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MHayes
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Posted - 2007.11.28 12:48:00 -
[61]
As said, argue that this change is against the terms and conditions in the contract.
I am not sure how changing the packet priority yourself will help. if the problem is at the ISP end. They will probably be filtering based on port number.
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Hungo
Minmatar Nightfallz
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Posted - 2007.11.28 12:49:00 -
[62]
Originally by: heheheh
Originally by: Hungo Why the hell would u go with virgin?
There expensive, limited bandwith and very abd customer service
Go with BT or NTL
Your not to smart for going with them in the first place
Your not smart at all either, virgin are ntl, they have taken it over, and also its the cheapest there is. Your answer was totally backwards.
Im with BT i wasnta ware NTL had been brought out, but still, virgin is crap, there prices are stupid high for **** service, and the bandiwth limits suck hardcore
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Jart
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Posted - 2007.11.28 12:54:00 -
[63]
If the problem is not resolved soon then I will try and move provider, but I will need to get proof of what is actually happening. Are there any official statements by VM or confirmation from a reliable source that I can use?
I don't doubt the statements made here, I just think I will need something better to use as my evidence.
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Adonis 4174
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Posted - 2007.11.28 13:04:00 -
[64]
Just to clarify what others have said, BT Wholesale is not part of BT. BT Internet and BT Connect buy services from BT Wholesale in exactly the same way that other ISPs do. If you were sold BT Internet on a claim that this was not the case then you bought the advertising pitch. ----- "Why can't you just be friends?" -- Oveur |
gordon861
Minmatar Head Insurance Services
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Posted - 2007.11.28 13:05:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Jart
Originally by: Fanjita I use cfosspeed traffic shaping software to set the priority of my packets for the different programs i use and have had no problems with my bband speeds im also with virginmedia might be worth a try for you peeps having trouble.
I am having recent trouble with my Virign ADSL as well, although I would not consider where I live (York) the East of England as mentioned by the OP. Unfortunately, I have only recently joined this service so it would be tricky to move to another provider.
I am going to try the method quoted above, but if there is something CCP can do this would be very appreciated.
Did you sign up after talking to one of their reps on the phone ?
If so, even if you signed up via the internet rather than over the phone if you told them what you want the service for they could be in breach of terms. You can argue that the service they are providing is no longer 'fit for the purpose' that you took it up for. This may be enough to allow you to break the contract early if that's what you want to do. Talk to you local trading standards at the council they can often be helpful, also don't forget that a lot of EU and UK law re contracts requires them to be reasonable and fair so often allows a way out if the contract has changed drastically. You may also find that by rights they are required to give 4 weeks notice of a substaintial change to the service/contract in order to give you a chance to get out. Even if you do decide to stay with them in the hope things will get better it might be worth sending them a letter stating that you are unsatisfied with the change of service and reserve the right to leave early if the service doesn't return to the initial levels.
I have always made a point of making sure I ask particular questions before starting new ISP contracts like, do you block parts of the internet or ports etc and also what they mean by 'fair use'. If I don't like the answer I phone someone else.
I'm currently with BT on the unlimited package, not the cheapest but seems to work OK and not had my connection knocked down to 128k yet ! (thx Demon)
A few of the ISPs I spoke to when I changed over, including BT, now say that the 'fair use' agreement only relates to peak times, 16:00 - 00:00, which is fine as most people don't want to run P2P whilst playing Eve anyways. Just start the P2P after you quit Eve for the night and switch it off before you leave for work in the morning.
Originally by: CCP Arkanon I frown on employees being power players to the extent that their gameplay results in any sort of domination over others. I donĘt believe CCP employees should run the EVE universe. |
ColdheartedKilla
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:04:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Hungo Why the hell would u go with virgin?
There expensive, limited bandwith and very abd customer service
Go with BT or NTL
Your not to smart for going with them in the first place
neither are you so it seems giving the fact that virgin are NTL
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JamnOne
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:14:00 -
[67]
Hmm, Where is Virgin Media located and who are the parent investors?
I ask as that is what they want to do here the States. Those who pay get more bandwidth alloted to them and everything else gets pushed to the side. An example would be if Eve wanted to have it's players in the US play the game with out any issues they would have to pay more money to make sure they got better access to the net. This would also apply to ABC, Fox Networks, Intel Corp., AMD, they are not picky who - if you want to be seen you will pay the price.
This idea is being totally pushed by the internet providers and the entertainment industry as well as small businesses who want to make sure others can access their content are fighting back. ________________________
Originally by: CCP Prism X Hah! Vengeance is sweet!
