Hi, didn't read all of what you said... but here is the thing

High sec is not suppose to be where you can earn the most isk without much risk (besides suicide ganks)
anywhere els you have to be aware of who is in local either by scanning constantly for probes on scan (in wormholes)
constantly checking local in 0.0... (trying to rat in systems often camped by people with covert cynos ready to hotdrop 30 bombers on your income ships)

Risky space is suppose to be worth more than high sec, regardess of who holds it (just because it's a big alliance and coalition holding a large region or ten... doesn't make it 100% safe like high sec...

So -10% income on rats in high sec is fine. it's either that or buff it everywhere els.

Incursions too... shouldn't pay much more than a lvl 4 missions in high sec... but in low sec the payout is fine as is.

You said so yourself. Most will just quit.

Once we make it impossible to place a POS in highsec this game will get interesting again.

Prices will adjust and things will continue as usual. Not really much to see here.

lol everytime EVE has expanded warfare and pvp subs went up, when they put in expansions that introduced nothing but risk-free highsec carebear money machines like Incursion, Tyrannis and Incarna, CCP almost died.

CSM elections by the player base, CCP market research and even advertisements all agree on what type of content is drawing new players into EVE, and it isn't some sort of gay concord-protected decshielded station docking bullshit

You have pretty much condensed it to where it is going, OP.

High sec is going to become unplayable. "Be afraid" you say. Who? 10 years now, CCP have tried, tried and failed to herd the masses to null sec. You said so yourself. Most will just quit.

Who should be afraid here?

Yes indeed, one CCP person making such statements as has been done has not considered the serious long term repurcussions.

Be Afraid ? I would say it's very much like commercial suicide on CCP's behalf.

To all the null sec zealots, I am certain that all these changes provide you with immense glee.
But if you notice the title of the thread, it was not addressed to you.

You laugh now. You will continue to laugh as the high sec tears spread.
I imagine you will continue to laugh into the early / mid fall, until CCP announces there is a drop in subscriptions..

subs only drop when highsec is catered to, see incursion and tyrannis

hth

Datacores: If you are smart, you will cash out before Inferno. Soundwave says those words between 8:30 of the interview. He believes the datacore system is "terribly abused". Those are his words. BTW, there will be an ISK charge to get your datacores from an agent

High sec Incursions: Some kind of nerf. This has been done to death in a ton of threads, no need for comments

ALL NPC bounties: At 13:45 to 15:00, a nerf of a suggested 10% across the board, all regions. Soundwave called this the "emergency button" button. Of course, at 12:50 of the interview that 10-15% of all NPC kills came out of Drone Regions. I doubt it will be a one to one ratio, but if they nerf all NPC income by 10%, yet Drones start having bounties, will not that be a wash for null sec income, but a high sec income nerf.

Mining: No direct comment on high sec mining, but it will be better as low end mins prices rise, assuming null sec mining does not crank up. Soundwave at 11:35 says 40% of the high end minerals come from the null regions. That means nothing to high sec miners, but will kill high sec industrialists who rely on their high end mins from null sec being sold in high sec

High sec transaction taxes: At 13:28, he says empitransaction cost going up, because they want to reign in the economy. This has the biggest impact of course on the high sec players

Soundwave makes it clear that he wants to shake Eve to its foundations. He says, and once again a quote " I kind of hope things go terribly wrong" at 8:02 of interview. I understand he does not want to design a game for specific results (his words), but many of the changes are going to trash high sec industrial chars specifically

...

If they killed carbear in EVE I would put money on it, EVE would drop to max 30K Subs with 6K login (like it used to be not that many years ago) and with CCP's current debt, the company would bankrupt.

it's really rather amusing, all this peanut gallery gibberish. Most of the people talking out of thier ass don't know or care to know the history of EVE..

To all the null sec zealots, I am certain that all these changes provide you with immense glee.
But if you notice the title of the thread, it was not addressed to you.

You laugh now. You will continue to laugh as the high sec tears spread.
I imagine you will continue to laugh into the early / mid fall, until CCP announces there is a drop in subscriptions.

I am looking forward to how people that have a raft of subs with chars focused on datacore production will find a way to justify keeping their accounts open. Some fellow posted in the industry forum he has quite a few accounts designed primarily for datacore farming. How many accounts pray tell will he need / feasibly run in low sec FW to get those same datacores?

