I have some of what you're smoking?

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Originally by: Kuzya Morozov

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Originally by: shinsushi

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Slightly overpowered?

HEy, with 5 turrets and 5 medium drones, the EOS will still be the # damage dealing fleet command ship won't it? How many DPS is it still pumping out anyway?

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Are you too busy whining about Amarr or are you joking?

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Originally by: Kaker

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dont nerf the myrm or the EOS any smart pilot will realize that they can one volley or two volley their drones. Why does CCP help those that cant think but screw those who have adapted?

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Originally by: hattifnatt

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Edited by: Horza Otho on 23/10/2007 21:27:02

Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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The ship is grossly overpowered when compared to other fleet command ships. This wasnt a nerf, it was a balance and it got what it needed. Fly an Astarte.

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Why not boost the other fleet commands then? (they do suck bad.)

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Originally by: CCP Atropos

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The Eos has been brought in line with the other Fleet Command ships. It has, for a long time, been immensely overpowered compared to the Claymore, Damnation and Vulture. It was the only Fleet Command ship that could out damage it's equivalent Field Command. If you don't think that's wrong, then can I have some of what you're smoking?

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Originally by: slothe

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eos was always overated tbh

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Originally by: hattifnatt

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Edited by: Horza Otho on 23/10/2007 21:27:02

Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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The ship is grossly overpowered when compared to other fleet command ships. This wasnt a nerf, it was a balance and it got what it needed. Fly an Astarte.

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Why not boost the other fleet commands then? (they do suck bad.)

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I dont really think people understand. Your not supposed to solo in FLEET command ships. Heck, this is a mmog, your not supposed to really solo at all.

The point is that the Eos is now balanced with the rest of the command ships. It does low dps to coincide with the Damnation, Vulture and Claymore. If you want to do damage you should (omg) get a Astarte?

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Originally by: Praxis1452

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Originally by: hattifnatt

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Edited by: Horza Otho on 23/10/2007 21:27:02

Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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The ship is grossly overpowered when compared to other fleet command ships. This wasnt a nerf, it was a balance and it got what it needed. Fly an Astarte.

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Why not boost the other fleet commands then? (they do suck bad.)

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I dont really think people understand. Your not supposed to solo in FLEET command ships. Heck, this is a mmog, your not supposed to really solo at all.

The point is that the Eos is now balanced with the rest of the command ships. It does low dps to coincide with the Damnation, Vulture and Claymore. If you want to do damage you should (omg) get a Astarte?

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well why doesn't CCP just make a A kills B kills C kills A system. Because it's boring. Ships have roles and bonuses help them toward roles but if a ships can solo there is no reason why it shouldn't. CCP should not force people to play a certain way. Also soloing is quite fine in Eve, just because you believe everyone needs another person to play with doesn't mean that the devs should actively stamp it out.

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Ok, so the EOS bonus to drone has been nerfed to oblivion : from 50m3/lvl, it is on Sisi, it is now 15m3/lvl. 250 at lvl 4.

On the plus side, it's base drone bay is now 150, so it's 210 at lvl 4. Not big of a nerf. But wait.

The bandwith has been set to 75. 75, that means 5 meds, or a bizarre mix of unbonused drones (2H, 2M and 1L). Ok.

And, now, looking closely, I see that it as lost TWO, not one, but TWO ******* TURRET HARDPOINTS!!! Only 5 out of 7.

Well? It was slightly overpowered, ok, now it is just pathetic. Please, CCP, if you don't want it to field 5 Heavy drones (without bonus), ok fine, but give us back our turrets! Or give us bonus like the myrm to drones...

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Originally by: hattifnatt

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Edited by: Horza Otho on 23/10/2007 21:27:02

Originally by: Cornette

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To bad the whine crowd got what they asked for.

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The ship is grossly overpowered when compared to other fleet command ships. This wasnt a nerf, it was a balance and it got what it needed. Fly an Astarte.

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Why not boost the other fleet commands then? (they do suck bad.)

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Originally by: Stamm

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Some people might have been convinced by the official announcement posted by Steelrat, but not me, I wasn't convinced until some random alt posts a brand new thread.

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Ok, so the EOS bonus to drone has been nerfed to oblivion : from 50m3/lvl, it is on Sisi, it is now 15m3/lvl. 250 at lvl 4.

On the plus side, it's base drone bay is now 150, so it's 210 at lvl 4. Not big of a nerf. But wait.

The bandwith has been set to 75. 75, that means 5 meds, or a bizarre mix of unbonused drones (2H, 2M and 1L). Ok.

