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Attributes & Skills - The New Guide

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
celous Caldari Dark Skyes	Posted - 2006.11.03 16:52:00 - [211] With the training of tho skill with out implants it would take 60day right how long would it take with all +3 implants and +4 implants?
NenMaster	Posted - 2006.11.07 13:42:00 - [212] can someone please tell me how long would a noob benefit from training all learning skills to lvl 4? how many weeks, i dont need a perfect answer just a general on any build you want to supply. this will help new players choose when to learn upto this lvl, i have 3 of the learning skills to lvl4 and im looking at 6 days each for lvl5s
UclanChar	Posted - 2006.11.08 12:55:00 - [213] I would get Memory, Percetion, Willpower and Spatial Awareness to level 5, then Eidetic Memory, Logic, Focus and Clarity as far as you can to level 4. Some people leave these at level 2 or 3 but the more your train them the more you will benefit in the future. It's like all things in life, the more you put in, the more you get out of it. Regards, UclanChar.
Valerek Gallente PhoenixCorp	Posted - 2006.11.10 04:00:00 - [214] Originally by: UclanChar I would get Memory, Percetion, Willpower and Spatial Awareness to level 5, then Eidetic Memory, Logic, Focus and Clarity as far as you can to level 4. Some people leave these at level 2 or 3 but the more your train them the more you will benefit in the future. It's like all things in life, the more you put in, the more you get out of it. Regards, UclanChar. Quite true, but then they try to spook you off with the "payoff" chitchat. It all depends how long you want to stick around Eve. ------------------------- Who? Me?
shibbymonkey	Posted - 2006.11.17 14:24:00 - [215] Just want to thank all for this post. Been in-game for over a month now, and this is the best training resource that I have found yet. Know now that I couldve done better w/ my training to date, but will def use this going forward. --------------------------------------- Ever in search of new ways to turn ISK into noise and fire.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2006.11.26 07:12:00 - [216] As of November 28th, 2006 the skill requirements for the advanced learning skills will have been reduced. (Previously, all advanced learning skills required level 5 in their basic counterpart. Now, they will require only level 4.) I have updated the recommended training order accordingly. See page 1. --- 295 of 315 skills trained.
Soporo	Posted - 2006.11.26 20:23:00 - [217] Thanks,that was what I was looking for, a Revelations related update.
Spectroid 224	Posted - 2006.11.27 16:56:00 - [218] Excellent!
Minnanon	Posted - 2006.11.27 19:58:00 - [219] Originally by: Tripoli As of November 28th, 2006 the skill requirements for the advanced learning skills will have been reduced. (Previously, all advanced learning skills required level 5 in their basic counterpart. Now, they will require only level 4.) Aha thx, this edit explains my confusion! It does seem a tad unfair on existing players, since us newcomers will be able to advance our character faster than they could. But hey ho, suits me just fine!
Zeonos Amarr venus divine brotherhood Dark Forces Alliance	Posted - 2006.12.01 12:44:00 - [220] Originally by: Minnanon Originally by: Tripoli As of November 28th, 2006 the skill requirements for the advanced learning skills will have been reduced. (Previously, all advanced learning skills required level 5 in their basic counterpart. Now, they will require only level 4.) Aha thx, this edit explains my confusion! It does seem a tad unfair on existing players, since us newcomers will be able to advance our character faster than they could. But hey ho, suits me just fine! well old players still have more attrabutes when they have the skills to 5. and you cant advance faster than them anyway. :) only just as fast. but they still have many more mil in sp than you.