And when some high sec mission runner sees his income nerfed 10%, I am sure he will have no problem just playing 10% more to gain the same income.

And when some industrialist who hates null is getting murdered trying to compete with null sec industrialists, no problem there. I am sure he will have a complete change of heart and join goons.

Plus all those incursion runner who opened up new accounts because of the income that they got from Vanguards, I am certain they will keep those accounts open.

But hey, it's OK.
You zealots do your happy dance now.

It will be interesting to see if CCP is doing a happy dance as well say around October.

I bet the population that experiences the most amount of churn is people who never leave high sec. CCP is just trying to allow carebears to experience the fun the rest of us are having. People who do nothing but mine or run missions must be miserable.

Yes indeed, one CCP person making such statements as has been done has not considered the serious long term repurcussions.

Be Afraid ? I would say it's very much like commercial suicide on CCP's behalf.

I bet the population that experiences the most amount of churn is people who never leave high sec. CCP is just trying to allow carebears to experience the fun the rest of us are having. People who do nothing but mine or run missions must be miserable.

here allow me

unprecedented steady growth and retention of users in a fickle MMO market for nearly 10 years until highsec-exclusive, anti-PVP expansions were ushered in, bringing about the summer of rage until CCP wisened up and started making PVP-related expansions again

threats of 'put highsec in pvp and watch us all leave' made by idiots were exposed as nothing but hot air, with all evidence pointing to the exact opposite

That's snake oil propaganda that's only usefull in the forum wars.

Every single account holder in EVE over 6 months old has been to null and was greeted by a wall of excuses from tinfoil hat null bloc's that had every right to be paranoid because of the huge impact Meta has on a broken permissions system. We all went there with billions, got sold a bill of goods and ended back in high sec farming missions to replace our ships.

If you play a high sec game and have not seen this interview, watch it, and then make plans of moving out of high sec, or quitting the game.

Instead of adapt or die, I will be considering adapt or quit

http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve-online/interviews/inferno-part-one

What Soundwave is saying is pretty much further expounding on everything that came out of Fanfest

Highlights of what he says in the interview

Datacores: If you are smart, you will cash out before Inferno. Soundwave says those words between 8:30 of the interview. He believes the datacore system is "terribly abused". Those are his words. BTW, there will be an ISK charge to get your datacores from an agent

High sec Incursions: Some kind of nerf. This has been done to death in a ton of threads, no need for comments

ALL NPC bounties: At 13:45 to 15:00, a nerf of a suggested 10% across the board, all regions. Soundwave called this the "emergency button" button. Of course, at 12:50 of the interview that 10-15% of all NPC kills came out of Drone Regions. I doubt it will be a one to one ratio, but if they nerf all NPC income by 10%, yet Drones start having bounties, will not that be a wash for null sec income, but a high sec income nerf

Mining: No direct comment on high sec mining, but it will be better as low end mins prices rise, assuming null sec mining does not crank up. Soundwave at 11:35 says 40% of the high end minerals come from the null regions. That means nothing to high sec miners, but will kill high sec industrialists who rely on their high end mins from null sec being sold in high sec

High sec transaction taxes: At 13:28, he says empitransaction cost going up, because they want to reign in the economy. This has the biggest impact of course on the high sec players

Soundwave thinks that the economy is approaching a place that is "not healthy". He has started playing Ultima Online again and he does not want the Eve economy to reach the point that Ultima's is in

Soundwave makes it clear that he wants to shake Eve to its foundations. He says, and once again a quote " I kind of hope things go terribly wrong" at 8:02 of interview. I understand he does not want to design a game for specific results (his words), but many of the changes are going to trash high sec industrial chars specifically

Guess the null sec power blocs are getting want they want
Even though the power blocs are losing direct control of moon goo, the wealth of that moon goo is staying in null sec
The high sec players are getting shafted as the overall potential wealth generation in high sec is lowered

This is of course what many of the null sec zealots have wanted for quite some time

I have done my time in null sec and wh's. I will not be choosing that option of joining a low sec/ null sec/ wh corp if my income gets squeezed as badly as I forsee. I will be choosing the remaining option of quitting

If you're playing Eve today and you're not on board with the future, which is WiS, Avatars, paid customization and more hisec consensual content (FW, War Decs, etc) then your days are probably somewhat numbered, because it is a lot more work for CCP to cater to the 8 or 10 year old player than it is to cater to the one week old newbie..

also nullsec anomaly running is way too safe and there's too little risk because of BUBBLES AND LOCAL nobody ever loses ratting ships in nullsec, hisec incursions are the riskiest pve in the game because one time i heard from some dude in my vanguard fleet that his corpmate lost his nightmare when one of the logis lost his connection

CTA tax was 100% and we had CTA tax pretty much every time I logged in so that was never really a debate for me.

