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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Merfio Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.11.26 17:18:00 - [301] Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:18:01 Originally by: Seishi Maru Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 16:42:25 Originally by: Sannye Edited by: Sannye on 26/11/2009 16:36:09 Merfio,do you have troubble reading? No, you have. They were in since a few days. Not since tonight. Get your facts straight plz. And btw you ever thought of suicide possibilties to get down SBUs quickly? Plz take a note how much damage torps do on stationary targets. Theyre just fecking awesome on them. youmean on hypotetical targets inside 36 km? Anythign shorter than 60 km is waste of time. Well plz try to see the bigger picture. SBUs are used for breaking sov in the new system. They have like 20.000.000 hp? How many suicide phoenix will you need for this? not even 20 i guess. Your bumping arguement doesnt count on that imho. And they have no forcefield.
Myheart Aflame	Posted - 2009.11.26 17:42:00 - [302] Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:12:04 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:10:44 About that this has changed last night: Quote: The new version of the Citadel Torpedo follows the same trend as other unguided missiles. The explosion velocity is slightly higher than that of the Citadel Cruise Missiles (or 2250) which means target painters will have to be utilized in many situations to achieve full damage potential. They do considerably more damage than their missile counterparts, with reduced range and velocity. The explosion radius of Citadel Cruise Missiles will be set to 1500, which differs from the current 1000 explosion radius of Citadel Torpedoes on Tranquility. This value has remained the same throughout many capital ship changes since capital ships were introduced with a signature radius of 1000, causing imbalances with the weapon system. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=717 This more funny then i thought. It is already on the server since the introduction of the citadels cruises. Bot noone seems to be interested in testing them on Sissi. Yay eft warriors.
Seishi Maru The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.11.26 17:45:00 - [303] Nope. You lack understanding of how things really are nowadays. No reasonable alliance has ANY issues to field enough dreads to finish up any POS or target in less than 1 siege cycle. Singe the minimum time will always be 10 minutes, there is NO advantage at ALL to be able to kill some static target faster. Dread performance is ONLY relevant on capital to capital combat. Even if dreads had all 30% less dps they would be far more than enough to kill common pos and static targets on the numbers any alliance can field nowadays. Therefore MORE damage against POS is IRRELEVANT in 90% of situations. Unless CCP woudl drop siege cycle to 5 minutes....
Merfio Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.11.26 17:51:00 - [304] Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:55:27 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:52:09 Originally by: Seishi Maru Nope. You lack understanding of how things really are nowadays. No reasonable alliance has ANY issues to field enough dreads to finish up any POS or target in less than 1 siege cycle. Singe the minimum time will always be 10 minutes, there is NO advantage at ALL to be able to kill some static target faster. Dread performance is ONLY relevant on capital to capital combat. Even if dreads had all 30% less dps they would be far more than enough to kill common pos and static targets on the numbers any alliance can field nowadays. Therefore MORE damage against POS is IRRELEVANT in 90% of situations. Unless CCP woudl drop siege cycle to 5 minutes.... And your failing to understand , that your nowadays things are changing most likely next week. I am trying to take that into account. You still dont answer my thought about the new SBUS, which can be multiple in a system and it might be interesting to have small teams killing those fast at night. We all dont know whats gonna happens with the new system. But plz dont pretend you already do. Im only making assumptions based on my own testing sessions. Another false thinking form you is that only big alliances, who can field like 100 dreads at the same time are relevant. What about these smaller entities? Ah right they dont count, theyre only pets from someone..... With these changes smaller alliances could make a difference when spreading out.
Sannye	Posted - 2009.11.26 19:38:00 - [305] The dev blog has been edited - explosion radius was 2500 on torps, 2250 on cruise the night that blog came out. That is has changed one of the latest updates is fine - but it is far from enough to make missiles a worthwhile DPS method. Is there any reason at all to have a phoenix on the field, compared to the revelation ? Try to answer that - and IF you think its a bonus for the smaller corps, you are dead wrong! The phoenix cant even carry enough missiles or torps for that matter in it's cargo hold, to give significant damage when you are in a small corp (you would need quite a few jumpfreighters with stront/torps) Again, even for the small corps, the revelation would be a much better choice. For anything pos related, the explotion radius of 2250 means that the torps would be useless - the revelation has a sig resolusion on 1000 m - again, the revelation would be able to shoot guns and structures and the phoenix woulnt. Is there even 1 argument for having a phoenix in your fleet? I really would like to hear it !
Juliette DuBois	Posted - 2009.11.26 19:42:00 - [306] Besides, who is going to suicide small fleet of dreads every time they want to take a stab at some system? And no, small entities won¦t have staying power to actually go through defended 0.0 system... They will run out of isk and get blobbed.
