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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |

Nofearion
sleep Deprivation INC. LLC Brothers of Tangra
67
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 10:17:00 -
[451] - Quote
It is natural for most to Fear change, to explore the unknown and be taken out of their comfort zone. Make no mistake change has been needed for quite some time in the indy game. This is but one piece of the puzzle and I believe CCP is doing their best to improve the game. From what CCP Fozzie has stated and from what is in the other threads this will be a good change overall. This step is intended to encourage local markets to flourish by building locally while at the same time putting a squeeze on large scale force projection.
I applaud the effort, However I think you will see that the power blocs will simply start using ships that use the fuel type of the region they are holding, and will encourage botting of ice mining in null to feed the massive fleets. The other side of the coin is the small entrepreneurs like myself and many others posting in protest will see increased cost of transport quickly outstipping our profit margins, Can't do without goods will cause an imbalance in the market where it is relatively cheap in the space it is found in. Namely products made from the racial goo's. Do the the cost of import and scarcity these items will command a very high price. where they cannot be found.
I know that sounds good right?
however the power blocs have their logistic chains set up and cover so much space that members of those power blocs will see little of any change. Those of us who are not operating within those circles will be cut out. help us remain competitive, in addition of the 2/3ds reduction in the size of Isotopes, increase Jump freighter fuel bays by 40%. while it will not reduce the cost it will increase our range and or allow us to get the best price for needed fuel to where we do not pay a premium do to limited availability in the areas we travel.
|

Night9
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 10:26:00 -
[452] - Quote
loving the tears.
rus for life )) |

Anthar Thebess
REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN
388
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 10:33:00 -
[453] - Quote
Good change.
Big bloobs are already unhappy - as this will increase cost of defending moons on edge of their space.
Can we get also pos jumb bridge fuel cost increase and smaller Jump Bridge range? Isthar Changes LVL 5 Missions in Nullspace |

Anita Too
Ayonae Enterprises
5
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 10:58:00 -
[454] - Quote
I am neither an opponent nor a proponent to this change. However, an industry buff should not be raising the price of everything thus forcing people to do industry (or making people who already does industry happy for a short time). Rather, CCP should look into making industry (or mining ice in this aspect) more interesting.
As I remember, there was talks of having surprises of finding moon-goo during mining. What happened to that suggestion? What about creating a mini-game at the end of each asteroid's life (when it was about to pop) where upon successful completion will give some valuable moon-goo/minerals or even modules and ships (well the roids can form around modules/ships if lore if what we're worried about)? Engaging our mind in a mini-game and being rewarded with some "surprise" is what creates excitement.
Hope this helps. |

Marius8
DNS Requiem Brothers of Tangra
5
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:00:00 -
[455] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Can we get also pos jumb bridge fuel cost increase and smaller Jump Bridge range?
please don't give them more BAD ideas! |

Bill Andrex
SiN Corp The Unthinkables
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:02:00 -
[456] - Quote
Increase isotopes are you mad? So let's kill off industry for the average guy or small alliance in one foul swoop so the large entities are are to absorb these costs from moon goo and rental agreements.
Bad enough with the refining changes coming in as well, manufacturing and logistics in 0.0 will suffer, this is a double edged sword with increased hauling with ore compression AND increased costs in logistics.
If it ain't broke don't fix it, CCP please stop screwing your customers.... |

Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
1302
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:10:00 -
[457] - Quote
Bill Andrex wrote:Increase isotopes are you mad? So let's kill off industry for the average guy or small alliance in one foul swoop so the large entities are are to absorb these costs from moon goo and rental agreements.
Bad enough with the refining changes coming in as well, manufacturing and logistics in 0.0 will suffer, this is a double edged sword with increased hauling with ore compression AND increased costs in logistics.
If it ain't broke don't fix it, CCP please stop screwing your customers....
Use normal freighters. JF shouldn't even be in the game. The Tears Must Flow |

King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
74
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:12:00 -
[458] - Quote
CCP: we want to encourage local production by buffing refining and production outside high population areas and nerfing JFs Nulltards: bloobloo alkjdsalksjdlaksj butbutbut JFs will cost more
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gascanu
Bearing Srl.
107
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:13:00 -
[459] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Good change.
Big bloobs are already unhappy - as this will increase cost of defending moons on edge of their space.
Can we get also pos jumb bridge fuel cost increase and smaller Jump Bridge range?
ice miner spotted!  |

Rommiee
Mercury Inc.
694
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:21:00 -
[460] - Quote
Vaju Enki wrote:
Use normal freighters. JF shouldn't even be in the game.
They already are. If you don't know how or why do some research before making idiotic comments. |