As nobody asked.. Your Stuffs, I can haz?

tl;dr - endeavor starfleet once joined some crappy nullsec renters because they're the only ones that would take in his equally worthless main before getting run back to highsec because it was full of quitters just like him who gave up at the first sign of adversity

lol full api key to rent space, where does he think of this ****?

your leader lets you rat in your space? ours just yells at us to use Incursion alts because they're both more profitable and safer, then jump clone back to fight for space

truly the rewards of nullsec space vs incursions is balanced indeed

People like you just don't get it. You view hisec as the great unwashed or the rebels. They wont be your fodder and they wont be your target (Or free victim) so what does that make them to you.

sov holding is basically a gimmick whose only real benefit is allowing you to build supercaps and upgrade ihubs to allow more anoms to spawn so that nobody will bother running them

hey anyone reading this i have a noctis tackled in NIZJ-0 in esoteria but my anathema can't crack the noctis' passive shield regen


someone plz help i will fleet u and you can warp to this anom and we will share this km : twisted:

http://i.imgur.com/2fgg8.jpg

also most of you pve lovin hisecers are all worthless because you do nothing but grind for your next plex, what you going to tell me that pve in eve is fun? why do you even play this game quit and gtfo

I don't believe CCP is dumb enough to stomp on hisec players that hard. Especially after the many nerfs the players have already experienced

So what exactly is wrong with getting EVE back on track again?

I never found 0.0 that risky but only stayed there about a month. Get rid of local then you could really call it risky.

EVE IS DYING!!!11!00001011!


What? Wrong thread?

Risk vs reward is what this game was founded on, and it's broken, way broken. High sec income needs to drop by 1/2 across the board, or content needs to be revamped to actually be difficult (lvl4s for example were created before rigs or T3 BSs were released).

so why is it so easy to farm rats in 0.0 with 0 risk?

yeah you're pretty dumb

it's really rather amusing, all this peanut gallery gibberish. Most of the people talking out of thier ass don't know or care to know the history of EVE.

There was a time there was no Concord and EVE was the wild west of MMO's with "HTFU EVE" mantra ruling the skies of New Eden.
They alos couldn't break 5K subs with that model and soon changed it.
Since that time, CCP stopped being an Inde corp and became a larger entity with debt to reflect it.
If they killed carbear in EVE I would put money on it, EVE would drop to max 30K Subs with 6K login (like it used to be not that many years ago) and with CCP's current debt, the company would bankrupt.
A company that is 10 years old is not old, it's a new company. A company that went from 75K revenue to 6 million revenue a month in 10 years is what is known to investors as a bubble.

EVE is not a l33tboi PvP bear game. EVE is a sandbox. It is Industry, it is exploration, it is PvE, it is PvP, it is mining, manufacturing, it is many, many things and you can smack talk all you want but the fact is, EVE needs all its players. It needs them all to feel achieved and it needs them to be having fun.

Or
It
Dies.

Because they made it safe for themselves.

They, not CCP.

then again you probably don't consider losing access to your assets and having to firesale at 50% jita price a risk or you failed to consider that in your assessment because lol one month in nullsec

btw since it was so safe why didn't you stay there ;p

Would you like to expand on your comment?


We used to get hostiles coming through you could see them entering the system and just avoid them if you wished. As well as reporting their whereabouts.

But it would have been more interesting without local.

low sec should have the best rewards then.....

far harder to keep low sec secure than it is some 0.0 region at the end of the universe a million jumps from anywhere

Chances are Mittani and crew will be kicking and screaming and whinging behind the scenes right up to the moment the ring-mining change happens and all the static moon goo wealth goes away.

The fact that you think that anybody on the CSM is against a tech rebalance is hilarious.

clearly you are qualified to give these insights because of the whole month you spent in nullsec

it's not like making cloaks overpowered is an issue

so why is it so easy to farm rats in 0.0 with 0 risk?

