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Incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet in the game???

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Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 5667	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:17:00 - [61] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: You want to biiiiiitch about out of porportion faucet that makes a few into super rich at the cost of the other 99.99% look at Mineral/Catalyst faucet known as Tech Moons babe.. You mean those things that don't inject any ISK? Those things that require significant (and continuous) investments in manpower to acquire and keep running? Those things that exist exclusively in nullsec where they create wars and the losses of cubic kilometres worth of assets? Yeah, no. They're not really an issue for the economy. Nice straw man though GÇö fits right in with the ridiculous straw man of the OP. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Cambarus Baros Reloaded 142	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:18:00 - [62] - Quote Azure Moonlight wrote: Bounties arent a problem and never were and its not at all surprising they generate the most ISK. I think noone ever said otherwise. Incursions whereas are a problem, because they are totally out of proportion. A minimal number of players generating 1/3 of all bounty income on the server? Thats a small bunch of suddenly VERY rich people. That is hurting the economy and not primarily bounty income and what is attached to it. The problem with this mentality is that you're ignoring the fact that it's only the best people that get paid once systems start getting crowded. Not that vanguards don't need a nerf, because they do (and the larger sites need a buff) but come on, is it really that shocking that group oriented top tier PVEers make more isk doing PVE than people doing other forms of pve? Incursions SHOULD pay more than level 4s, and they SHOULD be about on-par with more risky forms of solo-pve. High rewards are an incentive to get people to work together, just as they're an incentive for people to take risks. Complaining about how much incursions pay compared to sites that you solo in nullsec is like complaining that highsec level 4s pay more than lowsec level 3s. Mind you there really should be a mechanic to force incursions in nullsec systems, but that's about the only problem with them on a highsec vs nullsec level. (though it is worth noting that CCP really should undo the changes where they made 90% of nullsec useless for the sole reason of encouraging people to fight over the 10% that isn't)
Falin Whalen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 173	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:25:00 - [63] - Quote Azure Moonlight wrote: Bounties arent a problem and never were and its not at all surprising they generate the most ISK. I think noone ever said otherwise. Incursions whereas are a problem, because they are totally out of proportion. A minimal number of players generating 1/3 of all bounty income on the server? Thats a small bunch of suddenly VERY rich people. That is hurting the economy and not primarily bounty income and what is attached to it. What is really scarry is that ~9 Bil from Incursions, is on top of the ~33 Bil for bounties. That is an aditional ~9 Bil being pumped into the economy that is not getting taken out by very many sinks to it. That is a setup for rapid inflation. You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons.
Poetic Stanziel Major Kong Freight 769	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:31:00 - [64] - Quote Falin Whalen wrote: Azure Moonlight wrote: Bounties arent a problem and never were and its not at all surprising they generate the most ISK. I think noone ever said otherwise. Incursions whereas are a problem, because they are totally out of proportion. A minimal number of players generating 1/3 of all bounty income on the server? Thats a small bunch of suddenly VERY rich people. That is hurting the economy and not primarily bounty income and what is attached to it. What is really scarry is that ~9 Bil from Incursions, is on top of the ~33 Bil for bounties. That is an aditional ~9 Bil being pumped into the economy that is not getting taken out by very many sinks to it. That is a setup for rapid inflation. You mean TRILLIONS, not billions. Three orders of magnitude difference, per month. The STAIN Travel Bookmark Collection - 451 Bookmarks
Farang Lo State War Academy Caldari State 9	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:33:00 - [65] - Quote quite stupid that 25% isk generated drop into 1% of eve population
masternerdguy Inner Shadow NightSong Directorate 13	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:33:00 - [66] - Quote Farang Lo wrote: quite stupid that 25% isk generated drop into 1% of eve population There's only one solution: Occupy Incursions
Ottersmacker Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 101	Posted - 2012.03.18 19:56:00 - [67] - Quote Considering how risk-averse incursion fleets seem to be, it doesn't seem like a very hard thing to do (i've seen a 11-strong fleet with 3 logistics stand down because someone had a war dec from a 2 man corp with no online members, this caused an aggro timer to one of the logistics and the entire operation stood down for 15 minutes). I can only wonder what declarations of war or sudden appearances by thrashers and tornados can do. The Order of the Falcon or Hin +¡slenska f+ílkaor+¦a is a national Order of Iceland
baltec1 834	Posted - 2012.03.18 20:05:00 - [68] - Quote Bat Country shall look into this to see what we can do.
