I don't think that's going to happen seeing as how Zulu is planning to speak with the CSM again next week. It seems that CCP has learned a lesson or two about running things by the CSM before ummm... 'surprising' the community with news.



Good point and I'll poke someone about getting that going again.

I also wrote a quick blog about the events of today to try and put everything in one place: Minutes & Meetings

So far we have Meissa, Mittani, Two Step, and a few other CSM delegates (sorry -- can't be bothered to gather all the names) claiming to have had a meeting with one CCP manager, and claiming that good stuff was talked about, and claiming that we'll hear about it, eventually, maybe. 138 posts and 7+ hours later, and not a single CCP person has chimed to confirm even the most basic of facts; like even the meeting occurred, much less that anything substantial was discussed or that anything will be the result of it or even the vaguest of indications when. I predict that none will be forthcoming in the next several days either, seeing as CCP is incapable of staffing for the weekend.

Face it CSM: CCP has absolutely no respect for you, and by extension no respect for the players. They're just trolling you. Quelle surprise

MDD

This is a very fair point. Thanks for bringing it up.

I'd been talking to the CSM about something entirely unrelated a day or two before, but since I already knew what the content of yesterday's dialogue was going to be, I requested to be a part of the meeting as a fly on the wall. CCP Xhagen graciously accepted my request.

Obviously, since I am also under NDA as an employee (and since I'm part of the evil team of the one single guy in public relations that pursues press opportunities) I too cannot reveal the main bulk of the conversation. Sorry dads I am disappoint.

However, for what it's worth, as an EVE player I can say that I am wet-my-pants-silly-happy about where the meeting content is headed. Yes, this was a preliminary meeting, but it was absolutely positively necessarily so. That does put the CSM temporarily in a bit of a tough spot, but eh, they were elected to be in that tough spot and kinda campaigned to be there.

I'll get it out of the way here. This meeting was not about ponies. Sorry guys.

One of my main takeaways from the meeting (and my dealings with them separate from the meeting) is that the CSM will not be distracted from their stated mission. Their tactical use of a mini-PR campaign is a testament to that. Their immediate first responses to stuff Zulu had to say also speaks volumes to their undeterrability. They haven't "called a truce" or been sated.. yet. See Mittani's Red Meat comments in this thread. Their questions were myriad and delivered stalwartly. Also, they haven't been threatened with the NDA wagged in front of their faces. They have stood quite firm in their priorities--and are very much of the mind of many of you that it's going to be "watch what we do" .

They are right in saying that nothing of detailed substance was said during the meeting--however there was apparently enough vague substance to convince them that the next meeting should be promising indeed. Convinced enough to decide to come to you guys and give a progress report, treading dangeous political waters. If the preliminary meeting didn't smell of enough Red Meat, I severely doubt they would be here at all. We didn't try to convince them to speak to you guys.

Hope that addresses some of the meta-comments here about the CSM's behavior/communications. Sorry about the delay in coming here. I had to sleep.

This is a very fair point. Thanks for bringing it up.

I'd been talking to the CSM about something entirely unrelated a day or two before, but since I already knew what the content of yesterday's dialogue was going to be, I requested to be a part of the meeting as a fly on the wall. CCP Xhagen graciously accepted my request.

Obviously, since I am also under NDA as an employee (and since I'm part of the evil team of the one single guy in public relations that pursues press opportunities) I too cannot reveal the main bulk of the conversation. Sorry dads I am disappoint.

However, for what it's worth, as an EVE player I can say that I am wet-my-pants-silly-happy about where the meeting content is headed. Yes, this was a preliminary meeting, but it was absolutely positively necessarily so. That does put the CSM temporarily in a bit of a tough spot, but eh, they were elected to be in that tough spot and kinda campaigned to be there.

I'll get it out of the way here. This meeting was not about ponies. Sorry guys.

One of my main takeaways from the meeting (and my dealings with them separate from the meeting) is that the CSM will not be distracted from their stated mission. Their tactical use of a mini-PR campaign is a testament to that. Their immediate first responses to stuff Zulu had to say also speaks volumes to their undeterrability. They haven't "called a truce" or been sated.. yet. See Mittani's Red Meat comments in this thread. Their questions were myriad and delivered stalwartly. Also, they haven't been threatened with the NDA wagged in front of their faces. They have stood quite firm in their priorities--and are very much of the mind of many of you that it's going to be "watch what we do" .