You keep saying "tech rebalance" as if it doesn't meen "moon goo income armageddon"

Removing trillions of isk of guarenteed passive income each month from the game and forcing nullsec alliances to actually put players in space to gather resources in a way that can be interdicted by other players in small gangs is so fair beyond the word "rebalance" its rather funny too.

Once we make it impossible to place a POS in highsec this game will get interesting again.

Please tell us who is offending you from behind and what we can do to help make it stop?

Removing trillions of isk of guarenteed passive income each month from the game

**** highsec industry tbh

Why is it that the people who say how easy and safe it is to farm BS rats and mine ABC ores in 0.0 are all mining veldspar and doing level 4s in hi-sec?

You have pretty much condensed it to where it is going, OP.

High sec is going to become unplayable. "Be afraid" you say. Who? 10 years now, CCP have tried, tried and failed to herd the masses to null sec. You said so yourself. Most will just quit.

Who should be afraid here?

but if they nerf all NPC income by 10%, yet Drones start having bounties, will not that be a wash for null sec income, but a high sec income nerf

Last time I checked EVE was supposed to be a sandbox style game. So why dose CCP feel the need to take all my sand away and force me to play where i don't want to?

Last time I checked EVE was supposed to be a sandbox style game. So why dose CCP feel the need to take all my sand away and force me to play where i don't want to?

Why is it that the people who say how easy and safe it is to farm BS rats and mine ABC ores in 0.0 are all mining veldspar and doing level 4s in hi-sec?

Where did they say that they will be forcing people to move somewhere?

Right, they didn't.

Seriously chill out.

The problem with Eve the last few years is it got horribly stale and boring. People got stuck in their ways and much of the game turned into yawnsville online. Soundwave is right that it needs shaking to the core. Many forms of hisec income are too easy. Lowsec income definitely needs boosting in terms of interest and profitability and Nullsec passive moon income needed shooting in the head.

I wouldn't worry too much with theories of goon csms getting all they wanted btw. Chances are Mittani and crew will be kicking and screaming and whinging behind the scenes right up to the moment the ring-mining change happens and all the static moon goo wealth goes away. That will be the single most significant change the game has seen since moon-mining was introduced and it will turn 0.0 back into a brutal bloody warzone where alliances smash themselves to pieces in the quest for regional security and mining opportunity.

Impact on the rest of the game -> potentially immense as the prices of t2 ships and modules skyrocket - maybe it'll become more difficult for the average player to replace missioning nighthawks in the future but frankly - good.

Eve should be about interconnected systems where actions in one part of space impact players everywhere else. Last few years its like Hisec and Nullsec where separate shards and thats not how the game should work.

They don't have to directly say it.

Their actions/changes speak just as loud as words.



Like the time they tried to spread out the mission runners and instead forced mission runners to be more compacted away from the borders of low-sec.

I left nullsec..

I left it because it is a load of dog crap that rewards good ole boys and large alliances over small dedicated ones. Where asking for invasive Full API keys is now normal due to absurdly broken corp and POS mechanics. Where new players get shunned as potential spies due to said mechanics. Where FCs feel free to call kitchen sink CTAs and say "Don't like mah CTA? GTFO of Corp or log off" Where corps feel free to say "Don't report blue bots" Where major RMT operations run. Where lazy ass renters gather and never bother to read on the future of EVE much less care

And to be frank CCP It looks like you have barely just stated on this mountain of crap. Corp and POS fixes in 2013? They should have been planned with Inferno instead of shiny new (and will be abused) wardec system. Nothing about AFK cloaking?

I am not going back to nullsec until it is fixed. And yes that means I will sooner quit EVE after hisec sledgehammer nerfs hit than go back to null not having fun. The threat of members going back to hisec content is about the only thing keeping member abuse in check and once that is gone I will have better things to do than support a broken game by that point.

EVE is not a l33tboi PvP bear game. EVE is a sandbox. It is Industry, it is exploration, it is PvE, it is PvP, it is mining, manufacturing, it is many, many things and you can smack talk all you want but the fact is, EVE needs all its players. It needs them all to feel achieved and it needs them to be having fun.

On day one of Fanfest, Seleene sitting with CCP Sunset and Soundwave said he saw so many "Carebears" coming to Fanfest, and Soundwave's face became a bitter scowl, it was rather illuminating. It's true that some emotions are hard to conceal but maybe I'm being paranoid. but to me, he doesn't appear to approve of that kind of play style.

A grain of truth amidst all the whining and complaining.