Green Gambit
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
50
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:24:00 -
[461] - Quote
Needmore Longcat wrote:In all seriousness, not trolling or trying to be nasty at all.
Why can we not work on the things that have been broken for literally 10 years, before we start changing mechanisms that work at least somewhat well at the moment?
POS comes to mind, for one...
Because whilst getting a game designer/balancer to work on POS code would be very entertaining - I don't think it would come out of the process much better than it is now. |

gascanu
Bearing Srl.
107
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:35:00 -
[462] - Quote
isotopes are basically " the gasoline" of eve online; this change will drive the prices up; and, like in real life, (yea, i know, but it's about economy here) when the gasoline prices goes up, who will get affected really bad? the medium/low classes; the rich don' t really care and the oil producers ... |

sci0gon
Kaira Innovations Superior Eve Engineering
23
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 11:49:00 -
[463] - Quote
I cant help but think that you guys made this change rashly.
firstly industry changes are going to force people to use pos's more due to the pricing scheme of station use and with the lack of standings required to put up a pos it really doesn't take much to do it. now we have the must nerf cap's fuel just for the sake of it, so whats next? are you going to nerf fuel blocks to the point that they build with the same requirements but only produce half the fuel?
both of these changes and projection of player pos use in empire will have a price hike on ice mining as already discussed while will cause many to flock to it not just those who mine to sell but also those who mine to fuel their own pos's |

Black Canary Jnr
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance
104
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:01:00 -
[464] - Quote
The other angle to this is that it combats cap proliferation by pricing out poorer players and making caps a more substantial investment.
Before you go on about how it's your right to have a cap lets look at the situation.
Serious sov battles in 0.0 (Notice: SOV) have become about who has the most caps and supers to the point where subcaps are irrelevant, except for HICS and DICs, and prehaps a few support ships. The Slowcat carrier doctrine, even post drone assist, is still a monumental force. It can take on subcap forces many times larger than it's own to the point where sub-caps are almost ineffective, the only counter is other capitals and supers. A newbie in a rifter was once a force to be reckoned with, now he's a none factor in a sov battle. What we are approaching is the end game, where it's all about caps. It used to be Hellcats, drakes, alpha fleets, thundercats and other doctrines, were you could 'counter' an enemy fleet with a different concept, be it sig tanking, sniping, out tanking, alpha. All that is now becoming more irrelevant in serious Sov 0.0 battles and the arms race is getting more advanced in other fights, we are seeing T3s become the main subcap fleet doctrines for all 0.0 powers. The end game of eve gets nearer everyday as we continue our trudge towards inevitable cap ownership. The next big war we will see (likely N3/ PL v. Goons + pets) is going to highlight this fact more than ever before as fights depend on breaking the ever increasing, easily replaceable, caps being fielded.
Whilst this change to fuel consumption will have negative impacts there is no way around it, caps must be neutered, the consequences of inaction is a nerf to the PvP that makes EVE so great and enjoyable. Does increasing Jump costs neuter them? Yes, i'd say it goes a way towards it, but it doesn't do enough. Caps and supers should be expensive, it's a frickin' capital ship with 1000's of crew members with the best mobility, defence and offence in the game (not including JFs and Rorqs of course). That comes at a price and the price just went up.
Yes, prices will go up this patch, the formulas are changing, it's going to be more expensive for T2, but that's going to affect everyone equally, i can live with that, i can live with inflation and getting less bang for my buck. I have no sympathy for the people who want to jump stuff 2 times to sell it in hi-sec, it's a buff and a niche for shallow 0.0 with it's poor ratting. Deep 0.0 gets officer spawns and AFK ratting, we get to do cheaper indy. Don't like it? Get your renter overlords to get you a new system closer to hi-sec.
This patch is going to open up lots of opportunity's if people can just see past the 'i pay more/ i get nerfed' view. Can't have it your way all the time. |

Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
6295
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:17:00 -
[465] - Quote
Albert Madullier wrote:^ you mean it seems that ppl aren't willing to give up their real life jobs and have making isk as their full time job
That sounds like entitlement to me.
If things get too expensive, cut back. I am going from 4 accounts to 3 because while isk isn't hard to make, 3 billion isk per month for plex is a bit high as overhead, so to be more comfortable I'm letting go of a mostly cyno account. CCP never promised that plex would stay low. and no one ever promised you that you'd always be able to just plex accounts forever.
Likewise, our alliances should adapt to this change (even exploit it) and keep on trucking. As much as I'd hate to pay more at the pump, the truth is that fuel has probably been way too cheap for a long time.
|

Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
6295
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:19:00 -
[466] - Quote
Black Canary Jnr wrote:The other angle to this is that it combats cap proliferation by pricing out poorer players and making caps a more substantial investment.
Before you go on about how it's your right to have a cap lets look at the situation.
Serious sov battles in 0.0 (Notice: SOV) have become about who has the most caps and supers to the point where subcaps are irrelevant, except for HICS and DICs, and prehaps a few support ships. The Slowcat carrier doctrine, even post drone assist, is still a monumental force. It can take on subcap forces many times larger than it's own to the point where sub-caps are almost ineffective, the only counter is other capitals and supers. A newbie in a rifter was once a force to be reckoned with, now he's a none factor in a sov battle. What we are approaching is the end game, where it's all about caps. It used to be Hellcats, drakes, alpha fleets, thundercats and other doctrines, were you could 'counter' an enemy fleet with a different concept, be it sig tanking, sniping, out tanking, alpha. All that is now becoming more irrelevant in serious Sov 0.0 battles and the arms race is getting more advanced in other fights, we are seeing T3s become the main subcap fleet doctrines for all 0.0 powers. The end game of eve gets nearer everyday as we continue our trudge towards inevitable cap ownership. The next big war we will see (likely N3/ PL v. Goons + pets) is going to highlight this fact more than ever before as fights depend on breaking the ever increasing, easily replaceable, caps being fielded.
Whilst this change to fuel consumption will have negative impacts there is no way around it, caps must be neutered, the consequences of inaction is a nerf to the PvP that makes EVE so great and enjoyable. Does increasing Jump costs neuter them? Yes, i'd say it goes a way towards it, but it doesn't do enough. Caps and supers should be expensive, it's a frickin' capital ship with 1000's of crew members with the best mobility, defence and offence in the game (not including JFs and Rorqs of course). That comes at a price and the price just went up.
Yes, prices will go up this patch, the formulas are changing, it's going to be more expensive for T2, but that's going to affect everyone equally, i can live with that, i can live with inflation and getting less bang for my buck. I have no sympathy for the people who want to jump stuff 2 times to sell it in hi-sec, it's a buff and a niche for shallow 0.0 with it's poor ratting. Deep 0.0 gets officer spawns and AFK ratting, we get to do cheaper indy. Don't like it? Get your renter overlords to get you a new system closer to hi-sec.
This patch is going to open up lots of opportunity's if people can just see past the 'i pay more/ i get nerfed' view. Can't have it your way all the time.
Well said. No one likes a nerf but CCP is balancing a video game and when something is too cheap or easy, it should probably be adjusted.
|

Arthur Aihaken
Erebus Solia
3403
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:29:00 -
[467] - Quote
In addition to the proposed changes, why not also disallow isotope storage in fleet hangars? This would have a minimal impact on black ops, dreadnoughts and jump freighters but seriously curtail carriers, supercarriers and titans. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |

Saab Kado
DEAD JESTERS The Harlequin's
19
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:29:00 -
[468] - Quote
Someone just finished training Brain Damage V,
Can we have a real expansion instead of a TL;DR we want you to buy PLEX by making all sh**ts ingame ++ber expensive ? |

Neutrino Sunset
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
26
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:46:00 -
[469] - Quote
Apollo Purvon wrote:You expect highsec ice consumption to drop on the theory that people will downsize their towers, ignoring the idea that more people will drop towers because you're also removing standings requirements and giving bonuses to tower manufacturing. In order to offset this drop in Highsec consumption, you're increasing nullsec logistics costs. This is a bad fix based on a non-existent problem. This. Attempting to fix a non-existent problem.
If anything needs fixing it is ease of power projection for alliances with limitless isk renting out half of nullsec. But until you can think of a way of fixing that without making logistics even more of a nightmare than it already is or nerfing BlackOps, then just leave it alone.
If you need something useful to do you could start with fixing the bloody overview so that it remembers each tab's sort order, and giving us a keyboard shortcut for 'orbit at current'.
|

Ream Lolstar
WALLTREIPERS The Initiative.
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:52:00 -
[470] - Quote
Really nice change fozzie, if you want to move around eve with your capitals you have to pay for it |

Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
1305
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 12:56:00 -
[471] - Quote
Also make capital ships have an daily upkeep cost (like magic the gathering cards). The Tears Must Flow |

boernl
Finis Coronat Opus Brothers of Tangra
25
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:05:00 -
[472] - Quote
what ccp is trying to do is obvious
since as we all know the gms are nothing else than goon members
and as we all know goons is always against industry in the first place this change does not suprise me at all
in short CCP IS ******* THE SMALL CORPS UP AGAIN in favor of the big massive alliances
so **** YOU CCP |