They are right in saying that nothing of detailed substance was said during the meeting--however there was apparently enough vague substance to convince them that the next meeting should be promising indeed. Convinced enough to decide to come to you guys and give a progress report, treading dangeous political waters. If the preliminary meeting didn't smell of enough Red Meat, I severely doubt they would be here at all. We didn't try to convince them to speak to you guys.

Hope that addresses some of the meta-comments here about the CSM's behavior/communications. Sorry about the delay in coming here. I had to sleep.

This meeting was something of a surprise and the content of it was enough to convince me that CCP is taking the concerns of the CSM and the players very seriously. Beyond that I cannot say more.

I'll get it out of the way here. This meeting was not about ponies. Sorry guys.

This is one of the moments where we look at what CCP does and less of what CCP says.

... we discussed the players' concerns

...I can't disclose in what way yet.

I really think they will slam headlong into the NDA here.

I'm 99% sure that the only person above Zulu is Hilmar.

Thanks for your analysis, O mighty internet lawyer. Can you tell me exactly what law you think the CSMs might be faced with charges under? "A first degree charge of Saying Mean Things That Are Provably True"? So far as I know, none of them live in Iceland, so they'd have to be extradited to face any charges.

As for banning? Yeah that'd work well, real smart tactics. I can tell you've read your Machiavelli. Even apart from the tsunami of horrible PR that would generate, even apart from the massive shitstorm that would immediately occur within the playerbase, what do you think the reaction of the banned CSMs might be? Might there be some retaliation that they could take, do you think?

Dear CSM,

If you have nothing to say then don't say anything.

I like you guys so not reported for spam/trolling.

*Hugs*

THIS game needs an NDA because of the competitive nature of it. IE if I knew they were definitely going to remove ice from high sec tomorrow, guess what i'd be buying today?

Non-Disclosure Agreements have legal standing if, and only if, the information obtained and disseminated produces actual harm. In essence, unless trade secrets are leaked, the NDA isn't violated. A CSM coming out and saying, "Look, we talked about X with CCP, Zulu agrees, he's bringing it to the bosses" isn't a violation of trade secrets. At least I hope it isn't.

I mean, is making the game better to keep subscriptions a trade secret, now...?

I am just surprised it took this long to implement SM3.

SM3 came out in 2004, and people are butthurt that they can't play Eve on their PC anymore?

Do yourself a favour, go out and buy a nice decent graphics card. Turn Eve settings up to max and enjoy.

They are right in saying that nothing of detailed substance was said during the meeting--however there was apparently enough vague substance to convince them that the next meeting should be promising indeed. Convinced enough to decide to come to you guys and give a progress report, treading dangeous political waters. If the preliminary meeting didn't smell of enough Red Meat, I severely doubt they would be here at all. We didn't try to convince them to speak to you guys.

I hope in that context that CCP - at all levels - fully understands that for many of us our patience is no longer wearing thin, it has in fact worn through.

Of the dozen or so friends I used to attempt 'flying in space' with none play EVE any more.

That's right - zero.

C.

38.071 online, am i wrong or is it looking like a drop of about 12.000 players for an average saturday ?

38.071 online, am i wrong or is it looking like a drop of about 12.000 players for an average saturday ?

My own ideas on what should be added are irrelevant.

One thing, if you could mention it to them, and I would be appreciative.

After the cookie derp and the Incarna RAEG release, I thought maybe they decided not to publish any major changes or make any major changes just prior to the weekend. Y'know, on a Friday.

And here it is, the new forums went live at 10 after five... on a Friday. Is Screegs pulling overtime on the weekend just in case?

CCP may wonder why trust is such a hard sell to players. Could this be a reason?

Just sayin'. Making major changes ten minutes after typical "closing time" the day before a weekend might not be a great idea when you've made public statements that it wasn't going to happen again. (I guess it could have been worse... you could have done it before a long weekend for a major market share area.)

I had to sleep.