What did you expect? Think back to Sim City. After you've built this fantastic city with all your time and hard work.........the very next thing you did was send godzilla or a meteor shower or some other diasaster to your little world. And watch it burn. Then build it back. EVE is CCP's Sim City. Why should they want it to be easy and passive? They want to toss in a few grenades and watch us scramble around trying to survive. They wouldn't have it any other way.....unless we won't pay for it, hehe.

On day one of Fanfest, Seleene sitting with CCP Sunset and Soundwave said he saw so many "Carebears" coming to Fanfest, and Soundwave's face became a bitter scowl, it was rather illuminating. It's true that some emotions are hard to conceal but maybe I'm being paranoid. but to me, he doesn't appear to approve of that kind of play style.

Has CCP said what proportion of the player community plays exclusively in highsec?

I'd want to be very careful about biting the hand that feeds if I were them.

As to whether I'll throw in the towel after these nerfs go into effect, I'll have to see how badly it bites my ability to make ISK. Already tried nullsec gameplay is it sucks kinda badly from my point of view, so highsec is where I live.

I'm pretty sure Soundwave doesn't have any issues with a particular play style. I certainly don't because I've probably spent as much time building things as I have destroying them. v0v

CCP won't do anything to endanger their hisec dwellers. They might prod them and touch them in some places, but they won't risk alienate the people not willing to go into lowsec, WH or nullsec.

Asides for suicide ganks which are more common along miners or going for +2bil fits and can-baiting, pushing people averse to PVP into PVP will not work. They are settled in their own ways and most of them would look for something else where they could do similar activities.

Despite all their high and mighty attitude, CCP is still a company trying to make money. So, withing limits, the more people joining the game and having a decent start-up experience, thus sticking with the game, the better.

Thus, we need to take into account that quite a lot of people are in "protected" space. Which means, discounting the PVP-ers, that they may be at least equal to the people in lowsec and nullsec, where supposedly the risk is a constant. After that, we need to take into account that most MMO players are "carebears" which like to bash NPCs.

Therefore, CCP will have limited maneuver space to modifying game-play in hisec.

The MAJORITY (which isn't you Goonwaffle) subscribes (with money) to the notion it's a SANDBOX. It's not hard to visualize the really good and experienced players (Read: YOU Goonwaffles) have evolved a game for themselves that allow them to set up their own dynasties in null sec. Low sec players [can] be situated in between the beginners and the pros, too good to be in hi sec, not quite organized enough to move into null.

You're subscribing a bit too hard to the idea that we seriously sit around and worry about that publords do in highsec. Other than some people who do stuff there like market action, mineral compressing, jump freightering most of us only occasionally care. (Other than of course if we're having celebrations in highsec~. I hope you stocked up on Caldari ice after Riverini told you of Bat Country's heroic interdiction). There's even a pretty nice market hub down here with competitive prices on stuff that is important to what we do.

A bunch of idiots decided to try and wipe a member corp off the map and after goodness how long of sieging them they got chased off in two days when we all came down to defend our allies. And then there's bigger things like people who will kick us out of our home by febuary, and people who don't want their moons in Tenal anymore.

Soundwave makes it clear that he wants to shake Eve to its foundations. He says, and once again a quote " I kind of hope things go terribly wrong" at 8:02 of interview. I understand he does not want to design a game for specific results (his words), but many of the changes are going to trash high sec industrial chars specifically

Mommy?

Datacores: If you are smart, you will cash out before Inferno. Soundwave says those words between 8:30 of the interview. He believes the datacore system is "terribly abused". Those are his words. BTW, there will be an ISK charge to get your datacores from an agent

ALL NPC bounties: At 13:45 to 15:00, a nerf of a suggested 10% across the board, all regions. Soundwave called this the "emergency button" button. Of course, at 12:50 of the interview that 10-15% of all NPC kills came out of Drone Regions. I doubt it will be a one to one ratio, but if they nerf all NPC income by 10%, yet Drones start having bounties, will not that be a wash for null sec income, but a high sec income nerf

High sec transaction taxes: At 13:28, he says empitransaction cost going up, because they want to reign in the economy. This has the biggest impact of course on the high sec players

I understand he does not want to design a game for specific results (his words), but many of the changes are going to trash high sec industrial chars specifically
...
I have done my time in null sec and wh's. I will not be choosing that option of joining a low sec/ null sec/ wh corp if my income gets squeezed as badly as I forsee. I will be choosing the remaining option of quitting

Hi, didn't read all of what you said... but here is the thing

High sec is not suppose to be where you can earn the most isk without much risk (besides suicide ganks)
anywhere els you have to be aware of who is in local either by scanning constantly for probes on scan (in wormholes)
constantly checking local in 0.0... (trying to rat in systems often camped by people with covert cynos ready to hotdrop 30 bombers on your income ships)

Risky space is suppose to be worth more than high sec, regardess of who holds it (just because it's a big alliance and coalition holding a large region or ten... doesn't make it 100% safe like high sec...

