Well... noobish mistakes aside I hear what you're saying.

The issue isn't staying clear when we start mixing contexts. In one context, taking away podding costs wouldn't be fair to younger players, in another context younger players benefit too much from lower podding costs.

Maybe insurance payouts for ship losses could be adjusted by ratio of the character's skillpoints to the mean. Older characters would get less reimbursed and new characters more for the same ship.

That might work to make keep the playing field level as you lose more ships while skill points are low and you're still learning the mechanics.

dunno

Why do it by skillpoints? Why not by Net Asset Value?

Was this a serious question?

For one thing, you'd CTRL-A your hangar and contract everything to an alt before the op and cancel the contract after the op was over. There's just too many ways to get around that.

And that's aside from the fact that more than a few ships get destroyed every day and I wouldn't even want to think about what the database would have to do to calculate all that.

Actually, the more I think about it, the more I like the idea of using variable insurance rates to level the playing field. It's easy to calculate, the amount of isk sink is easy to adjust and it seems to address the issue of podding costs a little better than the current system.

Should it be coupled to skill points? dunno.... the current system is, so that's the direction I was thinking in.

Then don't use it.

If you have trained up a 200M skill point character and then want to use them in a frigate... you have made a poor choice.

That is a ridiculous comment. I wanna fly any and everything, just because I have a high amount of SP I shouldn't have to give up on flying smaller ships like frigates. Very poor way of looking at things.

So I managed to force myself to read more of the posts in this thread.

I am shocked.

What the **** do you guys want? Risk free pvp with losses without a meaning?

What brought me to this game was the fact that every single loss was permanent and a major setback. In the beginning (2003) even losing a cruiser was something that could make a grown man cry. Today people throw t3 ship after t3 ship in a fight and don't care a thing about the losses as ISK is plenty and easy to get. Pods are actually one of few losses people tend to care about especially if they have forgotten to upgrade their clone and lose skillpoints.

If you reduce the impact of a loss even more the meaning of pvp will decrease even more.

All the talk of "making people pvp more if the losses costs less" is just a step in the completely wrong direction. What the **** do you want? Evey single ship in game in your hangar spawn when you log in? Just log onto the test server instead.

Don't ****** ruin my game.

It's not actually your game it's CCP's and from what you have written, you've written it from your perspective. But it might shock you to know that not everyone is in the same boat as you. A reduction in the cost of clones, you would hardly even notice, whereas it could mean a big deal for other players.

So I managed to force myself to read more of the posts in this thread.

I am shocked.

What the **** do you guys want? Risk free pvp with losses without a meaning?

What brought me to this game was the fact that every single loss was permanent and a major setback. In the beginning (2003) even losing a cruiser was something that could make a grown man cry. Today people throw t3 ship after t3 ship in a fight and don't care a thing about the losses as ISK is plenty and easy to get. Pods are actually one of few losses people tend to care about especially if they have forgotten to upgrade their clone and lose skillpoints.

If you reduce the impact of a loss even more the meaning of pvp will decrease even more.

All the talk of "making people pvp more if the losses costs less" is just a step in the completely wrong direction. What the **** do you want? Evey single ship in game in your hangar spawn when you log in? Just log onto the test server instead.

Don't ****** ruin my game.

So I managed to force myself to read more of the posts in this thread.

I am shocked.

What the **** do you guys want? Risk free pvp with losses without a meaning?

It's not actually your game it's CCP's and from what you have written, you've written it from your perspective. But it might shock you to know that not everyone is in the same boat as you. A reduction in the cost of clones, you would hardly even notice, whereas it could mean a big deal for other players.

I usually don't like the comparison to Hello Kitty Online, but seriously what do you want from this game? A themepark MMO where all is nice and sweet? You are entitled your own opinion, of course, but do not try to force that on everyone else.

This game was branded as a harsh environment where losses ment something. Don't change that.

seriously i would LOVE to have free clones, removed learning implants and all this stuff.
I WOULD LOVE IT.

but you should see some perspective outside of your personal interests. This makes me stand against such "big deals for other players"

yes, the whole thread looks like people want risk-free pvp.

You're another one that's over reacting, nobody is talking about free clones. Well I say nobody, there was 1 post I've seen that mentioned it and I gave a reason why I think that's not a good idea.

It's not about making clones cost nothing but it is about reducing their costs.

No, we, want to make the choice of how much we risk. Right now I am forced to risk a 32 million ISK clone. I don't get a choice.

personally i seen a lot more (note: there is LOTS of threads about this).
- free clones
- cheap clones (cheaper than now)
- 1 mil for clone
- complete removing of clones
- player made clones (everybody know what would it be don't we?)
- many clones in one station + insta-free JC inside 1 station
- etc....

so nope. Not "noone". Add here learning implants (which is too be removed as people want) and you have an idea....

I can't help but to think about the op we had last night. We were on a gate waiting for a minute while I did something and some guys started jumping through the gate in pods and shuttles.

of course we blapped them all and one of the guys calls out on comms, "BRING ME SOME BACON.... MAMMA JUST COOKED SOME EGGS!"

What some of you are still not quite getting is that (at least how I see it) part of the reason for higher pod costs for vets was to level the playing field a bit so that younger players weren't perpetually disadvantaged by the mere fact that they were younger.

So ... suppose pod costs are zero for everyone. How you get that leveling effect back in?

I suggested moving it to insurance and got the comment that it wasn't fair because vets lose more ships and they shouldn't be made to pay more or take higher risks and blah blah.....

But it's not the vets who need to "catch up"

You want to find a way to "go easy" on new players at least isk wise while they learn how the game works, don't you? Maybe going hard on vets isn't the right way to go easy on newbies but there must be some way to get to a nice balance..

I want to be able to choose the level of risk I take when I undock and not be arbitrarily punished because I've been a loyal customers of CCP for over a half a decade. I had this option when I started playing this game and no one had or seems to have a problem with it, so why is having the same choice available for older players a problem then?

In general I want assets I risk losing to contribute to my performance and if they don't or I don't want to risk them, I want to be given the choice to remove them and replace them with something more fitting before I undock. I'm not asking for free anything nor do I want it. I want the choice of choosing what I risk and not be prevented by game mechanics from making this choice. What I want is medical clone costs, that are SP neutral and the ability to freely choose what clone I take to battle just like I can with ships and fittings. I want choice and if your vision of this game doesn't allow it, I have no use for it.

No, we, want to make the choice of how much we risk. Right now I am forced to risk a 32 million ISK clone. I don't get a choice.

Have you ever had the shakes before a batlle?

Ever thought of why?

Then it's easy. Stop training and you wont need more expensive clones. Or just don't buy new clones and the costs of your pods will decrease over time....

Seriously, the options are there. You just need to choose.

What some of you are still not quite getting is that (at least how I see it) part of the reason for higher pod costs for vets was to level the playing field a bit so that younger players weren't perpetually disadvantaged by the mere fact that they were younger.

Well if you had read other threads recently, you might have realised I don't like theme parks, not much into MMO company generated content either. If this game became a theme park I wouldn't be playing it. Reduction in clone costs doesn't worry me at all in respect to theme parks as I know that has nothing to do with it. What I'd be more worried about, is the side games I've heard about, although I've not heard that much about them yet.

Fit your ship with expensive gear and your clone with expensive combat implants, you might still be able to get those shakes still.

At the same time more people will be able to afford to PvP.


Sounds like win-win to me.