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Caldari damage bonus... wtf?

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Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:40:00 - [61] Originally by: Zeba Caldari are the missile spammer race. Missiles only do one type of damage and turrets do 2 or 3 in the case of a few projectile ammos. Each race has a damage type associated with it. Amarr: EM Minmater: Explosive Gallente: Thermal Caldari: Kinetic Check each races missile spammer ship and you will find those ships are limited to only that single damage type for a bonus. You're confusing Rats with human players.. although i see you have knowledge of the game, please.. 14/10 for thermal/kinetic doesn't put Thermal as the only damage for Gallente for example.. nor does same with EM/Thermal for Amarr.. If you want' to talk missions i do fit kinetic on most misile ships just because they do about equal damage compared to the specific rat damage for the mission, and cause i'm lazy to refit, i do although keep a load of additional types of misiles just incase.. The OPs point is probably regarding PvP, where misile ships are limited in their bonus, not in their type of damage to choose. As damage type is type of ship specific bonus for most caldari misile boats, that eats up that bonus unless used as intended. I'd much more prefer a rof bonus like the Raven on all other misile boats, rather than the kinetic misile bonus for example, or even the 5% resistance or 7.5% shield boost or what have you..
Nasta443	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:40:00 - [62] I think its time we get barrage and hail ammo with multiple damage types, along pure emp ammo. it is not fair that barrage usually does explosive ammo because it is easy to predict what a ship in falloff will be using, and emp has an explosive component so it is easy to just fit an explosive hardener ... this has to be the most ******** thread i've seen in the last 4 days. fortuanetly i have just acquired forum whoring level 3 and i managed to edit out in time some silly mistake due to braindamage from this thread
An Anarchyyt Gallente Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:40:00 - [63] Originally by: Lirt Anarchyyt: you can say all you guys want, but you still didnt say me a good valid reason why caldari gets only kinetic bonus. Al you say is adapt or play kitty online. Well i already adapted this unfair situation cause im caldari, but i think its time balance it. Because it really isn't unfair. Amazingly enough, there are many times when I am not using Kinetic missiles in my Caldari ships. And often they DO MORE DAMAGE. Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:42:00 - [64] Originally by: Xennith Originally by: Lirt Xenith: I am not saying kinetic sux, im saying why ONLY kinetic??? because. i think giving a bonus to all 4 damage types would be a little unfair, people have to be able to predict what kind of damage they are likely to face and going up against caldari and not having a clue what to expect damage wise would suck from a game design point of view. caldari picked kinetic. oh. and guristas are weak to kinetic. Like you can predict with Minmatar?
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:43:00 - [65] Originally by: An Anarchyyt Originally by: Lirt Anarchyyt: you can say all you guys want, but you still didnt say me a good valid reason why caldari gets only kinetic bonus. Al you say is adapt or play kitty online. Well i already adapted this unfair situation cause im caldari, but i think its time balance it. Because it really isn't unfair. Amazingly enough, there are many times when I am not using Kinetic missiles in my Caldari ships. And often they DO MORE DAMAGE. Exactly, so you just wasted your ship's bonus.. while a Gal char, keeps his 7.5 tracking, Amarr char keeps his 10% cap bonus, Minnie char keeps his 5% speed.. and so on...
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:44:00 - [66] Glassbil: i wont mention the "at any range" comment cause that belongs to the guns vs missiles dicscussion. But yes you have the ability to choose damage type, but for what? if you gonna lsoe the damage bonus then damage would be same and in most cases worse, so no point to change ammo. About that ammo change during fight... well give me a break, i wont mention fleet battles cause there its impossible but even in small gangs you lose too much time and too much dps if you go into that strategy. And in most times it wont matter cause because kinetic has bonus and others dont it wont be much difference, and maybe kientic still does msot damage. -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Glassbil	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:45:00 - [67] Originally by: Lirt Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 17:40:02 Quote: -Leviathan - 37.5% shield HP bonus, only titan that can do a large amount of damage with normal weapons (7 citadel launchers = melts battleships), best damage type for doomsday. Now that you mention shield bonus, why shield when it gets bonus doesn't regenerate automatically? Yea and the recharge rate of the shield swhen they are almost full (like when receiving shield bonus) is so high... But nevermind thats another issue.. Also all you mention in your post is that caldari has absurb tanking abilities, although that i dont agree cause armor tanking is better but nvm. The only damage ship you mention is cerberus and that it wipes out smaller ships.. well lol yea what about other hacs. Its not like if caldari gets another damage bonus they gonna pwn anyway but it gives you more versatillity... liek the other races. I'm still waiting for a PROPER answer to my post, But i guess i'm not going to get that since you obviously can't provide one. Amarr deal ONLY EM/Thermal, Gallente deal ONLY Kinetic/Thermal, Caldari can deal ANY dmg type, And yes, It IS beneficial to switch to a different dmg type sometimes, Even without the bonus.
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:45:00 - [68] Originally by: Xennith Originally by: Black Scorpio AAahahahahhahahhahahhahaaahahahahhahahhahahhahahahhahahhahah hahahhahahahhahah ahaha hahaha hahahh ... i'm breathless now.. aahahahh hahahhah hahahhh not a fan of ewar? Oh i quite like it but to give it as an example of pure win.. lol... good support maybe.