And, now, looking closely, I see that it as lost TWO, not one, but TWO ******* TURRET HARDPOINTS!!! Only 5 out of 7.

Well? It was slightly overpowered, ok, now it is just pathetic. Please, CCP, if you don't want it to field 5 Heavy drones (without bonus), ok fine, but give us back our turrets! Or give us bonus like the myrm to drones...

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Originally by: DeMundus

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Id like to point out Eos can only do a ceritian dmg type with guns... ppl that say we should look at the other ship to compare... well you can change dmg type, minmatar and caldari... ok I admit I dont wanna be Amarr... Nerfing both guns and drones seems to much... and why does every ship have to be balanced? Some minmatar ships are ******* great some are poor, so is it with the other races... in the end all ships only do diffrent dmg if CCP keeps going this way....

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Originally by: Shevar

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So yes it is brought inline in terms of DPS of the other fleet command ships.

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Originally by: Reacz

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Edited by: Reacz on 24/10/2007 09:02:43
Whatever the complaints, the Eos will probably become nice and cheap now.

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Shevar

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So yes it is brought inline in terms of DPS of the other fleet command ships.

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...while ignoring that fact that the full Eos dps is only available at 2-3km range, unlike the other fleet commands.

The new Eos is just sad. Low, close-range dps, poor tank, crappy gang links (as compared with the other fleet command ships).

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Originally by: Shevar

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Shevar

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So yes it is brought inline in terms of DPS of the other fleet command ships.

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...while ignoring that fact that the full Eos dps is only available at 2-3km range, unlike the other fleet commands.

The new Eos is just sad. Low, close-range dps, poor tank, crappy gang links (as compared with the other fleet command ships).

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?

Optimal is 2250m with a 6250 m fall off.

Also I didn't include ANY dronedamge.

So if only the bandwidth and no turrets would be changed and both eos and damnation got 1 dmg mod you get;

709 dps eos with 7 neutrons 2 ogres 2 hammerhead 1 hobgobs
382 dps damnation with 5 hams and 2 pulse 5 hobgobs

But since you hate short range appearantly

489 DPS with 7 rails 2 ogres 2 hammerheads and 1 hobgob.

And you get a higher range then the damnation to boot.

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Originally by: Shevar

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709 dps eos with 7 neutrons 2 ogres 2 hammerhead 1 hobgobs
382 dps damnation with 5 hams and 2 pulse 5 hobgobs

But since you hate short range appearantly

489 DPS with 7 rails 2 ogres 2 hammerheads and 1 hobgob.

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Originally by: Spenz

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Paper DPS once again wins. Practical experience once again is forgotten.

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 24/10/2007 09:54:26

Originally by: Shevar

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709 dps eos with 7 neutrons 2 ogres 2 hammerhead 1 hobgobs
382 dps damnation with 5 hams and 2 pulse 5 hobgobs

But since you hate short range appearantly

489 DPS with 7 rails 2 ogres 2 hammerheads and 1 hobgob.

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Fail. If you'd actually read the changes, you'd notice that the Eos now has only 5 guns (it lost 2, along with the drone nerf).

It now has comparable damage at range to the Damnation, while sporting a (relatively) poor tank and much, much worse gang links. Not to mention that is has a weapon system that can partially be killed (drones) or jammed (tracking disruptors), unlike the Damnation's HAMs.

... and good luck fitting a rack of neutrons *and* a tank on the Eos. Another problem the Damnation doesn't share.

As a fleet command ship, it now sucks compared to the others.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Whats all this funny bizz with drones being destructable? You killing frigs and AFs in that large thing? Or how many ships actually use SBs? Drone killing drones? So can you. I dont see this as a major set back. Drone damage is the most annoying damage type in the game tbh.

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Whats all this funny bizz with drones being destructable? You killing frigs and AFs in that large thing? Or how many ships actually use SBs? Drone killing drones? So can you. I dont see this as a major set back. Drone damage is the most annoying damage type in the game tbh.

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Ok, you've proven that you don't know enough to be worth talking to on this matter.

If you've never flown enough drone boats to know the basics of what I'm talking about, you have no business discussing something like Eos balance.

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Originally by: Shevar

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Eos without drones and 1 mag stab 499 DPS, damnation with 2 pulses and 5 heavy assault launchers with 2 BCU's 348 DPS. And the damnation can only field 5 light scout drones.

So yes it is brought inline in terms of DPS of the other fleet command ships.

The issue is though the eos might not be as good of a gang booster as the others. And CCP won't chang that probably, but then again this is how it usually goes. Did the curse/pilgrim get any bonusses for gang work after their solo ability got omgwtfpwned by the nerbat?