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:17:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Sister Impotentata
Originally by: Moghydin Edited by: Moghydin on 28/11/2007 08:46:57 I called my ISP and the senior tech support person said that they are throttling higher ports and also using packet analyzers which plainly throw away some packets of the traffic they see as "bad",
"Packet Analyzers"? Please tell me this is not in the US. I'll flip. It's one thing if The Government autonomously scans my bits to see if I'm looking at children or planning naughty acts. It's another if my ISP starts scanning my bits to decide what I can have.
If I order a pepperoni pizza, I better get a pepperoni pizza, not a piece of bread with some tomato paste, because "Well, we scanned your order and the cheese and the pepperoni... they're not good for you. So you can't have them."
the government here has been doing that for years...there's a scandal with AT&T right now over them handing over all kinds of information they collected from traffic over their network...not just phone calls...everything...
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Threv Echandari
Caldari Dragons Of Redemption Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:29:00 -
[69]
So much for "Net Neutrality"
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Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari Sane Industries Inc.
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:36:00 -
[70]
Only thing that makes sense in this case, is that they prioritize packets with IPTOS_LOWDELAY set. This being a suggestion to the routers that the packets should be prioritized to ensure lower delays, but at the expense of throughput.
So normal packets should still be close to the old throughput and delay if routing is implemented correctly, since low delay packets should be throttled if they use too much bandwidth. (Marking all your packets LOWDELAY shouldn't be a free card for getting all the bandwidth)
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Plutoinum
German Cyberdome Corp Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.11.28 16:52:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 28/11/2007 16:54:03
Originally by: Maximada Basically Virgin have introduced what they call a 'Developer Prioritising System' and programs that are not set for high priorities by developer will come down the line really slow to make way for more important traffic.
If they were talking about 'Developer Prioritizing' ... The only influence that a Developer has are the Type of Service (TOS) bits, if I'm not totally wrong. You can set them to low delay, high throughput and/or high reliability. Those bits might be used as a hint, when the packet meets a traffic shaper that prioritizes the packets, because the line is on it's limits.
So, hmm, setting those bits is not a big deal, it's just the question if this is all that they are looking at.
( I had set up a traffic shaper myself on a linux router some years ago, when I was sharing a connection with 3 other people. They were downloading a lot with p2p and it was killing my connection and teamspeak, so needed prioritize that stuff that EVE traffic and teamspeak is uneffected. Worked quite well. Didn't use the TOS bits though, but classified them by ports, ip addresses, protocols, type of the packet, size etc. and some specific filters that detected p2p like kazaa, emule and such things. Worked nice ... Now I got 16Mbit down, 1 MBit up on my own and so far no problems with my provider )
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Barbaro55a
Caldari Amesha Spentaz Terra Incognita.
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Posted - 2007.11.28 17:29:00 -
[72]
I've been suffering terrible lag and constant disconets for the last week or so.
It all makes sence now, i'm with Virgin, will be looking for an alternative tonight.
Originally by: ISD Valorem If someone has hurt you out of game then please talk to family, friends or Police (if necessary)
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SoftRevolution
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Posted - 2007.11.28 18:05:00 -
[73]
Edited by: SoftRevolution on 28/11/2007 18:07:59 BT Internet are tools.
My defining experience of having them for an ISP was back in the days of dialup when they moved me to a slower connection because I used their "Unlimited" 0800 service too much. Not that they ever explicitly admitted that. If you're worried about your ISP sneaking crap like that in unannounced then I'd certainly expect them to do that.
On the other hand the absolute best ISP I've ever had are five minutes walk from my house. Faster connection speeds, better uptime, better customer service than any of the big companies I have used in the past.
Zen I have tried and I seem to recall them being passable, unless they got bought by anyone or suddenly got popular and oversubscribed. EVE RELATED CONTENT |
Tallann
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Posted - 2007.11.28 18:38:00 -
[74]
This issue revolves roughly around what in the states is currently being referred to as Net Neutrality. The basic principle behind Net Neutrality is that all packets are created equal and that ISPS are not supposed to throttle traffic based on a) where it comes from b) where its going c) what it is.
The reason for this is because it will significantly stifle inovation on the internet if all of a sudden a startup company in California needs to pay EXTRA money to the providers of the pipes between it and say users in NY. Under the current system Comcast could throttle all traffic coming through there system from another provider, or even going to competing websites, if there was a startup cable company somewhere in the States, Comcast could simply throttle or redirect all packets coming over there lines in that direction. There isn't widespread use of this as of yet, but its starting to come into being slowly.