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:46:00 - [69] Originally by: MassonA Just because you've been given a kinetic bonus doesn't mean you MUST use kinetic missiles. Just because Amarr ships get cap bonus don't mean they have to use lasers.. but most do don't they..
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:47:00 - [70] Originally by: An Anarchyyt Because it really isn't unfair. Amazingly enough, there are many times when I am not using Kinetic missiles in my Caldari ships. And often they DO MORE DAMAGE. Now imagine the other races that get a bonus also to second damage type... Also most minmatar missile ships get a rof bonus which means damage bonus to all, and also the sacrilege gets all four types damage bonus. Only caldari ships are nerfed to kinetic only so its not a missile weapon issue, its a caldari ship issue... -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:49:00 - [71] Originally by: Black Scorpio Oh i quite like it but to give it as an example of pure win.. lol... good support maybe. scorpions are generally primaried in fights because everybody knows just how much trouble they can be. theres a lot more to winning a fight than DPS. disagree if you want (and judging by your recent side-splitting, i guess you do). We come for our people
An Anarchyyt Gallente Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:50:00 - [72] Edited by: An Anarchyyt on 04/03/2008 17:50:33 Originally by: Lirt Originally by: An Anarchyyt Because it really isn't unfair. Amazingly enough, there are many times when I am not using Kinetic missiles in my Caldari ships. And often they DO MORE DAMAGE. Now imagine the other races that get a bonus also to second damage type... Also most minmatar missile ships get a rof bonus which means damage bonus to all, and also the sacrilege gets all four types damage bonus. Only caldari ships are nerfed to kinetic only so its not a missile weapon issue, its a caldari ship issue... How about my Gallente ships with missiles where I use Explosive damage? Infact, aside from the Nemesis, do any of the Gallente ships with missiles launcher hardpoints actually get a bonus to them? Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:50:00 - [73] Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 17:51:18 Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 17:51:02 Quote: Amarr deal ONLY EM/Thermal, Gallente deal ONLY Kinetic/Thermal, Caldari can deal ANY dmg type, And yes, It IS beneficial to switch to a different dmg type sometimes, Even without the bonus. Yea say ONLY like its bad lol. Whats the point changing ammo if you dont get bonus?? Why all the training then? And in most cases you wont do more than kinetic. So changing ammo is not an excuse. Also as i said in my previous posts, check non-caldari missile ships and their bonuses, non of them gets a one damage type bonus. Anarchyyt: what ships you talking about, like... 1 ship? -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:52:00 - [74] Originally by: Zantrei Kordisin So, let's take a look at Caldari ships... Starting from the top. -Leviathan - 37.5% shield HP bonus, only titan that can do a large amount of damage with normal weapons (7 citadel launchers = melts battleships), best damage type for doomsday. -Wyvern/Chimera - best carriers/mom's for taking a lot of damage for a short period. Shield tanks are good at that. -Phoenix - Citadel torps > turrets when attacking BS's and other capital ships. By far. -Charon - Highest capacity freighter. -Golem - best PvE ship. -Widow - imo, one of the best solo ships. Can jam pretty much any targets, and has rof bonuses and an extra missile slot. -Rokh - Best sniping battleship atm. -Raven - Best missile BS. With torps is lethal, with precision cruise is good for wiping out support in fleets. Also, best PVE T1 battleship by far. -Scorpion - Best ECM ship in the game. Absurdly useful in fleets. -Nighthawk/Vulture - Absurd tanks that need to be nerfed. -Drake - Best tank of any of the battlecruisers. -Ferox - actually pretty awesome for sniping frigates. -Eagle - wipes out frigate, one of the best support HAC's. -Cerberus - Best missile HAC, insane for killing smaller ships, with very good damage output, and can tank and gank setup at the same time. -Rook - Best EW recon. Jamming bonuses make it almost as good as the scorpion (same, but one less mid). -Falcon - great ship to use in combination with other force recons. Love these things. -Onyx - Best tank of any of the HIC's, tbh. Actually I'll stop here. Getting bored. Basically, if anything Caldari need a nice big, forceful swing of the nerf bat. That's great Zantrei, I buy HACs and BCs just so I can kill frigates. Shield tanks - take a lot of damage for short amount of time? and then they die.. awesome feature. Also thank you for explaining the great "Support" and "PvE" role of all the caldari ships you listed above.. it was very entertaining!
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:52:00 - [75] omg.... this thread, just omfg
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:52:00 - [76] Originally by: Xennith Originally by: Black Scorpio Oh i quite like it but to give it as an example of pure win.. lol... good support maybe. scorpions are generally primaried in fights because everybody knows just how much trouble they can be. theres a lot more to winning a fight than DPS. disagree if you want (and judging by your recent side-splitting, i guess you do). Or how easily they die.. and your point is?