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Originally by: Ogul

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Originally by: Shevar

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Eos without drones and 1 mag stab 499 DPS, damnation with 2 pulses and 5 heavy assault launchers with 2 BCU's 348 DPS. And the damnation can only field 5 light scout drones.

So yes it is brought inline in terms of DPS of the other fleet command ships.

The issue is though the eos might not be as good of a gang booster as the others. And CCP won't chang that probably, but then again this is how it usually goes. Did the curse/pilgrim get any bonusses for gang work after their solo ability got omgwtfpwned by the nerbat?

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Welcome to the world of missiles, and prepare to get flamed at every corner for daring to compare their crappy dps to real close range weapon systems, because - without a doubt - some troll will point out their far superior range and say something like "Caldari always want easy mode!".

Anyway, any attempt to get a decent kind of damage out of a damnation is doomed from the start because it has no damage but a missile range bonus.

The question is - however - does it have to be this way for every fleet command ship? I see that having one good ship and three crappy ones is not fair, but nerfing the good one into uselessness is not the right way to go.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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I have used alot of drone ships thank you very much. If youre outnumbered 3 to 1 yes youll have hard time keeping your drones alive if they are a threat to the enemy. But then again youre in a world of hurt anyway. In 1 on 1 you both have equal skill and opportunity to kill eachothers drones. No medium guns or up are gonna try web and pop your drones, dear. In larger engagements 3vs3 and up no one will be arzed to kill drones.
You sure we playing the same game?

Now how are drone far worse then turreted weapons? 1 TD and poof all turrets gone if youre in a bad situation.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Is there a difference in boosting 3 to perform as the 1 that is overpowered or nerfing that 1 down to the level of the other 3? Option 1 doesnt really appeal...

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Is there a difference in boosting 3 to perform as the 1 that is overpowered or nerfing that 1 down to the level of the other 3? Option 1 doesnt really appeal...

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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I have used alot of drone ships thank you very much. If youre outnumbered 3 to 1 yes youll have hard time keeping your drones alive if they are a threat to the enemy. But then again youre in a world of hurt anyway. In 1 on 1 you both have equal skill and opportunity to kill eachothers drones. No medium guns or up are gonna try web and pop your drones, dear. In larger engagements 3vs3 and up no one will be arzed to kill drones.
You sure we playing the same game?

Now how are drone far worse then turreted weapons? 1 TD and poof all turrets gone if youre in a bad situation.

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Did you actually read what I wrote earlier?

I said that:

- the Eos now has 5 turrets, not 7
- fitting all-neutrons is not a realistic setup on Eos (Ions are the way to go)
- missiles do not have the drawbacks that drones and gun do, as weapon systems
- the Eos now does comparable dps to the Damnation, while being sub-par in all other fleet command respects

It would be balanced if the Eos tank was comparable to the Damnation, and if the infowar gang links were even close to being comparable to the armor tanking ones. But it isn't, and they aren't.

There is no reason to fly the Eos now, unless you are supporting a dedicated ECM squad -- and even for that, the Eos bonuses are a bit weird. That's a very, very niche role, compared to the other 3 fleet commands, all of which are nearly universally useful. If that's the only role it now has, it has become effectively a useless ship.

In almost all cases, you'd now be much better off flying any of the other 3 in fleet support. You get about the same dps (plus or minus), a much better tank, vastly superior gang bonuses.

My Damnation was already a more generally useful gang support ship than my Eos. Now the situation is just sad.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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You cant compare it with amarr :-)
Damnation tanks better? We'll as many say we are supposedly the tanking race, WOW its true for this ship! Unfair!
Damnation has better gang support? Does the phrase "Amarr shine in groups" ring a bell. WOW, this also holds true for this ship! Unfair!

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 24/10/2007 09:54:26

Originally by: Shevar

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709 dps eos with 7 neutrons 2 ogres 2 hammerhead 1 hobgobs
382 dps damnation with 5 hams and 2 pulse 5 hobgobs

But since you hate short range appearantly

489 DPS with 7 rails 2 ogres 2 hammerheads and 1 hobgob.

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Fail. If you'd actually read the changes, you'd notice that the Eos now has only 5 guns (it lost 2, along with the drone nerf).

It now has comparable damage at range to the Damnation, while sporting a (relatively) poor tank and much, much worse gang links. Not to mention that is has a weapon system that can partially be killed (drones) or jammed (tracking disruptors), unlike the Damnation's HAMs.

... and good luck fitting a rack of neutrons *and* a tank on the Eos. Another problem the Damnation doesn't share.

As a fleet command ship, it now sucks compared to the others.