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2009.11.27 02:12:00 - [307] Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:12:04 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:10:44 About that this has changed last night: Quote: The new version of the Citadel Torpedo follows the same trend as other unguided missiles. The explosion velocity is slightly higher than that of the Citadel Cruise Missiles (or 2250) which means target painters will have to be utilized in many situations to achieve full damage potential. They do considerably more damage than their missile counterparts, with reduced range and velocity. The explosion radius of Citadel Cruise Missiles will be set to 1500, which differs from the current 1000 explosion radius of Citadel Torpedoes on Tranquility. This value has remained the same throughout many capital ship changes since capital ships were introduced with a signature radius of 1000, causing imbalances with the weapon system. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=717 This more funny then i thought. It is already on the server since the introduction of the citadels cruises. Bot noone seems to be interested in testing them on Sissi. Yay eft warriors. The only funny thing is the part were the Dev is actually trying to make it sound like the 1000 ms explosion radius of citadels was somehow overpowered in dread vs dread warfare, compared to turrets.
Seishi Maru The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.11.27 10:40:00 - [308] Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:55:27 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:52:09 Originally by: Seishi Maru Nope. You lack understanding of how things really are nowadays. No reasonable alliance has ANY issues to field enough dreads to finish up any POS or target in less than 1 siege cycle. Singe the minimum time will always be 10 minutes, there is NO advantage at ALL to be able to kill some static target faster. Dread performance is ONLY relevant on capital to capital combat. Even if dreads had all 30% less dps they would be far more than enough to kill common pos and static targets on the numbers any alliance can field nowadays. Therefore MORE damage against POS is IRRELEVANT in 90% of situations. Unless CCP woudl drop siege cycle to 5 minutes.... And your failing to understand , that your nowadays things are changing most likely next week. I am trying to take that into account. You still dont answer my thought about the new SBUS, which can be multiple in a system and it might be interesting to have small teams killing those fast at night. We all dont know whats gonna happens with the new system. But plz dont pretend you already do. Im only making assumptions based on my own testing sessions. Another false thinking form you is that only big alliances, who can field like 100 dreads at the same time are relevant. What about these smaller entities? Ah right they dont count, theyre only pets from someone..... With these changes smaller alliances could make a difference when spreading out. Evolution grandet the human being with a brain whose main capability is to annalyse situations and data and predict the future based on your understandings and experiences. Summarizing.. anyone with half a brain CAN and will predict 95% of everything that will happen after THIS or next or any other expansion. Everytime we warn ccp, they put connton intheir ears, say lalala!!! and push it anyway and 9 in 10 times it happens exaclty as we players with brain predicted. our line of tough on other hand is not based on annalysis how how players behave but how you would LIKE to players behave. No one wil spread their fleets because then they will be massacrated 1 by one. Try separating your gang of 40 dreads in 4 groups of 10 dreads then count later the numbers of "noob" or worse things you will get in your mail and local after the fight ends.
Merfio Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.11.27 14:16:00 - [309] Originally by: Seishi Maru Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:55:27 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:52:09 Originally by: Seishi Maru Nope. You lack understanding of how things really are nowadays. No reasonable alliance has ANY issues to field enough dreads to finish up any POS or target in less than 1 siege cycle. Singe the minimum time will always be 10 minutes, there is NO advantage at ALL to be able to kill some static target faster. Dread performance is ONLY relevant on capital to capital combat. Even if dreads had all 30% less dps they would be far more than enough to kill common pos and static targets on the numbers any alliance can field nowadays. Therefore MORE damage against POS is IRRELEVANT in 90% of situations. Unless CCP woudl drop siege cycle to 5 minutes.... And your failing to understand , that your nowadays things are changing most likely next week. I am trying to take that into account. You still dont answer my thought about the new SBUS, which can be multiple in a system and it might be interesting to have small teams killing those fast at night. We all dont know whats gonna happens with the new system. But plz dont pretend you already do. Im only making assumptions based on my own testing sessions. Another false thinking form you is that only big alliances, who can field like 100 dreads at the same time are relevant. What about these smaller entities? Ah right they dont count, theyre only pets from someone..... With these changes smaller alliances could make a difference when spreading out. Evolution grandet the human being with a brain whose main capability is to annalyse situations and data and predict the future based on your understandings and experiences. Summarizing.. anyone with half a brain CAN and will predict 95% of everything that will happen after THIS or next or any other expansion. Everytime we warn ccp, they put connton intheir ears, say lalala!!! and push it anyway and 9 in 10 times it happens exaclty as we players with brain predicted. our line of tough on other hand is not based on annalysis how how players behave but how you would LIKE to players behave. No one wil spread their fleets because then they will be massacrated 1 by one. Try separating your gang of 40 dreads in 4 groups of 10 dreads then count later the numbers of "noob" or worse things you will get in your mail and local after the fight ends. yeah and bombs are also useless and will however never be used in pvp. i gotcha.
