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Musical Fist Gallente NAP Coalition	Posted - 2010.08.09 08:48:00 - [391] A fool and his plex are soon departed -- Recruiting now open!!
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2010.08.09 08:48:00 - [392] Originally by: Cap II People buy, sell, and trade in game items and characters every day. A simple search of eBay will show you this. So since you answered no, then please, enlighten us as to how the multitude of isk selling websites stay in business? ISK sales may not be tangible in the traditional sense, but people are paying real money to have their eve wallet go up X amount. You argument boils down to "I am ignorant of reality in this situation, yet i'll continue to speak." So i'll just go ahead and let you talk out your ass as you're doing a damn good job of helping me make you look stupid. No, they do not sell items/characters/etc because they do not own those items/characters/etc. The idiots who pay money to these people are buying, at most, a promise to perform certain in-game actions (a promise which can not be enforced). At no point does any character/item/etc change ownership, CCP still owns them. Consider an analogy: I have a pile of dirt I want moved. I offer you $20 to move the pile of dirt to the other side of my yard. You accept the deal, move the pile, and I give you the $20. At no point in this transaction has ownership of the dirt changed, so you have no grounds for claiming that the pile of dirt has a value of $20. The same is true of EVE: ownership of the items being moved around is not changing, therefore there has never been a character or item sale. -----------
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2010.08.09 08:53:00 - [393] Originally by: Cap II Oh and if you're really correct, go ahead and answer all the questions I posed to you, i'm sure your infinate wisdom will allow you to do this without issue. Easy: Quote: Do you agree that isk buying/selling takes place? No. There has not been even a single sale of ISK in the entire history of EVE. From the day the servers were first started up, every single ISK has been owned by CCP and that ownership has never changed. Quote: Are there buyers? No. See above. Quote: Are there sellers? No. See above. Quote: If ISK has no real world value then how do websites "selling" isk stay in business? By performing in-game actions involving items owned by CCP. Enough people feel that the unenforceable promise to perform those actions in exchange for money is worth giving real money to the "seller", however, no object is sold. Quote: If ISK has no real world value then why are people willing to buy or sell it? ISK has never been sold, therefore the question is flawed. -----------
Cap II GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.08.09 08:53:00 - [394] Edited by: Cap II on 09/08/2010 08:56:10 Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Cap II People buy, sell, and trade in game items and characters every day. A simple search of eBay will show you this. So since you answered no, then please, enlighten us as to how the multitude of isk selling websites stay in business? ISK sales may not be tangible in the traditional sense, but people are paying real money to have their eve wallet go up X amount. You argument boils down to "I am ignorant of reality in this situation, yet i'll continue to speak." So i'll just go ahead and let you talk out your ass as you're doing a damn good job of helping me make you look stupid. No, they do not sell items/characters/etc because they do not own those items/characters/etc. The idiots who pay money to these people are buying, at most, a promise to perform certain in-game actions (a promise which can not be enforced). At no point does any character/item/etc change ownership, CCP still owns them. Consider an analogy: I have a pile of dirt I want moved. I offer you $20 to move the pile of dirt to the other side of my yard. You accept the deal, move the pile, and I give you the $20. At no point in this transaction has ownership of the dirt changed, so you have no grounds for claiming that the pile of dirt has a value of $20. The same is true of EVE: ownership of the items being moved around is not changing, therefore there has never been a character or item sale. Your analogy is totally irrelevant as you plainly stated that the $20 is for the service of moving the dirt, not taking custody over it. Now consider this analogy: I come into possession of a 2010 Chevy Camero. I offer to sell it to you at a cost of $20,000 US and you accept. You give me the money and I give you the keys. It later becomes clear that I stole the car. What is the value of the car? You should probably read this as well http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/hoax/Hoaxipedia/Brooklyn_Bridge_Scams/ The main difference here is that in eve it is possible to take custody over property in game between 2 3rd parties, regardless of the fact that technically it is "owned" by CCP. [yellow]Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes[