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Originally by: Shevar

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The reason I show these numbers is to show that just changing bandwidth so it can't field 5 heavies isn't enough to put them inline in terms of DPS with other command ships.

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Originally by: Shevar

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And for the record I agree that just as the curse/pilgrim the Eos needs to be boosted for gang use now that it's strong solo ability got nerfed. But then again, get back in line. The apoc has been utter ****e for like 2 or 3 years now?

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Originally by: Shevar

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The reason I show these numbers is to show that just changing bandwidth so it can't field 5 heavies isn't enough to put them inline in terms of DPS with other command ships.

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Originally by: James Lyrus

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So, still, in fact, does noticably more damage than the others.

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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You cant compare it with amarr :-)
Damnation tanks better? We'll as many say we are supposedly the tanking race, WOW its true for this ship! Unfair!
Damnation has better gang support? Does the phrase "Amarr shine in groups" ring a bell. WOW, this also holds true for this ship! Unfair!

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You're again not making any sense, and effectively dodging most of the issues.

I'm done talking to you.

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Originally by: Shardrael

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Originally by: DeMundus

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Id like to point out Eos can only do a ceritian dmg type with guns... ppl that say we should look at the other ship to compare... well you can change dmg type, minmatar and caldari... ok I admit I dont wanna be Amarr... Nerfing both guns and drones seems to much... and why does every ship have to be balanced? Some minmatar ships are ******* great some are poor, so is it with the other races... in the end all ships only do diffrent dmg if CCP keeps going this way....

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you still have drones to choose dmg so that point is pretty mute, just the same though the nerf might have been a bit much but well see how it makes it to live

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Originally by: DeMundus

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Originally by: Shardrael

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Originally by: DeMundus

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Id like to point out Eos can only do a ceritian dmg type with guns... ppl that say we should look at the other ship to compare... well you can change dmg type, minmatar and caldari... ok I admit I dont wanna be Amarr... Nerfing both guns and drones seems to much... and why does every ship have to be balanced? Some minmatar ships are ******* great some are poor, so is it with the other races... in the end all ships only do diffrent dmg if CCP keeps going this way....

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you still have drones to choose dmg so that point is pretty mute, just the same though the nerf might have been a bit much but well see how it makes it to live

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But thoese are the ones getting nerfed

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Originally by: Valea Silpha

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I feel it needed to add to this an idea probably quite alien to gallente players.

Just because something is THE BEST doesn't make it worthless. Your all bleeting because your fleet command is no longer a gank ship... well too bad for you. My claymore does... well ... less than impressive DPS. But you know what ? I use my claymore like its supposed to be used. It has a minimum of two gang links on it at all times, and aside from that is deigned to survive long enough to make its bonuses count.

Oh and don't start saying how rubbish information links are, thats the price you pay for having everything else in eve going for you.

So to sumerise. Your not the best for once. OHNOES. Better quit eve now.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Originally by: Valea Silpha

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I feel it needed to add to this an idea probably quite alien to gallente players.

Just because something is THE BEST doesn't make it worthless. Your all bleeting because your fleet command is no longer a gank ship... well too bad for you. My claymore does... well ... less than impressive DPS. But you know what ? I use my claymore like its supposed to be used. It has a minimum of two gang links on it at all times, and aside from that is deigned to survive long enough to make its bonuses count.

Oh and don't start saying how rubbish information links are, thats the price you pay for having everything else in eve going for you.

So to sumerise. Your not the best for once. OHNOES. Better quit eve now.

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QFT. Justice has been served and it tastes like a million buck meal.

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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See, this is how you differentiate between intelligent people and utter ******* morons.

The intelligent people recognize sub-par ships even when they don't fly them themselves, and hope that all ships are made useful regardless of whether they have a personal stake in things themselves.

The morons sound like the people above, and usually follow the logic: "our ships X, Y and Z suck, so it's great that ship N (which I don't fly) is also made to suck! Woohoo!"

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Originally by: Valea Silpha

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I feel it needed to add to this an idea probably quite alien to gallente players.

Just because something is THE BEST doesn't make it worthless. Your all bleeting because your fleet command is no longer a gank ship... well too bad for you. My claymore does... well ... less than impressive DPS. But you know what ? I use my claymore like its supposed to be used. It has a minimum of two gang links on it at all times, and aside from that is deigned to survive long enough to make its bonuses count.

Oh and don't start saying how rubbish information links are, thats the price you pay for having everything else in eve going for you.

So to sumerise. Your not the best for once. OHNOES. Better quit eve now.

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QFT. Justice has been served and it tastes like a million buck meal.