SpaceDrake Taleweaver	Posted - 2006.12.05 19:14:00 - [221] One thing, Tripoli. I, personally, would dissuade newbies from training Advanced Learning skills to 4 off the bat - with the skill requirement reduction, you can now train +7 to all attributes in the space of roughly a week (less if you skip Charisma for a while). The extra +1 will take a while to pay off, even though L4 in Advanced skills takes a fraction of the time that a +5 in Basics do. I really think we should be advising the nooblets to get on with training stuff that'll be useful to their gameplay ASAP - CCP has cut the Learning grind down by potential months and everyone should be encouraged to take advantage. Even then though, are you sure getting to Basics 4/Advanced 4 takes a "month"? With my new Amarr character, the Advanced 4 train is going to take usually 2 days per skill, a bit more for Charisma... add in about a week and a half total to train all five Basic skills to four, that comes down to about two and a half weeks. Obviously I'm doing some off the cuff mental math, but unless a character is heavily Memory challenged I don't think the 4/4 train takes a "month" (E.G. 4 weeks) anymore. Awesome guide, all the same. --- What good are actions if there's no one to tell the tale afterward?... Former player of Andre Ricard (sold). Currently plays a Sekrit CharacterÖ.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2006.12.07 02:02:00 - [222] Originally by: SpaceDrake Taleweaver One thing, Tripoli. I, personally, would dissuade newbies from training Advanced Learning skills to 4 off the bat - with the skill requirement reduction, you can now train +7 to all attributes in the space of roughly a week (less if you skip Charisma for a while). The extra +1 will take a while to pay off, even though L4 in Advanced skills takes a fraction of the time that a +5 in Basics do. I really think we should be advising the nooblets to get on with training stuff that'll be useful to their gameplay ASAP - CCP has cut the Learning grind down by potential months and everyone should be encouraged to take advantage. Even then though, are you sure getting to Basics 4/Advanced 4 takes a "month"? With my new Amarr character, the Advanced 4 train is going to take usually 2 days per skill, a bit more for Charisma... add in about a week and a half total to train all five Basic skills to four, that comes down to about two and a half weeks. Obviously I'm doing some off the cuff mental math, but unless a character is heavily Memory challenged I don't think the 4/4 train takes a "month" (E.G. 4 weeks) anymore. Awesome guide, all the same. I've never been an advocate for training nothing but learning skills right off the bat. I'm merely offering the optimal training order for those who want to know. I do indeed highly recommend training whatever makes the game fun for you. I just want to make sure people are aware of how beneficial the learning skills can be for long-term players. My 1-month figure was also an off-the-cuff, late-night, slightly-drunken guestimate. While not difficult to calculate the time it would take the average player, actually going through the motions of doing those calculations is quite time consuming, and not really worth the effort because it can vary widely with player's attributes. Glad everyone seems to appreciate my work here. It's my pleasure to help the community in any way I can. --- 316 of 341 skills trained.
Ace Hawke	Posted - 2006.12.09 11:15:00 - [223] Is the Learning skill modifier always on top of the attributes or does it only apply at the time you train it? That is will you get a 10% bonus to your current stats with a Learning skill at lvl5 or will it only apply at the time you learn it. (And the every attribute after this is stacked on top of that?). Does that make any sense? =)
Dinife Dinife Corp	Posted - 2006.12.10 07:29:00 - [224] 1. I have copyed the skills from the market, to a spread sheet and got 344 skills. and i have got a break down of attributes to skills. att pri# pri% sec# sec% avg% int 123 35.75 53 15.4 28.6 char 40 11.62 13 3.77 8.8 per 101 29.36 39 11.33 23.1 will 15 4.36 117 34.01 14.1 mem 65 18.89 122 35.46 24.1 using the avg on the 39 skill points a player gets. int 11 char 3 per 9 will 6 mem 10 and it can be done. a caldari achura stargazer.
