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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 32 post(s) |
Tank Talbot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
44
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Understand where I am coming from. I think the designers at CCP are intelligent people who do good work for the game and have worthy goals. ItGÇÖs true, I have personally lamented the fact that design documents always included real at the expense of fun when considering new features to add into EVE when I thought both factors should be included. For example, the new multi-launch probe system with preset formations is both fun enhancing and feels real. It is a great addition to the game in my view.
However, the new system of hacking a hull by way of a mini-game that results in an explosion of goodies you and a pal have to run catch or lose looks to be a SILLY addition to play. ItGÇÖs a feature more worthy of an action game that doesnGÇÖt take itself seriously instead of a a space sim like EVE. I think they should keep the goodies in a can to collect even if said can looks like a space ship to loot now. There are better ways to make exploration less of a solo activity but I am not sure they can kill multi-boxing on PC to get around this anyway as boxer can account for it.
I understand the need to make the game more accessible to new players. I understand making the game look nicer to improve its appeal with gate, docking, and new probe interface animations. ItGÇÖs why I can accept the change in terminology for site names. But none of it should be done at the expense of actual, in-depth, play. Put it all together with the catch and grab mechanic and its like some one is looking to GÇ£dumb downGÇ¥ the game into an action game for PS4, tablets, mobiles, and novelty gadgets like Oculus.
There are enough shallow, pretty looking, little action games on the market right now and EVEGÇÖs intelligence, depth and breadth, is the only thing that keeps people here and playing as long as they do. I know the game has to grow and adapt but not at the cost of its core values with features like that.
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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
4845
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:17:00 -
[2] - Quote
I thought it was pretty obviously two things. Improving the profession sites to make them actual professions and encouraging to play with other people.
The new system is a clear improvement for the simple reason, that the gameplay before was as dumbed down as you could possibly make it. Activate a module on a can, wait, collect loot and find another can to activate a module on. You can't dumb down on the mechanic, since it was so simple to begin with. The new one at least offers some gameplay and as a bonus offers a clear reason to explore with other players, because you can't get all the loot by yourself and no amount of alts is going to help you. The active gameplay is a must or that goal wouldn't be reachable. I'm sure it isn't perfect, but it can't possibly be worse or more dumbed down then the current mechanic. |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
Anyone got a video for this? As someone who explores I am interested. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Nariya Kentaya
Always Negative.
514
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:32:00 -
[4] - Quote
Garresh wrote:Anyone got a video for this? As someone who explores I am interested. ah, its on CCP's twitch TV channel, but basically its a minigame similar to Deus Ex hacking. and once your done a ball explodes sending goodies everywhere on your screen you have to click when theya re green, after grabbing oen they turn red, then a few seconds later turn green again, its basically designed so that you CANT get all the loot by yourself, and if your monitor isnt very good, or your a little laggy, or you have poor eyesight, youll no longer be able to reap the rewards of exploration sites. |
Makoto Priano
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services
301
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
Hmmm. Going point on eyesight. CCP, definitely avoid green-red -- green-red colorblindness is an issue. Possibly work with color intensity or something as such?
That said, imagine this: you're hacking open the cargo bay on an abandoned ship/structure/whatev. The bay opens, and decompression sends stuff flying. Voila.
I think it's a clever way to release goods, and incentivize group activity, something most scanning lacked before. |
Tank Talbot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
44
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Posted - 2013.04.27 05:58:00 -
[6] - Quote
Destination SkillQueue wrote:I thought it was pretty obviously two things. Improving the profession sites to make them actual professions and encouraging to play with other people.
The new system is a clear improvement for the simple reason, that the gameplay before was as dumbed down as you could possibly make it. Activate a module on a can, wait, collect loot and find another can to activate a module on. You can't dumb down on the mechanic, since it was so simple to begin with. The new one at least offers some gameplay and as a bonus offers a clear reason to explore with other players, because you can't get all the loot by yourself and no amount of alts is going to help you. The active gameplay is a must or that goal wouldn't be reachable. I'm sure it isn't perfect, but it can't possibly be worse or more dumbed down then the current mechanic.
If you desire to add game play to a GÇ£blandGÇ¥ mechanic like hacking is a thoughtful, planned hacking mini-game a better alternative on its own? You could simply create versions of the mini-game requiring multiple players for advanced sites to defeat multi-boxing and make it less the solo activity rather than adding a GÇ£twitchGÇ¥ catch the loot mechanic to a sim. EVE itself has never been a very GÇ£activeGÇ¥ play game like a shooter and you can ask if this new mechanic goes against the nature of play established over the years too strongly.
