The issue at hand is Risk vs. Reward - and this is a system that needs to be monitored and adjusted by CCP as outcomes to their system that they don't forsee arise.

It's interesting to see that there are still people who believe the current mineral prices are completely driven by player activities and completely ignore the changes to the game that drove those changes. The players are reacting to a change CCP made to other systems, and due to the complexity of eve an unfortunate outcome has arisen. Its players that place the buy/sell orders but its CCP that creates the system that drives the players.

Here is a relative value chart of ores based on current prices. The value is relative to the lowest valued ore. The numbers come from a break down of the mineral componenents of each ore type and are updated based on mineral values. I use this tool to tell me what to mine on a given day.

Take note that mining High End Scordite is just as valuable as Standard Arkonor.


Here is the same chart with prices from Pre-Incursion / Drone Nerf / T1 Loot revamp. The skew is towards the nullsec ores maintining a reasonable risk-reward scale.



edit * Actually this second value scale is really a perfect example of how it should look. Even the low-sec ores provide a benefit to the miner, but not quite as much as the nullsec ones. And the hardest to find ore - arkonor - is the king. It was brilliant.

PS - When was the last time you used a titan fleet to aquire a mineral belt in empire the way alliances claim -1.0 truesec systems in null? So dont even try to pretend nullsec mining is less work.

I'm Just curious to know what has ore prices got to do with building and selling stuff?


I don't understand why people like to say, this is solely a player driven economy. It is only correct to say it is partly driven by players. The environment and game mechanics has still got a lot to do with prices, and that is controlled by CCP.

The ore imbalance is pretty obvious and the new mining changes are a way to counter it, these changes set as an example proves that the developers also change the economy, just wait a few months from now.

~moronic pubbie post~

Industry that is non-highsec is broken your points are invalid.

That statement implies that non-highsec industry was functional at some point over the last 9 years.
And somehow became broken. Which is not the case. Industry that is non-highsec was designed that way and has been that way for years.

So you're saying that anything CCP hasn't bothered to fix in years is not broken? Simply because CCP hasn't bothered to fix it.

I am saying it is your opinion that it is broken. CCP designed it the way it is. The reasons for which players think they know the answer to and often times this is all misdirection and misinformation. Just like your post is.
Until CCP brings forth a proposal to fix something I do not consider it to be broken but a game design feature. Regardless of who ever claims it to be different. Everybody always has a hidden initiative.

Oh aug 2011. I can hardly wait for it.....Maybe by 2015, 2020?

At any rate it changes nothing about this thread.
Or the current here and now.

You claimed that Nullsec Industry wasn't broken because CCP hadn't said it was.
I showed that CCP had in fact said it was.

You post.... whatever this is.


By the way, the biggest problem with Nullsec Ore production is that the Ore is produced in fixed ratios due to the need to cycle sites to keep the industry level up. There's no "mine less Spud 'cause it's worthless," or "Mine Less Bistot*"

*Bistot is 32.2% of the Large Asteroid Cluster by volume. The Large Asteroid Cluster is generally what you cycle.

So what? Changes nothing about current supply and demand issues. This thread is not about changing null sec industry.
CCP has had 2 updates to the game since they suggested changes to null sec industry. That is last years news!
This is today and the winter update changes nothing again about null sec industry. Supply and demand will still control the price of ore as I stated in post 271 and 272. Broken null sec industry or not does not change that at all. The game today is what it is not something on a drawing board. That is my point.

Until CCP brings forth a proposal to fix something I do not consider it to be broken but a game design feature

How does broken null sec industry invaladate current supply and demand issues of ore?

Where did I say it did?


In 272, you claimed that Nullsec miners have "Pricing Power." Where's your evidence to support that? The fact that it takes effort to bring your product to market does not magically give you "Pricing Power"

~more mornic pubbie babble~

This ore imbalance is a joke, even Perpetuum has ores better balanced than this, and it's player driven too. Those small tweaks need to come from the Devs. Just look at Scordite description, they are meant for beginner miners.

'Scordite is amongst the most common ore types in the known universe. It has a large portion of tritanium plus a fair bit of pyerite. Good choice for those starting their mining careers.'

It's easy to say stuff like that. Changing the way the economy works is harder. The only real way CCP could make ore like scordite a real beginner ore is to cahnge what the economy burn in term of material. Find what destroy the most minerals in the game and add more low+¬null sec minerals to the bill of material list of said things.

Lets take ammo for example. Ammo gets burned every day in EvE which means some materials goes up in smokes. as an example, lets take an imaginary ammo of type X. (I don`t know industry number so I can't use a real value)

Ammo X bill of material per batch

10000 trit
5000 pyerite
2000 mexallon
1000 isogen
500 megacyte
100 Morphyte

The real way to incraese the price of high end stuff would be to chage the bill of amterial to.

10000 trit
5000 pyerite
2000 mexallon
1000 Isogen
1000 Megacyte
300 Morphyte

This technically triple the need for morphyte and double the need for megacyte in this particullar field. Of course ammo is only one market where the minerals go so changing only this would not change the pricing that much but it would be a start. You can play with the fabricaton cost of pretty much anything as long as something just as good is not seeded by NPC for a fixed amount of isk or the price rise generated by the new bill of material risk killing the need of prodution because people would only use the npc seeded item if it ever become cheaper.

You implied it with your post #276.

Well maybe 0.0 miners should stop mining just abc ores and stop flooding the market with those. And yes i do mine time to time in 0.0 myself, but mainly just to get some change for grinding npc sites.

In fact im suprised 0.0 miners havent switched to these more valuable ores, since those rocks in 0.0 should be pretty big by now.

Also i think 0.0 is safer then highsec. none will stay im belt mining when theres red or neutral in system..

It's easy to say stuff like that. Changing the way the economy works is harder. The only real way CCP could make ore like scordite a real beginner ore is to cahnge what the economy burn in term of material. Find what destroy the most minerals in the game and add more low+¬null sec minerals to the bill of material list of said things.

Lets take ammo for example. Ammo gets burned every day in EvE which means some materials goes up in smokes. as an example, lets take an imaginary ammo of type X. (I don`t know industry number so I can't use a real value)

Ammo X bill of material per batch

10000 trit
5000 pyerite
2000 mexallon
1000 isogen
500 megacyte
100 Morphyte

The real way to incraese the price of high end stuff would be to chage the bill of amterial to.

10000 trit
5000 pyerite
2000 mexallon
1000 Isogen
1000 Megacyte
300 Morphyte

This technically triple the need for morphyte and double the need for megacyte in this particullar field. Of course ammo is only one market where the minerals go so changing only this would not change the pricing that much but it would be a start. You can play with the fabricaton cost of pretty much anything as long as something just as good is not seeded by NPC for a fixed amount of isk or the price rise generated by the new bill of material risk killing the need of prodution because people would only use the npc seeded item if it ever become cheaper.

We just want industry balanced across the entirety of the game instead of favored in highsec and very unfavored in the rest of the game. That means nerfs and buffs to go around.

Ah, goon tears. Most delicious.