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See, this is how you differentiate between intelligent people and utter ******* morons.

The intelligent people recognize sub-par ships even when they don't fly them themselves, and hope that all ships are made useful regardless of whether they have a personal stake in things themselves.

The morons sound like the people above, and usually follow the logic: "our ships X, Y and Z suck, so it's great that ship N (which I don't fly) is also made to suck! Woohoo!"

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Originally by: Shevar

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That being said the Eos is sub par and not sucky after the changes, and you should wonder for how many roles does gallente have sub par ships and compare that to other races. Sorry but I really can't start caring to much since gallente specced players got loads of top end shiplines left.

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Originally by: Ogul

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To be honest, the most disappointing thing about these changes is drone bays actually becoming smaller, didn't someone say bandwith was supposed to enable bigger drone bays while still restricting the number/class of drones active?

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Originally by: Fuazzole

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Only ever used 5x Guns + 2 Warfare,
will feel the 5 Heavy logistixs drone nerf

I can't complain, I like CCP prefer to see ships in specific roles then botched into poon-mobiles

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:25
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 23/10/2007 20:21:10

Originally by: Xao Wen

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Compare the tanks too. Have you seen the monster tank on those ships? Now the Eos has a 5 slot tank (yay), no drones, no guns. It's not "inline", it's "reducing to worthlessness".

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Uh? EOS has one of hardest tanks to *****, surely better than claymore (unless sleip faction fits), comparable to damnation (better in longer run). Only vulture has best fleet command tank.

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Originally by: phillie blunt

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please leave the turret hardpoint to 7!!!!

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Originally by: Barthezz

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Edited by: Barthezz on 24/10/2007 14:05:50
Cross training to another fleet command ship takes a whopping +-20 days (depending on attributes / implants).

I personally went for the absolution instead of the claymore because the tank on the absolution is much better while still allowing me to tackle people.

Ever tried to fit a claymore for 'normal' gang operations? You know the parts where you need at least an MWD and Injector? That leaves you 4 mid slots for a tank (and no tackle gear).

Yea if you go pure tank (which is still only a 5 slot tank, as you still need an injector), it could perhaps be better then an EOS. But an EOS gets a good tank + injector + tackle gear while the claymore watches people warp off (or not tank).

It was a needed nerf, it was too powerful and I do think its more inline with other fleet command ships. Its perhaps no longer top dog, but each command ship has its own pro's / con's.

[note I said good tank, not great]

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Originally by: Justice Bringer

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See the bit about the drone bay being increased?

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Originally by: Valea Silpha

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Just because something is THE BEST doesn't make it worthless. Your all bleeting because your fleet command is no longer a gank ship... well too bad for you. My claymore does... well ... less than impressive DPS. But you know what ? I use my claymore like its supposed to be used. It has a minimum of two gang links on it at all times, and aside from that is deigned to survive long enough to make its bonuses count.

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Originally by: dalman

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In response to the highlighted part of the quote. THAT is the issue. You can't use an Eos "like its supposed to be used". Is it really that hard to get it into your heads?

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Originally by: dalman

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Originally by: Valea Silpha

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Just because something is THE BEST doesn't make it worthless. Your all bleeting because your fleet command is no longer a gank ship... well too bad for you. My claymore does... well ... less than impressive DPS. But you know what ? I use my claymore like its supposed to be used. It has a minimum of two gang links on it at all times, and aside from that is deigned to survive long enough to make its bonuses count.

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By ghad. Are you lot really this ******ed? Especially Lyria Skydancer, who's been spamming this thread without making any sense.

In response to the highlighted part of the quote. THAT is the issue. You can't use an Eos "like its supposed to be used". Is it really that hard to get it into your heads?

The Eos is now a completely worthless ship. As in, it's not worth a single isk more than the minerals you get when you recycle it.
Because the ship is now useless for combat without gang-links, and it's already useless for combat with ganglinks (opposed to for example the claymore).

(And NO, it's not about that information warfare links are not good, it's that the ship is worthless. It can't be used for anything except sitting at a POS)

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Im the one that's not making sense?

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Originally by: Xao Wen

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Ok, so the EOS bonus to drone has been nerfed to oblivion : from 50m3/lvl, it is on Sisi, it is now 15m3/lvl. 250 at lvl 4.

On the plus side, it's base drone bay is now 150, so it's 210 at lvl 4. Not big of a nerf. But wait.

The bandwith has been set to 75. 75, that means 5 meds, or a bizarre mix of unbonused drones (2H, 2M and 1L). Ok.