Raketefrau
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Fatal Ascension
34
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:31:00 -
[473] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hello everyone!
In the upcoming Summer release we are making a lot of changes that we expect will impact player behavior surrounding manufacturing, mining and starbase use. We see an opportunity here to make some adjustments to the way that Jump Drives consume their isotope fuel that will hit a few birds with one stone.
Eve Summer 2014: Screwing Every Orifice
Pretty much every single devblog I've seen so far about this expansion has been a kick in the nuts. More complexity, more cost, more work, more effort in a game that already feels like an extra job.
Gonna be nice to get that $30/month back in the budget. |

Anthar Thebess
REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN
390
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:32:00 -
[474] - Quote
How to block good change?
Ask/Force your renter hordes to post a negative comment : http://eveskunk.com/e/338387548
Maybe it is time to reduce rent for those who posted here , like in CSM elections for proper voting. Summer 2014 - Jump Bridge Changes |

Beryl Invictus
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:34:00 -
[475] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:How to block good change? Ask/Force your renter hordes to post a negative comment : http://eveskunk.com/e/338387548Maybe it is time to reduce rent for those who posted here , like in CSM elections for proper voting.
ha!
That's amazing... and probably every major alliance is doing this as well.
Classic. |

Demotress
The Circus Corp Intrepid Crossing
20
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:35:00 -
[476] - Quote
dont forget this is gonna affect prices of null and low sec commodities. meaning anything you can only find in null or low will go up rather sharply in price because the cost to move it is going to go up sharply. therefore itll end up increasing anything that needs for example moon goo to be built. be ready for a mass inflation of prices. |

Anthar Thebess
REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN
391
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:45:00 -
[477] - Quote
This is move in the right direction.
Now big bloobs just drop countless capital fleets on each possible timer.
After this change price of defending r64 moon that is to far from a staging location will be so big that moving your ships to defend this tower will be equal to a month or two month income from this pos. So big powers will have to decide let go on this moon , or spend 2-3b just to defend this one timer.
From my perspective titan bridge cost need to be also escalated.
We are not talking only about 50% increase in fuel consumption , but about 75% shift in the isotopes price at the same time.
People will put a lot of towers in the higsec that also need those isotopes.
Summer 2014 - Jump Bridge Changes |

Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
1305
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 13:45:00 -
[478] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:How to block good change? Ask/Force your renter hordes to post a negative comment : http://eveskunk.com/e/338387548Maybe it is time to reduce rent for those who posted here , like in CSM elections for proper voting.
This is beautiful. The Tears Must Flow |

Anthar Thebess
REPUBLIKA ORLA C0VEN
391
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 14:05:00 -
[479] - Quote
This is the real reason why.
Bloobs are using Archon fleets. Lets assume that r64 moon is owned right now by a bloob. Let it be close, very close to staging point , only 1 midpoint , around 30 LY so all carriers at lvl V calibration can jump.
Currently amarr isotopes is expensive , but it will be more so lets assume 1.5k per isotope.
Lets think about smaller fleet just 100 archons that have to make this trip. This will give us 20,500 isotopes in only one way after this change - so this will be around 4.100.000 isotopes for this whole fleet to be moved in both directions.
Simple math : 4.100.000 * 1.500 = 6.150.000.000 per trip to save one r64 tower.
This is way more than this tower will earn you in month , and locals can ref it again day after.
This is what all big blobs are terrified that all their income will be consumed by fuel costs.
If this change will be connected to direct pos jump bridge changes , and increase in cost of titan bridges then all smaller alliances , lowsec people will be able to take poses that are in area where they are living.
Big coalitions will have rethink what is realy worth to defend - when they spend 8bil a month to defend pos that will give them 2-3bil of income per month. Summer 2014 - Jump Bridge Changes |

El Geo
Pathfinders. Veni Vidi Vici Alliance
200
|
Posted - 2014.04.30 14:07:00 -
[480] - Quote
I'm neither part of a large coalition or alliance nor do I wish to be but one thing I do use is my archon for hopping around NPC k-space as a type of mobile office for myself and sometimes members of my small corp, i've also recently taken to bridging them around by use of blops to make things easier.
Now, I'm definately not a fan of large alliances (like a lot of you posting are in) and I can afford the costs (although extremely grudgingly but I like my semi nomadic gamestyle, and the my carrier enables me to do that where Blops bridging allows me to move my corpmates (without jump capable ships) around as well) but I can not see the sense in these particular changes, so far everything i've been reading in the upcoming patch seems to point to an increase in overal pricing accross the board.
Am I to assume that these changes are meant to somehow benefit me or my small corp in some way and how exactly will they do it?
path-+find-+er (pthfndr, p+๑th-)n. 1. One that discovers a new course or way, especially through or into unexplored regions.
http://www.youtube.com/user/EvEPathfinders/videos?view=0 |
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