Cap II GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.08.09 08:55:00 - [395] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Cap II Oh and if you're really correct, go ahead and answer all the questions I posed to you, i'm sure your infinate wisdom will allow you to do this without issue. Easy: Quote: Do you agree that isk buying/selling takes place? No. There has not been even a single sale of ISK in the entire history of EVE. From the day the servers were first started up, every single ISK has been owned by CCP and that ownership has never changed. Quote: Are there buyers? No. See above. Quote: Are there sellers? No. See above. Quote: If ISK has no real world value then how do websites "selling" isk stay in business? By performing in-game actions involving items owned by CCP. Enough people feel that the unenforceable promise to perform those actions in exchange for money is worth giving real money to the "seller", however, no object is sold. Quote: If ISK has no real world value then why are people willing to buy or sell it? ISK has never been sold, therefore the question is flawed. Thanks for demonstrating that you are totally ******ed. I have only one question. Does it hurt? Because if it doesn't it should. You've changed your argument from "I am ignorant of reality" to "LALALALALA FINGERS IN MY EARS I CANT SEE YOU SO YOU DONT EXIST LALALALA" [yellow]Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes[
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:04:00 - [396] This loss was less than a third of a Titan. Titans get destroyed now and then. Or, to put it another way, you can sell the titan and buy 18 years of game time instead of the 6 years of game time that was lost by the nincompoop who could't be bothered with taking 10 trips to minimize his losses even if he really truly had some sort of reason to move them because he had even stupider peopel he was selling them to that couldn't believe that they work from far a way. I buy plexes with isk and resell them higher the same way i might by a few dozen arbalest heavies or standard implants... so to me the plex isn't any different thatn another item. True, I can use if for game time, but in reality I have three accounts and the second and third account are really just game enhancements.. the same way a higher skill might enhance my game play or buying a new ship might enahnce my game play. I'm still one human being playing one game no matter how many accounts I have. PLexs are just a way to expand my game play as a result of my game play choices that allow me to earn the right to more characters with my isk. CCP is under no obligation to have players sell the plexes to other players if the buyer is is looking to use real money to buy isk Its really a very kind thing of them to let peopel buy free time with isk.. they could just sell isk directly to players for $ and not allow peopel like me to buy free game time. That is the other side of the coin. CCP gives away free game time to people like me all the time...if a few plexes get blown up it hardly will scratch the amount of game time they give out for free unnecessarily.
CyberGh0st Minmatar Ara Veritas	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:10:00 - [397] Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder The only thing wrong here is that drops are calculated on whole stacks. Maybe they should calculate drops of portions or % of stacks, and some PLEXes might drop Who ever get plexes and travel with them is accepting the risk for selling somewhere else for profit. I agree, but since CCP wants to treat PLEXes as any other item, it won't happen :p So it is all or nothing. All I can advice is that next time when someone flies out with a bunch of PLEXes, please unstack them first :p http://www.mmodata.net Favorite MMO's : DAoC Pre-TOA-NF / SWG Pre-CU-NGE
Ressiv Cooperative Freelance Navigators Association	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:20:00 - [398] Originally by: Cap II Thanks for demonstrating that you are totally ******ed. I have only one question. Does it hurt? Because if it doesn't it should. You've changed your argument from "I am ignorant of reality" to "LALALALALA FINGERS IN MY EARS I CANT SEE YOU SO YOU DONT EXIST LALALALA" baaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaaaa baaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaaaa Seriously tho: He is right in stating that you do not own ANY in game items AT ALL. You dont even own 'your' account. You are allowed to use it. The payed for, and protected by law, agreement on providing gametime is attached to the GTC. It is in no way attached to the PLEX. PLEX derives it's value from the option to turn it into gametime. This is in order to be able to negate the need for RMT. The person buying the GTC, converting it to PLEX' and selling them got their service. The person buying the GTC, converting it to PLEX' and proceeding to undock to trade them has a hole in is head where most people have brains because there is no need to do that. The person buying the PLEX', applying them to their account, got their service. The person buying the PLEX', and trying to transport them for moar pr0f!t$, gambles with them and should be free to do so. In all casses, no