Mortimer Civeri Aliastra Gallente Federation 24	Posted - 2012.03.18 20:23:00 - [69] - Quote Ottersmacker wrote: Considering how risk-averse incursion fleets seem to be, it doesn't seem like a very hard thing to do (i've seen a 11-strong fleet with 3 logistics stand down because someone had a war dec from a 2 man corp with no online members, this caused an aggro timer to one of the logistics and the entire operation stood down for 15 minutes). I can only wonder what declarations of war or sudden appearances by thrashers and tornados can do. If you are not in an NPC corp we don't want you, is that going to be next, besides the officer fit Zelot/Guardian? That which does not kill you, makes you stronger.-á Friedrich Nietzsche That which does not kill you, hurts like hell.-á UNKNOWN
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:04:00 - [70] - Quote Tippia wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: You want to biiiiiitch about out of porportion faucet that makes a few into super rich at the cost of the other 99.99% look at Mineral/Catalyst faucet known as Tech Moons babe.. You mean those things that don't inject any ISK? Those things that require significant (and continuous) investments in manpower to acquire and keep running? Those things that exist exclusively in nullsec where they create wars and the losses of cubic kilometres worth of assets? Yeah, no. They're not really an issue for the economy. Nice straw man though GÇö fits right in with the ridiculous straw man of the OP. Correct the moon goo faucet. Don't tell me it is not a faucet that is not lining the wallets of a very few . You are telling me there are not considerable investments in man hours devoted to incursion running? I often fly 6 billion ISK ships in certain fleets & am surrounded by man ships that cost the same or more... 20-80 man fleets. It required alot of work to get these fleets running hunny. YOU ARE TELLING ME MOON GOO IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR THE ECONOMY?!?!?! YOUR BS IS PILED SKY HIGH IN THAT STATEMENT GIRL
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:09:00 - [71] - Quote Ottersmacker wrote: Considering how risk-averse incursion fleets seem to be, it doesn't seem like a very hard thing to do (i've seen a 11-strong fleet with 3 logistics stand down because someone had a war dec from a 2 man corp with no online members, this caused an aggro timer to one of the logistics and the entire operation stood down for 15 minutes). I can only wonder what declarations of war or sudden appearances by thrashers and tornados can do. BEEN DONE BEFORE... what happens now is the war decked doesn't get reps & dies... standing order for his stupidity for not reading my fleets MOTD.
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:10:00 - [72] - Quote Farang Lo wrote: quite stupid that 25% isk generated drop into 1% of eve population prove that statisic... Until you do I say incursion runners are 10%+ of the eve population... prove me wrong... Yep you can't becuase you are clueless about the real numbers
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:17:00 - [73] - Quote Azure Moonlight wrote: Bounties arent a problem and never were and its not at all surprising they generate the most ISK. I think noone ever said otherwise. Incursions whereas are a problem, because they are totally out of proportion. A minimal number of players generating 1/3 of all bounty income on the server? Thats a small bunch of suddenly VERY rich people. That is hurting the economy and not primarily bounty income and what is attached to it. Since when has nuevo rich ever become a problem in an economy?!?!?! Quite the opposite: Nuevo rich always invigorate economies
Jas Dor Republic University Minmatar Republic 74	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:25:00 - [74] - Quote Null sc requires supercaps. To get isk for supers people turned to botting. A bunch of bot isk drove inflation. Now 0.0 is going to get nerfed because alliance leadership turned a blind eye to botting.