Seishi Maru The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.11.27 14:42:00 - [310] Originally by: Merfio Originally by: Seishi Maru Originally by: Merfio Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:55:27 Edited by: Merfio on 26/11/2009 17:52:09 Originally by: Seishi Maru Nope. You lack understanding of how things really are nowadays. No reasonable alliance has ANY issues to field enough dreads to finish up any POS or target in less than 1 siege cycle. Singe the minimum time will always be 10 minutes, there is NO advantage at ALL to be able to kill some static target faster. Dread performance is ONLY relevant on capital to capital combat. Even if dreads had all 30% less dps they would be far more than enough to kill common pos and static targets on the numbers any alliance can field nowadays. Therefore MORE damage against POS is IRRELEVANT in 90% of situations. Unless CCP woudl drop siege cycle to 5 minutes.... And your failing to understand , that your nowadays things are changing most likely next week. I am trying to take that into account. You still dont answer my thought about the new SBUS, which can be multiple in a system and it might be interesting to have small teams killing those fast at night. We all dont know whats gonna happens with the new system. But plz dont pretend you already do. Im only making assumptions based on my own testing sessions. Another false thinking form you is that only big alliances, who can field like 100 dreads at the same time are relevant. What about these smaller entities? Ah right they dont count, theyre only pets from someone..... With these changes smaller alliances could make a difference when spreading out. Evolution grandet the human being with a brain whose main capability is to annalyse situations and data and predict the future based on your understandings and experiences. Summarizing.. anyone with half a brain CAN and will predict 95% of everything that will happen after THIS or next or any other expansion. Everytime we warn ccp, they put connton intheir ears, say lalala!!! and push it anyway and 9 in 10 times it happens exaclty as we players with brain predicted. our line of tough on other hand is not based on annalysis how how players behave but how you would LIKE to players behave. No one wil spread their fleets because then they will be massacrated 1 by one. Try separating your gang of 40 dreads in 4 groups of 10 dreads then count later the numbers of "noob" or worse things you will get in your mail and local after the fight ends. yeah and bombs are also useless and will however never be used in pvp. i gotcha. now many of the smart players ever said that. People said they would never be used until CCP gave them a reasonable not stupid cost. And we were right.. they started being used when ccp stoped with stupid prices lik 8 Mil per bomb. You should pay a bit more attention, there is a group of peopel in this forum very active that until today have basically never missed any prediction by more than a few inches... And ccp should start to pay attention on these people that can think and analyse how people behave (and now project an image of how they think people should behave).

Deva Blackfire 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2009.11.28 11:13:00 - [311] Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 28/11/2009 11:12:51 Can someone post the DPS on all 4 dreads with 3 damage mods using both close and long range guns (well, nag can have different amount of damage mods - not sure what setups they use)? Faction close range ammo where possible too.
Exquina	Posted - 2009.11.28 12:36:00 - [312] Hoi, Hoi I'm only sad that titan can 1shot anything smaller than supercarrier or itself. At lest properly fitted caps could survive. I haven't tried any officer fit on sisi for tanking a hit on dread and carrier from a Titans' DD, so I only hope u can pack up enough resists to survive a shot on TQ Dominion. Gallente are drone based race, that's how you introduced them. psst make a T3 cap ship via sleeper technology next, imo.