ownership changed. The right/ability to use something did. I can not sell you the pavement outside my door, for I do not own it. I can scam you into thinking I do own it, and try to sell you a worthless deed, but that doesnt make it hold up in court now does it ? ISK has no real world value. Period. What gives it a percieved value is the fact that some people choose to rather shell out some $$$ then invest a few hours. Opportunity cost if you like. Opportunity cost is not something that is fixed tho. It depends on the next best alternative. So while for some person the opportunity cost of a PLEX is 3 hours of gametime, the next person has 3 weeks of gametime attached to it, and yet another has his job/food on the table attached to it, and yet another $15,-. You can not state that ISK has real world value, beyond opportunity cost, unless I dont understand something correct, in which case I like to be corrected. ========================== Nothing is true, everything is permitted. ==========================
Cap II GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:26:00 - [399] I've never at any point suggested that any of us own anything related to this game infact i've stated the opposite outright. I've also stated that this lack of ownership does not mean that we cannot buy or sell these goods. And if you could go ahead and tell me what the difference between "perceived" value and real value is i'm all ears. I can tell you that if I were to sell someone isk the bills in my hand would be quite real. At this point one of you geniuses is going to say that I can't sell something I don't own, or i'm not actually selling the isk, but if the transaction takes place then the cash or check that the seller receives is quite real. But hey, its only "perceived" money right? [yellow]Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes[
Miss Connolly Public Relations Corp	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:50:00 - [400] Edited by: Miss Connolly on 09/08/2010 09:50:38 Originally by: Sarina Berghil It makes sense to have special rules for items that have real life monetary value, or represents real life services. As much as I hate imbeciles giving CCP free money (especially now when they don't deserve it) I disagree with the above quote. ALL items in EVE have a real life monetary value since you can legally buy ISK for RL money. A titan goes for about USD 3500-4000. A mom goes for about USD 1000-1500. And so on and so forth. So basically ever time an item gets destroyed you are destroying something with a real life monetary value - it's just a little bit less direct then in the case of PLEX. Edit: spelling ___________________ "It was mentioned by CCP that the data does not seem to support that polished quality sells better than new features." These are the people you are giving your money to.

Cap II GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.08.09 09:52:00 - [401] Originally by: Miss Connolly Originally by: Sarina Berghil It makes sense to have special rules for items that have real life monetary value, or represents real life services. As much as I hate imbeciles giving CCP free money (especially now when they don't deserve it) I disagree with the above quote. ALL items in EVE have a real life monetary value since you can legally buy ISK for RL money. A titan goes for about USD 3500-4000. A mom goes for about USD 1000-1500. And so on and so forth. So basically ever time an item gets destroyed you are destroying something with a real life monetary value - it's just a little bit less direct then in the base of PLEX. Congrats on being one of the only rational and logical people to post in this thread. It may be a club of just you and me right now but I think we can get more members. We should make our slogan "You can lead a fool to logic but you can't make him think" [yellow]Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes[
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:34:00 - [402] Originally by: Ascendic Originally by: Aerilis The gift card analogy looks good at first, but you missed a little tiny detail--Company X used to issue gift cards used to be indestructible and unstealable. But then Company X decided to change it so that gift cards were destroyable and stealable, and surrounded their store with muggers. On top of that, they made a deal with the muggers to get half the stolen gift cards back, and let the muggers keep the other half. Nailed it. Not really, no. What he said was incorrect: as mentioned roughly a bazillion times now, the gift cards Company X used to issue were destructible all along. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Aerilis Gallente Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:38:00 - [403] Edited by: Aerilis on 09/08/2010 10:38:45 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Ascendic Originally by: Aerilis The gift card analogy looks good at first, but you missed a little tiny detail--Company X used to issue gift cards used to be indestructible and unstealable. But then Company X decided to change it so that gift cards were destroyable and stealable, and surrounded their store with muggers. On top of that, they made a deal with the muggers to get half the stolen gift cards back, and let the muggers keep the other half. Nailed it. Not really, no. What he said was incorrect: as mentioned roughly a bazillion times now, the gift cards Company X used to issue were destructible all along. Ok fine. The previous "indestructible" gift cards could only be destroyed by right clicking on a special incinerator in the back of the store, and then clicking OK on a confirmation window. You can patch little holes like this forever, as all analogies are somewhat flawed, but I think I have all the important points covered. edit-****ed up formatting