Terajima Kazumi Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore 51	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:29:00 - [75] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Tippia wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: You want to biiiiiitch about out of porportion faucet that makes a few into super rich at the cost of the other 99.99% look at Mineral/Catalyst faucet known as Tech Moons babe.. You mean those things that don't inject any ISK? Those things that require significant (and continuous) investments in manpower to acquire and keep running? Those things that exist exclusively in nullsec where they create wars and the losses of cubic kilometres worth of assets? Yeah, no. They're not really an issue for the economy. Nice straw man though GÇö fits right in with the ridiculous straw man of the OP. Correct the moon goo faucet. Don't tell me it is not a faucet that is not lining the wallets of a very few . You are telling me there are not considerable investments in man hours devoted to incursion running? I often fly 6 billion ISK ships in certain fleets & am surrounded by man ships that cost the same or more... 20-80 man fleets. It required alot of work to get these fleets running hunny. YOU ARE TELLING ME MOON GOO IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR THE ECONOMY?!?!?! YOUR BS IS PILED SKY HIGH IN THAT STATEMENT GIRL Moon goo doesn't create ISK, it merely moves it.
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:37:00 - [76] - Quote Terajima Kazumi wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: Tippia wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: You want to biiiiiitch about out of porportion faucet that makes a few into super rich at the cost of the other 99.99% look at Mineral/Catalyst faucet known as Tech Moons babe.. You mean those things that don't inject any ISK? Those things that require significant (and continuous) investments in manpower to acquire and keep running? Those things that exist exclusively in nullsec where they create wars and the losses of cubic kilometres worth of assets? Yeah, no. They're not really an issue for the economy. Nice straw man though GÇö fits right in with the ridiculous straw man of the OP. Correct the moon goo faucet. Don't tell me it is not a faucet that is not lining the wallets of a very few . You are telling me there are not considerable investments in man hours devoted to incursion running? I often fly 6 billion ISK ships in certain fleets & am surrounded by man ships that cost the same or more... 20-80 man fleets. It required alot of work to get these fleets running hunny. YOU ARE TELLING ME MOON GOO IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR THE ECONOMY?!?!?! YOUR BS IS PILED SKY HIGH IN THAT STATEMENT GIRL Moon goo doesn't create ISK, it merely moves it. Moon Goo is used to create items & affects those items costs. It has a VERY real affect to the economy. Are you going to tell me next that the cost of oil does not affect the economy?
Jack Miton Lapse Of Sanity Exhale. 146	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:49:00 - [77] - Quote The difference between null bounties and HS incursions is that null has always been there available to people whereas incursions just took everyone who did existing combat PVE in HS (and many other places) and tripled their income for no extra needed effort or skills or risk. Obviously living in null also inherently carries with it a level of risk that running incursions in HS simply doesn't. The fact that incursions were introduced is not really the issue. The issue is that they are severely unbalanced compare to any other form of PVE in terms of risk vs. reward and that there were no new isk sinks introduced along with the faucet.
Terajima Kazumi Enlightened Industries Test Alliance Please Ignore 51	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:52:00 - [78] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Terajima Kazumi wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: Tippia wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: You want to biiiiiitch about out of porportion faucet that makes a few into super rich at the cost of the other 99.99% look at Mineral/Catalyst faucet known as Tech Moons babe.. You mean those things that don't inject any ISK? Those things that require significant (and continuous) investments in manpower to acquire and keep running? Those things that exist exclusively in nullsec where they create wars and the losses of cubic kilometres worth of assets? Yeah, no. They're not really an issue for the economy. Nice straw man though GÇö fits right in with the ridiculous straw man of the OP. Correct the moon goo faucet. Don't tell me it is not a faucet that is not lining the wallets of a very few . You are telling me there are not considerable investments in man hours devoted to incursion running? I often fly 6 billion ISK ships in certain fleets & am surrounded by man ships that cost the same or more... 20-80 man fleets. It required alot of work to get these fleets running hunny. YOU ARE TELLING ME MOON GOO IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR THE ECONOMY?!?!?! YOUR BS IS PILED SKY HIGH IN THAT STATEMENT GIRL Moon goo doesn't create ISK, it merely moves it. Moon Goo is used to create items & affects those items costs. It has a VERY real affect to the economy. Are you going to tell me next that the cost of oil does not affect the economy? Economic impact != currency issuance.