And, now, looking closely, I see that it as lost TWO, not one, but TWO ******* TURRET HARDPOINTS!!! Only 5 out of 7.

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Originally by: Horza Otho

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Omg they balanced the eos :senjaya:

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Originally by: Elles D

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Mwuhahahah now you know how it feels Gallente.

Whine away

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Originally by: Bomerang

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Originally by: Elles D

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Mwuhahahah now you know how it feels Gallente.

Whine away

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Drake tank has just made it into my top 5 things to bring to CCPs attention.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Originally by: dalman

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Im the one that's not making sense?

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Yes.
As shown by that you can't counter my statements.

1. Why would you fly a ship that is alot worse at everything compared to other ships available at the same cost? Useless.

2 and 3. Try to come up with a good fitting with ganglinks. You can't, because the ship is [drumroll] useless.

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Its useless? Im not gonna debate if it is or not. But if it is: Im happy, your race deserves much less.

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Originally by: Elles D

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Originally by: dalman

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Im the one that's not making sense?

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Yes.
As shown by that you can't counter my statements.

1. Why would you fly a ship that is alot worse at everything compared to other ships available at the same cost? Useless.

2 and 3. Try to come up with a good fitting with ganglinks. You can't, because the ship is [drumroll] useless.

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Its useless? Im not gonna debate if it is or not. But if it is: Im happy, your race deserves much less.

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Yay fantasy racist chants made up on the whim of CCP!

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Originally by: dalman

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Im the one that's not making sense?

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Yes.
As shown by that you can't counter my statements.

1. Why would you fly a ship that is alot worse at everything compared to other ships available at the same cost? Useless.

2 and 3. Try to come up with a good fitting with ganglinks. You can't, because the ship is [drumroll] useless.

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Its useless? Im not gonna debate if it is or not. But if it is: Im happy, your race deserves much less.

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Originally by: Zolian

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Edited by: Zolian on 24/10/2007 19:03:37
Waaaa waaaaaa we lost our imba pwnmobile. It's not fair, Gallente should have the best ship in every class .

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Originally by: Zolian

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Edited by: Zolian on 24/10/2007 19:03:37
Waaaa waaaaaa we lost our imba pwnmobile. It's not fair, Gallente should have the best ship in every class .

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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now check damage from 3 ogres... 180 or so dps iirc. Plus 7 guns with 25% damage bonus = a lot. Compare it now to claymore/damnation/vulture. Now you should understand why eos is set BACK IN LINE with others.

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Originally by: Letifer Deus

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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now check damage from 3 ogres... 180 or so dps iirc. Plus 7 guns with 25% damage bonus = a lot. Compare it now to claymore/damnation/vulture. Now you should understand why eos is set BACK IN LINE with others.

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It's 3 ogres plus 5 turrets. Get your sh*t straight before you type.

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Quote:

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And who will use the EOS now over the other Command ships?

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Originally by: Praxis1452

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And who will use the EOS now over the other Command ships?

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Originally by: Letifer Deus

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Edited by: Letifer Deus on 24/10/2007 19:43:41

Originally by: Praxis1452

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And who will use the EOS now over the other Command ships?

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Noone will use it for solo or 2 man, 3 man groups. It will really only be used in fleets, like the rest of the fleet CSs, where the 3 command modules they can fit are worth it.

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Originally by: Natalie Jax

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Edited by: Natalie Jax on 24/10/2007 20:56:59
This change is just too damn much. The ship makes absolutely no sense now. So it can fit 3 bonused Info Warfare modules: EWar strength, EWar range, and sensor strength.

The nature of those bonuses and the EWar modules they affect are most effective when the ship is at-range rather than up close. It really had no business being a blaster boat in the first place. But only 2 of the 3 links are (consistently) useful in battle, versus the other warfare link groups in which all three are always viable. It gets no bonuses that inherently aid a ranged-combat role. Glee, it can launch several waves of unbonused drones that have to MWD to their target before one single point of damage is dealt. The drone-bay "bonus" ... what the **** is that good for when working at range?

Ugh, what a lame ship. It was stupidly overpowered before, now it's just stupid. It has no business being on the field becuase it's existence in this state is an affront to the logic that supports the fleet command ship's purpose.

Fine, nerf the ship. But this is just downright stupid.
From a backstory perspective, CreoDron would never make a ship with such a dip**** design ethos.

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Originally by: VaderDSL

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Edited by: VaderDSL on 24/10/2007 22:02:23

Originally by: Natalie Jax

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Edited by: Natalie Jax on 24/10/2007 20:56:59
This change is just too damn much. The ship makes absolutely no sense now. So it can fit 3 bonused Info Warfare modules: EWar strength, EWar range, and sensor strength.