Makoto Priano wrote:Hmmm. Going point on eyesight. CCP, definitely avoid green-red -- green-red colorblindness is an issue. Possibly work with color intensity or something as such?
That said, imagine this: you're hacking open the cargo bay on an abandoned ship/structure/whatev. The bay opens, and decompression sends stuff flying. Voila.
I think it's a clever way to release goods, and incentivize group activity, something most scanning lacked before.
I could counter by asking why not simply allow salvage drones to collect the goods in such case as its a perfect extension of their role that could make them useful in play. That brings us back to square one where you donGÇÖt really need the twitch play mechanic or another person? Why not simply keep the basic can mechanic then? |
Nariya Kentaya
Always Negative.
514
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Makoto Priano wrote:Hmmm. Going point on eyesight. CCP, definitely avoid green-red -- green-red colorblindness is an issue. Possibly work with color intensity or something as such?
That said, imagine this: you're hacking open the cargo bay on an abandoned ship/structure/whatev. The bay opens, and decompression sends stuff flying. Voila.
I think it's a clever way to release goods, and incentivize group activity, something most scanning lacked before. I still think screen size is a legitimate issue, its practically go big or get out, especially for people who play on some of the older laptops, it would be near impossible to click the little buggers (now i use a desktop that runs 3 clients on all max settings fine, but many of my friends dont)
also, as Talbot mentioned the minigame
i can see this ending BADLY for low/null sites, where you often try to nija and GTFO, good chance of getting targeted and popped while you havea big window in your face blocking everything, would definetly discourage these activities in sapce that isnt balls deep in blue, or highsec. similar reason to why i shoot down in any thread wanting to bring minigames to mining. |
Chris Winter
Zephyr Corp V.A.S.T.
16
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:04:00 -
[8] - Quote
This sounds completely out of place in EVE. |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Chris Winter wrote:This sounds completely out of place in EVE.
It really does. I'll check out this vid in a sec though. TBH I've been trying to get my friends into lowsec and a game like this could actually help with that. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Drunken Bum
131
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mini-games. I ******* knew they'd turn to mini games. I hate mini games. Spare some change?-á |
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Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:10:00 -
[11] - Quote
Drunken Bum wrote:Mini-games. I ******* knew they'd turn to mini games. I hate mini games.
Scanning is a minigame. It's just one in which the "terrain" affects it, along with player fittings. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Tank Talbot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
46
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:17:00 -
[12] - Quote
Garresh wrote:Drunken Bum wrote:Mini-games. I ******* knew they'd turn to mini games. I hate mini games. Scanning is a minigame. It's just one in which the "terrain" affects it, along with player fittings.
True enough. But scanning and probing play out like a logical extension of piloting your ship inside the simulation (it feels REAL) so that most people donGÇÖt notice the fact rather than as a cobbled in twitch mechanic that runs contrary to established play methodology so strongly that it sticks out like a bruised thumb... |
Tetsuo Tsukaya
Pixel Navigators Hostile Work Environment.
13
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:21:00 -
[13] - Quote
That's too bad. I usually run radars and mags on my lunch break so when I play in the evenings I can go PVP. Doesn't sound like the new mechanic is going to suit me much, I hope someone likes it at least |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
1457
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:28:00 -
[14] - Quote
There is only one game that did the hacking mini-game right. Mining Overhaul Nothing changed since 2008. |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
As long as they make it feel like a logical extension of existing gameplay mechanics, or at least a fairly "sci fi" minigame, I'm okay with it. Sounds like they're not going to do that though. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Moneta Curran
Lunar Industries Ltd
28
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
As someone who practically lives off exploration income, I would like to chime in to say that this sounds utterly ********. |
Tank Talbot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
47
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Posted - 2013.04.27 06:43:00 -
[17] - Quote
Nariya Kentaya wrote:Makoto Priano wrote:Hmmm. Going point on eyesight. CCP, definitely avoid green-red -- green-red colorblindness is an issue. Possibly work with color intensity or something as such?
That said, imagine this: you're hacking open the cargo bay on an abandoned ship/structure/whatev. The bay opens, and decompression sends stuff flying. Voila.
