Will this mean no way of getting 1v1 frigate fights outside stations in highsec while waiting for trade orders to go through unless youGÇÖre in the same corp?

If so, that's kinda dull.

This is not just oddly intentional, it is very intentional. If we didn't want to penalise T3 death, we simply wouldn't have the skillpoint-loss mechanic in the first place

Will this mean no way of getting 1v1 frigate fights outside stations in highsec while waiting for trade orders to go through unless youGÇÖre in the same corp?

If so, that's kinda dull.

I have no issue with loosing skill point but i do not like the idea of not being able to eject to save your pod no matter what ship you are in.

With T3's why not make it to where if you eject from a T3 and that T3 gets destroyed while the pilot has a pvp flag, that pilot automatically loses skill points?

The are many engagements in eve where one player will almost certainly lose their ship and their pod if they don't perform specific actions...

For example, a hauler may get tackled by a combat ship and the only option he has available is to attempt to ecm jam the aggressor, and if that doesn't work, eject to save their pod. With your proposed change, that hauler would be an fool to attempt to escape using ecm as he will gain a weapons flag and be unable to eject for 60 seconds. You have just reduced that pilots options to - sit there and take it or lose everything.

How is that an improvement?

Wow! Did that mean a -5 cap on how far sec status could drop no matter how many ships you killed? That would be huge change. For some reason I was thinking ships kills dropped you a fixed amount (-3?) but were cumulative and that was to remain true.

But what if i want to lock two people fighting off a station/gate/etc, just to see how the fight is balancing up? I got bored reading at page 13 so have not seen this answered yet.... would it give me a criminal/suspect flag just because i want to watch two randoms fight?

Generally nice changes, but the NPC timer at 15mins is probably too long. I can understand why this was implemented, but seriously, if someone's hunting a PVE fitted ship, 5 mins is more than plenty to drop combat probes (scan within 1mil km) and tag the ship with a PVP flag. The longer period penalizes legit disconnects, increasing the likelyhood bad things happening to your ship while you struggle to get back online (if at all possible).

but retraining the same skills everytime you lose a ship is fun

so...

For T3 cruisers, if you are piloting the ship when it explodes, you lose a related skill level.

You used to be able to eject to avoid the loss of SP in any situation, but now that will not work if engaged in pvp? Is that intentional?

In my experience, most people prefer to go down fighting, and not eject for the pride factor, but still.

/edit
I did not read any of the thread, so this may well have been answered before

This was my understanding. But I'd like to hear from CCP if they're still planning this. Keep in mind that ship killing in high sec would still drop you below -5.

Thank you thank you thank you.

No more capitals logging off in sites when a new wormhole opens up to the system.

<3 you CCP

so...

For T3 cruisers, if you are piloting the ship when it explodes, you lose a related skill level.

You used to be able to eject to avoid the loss of SP in any situation, but now that will not work if engaged in pvp? Is that intentional?

In my experience, most people prefer to go down fighting, and not eject for the pride factor, but still.

/edit
I did not read any of the thread, so this may well have been answered before

I suppose you can argue it expedites the outcome of combat with obvious outcomes - and that those pilots should eject early and don't spoil a perfect ambush by petty revenge using drones to kill their drones or tackler.

PVP bait situations are even worse. Pilot goes after lone intruder and once he fires on it he gets tackled, can't eject and a ton of reinforcments begin arriving. if he could eject as soon as tackled or as first reinforcements show on directional...he could escape most bait tacklers that only have one warp jammer.

Please make sure the GMs are aware of these charts, how things are supposed to work, and that all these flags and timers are Logged. You're doing a re-design of a huge part of the game. "The Logs Show Nothing" will no longer be an acceptable excuse

Also, wardecs. Since war targets are always legal to shoot at, what flags will combat trigger and for how long? The Charts Show Nothing. The word "wardec" doesn't even appear on them. Will parties at war still be able to employ neutral remote-reppers without any consequences?

What I don't understand is this:

Why is it illegal to board a new ship for 60 seconds with a weapons timer?

Suppose a ninja in a frigate is attacked by a mission runner.

Ninja is able to survive the new NPC AI - and no outside help arrives for the mission runner.

Ninja is capable of holding the mission runner - but not breaking the tank. (a common situation)

Boarding a new ship (with more DPS) is key to breaking the mission runner.
What happens to the bait ship is largely unimportant.

Lets go pre-Orca oldschool:
Suppose an alt brings a Typhoon to the mission space, and ejects.
Under CW 2.0, the ninja is not allowed to board the Typhoon.
Why is this?

Even in the context of Crimewatch, this restriction makes no sense.

-Ninja's bait ship isn't leaving the field of battle or evading the consequences of combat. (locked = not scoopable)
-His Typhoon clearly isn't going anywhere until the battle is over.
-There is no 'hiding and escaping' going on, just bringing more firepower to the table to kill the carebear.

Its a simple matter of the carebear starting a fight that didn't end up being the fight intended.

Yet, for some reason - its now illegal.

I see a lot of smokescreens about T3's and 'evading consequences with Orcas.'
But none of this justifies arbitrarily preventing a player from boarding a new ship for 60 seconds.

But it seems that this is really about completely defanging ninjas (those who bait mission runners into shooting.)

Because forcing a ninja to turn off his guns for 60 seconds before being allowed to bring more DPS to the fight - well, the mission runner is going to dock up.

Is this really about providing consequences for 'criminals'? Or really - just coddling carebears?

It's fair because COMBAT is COMBAT, no matter against whom.
The PvPer could have a weak internet connection too, but of course,
mission runners want a special piece of the cake everybody gets ...

I'll reserve judgement unitl Super Friends blog comes out, but atm it's being implied that just the simple act of shooting first results in Kill Rights.

So if someone who's -4.9 charges me in a low sec belt and I do the intelligent thing and shoot, no matter the outcome they get kill rights ?

Thus, even in low sec, the only way i can avoid looking over my sholder for a month is to flip a can ? Or put myself at a distinct disadvantage by always having to wait for someone else to shoot first ?

Sorry, but if left unchanged you've very severly damaged low sec pvp.

The existing system, quite frankly, works perfectly. If you never get a chance to defend yourself ( ie: you get blobbed ) you can get payback 1 v 1. These proposed changed completely inbalance that.

I can see a great many people who principaly live in high sec, but who do random roams into LS, stopping under these circumstances. The risk to their main activities would be to great to warrant giving out kill rights to every target.

Low sec doesn't need fewer people pvp'ing it needs more, and this is a recipe for to kill that.


** Edit: Perhaps I've answered my own question. " Performing an action against another player that gets you a Criminal flag will also award a kill-right " On a more careful reading, Criminal flag would only apply to High sec agression ? So a failed suicide gank would carry the consequence of dealing killrights, but low sec agression would fall under the new PvP/LE flag and kill rights would apply only if the target couldn't/didn't defend themselves ?