The nature of those bonuses and the EWar modules they affect are most effective when the ship is at-range rather than up close. It really had no business being a blaster boat in the first place. But only 2 of the 3 links are (consistently) useful in battle, versus the other warfare link groups in which all three are always viable. It gets no bonuses that inherently aid a ranged-combat role. Glee, it can launch several waves of unbonused drones that have to MWD to their target before one single point of damage is dealt. The drone-bay "bonus" ... what the **** is that good for when working at range?

Ugh, what a lame ship. It was stupidly overpowered before, now it's just stupid. It has no business being on the field becuase it's existence in this state is an affront to the logic that supports the fleet command ship's purpose.

Fine, nerf the ship. But this is just downright stupid.
From a backstory perspective, CreoDron would never make a ship with such a dip**** design ethos.

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You arent tied into using the info warfare links though, haveyou ever used them? you only lose about 5% on a non racial fleet cs! you can put what you want in terms of warfare links you as long as you have the relevant mindlink.

And the info warfare links are fine as a close up ship, they affect everything, target painters, tracking disruptors, dampeners and ecm, they provide a massive boost to your ew support in a fleet, if you want to go in close andblast away, get an astarte, you want to hang around the edges of a battle or act as bait then go in with warfare links and a big tank and use medium fast drones, kill of the tacklers/cruiser and let your FLEET! come in and kill the bigger stuff.

If this nerf had been on a field command ship then yes, it would have been idiotic, it was nerfed on the fleet command ship to make the Eos become what it was meant to be, a Fleet command ship, it is fine as it is!

The only thing it needs now is a cap/fitting reduction on warfare links

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Originally by: Ezekiel Sulastin

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Originally by: VaderDSL

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Edited by: VaderDSL on 24/10/2007 22:02:23

Originally by: Natalie Jax

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Edited by: Natalie Jax on 24/10/2007 20:56:59
This change is just too damn much. The ship makes absolutely no sense now. So it can fit 3 bonused Info Warfare modules: EWar strength, EWar range, and sensor strength.

The nature of those bonuses and the EWar modules they affect are most effective when the ship is at-range rather than up close. It really had no business being a blaster boat in the first place. But only 2 of the 3 links are (consistently) useful in battle, versus the other warfare link groups in which all three are always viable. It gets no bonuses that inherently aid a ranged-combat role. Glee, it can launch several waves of unbonused drones that have to MWD to their target before one single point of damage is dealt. The drone-bay "bonus" ... what the **** is that good for when working at range?

Ugh, what a lame ship. It was stupidly overpowered before, now it's just stupid. It has no business being on the field becuase it's existence in this state is an affront to the logic that supports the fleet command ship's purpose.

Fine, nerf the ship. But this is just downright stupid.
From a backstory perspective, CreoDron would never make a ship with such a dip**** design ethos.

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You arent tied into using the info warfare links though, haveyou ever used them? you only lose about 5% on a non racial fleet cs! you can put what you want in terms of warfare links you as long as you have the relevant mindlink.

And the info warfare links are fine as a close up ship, they affect everything, target painters, tracking disruptors, dampeners and ecm, they provide a massive boost to your ew support in a fleet, if you want to go in close andblast away, get an astarte, you want to hang around the edges of a battle or act as bait then go in with warfare links and a big tank and use medium fast drones, kill of the tacklers/cruiser and let your FLEET! come in and kill the bigger stuff.

If this nerf had been on a field command ship then yes, it would have been idiotic, it was nerfed on the fleet command ship to make the Eos become what it was meant to be, a Fleet command ship, it is fine as it is!

The only thing it needs now is a cap/fitting reduction on warfare links

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Except every other fleet command now does the same DPS at better than intimate range while tanking better while still getting the improved gang bonuses that are applicable to every single ship in the fleet.

THIS is why the Eos nerf is unbalanced. It now has no role at all.

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Originally by: Spenz

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QFT. The LEAST they can do is keep the drone bandwidth at 125 m3 so that you can launch sentry drones. Take off another turret I don't care. That would allow me to fit 3 warfare links without losing something. Also remove a mid slot and give it a low slot. The ship is terrible now. I would have supported the turret hardpoint nerf 100%, but eos suffered 5 nerfs in one patch. Yes FIVE.
1. Drones
2. turrets
3. drones shields
4. drone space
5. damps nerfed (which coincidentally were the only reason to actually fit an info link in a gang in the first place).

Keep drone bandwidth at 125 m3. Its not like they are bonused anyhow. That is the LEAST that can be done.