While blocking of Torrents, P2P, and certain ports isn't quite the same issue because its there own users, it is the beginning of IMO a slippery slope that leads to controlling all sorts of traffic, and could certainly lead to censorship as a previous poster pointed out.(A la China, as well as other countries)
In my understanding, roughly about 1% of users take up about 99% of available bandwidth, unfortunately it makes sense for the ISPS to in some way limit those 1%.
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redialer
Minmatar The African Contingency Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.11.28 18:50:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Jart
Originally by: Fanjita I use cfosspeed traffic shaping software to set the priority of my packets for the different programs i use and have had no problems with my bband speeds im also with virginmedia might be worth a try for you peeps having trouble.
I am having recent trouble with my Virign ADSL as well, although I would not consider where I live (York) the East of England as mentioned by the OP. Unfortunately, I have only recently joined this service so it would be tricky to move to another provider.
I am going to try the method quoted above, but if there is something CCP can do this would be very appreciated.
I use Virgin ADSL and have been having these problems since Sunday, anything between 20-100 seconds lag/desync. If this is only meant to be in the East, I'd say they accidentley started in the NW!
I'm going to try cfosspeed which have not used for a while, see if that does help.
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BuffB
Amarr 13 apostle's
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Posted - 2007.11.28 19:13:00 -
[76]
exactly the same problem here. cancelled with them 2 days ago and new broadband provider goes live on patch day so fingers crossed for a smooth transition so i can get back for Trinity launch.
My advice.....avoid virgin
Sorry to hear other people have been having the same issues but glad i finally know its not my pc.....shame i have reinstalled windows twice now to try and solve the problem.
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Frogzuk
Dragonian Freelancers KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.28 19:26:00 -
[77]
gotta say i was with virgin for a long time, and about 12 months ago the service was getting bad, real bad..... hence the change to another isp... so glad i did !
froggy
DGF website Killboard |
Acedias
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Posted - 2007.11.28 22:08:00 -
[78]
Same trouble, and can definately relate to the 20-100 second gaps in usability of both EVE and vent (I am located in the South East currently, and have experienced this **** for just over a week). I've found that at about 12am to 1am .. magically normal service resumes, and remains throughout the night. The problem seems worse during 'peak times' (16:00-00:00).
Those peak times being the only sane times most working users will be looking to play, I can't see this system being too popular. If it is something CCP dev types can fix then please do so for those too lazy/unable to change
New ISP? The quest begins..
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Zaphod Jones
Minmatar Infinitus Odium The Church.
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Posted - 2007.11.28 22:30:00 -
[79]
I had this exact same problem with eve and ventrilo on NTHell/Virgin Cable
I had been a customer of over 5 years with their service and had no problems until this, unfortunately I had never had a BT telephone point put into the house so switching ISP meant having the extra expense of a new socket installed. To their credit BT did everything they said they would on the correct day, and i've had 6 months of excellent service faster than Virgin ever was for cheaper.
Save EvE TV |
Ander
Gallente Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.11.28 22:32:00 -
[80]
Buy professional tunneling and get high speeds and prioritized traffic if you cheat your ISP to think you're running VoIP or anything "prioritized" :)
Problem solved.
EVE PIRATE
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.11.28 22:32:00 -
[81]
I find myself thankful that Ireland is lagging behind in broadband. We don't have this kind of stuff yet. Not in my experience anyway.
A better way of fixing the Internet, rather than trying to limit the crap output by botnets and spammers and misconfigured machines, is to simply put everyone who has a broadband connection through some kind of competency test, and set the people who fail on fire. -
I wish I was a three foot female doll with a watering can and heterochromatic eyes. |
Hettar
Caldari Huff Technologies
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:12:00 -
[82]
this sucks, i just tansfer from tiscali to virgin to get rid of one problem and now i'm gonna get it again.........ALL ISP'S ARE CRAP.
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Zenst
Gallente Omniscient Order
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:16:00 -
[83]
If they want to priorotise your traffic over and above what you signed for then do the same with payment to them.
I know I am and they can whistle.