DarthNefarius Minmatar Heavy Industries 82	Posted - 2012.03.19 01:59:00 - [79] - Quote Don't tell my that ISK faucets are only thing causing inflation... the minerals/botting problem is part of the inflation here ( funny less botts will be causing inflation ) &the monoloplies on moon goo faucets can create inflation too. But if you want to only cry about the ISK faucets bounties are the biggest faucet & they can be botted too. Incursions are not being botted.
Cipher Jones 363	Posted - 2012.03.19 02:04:00 - [80] - Quote Tippia wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: Stop explaining the truth to the trolls.. GÇªand the truth of the matter is that incursions make for a massive ISK faucet that is completely out of proportion to how many are doing it and where they're done. I miss the good trolls like Tom Gerard who at least injected humor into their like whoring and ambiguous statement making. Incursions are done everywhere but wormhole space, and wormhole space injects more ISK than Incursions. You can cry about how dangerous WH space is but since you have no kills or deaths there, I will take anything you say about wspace with a grain of salt. And by take with a grain of salt i mean "reject it for the rubbish theorycrafting it is". 04:25:37 Notify Cipher Jones, criminals are not welcome here. Leave now or be destroyed.
Farang Lo State War Academy Caldari State 11	Posted - 2012.03.19 04:42:00 - [81] - Quote last I check, isk from incursion all go into individuals' wallet. while to hold moon goo and profit from it, big alliance need to attract ppl with ship reimbursement program and ****. and as I know -A- has a reimbursement program for T3
YuuKnow 156	Posted - 2012.03.19 05:05:00 - [82] - Quote The fact of the matter is that Incursions were a boost to the PvE gameplay of Eve, fostered more cooperative gameplay, and promoted more social interaction. In regards to MMOs in general PvE and cooperate PvE has been, is, and will be a rather sizeable part of any successful MMO, Eve included. Those that like to minimize the importance to Eve's success that PvE has been, forget that those that PvE pay the same subscription cost as those that PvP do. yk
Xorv Questionable Acquisitions 169	Posted - 2012.03.19 06:24:00 - [83] - Quote YuuKnow wrote: In regards to MMOs in general PvE and cooperate PvE has been, is, and will be a rather sizeable part of any successful MMO, Eve included. PvE driven Themepark MMORPGs yes, but PvP driven Sandbox MMORPGs no, you're wrong!
Tarryn Nightstorm Hellstar Towing and Recovery 286	Posted - 2012.03.19 06:39:00 - [84] - Quote Mai Khumm wrote: According to the latest devblog. (Correct me if I'm wrong here) More ISK came from bounties then incursions. http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=9115 Mainly this quote... "ThereGÇÿs certainly a lot of money coming from Incursions.-á Incursion rewards in December amounted to 9.6 trillion ISK, which is an all time high, while the rewards in January and February were 9.0 and 8.7 trillion ISK respectively.-á ThatGÇÿs quite a bit of money entering the economy.-á However, Incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet, bounties are.-á Bounty prizes paid out in February totalled 33 trillion ISK." So Apperantly incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet, but then how come I keep on reading posts stating that it is and how it should be stopped... Oh wait, only null alliances are saying that, while having the bigger ISK faucet... You: Uninstall the client. Now. In irae, veritas.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 5687	Posted - 2012.03.19 07:32:00 - [85] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Correct the moon goo faucet. Don't tell me it is not a faucet that is not lining the wallets of a very few . Again, nice straw man. The issue isn't that a few people are getting rich GÇö the issue is that a massive amount of ISK is injected by a low number of participants. Quote: You are telling me there are not considerable investments in man hours devoted to incursion running? Compared to keeping a profitable moon? Nope. Quote: YOU ARE TELLING ME MOON GOO IS NOT AN ISSUE FOR THE ECONOMY?!?!?! What economical issues are there with moon goo? Cipher Jones wrote: Incursions are done everywhere but wormhole space, and wormhole space injects more ISK than Incursions. Wspace is also 0.0, and thus deserve a higher payout. More the to point, though, how many people are running those wspace sweeps? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Ottersmacker Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED 103	Posted - 2012.03.19 08:45:00 - [86] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: what happens now is the war decked doesn't get reps & dies... standing order for his stupidity for not reading my fleets MOTD. DarthNefarius wrote: I often fly 6 billion ISK ships in certain fleets i'm a pretty chill guy, but others are reading your post as well. With this attitude i wouldn't be surprised if you get visited by some battlecruisers who post a warning in local about flying 6b ISK ships and then call you stupid for not reading it after the inevitable tears. I'm not saying something like that will happen, but it should give a reasonable man some food for thought. The Order of the Falcon or Hin +¡slenska f+ílkaor+¦a is a national Order of Iceland
Sade Onyx Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 18	Posted - 2012.03.19 10:13:00 - [87] - Quote Poetic Stanziel wrote: That's an extra 10 trillion ISK that was not in the economy previously on a monthly basis. The 10 trillion ISK seems to be approximately 20% of the ISK Faucet economy ... so yeah, Incursions are having an effect. The bounty system was here before Incursions. Oh look, another example of a live herpaderp, lol not very good at understanding Economy are you?... Suggest maybe you dont comment on things you know nothing about? If the people who are running incursions right now, were NOT running incursions, like, I dont know..BEFORE Incursions came out.... what do you think they would be doing?... nothing? Perhaps in your mind they are having a lovley cup of tea while taking screenshots of ships?... maybe you believe them all to be sat on their sofa in the captains quarters watching the screen? Oh wait... you thought that before incursions people were running ship spinning contests? Because before incusions came out it never even crossed their mind to make any ISK what so ever... Seriously, either get a brain or admit that the whole incursion inflation thing was a story, a lie, a deception meant to catch simple minded people.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 5690	Posted - 2012.03.19 10:22:00 - [88] - Quote Sade Onyx wrote: Seriously, either get a brain or admit that the whole incursion inflation thing was a story, a lie, a deception meant to catch simple minded people. GÇªexcept that what they did before probably didn't inject nearly as much ISK into the economy, so no, it was actually none of those. It's just that the incursion defenders refuse to get the point and keep coming up with various-sized straw men rather than any actual facts or data to counter what we already know. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
baltec1 836	Posted - 2012.03.19 10:23:00 - [89] - Quote Sade Onyx wrote: Poetic Stanziel wrote: That's an extra 10 trillion ISK that was not in the economy previously on a monthly basis. The 10 trillion ISK seems to be approximately 20% of the ISK Faucet economy ... so yeah, Incursions are having an effect. The bounty system was here before Incursions. Oh look, another example of a live herpaderp, lol not very good at understanding Economy are you?... Suggest maybe you dont comment on things you know nothing about? If the people who are running incursions right now, were NOT running incursions, like, I dont know..BEFORE Incursions came out.... what do you think they would be doing?... nothing? Perhaps in your mind they are having a lovley cup of tea while taking screenshots of ships?... maybe you believe them all to be sat on their sofa in the captains quarters watching the screen? Oh wait... you thought that before incursions people were running ship spinning contests? Because before incusions came out it never even crossed their mind to make any ISK what so ever... Seriously, either get a brain or admit that the whole incursion inflation thing was a story, a lie, a deception meant to catch simple minded people. They would be injecting a lot less isk into the system.
Tarryn Nightstorm Hellstar Towing and Recovery 289	Posted - 2012.03.19 10:53:00 - [90] - Quote J3ssica Alba wrote: That's why I added it to my sig. But jelly people are just blinded and see only what they want to see Ad hominem attack in your post, and blatant appeal to authority in your sig. Very nice, but you need to be a little less obvious about it. Unless you actually have a legitimate argument to prove your assertion? Yeah, I thought not. It is you and CCPSoundwave who are deliberately blind here, not us. In irae, veritas.

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