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Originally by: Derrios

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Originally by: slothe

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eos was always overated tbh

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truth. its just the people on the losing end who whined enough to get it changed.

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Originally by: Dracu1a

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So whats the EOS good at now? It went from being being good at small gang warfare and good at solo combat to.....good at absoulutely nothing.


Its warefare links suck.
Its tank sucks. (comparatively)
Its damage sucks.

And I dont mean its subpar in areas. It noticeably sucks worse in all areas of "fleet command" compared to the other ships.

I understand that there has to be one thats "at the bottom". But it shouldnt be at the bottom of all aspects pertaining to the ships role.


Un-nerf the eos.

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Originally by: Dracu1a

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So whats the EOS good at now? It went from being being good at small gang warfare and good at solo combat to.....good at absoulutely nothing.


Its warefare links suck.
Its tank sucks. (comparatively)
Its damage sucks.

And I dont mean its subpar in areas. It noticeably sucks worse in all areas of "fleet command" compared to the other ships.

I understand that there has to be one thats "at the bottom". But it shouldnt be at the bottom of all aspects pertaining to the ships role.


Un-nerf the eos.

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Originally by: Kormregort

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Please stop using EFT for your DPS and tank #'s. The ranges, active vs passive, and speeds change the reality of every fight significantly.

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Yes they do change the reality of every fight, in favor of gallente. Or how do you explain the immense amounts of gallente ships compared to amarr in pvp?

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Yes they do change the reality of every fight, in favor of gallente. Or how do you explain the immense amounts of gallente ships compared to amarr in pvp?

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Originally by: Alex Harumichi

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Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 25/10/2007 08:55:40

Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Yes they do change the reality of every fight, in favor of gallente. Or how do you explain the immense amounts of gallente ships compared to amarr in pvp?

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Because all too many Amarr ships suck. I tend to see about equal numbers of Gallente, Minmatar and Caldari ships in gangs myself, but way less Amarr.

Your "our ships suck so it's great that other ships will, too!" crusade is getting really old and tired, and makes you sound immature. Grow up, please.

The proper response to "our ships suck" is "they need to be boosted", not "everyone else needs to be nerfed". And yes, lots of Amarr ships suck, I fly them myself (some of them are great, though).

You're just ****ing people off with your childish stance, here.

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Originally by: Kormregort

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Edited by: Kormregort on 25/10/2007 08:49:18
Despite being a gang game, most people still insist on using their experiences in very, very small scale or solo as their OMGWTFNERF/BUFF this ship meter. Obviously, these fights are more personal and easier to correctly identify the mistakes/reasons you won/lost.

Amarr are great in gangs. Their damage type is only the weakest vs basic EANM/DC armor tanks, in other words, ships that, vs a gang, will drop like a rock anyway. Those ships that try to focus on their tank use active hardeners.....and skip EM. The exception to this is spider tanking....but read on

Amarr can project their PULSE DPS to great ranges(enough to have ships in/near optimal within disruptor range) In gangs, Abbadons/Geddon's are often the first on the killmail due to unleashing their max DPS w/o having to MWD close like gallente. When you focus fire, those extra 5-15 sec a blasterboat takes to get into optimal can mean the same sized gang of Amarr ships has already killed the target. Vs spider tanking.....the ability to quickly change targets and kill before a rep is possible is key. Pulses do this very well. Blasters....not as much. And when we get into lrg fleet where it's Rails vs Tachs......fleet these days is Hit and Run before you're bubbled.....repeat as necessary. The Abbadon's only weakness in fleet is it's cap problems.....except that doesn't matter in hit and run so you get much more practical HP and DPS....while having your weakness removed.

Most of the Amarr smallscale weaknesses are addressed in gang warefare. Gallente get damps, gank, and drones, all of which are being nerfed.

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Originally by: Rastigan

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Originally by: Derrios

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Originally by: slothe

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eos was always overated tbh

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truth. its just the people on the losing end who whined enough to get it changed.

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Even before the nerf it wasnt that much better than a Myrmidon to justify its cost.

Each Fleet command had something unique.. Vulture sniper, A damnation can have 350k EFT effective hp (insane passive tank), A Claymore has the strongest active shield tank in the game, the Eos is just a turd with a rotating turret on its chin...

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Originally by: Lyria Skydancer

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Oh so this is annoying and interuptive? When someone is trying to destroy your valid credibility by posting crap all over your thoughtful and creative posts? I think i know the feeling...

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Originally by: R'adeh

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Don't mind Lyria, she's just trying to live up to her title as most clueless troll in all Eos threads

*R'adeh hands a cookie to his favorite troll...

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