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Sprzedawczyk
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:28:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Kenneth McCoy Good christ at Japan D:
That's nothing. you should look around for NTT scientific whitepapers on their implementation of G-PON system as FFTH (ie one fiber per home, in stark contrast to one fiber per distric US sucy Verison uses:P). It's basically 2.4 Gb/s download and 1.2 Gb/s uload, with an option to add WDM (effectively multiplexing transmission speeds few times). Now, if of course includes both telephone(lol) full HDTV and the internet and is deployed to house (so if you're living in an apartment building the expected implementation is one fiber into basement and then VDSL+ to flats), but you could actually order one directly to your home:D
when it comes to fiber optics technology Japan and rest of the world is like comparing Lichenstein and Switzerland to 3rd world countries. Takt this example - this summer Corning Glass Company (leading producer of fibers in US, dudes who pretty much invented the whole thing in in 60ies) announced new breakthrough bendable fibers (normal fibers cannot bended with radius less than 4cm, or they will break or leak signal, which makes thema real pain to install). So, bendable fiber is really big thing and it's finally here. Except that Japanese have developed it in 2003 and you could bloody buy it in shops (makes you wonder how Corning made that "breakthrough" of theirs - they sent someone with mastercard on research trip to Akibara?:P:P)
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Paulo Damarr
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:28:00 -
[85]
I hope to god they dont carry these restrictions over to the cable service as well, I'm in hole as I have the full package of broadband, HD TV, land line phone and mobile phone.
If they ruin the broadband I can probably get out of the contract but I would need to get all my other services from elsewhere .
Originally by: Tortun Nahme CCP also condones thinking, I suggest you try it from tiem to time
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redialer
Minmatar The African Contingency Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:50:00 -
[86]
Originally by: Sprzedawczyk
Originally by: Kenneth McCoy Good christ at Japan D:
That's nothing. you should look around for NTT scientific whitepapers on their implementation of G-PON system as FFTH (ie one fiber per home, in stark contrast to one fiber per distric US sucy Verison uses:P). It's basically 2.4 Gb/s download and 1.2 Gb/s uload, with an option to add WDM (effectively multiplexing transmission speeds few times). Now, if of course includes both telephone(lol) full HDTV and the internet and is deployed to house (so if you're living in an apartment building the expected implementation is one fiber into basement and then VDSL+ to flats), but you could actually order one directly to your home:D
when it comes to fiber optics technology Japan and rest of the world is like comparing Lichenstein and Switzerland to 3rd world countries. Takt this example - this summer Corning Glass Company (leading producer of fibers in US, dudes who pretty much invented the whole thing in in 60ies) announced new breakthrough bendable fibers (normal fibers cannot bended with radius less than 4cm, or they will break or leak signal, which makes thema real pain to install). So, bendable fiber is really big thing and it's finally here. Except that Japanese have developed it in 2003 and you could bloody buy it in shops (makes you wonder how Corning made that "breakthrough" of theirs - they sent someone with mastercard on research trip to Akibara?:P:P)
In contrast to my local council who told the Cable companies: Yes, but you must leave the roads and pavements as you found them
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redialer
Minmatar The African Contingency Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2007.11.28 23:56:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Zaphod Jones I had this exact same problem with eve and ventrilo on NTHell/Virgin Cable
I had been a customer of over 5 years with their service and had no problems until this, unfortunately I had never had a BT telephone point put into the house so switching ISP meant having the extra expense of a new socket installed. To their credit BT did everything they said they would on the correct day, and i've had 6 months of excellent service faster than Virgin ever was for cheaper.
I agree, the logical choice is BT, Virgin have to rent the telephone lines once the cable line stops, so they cut services.
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Cypherous
Minmatar Liberty Rogues Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2007.11.29 00:53:00 -
[88]
VM are a massive pile of lose the cable sucks here and they have a monopoly on everything here so if you're not VM you're screwed, if they ever think about touching or throttling my gaming traffic i shall be speaking to a solicitor the very next day. ---------
Liberty Rogues Website
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Cailais
Amarr W A R
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Posted - 2007.11.29 01:12:00 -
[89]
Virgins announcement -
Linkage
Thankfully I changed isp provider a few months ago - close call!
C.
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Dehumanisation - griefers are cool and if you are not a griefer, you do not belong here.
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Agillious
Gallente Inner Circle Helter-Skelter
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Posted - 2007.11.29 01:31:00 -
[90]
For the people in here claiming this is happening all over the United States, I urge you to recheck your sources. There has been one reported instance of this so far, and involved COMCAST terminating Bit Torrent accounts on their network by spoofing their customers' torrent programs. They got a chastisement from Uncle Sam, but that was about it.
But yeah, ISPs want to do this so they can turn around and charge companies that need to use their network more for more "priority". My guess that is that this "priority" has nothing to do with a software programmer changing their software, and everything to do with that same software programmer paying a premium to an ISP to grant them "priority" status.
Just some words from a Yank. Sorry to hear about the ISP troubles
MORE SHINY, PLEASE!!!
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