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:53:00 - [77] Quote: Infact, aside from the Nemesis, do any of the Gallente ships with missiles launcher hardpoints actually get a bonus to them? Ok i loled, take megathron for example, yes you get missile hardpoints but you are a gunboat ffs!. Raven gets turret hardpoints also but no damage bonus to turrets.... -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 17:54:00 - [78] Cpt Fina: You dont have to read it. -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Black Scorpio	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:00:00 - [79] I guess if i understand the OPs gripe is that he is detesting the fact that a ship specific bonus on so many caldari misile ships is a kinetic only bonus to damage, while each other race's ship that relates to damage is damage for anything the ship can field, or other useful bonuses, i.e. rof, speed, tank, cap, etc.. That's all. Do you all need to come out and "show" how much you know about Eve by trying to make the OP look like an idiot, i don't know, but i get the point of his topic. Does it need to be changed? I've lived with it for about 3 years, and i don't mind it, i could see a benefit of changing the bonus on all ships affected from 5% kinetic to 5% damage or 5% rof, but that's for the guys at CCP to decide.
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:01:00 - [80] Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 18:04:46 Letouk: only crow gets 10% bonus to kinetic, all other ships get 5%. Bonny Lee: in the end yes if nothing else is possible at least give us EM also... -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Letouk Mernel	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:03:00 - [81] Edited by: Letouk Mernel on 04/03/2008 18:03:39 Yes, and they can make crows 5% kin and 5% thermal, and all others 3% kin and 2% thermal. My opinion is this: I understand your gripe, but they won't replace a damage bonus with some other bonus, they had their reasons for giving ships a damage bonus, so the only possible "fixes" to what you're complaining about are nerfs.
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:06:00 - [82] Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 18:07:09 Letouk what you talking about i already mentioned you the other races. Gallente for example do thermal and kinetic and get bonus to both. Why you have to split damage bonus to caldari? then split it for all the others also. Correct way is 5% to kinetic or 5% to thermal missile damage. -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Bonny Lee Caldari Trinitas Inc. Phoenix Allianz	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:08:00 - [83] You dont understand?? In this worst case for Caldari we would lose kinetic but get EM. => cry => all damage typs => the other races cry => nerfd to death: em hope you can follow me ;)
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:10:00 - [84] Bonny Lee: and why it has to be this way, also im not asking for a all damage bonus only a 2 type damage bonus. Sacrilege is the prime example of the problem here, why a non missile race gets a ship with an ALL damage bonus to missiles? Whats the logic? i dont get it? because amarr cry more than caldari? -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Nasta443	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:11:00 - [85] Lirt are you an alt of UmaThurman? Honestly.
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:11:00 - [86] Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 18:11:32 No nasta443 im not. -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Zantrei Kordisin True Centii	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:16:00 - [87] Originally by: Black Scorpio That's great Zantrei, I buy HACs and BCs just so I can kill frigates. Shield tanks - take a lot of damage for short amount of time? and then they die.. awesome feature. Also thank you for explaining the great "Support" and "PvE" role of all the caldari ships you listed above.. it was very entertaining! If you were a PVPer, you would value those roles. Evidently you are not; in which case why are you arguing? The best mission running/npcing/etc ships are Caldari by far.
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:20:00 - [88] Zantrei actually you are a little wrong. Raven is very good for npc because it gets an all damage bonus to missiles, not all caldari ships. And i already said raven is fine exactly because it gets an all damage bonus. Imba because of that bonus? no, then why not put it in all caldari ships? -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"
Zantrei Kordisin True Centii	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:25:00 - [89] Originally by: Lirt Zantrei actually you are a little wrong. Raven is very good for npc because it gets an all damage bonus to missiles, not all caldari ships. And i already said raven is fine exactly because it gets an all damage bonus. Imba because of that bonus? no, then why not put it in all caldari ships? The simplest way to put it is this. For turret ships, a damage bonus is given as they are confined to primarily one damage type. Caldari get their primary damage type, and an added bonus of having the option to use any other damage type they want. Why is that unbalanced? If anything, it's a bonus that Caldari has over other races. When other races have the ability to pick and choose their damage types and keep the same level of damage, it will be balanced for Caldari to have it. Right now? I want some of what you are smoking. It must be good.
Lirt Ceratias Holboelli	Posted - 2008.03.04 18:28:00 - [90] Edited by: Lirt on 04/03/2008 18:32:28 Originally by: Zantrei Kordisin The simplest way to put it is this. For turret ships, a damage bonus is given as they are confined to primarily one damage type. Caldari get their primary damage type, and an added bonus of having the option to use any other damage type they want. Why is that unbalanced? If anything, it's a bonus that Caldari has over other races. When other races have the ability to pick and choose their damage types and keep the same level of damage, it will be balanced for Caldari to have it. Right now? I want some of what you are smoking. It must be good. You get 2+ damage types with turrets, not one. And i already said changing ammo to non damage type doesnt have that much difference. Do you change from lasers to projectiles? to do kinetic? Im not talking about the all damage bonus on turrets, thats fine cause most turret ammo do 2 damage type only. Im talign about missile ships that get an all damage bonus, as well as caldari ships that get only 1 damage type unlike turret and other races missile ships. -------------------------------------------------- "Assumption is the Mother of Screw-Up"

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