Washell Olivaw	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:43:00 - [404] Anyone suggested yet that destroyed PLEX like these could be added to a pool which subsequently can be used to make them drop from rare NPC's? No game time ever destroyed, all of it paid for, in-game 'source' of PLEX, makes them a tiny bit more normal. Originally by: Signature Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
QT McWhiskers	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:46:00 - [405] Originally by: Vlayde Riser This is a joke right? Over 1000$ inside a t1 frigate piloted by an alliance leader, and he decides to undock it in Jita? How does someone with such poor common-sense manage to even lead an alliance? If it were me, I would've ordered every alliance member to hop in a logistics and to stick on my ass until all of those plexes were safe. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=3832139 Granted its not plexes, but its still very lulworthy. Originally by: CCP Incognito Originally by: Steve Celeste Would have been a nice drop, too bad that CCP set the drop chance for that item to ABSOLUTELY ZERO I would like to nip this in the but, PLEX drop just like any other cargo using exactly the same rules. If the PLEX are in a can and the can doesn't drop as loot then everything in the can doesn't drop as loot. In this case it was one role of the die and the can didn't drop, so bye bye all the contents. Sorry if someone else has said this, but I didnt see a can anywhere on that killmail. Could be my mistake, but all the killboards I have checked show no can. http://www.smalliance.com/killboards/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=2847 http://ad0pt.evekb.co.uk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=1539031 http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=11038826 Here is my two cents on this issue. The changes to the plex do not, will not, nor have they ever affected me. If one of my accounts needs a plex, I go to Jita or Amarr, and buy one. (I am in the militia so I dont go to dodi or rens.) Do I agree with what CCP does? No. Do I like it? No. However CCP is perfectly within their legal rights. Believe it or not, the actual obligation from CCP was gone when the person converted them into plexes. I personally think it is shady, but legal. Although not on the scale, but in the US. Home owners associations can take people's homes for not cutting their grass. (Even if the person, or persons are physically unable to cut it themselves.) While what CCP is doing is no where near as bad, it is still pretty shady. Another fun question for everyone here. How many people make plexes, put em up on the market, and they never get sold? I had two plexes up in Jita for a long time. (Was actually 6 but 2 just never would seem to sell.) Eventually I just gave up and used them. Honestly, if someone wants to make some money, go to the GTC forums here and make your money there.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:49:00 - [406] Originally by: Aerilis Ok fine. The previous "indestructible" gift cards could only be destroyed by right clicking on a special incinerator in the back of the store, and then clicking OK on a confirmation window. You can patch little holes like this forever, as all analogies are somewhat flawed, but I think I have all the important points covered. The important point is this: This introduces nothing new. Players still have to choose to "give CCP free money". CCP has just given you a destruction mechanism that isn't 100% certain to destroy the item, so if you choose to you can gamble that chance of non-destruction against the chance of earning more ISK. If you want to argue about the horridness of the change, gets your facts about that change right. àand, indeed, as far as the "free money to CCP makes CCP bad" line of reasoning, I still want to know why this particular set of choices is any worse or any different than if I choose not to log in for 30 days, even though I paid CCP for those days? Why isn't this bad behaviour on CCP's part? ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Serpents smile	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:51:00 - [407] Still going strong here. The forum warriors do not dissapoint. Originally by: QT McWhiskers Sorry if someone else has said this, but I didnt see a can anywhere on that killmail. Could be my mistake, but all the killboards I have checked show no can. If the plex where stacked, the entire stack gets destroyed (I'm told).