Solomunio Kzenig Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2006.12.12 17:10:00 - [225] Great Post Tripoli...it will realy help with cutting down on later skill training if you max out your learning skills early on. I'm a noob with 1mil SP so i've a long way to go yet (500,000 in gunnery though....you can see where i'm headed ) One Empire, One People, One Emperor, Forever under Heaven. Amarr Aeternus.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2006.12.13 03:28:00 - [226] Originally by: Ace Hawke Is the Learning skill modifier always on top of the attributes or does it only apply at the time you train it? That is will you get a 10% bonus to your current stats with a Learning skill at lvl5 or will it only apply at the time you learn it. (And the every attribute after this is stacked on top of that?). Does that make any sense? =) The Learning skill modifier is always calculated last, and the order you train skills in (or add implants) does not affect your attributes (and hence training speed) when it's all said and done. --- 316 of 341 skills trained.
Ace Hawke	Posted - 2006.12.13 16:27:00 - [227] Originally by: Tripoli The Learning skill modifier is always calculated last, and the order you train skills in (or add implants) does not affect your attributes (and hence training speed) when it's all said and done. Thanks, good to know =)
Angelis666 Amarr The Knights Of Camelot FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2007.01.01 09:37:00 - [228] Drones: Memory / Perception Electronics: Intelligence / Memory Engineering: Intelligence / Memory Gunnery: Perception / Willpower Industry: Memory / Intelligence Leadership: Charisma / Willpower Learning: Memory / Intelligence Mechanic: Intelligence / Memory Missile Launcher Operation: Perception / Willpower Navigation: Intelligence / Perception Science: Intelligence / Memory Social: Charisma / Intelligence Spaceship Command: Perception / Willpower Trade: Charisma / Memory Charisma: Trade / Social / Leadership Perception: Spaceship Command / Missile Launcher Operation / Gunnery Intelligence: Science / Navigation / Mechanic / Engineering / Electronics Memory: Learning / Industry / Drones Willpower: Spaceship Command / Missile Launcher Operation / Leadership / Gunnery Willpower is 'generally' a secondary attribute amoungst all catogorys Where Gamers Give Back
Michayel Lyon The Corporation Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.01.17 02:18:00 - [229] Hey Tripoli, just a small question. Wouldn't it be more efficient to take the basic perception, charisma and willpower learning skills to level 4 (or even level 5, if you intend to train them at all), before you start training any of the advanced perception, charisma or willpower learning skills? The reason should be that, since all the basic skills have mem as primary and int as secondary, the time to train the basic perc, cha and will learning skills is fixed once you're done with mem and int learning skills. However, the attributes they affect will have an impact on the advanced learning skills. Or maybe there is something wrong in my reasoning? I only have Logic trained to level 4, after all... --- Lasiverin Dark > Is everyone here allied? Red Knight > we are allied by our zombie like ability to ***** missions
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2007.01.17 05:43:00 - [230] Well, it's really not much an issue, seeing as level 4 is required to even start the advanced skills. Following the order I have laid out (which varies slightly character to character) is the optimal route. You should train the relevant advanced skills to level 3 before training the basic skills to level 5 (with the exception of Instant Recall 4). Because of the Rank 3 multiplier on the advanced skills, it's more beneficial to train their lower levels before continuing to the last level of the basic skills. --- 320 of 341 skills trained.

Enaria Ferenic	Posted - 2007.01.19 03:56:00 - [231] Just a quick question: if i get all my learning skills (standard and advanced) up to lvl 4, then how much SP can i expect to increase by each month, assuming that i'm constantly training? This Char is an Alt.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2007.01.19 05:37:00 - [232] That can theoretically add over 500,000 SP/month above what you'd otherwise have. --- 321 of 341 skills trained.
Enaria Ferenic	Posted - 2007.01.19 06:36:00 - [233] Thanks for the reply.....looking roughly at the math i thought it was about 500,000. This Char is an Alt.
Arthe Xavier	Posted - 2007.01.23 18:33:00 - [234] Thank you - this thread is very helpful for us newbies. Sometimes one can get flabbergasted at the amount of skill-choices EVE has to offer, you know. :)
Dude Darkness	Posted - 2007.01.24 03:18:00 - [235] I've finally finished all my learning skills. My stats are as follows int 16.5 cha 17.6 per 26.4 mem 15.4 wil 22.0 I learn gunnery skills well but I was wondering where I can look to find what would be best to learn next. I wanna outfit my ships primarily for mission running but I want to be ready for more when the time arives. any advice on where to get started would be greatly appreciated. perhaps another good walkthrough.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2007.01.24 03:45:00 - [236] 10 different people will tell you 10 different things. Where to go once you've finished your learning skills is up to you. --- 321 of 341 skills trained.