I think it's a clever way to release goods, and incentivize group activity, something most scanning lacked before. I still think screen size is a legitimate issue, its practically go big or get out, especially for people who play on some of the older laptops, it would be near impossible to click the little buggers (now i use a desktop that runs 3 clients on all max settings fine, but many of my friends dont) also, as Talbot mentioned the minigame i can see this ending BADLY for low/null sites, where you often try to nija and GTFO, good chance of getting targeted and popped while you havea big window in your face blocking everything, would definetly discourage these activities in sapce that isnt balls deep in blue, or highsec. similar reason to why i shoot down in any thread wanting to bring minigames to mining.
I hadn't really considered the screen size issue and it's true that we live in an age where the laptops are starting to outnumber the traditional PC even amongst game players. When it comes to the break through the firewall mini-game itself, again it is a play mechanic that doesn't seem to play out like a logical extension of piloting your ship but I could compromise it they work on it. Cobbled in twitch for a sim? I need to crack an active computer firewall to salvage parts from a centries old exploded derilect ship? None of this seems to have a place in EVE or to fit. As to how actual exploration might play out in low/null... IDK. |
Gnoshia
Section 8. Fatal Ascension
22
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Posted - 2013.04.27 07:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
Well it's better than the old system that much is certain.
Clicking a module and waiting to loot the can was about as mind-less and boring as you can possibly imagine. Granted this new version isn't much better, but it's enormously better than the old system. |
Caldari 5
The Element Syndicate
57
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Posted - 2013.04.27 08:07:00 -
[19] - Quote
The twitch to get stuff that is jettisoned into space mechanic looks all manner of wrong, and is a backwards step. Especially due to the number windows that I generally have open, I just won't see most of them, due to them getting hidden behind chat windows/the overview, cargohold etc
The Hacking minigame thing? what the?? can someone actually explain how this is actually meant to work, seems more like he clicked on random crap on the screen. Again it looks to be a backwards step, especially again due to having multiple screens open and screen sizes and the like that other posters have mentioned. |
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
463
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Posted - 2013.04.27 08:14:00 -
[20] - Quote
Caldari 5 wrote:The twitch to get stuff that is jettisoned into space mechanic looks all manner of wrong, and is a backwards step. Especially due to the number windows that I generally have open, I just won't see most of them, due to them getting hidden behind chat windows/the overview, cargohold etc
The Hacking minigame thing? what the?? can someone actually explain how this is actually meant to work, seems more like he clicked on random crap on the screen. Again it looks to be a backwards step, especially again due to having multiple screens open and screen sizes and the like that other posters have mentioned. I'm in two parts about this.
One part is screaming exactly what you've stated.
But the other part is injecting that new mechanics might in the end lead to new habits and ways of handling this.
If profitable enough.
I'll decide if I'll silently accept and burn some monument after I've tried it for some months.
CCP Eterne: Silly player, ALL devs are evil. CCP (aka Judge) Peligro: I will find your main.
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Verrys
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2013.04.27 08:18:00 -
[21] - Quote
Truly awesome game. |
bartos100
Living Ghost
19
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Posted - 2013.04.27 08:28:00 -
[22] - Quote
i agree that the flying items are kind of strange unless they raised the value of the items that drop so that even if you don't catch all of them you still get something useful to sell
and if i heard correctly they will be removing all npc's from both the radar and the mag sites making it a lot easier to go roaming in low/null in say a cov'ops to run those and making it that you only have to watch out for other players
and if i saw correctly you can change the size of the window for the minigame so you can keep an eye on local and d-scan |
Vilnius Zar
Ordo Ardish
838
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Posted - 2013.04.27 08:32:00 -
[23] - Quote
Sooo. are they going to make lvl 4 missions also a group effort? Amat victoria curam. Excellence in everything.
Some guides that may be useful to you: http://www.youtube.com/user/OrdoArdish |
Arin Archer
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.04.27 09:13:00 -
[24] - Quote
I thought CCP was committed to supporting solo play as part of EVE. Now all of the sudden, for exploration, which is what many solo players choose to do, you need a "buddy" to fast twitch catch loot? It doesn't seem right. I choose exploration because it's something you do on your own pace, now all the sudden you have to stress over fast disappearing loot after hacking. You've got PLENTY of things to worry about in EVE. There's the constant threat of PvP. I don't understand why one of the best solo activities was made into an arcade game.