So -10% income on rats in high sec is fine. it's either that or buff it everywhere els.

Incursions too... shouldn't pay much more than a lvl 4 missions in high sec... but in low sec the payout is fine as is.

To all the null sec zealots, I am certain that all these changes provide you with immense glee.
But if you notice the title of the thread, it was not addressed to you.

You laugh now. You will continue to laugh as the high sec tears spread.
I imagine you will continue to laugh into the early / mid fall, until CCP announces there is a drop in subscriptions.

I am looking forward to how people that have a raft of subs with chars focused on datacore production will find a way to justify keeping their accounts open. Some fellow posted in the industry forum he has quite a few accounts designed primarily for datacore farming. How many accounts pray tell will he need / feasibly run in low sec FW to get those same datacores?

And when some high sec mission runner sees his income nerfed 10%, I am sure he will have no problem just playing 10% more to gain the same income.

And when some industrialist who hates null is getting murdered trying to compete with null sec industrialists, no problem there. I am sure he will have a complete change of heart and join goons.

Plus all those incursion runner who opened up new accounts because of the income that they got from Vanguards, I am certain they will keep those accounts open.

But hey, it's OK.
You zealots do your happy dance now.

It will be interesting to see if CCP is doing a happy dance as well say around October.

And when some high sec mission runner sees his income nerfed 10%, I am sure he will have no problem just playing 10% more to gain the same income.

If you play a high sec game and have not seen this interview, watch it, and then make plans of moving out of high sec, or quitting the game.

...

High sec transaction taxes: At 13:28, he says empitransaction cost going up, because they want to reign in the economy. This has the biggest impact of course on the high sec players...

...
Guess the null sec power blocs are getting want they want
Even though the power blocs are losing direct control of moon goo, the wealth of that moon goo is staying in null sec
The high sec players are getting shafted as the overall potential wealth generation in high sec is lowered.

This is of course what many of the null sec zealots have wanted for quite some time

I have done my time in null sec and wh's. I will not be choosing that option of joining a low sec/ null sec/ wh corp if my income gets squeezed as badly as I forsee. I will be choosing the remaining option of quitting.

I have done my time in null sec and wh's. I will not be choosing that option of joining a low sec/ null sec/ wh corp if my income gets squeezed as badly as I forsee. I will be choosing the remaining option of quitting

Bounties nerfed because ships ae too easy to kill?

Christ why not make the ships tougher instead? And while you're at it, put sleeper AI on all the rats, even the highsec missions.


Infact I wish they'd overhaul highsec missions entirely, I run them regularly because I'm a standings ***** with an OCD to hit 10.0 with everything, I would love them to be more engaging and intuitive.

This is actually the best idea I have heard.

How quickly we go from "It's a sandbox. Do what you want." TO "EVE is supposed to be a....(insert ill-considered, self-centered definition.)" This is why few of these people can be trusted. It's not that they're dishonest (which most of them are). It's that they can't juggle complicated things in their minds. It's got to be all THIS or all THAT with them.

The MAJORITY (which isn't you Goonwaffle) subscribes (with money) to the notion it's a SANDBOX. It's not hard to visualize the really good and experienced players (Read: YOU Goonwaffles) have evolved a game for themselves that allow them to set up their own dynasties in null sec. Low sec players [can] be situated in between the beginners and the pros, too good to be in hi sec, not quite organized enough to move into null.

The OP has some of the charecteristics of a modern mindset, but "instantgratification" seems the most complete one I've read sofar..

Idiot.

You have one bizarre view of instant gratification.
If you think the weeks of work researching, then getting the data core skills, the research management skills, then the grinding of standings to get access to L4 R&D agents for multiple chars is "instant gratification", you are clearly out of your mind.

Also, try setting up some industry where in some cases it takes months to research blueprints to profitability, and then get back to me about "instant gratification".

Idiot.