I don't think I ever seen a rohk being used in pvp, except for that rare newbie who loses it 3 seconds later and have it lol-fitted. Now with Naga and other attack battlecruisers I doubt it have a use at all since its not cost-effective. If anyone have a fit that isn't lol and doesn't include hugging a station all the time or alts with logistics, please post it, I'm really curious.

and personally, I think that raven's role still needs rethinking - what is it supposed to be? med range torpedo boat? Unless torps are looked into, it still won't have enough range or damage application to be of much use and tornado will outperform it as torp boat due to better damage application. Cruise missile sniper? Contradicts idea of attack battleship and rokh will likely outlast, outgun and outperform it in long range combat role. Cannot really find third use of it

Imo, either given raven double range bonuses so it can reach decent range with torps - it would make it fairly unique ship due to ability to hit 50k+ with torps or just give it double damage or double damage application bonuses and make it proper 'attack battleship' due to (excellent) damage application with missiles, hybrid of these two just doesn't work; in any case, extra launcher or -1 launcher and 10% / lvl damage bonus would go long way in giving it bit more bang for its buck

I don't think I ever seen a rohk being used in pvp, except for that rare newbie who loses it 3 seconds later and have it lol-fitted. Now with Naga and other attack battlecruisers I doubt it have a use at all since its not cost-effective. If anyone have a fit that isn't lol and doesn't include hugging a station all the time or alts with logistics, please post it, I'm really curious.

The viability of missiles in fleet combat should IMHO be looked at by defining a role for them and sticking to it. Example follows:

CRUISE MISSILES AND HEAVY MISSILES: Absolute highest DPS at the ranges they are capable at (150-250km raven), with the drawback of flight time. I'd look at making standard Raven fleet fit in at 900dps+, with t1 cruise missiles at 150-250km and otherwise current mechanics.

TORPEDOES AND HAMS: Absolute highest DPS in game, but only functions against highly target painted and webbed victims. Base DPS at around 2000 for a gank fit torp raven using standard torps only, but requires 2-3 target painters to apply fully on a battleship. Without painters, 500-1000dps depending on target speed.

This would put the cruise missiles into an anti-capital fleet role, as smaller ships could often warp out when redboxed by the raven fleet. The minmatar typhoon could turn into a good old cruise cavarly setup, speeding above normal fleet fit BS'es to keep at 150-200km range where they deal the most damage.

The viability of missiles in fleet combat should IMHO be looked at by defining a role for them and sticking to it. Example follows:

CRUISE MISSILES AND HEAVY MISSILES: Absolute highest DPS at the ranges they are capable at (150-250km raven), with the drawback of flight time. I'd look at making standard Raven fleet fit in at 900dps+, with t1 cruise missiles at 150-250km and otherwise current mechanics.

TORPEDOES AND HAMS: Absolute highest DPS in game, but only functions against highly target painted and webbed victims. Base DPS at around 2000 for a gank fit torp raven using standard torps only, but requires 2-3 target painters to apply fully on a battleship. Without painters, 500-1000dps depending on target speed.

This would put the cruise missiles into an anti-capital fleet role, as smaller ships could often warp out when redboxed by the raven fleet. The minmatar typhoon could turn into a good old cruise cavarly setup, speeding above normal fleet fit BS'es to keep at 150-200km range where they deal the most damage.

To refer to the bolded point: You mean like right now, in terms of torps? But you also want to break HAMs again too? No. Needing three painters to be able to hurt people is dumb. Keep (or even slightly lower) torp DPS as it is, and raise their ability to apply damage to battleships and most battlecruisers (though it's reasonable to still need webs/painters for fighthing cruisers, and allowing friends in other frigates to kill enemy frigates for you.)

Nagas and Rokhs are both fantastic for medium and large fleet PvP respectively.

That link Gypsio posted is helpful, I will take a look at individual Rohk killmails, I bet they all will be fleet-fitted.