Theron Gyrow Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.11.29 11:40:00 - [313] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 28/11/2009 11:12:51 Can someone post the DPS on all 4 dreads with 3 damage mods using both close and long range guns (well, nag can have different amount of damage mods - not sure what setups they use)? Faction close range ammo where possible too. Copying from an old thread... If my numbers are correct (I now fear that I might have used the old RoF bonus for Nag instead of damage; someone check it, please): All dreads with maxed skills, 3damage mod, 5Bouncer II, short-range weapons and ammo (no faction ammo used, it is rare enough that I do not see people using it as a rule): Phoenix (new kinetic torps): 8547 DPS (8285 DPS from torps), 37km range. Naglfar with 2BCU2, 1Gyro2 (new EMP/PP/Fusion ammo, new torps): 2795 DPS from ACs, 3929 DPS from torps and 263 DPS from Bouncer IIs, so 6987 DPS total. 12.5km optimal and 24km falloff for guns, 37km range for torps. Almost full damage type choice. Moros (with 20%/level to drones): 6941 DPS (6416 DPS from guns), 15km optimal and 11km falloff. Revelation: 6485 DPS (6223 DPS from guns), 20km optimal and 6km falloff. All dreads with maxed skills, 3damage mod, 5Bouncer II, long-range weapons and shortest-range ammo (if no changes to arty DPS and rail/beam RoF same as in TQ): Phoenix (new kinetic cruises): 3671 DPS from missiles + 263 DPS from drones = 3934 DPS total, theoretical range 157km. Naglfar (new arty ammo, new cruises, 2BCU2, 1Gyro2): 1552 DPS from arties, 2140 DPS from cruises and 263 DPS from Bouncer IIs, so 3955 DPS total. 45km optimal + 87.5km falloff for arty, 157km range for cruises. Moros (with 20%/level to drones): 3182 DPS + 525 DPS from drones = 3707 DPS total, 60km optimal + 30.6km falloff (60km max range for drones) Revelation: 3743 DPS + 263 DPS from drones = 4006 DPS total, 45km optimal + 28km falloff Hope this helps. No faction ammo, since that is like, pretty rare, but you should be able to work them to the values pretty easily. -- Gradient forum
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2009.11.29 14:25:00 - [314] Originally by: Theron Gyrow If my numbers are correct (I now fear that I might have used the old RoF bonus for Nag instead of damage; someone check it, please): Your numbers aren't correct. They are pure raw DPS without any consideration to what you are shooting. Especially misleading on the Nag and Phoenix damage calculations due to sig radius. Also, your ranges are outdated. Hop on Sisi again.
Theron Gyrow Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.11.29 15:09:00 - [315] Originally by: Pohbis Originally by: Theron Gyrow If my numbers are correct (I now fear that I might have used the old RoF bonus for Nag instead of damage; someone check it, please): Your numbers aren't correct. They are pure raw DPS without any consideration to what you are shooting. Especially misleading on the Nag and Phoenix damage calculations due to sig radius. Also, your ranges are outdated. Hop on Sisi again. sigh Are the "pure raw DPS" values correct? Since I gave the DPS per weapon system type, it should be easy enough for the others to interpret the data if they are. Also, if you know the ranges are outdated, it would be much appreciated if you could let others know what the correct values are. -- Gradient forum
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2009.11.29 15:14:00 - [316] Originally by: Theron Gyrow sigh Are the "pure raw DPS" values correct? Since I gave the DPS per weapon system type, it should be easy enough for the others to interpret the data if they are. Also, if you know the ranges are outdated, it would be much appreciated if you could let others know what the correct values are. Sorry, I edited my post. No, I don't think your raw DPS numbers are even correct, since the bonuses have been swapped around according to the patch notes. I'm hopping on Sisi now, and as far as numbers go, I posted the latest citadel launcher numbers a few posts up not long ago.
Gronker Lonker	Posted - 2009.12.06 12:33:00 - [317] Originally by: Theron Gyrow Originally by: Deva Blackfire Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 28/11/2009 11:12:51 Phoenix (new kinetic cruises): 3671 DPS from missiles + 263 DPS from drones = 3934 DPS total, theoretical range 157km. Naglfar (new arty ammo, new cruises, 2BCU2, 1Gyro2): 1552 DPS from arties, 2140 DPS from cruises and 263 DPS from Bouncer IIs, so 3955 DPS total. 45km optimal + 87.5km falloff for arty, 157km range for cruises. Moros (with 20%/level to drones): 3182 DPS + 525 DPS from drones = 3707 DPS total, 60km optimal + 30.6km falloff (60km max range for drones) Revelation: 3743 DPS + 263 DPS from drones = 4006 DPS total, 45km optimal + 28km falloff Just did the calcs with the new EFT and i have some different values for the Naglfar: Naglfar: With your setup (2x BCU II, 1x Gyro II): Arties: 1455 DPS Cruise: 1741 DPS Drones: 262 DPS ---------------- Total: 3458 DPS Classic Setup (3x Gyro II): Arties: 1957 DPS Cruise: 1185 DPS Drones: 262 DPS ---------------- Total: 3404 DPS +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Phoenix, Revelation and Moros have the same DPS, as Blackfire computed.
Deva Blackfire Viziam	Posted - 2009.12.09 18:43:00 - [318] I didnt calc anything, s1 screwed up quoting ;p But thx for info

CCP Abathur C C P C C P Alliance	Posted - 2009.12.21 08:33:00 - [319] Please see this thread for updates.



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