Michayel Lyon The Corporation	Posted - 2007.01.25 17:48:00 - [237] Originally by: Tripoli Well, it's really not much an issue, seeing as level 4 is required to even start the advanced skills. Following the order I have laid out (which varies slightly character to character) is the optimal route. You should train the relevant advanced skills to level 3 before training the basic skills to level 5 (with the exception of Instant Recall 4). Because of the Rank 3 multiplier on the advanced skills, it's more beneficial to train their lower levels before continuing to the last level of the basic skills. You're wrong. It's more beneficial to train the basic perc, will and charisma skill to lvl5 (if you intend to do this at all) before you start with the advanced perc, will and charisma skills, because the basic skills affect the relevant attributes of the advanced skills, but the advanced skills doesn't affect the attributes for the basic skills. Of course, this isn't true for int and mem. If you don't believe me, test it in EVEMon. --- Lasiverin Dark > Is everyone here allied? Red Knight > we are allied by our zombie like ability to ***** missions
AvatarADV	Posted - 2007.01.28 00:49:00 - [238] Having entirely too much free time on my hands, I decided to look at it from a different perspective - that of skill number x skill rank. This gives us a better understanding of the actual importance of a particular attribute - if the attribute is assigned to many skills with huuuuge ranks, then even small improvements in that skill will be valuable compared to skills with fewer ranks. Anyway, adding up ALL the skills (except the learning category, which is pretty minuscule and y'all have talked it to death here), with a value of 1 per primary and .5 per secondary times the number of ranks, the weightings come out: 422 Mem, 480 Int, 680.5 Per, 390 Will, 130 Cha We can see that Perception is the highest-ranked attribute, that Willpower isn't far behind the two mental attributes, and that Charisma has really, really gotten the shaft. But wait! These numbers stink, actually, because they represent a completely unusual skill loading. NOBODY is trained to operate all four races' Titans, right? In practice, a player would likely restrict themselves to a single race of ships and the corresponding weapon (let's leave missiles in there - there's plenty of ships with both missile and turret hardpoints). Taking that into consideration drastically lowers the importance of Per and Will. The recalculated Perception total is only 352.5, and recalculated Willpower is 235.5. Looking at it that way, Perception falls behind the two mental attributes, and Willpower is way behind. Of course, Int (and to a degree Mem) is getting a huge bonus from all of the many-ranked research skills, not all or even most of which a research-oriented character is going to train. And, of course, an awful lot of points from there are oriented to capital-specific equipment, so if your ultimate goal doesn't include your own Titan, you could strip all those out... and so on, and so on.
Tripoli XenTech	Posted - 2007.01.28 03:50:00 - [239] Originally by: Michayel Lyon You're wrong. You're....you're....you're **ing right. **. /me goes and fixes the skill training order on page 1. --- 321 of 341 skills trained.
Raphael Ordo The Movement	Posted - 2007.02.01 09:48:00 - [240] Originally by: Tripoli To date, charisma is generally considered one of the less useful attributes in EVE. Currently there are relatively few skills that have Charisma as a primary attribute. It is likely that this attribute will become more useful as the game progresses and content is added, but at this point it is easily the least useful. Right now, it is good for people who wish to make a living doing trading and running agent missions, but its usefulness doesnÆt extend very far beyond that, especially when compared to attributes like Intelligence and Perception. Charisma is altough well used within skills of Leadership and alike. In which leadership plays an significant role in Major/minor Fleet Battles. Or even Squad Ganks or whatever you prefer.



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