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:56:00 - [408] Originally by: Cap II Your analogy is totally irrelevant as you plainly stated that the $20 is for the service of moving the dirt, not taking custody over it. And it is equally plainly stated that CCP owns every single part of EVE, including every single in-game item and character. Only an idiot would believe that sending money to anyone other than CCP (who is not willing to sell those items) gives them ownership of any in-game item or character. The fact that some people are delusional and refuse to accept the obvious truth does not change the fact that ISK/characters/items/etc have never been sold. Quote: I come into possession of a 2010 Chevy Camero. I offer to sell it to you at a cost of $20,000 US and you accept. You give me the money and I give you the keys. It later becomes clear that I stole the car. What is the value of the car? Irrelevant analogy, as you are not buying any item (if you disagree, please explain exactly where in the transaction an item enters your possession) when you send real money to an ISK "seller". Originally by: Cap II You can quibble over terminology all you want, but the fact remains that every day Player A makes an agreement with Player B in that Player A agrees to send X amount of USD to Player B, and in return Player B agrees to send X amount of ISK to Player A. You can quibble over terms and definitions and ownership all you want but you cannot deny that this scenario takes place every single day. Well I guess you could deny it but at that point you'd just be deluding yourself. Yes, that scenario happens every day, however no item has been sold. A service (performing certain in-game actions with items owned by CCP) may have been sold, but no ISK has changed ownership no matter how much money you give to an ISK "seller". Therefore it is impossible to claim that ISK has any real-money value based on its current sale price. Like it or not, the current sale price of ISK is ZERO. It can't be sold, it can't be bought, therefore PLEXes, items, etc, all have zero real-money value. -----------
CyberGh0st Minmatar Ara Veritas	Posted - 2010.08.09 10:58:00 - [409] Originally by: Washell Olivaw Anyone suggested yet that destroyed PLEX like these could be added to a pool which subsequently can be used to make them drop from rare NPC's? No game time ever destroyed, all of it paid for, in-game 'source' of PLEX, makes them a tiny bit more normal. Interesting idea http://www.mmodata.net Favorite MMO's : DAoC Pre-TOA-NF / SWG Pre-CU-NGE
Aerilis Gallente Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:00:00 - [410] Edited by: Aerilis on 09/08/2010 11:00:55 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Aerilis Ok fine. The previous "indestructible" gift cards could only be destroyed by right clicking on a special incinerator in the back of the store, and then clicking OK on a confirmation window. You can patch little holes like this forever, as all analogies are somewhat flawed, but I think I have all the important points covered. The important point is this: This introduces nothing new. Players still have to choose to "give CCP free money". CCP has just given you a destruction mechanism that isn't 100% certain to destroy the item, so if you choose to you can gamble that chance of non-destruction against the chance of earning more ISK. If you want to argue about the horridness of the change, gets your facts about that change right. àand, indeed, as far as the "free money to CCP makes CCP bad" line of reasoning, I still want to know why this particular set of choices is any worse or any different than if I choose not to log in for 30 days, even though I paid CCP for those days? Why isn't this bad behaviour on CCP's part? Because CCP went out of their way to wring the playerbase for every last cent using the excuse of "making PLEX like every other item" instead of fixing lag. They must have had a reason for making them indestructible in the first place right? But then their greed got the better of them and they just what they could get away with... But at least you understand what is going on here, unlike those who are like LOL LOSING A PLEX IS SAME AS LOSING A BS HTFU NOOBS

QT McWhiskers	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:18:00 - [411] Originally by: Serpents smile Still going strong here. The forum warriors do not dissapoint. Originally by: QT McWhiskers Sorry if someone else has said this, but I didnt see a can anywhere on that killmail. Could be my mistake, but all the killboards I have checked show no can. If the plex where stacked, the entire stack gets destroyed (I'm told). OK I will accept that. I will have to look through my kill history though. I remember a few kills in the wormhole where salvage did split.