Why not make asteroids explode as well? Maybe make all ships that are destroyed...actually blow up and have the loot vanish in seconds...why penalize explorers with this exploding/vanishing loot mechanic? See how well PvP players enjoy loot vanishing in a few seconds.
Highly questionable IMO. When exploring, you earn your "loot" by taking the time to scan down and discovered sites, and now, I guess, by playing a hacking game. Are they trying to push solo players back to mining? You shouldn't need a "buddy" to be present to click on little colored moving dots on the screen for an otherwise great solo activity in EVE. The game mechanic should be to determine what your reward is after this hacking game and then let the reward sit on the screen as long as any other item normally would while, just like everywhere else in EVE, under thread of being ganked. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
358
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Posted - 2013.04.27 09:32:00 -
[25] - Quote
I hope that this stuff is for wormholes too. G££ <= Me |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 09:33:00 -
[26] - Quote
Alright I've looked for info on these new hacking/salvaging/archaeology minigames and I can't find the video. This thread desperately needs a video for those of us too stupid/busy/ignorant/drunk to have watched the original video.(for the record I was busy being drunk) Anyone willing to provide? This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Arin Archer
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.04.27 09:39:00 -
[27] - Quote
Garresh wrote:Alright I've looked for info on these new hacking/salvaging/archaeology minigames and I can't find the video. This thread desperately needs a video for those of us too stupid/busy/ignorant/drunk to have watched the original video.(for the record I was busy being drunk) Anyone willing to provide?
Hacking starts about 1:13:00 into the video
http://www.twitch.tv/ccp/c/2208288 |
Logan LaMort
Screaming Hayabusa
1302
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Posted - 2013.04.27 09:45:00 -
[28] - Quote
I liked it. I used to do exploration all the time, the probing bit was fun but the hacking/analyzing part? Ehh, completely braindead activity.
Also lots of opportunities to ninja other people's loot |
Garresh
Native Freshfood Minmatar Republic
128
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Posted - 2013.04.27 10:02:00 -
[29] - Quote
Arin Archer wrote:Garresh wrote:Alright I've looked for info on these new hacking/salvaging/archaeology minigames and I can't find the video. This thread desperately needs a video for those of us too stupid/busy/ignorant/drunk to have watched the original video.(for the record I was busy being drunk) Anyone willing to provide? Hacking starts about 1:13:00 into the video http://www.twitch.tv/ccp/c/2208288
Much Obliged. I'll make a point not to shoot you next time I'm getting drunk and shooting people. This Space Intentionally Left Blank |
Tank Talbot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
49
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Posted - 2013.04.27 11:02:00 -
[30] - Quote
ItGÇÖs already possible to ninja an exploration site and have fun with people in low and null. I see no need to make it easier to grief a group of explorers in hi sec than it is to do so to a miner in hi sec now with a silly mechanic... Going grant kill rights off of vanishing loot catches they nab before you can twitch? I mean really?
Arin Archer wrote:I thought CCP was committed to supporting solo play as part of EVE. Now all of the sudden, for exploration, which is what many solo players choose to do, you need a "buddy" to fast twitch catch loot? It doesn't seem right. I choose exploration because it's something you do on your own pace, now all the sudden you have to stress over fast disappearing loot after hacking. You've got PLENTY of things to worry about in EVE. There's the constant threat of PvP. I don't understand why one of the best solo activities was made into an arcade game.
Why not make asteroids explode as well? Maybe make all ships that are destroyed...actually blow up and have the loot vanish in seconds...why penalize explorers with this exploding/vanishing loot mechanic? See how well PvP players enjoy loot vanishing in a few seconds.
Highly questionable IMO. When exploring, you earn your "loot" by taking the time to scan down and discover sites, and now, I guess, by playing a hacking game. Are they trying to push solo players back to mining? You shouldn't need a "buddy" to be present to click on little colored moving dots on the screen for an otherwise great solo activity in EVE. The game mechanic should be to determine what your reward is after this hacking game and then let the reward sit on the screen as long as any other item normally would while, just like everywhere else in EVE, under threat of being ganked.
When you look at the game design as it currently stands, I have to agree that solo exploration in sector space is "mostly" fine (I am sorry, I have a personal hang up with multi-boxing. lol) Worm Holes have group exploration and the subsequent exploitation of sites already covered. |
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