Please CCP Rise, Take a look at this tread:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=228586&find=unread

I'm just an engineer trying to improve eve : )

I like that idea!

Anyway, back to the problems of missiles:

CCP do something to make missiles better at applying damage. Otherwise it doesn't matter (even if hell freezes over) how much volley damage they do. Since Caldari ships lose absurd amounts of damage due to the present mechanics. If you change the mechanics to put missiles on better damage-application it could be reasonable to reduce base damage to equate.

Shhhhhh dont talk about reducing damage...CCP will make them hit a slight better, reduce base damage by like 50%.. call it fixed and then not look at the mistake for another 6 years.

You risk making Caldari even more popular with these changes as they already are

You risk making Caldari even more popular with these changes as they already are. Please reconsider the cruise changes.

Well, it took 27 pages, but we finally found someone who thinks that cruise is fine as it is.

Raven needs that extra mid for flixibility but with the cruise damage buff. Raven will become omni damage dealing monster. Which raw dps can pierce any BS hull tank when the damage is aimed right. Raven can become such OP ***** as drake has been not through tank but DPS. Don't forget that launcher system DPS should be less than other weapon systems because they can precisely aim to weakest resistance. When lasers are forced to deal EM/thermal, hybrids Kinetic/thermal, projectiles any/kinetic/explosive. Launchers is the only weapon system that can deal all damage types cleanly without 2ndary or more damage types, even with T2 ammos. Making you able to pinpoint precisely the weakest resistance and poke your opponent to death from the backdoor.

You risk making Caldari even more popular with these changes as they already are. Please reconsider the cruise changes.

LOL poke your opponent to death from the backdoor... :)

Anyway Raven will have 7 mids thats plenty ... but i do think cruise raw damage will be excessive now.. which considering the range as well is much better than most turrets are able to reach and you would be aiming it at battleships so the only issue at that point is the speed of the opponent and if they have a counter at all.

Attack battleships

I may post this in every thread.

Anybody feel these are a little lacking in their role.

The Mega may be an exception due to itGÇÖs opportunity for massive close range DPS but generally these feel like they should be on the move and yet seem to have cap problems doing so, this is not so much a problem for combat battleships that may end up in scram range or as fleet platforms where mobility is just one factor.

Attack frigates have a role bonus over combat frigates, this helps them maintain tackle and speed by reducing the cap draw of propulsion disruption modules. At battleship level such a bonus would make very little difference but at battleship level, no ship can run a Microwarpdrive for any significant period of time.

How would people feel about a cap reduction role bonus for propulsion modules for all Attack Battleships? Even something as strong as 50% or even 75% to enable these ships to stay on the move (as much as battleships can) without constant cap boosting.

Well, it took 27 pages, but we finally found someone who thinks that cruise is fine as it is.

Shhhhhh dont talk about reducing damage...CCP will make them hit a slight better, reduce base damage by like 50%.. call it fixed and then not look at the mistake for another 6 years.

Oh right! Sorry my bad, engineering background showing...

Yea! CCP thanks for screwing over Caldari pilots yet again! May I suggest that you send the Devs to Nepal. While in Nepal they need to learn proper meditation. Maybe if they learn to balance themselves, they might be better at balancing ships in Eve. Just a thought.

Anyway, I very strongly request that you reconsider the 'balancing' done to these BS. As so far communicated clearly in the threads. No, I am not going to summarize for you...We pay you to do your jobs properly which includes reading the feedback threads. Furthermore, it is about 1:30 in the morning for me so, not going to stay up for 30 min to write you (CCP) a summary.

Now it might be possible but you gonna have to pay me: $200 please!

*Note: I am not responsible for any feelings from reading the remarks. As I am under sugar-influence at the present time and thus extremely hyperactive.*

The fact that a Naga can out damage a rokh is hilarious and the rokh is just sitting sadly in the deep dark corners of a station hangar.