Cailais Amarr THE ORDAINED	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:23:00 - [412] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Like it or not, the current sale price of ISK is ZERO. It can't be sold, it can't be bought, therefore PLEXes, items, etc, all have zero real-money value. That's true to an extent. But clearly ISK has 'a' relative value because of the relationship between buying the game time service and its corresponding in game ISK value. What you cant do is convert ISK all the way back into real-money - the closest approximation is to convert it into game time (which you would otherwise had to have paid real money to have). Because we can do this conversion is possible to say that ISK has an approximate real money value - its just not practical to state that every time we make that comparison. Whilst items in game aren't "sold" in the literal sense (all of them being the ownership of CCP) they are exchanged within the framework of the game - again its not practical to state this every time we talk of 'exchanging' an item within that framework. What is sold, by CCP, is access to the EVE Online game service - which through conversion into the framework of the game (i.e a PLEX) can subsequently be lost without CCP having to honour the implied exchange of real money for access to the EVE Online service. It's that implication which creates the moral quandary and the resultant impression that CCP is getting money for nothing. Whether you think that is morally right is a question only each of us can answer alone. C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Carmen Opausia	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:30:00 - [413] I wonder if he had his frigate insured
Merin Ryskin Peregrine Industries	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:32:00 - [414] Originally by: Cailais It's that implication which creates the moral quandary and the resultant impression that CCP is getting money for nothing. There is no moral quandary here at all. You are never required to risk anything in the process of using PLEXes or GTCs. CCP has offered a system where you can buy, sell, and use PLEXes without ever having to expose them to any risk: simply buy them (after carefully reading the contract or sale price) and then apply them without taking them out of the station, or convert your GTC in the station you intend to sell the PLEX from and then immediately put it on the market/contracts. The only time your PLEXes are at risk is if you voluntarily decide to take risks in exchange for perceived gain. CCP does not require you to do so, so CCP can not be blamed if taking that risk results in losses. The entire "destroyable PLEX" change is a benefit to the players. Those who do not want risk experience zero change, those who wish to do risky things with their PLEXes are now able to do so. -----------
Yazus Kor Kotharat Logistics	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:38:00 - [415] Edited by: Yazus Kor on 09/08/2010 11:38:24 Don't get the whiners. What's the difference between buying 74 PLEX and losing them and redeeming 74 PLEX, buying that much in goods and losing it? Either way, pilot was stupid for spending that much cash on Internet spaceships in one go. "Beware, you who seek first and final principles, for you are trampling the garden of an angry God and he awaits you just beyond the last theorem."
Baneken Gallente School of the Unseen	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:43:00 - [416] Wow already 14 pages dedicated for stupidity, I wonder how many pages this can go on ? http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Murauke EvE Rookie Collective EvE Rookie Collective Alliance	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:45:00 - [417] I still dont see why you dont use the TimeCard Bazzar? Am i missing something here? Did he actually spend $1000 on those timecards or ISK?
Marlona Sky D00M. Excessum Messor	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:54:00 - [418] I had no idea so many lawyers played this game.
Halcyon Ingenium Caldari Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:57:00 - [419] The more I think of the possibility of getting an plex drop from blowing someones ship up the more I like the idea of people undocking with plex.
Cailais Amarr THE ORDAINED	Posted - 2010.08.09 11:59:00 - [420] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Cailais It's that implication which creates the moral quandary and the resultant impression that CCP is getting money for nothing. There is no moral quandary here at all. You are never required to risk anything in the process of using PLEXes or GTCs. CCP has offered a system where you can buy, sell, and use PLEXes without ever having to expose them to any risk: simply buy them (after carefully reading the contract or sale price) and then apply them without taking them out of the station, or convert your GTC in the station you intend to sell the PLEX from and then immediately put it on the market/contracts. The only time your PLEXes are at risk is if you voluntarily decide to take risks in exchange for perceived gain. CCP does not require you to do so, so CCP can not be blamed if taking that risk results in losses. The entire "destroyable PLEX" change is a benefit to the players. Those who do not want risk experience zero change, those who wish to do risky things with their PLEXes are now able to do so. CCP allows, through its in game mechanics, for a plex to be moved or lost. Admittedly it doesnt require this but is has enabled it. CCP could have enabled another mechanism - for example one where by a PLEX could be instantly transferred but chose not to. One would assume that it chose its current mechanism on the assumption that some PLEX items would be lost. When this event occurred it would receive money without having to then provide a service to a player; again CCP deliberately chose this option. The moral question in this case is should CCP have implemented its current mechanism rather than an alternative mechanism? Is it morally right to accept payment for a service you know you may not have to provide according to the rules you yourself have established? C. the hydrostatic capsule blog



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